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Article Of Impeachment Could Be Introduced Tomorrow; Interview With Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee (D-TX); Biden To Release Most Vaccine Doses To Speed Up Vaccination Effort; Feds Say, Police Found A Truck Full Of Bombs And Guns Near Capitol; Source Says, Vice President Pence Not Ruling Out 25th Amendment Option; Right-Wing Social Media Loses Its Major Platforms. Aired 2-3p ET

Aired January 10, 2021 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[14:00:24]

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN HOST: Hello, everyone. Thank you so much for joining me this Sunday.

I'm Fredricka Whitfield.

Right now, Congress is finalizing plans that would make President Trump potentially the first U.S. president impeached twice. A new article of impeachment is expected to be introduced in the House tomorrow.

Congress is indicting President Trump for inciting the insurrection at the U.S. Capitol last week, an insurrection that left five people dead, including a Capitol Hill Capitol police officer.

A dark day for American history, but one just recognized by the president moments ago. Flags at the White House now being lowered to half-staff in honor of the fallen officer, something Congress did days ago.

A growing number of Republicans say they want President Trump out, either by impeachment, resignation or by his cabinet invoking the 25th amendment. And that includes at least two Republicans, former Trump allies themselves who tell CNN they now support his impeachment. Pennsylvania Republican Pat Toomey going a step further this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SENATOR PAT TOOMEY (R-PA): I think there is also a possibility that there is criminal liability here. I'm not a lawyer. I'm not a prosecutor. And I do know that the -- you know, the standard for a conviction in a criminal prosecution is quite high, so I'm not sure whether that could be met.

I don't know whether he's met a standard that could actually be prosecuted and gain a conviction. But the behavior was outrageous. And there should be accountability.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: As Democrats design plans to remove President Trump from office, sources tell CNN that Vice President Mike Pence has not ruled out invoking the 25th Amendment, a fact sure to further divide an already fractured friendship between the two.

Let's first now turn our focus to Capitol Hill. Democrats expected to introduce an article of impeachment there tomorrow.

CNN's Sunlen Serfaty joins me now with details on that. So at the very least the objective in the House of Representatives is to impeach the president. Of course, any kind of removal of office, well most say that's a long shot.

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Fred.

Things are very much still in flux up here on Capitol Hill which I think speaks to the importance of this moment and the complexity of this moment for Democrats given that we are just essentially just over a week plus away from the end of President Trump's presidency.

Now there is word, CNN is told that Democrats right now are considering potentially delaying the start of an impeachment trial in the Senate.

Now, that's an important development. Democrats last night hopped on a conference call where they're discussing what impact a start of a senate impeachment trial would be on a Biden administration in the first few days.

The fact that everything else essentially would come to a standstill at the start of his administration, things like getting these nominees confirmed and through to fill out his cabinet, things like the COVID relief, a stimulus package that the Biden administration has said they will, of course, prioritize.

So Democrats right now are discussing how this potentially would go.

Here's House Majority Whip Clyburn on "STATE OF THE UNION" earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JAMES CLYBURN (D-SC), HOUSE MAJORITY WHIP: We'll take the vote that we should take in the House and she will make a determination as when is the best time to get that vote, get the managers appointed and move the legislation over to the senate.

It just so happens that if it didn't go for 100 days, let's give President-Elect Biden the 100 days he needs to get his agenda off and running. And maybe we'll send the articles sometime after that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SERFATY: Now, Clyburn there, of course, hinting that this potentially could be the way that this could all go. Of course, that power rests with Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi.

But, Fred, here's how we think this week at least could go. Monday the House Rules Committee will be convening. They are going over the terms of the debate in the House, outlining the parameters of that. They could pass that out to vote in the full House likely on Wednesday, potentially as early as Wednesday.

It likely will pass, but then that's where we'll look to Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi. Will she essentially hold onto the articles of impeachment, not deliver it over to the Senate, in essence, delay this a bit, as Clyburn said, to give room for the Biden administration potentially as much as a hundred days to kind of start their agenda, get their cabinet officials confirmed.

Will she hold onto those articles? That is under active discussion right now among House Democrats, but of course that power rests with the Speaker.

[14:04:02]

SERFATY: Now, she has told Democrats who are across the nation right now, over at home that they should be prepared to be back here in Washington, of course, to take those actions in the House this week, Fred.

WHITFIELD: All right. Sunlen Serfaty, thank you so much on Capitol Hill.

All right. Joining me right now is Congresswoman Sheila Jackson-Lee. She is the Democratic representative from Texas and a member of the House Judiciary Committee. Congresswoman, good to see you again.

REP. SHEILA JACKSON LEE (D-TX): Thank you for having me. Good afternoon.

WHITFIELD: Well, I'm going to ask you to reflect if you would, you know. You were in the Capitol during 9/11 involving foreign terrorists. And now this mob insurrection involving domestic terrorists.

In fact, we have photographs of you getting down low in the House chambers as the rioters entered the Capitol. And then pictures of you all being escorted out, you know, to safety.

How do you compare these experiences that's now a few days after the fact to reflect?

JACKSON LEE: Very painful, and from all of the comments that I've been receiving from around the nation and in my own district, the American people are very hurt and very pained.

You're right. And I was actually in the Capitol at 9/11 and didn't know what had happened as we were being screamed at to flee wherever we could and that we were leaving the Capitol, some without shoes, running as fast as we could. We could look over our shoulder and see the building smoke. At that time heroic Americans decided to take things into their own hands and avoided killing this precious -- eliminating this precious site. This seat of government was so important to them, the democratic symbol, the Capitol, that they took their own live and took things in their own hands.

And here as we were crouching down, hearing gunfire, because I believe at that time the shooting occurred of the individual, unfortunately, that was trying to break into the chamber. And then to speak on demand (ph) to Capitol police with barricades trying to prevent Trump- motivated mobs' vicious determination to destroy democracy tried to pierce that very special place.

It doesn't belong to those of us who are members of Congress. We are entrusted with the duty that is given us. But it belongs to the American people. And what they were doing is they were desecrating the sacred place that belonged to the American people, and the American people that had loved, had honored and wanted to preserve.

And it was a frightening but it was a humbling experience. And I think we will continue to reflect on this. And that's why I think President Trump not only should be impeached, Fred, but he should be criminally charged for inciting an insurrection and attacking the seat of government, the Capitol of the United States, the place of democracy.

WHITFIELD: And I wonder too, as members of Congress, and really everyone who witnessed this is now reflecting on, you know, the gaps in law enforcement. Is it your belief, similar to your fellow Congresswoman Jayapal, who believed that the White House stood in the way of the National Guard being activated. Do you believe that?

JACKSON LEE: Well, first of all, I want to pay tribute and to indicate my sadness for all of the loss of lives that occurred particularly as you well know, we have the flags at the United States Capitol at half staff. They're not that way before at the White House for the Capitol --

WHITFIELD: It just happened apparently -- actually it just happened at the White House now. We know that at the Capitol, and we've all observed at the Capitol, that the flag went to half staff days ago. Whereas for the White House it just happened really inside the last hour. And your view on that contrast?

JACKSON LEE: Well, I think it's telling that here an officer died in the line of duty, died as a hero. In more ways, he served this nation both in the United States military. And it took this president who created the atmosphere that caused his death.

I said before and I maintain, blood is at the hands and the feet of the president. And yes, I think it is glaring. The Congressional Black Caucus will be probably the first organization that will be digging into this by way of an investigation this coming week.

But we clearly have to look into why the president of the United States denied the sitting executive, the mayor of the city of Washington, D.C. the right to have the National Guard stand up. Where were the other supporting federal law enforcement that are

typically utilized? The use of the metro police, I understand were at their (INAUDIBLE). They did not call them. Park police, FBI, Secret Service were certainly on hand to give information.

And let me add this, the Department of Homeland Security had a mountain of evidence on this right wing mob and their intended actions.

[14:09:54]

JACKSON LEE: And they provided, as I understand, if not to members of Congress, who were jurisdictionally required to have it. They certainly didn't provide any urgency so that the chief of police could move quickly not by his own will but being demanded to have more resources and be of help.

I'm going to be very clear. We in the United States Congress take our oath of office seriously. We know that the protection of the American people is the paramount responsibility that we have. But we also know that for the continuity of government, the lives of members of Congress and the leadership, including the Speaker, the vice president was present, the majority minority leader of the United States Senate, who had the responsibility of governing along with members of Congress were in jeopardy.

And as I understand it, the White House was playing dance music, looking at the screens and seeing the glare of the violence of those climbing the walls, looking to destroy the historic mementos.

And I just want to say this, Fred, because it struck my heart. We honored John Lewis with the draping in kind of the majority leaders' office with black draping. He's not been deceased for a year yet, and that was stripped, destroyed and torn down, which leads us to know that not only were these vicious mobs provoked by President Trump, but they were racist through their soul and their core with the symbol of the confederate flag, maybe not the confederate flag ---

WHITFIELD: A symbol of white supremacy.

(CROSSTALK)

JACKSON LEE: -- symbol of white supremacy. So I want to do this in the manner that Congress does it. We have to be somewhat objective to the extent, let's get the facts so the American people will know, and I think they'll find the facts particularly tawdry in relation to who did not do what, how the chief executive of the city was treated when she wanted to do her very best for the city and for the Congress and the American people.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITFIELD: Do you go as far -- do you also go as far as --

JACKSON LEE: Pardon me? WHITFIELD: Do you go as far as even thinking that there was assistance, whether it be from inside the White House or even law enforcement to assist some of these mobsters, given that even, you know, Congressman Clyburn said -- you know, he was curious as to how some would know of a secondary office that he would have and that these mobsters seemed to know exactly where to go?

JACKSON LEE: I tell you where I stand on that, Fred. I don't want any ending of the long level of investigations that will get to every aspect that is being presented by members of Congress. I want to hear every aspect of their experience. I want to hear every aspect of the staff experience.

I want a full investigation that is not short-changed. and yes, I think it is our responsibility to determine if there was any collaboration. Just as we proceeded with 9/11 with a series of hearings in 9/11 legislation and continue to review 9/11, to be frank with you, because of all of the innuendo and circumstances.

We know that it turned on these perpetrators on the plane. We know that they're (AUDIO GAP). We know that they were terrorists.

But in this instance, domestic terrorists, whatever help they may have gotten, whatever individuals who coming in that were showing their badges which was (INAUDIBLE) we want to hear from the Capitol police officers, the line officers who were there.

We want to express our sadness for the officer who was crushed, seemingly crushed, with no one being able to help him. And so all of these persons must be given an opportunity for a statement and affidavit. We need to know whether there were outside first responders that came from other jurisdictions --

WHITFIELD: And in fact -- Congresswoman, if I could interrupt you -- I just want to take a look outside there in Washington. Apparently this is a procession for that fallen Capitol police officer, Officer Sicknick, who died after being, you know, attacked by this mob, by this group of domestic terrorists.

And you see -- I don't know if you have a return monitor, but what we're seeing are officers on bikes, on their motorbikes with their sidecars empty, symbolism for that fallen officer. And then a salute there. Perhaps this is Constitution Avenue.

And now you see a vehicle going by as well. And it looks from as far as the eye can see here with the Capitol Building in the background, that pristine white building, that symbol of democracy, you can see as far as the eye can see, Congresswoman, the street is lined with officers.

[14:14:48]

JACKSON LEE: Let me just say this. This is Officer Sicknick's home and his workplace. This is where he gave his ultimate sacrifice, but more importantly, over the years he gave his best. And I am -- tragically, we are as his family that he was so eager to protect, his work family, the members of Congress. We are so saddened by his loss and the fact that he had to die at the hands of these brutish domestic terrorists who had been motivated by the words just a few hours ago, I guess, and it was unbeknownst to us, Fred that, this big rally was downtown in terms of the speakers being President Trump, Rudy Giuliani who should also be held accountable, and his son. Rudy Giuliani said having a trial by combat.

What does that mean? Combat is losing (ph) war, and the president saying the only way that you can show who you are is by strength. And of course, his son encouraged them to go up and be as violent as they were.

This is not America. I love this country. Patriots came to our assistance. We know there are some facts that we need to dig into, and we also know that the issue of institutional racism propped its head unfortunately in a place that we love and call the seat of democracy. And it belongs to all of America.

What is so special about this country is that no matter who you are, if you came as an immigrant to this country, if you were born here, or if you were a Native American of whom we owe a great deal of respect and response to in all the diverse communities, that this is a place where parents stroll little babies alongside of, picture-taking goes on every single day where Americans come and wave at congresspersons as they go into the United States Capitol with a sense of deference and respect and where they come in awe.

Some of them come inside as tourists. Others stand outside and walk up and down the plaza. This is their place. And what happened in the last couple of days or the day of infamy on January 6th was a day that President Trump himself should be saddened by the disgraceful actions. I don't know how he can comport this to losing a race that was legally and factually lost by him.

The American people voted for Joe Biden and Kamala Harris. Why not, like a man, stand up as a patriot and accept it and give a farewell to the nation?

I wish that he would resign. That's what we wanted to have happen. I wish Vice President Pence had the understanding of his job, to find him ill-suited and unfit for office.

But if not, we have resolutions all of us will be introducing. Some will include the fact that he abused his power and failed to defend the constitution. I think that should be his legacy as he goes out.

We should never hear from him again in terms of trying to destroy by words and actions this great nation. And I think that we will come together. We will heal ourselves. We will come together under the new leadership, but we must, Fred, we must hold him accountable.

I don't know what he was thinking, but we must hold him accountable. We'll do it through the --

WHITFIELD: And in that article --

(CROSSTALK)

WHITFIELD: -- in that article --

JACKSON LEE: -- pardon?

WHITFIELD: In that article to be introduced tomorrow, the charging of the president for incitement of insurrection, you mentioned, you know, the Capitol building, the building symbolic of so much, representing, you know, democracy, representing freedom, representing order and grace.

I mean, it's one of my favorite buildings. Whenever I come to Washington, I always make sure I cross the 14th Street bridge before going into the city just because I always want that first look of the U.S. Capitol on the right, and then I look left to the Washington Monument. It's still just my favorite spot.

You mentioned the president being held accountable. What about for your fellow members of congress? Do you see also on the table censure -- some sort of penalty for those who may have assisted in fanning the flames?

JACKSON LEE: Well, I think each body will address their colleagues. Sometimes colleagues can be addressed by the mere House procedures that deal with committee assignments and otherwise.

I know that we want to spend time -- I don't think that there should be any attempt to ignore their behavior, their provoking.

We asked them after this tragedy to please not continue with these objections. They were fraudulent, they were false, they were untenable (ph). We asked them maybe pleaded with them, let us continue the count.

But they did not. And I guess it was about 4:00 a.m. close to 5:00 a.m. in the morning when I took the gavel (INAUDIBLE) and gaveled the House out and announced the election of President Biden and Kamala Harris in place in the congressional (INAUDIBLE).

WHITFIELD: Ok.

[14:19:57]

JACKSON LEE: But we have asked and we did our job anyhow. I believe that the House and Senate will address that accordingly. I think what we need to do, of course -- is that when a president -- let me say this.

The constitution really gives protection to the executive because we did not want to have the tyranny of the people to be able to up that and take out and have a coup on the president of the United States.

We didn't have a king or queen.

WHITFIELD: Ok.

JACKSON LEE: We wanted it to be a process. But in this instance, because they are protected, we have to really address the president of the United States constitutionally. And I think he should be addressed criminally. He has to be held accountable.

WHITFIELD: Got it. Congresswoman, we'll leave it there for now.

Again, on this day, the flag now at half staff over the White House as it has been in the U.S. Capitol as fellow officers pay homage now to Capitol Police Officer Sicknick and that procession that went right through downtown Washington.

Thank you so much, Congresswoman. We'll be right back.

[14:20:57]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right. Welcome back.

We're just ten days into the New Year, and the U.S. has already recorded more than two million new coronavirus cases and more than 27,000 deaths. The nationwide vaccination effort is still underway but it's behind schedule, prompting President-Elect Joe Biden to break with the federal government's current strategy.

Biden now planning to release nearly all available vaccine doses when he takes office, but his team says they do not intend to delay the second doses.

Joining me right now to discuss is Dr. Celine Gounder, a member of the President-Elect Joe Biden's COVID advisory board. Doctor, good to see you.

DR. CELINE GOUNDER, MEMBER, JOE BIDEN'S COVID ADVISORY BOARD: Great to see you, Fred.

WHITFIELD: So why is this the best strategy moving forward?

DR. GOUNDER: I want to be very clear that the recommendation remains that the second dose of the Pfizer vaccine be given at 21 days and the second dose of the Moderna vaccine be given at 28 days.

The idea here is really want to help best to manage the supply, the supply chain chain not to change the dose or the dosing regimen. The Biden brand is follow the science, so we are following the science. We are following the FDA recommendation and so that dosing schedule and the doses remain the same.

The challenge here is we in a sense have made things overly complicated and we're getting in our own way in terms of getting these doses out there.

WHITFIELD: Meaning the problem has not been supply, the problem is distribution. DR. GOUNDER: That's right, the problem is distribution. And so some of

this is happening in hospitals where staff are being staggered so they're not all getting vaccinated, say in one unit at the same time. You know, that does slow things down a bit.

In terms of the long-term care facilities, assisted-living facilities were added to the list in addition to nursing homes very late in the game. That essentially tripled the number of facilities that needed to be covered. And the start dates for vaccination were December 21st and 28th, so right around the holidays.

You can imagine that some of these facilities were not really prepared to get started or didn't want to over the holidays. So there was a bit of a delay there.

And then once you get beyond that, there are other distribution challenges in terms of staffing for people to vaccinate, the I.T. system. So there -- it's really more of a distribution problem that we're facing.

WHITFIELD: Right, so making it all available does not answer the distribution problem, meaning there are some states, jurisdictions, that say we don't even have the refrigeration so that's why we can't, you know, hold onto the stockpile. And then there are others, like you mentioned, they don't have the staff or the coordination in which to distribute get the shots in the arm.

So how might that be addressed? Doesn't that have to be addressed first just as this rollout of releasing more vaccines is being pushed?

DR. GOUNDER: Well, we have to address both. So what we're trying to do is simplify the distribution. You know, for example, if I get vaccinated today, then the vaccinator has to keep track of is there a second dose for Dr. Gounder on the shelf in 21 days or 28 days with her name on it? And that becomes a much bigger tracking and logistical challenge for these local and state health departments that are already having those challenges.

So we certainly do need to address staffing. There needs to be a massive funding of local and state health departments so that they can hire this kind of staff --

WHITFIELD: Can that be done in ten days?

DR. GOUNDER: Sorry?

WHITFIELD: Can that be done in ten days? Because if that's going to be one of the first orders of business for the Biden administration, that's ten days away.

DR. GOUNDER: Well, certainly this is going to be very high on the agenda is increasing funding to local and state health departments so they can get the job done.

WHITFIELD: All right, Dr. Celine Gounder, good to see you. Thanks so much. All right. Straight ahead, an uprising of anti-government white

supremacy fueled by misinformation on line. The hard truth? There are talks of further attacks. Is the U.S. prepared?

And newly-elected Georgia Senator Reverend Raphael Warnock with this blunt description of the violence on the Capitol.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SENATOR RAPHAEL WARNOCK (D-GA): You cut the head off of a snake, it shakes and moves violently not because it is living, but because it is dying.

Power concedes nothing without a demand. So there is both victory in this moment, there is violence in this moment, there is fantastic opportunity and fierce opposition. And it reminds us that there is still a whole lot of work to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[14:29:48]

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[14:30:00]

WHITFIELD: Days after the insurrection, we are getting closer looks now at the horrific acts of some of the pro-Trump rioters at the U.S. Capitol on Wednesday. CNN has learned an Alabama man parked a truck packed with 11 homemade bombs and a pair of guns just two blocks from the Capitol. The material in Lonnie Coffman's truck, mason jars filled with melted Styrofoam and gasoline, apparently a combination that has the same effect as napalm. His truck sat there for almost four hours before the bomb squad found it.

Another man, Cleveland Meredith Jr., came Washington a day before Trump's rally with hundreds of rounds of ammunition and an assault rifle. Court documents say he allegedly sent a text message saying he was thinking of, quote -- I'm quoting now from his text, putting a bullet in Pelosi's noggin on live T.V., end quote.

[14:35:08]

In another text, he said he was headed to Washington with a ton of armor-piercing ammo.

As of Friday, the Department of Justice says 13 people are facing federal charges.

Let's talk about this with Cynthia Miller-Idriss. She is the director of the Polarization and Extremism Research and innovation Lab at American University. It's so good to see you. And she is also the author of Hate in the Homeland, The New Global Far Right.

Cynthia, boy, this is so troubling. I mean, it just becomes more and more troubling every day. I think people were incensed obviously from Wednesday and didn't think it could get worse than that, but when you hear the details, yes, it does. So how, in your view, did misinformation catalyzed this group to simply storm the U.S. Capitol hunting for people?

CYNTHIA MILLER-IDRISS, DIRECTOR, AMERICAN UNIVERSITY POLARIZATION AND EXTREMISM RESEARCH AND INNOVATION LAB: Well, thank you for having me, and you're right, the news coming out just keeps getting worse and worse about what was being planned. What we see here is that uniting across a desperate group of people, the fervent belief that this election has been stolen from them, that there was mass voter fraud, and that they're being called upon as patriots to defend democracy.

So they believe they're being heroes here, and they've been told that by the very people who they trust for information, which including this president and other elected officials who have helped propagate, create and spread misinformation and disinformation about the election, so these people now feel not only empowered to act but compelled to do so.

WHITFIELD: Wow. So you're saying the people that we're seeing here, they believed the many lies and this provoked them to take on Washington, to call to arms. They believed the president when he said the vice president could help overturn, come to find out that is not in the parameters of the vice president's powers. He couldn't turn things around, and so this elicited more anger that these people feel that they have been deceived because they believe and had been hanging on every word of the president, even though he has a litany of lie after lie after lie.

MILLER-IDRISS: They believe fervently, they believe that they are being heroic here and they believe that it's their patriotic duty. So when you listen to the words that they're using, they are using words like freedom and democracy. This is an extraordinarily hard thing to combat at this point because once the genie is out of the bottle, the question is how do we get it back in. They believe they're on the side of right. They feel righteous. They feel they're facing an existential threat. They feel this is a challenge to democracy that they are being called on as patriots to engage in.

WHITFIELD: CNN's Elle Reeve extensively covered the 2017 rally in Charlottesville that ended with at least one person, a woman dying, and she was with Vice News at the time. Perhaps you've seen some of her stories on our network and even on Vice. And she was in the crowd this go-round there on the Capitol, talking to people, asking them what was motivating them, why are they there, why do they feel it they're right. Take a listen to what she discovered in them.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're just standing here throwing some (BLEEP).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What are we supposed to do, okay? The Supreme Court is not helping us, no one is helping us. Only us can help us. Only we can do it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Unquestionable that our votes were stolen. It's unquestionable. There is so much proof.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, people, come on, you didn't come here for nothing. Come on up and tell Nancy Pelosi what you think.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We want our representatives to do the right thing and decertify like the seven swing states.

PROTESTERS: USA. USA. USA.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Taking our freedom, locking us down and turning this country into a blasted socialist republic, and that is not right. That's what I'm doing here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: I mean, just listening to their voices, I mean, they are not to be convinced otherwise. It doesn't matter what you say. So, I mean, to borrow your words, how do you put the genie back in the bottle?

MILLER-IDRISS: It's an extremely difficult thing to do, and, really, the best thing to do would have been to never let that genie out of the bottle to begin with, by which I mean heavily investing in prevention and intervention work to help people understand what online manipulation looks like.

WHITFIELD: Well, we're past that now.

MILLER-IDRISS: Right, exactly. I mean, we could still -- there still maybe still be some work to be done to help younger generations from mobilizing into this kind of stuff.

[14:40:00]

But the only thing to do right now is to work to create strategies to combat that disinformation. On the one hand, we're seeing deplatforming that will help with the circulation. But for these people who hold fervent beliefs at this point that they've had something taken away from them, that the Democratic process is broken, we're in a really deep, dark hole in this moment.

WHITFIELD: Yes. So, the next ten days, how does it look to you? What are your concerns?

MILLER-IDRISS: Yes, I live in Washington, D.C. This is my city. Obviously, I'm concerned about what we're going to see in terms of the military -- kind of militarization of the city in the next ten days because we've seen it before post-9/11, tanks on the street kind of thing, and we saw it around in Black Lives Matter protests.

And I think at this point, we are facing a situation where we're going to have to see that kind of response, and we're past the point of prevention and intervention, and we're moving toward a kind of -- a real militarization, potentially, and a heavy law enforcement response, which leads, obviously, to a lot of potential for additional violence. And so I'm quite concerned about what the next ten days brings.

WHITFIELD: Yes, it's a sad outlook. All right, Cynthia Miller-Idriss, thank you so much, I appreciate it.

MILLER-IDRISS: Sure, thanks for having me.

WHITFIELD: Straight ahead, silence from President Trump in the wake of the Capitol Hill riots. We're learning he and Vice President Pence are at odds and not even speaking. What a source says would make Pence support invoking the 25th Amendment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:45:00]

WHITFIELD: We're continuing to follow developments which are growing, deep friction between the president and Vice President Mike Pence. A source close to the vice president tells CNN invoking the 25th Amendment to remove Trump from office is still on the table in case the president becomes more unstable. Another source telling CNN the two haven't even spoken since last week's Capitol attack.

CNN's Jeremy Diamond is at the White House. So, Jeremy, Pence now seems to be seeing the wrath of the president firsthand. What is he thinking about?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Look, Vice President Mike Pence has been at President Trump's side for five years, going back to the campaign, and he's witnessed President Trump's vindictiveness toward others, the way he has lashed out at others, but this is the first time that he is experiencing it personally, and one source familiar with the matter saying that the vice president is finally getting a glimpse of the president's vindictiveness after all this time.

And the two sources are telling us that the vice president is disappointed and saddened by the way that the president has reacted to him. Again, as you said, the president hasn't even spoken with Vice President Mike Pence, and, of course, it was the president who was pressuring Pence during that rally before that mob stormed Capitol Hill, pressuring the vice president to essentially forgo his constitutional duty and overturn the results of the election for him, even though the vice president had already told him that he planned to certify the votes, as he was expected to do.

And after that, we saw those crowds of people on Capitol Hill chanting that the vice president should be hanged. So, again, this is a low point for sure in the relationship between these two men, and we now have learned that Vice President Mike Pence, while he is unlikely to invoke the 25th Amendment, to strip President Trump of his presidential powers, he isn't taking it off the table, and one source close to the vice president telling us that the vice president is keeping that option on the table in the event that the president should become more unstable, and that given the events of the past week, it's simply something that he can't rule out altogether. WHITFIELD: I wonder if the vice president has felt like so many others have, which is it's only a matter of time before the president kind of, you know, turns his view on them or someone.

So let's talk about the flag at half-staff now, because it took a long time for that to happen, this in honor of the Capitol police officer, Brian Sicknick, who died following that riot on Wednesday. Do we know about the process of thought, why the White House refrained as long as it did and what compelled it to do it now?

DIAMOND: Well, first of all, we presume that that is why they lowered the flag to half-staff, but the White House has yet to actually confirm whether this is indeed to honor fallen Officer Brian Sicknick. Presumably, that's the case, but we are waiting for the official proclamation from the White House on the order to lower that flag to half-staff. But if, indeed, that is the case, it comes two days after House Speaker Nancy Pelosi did the same thing.

And this is just part of a pattern with President Trump. He is reluctant to do the right thing initially, and when he relents, it's too little too late, and the damage has already been done, because the president himself, he has yet to actually comment on Officer Sicknick's death. So even as he is lowering the flag to half-staff, that is also something to keep in mind here.

WHITFIELD: Right, like the late senator, John McCain, it took days before the White House ever lowered the flag.

All right, Jeremy Diamond at the White House, thank you so much.

All right, still ahead, as concerns about extremism mount, Apple and Amazon take steps that lead to the shutdown of an alternative social media site. We'll talk about that, next.

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WHITFIELD: Parler, the alternative social media platform favored by conservatives, is now finding itself virtually homeless after losing its major hosts and providers. Amazon, Apple and Google have all removed it from their platforms in a little over 24 hours. And that could drive the service offline, at least temporarily. The move follows the attack on the Capitol last week and because of threats that were posted on Parler, including one reportedly calling for Vice President Mike Pence to be executed.

CNN Tech Reporter Brian Fung is following these reports for us. So, Brian, will this take Parler offline?

BRIAN FUNG, CNN TECH REPORTER: It absolutely will, Fredricka, and this is a huge setback to President Trump -- Donald Trump's supporters.

Parler, if you're not familiar, is an alternative social network that bills itself as a platform for free speech. In practice, what that has meant is a lot of violent rhetoric and incitement on the platform. We've had companies, including Apple, Amazon and Google, forwarding examples of these types of content to Parler saying, hey, we've seen threats of assassination, calls for civil war, what are you going to do about it.

And now these platforms, seeing that Parler has not done anything about them, have removed the app from the app stores as well as the Amazon web services, which is the cloud hosting provider that keeps both Parler's website as well as its app functioning.

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So all of this means that even if you have the app installed on your phone, you won't be able to access the service.

And Parler's CEO is saying the companies are trying to stifle speech and that the service could be down for up to a week while it tries to find a replacement host. Fredricka?

WHITFIELD: And then I wonder, how popular has Parler become? Did it get a particular boost in recent months in, you know, members, people who use that site?

FUNG: Well, Parler has seen a lot of growth particularly as the president has attacked Twitter and Facebook for alleged censorship, and that's driven a lot of growth for this new social media platform.

WHITFIELD: All right. Brian Fung, thanks so much. Good to see you.

And join CNN's Wolf Blitzer for "The Trump Insurrection: 24 Hours that Shook America," a look at what happened at the U.S. Capitol and what happens next. This new CNN special report airs tonight at 10:00.

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