Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

President-Elect Joe Biden's Plans for Immediate Action; Transfer of Power: Trump's Final Hours as U.S. President; Brazil Authorizes Two Vaccines for Emergency Use; Kremlin Critic Alexei Navalny to Remain in Custody for 30 Days; Critics "Moved to Cheers" over Trump's Departure. Aired 2-3a ET

Aired January 19, 2021 - 02:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[02:00:00]

(MUSIC PLAYING)

ROBYN CURNOW, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Ahead, the U.S. Capitol looks like a fortress as the country prepares to inaugurate its 46th president.

The FBI's vetting tens of thousands of National Guard troops, hoping to root out any threat from within. And acting Defense Secretary says no stone will be left unturned.

Meanwhile, President Trump has recorded a farewell message highlighting his accomplishments. We are expecting that and as many as 100 pardons and commutations in the coming hours.

We are already learning Joe Biden will roll back a number of Trump era policies on his first days in office, rejoining the Paris climate accord and ending the Muslim ban. He has been busy crafting his inaugural address, urging unity for a country in crisis.

Hello, I'm Robyn Curnow. You are watching CNN NEWSROOM.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): Live from CNN Center, this is CNN NEWSROOM with Robyn Curnow.

CURNOW: Thanks for joining me.

There's a little more than 24 hours left for Trump's presidency and spending his last full day in the White House. This as the nation's capital turns its attention to his successor Joe Biden. His inauguration on Wednesday will be unlike any other as the nation struggles with a coronavirus pandemic and the threat of more violence from Trump supporters.

Nearly 200,000 flags, as you can see here, are along the National Mall, they were lit up on Monday night to honor the incoming president. Ryan Nobles has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) RYAN NOBLES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Inauguration week is already underway here in Washington and it started on Monday night with a brilliant light display along the National Mall.

The presidential inaugural committee trying to replicate the fact that the hundreds of thousands of people that normally attend the inauguration just will not be able to be here, because of coronavirus pandemic concerns and also because of security concerns.

In place of all those spectators, they have lined 200,000 flags along the National Mall. Those flags are representing all 56 states and territories in the United States. Then on Monday night, they lit 56 pillars of light to represent those states and territories. They did it over a 46-second period of time to honor the incoming president, Joe Biden.

Joe Biden and his administration do want to make this situation as normal as possible, given the fact that we are living in abnormal times. They still want it to be a festive atmosphere. They want the visual and optics of this to be as pleasing as possible to the millions of people that will be watching from the comfort of their own homes.

That is beginning of this process. Joe Biden is spending his last night in Wilmington on Monday night. He will travel to Washington on Tuesday, participating in some service events here in Washington on Tuesday before taking the oath of office on Wednesday -- Ryan Nobles, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: Joe Biden plans to introduce sweeping changes to America's immigration system shortly after he takes office on Wednesday. He is expected to propose new legislation that would offer millions of undocumented immigrants a pathway to citizenship. That is not the only action he is expected to take as Jeff Zeleny now reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Two days before taking office, President-Elect Joe Biden and his family filling food boxes in Philadelphia at a community service project to honor the legacy of Martin Luther King Jr.

It's his final stop before traveling to Washington on the eve of his inauguration where the pomp and circumstance from his own swearing-in as vice president will be far different on Wednesday, amid the country's stubborn pandemic in a capital fortified by wartime-like security.

He is still putting the finishing touches on his inaugural address, aides tell CNN, with an overriding theme, "A Clarion Call for National Unity."

And just after the ceremony, Biden is planning for swift and sweeping action on his first day in office. JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: And the first thing I will do, I will rejoin the Paris accord.

ZELENY (voice-over): In addition to making good on a campaign promise to rejoin the Paris climate accord, Biden will also end the travel ban on predominantly Muslim countries, halt evictions and student loan payments and issue a new executive order requiring masks on federal property.

[02:05:00]

BIDEN: It's not a political statement, it's a patriotic duty.

ZELENY: Yet Biden will not be surrounded by his own cabinet when he arrives at the White House. The Senate has not confirmed any of his nominees, even those tasked with national security.

The confirmation hearings for secretary of state, Defense Secretary, intelligence chief and Treasury Secretary are set for Tuesday.

Incoming White House chief of staff Ron Klain told Jake Tapper on Sunday that confirming those nominees is critical and must be done even as the Senate begins an impeachment trial.

RON KLAIN, BIDEN CHIEF OF STAFF: It is important for the Senate to do its constitutional duty but also to do its constitutional duty to move forward on these appointments, on the urgent action the country needs.

ZELENY (voice-over): Biden believes the inauguration is one way of beginning to open a door to work toward bridging that divide.

Jill Biden asked country star Garth Brooks to perform at the inauguration.

He said yes, telling reporters today, "It was not a statement of politics, but one of unity."

GARTH BROOKS, SINGER: I might be the only Republican at this place but it's reaching across, loving one another, because that is what is going to get us through probably the most divided times that we have.

ZELENY: So when Joe Biden does take office on Wednesday at noon, none of his cabinet secretaries will be confirmed.

That is far different than from 12 years ago when he assumed the office of vice president and Barack Obama was president. At that point, they had six cabinet secretaries confirmed.

That is why the Biden officials now are looking across the government to find acting secretaries, who will effectively be in charge of the government when President Biden takes office-- Jeff Zeleny, CNN -- Wilmington, Delaware.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: When President Biden enters the White House, he will be greeted with a long list of issues that need his attention both here in the U.S. and abroad, COVID-19 social and political divisions and tensions with allies.

Here to discuss all of that is historian and author Max Boot, a CNN global affairs analyst and columnist with "The Washington Post."

Max, hi. Lovely to see you. It is certainly going to be a big week, Biden has a team, a number of teams, lined up to hit the ground running. There are historic challenges. You also said opportunities as well.

Why?

MAX BOOT, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: For one thing, President Biden is going to be following arguably the worst president in U.S. history, so that creates an automatic assumption that, if Biden is even minimally competent, he will do much, much better.

On the other hand, the flip side of that is because Trump has been so incompetent, the challenges that Joe Biden faces are unprecedented, almost unprecedented. This is certainly the most challenging transition we have seen since Franklin Roosevelt took over in 1933.

You think about what is on the new president's plate, which includes 400,000 COVID deaths and rapidly rising; an economy that is still not recovered from the pandemic; all sorts of other problems, including racial injustice, global warming. It's overwhelming, the number of problems that the new president has to deal with.

CURNOW: We also have a huge chunk of Republicans believing the president's lies and conspiracy theories, essentially are confused -- and I'm saying that mildly about Biden's illegitimacy.

How does he overcome the gulf of misinformation that if folks at home are digesting still?

BOOT: That's another massive challenge, the fact that some are over 70 percent of Republican base, believes that Biden stole the election. That he is not a legitimate president.

Of course we saw on January 6th where those beliefs could lead when the Capitol was stormed. As a result of that you now have downtown Washington, D.C., looking like a war zone with troops that you would normally only see in places like Baghdad and Kabul.

And that certainly adds to the challenges that President Biden will face. Simply getting inaugurated safely cannot be taken for granted anymore. I do not think there is an easy way out of that trap.

But I think the good news for President Biden is he does start off with much higher approval ratings than Donald Trump has ever had. While there are a lot of extremists and conspiracy mongers in the United States, they still remain a marginal fringe.

I think most Americans are still eager for President Biden to do a good job. I think it will be possible to reach an agreement on issues like the coronavirus stimulus package, more spending for vaccinations. There are issues where it could still be possible to work across the aisle with at least a few members of the Republican caucus.

CURNOW: There is, as you mentioned, a division, distress, rampant inequality.

[02:10:00]

CURNOW: The COVID of course, as you say, needs to be dealt with as well.

What do you make of President Trump lifting some COVID travel restrictions just when the Biden team plans to put them back in place potentially in the next few days?

BOOT: It's hard to know what to make of that, other than just Trump is making mischief and trying to screw things up for Biden by somehow putting the onus on the new president to impose the travel restrictions, so Trump, out of office, could now attack Biden for supposedly harming the economy.

I don't know. These are these kinds of petty, sordid machinations that Trump has engaged in for four years. We just have to go beyond that and focus on how to deal with this horrible disease that Trump has so calamitously mismanaged.

CURNOW: In many ways, the president is leaving Mr. Biden land mines.

How does Mr. Biden lift the country, the presidency, above the chaos from the past 4 years?

What words or actions do you think will have the most profound impact after years of so much noise?

Will quiet just suffice?

BOOT: I think a lot of people are ready for a lot of quiet and we are already getting used to a president who is not tweeting like mad because Trump has been shut off Twitter. But Biden is not going to play that social media game, nor should he. There is really no words that can heal the country at this point. What we need is action.

But I think there is a good prospect of successful action by President Biden, because you think about the fact that the vaccines have already been developed. It's simply a question of getting them into people's arms and organizing the vaccinations. That is something that President Biden is confident and his team can do. If they do that they will lift the threat of the pandemic and therefore the economy will naturally revive.

So I think if President Biden is even minimally competent -- and I have every expectation that he will be very competent -- I think you can see a real rebound in this country over the next 6 months or so.

CURNOW: Thank you so much, Max Boot. Appreciate you joining us.

BOOT: Thank you.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

CURNOW (voice-over): Be sure to stay with CNN for extensive live coverage of the Biden inauguration our special coverage, will take place all day this Wednesday, January the 20th.

Still ahead, President Trump prepares to leave the White House. We will go over what his last full day in office could look like.

And as the pandemic worsens around the world, many countries are now struggling with this vaccine rollout. Stay with us for that story as well.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(MUSIC PLAYING)

CURNOW: As soon as U.S. President-Elect Joe Biden is inaugurated on Wednesday, he is expected to almost immediately begin to focus on the colossal task of overcoming the coronavirus pandemic. The U.S. has now surpassed 24 million cases and are nearing 400,000 deaths. And now some experts fear new variants of the virus can cause more spikes.

[02:15:00]

CURNOW: Here's Erica Hill with more on that.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR AND U.S. CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): First, the good news: testing is up. The daily average of new cases is down in 35 states over the past week. Hospitalizations also on the decline.

DR. JONATHAN REINER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: All of those metrics point to the conclusion that we may have passed the peak.

HILL (voice-over): But could a more transmissible variant of the virus soon fuel a new peak?

DR. SCOTT GOTTLIEB, FORMER FDA COMMISSIONER: In about five weeks this is going to start to take over.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's going to take a while to turn this around.

HILL (voice-over): The pace is already increasing. 60 percent of all COVID cases in the U.S. have been added since election day. 40 percent of the nation's COVID deaths reported in that same period.

DR. ROCHELLE WALENSKY, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: By the middle of February we expect half a million deaths in this country. I think we still have some dark weeks ahead. HILL (voice-over): In Los Angeles County, air pollution rules temporarily suspended to allow for more cremations to, quote, "assist with the backlog caused by the COVID-19 pandemic."

On the vaccine front, continued frustration.

GOV. TIM WALZ (D-MN): They were lying. They don't have any doses held back.

HILL (voice-over): Pfizer telling CNN it has those critical second doses noting the government only recently asked the company to send them. Dr. Anthony Fauci batting cleanup over the weekend.

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: I think there was just a misunderstanding.

DR. LEANA WEN, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: I just don't understand how no one is able to give a straight answer to the question of how many doses are out there, that are ready to be distributed and at what point?

HILL (voice-over): What we do know of the more than 31 million doses distributed, just 39 percent have been administered.

WALENSKY: Our job is to make sure that with the entire support of the federal government that we get -- we address all of those bottlenecks wherever we are so we can get vaccine into people's arms.

HILL (voice-over): In New York, I'm Erica Hill, CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: An international group of experts is criticizing China and the World Health Organization for their initial handling of the pandemic. The new report concludes China could have tried harder to contain the coronavirus a year ago. And it also says the WHO took too long to declare an international emergency.

This comes as researchers at Oxford say the U.K. has the highest COVID death rates in the world last week. And the WHO predicts global deaths can surpass 100,000 a week very soon.

Meanwhile during his waning hours in office, President Trump signed an executive order lifting certain international travel restrictions. The Biden administration has already said it will block it. But the move would have allowed travelers from parts of Europe entry to the U.S. by the end of the month. Here is Melissa Bell with that.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MELISSA BELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Here in Europe, several countries under pressure over those COVID-19 figures. Portugal has announced a record when it comes to COVID-19 related deaths.

On Tuesday, Germany will consider whether to further tighten its restrictions already. The partial lockdown that is in place there was extended beyond January 31st.

The question is how much tighter the restrictions have to become?

The Austrian chancellor had announced that the lockdown --

(CROSSTALK)

BELL: -- had to be extended yesterday. Today he urged the European Medicines Agency to come to a quick decision when it comes to the AstraZeneca vaccine. More than 3 weeks now after the E.U. launched its vaccination campaign, several E.U. countries have come to criticism for the small rollout of their programs.

Germany but also here in France. The prime minister on Monday spoke to the nation on French TV, promising that, by the end of the month, 1 million people would have been vaccinated -- Melissa Bell, CNN, Paris.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: Brazil has kicked off its COVID vaccination program one day after health officials there authorized two vaccines for emergency use. This comes as parts of the country are seeing a deadly resurgence of the virus with the Amazon region getting hit the hardest.

The Brazilian president has refused to take responsibility and is instead claiming credit for the new vaccine rollout. Here is Shasta Darlington.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHASTA DARLINGTON, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Brazil launched its national vaccination campaign on Monday, weeks behind other nations and with a severely limited supply.

In the hardest hit city of Manaus in Brazil's Amazon, patients have been dying at an alarming rate in part because hospitals are running out of oxygen. Severe COVID-19 patients have been airlifted to other cities around the country. Even 60 premature babies were airlifted out of Manaus last week because they simply didn't have enough oxygen tanks.

Some of the first doses of vaccine headed to Manaus first. Brazil's health regulator approved emergency use authorization for two different vaccines on Sunday. The government of Sao Paulo state started its rollout on the same day.

[02:20:00]

DARLINGTON: The national health ministry, however, started shipping off supplies to the rest of the country on Monday. The outlook is still grim; initially only 6 million doses were made available for a country of 211 million people and with the second highest number of deaths in the world -- Shasta Darlington, CNN, Sao Paulo.

(END VIDEOTAPE) CURNOW: Now to a developing story out of Argentina, a strong earthquake has hit the western province of San Juan and the U.S. Geological Survey said it was a 6.4 magnitude followed by a series of aftershocks, at least one of which came almost 20 minutes later and 1,000 kilometers away.

The quake was powerful enough to rattle these clothing racks in this shop. There is no threat of a tsunami at this time. We will continue with updates right here on CNN.

A chaotic scene in Guatemala as police and soldiers confront migrants hoping to reach the U.S. Authorities say many as 8,000 people are traveling in this caravan that left Honduras last week. Many camped out on highway overnight and security forces took action to move them out. Here's Patrick Oppmann.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PATRICK OPPMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Guatemalan police and soldiers on Monday, continue to clash with a large caravan of migrants heading through the country to Mexico, as they eventually try to reach the U.S.-Mexico border.

Over the weekend, as the caravan left Honduras and entered Guatemala, their police used stun grenades, tear gas and hit this group of migrants with batons, trying to draw them back into Honduras.

With thousands of the migrants did enter into Guatemala, and on Monday police continued to try and disperse them and tried to keep them from advancing, through Guatemala into Mexico. The president of Mexico says that he's been in touch with both members of the Biden, the incoming Biden administration and the Trump administration about this caravan.

It seems to indicate that both administrations have a very different view on immigration policy, are concerned with this caravan. The policy at least for the time being, is to try to keep caravans like this one from reaching the U.S.-Mexico border, possibly entering into the United States.

A number of these migrants have talked to the media, including CNN Espanol. They said that the two hurricanes that hit the region late last year and the pandemic has only made the situation in countries like Guatemala, like Honduras and El Salvador worse.

That is why you're seeing people continue trying to leave the region. As well and a number of the migrants said that they are expecting President-Elect Joe Biden will change U.S. immigration policy and that migrants upon reaching the U.S.-Mexico border, might be able to ask for asylum and actually enter the U.S. again.

As they have been able to do in former years, until the Trump administration made that impossible and enacted a policy of driving migrants back, keeping them in Mexico, not allowing them to ask for asylum.

But it seems that so far at least, for the coming months, there will not be any immediate change. So while these migrants are undergoing a difficult and dangerous journey to the United States, they may not be receiving the welcome they're hoping for -- Patrick Oppmann, CNN, Havana.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: Alexei Navalny is urging his supporters to take to the streets in protest later on this week. The Kremlin critic was ordered to remain in custody for 30 days in a surprise hearing on Monday.

He was detained as soon as he arrived from Germany the night before. He spent months there recovering from being poisoned with the nerve agent Novichok. Fred Pleitgen now reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Things are moving extremely fast here in Moscow after the arrival and detention of Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny here in Moscow on Sunday.

There was a hearing that took place on Monday. And it was really something that was remarkable, because Alexei Navalny said that, early in the morning, guards came into his cell. They told him there would be a hearing against him that day.

That hearing then started only a couple of minutes later. During that hearing, Alexei Navalny was set to remain in detention for at least another 30 days. Of course, there are several other cases against him here in this country. So he could be sentenced to much longer than that.

But in the meantime he will remain in custody for 30 days as of right now. Alexei Navalny, for his part, urged his supporters to take to the streets and protest against his detention. Here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALEXEI NAVALNY, RUSSIAN OPPOSITION LEADER: What is this toad afraid of, what are these crooks sitting in their bunkers most afraid of?

You know very well: people taking to the streets.

That is the political factor you cannot ignore. That's the most important factor, the essence of politics.

[02:25:00]

NAVALNY (through translator): So come to the streets, not for me but for yourself and your future.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PLEITGEN: The date for that mass action is set to be January 23rd, which is, of course, this upcoming Saturday. And those actions are set to take place in several cities. Alexei Navalny was detained here in Moscow upon arrival at the airport

before he even managed to enter the country. He managed to kiss his wife goodbye, give her one last hug and went into the arms of the authorities, who then put him in detention in the north of Moscow.

Right now he is situated in one of the most infamous jails here in the city, the Matrosskaya Tishina jail, which is east of the city and in the past has housed very famous prisoners, like Mikhail Khodorkovsky and Sergei Magnitsky as well. It's a very, very rough place. There is a lot of people who are very concerned about the health and safety of Alexei Navalny -- Fred Pleitgen, CNN, Moscow.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: Ahead on CNN, the potential timeline of President Trump's impeachment trial and why Rudy Giuliani said he will not be part of Trump's legal team.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(MUSIC PLAYING)

CURNOW: Welcome back to CNN NEWSROOM. It's 28 minutes past the hour. I'm Robyn Curnow.

The National Mall in Washington, D.C., might be closed to the public but it was still lit up on Monday ahead of the presidential inauguration. Today's president Donald Trump's final full day in office, when he is expected to issue a flurry of pardon and commutations.

President-Elect Joe Biden will start the day in Wilmington, Delaware, before traveling to Washington. Later he will take part in a national memorial ceremony to remember those Americans who have died from the coronavirus.

Those pardons from Donald Trump will likely be his last major act as president. But as Kaitlan Collins now reports, he's planning several more things before he goes.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: It's President Trump's final full day in office. His schedule looks a lot like it has for the last several weeks, ever since, of course, he lost that presidential election to Joe Biden, where he says he has "many calls and many meetings."

But beyond that, not a lot of details on Trump's schedule.

And, of course, we have not seen him publicly since last Tuesday, when we went in Texas to visit the border wall. And one thing we are expecting, though, in this final full day that Donald Trump is in office, is a list of pardons to come our way, because the president is expected to pardon or commute the sentences of about 100 people today.

[02:30:00]

COLLINS: That's what we're hearing from sources so far.

And we know he has spent several days reviewing that final list of what that's going to look like, including meeting with Jared and Ivanka Trump, as he did on Sunday.

He had another meeting on pardons Monday. So we are expected to get that list today because Wednesday is going to be the president's final trip out of Washington as a current president. He is leaving before Joe Biden is going to be sworn in.

But there are new questions about just how many people are going to be at that sendoff ceremony for the president at Joint Base Andrews because we know the White House has invited a lot of people. They can bring up to five guests per invitation.

But we've heard from some people who say they are not going because of the travel restrictions there happening in D.C., given that seats on Capitol Hill or the fallout from the president's response to that attack.

And so it's an open question of what that ceremony is going to look like for the president. That's what we're monitoring.

Whether the president is going to be here in public or just make that video that we know he taped on Monday, that final farewell address highlighting his accomplishments, that is something we expect the White House to release today.

But beyond that, it still remains to be seen what the president is going to do, at least publicly -- Kaitlan Collins, CNN, the White House.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: Thank you, Kaitlan, for that reporting from the White House.

Meanwhile, the timing of President Trump's impeachment trial has not been set but it could begin as early as next week. That's according to sources. The president's personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, will not be part of the defense team. He told ABC News he cannot defend Mr. Trump because he may be called as a witness since he spoke at the rally that preceded the D.C. riot. Manu Raju has more on the timing of the trial.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This was dictated in part by the decision by the Speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi, to actually formally transmit the article of impeachment over to the Senate to begin the Senate trial.

That article, of course, approved by a bipartisan majority in the House last week on the charge that president Donald Trump incited an insurrection. And if 17 Republican senators joined with 50 Democrats in the Senate, they could convict Donald Trump and prevent him from ever holding office again.

But it still needs to begin. And once the article is transmitted, that would actually lead -- force the Senate to act the next day. And it comes just as Joe Biden is coming into office on Wednesday, trying to get his cabinet nominees confirmed by the Senate and move on legislation, including a major COVID relief package.

So you are seeing a collision course of sorts, with the Senate trying to move forward on the trial but also Biden pushing to get his agenda through, requiring cooperation from Republicans and Democrats in the Senate to do both.

Uncertain if that will happen, so a lot of questions on the timing, questions of how long this trial will last, whether or not Democrats will bring in witnesses and the like or whether they're trying to wrap this up quickly but also the question, will Republicans break ranks, convict Donald Trump and part overlying the question of Democrats lay out in the weeks ahead.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: Manu Raju reporting from the Capitol.

I want to bring in Harry Litman, a former U.S. attorney and legal affairs columnist for the "Los Angeles Times" and host of the podcast, "Talking Feds."

Good to see you, sir. Thank you for joining me.

HARRY LITMAN, FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL: Thank you, Robyn.

CURNOW: As you heard Kaitlan there reporting, we are going to see probably today a flurry of pardons before the end of this president's term. Now that is not unusual.

But what is going to be unusual about this?

What are you expecting?

LITMAN: I think what you mentioned is the only thing that is not going to be unusual. Trump has broken every rule and norm in his use of pardon power so far, some very flagrantly, potentially criminally.

But also, in general, there is a system set up here to be sure than anyone who gets a pardon has expressed remorse for his criminal conduct or her criminal conduct and return to a productive life.

That has been something that the president has completely ignored. Now I think there will be some in this flurry that will be run of the mill.

But I am looking for, in particular, will he try to pardon himself?

That, of course, could potentially have implications for his impeachment trial.

Will he issue what is called a blanket pardon, where he tries to just say any and all crimes you have committed, you are excused?

And will there be any final pardons, as there has been already that have the sort of whiff of a quid pro quo an, illegal exchange of something for the president?

Those would be the ones that would be most likely to be illegal. But of course, pardons are weird because, unless they are challenged in court, you never really get a definitive assessment by a judge of whether they are lawful or not.

CURNOW: So is that the reason why some have dissuaded the president from preemptively pardoning himself?

[02:35:00]

CURNOW: Essentially that act would perhaps be forcing him to open himself up to more legal testing, more legal jeopardy.

LITMAN: Yes, but that and also the trial -- you can imagine, there seems to be 4, 5, 6 Republicans who could vote to convict. But it is very fluid and it could especially fall like dominoes if Mitch McConnell decides to convict.

Now if you are sitting in judgment on the president and he has just issued a pardon for himself in a criminal system, that I think really displays his contempt and sort of his placing himself above the law. I think that makes senators more likely to convict and especially for the consequence, as you have mentioned, of keeping him from holding future office.

CURNOW: There is a political and a legal dissuasion, I suppose, for him not to preemptively pardon himself.

What about his family?

That again has been thrown out.

Also something that has been thrown out, is could the president pardon himself or his family secretly, that he could behind the scenes give himself a get out of jail card free, and then whip it out when potentially federal charges are brought against him in the future?

LITMAN: Right, keep it in his pocket until he lands on that square.

Well, look, as I was saying, we have very little by way of precedent here. What would have to happen is the government would have to challenge that pardon and take it to court. You cannot just get an advisory opinion from a court.

But there is a suggestion that you can do this so-called hidden in the back pocket pardon, mainly because it has never been held you can't. But if you think about it, if you think about the public accountability need in a pardon and the ultimate check being the people and whether it's fair, I think back to controversial pardons like in the past, like Marc Rich with Bill Clinton.

It seems at least to be going against the grain of what they are supposed to be. But I think it is a general assumption that there is no precedent that would say he cannot try that sort of stratagem; family, same kind of thing.

Especially will it be a blanket pardon?

Again, pardons are supposed to be after expressing remorse for a crime, not for a person. So when you just say anything you might have done, that is really pushing it. It has happened once or twice for special reasons. But it is really pushing it.

CURNOW: Really pushing it. That is one way to put it, I suppose. I suppose. Wow, lots that could potentially happen in the next 48 hours. Harry Litman, great speaking with you. Have a lovely weekend.

LITMAN: Thank you, you as well.

CURNOW: You are watching CNN. I am Robyn Curnow. Coming up Donald Trump's presidency is coming to an end and that means moving out of the White House. Cue the Internet memes. That's just ahead as well.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[02:40:00]

(MUSIC PLAYING)

CURNOW: Country singer Garth Brooks will perform at the inauguration of President-Elect Joe Biden. Brooks accepted the invitation from Jill Biden for what he calls a statement of unity. The statement says he has performed for multiple U.S. presidents, Republicans and Democrats, and considers it a great honor.

Brooks will perform as part of the swearing-in ceremony at the Capitol. He says he is ready for the U.S. to come together.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARTH BROOKS, SINGER: I might be the only Republican at this place but it's reaching across, loving one another, because that's what's going to get us through probably the most divided times that we have. I want the divided times to be behind us.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CURNOW: The Trump administration is packing up and moving out of Pennsylvania Avenue and, on social media, many critics of the president were moved not to tears but to cheers, as Jeanne Moos now reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Just to hear the sounds that moving makes can induce anxiety.

But when the moving trucks are in front of 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue?

Well, reality just parked in front of the White House. Those who are anti-Trump instantly became pro-moving.

Whoo hoo!!

Sure, some have claimed moving is more stressful than even divorce. But for Trump opponents, it is, oh, happy day, all the way. Watching empty boxes go by, crates ready to be filled with belongings, framed mementos of an administration whose time is up, inspiring digs like, "I hope they brought enough moving blankets to protect Trump's fragile ego."

STEPHEN COLBERT, CBS HOST: I have never found a moving truck so moving.

MOOS (voice-over): Moving trucks are being monitored all the way to Mar-a-lago, where a couple of massive ones were spotted, as stuff was unloaded into the club.

The move is leaving mockery in its wake. President Trump at the wheel of a golf cart, towing a U-haul. When that bust of Lincoln was spotted being moved out of the White House, critics were quick to suspect the worst.

JIMMY KIMMEL, ABC HOST: He is going to use that as a hood ornament on his golf cart.

MOOS (voice-over): But the White House Historical Association confirmed they are confident items being removed from the West Wing are being handled appropriately. Pieces are loaned to each new administration and then returned.

And don't have a bird over that stuffed pheasant. That's the wife of chief of staff Mark Meadows, packing up his personal mementos.

Egged on by comedian Samantha Bee, who turned in a parting framed photo into a whiteboard so the Internet could have at it, the image was recycled, from young Donald Trump in a bathrobe, to bare-chested Geraldo Rivera, to hair as turbulent as the man it crowns.

Instead of a second inauguration on Capitol Hill, it was this "Hillbillies" reference to moving.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(MUSIC PLAYING)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): So they loaded up the truck and moved to Beverly -- Hills, that is.

MOOS (voice-over): Make that Mar-a-lago, that is -- Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: And thanks for watching CNN. I'm Robyn Curnow. Find me on Instagram and Twitter @RobynCurnowCNN and do stay with CNN as we prepare for a big week, the U.S. inauguration of President-Elect Biden. But first I will hand you over to "WORLD SPORT," up next after this break.

(WORLD SPORT)

[03:00:00