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Sources: Biden Inheriting Nonexistent Vaccine Distribution Plan; Biden Signs Flurry Of Exec. Orders Dismantling Trump's Policies; McCarthy Voices Support For Cheney Staying In GOP Leadership. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired January 21, 2021 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[12:30:00]

DR. ROCHELLE WALENSKY, CDC DIRECTOR: And we're going to stick to that plan. But I also want to be very cognizant of the fact that after 100 days, there are still a lot of Americans who need vaccine. And so we have our pedal to the metal.

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JOHN KING, CNN HOST: Joining us now to discuss Dr. Celine Gounder, an infectious disease expert and epidemiologist who was an advisor to President Biden during the transition. Dr. Gounder, it's great to see you. I'm grateful for your time on this day.

We talked public health issues, and that's what we need to talk about. But I also want to talk a little bit about a sense of political spin here. The new team is saying that there was no Trump vaccination plan and they're coming in essentially blind, you are part of the transition. Right now, about 890,000 vaccines being administered every day, that's what Joe Biden inherits. They want to get to a million a day. That's 100,000, 110,000 plus more, it sounds like that's not a giant jump. Why is there such trepidation about it?

DR. CELINE GOUNDER, FORMER BIDEN TRANSITION CORONAVIRUS ADVISER: John, you just played segments with Dr. Fauci and Dr. Walensky, I don't really think there's actually a contradiction between what each of them is saying. I do think the team is really on track to get to 100 million doses in 100 days, assuming there are no major glitches with manufacturing the vaccines. So I do think we're on target for that.

But I do think Dr. Walensky makes a great point, which is that that is only a fraction of Americans. We have 330 million Americans in this country. A 100 million is only a fraction of them. And so we still have a lot of work to do beyond that.

KING: And so as you mentioned a lot of work beyond that, in that period, you have to be better at everything else, right, to keep -- if you want to keep the case count trending down from a horrifically high point, but at least heading in the right direction, you got to be better at just about everything else. And so today, we're going to get from the new president executive orders, dealing with supplies for vaccination testing, PPE, a much more aggressive use of the Defense Production Act, we are told, COVID- 19 pandemic testing board, guidance for safer reopening schools, this is a test, the new President setting this bar saying he wants dramatically speed up the reopening of schools, the requiring of mask wearing where Joe Biden can mandate it, President Biden, federal property, federal transportation and the like, and creating this COVID-19 Health Equity Task Force.

Walk through the transition conversations in terms of OK, here's what we can do in the first week, here's what will take two or three weeks or a month, but walk through sort of the sequencing of things that you can do quickly that have an impact.

GOUNDER: Well, I think a lot of what you can do quickly is with the executive orders, which you just listed off many of them. I think some of the other executive orders that we're looking at are around travel. So international travel, we're going to be reinstituting, the current administration is going to reinstitute the requirement that people coming in from overseas have a negative COVID test.

Currently, there is a loophole for American citizens and permanent residents of the U.S. And so there may be further strengthening of guidance around travel. So for example, perhaps requiring quarantine and testing of American citizens and permanent residents upon return from international travel. So those are the kinds of things you can do with executive orders do quickly.

Other things that can be done more quickly are invoking the Defense Production Act, so to scale up production of PPE, of many of the supplies. One major limiting factor has been the production of these plastic tips that we use in the robotic machines and labs that run the test for COVID and the genomic sequencing. And so things like that we can move on pretty quickly here.

KING: It's going to be fascinating to watch this whole separate -- whole new set of accountabilities we move forward to the administration. Dr. Gounder, grateful for your help now and in the past, we'll continue the conversation as we go forward.

[12:33:44]

And when we come back, the Biden administration trying to start a new chapter by erasing a lot of President Trump's policies.

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KING: Change is the new President's top priority, changes in COVID policy, changes in immigration policy, changes in climate policy. Joe Biden out of the box as President trying to show he's turning the page from the Trump administration on many, many big issues. The question is, can he do that, especially here in a very divided polarized Washington. Take a look. Here's the cover of "Time Magazine", the new cover out today illustrating the challenge, that's quite a mess. You see there. Challenge for the new President in the days and weeks ahead as he works to push his agenda through under the backdrop. On the one hand, he says unity. On the other hand, he wants to do a lot of things that Republicans flat out oppose. Joining me now to discuss, Julie Pace, Washington bureau chief for the Associated Press, Laura Barron-Lopez, White House correspondent for POLITICO.

And Julia that is the challenge, you wrote about this after the inauguration yesterday. Joe Biden remembers bipartisanship. He thinks he can go back to that era. You're right Biden's ability to get that legislation passed will significantly shaped both his administration's ability to tackle the pandemic and his overall standing in Washington. He's staked much of the promise of his presidency on his ability to court lawmakers from across the aisle, touting his long working relationship with Republican senators and the reputation he cultivated as a dealmaker while serving as President Barack Obama's number two.

There are a lot of Democrats and even some Republicans who say that era is gone, but Joe Biden seems determined to try.

JULIE PACE, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, ASSOCIATED PRESS: Absolutely. And he knows that criticism. He knows that people in both parties say he's simply naive or dealing with a Washington that doesn't exist anymore. And he maintains that he can do this. He says that he's had conversations with a lot of Republicans privately over the last several weeks and feels in those conversations like there is an openness to working with him.

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I do think that, you know, we're going to learn very quickly who is right in this situation. He's going to try to go big on a COVID relief package. And essentially dare Republicans in the middle of this pandemic that is still spiraling in the country to say no to him. He is facing the Republican Party, though, that is still very much dealing with what their own future is going to be. And that too, is going to shape his ability to work with them as they sort through how much working with him is advantageous to their party going forward.

KING: And Laura, Julie mentions he's going to test this early, the COVID package will be one thing to test it on specifics. There are a lot of things in that package Republicans didn't want to do back during President Trump's administration. But now President Biden very early on, it's interesting calling congressional leadership down to the White House to say, let's prove we can work together.

You write about this creative tension is what I'm going to call it, where a lot of Democrats are saying, you know what, they're not going to cooperate, they're not going to give you a path to citizenship, for example, they're not going to give you some of these things that you're going to have to be more aggressive with executive actions. Talk about this tension.

LAURA BARRON-LOPEZ, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, Democrats want to see action early on from President Biden. But Biden, as Julie and you laid out, John, is ever the institutionalist. He's someone who doesn't want to stretch his executive authority. And so he has repeatedly said that he doesn't want to necessarily tackle big things like student loan debt through executive orders. He wants Congress to do that. He said that on his first day in office yesterday.

He and the White House said that they want to see Congress act on that. The question about COVID relief, though, you know, for Biden, and Democrats is how quickly are they going to be able to move on this given all the factors in terms of a slim house majority, a 50-50 Senate were the terms of this agreement between the two leaders between the Democratic and Republican leader and how they're going to share control of the Senate isn't even worked out yet.

All of that is pushing things down the road and whether or not they want to go big early or they just want to get little items done fast, like money for vaccine distribution is a big question that they're facing right now.

KING: Another great magazine cover in "The Economist", we showed you "The Time" cover at the top of the segment about a messy Oval Office and it messes Joe Biden. Look at this one here, "Morning after in America", the new President, President Biden, with a mop and a pail, the White House soiled behind him.

That is some of the mood and the spirit here in Washington, but he's the President now. And as he has said, just got to get to work, got to do it, no matter what the climate is, you got to do it. Julie Pace, how much does this question of, when will the impeachment trial start? How long will it last? How much does that hangover, the Biden agenda?

Again, you're asking Republicans to do some things they've been previously unwilling to do. You're trying to test with Trump on the sidelines. Can you get a couple of Republicans on this issue, a couple more on that issue? How worried are they that it's essentially putting poison in the well, if you have an impeachment trial?

PACE: Well, I thought it was really notable that in Jen Psaki's press briefing last night that she really danced around this question and didn't want to address a timeframe for this impeachment trial or any parameters around it at all. But this is the reality of what they have to deal with. And there's a lot of tension, not just between Democrats and Republicans over this, but within the Democratic Party, too, because you have a lot of Democrats who say, this is a moment to hold the outgoing President, the former President accountable for his actions, we shouldn't just take a pass because he's no longer sitting in the Oval Office.

They want to see some action on this. But you do have other somewhat more moderate Democrats who are saying that may be for the sake of the Biden agenda, that this would not be the smartest move. So Pelosi didn't show a lot of leg on this earlier today when she addressed reporters, but this is something that they're going to have to make a fast decision on. Otherwise, the question itself just becomes the thing that hangs over the agenda as much as an impeachment trial actually would.

KING: And the tone, the new President sets and the new President's team set are very important in these early days. So Julia mentioned Jen Psaki had a briefing on the first night. That's good. We want to have transparency. We want to have openness, we want to question them.

One interesting, though, Laura Barron-Lopez, you wrote about this during the campaign. Now you're covering the White House. Progressives are a little wary about Joe Biden because of his past history is more of a centrist and if we go way back more of a conservative Democrat, a conservative reporter asked Jen Psaki about taxpayer money the Hyde Amendment goes back to former Congressman Henry Hyde, the Mexico City policy to keep taxpayer money away from policies that support abortions. And here's the answer.

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JEN PSAKI, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I will just take the opportunity to remind all of you that he is a devout Catholic and somebody who attends church regularly. He started his day attending church with his family this morning. But I don't have anything more for you on that.

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KING: Not an answer to the substance. If you're a progressive watching how this new President is going to where he's going to plant his legs that might be curious.

BARRON-LOPEZ: Might be curious and it could also elicit a lot of reactions from the progressive, John. They are going to hold the new administration's feet to the fire, you know, they've made that perfectly clear that even though there was this pretty much quiet agreement on the campaign trail that they were going to hold their fire. They wanted to see Biden elected because progressives didn't want a second term for President Trump.

[12:45:19]

But now that he's in office, that honeymoon period, we don't know how long it's going to last. It may not last very long, depending on what specific policies and how fast Biden pushes on them. Progressives are definitely going to be trying to get him to move more to their corner.

KING: Most of the conversations, though, are about policies, not about tweets, that is refreshing, that's refreshing. We can air them out. We can air them out maybe even have some votes on them. Laura Barron- Lopez and Julie Pace, grateful the reporting and insights on this important day.

And up next for us, that impeachment push it's also pushing pull for Senator Mitch McConnell when it comes from within his own party. First listen to this. Mitch McConnell no longer the Majority Leader, now the Minority Leader, congratulating the new leader.

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SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R), MINORITY LEADER: I want to congratulate my colleague from New York. He's proud and emotion were palpable yesterday as the self-described kid from Brooklyn, and son of an exterminator and a housewife became the first Jewish member of Congress to lead either chamber and historic milestone.

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[12:50:52]

KING: Mitch McConnell is now the leader of a Republican Senate Minority that one of the big dramatic changes here in Washington right now. But this dynamic is familiar, McConnell confronting another test of how closely to stick with Donald Trump. McConnell leaving the door open to voting to convict the former President and an impeachment trial but that has some members of his own Republican family deeply unhappy, some of them warning they would no longer support him as leader, should he follow through on that.

And on the House side conflict as well. The number three Republican House, Liz Cheney, voted to impeach then President Trump and she now faces questions about whether she should stay in leadership. Today, this vote of confidence from the Republican House leader Kevin McCarthy.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Liz Cheney to remain as conference chair or no?

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): Yes.

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KING: Let's get straight up Capitol Hill, CNN's Manu Raju. Some interesting republican family dynamics.

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, no question about it. McCarthy also said that there will be a debate next week about Liz Cheney's role within the House Republican conference. And McCarthy himself has come under criticism about his handling of the run up to the what we saw on January 6th, the deadly violence here on Capitol Hill. He signed on to that Texas lawsuit seeking to invalidate the results of millions of votes across key battleground states.

He refused to acknowledge Joe Biden's victory until after January 6th. And even after the deadly riots, he voted to overturn the electoral results of Pennsylvania and Arizona. So just moments ago, I asked him if he regretted his role, given the violence that we saw. And if he should have asserted that the election was free and fair.

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MCCARTHY: I denounce any violence, denounced it that day, denounced it now, I denounced it in the summer, I denounced in what happened last night in Portland and Seattle as well. I'm very consistent. What I voted on wasn't to overturn an election because it wouldn't. It's the same thing that Nancy Pelosi said on the floor when she said this is Democracy, we should debate it.

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RAJU: Well, it's clearly not the same as what happened when the Democrats pushed back on previous electoral results. This time, of course, the outgoing President claimed he won, claimed the election was stolen. Kevin McCarthy was one of the few Republicans who, one of the Republican leaders who did not speak out against Donald Trump at that time.

One Republican who did speak out against this just Liz asserted that Joe Biden had won was Mitch McConnell back at after the December 14th timeframe when the Electoral College voted to make Joe Biden's victory official. Mitch McConnell asserted that Joe Biden won the race. He later criticize Donald Trump's handling of the of provoking that violent mob coming to Capitol Hill and questions, John, about whether or not Mitch McConnell could eventually vote to convict Donald Trump in an impeachment trial.

And you mentioned that I talked to a number of Republican senators many say that if he does go down that route, he could potentially lose his job as a top Republican leader, so a lot of difficult questions for Republicans as they still grapple with Donald Trump, even though he's off scene here, John.

KING: Right, one of the giant, giant dynamics here in a very newly realigned a Washington. Manu Raju, grateful for the important reporting today, we'll stay on top of that story as well.

And this hour, a little cleanup from the new administration, confirmation the FBI Director Christopher Wray will keep his job that after the new White House Press Secretary raised some doubts and eyebrows last night at a press briefing.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Got a confidence in the FBI Director?

PSAKI: I think I have not spoken with him about specifically FBI Director Wray in recent days, Peter, but I'll circle back with you if there's more to convey.

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KING: Jen Psaki circling back just moments ago. You see it right there, a little cleanup. She says the President has confidence in the job Director Wray is doing. Wray has more than six years left on his 10 year term, leading the FBI.

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Up next for us, what's next for the QAnon and its conspiracy theories now that Donald Trump is gone and President Biden is in the White House?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) KING: Right up until noon yesterday, some members who follow the QAnon conspiracy theory thought that somehow Donald Trump would stay in office, somehow that he would block the Biden inauguration. So now what? CNN business correspondent Donie O'Sullivan joins us now. Donie, there were those who thought martial law some dramatic move Trump would stay? Nope.

DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN BUSINESS REPORTER: Yes, John, some QAnon followers are really in shock this morning. You know, they were told the election was stolen. They believe that Biden would in some way his inauguration would be stopped because Trump would declare martial law. And in the very early hours of yesterday morning, about nine hours before inauguration, I bumped into a Trump supporter who is streaming live on YouTube. And he believed this martial law conspiracy theory. And after Biden was sworn in, I caught up with him in the afternoon. And here's what he had to say.

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WILLIAM WIETING, TRUMP SUPPORTER: I was just kind of in shock. And I thought I had to reevaluate everything the way my life was going to be now, because it's so different than my expectations. And I literally was just kind of walking around like, what now?

O'SULLIVAN: Do you think maybe the way you're wrong with Joe Biden being sworn in you might be wrong about the whole election rigging thing?

WIETING: No, I'm convinced that the election was a fraud.

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O'SULLIVAN: And so here's the challenge, John, right, because you can see there he realized that he believed one conspiracy theory, but will not accept this the lies about the elections of conspiracy theory. He says he still believes that it's actually left wing agitators, not Trump supporters who were responsible for the violent insurrection two weeks ago.

So you know, there is still a major problem in this country, and it's going to be with us for some time to common, it's something that the Biden ministration might have to address.

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KING: It certainly is. And I hope those followers slowly figure out they've been on the wrong path but we shall see.