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GOP Leaders Face Critical Test Over Fate of Representatives Green and Cheney; Merrick Garland's Confirmation Being Delayed by Lack of Power-Sharing Deal; Senate Democrats Still Without Committee Control Due to Power-Sharing Agreement Stalemate; Democrats Moving Ahead Without GOP Support on COVID Relief; CVS and Walgreens to Begin Giving Shots Next Week. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired February 03, 2021 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:24]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: A very good Wednesday morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Poppy Harlow.

It really is a critical day for the Republican Party and its path forward. Two congresswomen, two very different visions and values. And hours from now, Republicans will hold a meeting to debate their fate. Liz Cheney is fighting to keep her leadership post after voting to impeach former President Trump, and freshman Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene is fighting to keep her spot on the Education Committee despite pushing conspiracy theories and endorsing violence.

The future of the party is at stake here. We're following all those headlines.

SCIUTTO: And this. While Democrats are moving forward without Republicans to get Americans' COVID relief aid, the White House is ramping up vaccine efforts. The new plan, send vaccine doses directly to community pharmacies. It is an all-out push to get ahead of more fast-moving variants.

But first, we begin on Capitol Hill. Lauren Fox is tracking the Republican rift between Trump loyalists, longstanding conservatives.

Lauren, where do we stand? You know, you have two politicians' fate at stake here. Marjorie Taylor Greene, but also Liz Cheney's leadership position.

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's exactly right, Jim. And last night, we should note that Kevin McCarthy, the minority leader in the House of Representatives, he actually sat down for an hours-long meeting with Marjorie Taylor Greene to talk about her future. We are told that the minority leader is still undecided about whether or not she will keep her post. But essentially we are learning from that meeting that Marjorie Taylor

Greene did not apologize for the past statements that she has made. I heard from one Republican member of Congress who told me, you know, if she doesn't apologize and she doesn't back away from these theories that she has purported in the past, we really have no other option except to remove her from her committees.

Now, meanwhile, Democrats are going to hold a meeting today to begin the discussion about removing her from her committees by essentially having a vote on the House floor. That, of course, would be unusual. Usually this is a decision that is made by House leadership. But this is all coming as Republicans are expected to have a meeting this afternoon to discuss the future of Liz Cheney.

She is, again, a member of leadership in the House Republican Conference, but she voted to impeach former President Donald Trump, and has frustrated many of her colleagues because she made that decision while being the conference chairwoman. Now we expect that this meeting could be full of fireworks. It could, you know, take a lot of different paths. We do know that Cheney has been talking with members, having conversations with members, trying to shore up her support going into that meeting.

But a lot on the line. And I mean, this is really about a juxtaposition. What is the Republican party going to be? Are they the party of Marjorie Taylor Greene or are they the party of Liz Cheney? Two very distinct visions and paths here -- Poppy and Jim.

HARLOW: You're so right, Lauren. Thank you very much. Stand by. We'll get back to you in just a moment.

But let's bring in our special correspondent Jamie Gangel as well as former Republican congressman of Pennsylvania, Charlie Dent.

Good to have you both here. I think Lauren said it so well. Which way do you go? It's a fork in the road and your decision has a ton of consequences. And the question is, which is it going to be?

I thought it was interesting, Jamie, to hear South Dakota Republican John Thune say this about the party that he's part of. Do they want to be the party of limited government and fiscal responsibility, free markets, peace through strength and pro-life or do they want to be the party of conspiracy theories and QAnon? I think that's the decision they've got to face. It's a big distraction for them right now and not in a good way.

If they don't, Jamie, strip Marjorie Taylor Greene of her committee assignments, does the party not risk emboldening her the way that Trump was emboldened by not being convicted of impeachment the first time and does it hurt the party, big picture, long term?

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: I think that's absolutely correct. But it not only emboldens her, it emboldens that wing of the party.

I just got some reporting this morning. I spoke to a source familiar -- Republican source familiar with Kevin McCarthy's meeting with Marjorie Taylor Greene last night who told me that Kevin McCarthy actually, in addition to trying to get her to apologize, tried to convince her to resign on her own from the committees, which was a nonstarter. And so that's where they are today.

[09:05:03]

They had the steering committee meeting. That didn't go any place. There's talk of another steering committee meeting. But to your point, politically, big picture, absolutely this is a reckoning for the party. Are they going to cling to Donald Trump? Is Kevin McCarthy going to go running down to Mar-a-Lago because he's worried about fundraising? Or are they going to move past him?

And I think the real answer is in a lot of Republican swing districts, they will not win those seats. Trump Republicans may win primaries, but they won't win generals.

SCIUTTO: But, Charlie, the issue here with all this focus on Greene is that Trump is not mentioned, isn't it? Right? He's the 800-pound gorilla in the room. Marjorie Taylor Greene is a first-term congresswoman. A lot of Republicans willing to call her out but not do the same for Trump. I mean, you can sanction Greene all you want, but what's the importance to the direction of the party if it does not say, listen, Trump, the conspiracy theorist in chief for four years, right, we disavow him as well?

CHARLIE DENT, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Correct, Jim. Look, the Republican Party has to make a decision. I think McConnell is right. I think Liz Cheney is right. That the party needs to make a clean break from Trump, and I would argue a clean break from Trumpism with all of its ugly populism, isolationism, protectionism, nihilism. We need to make that break. That's how Marjorie Taylor Greene is able to thrive because Trumpism is able to thrive.

So I think it's important that the Republican Party stand up right now and not only remove Marjorie Taylor Greene from her committees but then also eject her from the House Republican conference and then also tell her that we're going to work with the Georgia GOP to defeat her in the primary and that she should enjoy the rest of her time in Congress. They have to be very strong on this and defend Liz Cheney.

They are making -- Adam Kinzinger, you know, is trying to lead a movement, as he should. He needs additional support. It just can't be Adam Kinzinger speaking. You know what you call a guy who is a leader with no followers is just a guy taking a walk. So we need to empower Adam Kinzinger and those who want a new direction for the party that is much more socially tolerant, constructively engaged on the international and domestic stage for that matter, and embracing free markets or reasonable regulation, developing policy solutions that are outside of their comfort zone on issues like climate change or immigration. So time to make the break.

HARLOW: Why, Jamie, is it so hard for Kevin McCarthy to make this decision? I mean, I know he doesn't really want to make it. The subcommittee is going to make that decision. It's like you either think the party should go this way or you don't. I mean, I don't even know what there is to debate for hours in the meeting.

GANGEL: I think Charlie can probably answer that question pretty bluntly about Kevin McCarthy. Look, the things that you hear from members about Kevin McCarthy is that he wants to please everyone. That he --

HARLOW: And wants to be speaker, right?

GANGEL: And he wants to be speaker. And right now, it seems that he has -- I mean, obviously he went running down to see Trump but that he's gotten on the same side as the Freedom Caucus. Jim Jordan, Andy Biggs, Matt Gaetz, and that is very much the anti-Liz Cheney. The other thing that some people may not realize is that those same Freedom Caucus members endorsed Marjorie Taylor Greene. So Kevin McCarthy has to decide which side he's on. He hasn't really shown an ability to do that.

SCIUTTO: And listen, the party has got to make a calculation as to what side the voter is on as well, right? And there's a real split there, although it seems that the voters by and large stick with the Trump wing.

Jamie, Charlie, please stick around. We have more questions for you. But let's bring back Lauren Fox because the other big thing, still, waiting to happen on the hill today is a power-sharing deal among Republicans and Democrats.

I mean, listen, it's 50-50 but with the VP breaking the tie, Democrats are the majority. What's holding up a rule setting deal here so they can get on to other business?

FOX: Well, it has been weeks, Jim, that we have been waiting for an agreement that would officially shift over who controls the committees' gavels. And that's obviously very important because those committees are setting the agenda for when Biden's nominees can move through. And there are different relationships on these committees. Some committee chairs have allowed these nominations to advance even though Democrats don't technically control the committees anymore.

[09:10:02]

But this is becoming a major problem in the Judiciary Committee where we are still waiting on that confirmation hearing for Biden's nominee for attorney general, Merrick Garland. You heard Lindsey Graham, the current chairman of that committee, saying that he is not going to hold a hearing on Monday because he thinks that this should be a two- day hearing. They're starting the impeachment trial on Tuesday. Therefore, he thinks that this is not a good time to hold that confirmation hearing.

That's significant. And so we are still waiting on this agreement between McConnell and Schumer. I am told that they are at the end of these negotiations, but there is a belief that McConnell is dragging his feet to make this take longer and longer. And, obviously, throwing up those traps makes it very difficult for Democrats to do the work that they need to, to get Biden's nominees in place. HARLOW: OK, Lauren, thank you again for that.

Let's bring Jamie and Charlie back in.

Charlie, you know, we -- I just wonder why it's been such a hold-up to get a power-sharing agreement and also, if you are at all surprised that there's not been a bigger sort of stink made about it. Technically, you still have the Republicans running these committees then, right?

DENT: Right. Look, they need to adopt something close to -- the Senate needs to adopt something close to the model that was reached by -- the agreement reached by Trent Lott and Tom Daschle back in 2001, where I believe at that time, ties went to the majority. So in the committee if there was a tie vote, the bill or the nomination would then move to the floor. So they need to come up with that agreement relatively quickly.

It can be done. If they could do it in 2001, they can do it now. Now I get it that, you know, life is a lot different today than it was then, but it shouldn't be that hard to reach that type of agreement and they should do it, you know, ASAP.

SCIUTTO: Jamie Gangel, all this talk in Washington of unity and that that was Biden's message in the campaign and on Inauguration Day. Of course, you know, forgive me for questioning the sincerity on the other side given that this has been a very partisan town for some time. I'm just curious where the politics are.

Do Republicans and Democrats have a political motivation here to compromise on, for instance, like a rule sharing agreement but also, really, the principal question, on COVID relief? I mean, where do the politics push them right now?

GANGEL: I think there's no question on COVID relief. Every city, every state, red or blue, people are suffering. So you would think at the very least that they could come to some agreement on that.

I think that the politics still very much depend on what's leftover of Donald Trump and the last four years, and just how tight that margin is. Yes, the Democrats have it and with one vote by Kamala Harris if she needs to do it, but the Republicans are not going to give up an inch of power easily. And we saw them play hardball on Merrick Garland. I just think that it's -- we still have a long way to go. Maybe an impossible way to go for unity.

SCIUTTO: Twice playing hardball on Merrick Garland, just for the record.

GANGEL: Right. Right.

HARLOW: Yes. That's a very good point.

I mean, Charlie, first of all, congratulations on your new role with the Aspen Institute, leading their effort on this and their focus on Congress. But you left. I mean, you left. Jeff Flake left. Rob Portman is leaving. It does seem like there's less and less excitement for the fundamental sort of values of being a Republican. At least within the party these days.

Like, is the party really as excited anymore about small government, about debt reduction, about globalization issues, about being hawkish on foreign policy? It doesn't -- I mean, with the Marjorie Taylor Greene thing it just doesn't seem like that's even what excites a lot of the party anymore.

DENT: Absolutely, Poppy. What I noticed during my time and what frustrated me so much, because of Donald Trump and this whole cult of personality, and I said it at the time. The party had become about a bit of loyalty test to one man rather than to a given set of principles or ideals. And because of Donald Trump's outsized presence, you know, he prevented us from having these kinds of robust policy discussions about what the party should be. Where we should stand on the issues.

And really we're now dealing with a hangover from all of this because, you know, we're having to, you know, deal with the aftermath of the insurrection and we can't even -- Republicans can't even, you know, have serious policy discussions until we somehow address just what happened during this dark period. It's very difficult.

I mean, I can think of all sorts of issues where we should be engaging on great debates.

[09:15:00]

The Keystone pipeline for example, many Republicans, you know, justifiably feel the itching was wrong. But it's hard to have a conversation and we're still --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

DENT: Trying to figure out whether or not we should be embracing, you know, QAnon conspiracy theories and other nuts like that.

SCIUTTO: Yes, it's -- I mean, you're right. It sucks up a lot of oxygen in the room. That would then, you think, accelerate decisions? We'll see. Jamie Gangel, Charlie Dent, thanks to both of you.

DENT: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: And still to come this hour, Democrats are pushing ahead with President Biden's larger coronavirus relief bill with or without Republican support. Is there still room for negotiation? Will Republicans come on board? Plus, how one mother climbed out of QAnon's conspiracy theory rabbit hole. A remarkable report and face-to-face discussion ahead.

HARLOW: And Capitol police officer Brian Sicknick was killed protecting the Capitol and Congress during the insurrection on January 6th. Today, his remains will lie in honor there. A congressional tribute for him will begin on Capitol Hill next hour, and you will see it all live right here. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:20:00]

HARLOW: Democrats really still pushing to go big on their stimulus bill economic relief with or without Republican support. Soon, President Biden will speak with Democratic lawmakers about what remains, Jim, a $1.9 trillion relief package.

SCIUTTO: And there are some Democrats who don't support that size.

HARLOW: Yes --

SCIUTTO: Joe Manchin among them has pushed for something smaller. There is a caucus within the party to push for some sort of compromise if possible. CNN's Jeremy Diamond is at the White House with more. Jeremy, we're hearing that Biden will meet with Senate Majority leader Schumer and Democratic committee leaders. You know, there's a -- and I don't know how much basis there is to this, but there's a story circulating among Republicans that Biden really wants the compromise. He's being pushed --

HARLOW: Right --

SCIUTTO: In this direction by Schumer, Pelosi and others. What are you hearing? Where does the White House stand on this, and is there still room for compromise?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Look, both things can be true here. We have heard President Biden repeatedly in public and in private talking about his desire for bipartisanship, his desire for unity and to actually reach across the aisle and work with Republicans.

We saw him do that in practice when he invited earlier this week, the group of 10 Republican senators over here to the White House to talk about that $1.9 trillion coronavirus relief package. At the same time, President Biden is also mindful of the current -- of the Democratic power in Washington right now. There's a reason why Democrats won the Senate majority with those races in Georgia, and they're going to use that power.

And so, that is where we see President Biden now approaching things. He is still open to working with Republicans to having discussions. We heard Jen Psaki; the White House Press Secretary yesterday pointing out that even as they move forward with his budget reconciliation process, Republicans will still be able to have inputs, offer up amendments and to continue having some technical discussions about the bill. But the framework of the bill, the broad outlines of this $1.9 trillion package, as of now, it appears that that's going to be what it's going to be as this White House moves forward.

And while we saw those bipartisan talks earlier this week, the optics of today are much different, of course, with President Biden not only dialing in to that 9:45 a.m. call, the house Democratic caucus called this morning in about 20 minutes time and also meeting in the Oval Office, sitting down with Democratic leaders in the Senate to hash out this path forward. So, it is clear at this point that the White House is moving forward with this. There will likely be some changes to this $1.9 trillion package, but again, it does appear that they're moving forward with this and the broad outlines of the bill are pretty much set.

SCIUTTO: Jeremy Diamond at the White House, thanks so much. Well, the Biden administration is also focused on ramping up vaccine distribution, boosting the number of doses given to states by an additional 5 percent. This coming as CVS and Walgreens, the private pharmacy chains, will begin giving shots next week, much like Poppy, we often go for our flu shots.

HARLOW: I can't wait to see that moment. Our Kristen Holmes -- sorry, is following the latest from Washington. That -- I mean, that could make a really big difference to have CVS and Walgreens administering these. The Biden administration says those vaccines are going to go directly to them. What more do we know? Is it like everyone on every corner?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning Poppy and Jim. Well, not quite. And I do want to note here, you know, you're absolutely right. This could make a huge difference. It also --

HARLOW: Yes --

HOLMES: Makes a big difference in supply. You have to remember, so many of these states were actually sending a chunk of their allocated vaccines to these pharmacies, and they no longer have to do that. So, now, they have a larger supply to send to different medical providers, and really just to have overall. But let's take a look at what this retail pharmacy plan will look like here.

You have CVS and Walgreens. As you said starting next week, CVS will start on February 11th, Walgreens on February 12th. CVS is going to deliver expected about 250,000 doses whereas Walgreens is about 170,000 doses. And this goes to your question, Poppy, of where this is going to be. And I want to pull up a map actually here, so you can see this, our viewers can see where this is.

Because CVS is starting just in 11 states. They have plans to expand, but starting with just 11 states, and then you have 15 jurisdictions that Walgreens is in. And so just to quickly run through, you know, in terms of CVS, you have California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Texas and Virginia.

[09:25:00]

The only difference here is it's obviously different states, but also jurisdictions when it comes to Walgreens. They're also adding in New York City, Chicago and Puerto Rico. Now, of course, all of this is part of that effort to boost not only distribution, but administration. They want to get those shots into arms. And I want to pull up the latest numbers here just so that we have them. You can see, we're still really far behind, we have 52.7 million doses distributed, but only 32.8 million actually administered. Again, the goal there is to really ramp up that administration number.

HARLOW: For sure. Kristen, thank you for that reporting very much. Next week could change your lives -- coming up, a story you have to see. A mother and a former QAnon follower explains how her belief in these conspiracy theories impacted her life and her 4-year-old daughter.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Instantly, I went into panic mode. I had to call my mom and I just told her, I was like we're all going to die. We're going to be owned by China, and I was like I might have to pull my daughter out of school because they're going to take her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Goodness, Lord, how that disinformation spreads. Plus, we are moments away from the opening bell on Wall Street. Stock futures mixed this morning, S&P 500 futures trending slightly higher after some strong earnings from Google's parent company Alphabet as well as Amazon. The future is tied to the Nasdaq and the Dow are flat. Investors monitoring negotiations in Washington around that coronavirus relief package. We'll continue to watch the markets and bring you any breaking news developments.

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