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House to Vote on Removing Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-GA) from Committees; CDC Says, Increasing Data Suggests U.K. Variant may Increase Mortality; House Paves Path to Pass COVID Relief Deal with No GOP Votes. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired February 04, 2021 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN NEWSROOM: A very good Thursday morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN NEWSROOM: And I'm Poppy Harlow.

Today, the House will vote to decide whether to strip QAnon-promoting Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene for committee assignments or not. Despite her consistent touting of conspiracy theories and lies, Republican leaders chose not to take action last night. Some even applauded her at one point.

They also decided not to remove number three Republican Liz Cheney from her leadership post. Cheney faced backlash from some in the party for voting to impeach former President Trump, again, Jim, calling it a vote of conscience, but she's able to hang on to that position.

SCIUTTO: Yes, quite a mixed result there from the party.

In minutes, we will hear from House Speaker Nancy Pelosi regarding her thoughts on all of this. We're going to bring you those comments live.

Let's begin on Capitol Hill with CNN's Manu Raju and Lauren Fox.

Manu, so you first. Tell us what we expect to see today in the broader House regarding Marjorie Taylor Greene? Democrats have the majority. We have at least one Republican saying publicly they're vote to remove. So it seems fait accompli for her?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it does. And this is something that is hardly ever if ever done, the House taking action to strip a member of an opposing party's committee assignments. That is something that could create a precedent that future majorities could certainly replicate.

But the Democrats say that they have to move forward now because of the dangerous views that Marjorie Taylor Greene has expressed over her last couple of years, whether it is about the massacres at the Parkland High School in Florida or it is about the -- promoting the QAnon conspiracy theory. They say that there is no room on congressional committees for her and it is time for the House to act. And that is exactly what they will do this afternoon. A simple majority will vote to remove her from the House Budget Committee and the House Education Committee.

Now, this came after the House Republicans refused to take action themselves. The Republican leader, Kevin McCarthy, tried to offer a compromise of sort, swap committees, put under a different committee, the Democrats said that was not good enough. They wanted her off all committee altogether.

And last night during the more than four hour conference meeting, a small portion of that meeting came focused on Marjorie Taylor Greene, mostly about Liz Cheney. But Marjorie Taylor Greene did talk to the conference. She apparently walked back some of her views and they don't represent who they are.

And Kevin McCarthy who talked to us late last night, he suggested that that was good enough for him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): She said she was wrong. She has reached out in other ways and forms.

I think everybody should hear that. And she has expressed that she's put it out from news agencies and others. I think it would be helpful if you could hear exactly what she told all of us. Denouncing QAnon, I don't know if I said it right. I even don't know what it is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: And, of course, he does know what it is. In fact, Kevin McCarthy himself said that QAnon has no place in the Republican Party. He said that before and not last night.

But the Republicans did appreciate what she said privately. They applauded her and stood up, gave her a round of applause, I am told. Then the number of them I talked to afterwards, including McCarthy, said she should say it publicly and denounce the things she said privately. No indication that she is going to do just that and Democrats regardless are moving ahead. Guys?

HARLOW: So, Lauren, I mean, what is interesting is McCarthy there sort of standing up for Marjorie Taylor Greene, being like, well, she didn't really mean it or she doesn't really think it any more. But that stands in stark contrast of what she chose to, yesterday, tell The Washington Examiner in an interview.

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's right. And we should note that this interview occurred before that conference meeting last night. But I do think that it's important, Poppy, to read you sort of what her mindset was going into that conference meeting.

She said, quote, and House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy and all these leaders, the leadership and everyone is proving that they are all talk and not about action and they're all just about doing business as usual in Washington. And so what is the difference between them and the Democrats? There isn't a difference.

She also goes on to say, if she's going to lose her committees, she is going to have more spare time to help try and foster an environment where conservatives can win in some of these House races. She says, quote, I'm going to push the party to the right of where it is, where they need to be and hold these people accountable and help people all over the country, hold them accountable, because that is what needs to happen.

Now, we should underscore that this meeting yesterday that went about four hours was intended to try to bring about some unity for the Republican conference. In fact, when McCarthy came out, he talked about the unit and being important to the future of the party. He said that this is a big enough tent, essentially, to include both Marjorie Taylor Greene's views and Liz Cheney's views.

[10:05:00]

And I think that this interview underscores maybe one of the problematic pieces of that going forward, which is that you have a House member here who clearly thinks that her views should be the future of the Republican Party. Jim and Poppy?

SCIUTTO: Yes. I mean, a big enough tent to include people who lie about the results of the 2020 election and those who don't. I mean, it is as simple as that.

Manu, so Liz Cheney -- there clearly weren't the votes to remove her. I mean, far fewer than those in the so-called Freedom Caucus thought that they had or said that they had. Path forward for her in leadership?

RAJU: That is a big question. I mean, let's say what happens in 2022, the Republicans take the majority and there is a good chance that they could win the majority next year. Where does she lie at that point? Kevin McCarthy will run for speaker at that point. Will she have enough support within her own conference to stay in the leadership position? That remains to be seen.

This is what -- one thing about last night, it's important to note, this was a secret ballot election. That means members could vote however they want without any accountability. I talked to dozen -- more than a dozen members after the meeting and they would not tell me which way they voted. Which also shows you that not a lot of them we know that Donald Trump came after Liz Cheney pretty aggressively for her vote to impeach him but the members realize that they don't have to say one way or another how they came down because their vote is not record and they have the freedom to whatever they want.

So in the secret ballot elections, at the end of the day, Liz Cheney, maybe she could survive another leadership challenge but at the same time it could change dramatically in the next year, guys.

HARLOW: Yes, and how much of that was because it was a secret ballot, right? Thanks, Manu. Thanks, Lauren.

Let's discuss with former GOP Governor and Congressman from South Carolina Mark Sanford. It is really nice to have you. Thanks for joining us.

FRM. REP. MARK SANFORD (R-SC): My pleasure.

HARLOW: You wrote a really interesting op-ed yesterday. We'll get to that in a minute. But building off the conversation we just had with our colleagues, who represents the future of your party? Liz Cheney or Marjorie Taylor Greene?

SANFORD: Well, that is the big contest in Washington, D.C., and we'll see. My suspicion is that yesterday represented something of a waterloo moment with regard to Trumpism within the caucus. I mean, I think that the Cheney vote was actually telling. Though it was secret, you're still looking at two-thirds on the side of Cheney, one-third against.

And given all of the hoopla that had been made by some of the Freedom Caucus members on Cheney needing to go, the fact that she stayed and more importantly the fact that McCarthy made the stand -- I mean, I don't know how his brain is working these days. One minute, he's on the Trump side, the next minute, he's against the Trump side and then for the Trump side.

HARLOW: Isn't that what politicians do?

SANFORD: I hope not. Ideally, there are some principles worth fighting for that they have some duration more than five or ten minutes.

But the fact that he made the statement that did he knowing that that would be a publicly received message from Donald Trump, I think, was telling. And so I think there is a little bit of hope in the water. We'll see.

HARLOW: All right. So your piece yesterday was super interesting. And you called on your party to recognize as a return to the things we once stood for, but in the same breath, you said, but we can't just go back to what we were.

And you called for these five things, an adherence to truth, that would seem obvious but you still have to say it, a tone that is not tone deaf, a re-embrace of reason and you called on people to re- embrace science and re-embrace math. Are they going to do all of these things? Is there political reward for doing that?

SANFORD: There hasn't been over the last four years. I mean, I think that there has been sort of a strange fever existing within the Republican Party that I still don't completely understand. And I understand its basis, its origin, which is going back to exactly what you said a moment ago, what politicians do, one thing and then the other, well, people got sick of it on the right.

And what Republican base has been told is if you have just give us the House, we'll have deliverables for you. And then they said, well, we can't get without if you just give us the Senate, we'll have deliverables for you. And then they said, we can't do with the House and the Senate. Just give us the White House. And they got sick of it.

And so I understand the origin of the frustrations, but the way in which Trump harnessed it, I think, was extremely dangerous and it's created quite a fissure within the party. And the question now, based on Cheney versus Greene question before us today, is do we go back to the origins of what made the party great and a bastion of conservative thought within the national debate that I think is important or do we stay on this weird island that we're on right now. I hope we quickly head back to the places that I think brought the party to prominence.

HARLOW: So, you obviously disagreed with President Trump on a lot, and so you ran against him.

[10:10:00]

But now it is pretty clearly the party of Trump. He's holding a lot of the power still even from Mar-a-Lago, if you look at the poll numbers. What do you think? I mean, would you make another run for it if the party remains like that?

SANFORD: Well, again, my run was never a real run. It was -- the buddies that brought it up, they're (INAUDIBLE), they've already invested 25 years in your life.

HARLOW: Sure, but for standing for something different, I guess.

SANFORD: Right. But their point was what is another couple of months if you might, and it is only might, be able to elevate the debt and deficit and spending issue that's not a part of the national debate on the Republican side. And I think that is tragic. I think it is wrong. I think it's a mistake. And so that was the attempt and it was a total waste of time.

But I think that other people certainly need to run against the current Trumpism element because I think it is leading us in a direction that is a problem for my four boys, I think, in the political sense, it leads us to some sort of desert that we are not coming back from.

When you look at the peel off with suburban women or young millennials, I mean, there are some astoundingly bad things happening in political terms in addition to policy terms that I think suggest we ought to take a different path.

HARLOW: Well, they can't say they weren't warned by a number of people and you.

Former Governor and Congressman, it is very good to have you, Mark Sanford. Thanks very much and I encourage people to read your piece if they haven't already. Thank you. Jim?

SCIUTTO: It is good to hear those voices. Ahead, we're going to speak to Republican Senator Bill Cassidy who backed up Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell's decision to rebuke Marjorie Taylor Greene, what he thinks about McCarthy's decision to punt on this.

Plus, it is an issue so many parents are facing. I'm sure many of you are watching right now. Home schooling and working at the same. But now, the CDC director suggests that schools could reopen safely even if not all teachers have yet been vaccinated.

HARLOW (voice over): We'll talk about that.

Also, millions of Americans are running out of food, they're running out of money because of this pandemic. They have a message for lawmakers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am a real person who had a real job. And now I need help so that I can provide for my children.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:15:00]

SCIUTTO: The CDC director said that new data suggests the coronavirus variant first identified in the U.K. could be deadlier than first thought. The threat of emerging variants is pushing officials to speed up vaccinations, as the CDC's latest ensemble forecast now projects the virus could claim up to 534,000 American lives, more than half a million just by the end of this month.

HARLOW: Our Health Reporter Jacqueline Howard is with us this morning. Good morning to you. What are the headlines you can share?

JACQUELINE HOWARD, CNN HEALTH REPORTER: Yes. You know, one headline is looking into how deadly this variant that was first identified in the U.K., B-117, really how deadly it is. And this -- there is a back story to this. About two weeks ago, the U.K. officials put out a report suggesting that there is some emerging evidence to suggest this variant might have a higher death rate. When that happened, the CDC got in contact with the U.K. to continue investigations into this specific variant. So this is being looked at directly.

And here is what CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky had to say about this in particular. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ROCHELLE WALENSKY, CDC DIRECTOR: We know that some of the variants have increased transmissibility. There is increasing data that suggest that some of the variants, the B-117 variant, may actually be increased -- lead to increased mortality. And the jury is still out with regard to how these vaccines are going to work with regard against these variants.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOWARD: So you see, Jim and Poppy, there are still many questions left to answer, again, looking at the death rate and how deadly the variant might be, and, again, looking at vaccines and how effective are vaccines are against not just the B-117 variant but against other variants as well.

So this is something the CDC is looking into closely. That is the headline, I think, we're being left with here.

SCIUTTO: Yes, and all of that data is coming in in real-time.

Okay, the CDC director, Dr. Walensky, also made this argument. She says that vaccinating teachers and school staff, though a good idea, not a prerequisite for schools to reopen safely. Tell us what they're basing this on.

HOWARD: Yes, this has been somewhat of a debate. And it sounds like what they're basing this on, there has been a new study that was just put out by the Rockefeller Foundation that showed how if certain measures are followed, wearing masks, physical distancing, and testing, rapid antigen testing. If those measures are followed, then we can see a significant decline in the spread of COVID-19 in schools and, therefore, that provides a certain level of protection, which could help ease concern around getting vaccinations done more quickly.

That is what I believe they're basing this approach on. This study specifically found that if antigen testing is put in place weekly for all students, staff and teachers, there could be a 50 percent reduction in infections in high schools, 35 percent reduction in primary schools.

[10:20:01]

Jim and Poppy.

SCIUTTO: That is good data. I mean, we know it works, right? And it is good to see that some things do. Jacqueline Howard, thanks very much.

Joining us now, Dr. Mark McClellan, he is the director of the Duke- Margolis Center for Health Policy and former commissioner of the FDA. We should note, he also sits on Johnson & Johnson's Board of Directors. Good to have you, Dr. McClellan.

DR. MARK MCCLELLAN, DIRECTOR, DUKE-MARGOLIS CENTER FOR HEALTH POLICY: Good to be with you.

SCIUTTO: So I would like to focus on the good news and I just want to get your sense of where things stand. I mean vaccinations do seem to be picking up. I mean, this is the key to ending this thing. Dr. Fauci said he won't be surprised if the J&J vaccine gets emergency authorization soon. Biden administration is now directing shipments to private pharmacies to help get more places out there that could vaccinate us. Where do you see this going? Do you see the number of vaccination picking up and picking up soon? MCLELLAN: Yes, Jim, the ramp up is underway and we need to make more progress., As you said, we're picking up the number of vaccines being administered daily up to an average of about 1.3 million per day, more than 35 million Americans have now been vaccinated, including a lot have gotten those second shots. We do need to make it go faster, though, to stay ahead of those variant strains and to really help contain the pandemic.

If you look ahead, the doses available, the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines, are supposed to reach 100 million each by the end of March. Plus, if the j&J vaccine does come online, as you mentioned, I'm on the board, and that is still in process and still needs a close review by the FDA, that should be happening. That could mean as many as 300 million more doses available in the next quarter.

Now, if we were really going to pick up the pace to be able to use all of the vaccines, to be able to be available by May or June, that means that just about all adult Americans could be vaccinated by the May/June timeframe. But to do that, Jim, we're going to have to get from 1.3 million doses per day where we are now to over 2 million, maybe 2.5 million. I think we can get there by keeping on ramping up the approaches that we're using.

You mentioned pharmacies, mass vaccination locations, getting out into communities that are harder to reach, those can all help us get there.

HARLOW: Doctor, you could explain why this U.K. variant would be actually more deadly, which is what the data show this morning, why would it be more deadly? I mean, I get why it might be more contagious, but why would it be more deadly?

MCCLELLAN: Yes, Poppy, I think it is the same kinds of reasons that make it more contagious, it is able to stick on to the receptors that enable the virus to enter your respiratory cells more avidly. And stronger stick probably means more ability to disrupt those cells, more ability to spread within the body, more consequences for the health of people who are infected.

And it is just a reminder that the stuff that we know works, the distancing, the masks, the vaccination, we really need to double down on those to help prevent that kind of spread and the health consequences too.

SCIUTTO: Reopening schools is the top of so many people's minds, whether you're a parent, like Poppy and I are, or just communities, right, because there are vast cost to school closing. Do you agree with the CDC director that you don't have to have every teacher vaccinated to do this safely, that other measures can bring this under control enough?

MCCLELLAN: Yes, that is right, Jim. We need a combination of measures. The disruption has been tremendous. Most schools are still completely remote, virtual. Especially in urban areas, we've seen the impact so far has been, by many estimates, six to nine months educational impact on populations, especially lower-income and minority population. That is a multi-trillion dollars hit, not to mention many Americans, especially women being out of the workforce because of having to take care of kids at home.

We know we can reopen and it should be through a combination of methods. That testing approach, as you said, is not perfect but it is one step along with distancing, along with good ventilation in schools. We've seen schools reopen successfully and that Rockefeller report, and I'm pleased to say I was part of this work, has shown examples of how to do this.

So it is not up -- none of these measures are perfect, but remember that there is a risk of COVID to kids out in the community and schools that do this well are getting the risks down and deliver better education.

HARLOW: You know what, perfect be the enemy of the good, they say, right? Well, thank you for being here and for your work on that study, it does show a lot. Dr. McClellan, we'll have you back soon.

MCCLELLAN: Thank you.

HARLOW: The number of Americans on food stamps has increased more than 20 percent just in this pandemic. The government has boosted funding to the program but many families are very worried and say it is not enough.

[10:25:02]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: Well, despite no public support from Republican lawmakers so far, the White House today is still pushing to get its stimulus plan to Americans who desperately need relief.

HARLOW: President Biden seems to be holding on out that he will get some Republican senators on board.

[10:30:02]

Let's go to John Harwood, he joins us this morning outside of the White House.

I mean, Mitt Romney very clearly said, you're not going to.