Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

White House Calls COVID Briefing as Death Toll Reaches 500,000; White House Says Teacher Vaccines Not A Prerequisite to Re-Open Schools; Supreme Court Allows Release of Trump Tax Returns; Poll Says 46 Percent Would Leave GOP And Join A Trump Party; Most Crucial Week Yet for COVID Relief Gets Under Way in Congress. Aired 3:30-4p ET.

Aired February 22, 2021 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, CHIEF MEDICAL ADVISER TO THE PRESIDENT: In other words we have vaccines that are out there that are highly efficacious. The manufacturers of these are going to want to know how they can address and modify their vaccines to address the ongoing evolution of variants.

And we expect the manufacturing recommendations to remain the same, and the effectiveness is going to be determined by immunogenicity studies, in other words, likely not have to prove efficacy in a large study.

The same hold true for COVID-19 tests. The updated guidelines describe the FDA's activities to better understand the public health impact on the variants and the impact on the test performances and provide recommendations to the developers of these tests regarding the future genetic mutations and what they need to do when designing or modifying their existing tests.

And finally the same holds true for therapeutics, both drugs and biologics. The FDA will provide recommendation on the efficient approaches, how to generate data that potentially could support an EUA for monoclonal antibody products that might actually be effective against emerging variants. Which obviously will be an issue because we already know, particularly that the South African variant is in fact obviating the effect of several of the monoclonal antibodies that people have developed.

And former guidances on therapeutics will also be updated to address the evolving landscape of the COVID-19 drug development again in the context of emerging SARS/COV-2 variants. In summary the FDA will give guidance to how these companies can address a problem that we know is with us already and that will be a problem in the future. I'll stop there, and back to you, Andy.

ANDY SLAVITT, HEALTHCARE ADVISER: Thank you, Dr. Fauci, Dr. Walensky. Let's take a few a few questions. BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: OK. So the headline that I heard from Andy

Slavitt of the top, and we'll digest all of this with Dr. Leana Wen, who's been kindly waiting in the wings. The headline is in the wake of the nasty winter storm that much of this country experienced, really the best part of last week especially, of course, the mess in Texas. Andy Slavitt said that all backlogged vaccine doses will be delivered by mid-week this week, which is wonderful, right, that's huge, but then he also acknowledged that's half the battle.

It's great, you've got the vaccines. You've got to get shots in arms and number two, he said that the White House will be hosting these listening sessions specifically on vaccine confidence, specifically within communities of color, right, who have been disproportionately affected by this just awful virus.

Leana Wen I'm bring you in because, doctor, I want to start with schools. We heard Dr. Walensky talk about that, right, so the big question is schools. The White House is continuing to say that teachers should be prioritized for vaccines, but, you know, in the same breath they say that also shouldn't be a pre-requisite for opening schools back up. How can both things be true?

DR. LEANA WEN, CNN MEDICAL ADVISER: Well, I can understand from their point of view, I think, in that they are saying, look, it's really important for teachers to be vaccinated, but we don't want to close down all the schools that are already open in order for teachers to be vaccinated, that the schools that should be open should remain open and, in the meantime, we can prioritize teachers.

If that's what they are saying that's fine, but I actually think that they should go one step more. Because it actually is in their control to try to prioritize teachers for vaccinations. They keep on saying, well, it's up to state governments. Well, actually the federal government can earmark, can set aside vaccinations or vaccines and say to state governments, we want, and we expect for these vaccines to go to teachers because vaccinating teachers is so essential.

If we really care about our children, we should also care about teachers and school staff. And in fact, we'll send in the National Guard. We'll send in the public health service. We'll help you figure out how to get these vaccines directly into teachers' arms.

And so that's what I'm missing here. I'm hear them saying it's a priority but don't just say the words, make it happen and frankly there are still more than 20 states right now where teachers are not even eligible to get the vaccine. So what are the government going to be doing about that.

BALDWIN: You read my mind. You read my mind because you hear President Biden. You feel his empathy through the screen, right?

[15:35:00]

You know, he's acknowledging just all of this and he's trying to push forward and get everyone vaccinated and he's saying, you know, listen, we'd love to get teachers healthy, vaccinated and back in schools, but he does keep essentially putting it off to the states. He's like I can't make everyone. It's up to the state level, and if the states want to prioritize teachers getting those vaccines then that's up to the states. Why do you think they have yet to take that extra step that you just outlined?

WEN: That's a good question. I would like for them to answer that because there are actually things the federal government can do including the rather draconian but possible step of saying to states, we're not going to give you any further vaccine allocations unless you put teachers into that priority group. Or even, we will do the work ourselves. We will distribute the vaccines directly to school districts as they are already doing to certain pharmacies and federally qualified health centers.

They can say we're going to allocate these vaccines and set them aside specifically for school districts and we will work with school health nurses to vaccinate the teachers, that's well within the Biden administration's control to do. And I think if they really want to show that they are committed to opening schools for in-person instruction that's what they would do today.

BALDWIN: Got it. My other question I started asking before we went to the COVID task force briefing is about for people, for grandparents out there who have been fortunate enough to have had the two shots, how long do grandparents and just using this as an example need to wait before they see their grandkids?

WEN: I would wait two weeks in order for the vaccine to reach optimal immunity so two weeks after that second shot. And then the grandparents are well protected themselves. I mean, again, the vaccine we know it protects you from having symptomatic disease and especially having severe disease that may land you in the hospital or cause worse illness.

But you could still be potentially a carrier to infect the rest family, and so I would say in those two weeks after you get that second shot reduce your own risk as much as you can. If you're traveling, make sure that you wear a mask and keep good physical distancing. And then I would say hug those grandkids and spend time with them because it's been such a long time and we really need to regain some sense of normality and also give hope to everybody else about why these vaccines are so important.

BALDWIN: We do. Doctor Wen, thank you as always.

And a reminder to all of you, please join Jake Tapper this evening as we here at CNN are pausing to honor the lives of the half million Americans lost to COVID-19. We remember 500,000, a national memorial service tonight at 11:00 Eastern here on CNN.

Also breaking today, a major defeat for former President Donald Trump. The Supreme Court ordering Trump's accountant to turn over his tax returns to prosecutors in New York. So what happens now? You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [15:40:00]

BALDWIN: Donald Trump's tax returns. They have been kind of a holy grail for his critics, and he has fought tooth-and-nail to keep those document secret but today the U.S. Supreme Court allowed for their release to a New York prosecutor and could possibly change the grand jury investigation into these alleged hush money payments and other issues.

Trump's former lawyer and fixer Michael Cohen saying today, quote, Trump will for the first time have to take responsibility for his own dirty deeds, end quote. CNN justice correspondent Jessica Schneider is with me. And so, Jessica, has President Trump responded to this?

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: The president's team has, Brooke, and they are releasing this long and angry statement. They say the Supreme Court decision is just a continuation of the witch hunt, and then they are accusing these prosecutors of being politically motivated. So this is what they're saying in part.

The Supreme Court never should have let this fishing expedition happen, but they did. This is something which has never happened to a president before. It is all Democrat inspired in a totally Democrat location, New York City and state, completely controlled and dominated by a heavily reported enemy of mine, Governor Andrew Cuomo.

Just to be clear though, this is being brought -- this investigation by the district attorney which really doesn't have any relation to the governor here, Brooke. But this statement it went on to call out head- hunting prosecutors and AGs who try to take down political opponents.

You know, to be clear, this is a major defeat for Donald Trump after he fought the release his tax returns for years. It was this morning that the Supreme Court cleared the way for New York City's top prosecutor to get the former president's tax returns dating all the way back to 2011.

So, Brooke, this is part of the investigation into those hush money payments Michael Cohen made to two women who alleged affairs with Donald Trump. And also court filings have since suggested that the Manhattan D.A. has actually broadened this investigation to include potential bank and insurance fraud.

Now we heard a while ago and from today Trump's accounting firm, Mazars, they have said in the past they will comply. They will hand over these years of tax returns. But it's important to note that it doesn't mean the tax returns will become public.

Those returns will actually go to the Manhattan D.A. they will be used into the grand jury investigation but crucially all proceedings here are kept secret. But the details they could eventually be exposed, Brooke, if there are charges, if there's a trial. And we're getting word this afternoon from my colleague Kara Scannell, sources are telling her that the Manhattan's D.A.'s office expects to have these returns in hands in the next few days.

BALDWIN: Wow.

SCHNEIDER: They're expecting them electronically, Brooke, and what's crucial is that this isn't just the tax returns, these are other documents, communications, work product here, and that could some shed light crucially if there was any criminal intent here which is what the D.A. no doubt will be look at -- Brooke.

[15:45:00]

BALDWIN: Wow, so in a matter of days, Cy Vance will have these in his hot hands. Jessica Schneider, thank you.

He's been fighting for them, let's talk more about this defeat. With me now CNN legal analyst Elie Honig who used to be with the Assistant U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York. Astead Herndon is with me, he's a CNN political analyst and reporter at the "New York Times." Ron Brownstein is with us, he's our senior political analyst and senior writer at "The Atlantic."

So gentlemen, Elie, I'm starting with you. All right, so in a couple of day Cy Vance has these documents. What can he do with these tax returns, and can he use them for cases, you know, outside of the current scope?

ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Sure, Brooke. So these tax returns are going to be key evidence in the Manhattan D.A.'s investigation. The crux of the investigation here is whether the Trump Organization intentionally inflated or deflated the value their assets.

For example, when they applied for bank loans. Did they sort of drum up the value of their real estate holdings, their revenues, that kind of thing.

And then when they applied for their tax refunds or put in their taxes, did they intentionally deflate the value their assets. The way would you find that is see those tax returns. So I assure you the prosecutor's office knows exactly where those tax returns fit into their case. They could be a crucial piece of evidence. We'll see what's on the tax returns. Well, we won't but Cy Vance will see what's on the tax returns themselves and that will guide his investigation.

BALDWIN: Quick follow-up. Can Trump and his legal team appeal this whole thing?

HONIG: It's all but over. Look, it turned out six times is the charm. Believe it or not, Donald Trump has lost this case six times in the federal courts as Jessica just said. It's going to be a matter of hours or days before those returns are in the D.A.'s hands, and he'll do with them what a prosecutor will do.

BALDWIN: Astead, obviously, we remember back to when Donald Trump had promised to release his tax returns, right, when he was running for president. That he would release them after, you know, I'm air quoting, the audit.

I was the looking on Twitter and I saw former Congresswoman Barbara Comstock. She floated this idea. She said, perhaps one way to stop Trump from running for president again would be to pass a law requiring full disclosure of personal and business tax records.

Do you think enough members could get behind, that A, and, B, if he is serious about running again could this tax return issue actually become a bigger deal next time?

ASTEAD HERNDON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: What you hear kind of quietly from Republicans is that in the absence of them having the kind of political courage to speak out against Donald Trump, they are hoping basically that prosecutors do that for them, that this kind of becomes a big enough issue that people who are hoping to take over the Republican Party from Donald Trump in the back of their head and kind of off record and on background they're saying, well, look at these legal issues and that may be what stops him.

I think what former Congresswoman Comstock is saying is just floating that out loud. Saying that the Congress could potentially pass a law -- and remember some Democrats on the trail talking about this to make sure that any type of nominee would have to open their tax returns and that would potentially bar Donald Trump.

We have seen Democrats not really willing to make that kind of proactive step. A lot of Democrats are kind of uneasy of looking like they are proactively trying to bar Trump from running from office, and we know Republicans haven't stood up on that front.

I think it's going to be unlikely that we see that type of proactive effort from Congress. I think what is more likely is either the legal questions kind of engulf him to the point where he cannot run or he's kind of free to do what we already know he can't which is to overtake the Republican primary where he still enjoys significant popularity.

BALDWIN: Speaking of looking into the future, Ron Brownstein, this is for you. You know, despite the fact that Donald Trump was acquitted for inciting insurrection like five minutes ago, Axios is reporting that Trump plans to, you know, talk at CPAC next weekend to talk to Republicans and basically tell them that he's the presumptive 2024 nominee. First of all what, and second of all, what do you do if you're Mitch McConnell?

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, I mean, look, this is -- first of all, the situation is really almost without historic precedent. Someone tweeted the other day and I think they're right, think of the last one-term president who was defeated who had retained significant influence in his own party, not George H.W. Bush, not Jimmy Carter, not Herbert Hoover, not William Howard Taft, not even Benjamin Harrison in the 19th century.

You must go back to before the Civil War and Martin Van Buren to find a precedent and the fact is that Trump does retain significance as Steve said in the Republican Party, in the polling about three- quarters of Republicans still want him to play a prominent role going forward.

The problem that the party has is that one-fifth to one-quarter of Republican voters who say they don't want to see a party stamped by and defined by Trump is plenty to cause them enormous electoral problems if in fact the party defers to Trump, and they pull away.

[15:50:00]

I will say that in practice the divide is kind of less than it appears in kind of the rhetoric because, for example, you're seeing in all of these states, from Arizona to Georgia to Wisconsin and Pennsylvania, Florida, Montana, efforts by state-level Republicans using Trump's discredited claims of fraud to impose this incredible new wave of voter suppression. So the party is kind of unifying in a Trumpian direction even as it argues over his personal role in that forward progress.

BALDWIN: Let me also help you further your point. And then Elie, I'm coming to you. I say this new Suffolk University/USA Today poll found that despite Trump's second impeachment, 46 percent of Republicans say they will abandon the Republican Party and join Trump if he starts a new political party.

So keep that simmering in all of our heads. Elie, here is what I want to know back to this whole, you know, tax issue. We know the taxes will be subject to grand jury secrecy rules, that will, you know, respect their actual -- restrict their actual public release. When could the public ever actually be able to see Trump's taxes?

HONIG: So two ways, Brooke. First of all if the Manhattan D.A. brings a charge and that charge goes to trial, the exhibits, the evidence that's used at a trial, that becomes part of the public record.

The second way -- let's remember, there's a second lawsuit going on here, where the Congressional committees are trying to get their hands on Donald Trump's tax returns. Now if that happens, how quickly does Congress leak? I think you could count that in a matter of hours. So keep an eye on that lawsuit as well. That's probably the quicker path for those tax returns to hit the public.

BALDWIN: OK, Astead, last question for you. You know Trump hasn't been out of office for very long. But keeps obviously as Elie's pointed out, you know he faces all these lawsuits, shows no signs of letting up.

He obviously has a firm grip on the party to Ron's point, Republicans keep going to Mar-a-Lago to proverbially kiss the ring. When and if Republicans try to hit him where it hurts, his wallet and actually use his tax returns against him, will it work against Teflon Don?

HERNDON: I mean, I think that it's a general election question, it is a larger populist problem for Donald Trump. It is not a Republican Party problem for Donald Trump because the party is so unified around anything that he does personally and that we have seen no willingness from the base to really break with him.

I mean, think about it this way, you have after the November election, you have potential rivals of his in 2024 already saying they would support him if he were to run again. I don't know how you undo that. I don't know how they can go to CPAC and say, hey, actually, maybe we should break from this guy.

I think you have Nikki Haley as a good example in the last couple weeks who had the moment after January 6th where she spoke to a reporter saying, kind of condemning Trump, and then all of a sudden, it's back at Mar-a-Lago. That is exactly the relationship with the president, and I don't I had we should expect that to break any time soon.

BALDWIN: Exactly. Astead, Elie, Ron, you all, thank you so much to every single one of you. Appreciate you.

President Biden's COVID relief bill just cleared a huge hurdle. And the House could pass it as early as next week. We have those details for you next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:55:00]

BALDWIN: Right now on Capitol Hill, the most crucial week for President Biden's massive COVID relief bill is underway. The plan will cost nearly $2 trillion. And it comes as the nation nears a half million deaths and nearly a year of pandemic hardships. The goal is to have the bill signed by March 14th. But there are a lot of hurdles between now and then.

Manu Raju is our chief Congressional correspondent he's on The Hill with the very latest, and Manu, talk to me about some of the hurdles, and really what's the next step?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, a big step that just happened this afternoon when the House Budget Committee approved along party lines the $1.9 trillion packet, it approved it by a 19-16 vote. It was supposed to be a straight party line vote. But one Democrat, Lloyd Doggett, accidentally voted against it. But I'm told from his spokesperson, in favor of it.

This goes on to the next step. The next step will be House Rules Committee will prepare it for the full House. The full House will vote at the end of the week.

Now the question will be, will Nancy Pelosi be able to keep her caucus which is divided between moderates and progressives, can she keep it together on the House floor? The expectation is at the moment, yes.

The Democrats are working very hard behind the scenes to lock down support, ensure they have no defections or a very limited number of defections.

Republicans on the other hand are pushing their members to vote against the measure. The House Republican leadership has sent a missive to all members asking them to vote against this plan, they believe it's too costly. They believe all of what's in here is not needed.

This proposal is sweeping in nature, Brooke. Includes $1,400 in stimulus checks for individuals under a certain income threshold. Money for small businesses. For schools for vaccine distribution, for state and local governments, a key priority of Democrats, in addition to raising the minimum wage to $15 an hour at the federal level.

All key issues that have some Democrats are in support of all the measures, but nevertheless they're all in this package here, Brooke. And there's an effort here to get this done by the end of the week in the House and then the question is the Senate.

BALDWIN: So quickly, 30 seconds, when it makes its way to the Senate, can Democrats stay united on this?

RAJU: That's the big question. Two Democratic Senators, Joe Manchin, Kyrsten Sinema, both are concerned about that federal minimum wage. The question is too whether the Senate rules will even allow that minimum wage hike to be included in this package. Because they are using a budget process to pass it through without Republican support. That's the big question that's going -- we're going to have to decide here in the next couple of days. Will Democrats stay united in the Senate? And will the Senate rules keepers allow to stay in?

BALDWIN: Manu Raju, you are so good. Thank you so much for just keeping us -- all the twists and turns in this COVID relief bill, my goodness. Thank you so much.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. We'll see you back here this time tomorrow. In the meantime to Washington we go.

END