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Death Toll Mounts As Israeli-Palestinian Fighting Intensifies; GOP Feud On Full Display After Liz Cheney Was Removed From Post; Confusion Over New CDC Mask Guidelines; More Than 80 Percent Of Gas Stations In D.C. Have No Fuel; Government Report On UFOs Set For Release Next Month; The Story Of Late Night Airs Tonight. Aired 7-8p ET

Aired May 16, 2021 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[19:00:37]

JESSICA DEAN, CNN HOST: Tonight on CNN NEWSROOM, the CDC director defends new mask guidance for vaccinated Americans after being met with confusion and concern. Meantime, Israel is under pressure to provide evidence that a building it leveled in Gaza was a legitimate military target.

And get those tin foil hats ready. A former Navy pilot says flight crews saw countless UFOs every day for at least a couple of years. Former director of National Intelligence, James Clapper, weighs in.

Good evening to you. I'm Jessica Dean in Washington, and you are in the CNN NEWSROOM.

The deadliest day yet in renewed fighting between Israel and the West Bank. And I want to warn you these images are disturbing.

We're told Israeli airstrikes targeting Hamas tunnels also caused family homes to collapse. Gaza's Health Ministry says at least 52 people were killed including children.

CNN's Nic Robertson has the latest now from Ashdod, Israel.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Well, the level of intensity of rocket strikes coming out of Gaza did seem to drop off some day compared to the previous days. But worse still late into the night we could see rockets flying up out of Gaza, however.

And this Sunday the deadliest day so far in Gaza, an indication perhaps of what the prime minister here, Benjamin Netanyahu, was saying that he hopes that the conflict will be over soon. But he says it is still too soon for that to happen, it won't be immediate.

Certainly, a lot of pressure being put on Israel at this time to end the conflict, pressure being put on Hamas as well, at a United Nations meeting to discuss the conflict here, the tempers and the level of deference could really be heard between the Palestinian Authority foreign minister and Israel's ambassador to United Nations. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RIYAD AL-MALIKI, PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY FOREIGN MINISTER: Israel is persecuting our people. Committing war crimes and crimes against humanity. We are not two neighbors living side by side in peace. Israel is the armed thief who has entered our house and is terrorizing our family.

GILAD ERDAN, PERMANENT REPRESENTATIVE OF ISRAEL TO THE UNITED NATIONS: For years Hamas has been using international aid not to help the people of Gaza but to abuse them. It has built a vast web of underground terror tunnels which snake beneath playgrounds, maternity wards and mosques with the clear strategic goal of increasing the number of Palestinian civilian casualties when Israel is forced to respond.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERTSON: Nevertheless, the pressure is mounting on both sides to end the hostilities a week into the conflict. Civilians both sides of the line will be hoping for better news.

Nic Robertson, CNN, Ashdod, Israel.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DEAN: Nic, thank you.

As the death toll rises and neither side shows sign of deescalating, the Biden administration is growing increasingly worried. The president has been speaking with leaders in the region, but the readout of his second call with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu signals some subtle shifts.

CNN's Arlette Saenz joins me now live from the White House.

And Arlette, what can you tell us about this call?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jessica, the White House is approaching the situation in Israel with a real sense of urgency. And you see that reflected in the number of outreach and phone calls that have been made over the course of this weekend from President Biden all the way down to other top officials.

Now yesterday the president spoke with both the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu as well as Mahmoud Abbas, the president of the Palestinian Authority. But in that readout of that phone call with Netanyahu, there were very slight changes in wording compared to the readout that was provided after the president spoke with Netanyahu on Wednesday.

Three times in that readout that was released yesterday the president expressed concerns about the situation regarding Israel and also specifically mentioned the Palestinian people for the first time, as he noted that there have been civilian casualties among both Israelis and Palestinians. [19:05:07]

Now, in addition to the president's call, you have seen other top officials reaching out to people in the region. The U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, Linda Thomas Greenfield, saying today to the U.N. Security Council that they are working tirelessly through diplomatic channels to try to bring an end to this conflict.

Secretary of State Tony Blinken, while he was traveling on his way to Copenhagen, reached out to various countries including Qatar, France, Egypt and Saudi Arabia, talking about the need to calm tensions in Israel, the West Bank and Gaza.

So this administration really trying to take an all-hands-on-deck approach to try to ease some of these tensions in the region. The White House has sent a top State Department official, Hady Amr, to the region to try to talk to people there, to get a grasp of the situation and trying to de-escalate these tensions.

As the White House is really facing this very delicate and tricky balance that they are trying to strike in supporting Israel's right to defend itself, and also trying to express some concern for those lives lost on both the Israeli and Palestinian sides.

DEAN: All right, Arlette Saenz for us at the White House, thanks so much.

And joining me now to discuss the forces at play in this crisis, P.J. Crowley, the former State Department spokesman under President Obama. Thanks so much for being with us tonight. He's also the author of "Red Line: American Foreign Policy in a Time of Fractured Politics and Failing States."

And, P.J., I want to ask you first, the Biden administration's response to this violence is dividing some Democrats. Senator Bernie Sanders' "New York Times" op-ed this morning did not hold back calling for an immediate ceasefire saying, quote, "We should also understand that while Hamas firing rockets into Israeli communities is absolutely unacceptable, today's conflict did not begin with those rockets.

Mr. Netanyahu has cultivated an increasingly intolerant and authoritarian type of racist nationalism." Now how does that compare, P.J., to what the Biden administration's current approach is to this whole situation?

P.J. CROWLEY, FORMER STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESMAN UNDER PRESIDENT OBAMA: Well, the current approach is simply to try to manage the crisis. You know, what is different, say, in this particular moment versus, you know, past crises, is there's no peace process to go back to.

So I think the effort right now is to, in fact, arrange a ceasefire, deescalate the tensions, you know, try to find ways to prevent further sparks, and then figure out as we go along how to pick up the pieces.

DEAN: And is there a point, do you think, where President Biden may be forced to take a stronger stance in all of this? CROWLEY: Well, it is a delicate balancing act. You know, the United

States does have a close relationship, you know, with Israel. It is trying to rebuild a relationship with the Palestinian Authority. You know, that relationship came to an absolute halt during the Trump administration. But, you know, the dilemma here is that you obviously on the one hand, yes, American officials repeat Israel's right to self-defense.

On the other hand, very conscious of the growing impact and costs on both sides of the border. And that's, you know, what's feeding this sense of urgency to try to arrange a ceasefire as quickly as possible.

DEAN: And last year Jared Kushner famously helped broker a peace deal for the region. And now with this situation deteriorating as it is, you have Republicans saying the collapse wouldn't have happened if President Trump was still in office. You have Democrats saying this shows the Kushner plan wouldn't have worked to begin with. What is your take on that? What went wrong here?

CROWLEY: Well, the Trump administration talked about recognizing, you know, realities on the ground. You know, but the fact is that this ongoing tension, you know, without any kind of a safety valve is also a reality on the ground.

And that's the dilemma for the Biden administration. It has not appointed a Middle East envoy at this point. It has sent, you know, a State Department official to the region, as you mentioned. The secretary of State and others are reaching out to everyone here.

You know, but the sad reality is at this point in terms of the politics within the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, there is little prospect that Benjamin Netanyahu and Mahmoud Abbas are ever going to agree, you know, to any deal that will end this conflict. And so I think the challenge here is to, you know, get back to the status quo, see if there's a change of leadership over time on one side or both, and then begin to assess, you know, what is possible going forward.

[19:10:00]

DEAN: And so it sounds like to me based on what you're saying that the best-case scenario here is not a peace plan but a de-escalation back to just where things were. Is that -- am I understanding you right?

CROWLEY: I think that's exactly right. You know, this is about crisis management. At the present time the conditions simply do not exist, you know, to solve this problem. And that's one of the reasons why, you know, the Biden administration is fully engaged here. But it is not pretending that, you know, there's a solution to this conflict emanating here from Washington, D.C.

DEAN: Right. Do you think we could see this turn into a ground war? If so, what would that mean for the region, for the United States? Or do you think it won't go to that point?

CROWLEY: I think there's always that danger. I do think that the Israelis and Hamas are being very cautious because we've seen, you know, ground action before, and it's turned into a disaster for everyone. I do think that, you know, if you look at the politics behind this, you know, Hamas is trying to play to advantage with the Palestinian Authority's sidelined, the Palestinians, you know, recently postponed an election that Fatah was bound to lose.

You know, Benjamin Netanyahu was fighting for his political life. I think probably the optics here, you know, may well help him in the short term. You know, but I do think that both sides will be very, very cautious. They want to achieve some political gains. They don't want the costs to mount beyond something that they can tolerate.

DEAN: All right. P.J. Crowley for us tonight, thanks so much for being with us.

CROWLEY: You're welcome.

DEAN: The CDC says new guidance does not mean everyone can just toss their masks, and it's calling on unvaccinated Americans to get their shots.

Also ahead this hour, a whole lot of close encounters of the completely unexplained kind. A former Navy pilot says flight crews saw countless UFOs every day for at least a couple of years. I'll ask former director of National Intelligence, James Clapper, if we really are alone.

But first, tonight, Liz Cheney rips her fellow Republicans for being complicit in Trump's big election lie. Former New Jersey Republican governor Christine Todd Whitman joins me next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:16:28]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JONATHAN KARL, ABC NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Should Kevin McCarthy be willing to speak -- testify before that commission, after all, he is one of the few people that we know of that was actually talking to Donald Trump while the attack was taking place?

REP. LIZ CHENEY (R-WY): He absolutely should, and I wouldn't be surprised if he were subpoenaed. I think that he very clearly and said publicly that he's got information about the president's state of mind that day.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: And that was Congresswoman Liz Cheney this morning calling for the House minority leader to testify before the January 6th commission. A commission that, as of right now, Kevin McCarthy may not even support.

Cheney isn't the only Republican breaking with the party on this issue. Here is Congressman Fred Upton on CNN reacting to his colleagues who last week downplayed the attack. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. FRED UPTON (R-MI): Bogus. It's absolutely bogus, it's absolutely bogus. It was chilling what happened. Absolutely chilling. And that's why I think that it's important that we move forward with this bipartisan commission, get the facts out, try to assure the American public this is what happened, and let the facts lead us to the conclusion.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Former Republican governor of New Jersey, Christine Todd Whitman, joins me now. She also was in the George W. Bush administration.

Good evening to you, Governor. Thanks for being with us on a Sunday night.

CHRISTINE TODD WHITMAN (R), FORMER NEW JERSEY GOVERNOR: Good evening, Jessica. Good to be with you.

DEAN: Yes. I'm curious first why do you think it is so controversial for a House Republican to support a fact-finding mission that's focused solely on the events of January 6th? Why isn't this something that everybody can get behind?

WHITMAN: Because I think they're afraid that the investigation will turn out that it was the Trump supporters, the far-right who really instigated the riot, that the Proud Boys and those other groups, the QAnon groups, that started the riot. There were a lot of people there who were just demonstrating because they have been told over and over again that the election was stolen and they bought into that big lie.

But they -- and they were not the ones who were going to cause trouble. But there were clearly groups who came prepared to cause trouble. There seems to be a paper -- not a paper trail but an internet trail of e-mails and texts back and forth with these groups. And the Republicans who support the president don't want that out, they don't want to have to admit that. They can't face it. It's why they threw out Liz Cheney from her leadership position.

DEAN: Is it remarkable to you that there are Republicans who are afraid that it's going to come to light that they were siding with insurrectionists and white supremacists and these types of people? Does that surprise you about your party?

WHITMAN: Oh, it not just surprises me, it terrifies me because I think it's very dangerous for our democracy to have people -- I mean, how can any congressman with a straight face stand up before the cameras and say it was just like any other day, tourist group.

And then there are videos of him helping to bar the door so they couldn't get into the chambers. I mean, these lies, this seeming willingness to say don't believe what you saw, believe what I'm telling you now, is very harmful to our democracy. No wonder people are losing confidence in government. This is

something we can't tolerate. It's more than just saying you're for Trump or you're against Trump. These lies, perpetuating these lies, doing things like Arizona, the fourth, the fourth recount with a group called Cyber Ninjas doing it who have no background in doing recounts and handling election ballots at all and run by someone who was a conspiracy theorist?

[19:20:09]

These things are detrimental to the public's confidence. And we have to have confidence in our voting procedure, and we should be proud of what happened in 2020 because it was an enormously safe election in the middle of a pandemic with a president who was saying -- had been saying long before the election that it was going to be stolen. And yet we had more people turn out, and it was quiet and it was safe and it was accurate.

DEAN: Safe and fair and against so many odds. The pandemic. Has so many things that were happening and those local officials, those local election officials just doing incredible work to make sure it was safe and fair.

Republican infighting right now really boils down, as we've mentioned, to the role of former President Trump. So Congressman Crenshaw and Kinzinger kind of represented two sides on "Meet the Press" this morning. I want to watch this clip.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. DAN CRENSHAW (R-TX): I think what Kevin McCarthy was trying to say there was, look, there is disagreement and it's time to move on. We can keep having that fight if we'd like, but what is the point and what is the outcome?

REP. ADAM KINZINGER (R-IL): You cannot on the one hand say that Donald Trump is a leader or the leader of the Republican Party, which I believe he is the leader of the Republican Party right now, because Kevin McCarthy gave him his leadership card. You can't say he's the leader and then say we have to move on. I would love to move on.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: And, so, Kinzinger and -- who was just speaking then, and Congresswoman Cheney, they seem to be very much, they are very much in the minority of their party right now.

Governor, when do you think it's time to admit that the battle is over and the GOP is not going to move on from President Trump?

WHITMAN: Well, I don't think you give up that battle. Certainly, we don't want. Those of us who are supporting the renewal for America process that we've talked about in the press release and in the principles that we've set forward. We're trying to work to get the Republican Party back to the centrist -- conservative center where it used to be, a party that had some principles for which you stood. Right now, there are no core values to the Republican Party. It's

whatever Donald Trump says to do or say on any particular day. And over the long term that is not a winning strategy. They may be able to pick up some seats in this next election cycle because that's what's happens when you have the next congressional election, traditionally after a presidential election, particularly when one party holds both Houses.

You see the party in power losing some seats. But over the long term, this is not a formula for success, and I believe, and those of us who have signed onto the principles, for the most part, I think I can speak for everybody, believe that our country is better served by two parties, a centrist left and a center right.

And we have lost the center right for the Republicans. The Democrats have to be careful because they're moving to the left awfully fast, and you don't want to get them to where we are.

But if you look at statistics and you look at registration, it's independence and unaffiliated who have the most registered voters, followed by Democrats and then Republicans. And it's those people who feel disenfranchised that we want to reach.

DEAN: Right. And Governor, you're talking about this group with about 150 likeminded Republicans that you all have come together and kind of you want to have a movement I think is how it's been described within the Republican Party. I'm curious, quickly before I let you go, practically, how do you do that? That's an uphill battle right now within your party. How are you practically going to make those changes and accomplish your goal?

WHITMAN: Well, it's not going to happen overnight. But one of the things we're doing is urging people to go to the Web site America's Promise, and sign up so we can show those who are leadership that, look, there are a substantial number of Republicans here. They are going to vote.

And then what we're going to do in that 2022 election cycle is support people like Kinzinger and Liz Cheney and those who have stood up to the big lie and go after those who haven't and start to build that way and go look at some of the local elections, too, and support those who will sign onto those principles that we have laid out because they're pretty basic.

And they're what everybody should agree with, you know, telling the truth, rule of law, respecting the Constitution, those kinds of things, and try to get the party back. But it will be a slow slog.

DEAN: Well, former governor Christine Todd Whitman, we appreciate you being with us. Thanks so much.

WHITMAN: My pleasure. Good to talk to you.

DEAN: You too.

Mask on or mask off? It's up to you. But the director of the CDC has a warning if you did not get the vaccine.

[19:25:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DEAN: The new CDC guidelines came as a bit of a shock this week. What a revelation. Fully vaccinated people can remove their masks and ease up on social distancing in almost any situation. That announcement left many people scratching their heads, though, about when and where they can take off their masks. And today the CDC director saying the honor system is key here.

CNN's Evan McMorris-Santoro reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

EVAN MCMORRIS-SANTORO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The re-opening excitement is palpable. But with the CDC's new guidance out last week that vaccinated Americans no longer need to wear masks in most situations, there is also confusion. Where is it OK to take off a mask? And how do we know if people taking off their masks are vaccinated? There's one thing Americans need to know, says the CDC.

ROCHELLE WALENSKY, CDC DIRECTOR: In terms of the honor system, people have to be honest with themselves. You're protected if you're vaccinated.

[19:30:02]

MCMORRIS-SANTORO (voice over): A celebratory moment muddied by continuing vaccine hesitancy.

With less than 45 percent of eligible Americans fully vaccinated according to the C.D.C., lifting mask mandates comes with caveats.

Dr. Anthony Fauci said Sunday, more clarity would come within the next few weeks about workplaces and other situations.

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: I would imagine, within a period of just a couple of weeks, you're going to start to see significant clarification of some of the actually understandable and reasonable questions that people are asking.

SANTORO (voice over): But in the meantime, states and local governments are left sorting out the new guidance.

In Rhode Island, the governor emphasized vaccines are the key to lifting those regulations.

GOV. DANIEL MCKEE (D-RI): People who are vaccinated can enjoy the freedom of not wearing a mask inside, and those who are not vaccinated -- we're not giving people in the state of Rhode Island a pass in terms of not becoming vaccinated and because it's safe, it saves lives and right now, everybody should be getting vaccinated in our state and around the country. SANTORO (voice over): The science around vaccination hasn't changed.

Experts say more Americans need to get their shots if the country has a chance at herd immunity.

That process is slow, but maybe it'll get a boost with new guidance allowing younger people to get doses.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You guys have the best day ever.

SANTORO (voice over): Those new rules mean all schools should reopen for full time in-person learning this fall says the leader of the nation's second largest teachers union, but the new rules don't mean America is ready to fully abandon the mask, she says.

RANDI WEINGARTEN, PRESIDENT, AMERICAN FEDERATION OF TEACHERS: we can't have mass shaming. If people want to wear masks for their protection they should be able to.

SANTORO (voice over): Evan McMorris-Santoro, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

DEAN: In the midst of the latest wave of gun violence in Chicago, two police officers there were shot just this morning. Chicago's Police Superintendent said the officers were responding to calls of shots fired when a man in an alley suddenly opened fire.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SUPERINTENDENT DAVID BROWN, CHICAGO POLICE DEPARTMENT: This offender had no regard for their position as police officers -- no regard and began trying to kill them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Thankfully those officers were treated and released from the hospital. The man who shot them is in stable condition at a separate hospital. Officials say, this marks the 29th time in 2021 that a Chicago officer has been shot or shot at by a suspect.

And first on CNN tonight, I've learned more than 25 Democratic senators led by Georgia Senator Jon Ossoff are calling for an immediate ceasefire in the Middle East.

In a statement released, the CNN the senators wrote there asking the White House to call for an agreement. Their statement says in part quote: "To prevent any further loss of civilian life and to prevent further escalation of conflict in Israel and the Palestinian territories, we urge an immediate ceasefire."

This comes on the deadliest day in the conflict since fighting began last week.

A former U.S. fighter pilot says he saw UFOs quote, "nearly every day for two years." And in just a few weeks, a government report will likely shed new light on these unexplained encounters. Former Director of National Intelligence, James Clapper joins me next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:37:25]

DEAN: The gasoline shortages plaguing much of the East Coast are starting to relax tonight, but in many cities, that recovery is taking longer than expected.

Washington, D.C. is currently bearing the brunt of the shortage with outages reported at 83 percent of gas stations in the U.S. Capitol. And as fuel begins to flow again, panic buying is leading to a spike in prices.

The national average is up to about $3.05 a gallon, that's about a dime more than last week when gas was already pricey at $2.95 a gallon.

And all of this started a week ago after a cyberattack on the Colonial Pipeline. In what is known as a ransomware attack, hackers captured data from the pipeline holding it hostage until the company paid them nearly $5 million.

The F.B.I. says the group behind the attack likely operated out of Russia raising questions about the Kremlin's role. Today, some experts are calling on President Biden to take action to prevent future attacks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTOPHER KREBS, FORMER DIRECTOR, CYBERSECURITY AND INFRASTRUCTURE SECURITY AGENCY: Ransomware in particular, something I've been barking about for a number of years, unfortunately, I think it's been treated as a law enforcement matter and not necessarily a national security threat.

We have a set of tools that we can use to de-platform effectively, these ransomware actors. But the last piece here is that when the President goes and meets with President Putin over the summer, this has got to be on the table.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: And joining me now to discuss all of this is the former Director of National Intelligence, James Clapper. Director, it is great to have you here. Thanks for being with us.

I want to ask you, gas stations up and down the East Coast remain today without gas, a lot of them in D.C. here. There are dozens of reports of panic buying at gas stations that do have gas and all of this, of course, a result on the cyberattack.

So what does this tell you about the vulnerabilities of America's infrastructure right now? JAMES CLAPPER, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, this just brings

home in a very vivid, demonstrable and personal way the vulnerability of our critical infrastructure, most of what -- most -- virtually all of which is operated, owned and operated by civilian entities.

And to this point, we haven't really been able to figure out a strategy for how to protect it, and particularly in the era of ransomware and the use of ransom to extract money and particularly when it's done by a non-nation state entity.

The nation state, well, you have more potential things you can exploit to counter such actions, but with non-nation state entities, we are in a bad place.

[19:40:10]

CLAPPER: So I have every confidence that the team that the Biden administration has assembled to deal with this will work this and come up with a solution, but it is a really tough problem. And until such time as we can create both the substance and psychology of deterrence, we're going to probably continue to have such attacks.

DEAN: And that's what I wanted to follow up with, because you we heard former Cyber and Infrastructure Security Director, Chris Krebs, saying there needs to be greater emphasis on these ransomware attacks in the national security arena, and for President Biden to address this with Vladimir Putin.

It sounds like you agree that there needs to be more emphasis on these ransomware attacks within the national security arena. What do you think about President Biden bringing this up with Vladimir Putin?

CLAPPER: Well, what I've -- what I understand is that the Russian government, as best we can tell, didn't have anything to do with this. I personally have a little trouble with that because just given away things are in Russia today, it's hard for me to believe Vladimir Putin wouldn't have known about this.

And certainly, in light of the harm that it has caused and the disruption it's caused, he is probably pleased with it.

So I think it's very appropriate that President Biden layout known in no uncertain terms, you know, we're wise with this and it has got to stop. And of course, hopefully, the President, well, our President will have up his sleeves some actual actions he can take that would seriously deter the Russians and impose on the government the responsibility for going after criminals who are acting against us.

DEAN: Okay, so putting that aside, the pipeline, and this very serious and critical infrastructure and ransomware discussion, I also want to turn now to talk to you about UFOs, because a former Navy pilot gave an interview to CBS News in which he says flight crews observed UFOs off the Atlantic coast every day, here's a clip from that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

QUESTION: So you're seeing it both with the radar and with the infrared and that tells you that there is something out there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pretty hard to spoof that. Every day, every day for at least a couple of years.

QUESTION: Wait a minute, every day for a couple of years?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: So next month, a government report is expected to be made public on the sightings of UFOs. As the former Director of National Intelligence, I think there have been a lot of theories about UFOs. What do you make of these revelations? What might this be? Have you seen any yourself? What do you make of this?

CLAPPER: Well, first, I think it is -- there is logic to the Intelligence Community addressing us since the Intelligence Committee has a lot of practice with dealing with ambiguity and less than complete facts.

And secondly, I think it's really important that the -- whenever we witness such phenomenon that it is recorded and documented for the future, and when we may gather more information and have a better understanding of what is transpiring. Could there be life out there? Sure. As huge as the universe is, you know, we really can't reject that possibility.

So I think this is a good thing, the transparency. I expect this report will be filled with ambiguity as well. And people, depending on their leanings will extract what they want out of this report.

DEAN: How it always goes, right? Where there is ambiguity, people can pull what they want from it, but it is -- it does sound like it is, you know, something that we haven't seen before this type of transparency around this topic.

CLAPPER: Yes. I'm not sure why that is. The only reason for -- to me -- for classification will be if there's some sensitive method that data relating to so-called UFOs was collected. But other than that, I don't know why we haven't been more transparent about it in the past and I'm of that crime, I guess, and my former capacities were, you know -- I didn't insist on more transparency with respect to this issue.

DEAN: All right. Well, former Director of National Intelligence James Clapper, thanks for your time tonight.

CLAPPER: Thanks for having me, Jessica.

DEAN: The biggest story of late night TV might have been who would replace the biggest name in late night TV, Johnny Carson. Bill Carter joins us next with a look back at that pivotal moment in TV history.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:49:27]

DEAN: For the past six decades, late night television has grown from a shot in the dark experiment to a thriving cultural phenomenon. This week's episode of the CNN original series "The Story of Late Night" looks at the drawn out drama over who would succeed Late Night King Johnny Carson on "The Tonight Show." Here's a preview.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WARREN LITTLEFIELD, FORMER NBC PRESIDENT: It was a very stormy February in Los Angeles and Rick Ludwin walked into my office and said, "We won't have Johnny tonight. The road up to the house is flooded out." And I was like, "Oh, it is February sweeps." So I picked up the phone and I said, "Johnny, we will send the NBC News helicopter out to your place in Malibu," and he said, "Warren, are you trying to kill me?"

[19:50:20]

LITTLEFIELD: And at that moment, I realized that there is going to be a time when you don't have Johnny.

It forced a deeper thinking about what the future would be.

We did have David Letterman, who was the most obvious choice to succeed Johnny, but we also had Jay Leno coming into his own.

When Joan Rivers got her shot over at FOX, there's the need to find another recurring sub, and Johnny was comfortable giving Jay a shot as a guest host.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: And joining us now, CNN media analyst and executive producer of "The Story of Late Night," Bill Carter. Nice to see you, Bill.

BILL CARTER, CNN MEDIA ANALYST: Nice to be with you, Jessica.

DEAN: Yes, heading into the 1980s, Johnny Carson was the undisputed king of late night, Kingmaker in the comedy world. How did he use his power then to set up who would come behind him?

CARTER: Well, you know, he gave the permanent guest host position to Joan Rivers, whom he had basically, you know, mentored as a comedian. And Joan was doing quite well as the guest host, and then it all went wrong when she heard that maybe Johnny, maybe NBC would put a man in charge of "The Tonight Show."

It wouldn't put a woman and so she decided she might have to skip out and go to FOX, and that set off a whole conflict between her and Johnny Carson.

DEAN: And so you guys are going to get into that in tonight's episode, I'm assuming?

CARTER: Yes. Oh, yes. DEAN: Oh, yes. And we know that Letterman wasn't allowed to use the

same format as "The Tonight Show." Did that change how he did things because he was kind of doing his own thing and known for being innovative in that space?

CARTER: Absolutely. And Carson was very much a fan of Letterman's. But when he was behind Johnny, he wanted -- Johnny wanted the show to be different. So he didn't want Dave to do a monologue. He didn't want to have a big band.

He didn't want him to have a sidekick. None of that bothered Dave or his head writer, Merrill Markoe, who was also his girlfriend, because they wanted to do a completely new and innovative show and this just gave them a whole range of things that they could do.

And they just, you know, hit the ground running and innovated all over the place. And, you know, Dave got a reputation quickly as an absolutely fresh new voice in late night.

DEAN: Well, there's so much to get into. We look forward to tonight's episode, Bill Carter. Thanks for being with us to preview it.

CARTER: Oh, it's a fun episode. Thanks, Jessica.

DEAN: Yes, and don't miss that all new episode of the CNN original series, "The Story of Late Night." It's tonight at 9:00 Eastern and Pacific only on CNN.

We'll be right back.

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[19:58:01]

DEAN: While COVID left many people feeling isolated, that is an everyday reality for some of the 61 million Americans living with disabilities. They face constant barriers in society and in daily life.

And this week, CNN Hero became paralyzed from the waist down. He struggled for years to get into shape and attain a healthy lifestyle. Inspired by his own journey, he created an adaptive physical training and nutrition program to help people with disabilities push beyond their limitations.

Meet Wesley Hamilton.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WESLEY HAMILTON, FOUNDER, DISABLED BUT NOT REALLY: Come on, easy.

My main goal is to teach people how to take control of their life. Take full accountability and embrace your reality.

Slowly, you can start right here.

When we go through our program, it is only the beginning. I want to be there through your whole journey because I want to see you successful.

There we go. One more.

I've gained so much from my injury. And I want other people to have that same mindset.

You're learning that, you're about to do more.

I believe that once we help someone, now they have the ability to help someone else. This is something that has to have a ripple effect.

We, coming together, empowering each other. Be an inspiration for one another.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: Fantastic stuff there. To see the full story and to learn more about Wesley's work, you can go to CNNheroes.com. And while you're there, nominate someone you think should be a CNN Hero.

Also tonight at 10 Eastern, join W. Kamau Bell as he looks into the dynamics of activism, civil disobedience and protest. You can catch the all new episode of "United Shades of America." It's right here on CNN.

Thanks so much for joining me this evening. I'm Jessica Jean.

The Fareed Zakaria special "Radical Rebellion" is next.

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