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Texas Governor Bans Mask Mandates by Schools, Local Governments; D.A. Declines to Charge Deputies in Andrew Brown Jr. Killing; American Airlines Largest Regional Carrier Gets FAA Warning; QAnon Lawyer Criticized for Derogatory References to the Disabled. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired May 19, 2021 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: The head of the Texas State Teacher's Association calls Abbott's move premature and ill-advised.

And Ovidia Molina joins us live now from Austin. Ms. Molina, thank so much for being here. What does this mean for teachers in the classroom if masks are no longer mandated come June 5th, what does that mean for teachers?

OVIDIA MOLINA, TEXAS STATE TEACHERS' ASSOCIATION: Thank you for asking. It's frustrating. It's hurtful. And we're back to the same fearful place that we were before. We know that masks are a safety measure that we need because we are around many people, our students and our coworkers. And the fact it's being done toward the end of the school year when many educators were breathing a sigh of relief that they made it to the end of the year is just ridiculous.

We should have as a state listen to the CDC. The guidelines are still saying that our students need masks. We don't have everybody able to get a vaccine, especially in our elementary schools.

CAMEROTA: Yes, children under 12 cannot get vaccinated yet, and most teenagers have not gotten it yet because it's so soon that the vaccine has been rolled out for them. And so what are teachers going to do about this?

MOLINA: As you just stated, you know, our students, the ones that are getting vaccinated are not going to be fully vaccinated until mid- summer at the earliest. And so our educators are being put in the predicament yet again by our state of choosing safety. We're towards the end of the year. How many educators are going to decide that they're just tired of being picked on by our state and are not going to come back?

We're going to lose dedicated workers. We're going to have people that are going to be afraid. Not to mention our students that their families are asking them to wear a mask. You know, are still wanting other people to wear a mask for the safety of everybody, educators, students and our communities. CAMEROTA: And I remember a year ago when COVID was just breaking out,

how many teachers decided that they weren't -- they loved this job. They loved their profession but they were going to retire. They were going to take early retirement. They just were going to quit. They weren't coming back. And so did Governor Abbott talk to you or talk to teachers before he made this decision?

MOLINA: This has been the most frustrating thing throughout the pandemic. That we have been fighting with the state, with Governor Abbott. No, he has not spoken to us. I don't believe any of the decisions he has made regarding schools has even had educators' input because we had to fight for PPE.

We had to fight to get to the front of the line for vaccines. And now we're fighting to ensure that our schools stay safe for as long as possible. We could have as a state waited until the CDC looked into the data a little bit more, more of our students got vaccinated, and we were a little bit safer.

Think about it as the fall coming back as a plan, but there has never been a plan by our state to take into account the safety of our educators, and that is how we feel. We have never been part of the plan.

CAMEROTA: We only have ten seconds left. What do you want to say to the governor today?

MOLINA: Governor Abbott needs to listen to our educators. We are the experts in our schools. We know what needs to happen because we know what we do every day. He needs to listen to us. We need to keep our students safe and we need to keep our educators safe because that's keeping the community safe.

CAMEROTA: Ovidia Molina, thank you very much for joining us.

MOLINA: Thank you.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Up next, the family of Andrew Brown, the man who was killed by deputies in North Carolina, that family is filing a federal lawsuit and they're asking the Justice Department to step in after the D.A. said the killing was justified. We'll talk about where this case goes from here.

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[15:35:00]

BLACKWELL: Well, CNN has learned that the family of Andrew Brown Jr. plans to file a federal lawsuit over his death. Now, just yesterday the district attorney there in North Carolina I should say announced that sheriff's deputies were justified in shooting Brown when they tried serving an arrest warrant last month.

CAMEROTA: The attorney for the Brown family is disputing a D.A.'s contention that Brown used his vehicle as a deadly weapon against the deputies. And CNN legal analyst Elliot Williams joins us now with more. So Elliott, what is the Brown family's recourse now that the D.A. has basically said that that was justified?

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: So a couple things. Number one, they can sue in their own capacity under federal law, it's called sort of a 1983 suit, you'll here that number from time to time, that the officers were acting under color of state law and violated his civil rights.

Look, also the Justice Department itself can bring criminal charges here. The challenge is that that's just a really high standard and burden to meet. To bring a criminal charge, the Justice Department has to establish that officers willfully set out to violate someone's civil rights, willfully set out to use excessive force, and that's just really, really hard to prove in case like this, particularly where it all happens very quickly.

So we'll see. Again, there's the Justice Department itself bringing criminal charges and the personal lawsuit both are avenues for the family.

BLACKWELL: Elliott, let me ask you about what to most people or some people I should say seems like a conflict here. The D.A. Andrew Womble yesterday said the actions of the deputies were justified and reasonable. But now I want you to listen to Pasquotank Sheriff Tommy Wooten his statement he posted on Facebook.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHERIFF TOMMY WOOTEN, PASQUOTANK COUNTY, NORTH CAROLINA: The three deputies involved will keep their jobs. They will be disciplined and retrained.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[15:40:00]

BLACKWELL: So if the actions are reasonable and justified, how and why would they need to be disciplined and retrained?

WILLIAMS: Yes, that in the law, Victor, is called an admission of guilt or liability. That's when you just don't click send on the Facebook video and leave it alone. They are all over the place in trying to win back this narrative. And they went out and did the press conference where they attempted far more than making any legal points to dirty up the victim, to dirty up the victim's family. to complain about the fact that the victim's lawyers aren't from North Carolina, but not really address the legal question.

By saying that they need to be retrained and moved, that actually gives ammunition to the victim's family to say that, no, this was clearly a violation of established procedures in North Carolina. So that's a very odd post and a very odd way to try to exonerate yourself.

CAMEROTA: In terms of dirtying up the victim, as you say, it's interesting that after so many weeks of a lack of transparency, they were quite transparent about the victim's past yesterday. I mean they just, you know, opened the books in terms of his past convictions and then they showed that 55 seconds, I think, of the bodycam. Did you hear anything that changed your impression of this case or from the video?

WILLIAMS: Look, if they were that convinced, and you know, to be clear, these heat of the moment situations can be very fraught and can be very difficult for officers. You know, we have to give them that allowance.

But if they are -- if the officers here were so clear that this was a stressful situation, then release the full videos and let the public decide. It's not going to particularly taint the jury or anything at this stage but get the information out there. They would be doing themselves as law enforcement a huge service by clarifying this question. But what they've done is proceed in the manner as if they've got something to hide.

And the media, the public, activists, whatever, people who are watching this, have every reason to doubt the sincerity of the sheriff and his colleagues here.

CAMEROTA: Elliot Williams, thank you very much.

WILLIAMS: Thanks, Alisyn.

BLACKWELL: All right, next, a CNN exclusive. An FAA report finds some disturbing practices among pilots flying some regional jets. And a few instances where planes were just seconds from disaster.

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[15:45:00]

BLACKWELL: A CNN exclusive now about a government warning for American Airlines' largest regional carrier, Envoy Air.

CAMEROTA: CNN has obtained an FAA document that describes evidence of consistently unsafe piloting by multiple flight crews. CNN aviation correspondent Pete Muntean has the reporting.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT (voice over): It is an airline that millions have flown on but might never know it. Now new documents obtained by CNN detail a federal warning against Envoy Air.

It is the largest regional carrier for American Airlines, operating smaller jets between small cities and major hubs, hundreds of times each day.

This Envoy flight that slid off a snowy Chicago runway is one of nine cases in 2019 and 2020 that the Federal Aviation Administration says showed serious problems with the pilots involved. In a letter to Envoy CEO, an FAA investigator cites consistent evidence showing potential lack of airmanship, deeper than what spot training or counseling have been able to resolve. PETER GOETZ: CNN AVIATION ANALYST: It is a big deal and it's

disturbing.

MUNTEAN (voice over): Former NTSB Managing Director Peter Goetz reviewed the FAA warning and says incidents could have been much worse. The letter describes a flight last year when an Envoy crew should have been landing on this runway but instead aimed at a parallel runway less than half as long. The FAA says only a last- minute realization prevented a potentially catastrophic situation.

GOETZ: It means that we were, you know, literally seconds away from a potential accident with significant loss of life. It really is an issue of training and culture.

MUNTEAN (voice over): Regional airlines have long been the starting ground for newer, less experienced commercial pilots. In its letter the FAA ordered Envoy to develop an action plan to deal with pilot issues. In a statement sent to CNN, Envoy insists nothing is more important than the safety of our customers and employees. The airline says it's working with regulators and its pilots union to examine the root cause of each potential issue and take any necessary corrective actions.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The fire is still burning from a plane that crashed into a house.

MUNTEAN (voice over): Regional airline regulations were overhauled after this 2009 crash of Colgan air flight in Buffalo, but aviation experts say these latest findings demand a new look at pilot qualifications, unchanged in almost a decade. Especially since Envoy says its pilots are guaranteed a direct path to flying larger airplanes for American Airlines. In an exclusive interview, FAA Administrator Steve Dickson says commercial flying is the safest it has ever been, but this shows the agency remains vigilant.

STEVE DICKSON, ADMINISTRATOR, FEDERAL AVIATION ADMINISTRATION: The good news story here is this is a proactive action. It's based on data that we have been able to glean by working with the operator to identify where there might be areas of emerging risk that they need to focus on and that we need to make sure they are not only come compliant but operating safely.

MUNTEAN: Should people feel safe?

[15:50:00]

DICKSON: Yes, yes. But it's something to never take for granted. I certainly never take it for granted.

MUNTEAN: The FAA says the pilots were not solely responsible in that 2019 snowy runway incident. In fact, it fined the airport for not fully clearing the runway, but the FAA also said that the pilots could have benefited from more experience. The FAA says it's still working with Envoy to clear up these issues -- Victor and Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Which is why your question of should people feel safe is such a good one. Pete Muntean, thank you.

CAMEROTA: OK. So next the attorney for the so-called QAnon shaman uses highly offensive language to explain his client's behavior, and he rips the Capitol riot suspects. What he thinks of their mental capacity next.

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[15:55:00]

CAMEROTA: Despite all of their conspiracy theories about the 2020 election being proven wrong, QAnon is not giving up. They are now focused on the GOP-led ballot audit happening in Arizona.

BLACKWELL: Yes, and that count is getting a lot of attention, especially since auditors hired by the state Senate have now backtracked from baseless claims that a key database was deleted from Maricopa County election servers. The president was leading that claim. They admit that the data is actually intact and that they have been looking for it the wrong way.

CNN's Donie O'Sullivan is here with this reporting. So, first, what is QAnon's interest here?

DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: They think the election might be overturned. They think falsely.

Look, I mean, I guess, it shouldn't be that surprising given that this audit, of course, is the result of a conspiracy theory. I mean, it's essentially trying to prove the big lie to be true. But what we're seeing is, you know, on many of the forms on the lead up to January 6th where, you know, obsessed with the idea that the election be overturned on that day are now looking at Arizona.

And I've even heard it out in the field. You know, a Trump supporter in Texas a few weeks ago mention to me that Arizona might be the first domino to fall and the election might be overturned. Of course, that is all false, and, you know, normally we wouldn't even be talking about, you know, conspiracy theories on certain parts of the internet but we've seen the danger in them given what happened on January 6th.

CAMEROTA: Donie, we also want to ask you about the lawyer for the so- called QAnon shaman, his name is Albert Watkins and he's made some highly offensive comments in defense of his clients.

Here is part of what he said, quote, a lot of these defendants -- and I'm going to use the colloquial term, perhaps disrespectfully -- but they are all "f'ing" short-bus people. These are people with brain damage. These are not people -- they don't have prior criminal history -- "blank." They were subjected to four-plus years of "blank" propaganda, the likes of which the world has not seen since f'ing Hitler.

Of course, if that's his defense of his client, I would hate to hear his complaints. But Donie, I mean, look, you speak to rabid Trump supporters all the time. What did you think when you heard one of these attorney's defenses?

O'SULLIVAN: Yes, I mean, look, there's a long overdue conversation I think to be had about the role mental health plays and, you know, leading people down these rabbit holes, the conspiracy theories. We've spoken to people who have left QAnon who were in dark places but obviously what that lawyer Albert Watkins is doing there is quite crude and crass and insensitive.

And he was actually on "Newsday" earlier this morning. Have a listen to what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALBERT WATKINS, ATTORNEY FOR "THE QANON SHAMAN": What I'm doing is that which is necessary to be done to put absolutely in the spotlight the fact that our nation is running a gulag, in effect taking people with vulnerabilities, with special needs, with sensitivities that put them in a category of being outside of what medical science may say is the bell curve of normalcy. And we're putting them in solitary confinement. You ask any doctor the way to treat people who are vulnerable is not to put them in solitary confinement for 23 hours a day.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'SULLIVAN (on camera): So look, as I say, there is a role mental health plays in this. We know directly from speaking to people, but, you know, I've spoken to people who have over the course of lockdown, over the course of the last year went down the QAnon rabbit hole because they felt depressed, anxious, isolated, searching for a community online, but, you know, they didn't necessarily go and storm the Capitol.

BLACKWELL: I just wonder if what's coming from this attorney is the start of a mental health defense for his client and others. Do we know if that's where he's going?

O'SULLIVAN: That certainly seems to be the direction he is going with it, and as I say, you know, he might have a case there. We will see. So but as I say, it is an important conversation to have as we talk about conspiracy theories and how people can be brought to very dark places on the internet, but Watkins there and his client may be not the best messengers in this case.

CAMEROTA: Yes, I mean, to be clear, you don't have to have a mental health issue to be susceptible to some of this stuff. Some of these folks are not critical thinkers. I mean, that's just true. They're not critical thinkers. They are susceptible even if they don't have some sort of mental health diagnosis.

O'SULLIVAN: And you know, especially if you're seeing this content on your feed non-stop. You know it's difficult to believe otherwise.

BLACKWELL: All right, Donie O'Sullivan, thanks so much. The Lead with Jake Tapper starts right now.