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White House Offers Infrastructure Counterproposal; Louisiana Police Video; Interview With Sen. Tammy Duckworth (D-IL). Aired 3- 3:30p ET

Aired May 21, 2021 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:01:28]

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Top of the hour. Thank you for being with us. I'm Victor Blackwell.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: And I'm Alisyn Camerota.

We begin with a mother's call for justice going nationwide today. Mona Hardin is speaking out following the release of a few clips of bodycam footage that show her son, Ronald Greene's final moments in Louisiana State Police custody.

We warn you that the video, which took more than two years to surface, is very graphic.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get on the ground! Get on the ground!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Taser, Taser, Taser.

(SCREAMING)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Put your hands behind your back. Hands behind your back.

(SCREAMING)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Make sure he ain't (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Put your hands behind your back.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, God (EXPLETIVE DELETED), get up here! Get your (EXPLETIVE DELETED)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You better not move.

(MOANING)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You got it?

(MOANING)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You all right?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I got blood all over me. I hope this guy ain't got (EXPLETIVE DELETED) AIDS.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Now, Greene's family members say that police initially told them that he died when his car crashed. And the initial state police crash report made no mention of troopers using force or arresting Greene.

Now, the first mention of a struggle came when Greene's death was investigated by the Louisiana State Police Criminal Investigations Division, after Greene's daughter filed a wrongful death lawsuit in May of last year.

CNN's Ryan Young is following.

Ryan, I know that we have obtained some new body camera video. CNN is still in the process have reviewing it, deciding what will be put on air, but what can you tell us about what it shows?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Victor, you know I have been working this story for several days now.

I was able to get from a source the video, the new video. And we have been watching it for maybe the last 40 minutes or so. I can tell you, if the video that you just saw turns your stomach, the next set of video only adds to the pain and agony. And I'm sure the family is going through this bit by bit, because, of course, they have seen the video.

One of the things that stands out to us -- and I just want to say this. Look, I cover law enforcement all the time. I have shared the original video with some other law enforcement folks from around the country to see what they thought about it. They were disturbed by what they saw in the video.

So, it's not just like us, the public, is upset about it. They're particularly concerned about Mr. Greene being placed on his stomach for such a long time.

And in this video, it seems like a supervisor or another officer arrives. And what you see is still Mr. Greene on the ground, still saying he's sorry, still asking for help from Jesus. He's saying hallelujah.

And, at that time, they are still concerned with keeping him on the ground. In fact, you even hear someone say: Look, I don't want him spitting up blood

But there's nowhere for him to go. There's no one watching. There's just officers. There's no attempt to turn him around at any point. Now, I'm about 25 minutes into this 30-minute video. We wanted to rush down and give you parts of what we were seeing.

In that, you can also hear this officer sort of praising the officers for the chase. You hear one officer say, in fact: "Hey, you just ran a light. Why did you speed away from us?"

But the only difference between this and maybe the George Floyd video was the fact that no one there was to stop. No one is screaming at the officers to turn him over.

[15:05:03]

He's sitting there in agony. And, of course, we heard from the mother earlier today. In fact, take a listen to what she had to say earlier on "NEW DAY."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MONA HARDIN, MOTHER OF RONALD GREENE: From that first time reviewing it, I relived it every day since then, the fact that it was a cover- up.

It's been a nightmare. We have not properly grieved. But we need to hold these people accountable. Someone needs to pay. Someone needs to go to jail for this. This is murder, what happened to my son Ronnie.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

YOUNG: Yes, I have talked to Ronald Greene's mother several times.

And you can understand the pain that she's in. In fact, maybe you can't understand the pain that she's in, because watching your child die on video like this, I would not wish that on anybody.

Still, if you think about the investigation and how long it took for us to get to this point, if it wasn't for this leak, this conversation probably would not be happening.

And now we have an additional 30 minutes to put together the pieces of the puzzle. We know investigators have had this video for quite some time. So, the big question really is, if investigators are sitting here, and they have the full 46 minutes, how weren't they able to piece all these pieces together to give us some sort of information to move forward?

Guys, a lot of questions still left to be answered. I'm going to go back and keep watching this video. And, as soon as we get it approved, of course, we will have to put it on for our viewers as well.

CAMEROTA: Ryan, you make such a good point. It's been two years.

YOUNG: It's two years.

CAMEROTA: Investigations can happen sooner than that.

YOUNG: Absolutely.

CAMEROTA: Thank you very much for bringing all of your great reporting for us.

With us now is one of Ronald Greene's sisters, Dinelle Hardin.

Dinelle, thank you very much for being here. We're really sorry about what your family is going through.

That video that our reporter Ryan just described, he said it's just as sickening as the clips, the few clips, just the two minutes' worth of clips that we have seen. Have you seen the whole 45-minute chunk of bodycam video?

DINELLE HARDIN, SISTER OF RONALD GREENE: No, I have not.

And I'm not ready. I'm not ready to view it in its entirety.

CAMEROTA: Have they given you the opportunity to see it?

D. HARDIN: No, they have not.

BLACKWELL: And what's the explanation?

D. HARDIN: I even requested--

BLACKWELL: Go ahead. I'm sorry.

D. HARDIN: Pardon me?

BLACKWELL: Continue. Continue.

D. HARDIN: I requested the chase.

We still don't even know if it was an actual chase. We still don't even have proof. We don't even know why he was pulled over.

BLACKWELL: So, tell us about the story police told you initially. We know that it does not align with the video that's come out, but what did they tell your family that happened?

D. HARDIN: That he was in a car accident and that he hit his head on the steering wheel and that's how he died, like he died on the way to the hospital.

CAMEROTA: And that wasn't true, of course. And yet that's what the coroner, the autopsy has proven.

And so how can you trust them for -- with anything? And I know that that's how you have been feeling for these past two years. And where are you, where is your family now with getting answers?

D. HARDIN: We're still waiting.

You know, it's still under investigation, according to the state of Louisiana, allegedly. But we have been waiting. They have been passing the buck around, saying that the federal bureau is still -- they still have the case. They have just been playing one big game with us. And if it wasn't for

us pushing the button and just taking notes along the way, we wouldn't be this far. And thanks to Lee Merritt, who took our case, because we were denied for many, many months along the way.

So, Lee Merritt and Ron Haley, I'm so thankful for these guys.

BLACKWELL: Now, you have not seen the full 45, 46 minutes of this video, but you have seen some of it. And what has that been like for you to see and hear your brother in that condition?

D. HARDIN: First of all, when I view it, I don't see my brother, because that's not who my brother was.

My brother was a very brave individual. To see him helpless, with no help, I can't even view it. I mean, when I look at it, it's like I have to, you know, plug my ears up. It's just -- it's unbelievable. I cannot believe that that's my brother, you know?

Ron -- I can't believe that's him. I can't believe that they would actually do something to my brother. He's telling them: I'm your brother. I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm scared.

[15:10:01]

They were out to kill him. He had no chance of living, even with the surrounding officers there, just standing there watching it go down. He had no chance.

CAMEROTA: I mean, we hear him -- we hear him begging for mercy there. He's not our brother, but I can see the -- I feel the pain of listening to somebody beg for mercy like that, while they're not offering any aid.

Your -- we just heard from Ryan that your family, I think maybe your mom, said you haven't been able to properly grieve because of all of these questions.

D. HARDIN: No.

It's been one long roller coaster. It's been a roller coaster, just up and down. Every time there's an update, emotions are triggered. We have had several sleepless nights because of this, trying to figure out, what can we do, you know? Who can we get to highlight my brother's case?

For many, many months, no one wanted to have any dealings with us because it was related to the police.

BLACKWELL: One of the officers, we know, is deceased.

But what should happen to these officers? What does justice, what does accountability look like for your brother and for your family?

D. HARDIN: One thing for sure, we want some arrests to be made, definitely. You know, we're not looking for a settlement. We want criminal charges

to be filed. And we want arrests to be made to all of the -- to all of the officers. And that's starting with the top on down, because, obviously, the governor, the attorney general, Jeff Landry, they're all part of the cover-up. This has been a cover-up from day one, from day one.

CAMEROTA: Has the governor not been helpful?

D. HARDIN: No, not at all. Oh, no.

John -- Governor John Bel Edwards has been playing it off, just, oh, it's still under investigation.

It's mind-boggling that we have been pushed aside. I have seen updates that he's done with the state of Louisiana as far as COVID, as far as LSU with their sexual misconduct, but nothing on the Ronald Greene case.

And I find that to be -- it's just shameful how he's just ignored us all of this time and has never reached out to us and said, I feel your pain or just anything.

BLACKWELL: One more thing here.

I have only seen the video of your brother that's now being released and the pictures that are online, but can you tell me about him?

D. HARDIN: Are you referring to the pictures where he has the bruises?

BLACKWELL: No, I'm telling -- just tell me about your brother. I never met him. Tell me about your brother, the Ronald you remember.

D. HARDIN: Oh, OK. OK, when he--

(CROSSTALK)

D. HARDIN: Oh, my gosh.

My brother was -- he was my hero. And when I say that, he was such a beautiful spirit. I mean, no one was ever a stranger. He lit up the room wherever he went. He was just a beautiful, well-rounded individual. He didn't even see color.

My brother loved everyone. And to see how hate took him down to his last few minutes of life, I can't believe it. I mean, he was tortured. And he was such a lovable guy. And he loved his family. He loved his friends. He loved everyone.

BLACKWELL: Well, Dinelle Hardin, thank you for telling us about your brother and sharing some time with us.

It's as difficult, as Alisyn said, to watch it. I can't imagine to watch it and for that to be your brother who was writhing and calling out for Jesus on the ground. Dinelle Hardin, again, thank you.

D. HARDIN: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: Thank you.

BLACKWELL: All right, just into CNN: The White House has apparently reduced the size of its infrastructure proposal in a counteroffer to the GOP. We will have details on that.

CAMEROTA: Plus: Senator Ted Cruz accuses Democrats of trying to turn the military into a bunch of pansies.

His colleague and Purple Heart recipient Senator Tammy Duckworth joins us live to respond.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:18:32]

CAMEROTA: Senator Ted Cruz has never served in battle, but he sure likes culture wars.

Today, he's taking issue with a recruiting video from the U.S. Army that features a real soldier's story.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CPL. EMMA MALONELORD, U.S. ARMY: Although I had a fairly typical childhood, took ballet, played violin, I also marched for equality.

I like to think I have been defending freedom from an early age. When I was 6 years old, one of my moms had an accident that left her paralyzed. Doctors said she might never walk again.

But she tapped into my family's pride to get back on her feet, eventually standing at the altar to marry my other mom.

With such powerful role models, I finished high school at the top of my class. I needed my own adventures, my own challenge. And after meeting with an Army recruiter, I found it, a way to prove my inner strength and maybe shatter some stereotypes along the way.

I'm U.S. Army Corporal Emma Malonelord, and I answered my calling.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: So, this is the true story of an actual hero who volunteered to serve her country in the military, and, for context, something that Ted Cruz has not done.

I want you to hear the Texas Republican's take on it.

[15:20:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX): What we're seeing is, we're seeing Democratic politicians and these woke lefty bureaucrats and lefty media reporters trying to destroy the American military, trying to turn it in -- into, frankly, a bunch of pansies.

The job of the military is to kill the bad guys, and it is to strike fear in the enemies of America. People sign up to join the military because they want to keep us safe. They don't want to sit around a circle emoting and passing daisies back and forth.

And I don't care if you're a left-handed lesbian who rides a unicycle. That doesn't matter. If you want to sign up to defend the nation, defend the nation and train to do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Well, for a different perspective, let's bring in now Illinois Senator Tammy Duckworth. She's an Iraq War veteran and Purple Heart recipient.

He tweeted out that video and another one with the Russian military, men doing pushups and, tweeted: "Holy crap. Perhaps a woke, emasculated military is not the best idea."

Your reaction to what you're seeing and hearing from your colleague?

SEN. TAMMY DUCKWORTH (D-IL): Well, first, let's say that video of the -- purported video of the Russian military actually was from white supremacist Web pages and chat rooms.

And so, number one, he is retweeting white nationalist propaganda to begin with.

Listen, I would like to hear and I'm willing to wait to have my colleague explain to me what about the video about the corporal was emasculating or turning the military into pansies?

The fact that it's about someone who graduated at the top of their class joining the military? Is it because it's about a video about someone who had a parent who overcomes significant disabilities and challenges and overcame them? Is it because it is someone who is choosing to use their skills to serve our nation and protect -- and took an oath to protect and defend the Constitution of the United States?

I'm willing to wait to hear from Senator Cruz which of those things is turning our military into a pansy. But I doubt that he will be able to answer me, because I don't think he can find a good reason. And, frankly, he is way off the mark here.

Our military is recruiting the very best to join. And it seems to me that this corporal is among the best.

CAMEROTA: Senator, I just want to underscore what you began with, which is, this content was created on Web sites, channels, social media channels that put out -- push out fascism and anti-Semitism.

DUCKWORTH: Yes.

CAMEROTA: That's the content that Senator Cruz is attracted to and feels the need to retweet, this -- I mean, the Kremlin must be so proud.

This is the juxtaposition of the Russian military with an Army, a real Army recruiting video. And that -- I mean, he's falling for it, in other words.

DUCKWORTH: Yes, he's a United States senator, and he is pushing white supremacist propaganda and denigrating the United States military, the same military, by the way, that has been protecting him ever since the insurrection that he helped to foment and continues, along with so many Republicans, to try to distract the American people from.

Remember that Senate Republicans, including Mr. Cruz, just sent a very clear signal that they won't support the commission to actually look and see what actually happened on January 6, by the way, a bipartisan commission.

And so he is doing everything that he can to distract the American people from the fact that it was people with Trump flags, wearing Trump propaganda who used the American flag to beat Capitol Police officers and mount an insurrection and stormed and desecrated our nation's Capitol.

And so how is he going to do this? How is he going to distract us from it? Oh, yes, he's going to retweet white supremacist propaganda. And, as a bonus, he's going to insult the United States military while he's at it. Shameful.

BLACKWELL: Yes. And I don't know who's going to Senator Ted Cruz as a barometer of masculinity on who serves or does not.

(LAUGHTER)

BLACKWELL: Let me come to you on breaking news.

The White House apparently is reducing the size of its infrastructure proposal from $2.25 trillion to $1.7 trillion. We know that the president has been trying to negotiate with Republicans. Your reaction to that reduction?

DUCKWORTH: Well, I am willing to work with my colleagues across the aisle to try to get some sort of an infrastructure plan out the door.

Our economy needs it. Working families need it. I hope they come to the table. I think this is a good-faith effort by the administration. I am somewhat concerned about moving broadband out of that, in this past year, where kids, like my 6-year-old, has been in distance education. We have over 20 million households in this country who don't have access to broadband.

And so I worry about moving things like that out of the package. But I'm happy to see the move towards dialogue and negotiations. Let's get this out the door and help the American people.

[15:25:10]

CAMEROTA: Senator Duckworth, I appreciate that you want to move onto business.

But I can't stop the Ted Cruz -- I cannot get past that he feels--

(LAUGHTER)

CAMEROTA: -- that he somehow has the right to tell the military -- I mean, you are someone who served. You're an Iraq War veteran.

From what you know of Senator Ted Cruz, and how, when the going went tough in Texas, he fled to Cancun, do you think he could have served by your side in the Iraq War?

DUCKWORTH: Well, I had some pretty tough men and women of all different backgrounds who served next to me. In my cockpit, it didn't matter where you were from and who you were, what you believed. As long as you defended the Constitution and had each other's back, that's all that mattered.

I will tell you that, when I was sitting in my helicopter bleeding to death after we were shot down, and my legs were blown off, I didn't ask the person who came to carry me out of that helicopter to safety whether they were raised by two moms or whether -- or how they identified.

All I cared about was that they were there and they had the American flag on their shoulder. And, by the way, at the time, Ted Cruz was not in uniform and he did not have the American flag on his shoulder.

CAMEROTA: Senator Tammy Duckworth, thank you. We really appreciate getting your thoughts on all of this.

DUCKWORTH: My pleasure. Thank you.

BLACKWELL: Thank you, Senator.

Let's get more details now on that potential change coming to the infrastructure proposal.

CNN senior White House correspondent Phil Mattingly has the reporting.

All right, Phil, give us the update.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Victor, I actually just obtained the entire three-page document that White House officials presented to Senate Republicans over videoconference earlier today, their counterproposal, which has been part of these ongoing talks between the White House and a group of six Senate Republicans.

In that proposal, the White House, as you noted earlier, comes down from the top line of $2.25 trillion to $1.7 trillion. They also make a number of four specific key concessions, at least in the view of the White House.

One is moving one key issue as it relates to R&D, supply chain, a key element of the president's American Jobs Plan, out of the discussions entirely, thinking that there are other vehicles those can move in, also comes down on the top-line number the president presented on broadband, trying to match up where Republicans were on the broadband side of things, and also reduces the president's top line as it pertains to roads, bridges and other major projects, coming down a little bit closer to where Republicans were on their 538 -- $568 billion proposal.

But it's key to note here, guys, from the top line -- I have been talking to some Republican aides on Capitol Hill who were involved in this discussion. They made clear they were not happy with what the White House put on the table today.

And I think the interesting question is, going forward, they have had two meetings this week, whether or not this is the signal that things may be ending soon, or whether or not this is just a step in the process. White House officials have made clear they expect the process to continue.

They believe this is a good-faith offer they're putting on the table that they would like Republicans to respond to. But they also make clear, when Republicans respond, if Republicans respond, they want Republicans to come up significantly and show that they are willing to increase their top lines on several different areas.

Whether that happens, guys, well, we will have to see, but the White House now has a new proposal on the table.

CAMEROTA: OK, Phil Mattingly, thank you very much for that breaking news from the White House.

OK, so up next: Former President Trump is planning to hold a series of campaign-style rallies in Florida and Ohio. What does this mean for the governor of Florida, who's hinting about what may be next for his political future?

BLACKWELL: Plus: New York's governor under criticism for the millions of dollars he made off his book on his COVID response. And he got a little riled up when a reporter asked him about it.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)