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Soon, White House to Give Update on Unfolding Situation in Afghanistan; Afghan Woman Who Fled: Afghans Still in Kabul Are Now "Downing in a Sea of Chaos, Fear and Betrayal"; White House Briefing on Afghanistan Situation. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired August 17, 2021 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[13:30:35]

ANA CABRERA, CNN HOST: Any moment now, we will have an update from the White House on the chaotic situation in Afghanistan. And we will take you to this briefing, live, as soon as it begins.

This will be a critical update of a critical time. A flood of people desperate to escape the country. And according to my next guest, they're, quote, "drowning in a sea of chaos, fear and betrayal."

Nasrin Nawa is a Fulbright Scholar at the University of Nebraska, Lincoln. She fled Afghanistan days ago. But her sister is now stuck and hiding.

And also joining us is Gayatri Patel, vice president for external relations at the women's refugee commission.

Thank you very much, ladies, both, for joining us.

Let me start with you, Nasrin.

When did you speak with your sister last? What did she tell you about what's happening right now?

NASRIN NAWA, FULBRIGHT SCHOLAR, UNIVERSITY OF NEBRASKA, LINCOLN & FLED AFGHANISTAN LAST WEEK: It was just maybe two hours ago. We were speaking normally today. She feels better but she's scared and talking to me about an escape plan.

She hopes things get back to normal and she can find a way to get out of the country for now.

We may be -- it's dangerous for her because she's a woman. (INAUDIBLE). She was bike riding her bike just the day before Taliban entered Kabul.

CABRERA: Wow. I have to warn you, ladies, we got a two-minute warning so we may be

having to interrupt this conversation to go live to the White House.

Let me ask you, Gayatri, because you called people desperately trying to flee, like Nasrin's sister, sitting ducks. And right now, you're work to assemble a master list of people who are desperate to escape.

How long is that list? And what are you hearing from people who are there, who are stuck?

GAYATRI PATEL, VICE PRESIDENT FOR EXTERNAL RELATIONS, WOMEN'S REFUGEE COMMISSION: Yes. Thanks so much, Ana.

I mean, the Women's Refugee Commission has been working around the clock since Sunday to really elevate and get those women in front of people that they need to be in front of to be evacuated. The urgent need is so great right now.

I mean, it's a moving target in terms of how many are on that list. But what we're hearing is that they are scared. They are afraid to go

home. And many of them have had to relocate because the Taliban has already raided their homes. They are facing harassment in the streets.

And, you know, the immediate priority is just to get them on the planes, get them out of the country. And really working to push the Biden administration to make that happen by whatever means necessary to get them out of the country.

CABRERA: What is the plan at this point in terms of trying to get to those people, get them to the airport and then, obviously, to safety?

PATEL: You know, that's something that we've been concerned about.

(CROSSTALK)

CABRERA: CABRERA: Forgive me. I need to interrupt.

Let's go live to the White House.

JEN PSAKI, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY --- Jake Sullivan, who will provide an update on Afghanistan and then take some of your questions.

With that I'll turn it over to Jake.

JAKE SULLIVAN, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: Thank you, Jen.

And hello, everybody.

I'm going to start with an update just in terms of the president's engagement today and engaging with his national security team and then make a few comments broadly on the situation. And then I'll be happy to take your questions.

This morning, the president spoke with his military commanders for an operational briefing on the security at the Hamid Karzai International Airport, commonly known as HKIA.

He spoke with Secretary Austin, Chairman Milley, General McKenzie, Admiral Vasely and myself. The president was briefed that DOD personnel have now secured HKIA. HKIA is open and U.S. military evacuation flights are taking off.

Following this operational briefing with his military commanders, the president and the vice president met by secure video conference with their national security team to hear intelligence, security and diplomatic updates on the evolving situation in Afghanistan.

They discussed the status of ongoing evacuations of U.S. citizens, SIV applicants, and other vulnerable Afghans at risk, and how we would do this safely and efficiently and with a laser focus of the team on monitoring foreign preventing any potential terrorist threats at or around HKIA, including from ISIS-K.

[13:35:02]

They were joined by Secretary Blinken, Secretary Austin, Chairman Milley, Director Haynes, Director Burns, myself, Ambassador Wilson, Ambassador Khalilzad, General McKenzie and other senior officials.

Just to say a few words about where we've come from and where we are.

I want to start by saluting our troops and our civilian personnel at the Kabul airport.

I want to salute the Defense Department, the Intelligence Community, the State Department, the Department of Homeland Security, and especially our country team in Kabul who have been doing incredible working under very trying circumstances.

They have safely and effectively drawn down our embassy compound and retrograded our diplomatic personnel.

They have now secured the airfield and are conducting flights out of country. They are moving American citizens as well as Afghan nationals and third country national. They are facilitating flights for our allies and partners to get citizens and others out of Afghanistan.

These operations will continue in the coming days as we move to evacuate American citizens and Afghan nationals who worked with us along with other vulnerable Afghans.

We're engaging diplomatically at the same time with allies in regional countries and with the United Nations to address the situation in Afghanistan.

We're in contact with the Taliban to ensure the safe passage of people to the airport.

We're monitoring for any potential terrorist threats, as I just mentioned, including from ISIS-K.

We intend to continue these operations over the coming days before completing our draw down.

When you work on any policy issue, domestic policy, foreign policy, any policy issue, the human costs and consequences loom large. We're all contending with the human costs of these developments.

The images from the past couple of days at the airport have been heartbreaking.

But President Biden had to think about the human costs of the alternative path as well, which was to stay in the middle of the civil conflict in Afghanistan.

There are those who argue with 2,500 forces, the number of forces in country when President Biden took office, we could have sustained a stable peaceful Afghanistan. That is simply wrong.

The previous administration drew down from 15,000 troops to 2,500 troops. And even at 15,000 the Afghan government forces were losing ground.

What has unfolded over the past month has proven decisively that it would have taken a significant American the troop presence, multiple times greater than what President Biden was handed to stop a Taliban onslaught.

And we would have taken casualties. American men and women would have been fighting and dying once again in Afghanistan and President Biden was not prepared to send additional forces or ask any American personnel to do that over the period ahead.

There have been questions raised about whether we should have drawn down our embassy and evacuated our Afghan allies earlier. These are reasonable questions.

We did dramatically accelerate the SIV process and move out a substantial number of SIV applicants and their families.

But the Afghan government and its supporters, including many of the people now seeking to leave, made a passionate case that we should not conduct a massive evacuation lest we trigger a loss of confidence in the government.

Now our signaling support for the government did not save the government but this was a considered judgment.

When you conclude 20 years of military action in a civil war in another country, with the impacts of 20 years of decisions that have piled up, you have to make a lot of hard calls, none with clean outcomes.

What you can do is plan for all contingents. We did that. The American forces at HKIA are now on the ground are there because ever contingency planning and drilling we did over the course of months preparing for a range of scenarios, including dire scenarios.

President Biden ordered multiple battalions to be pre-positioned in theater and he activated them for deployment before the fall of Kabul.

He also put additional battalions on a short string here in the United States. Those battalions have now flown in as well.

Yes, there were chaotic scenes yesterday. But, as Admiral Kirby said, even well-drawn plans don't survive first contact with reality. They require adjustments. We've made those adjustments.

We'll stay in close touch with our allies and partners in the days ahead as we contend with the immediate need complete the evacuation mission and as we deal with the broader challenges posed by the new reality in Afghanistan.

And we will remain persistently vigilante against the terrorism threat in Afghanistan and in multiple other theaters across multiple continents.

We have proven in other places that we can suppress terrorism without a permanent military presence on the ground and we intend to do exactly that in Afghanistan.

[13:40:05]

And with that, I would be happy to take your questions.

Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: I want to ask, the president yesterday said the buck stops with him.

I want to get an understanding of, what did he mean by -- what is he taking ownership of, not just the decision to leave Afghanistan but is he taking responsibility for the chaos that happened during the evacuation, for the decisions not to do evacuations sooner?

Is he taking responsibility for that and for any bloodshed that may be happening right now? Is he taking responsibility for that?

SULLIVAN: He's taking responsibility for every decision the United States government took with respect to Afghanistan because, as he said, the buck stops with him.

I am also taking responsibility and so are my colleagues, the secretary of state, the secretary of defense, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the directors of our intelligence agency.

We, as a national security team, collectively take responsibility for every decision, good decisions, every decision that doesn't produce perfect outcomes. That's what responsibility is.

Now at the same time, that doesn't change the fact that there are other parties here responsible as well who have taken actions and decisions that help lead us to where we are.

So from our perspective, what we have to do now is focus on the task at hand, the mission at hand. You mentioned chaos the at the airport yesterday. At the end of the

day, the question is, can we effectively evacuate those people who we intend to evacuate?

And that's what we are planning for and executing against, beginning today, where the airport is secure, the flights are going, the people are coming. And we will continue to do that in the days ahead.

Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What is President Biden's response to the people in Afghanistan that are now in the hands of the Taliban terrorists and feel abandoned by the United States?

Or those in Taiwan and elsewhere that are fearful that the U.S. will abandon them to the aggression of China?

And the follow-up to that is, what is Biden's response to people in Israel and other countries who might also believe that the U.S. will abandon them to terrorists?

SULLIVAN: To the first question, President Biden and all of us, as I said in my opening comments, are heartbroken by the human consequences that have unfolded and could continue to unfold in Afghanistan.

We believe passionately in human rights and human dignity. And we want to work with the international community to advance that wherever we can.

But President Biden was not prepared to have American men and women continue to fight and die in a civil war of another country in order to achieve that.

We will use every other tool at our disposal to achieve that. And we will do so day after day, month after month in the period ahead on behalf of the people of Afghanistan.

To your question about allies, we gave 20 years of American blood, treasure, sweat and tears in Afghanistan. We gave them every capacity in terms of training, equipment to stand up and fight for themselves.

And at some point, it was the time for the United States to say that the Afghan people had to stand up for themselves.

We believe our commitments to our allies and partners are sacrosanct and always have been. We believe our commitment to Taiwan and to Israel remains as strong as it's ever been.

Keep in mind, with respect to Afghanistan, we said back in 2011 that we would be out in 2014. We stayed another seven years, far above and beyond the commitment that we made more than a decade ago.

And the last thing that I would say is that President Biden is laser focused on accomplishing the core national security objectives of the United States. And when it comes to Afghanistan, that was getting bin Laden and

degrading al Qaeda. We accomplished that. And he believes it was time for our troops to come home.

(CROSSTALK)

SULLIVAN: Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: So -- (INAUDIBLE) -- described a kind of a choice that the president, that was in front of the president, either save the folks, the allies in Afghanistan, the folks that helped the United States for two decades, or sacrifice more Americans, young men.

The question out there on Capitol Hill and around Washington and elsewhere is, wasn't there another choice?

Wasn't there a way you could have ended - President Biden could have ended the war the way he wanted to end the war so the Americans don't sacrifice further lives for this war but, at the same time, do a better job of either ignoring Ghani's request to not start evacuations?

Or, you know, figuring some way that we wouldn't end up in a situation where there's masses of people rushing to the airport and the execution of the last four or five, six days that has seemed to just about everybody as not the way a competent administration, you know - not the result that a competent administration has -

(CROSSTALK)

[13:45:18]

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Isn't that a false choice? And why could you do both?

SULLIVAN: So first, what I would say is that we were clear-eyed going in when we made this decision that it was possible that the Taliban would end up in control of Afghanistan. We were clear-eyed about that.

Now, as the president said in his remarks yesterday, we did not anticipate it would happen at the speed, though we were planning for these potential contingencies.

The reason I say that at the outset that we knew it was possible they could take over and that had to be built into our calculus in making the determination, as the president did, to drawdown our forces is because, once the Taliban came into Kabul, we were going to be faced with a situation, no matter if there were still U.S. troops on the ground or no U.S. troops on the ground, of dealing with a significant number of people wanting to come to the airport to try to get evacuated.

I'll give you an example. We communicated with American citizens for weeks telling them to get out of the country. We offered financial assistance for those who wouldn't be able to afford to get on flights themselves. Many chose to stay right until the end. And that was their choice.

We now are faced with a circumstance where we have to help evacuate those. That's our responsibility as the U.S. government.

But the point I'm making is that when a civil war comes to an end with an opposing force marching on the capitol, there are going to be scenes of chaos. There are going to be lots of people leaving the country. That's our responsibility as the U.S. government. That is not something that can be fundamentally avoided.

And so while it is a point for reasonable debate, in my view as to how to think about the right moment to signal a complete loss of confidence in a government or not, and which is going to lead to more suffering and death or not, the fact is that we made the judgments we made based on the information we had at the time while preparing for the alternative contingency.

(CROSSTALK)

SULLIVAN: Which was having to fly in these troops to be able to get out folks in a massive evacuation.

Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Do you believe the mission would be completed by August 31st.

And as national security adviser, what is the scenario on September 1st? Do you think the Taliban of 2021 will be different?

Do you see another situation in Iraq where a new terrorist organization would be born, like ISIS, for example?

SULLIVAN: Just on the last point, it's fairly well documented that the Taliban and ISIS-K fight one another, struggle against one another. So I do not foresee a symbiotic relationship there. These are dynamic scenarios so we'll have to see how it plays.

We're working day-by-day to get as many people out. I won't speculate on the timetable question that you just laid out.

And then finally, on what we expect from the Taliban going forward, that's something that will have to be watched and observed over time.

Whether, in fact, they are prepared to meet their obligations to the basic human rights and human dignity of people, to the safe pass satisfying people to the airport, to the fair and just treatment of civilians, that's something they will have to show.

I come at this with no expectations but only a sense that they will have to prove to the international community who they ultimately are going to end up being.

Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Thank you, Jake. Can you tell us, what is it exactly, from the Taliban regarding the

safe passage of Americans as well as the tens of thousands of vulnerable Afghans?

SULLIVAN: The Taliban have informed us that they are provide the safe passage of civilians to the airport. And we intend to hold them to that commitment.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Do you believe them?

SULLIVAN: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: On an inquiry that, is there a deadline that's been set? Has the Taliban given assurances that this will go until August 31st? Is the deadline before or after that, for clarity on what you just said?

SULLIVAN: We believe this can go until the 31st. We're talking to them about what the exact timetable is for how this will all play out.

And I don't want to negotiate in public on working out the best nodality to get the most people out in the most efficient way possible.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: I have a question about, yesterday, President Biden said that the United States military cannot safely be tied to where there is a no mission or interest. If the same -- (INAUDIBLE) - its allies, including South Korea, what do you think (ph)?

[13:50:14]

SULLIVAN: So the president, as he has said repeatedly, has no intention of drawing down our forces from South Korea or from Europe where we have sustained troop presences for a very long time. Not in the middle of a civil war.

But to deal with the potential of an external enemy and to protect our ally against that external enemy. So it's a fundamentally different kind of situation from the one we're presented with in Afghanistan.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The president yesterday said the situation in Afghanistan unfolded more quickly than anticipated, as you said moments ago.

But numerous officials have told ABC that there were key intelligence assessments warning the Taliban could overwhelm the country and take the capital within weeks.

Did the White House disregard that intelligence and push ahead?

SULLIVAN: I'm not actually familiar with the intelligence assessments you're describing. But I also don't want to get into specific intelligence products.

And one thing I will not do from this podium or anywhere else is talk about what a different component of the inner agency did or didn't do because, from my perspective, we're one team with one mission trying to execute and do so in the best interest of our interest in values.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: In the last few days -

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: -- complete by August 31st and there are Americans and Afghan allies who remain there. Will U.S. troops stay until everyone is out or will they leave?

SULLIVAN: So I'm not going to comment on hypotheticals. I'll stay focused on the task at hand, which is getting as many people out as rapidly as possible and we will take that day by day.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: You can't commit to bringing back every American --

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: There's a large number of -- there's a large number of Christian missionaries and aid workers that are particularly vulnerable because they are Christians. Is there any plan to get them to the airport and get them out?

SULLIVAN: We are working with a variety of different types of groups, journalists, aid workers, NGO workers and so forth, to help facilitate their departure from the country.

Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Talk about the contingency plans. The president of the United States left the White House on Friday. When did your administration know another 6,000 troops would be needed for this withdrawal?

SULLIVAN: So on Wednesday evening, the president convened the principals --this is last Wednesday evening -- to discuss the deteriorating situation on the ground in Afghanistan.

He posed the question as to whether we had to flow more forces in from the point of view of a contingency to draw down our embassy and secure evacuation.

Thursday morning, he gave the order to begin flowing those forces in.

And then, as we watched the situation unfold over the course of the coming days, we determined that we would go from step one of that contingency plan, which was about 3,000 troops, to step two of that contingency plan, which is about 6,000 troops.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: If he flew them in, why did he leave the White House? On Thursday, he knew. Why did he leave on Friday?

SULLIVAN: The president worked throughout the entire weekend. I was intimately familiar with his working habits over the course of the week because I was on the phone with him constantly. Secretary Austin was on the phone with him, Chairman Milley, Secretary Blinken, the team in country.

So he was monitoring developments hour by hour throughout that entire time.

And has been making a series of decisions about troop deployments, giving us direction and guidance about how to take the shape of the mission and make sure to execute it.

And at every turn, asking our military, who is leading this mission and executing this mission with bravery and valor, what do you need? I'll get you anything you need. He asked that question multiple times every day.

(CROSSTALK)

SULLIVAN: So President Biden has been deeply engaged in this.

Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Jake - sorry. There's a lot of anger in Australia this morning about the way this has played out. We've got citizens and then, of course, so many Afghans who have helped the Australian forces and helping the U.S. mission over the past 20 years.

Does the administration accept some responsibility? Or perhaps what would be your response to those people who are trapped and some are fearing execution because of the exit strategy or perhaps lack of confident exit strategy?

SULLIVAN: We do take some responsibility for our allies and partners in Afghanistan. In fact, as I said in my opening comments, we are working to facilitate flights and have done so for countries that have lined them up and gotten citizens to the airport.

And we'll be eager to work with Australia to help get out Australia citizens and other individuals who the Australians would like to see get out.

(CROSSTALK)

SULLIVAN: Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Jake, what do you say to the next generation of Afghan women and children, young girls, who will have fundamentally different human rights moving forward?

SULLIVAN: I say that, truly, deeply, my heart goes out to Afghan women and girls in the country today under the Taliban. We've seen what they've done before. And that's a very hard thing for any of us to face.

[13:55:12]

But this wasn't a choice just between saving those women and girls and not saving those women and girls. The alternative choice had its own set of human costs and consequences as I said.

And those human costs and consequences would have involved a substantial ramp up of the American participation in a civil war with more loss of life, more bloodshed, families here in the United States that would be asking a different form of the question you just asked.

These are the choices a president has to make. And it doesn't mean because we don't have forces in that country that we're not going to fight on behalf of women and girls and human rights and human dignity. We are. We do, in many other countries where we don't have active military participation.

And we'll do it in Afghanistan, too. And we will attempt to use every measure of tool and influence we have, along with our international allies and partners, to alleviate the burden those women and girls will face in the days ahead.

We are absolutely resolutely committed to that.

Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Would you say the Taliban is the legitimate governing power in Afghanistan now?

SULLIVAN: Right now, there's a chaotic situation in Kabul where we don't have the establishment of a governing authority. So it would be really premature to address that question.

Ultimately, it will be up to the Taliban to show the rest of the world who they are and how they intend to proceed. The track record has not been good.

But it's premature to address that question at this point.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Jake?

SULLIVAN: Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The Taliban committed to safe passage to the airport but our reporting is that they set up check points outside the airport. People are being beaten and whipped when they try to cross these check points. And that some of the evacuation flights are leaving nearly empty as a result.

What assurances do you have specifically about the check points and when do you expect them to stop?

SULLIVAN: Two things about that. First, the earliest evacuation flights in any evacuation tend not to have every seat filled because the process of getting any evacuation underway has a through-put issue.

So we believe that is being resolved with each successful flight. And we will be putting 300 passengers on your average military cargo plane heading out of the country, one after another, hot unloading and hot offloading.

Second, in terms of people being turned away, by and large, what we have found is that people have been able to get to the airport. In fact, very large numbers of people have been able to get to the airport and present themselves.

There have been instances where we have received reports of people being turned away or pushed back or even beaten. We are taking that up in a channel with the Taliban to try to resolve those issues.

And we are concerned whether that will continue to unfold in the coming days.

As things stand right now, what we are finding is that we are getting people through the gate, we are getting them lined up, and we are getting them on planes.

But this is an hour-by-hour issue. And it's something we are clear- eyed about and very focused on holding the Taliban accountable to follow through on its commitment.

UNIDENTIFIED CORRESPONDENT: Jake?

SULLIVAN: Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED CORRESPONDENT: Thanks so much.

You've talked about your confidence in the contingency plan. I'm wondering if, in hindsight, looking at planning and execution, what this administration could have done differently knowing what it knows now?

SULLIVAN: It's a good question, and it one we'll conduct an extensive hot wash, as we say. We will take a look at every aspect of this from top to bottom.

But sitting here today, I'm spending every hour I have focused on how we execute the mission we have before us, which is getting all of these people out.

Yes?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Jake, a couple of questions for you. One, has the president spoken to any other world leaders since Kabul fell to the Taliban?

SULLIVAN: I'm sorry, that was the wrong person.

He's not yet spoken with any other world leaders. Myself, Secretary Blinken, several other senior members of the team have been engaged on a regular basis with foreign counterparts. And we intend to do so in the coming days.

Right now, the main issue is an operational issue. It about how we coordinate with them to help them get their people out. And we are operating through logistic channels and policy channels to try to make that happen.

(CROSSTALK)

SULLIVAN: Yes?

COLLINS: Jake, just to follow-up on that, you just said you will conduct a review of what went wrong here on the U.S.'s response. I know you said there are additional factors like what happened on the ground in Afghanistan that led to this.

Will you publicly disclose what went wrong and who misjudged the intelligence here for how quickly the Taliban could take over?

SULLIVAN: First, I didn't describe that we were doing a, quote, "what went wrong" review.

What I said was we'll do a hot wash. We'll look at everything that happened in this entire operation from start to finish and the areas of improvement where we can do better, where we can find holes or weaknesses and plug them as we go forward.

[13:59:57]

And of course, we intend, after we've had the opportunity to run that analysis, to share that with people.

Yes?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Thank you, sir.

You've noted that you have encouraged Americans on the ground there to leave and that many chose not to.