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Biden Facing Bipartisan Backlash after Taliban's Swift Takeover; Biden Presidency Faces Key Early Test after Taliban Takeover; Deposed Afghan President Speaks After Fleeing Country; Poll: 69% Support for Mask Mandates in Schools Districts; Poll: Support Growing for Employers Mandating Vaccines. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired August 18, 2021 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00]

ANA CABRERA, CNN HOST: So I think -- what I'm trying to drill down on is, was the president being told one thing, but then telling the American people another?

MARK MAZZETTI, WASHINGTON INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Well, I think it's still unclear and it bears more reporting. And this is going to take weeks, months to find out who knew what when.

We know around the time President Biden on July 8th made that assessment, the intelligence reports were going in the direction of a worst-case scenario.

But what we don't know yet is what he is briefed every morning, what his briefers told him, what Haynes, the DNI,, told him. And so how this was presented to White House officials.

This is what is going to continue bearing out. We've got to see bear out, see where the reporting goes to know more -- to answer definitively your question.

CABRERA: I really appreciate your reporting. Thanks for sharing it with us.

Mark Mazzetti, it's good to have you here.

MAZZETTI: Thank you.

CABRERA: What we do know is it is a mess in Afghanistan right now. And a messaging crisis here in the U.S. The political stakes ahead of President Biden's first sit-down with the media, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:36:95]

CABRERA: President Biden is standing by his decision to withdraw troops from Afghanistan, but can he get the American people to stand behind him as the chaos continues to unfold?

The president set to give his first interview following the events of the last few days.

I want to turn to someone who has been inside administrations in times of crisis. CNN senior political analyst, David Gergen joins us. He's also a former presidential advisor to four presidents, both Democrat and Republican.

David, what does President Biden need to say now? What's your advice to him?

DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: I'm so glad he's doing this and interviewing and taking some hard questions, because the questions are cascading now.

And the president has to protect and advance his own credibility that's very much on the line now. And answer questions that go to the competence of this whole operation, how did it get so botched?

Up until now, the Biden administration has been very effective at getting things done. They've worked well together. You and I have talked before about how well they were doing.

Yet, the inexplicable is now happening. He has to make that explicable.

One question is when he knew that the intelligence reports were getting grimmer about what was going on there, why didn't the administration start looking at the interpreters and allies then weeks ago?

Weeks ago, veteran groups started asking the White House and State Department to speed up the process on these interpreters. People could see it coming weeks ago.

Why, if you know trouble is potentially coming, why would you get rid of your Air Force base just outside Kabul? It doesn't make any sense to get rid of it. We wouldn't have these problems at at the airport we're having now.

Knowing what he knew, why did the president put such a rosy face on things or at least assure us things were going to be fine?

They thought through all the options, but they hadn't thought through all the options.

When they say they didn't act because there wasn't a high level of confidence in the Intelligence Community, that's not the standard.

If the only reason we went after Osama bin Laden was because we had high confidence in where he was, we never would have got him.

They've got a lot on their plate at this White House and I'm sympathetic with that, but still their credibility is on the line.

CABRERA: You have been inside four White Houses, and crises from Iran to Contra. Do you see this as a legacy defining moment for Biden?

GERGEN: A lot depends on what happens in the next few days. If it continues, if there's more mayhem, if there's complete chaos and Americans are killed, yes, it will be a defining legacy.

If he can get order in the streets and get people out of there quickly, people will pay more attention to the economy and the pandemic and so forth.

I think the danger now is that it's not just what's going on in Afghanistan but the fact that we've got the COVID problem getting worse again. Inflation may be coming back.

We've got the president at loggerheads about how much spending to do. I think there's a sense in the country, who's in charge here? Are things under control or not?

And how much can we rely on those who are talking to us from the White House and other positions of power?

So I think this has ramifications and connections to things that go beyond, that really help part of a narrative about how you think about what's going on in the administration.

CABRERA: Again, the president expected to give that interview this afternoon.

GERGEN: Yes.

[13:40:02]

CABRERA: David Gergen, thank you. Thank you so much.

GERGEN: Thank you, Ana. Good to you.

CABRERA: Just in, Afghanistan's former president releasing a new statement as the chaos unfolds. His message, next.

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[13:45:04]

CABRERA: Just minutes ago, we heard from Afghanistan's deposed President. Ashraf Ghani fled his country on Sunday as the Taliban fighters were closing in on Kabul.

CNN's Arwa Damon listened to his statement and joins us with the latest.

What did he say, Arwa?

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it was a bit more of an elaboration, a justification for why he left the country.

Remember, he also released a statement on Facebook on Sunday. This one he made much longer than the previous one, arguing that he didn't have a choice but to flee.

Saying that his security had urged him to do so, that he was in the process of negotiating through a delegation with the Taliban for them not to enter the city of Kabul, but that basically he was left with no choice.

Here's a portion of what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ASHRAF GHANI, DEPOSED PRESIDENT OF AFGHANISTAN (through translation): Honorable death. And counting in Afghanistan was not acceptable for me. I had -- I was taken out of Afghanistan to avoid bloodshed and destruction of Afghanistan.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DAMON: And, Ana, he's in the United Emirates right now. They apparently took him in on humanitarian grounds. That's what we heard from the United Arab Emirates.

But given the situation in Afghanistan, given the situation in Kabul, it is highly unlikely that this message is going to change much of the perception around his departure.

Many other members of his own government, people who had worked very closely with him, have been expressing their anger, their disappointment at the fact that he just packed up and left along with two of his senior aides.

The Afghan people bitterly, understandably disappointed in this.

The Taliban had said that he should return and be a part of negotiating the way forward for Afghanistan. They said that they had previously told him that he also would be granted amnesty, that he did not need to flee.

The other point it seems he was trying to make was to dispel a lot of these rumors that are out there that he left with suitcases of money and that sort of a thing.

But really what was lacking in all of this was a heartfelt message to the Afghan people. He didn't really speak to the Afghan people.

CABRERA: Arwa Damon, thank you for that reporting.

Back here in the U.S., air travel is down, but keep that mask up. The TSA extending its mandate for face coverings on flights.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:53:01]

CABRERA: Air travel hit a 10-week low yesterday as the Delta variant surges through the U.S. and as the TSA now extends its mask mandate until at least January. CNN senior data reporter, Harry Enten, is here now.

There's a lot of debate on the issue of masks, especially in schools. Is it as divisive as we think?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: I don't think it's as divisive as people think. In polling, we see massive support for mask mandates.

Look at this, a new poll out yesterday showed us 69 percent of Americans said they support mask mandates in their school district. Even among Republicans, it was still up to 44 percent.

And here's the key thing, right? If you look at a state like Florida, Ron DeSantis has been threatening to withhold funding from districts.

Look at that, just 22 percent support the idea of withholding funding. It has no support. Even from Republicans, it's just 30 percent.

CABRERA: And more employers are also requiring vaccines to work. What insights do you have for us there?

ENTEN: Well, this to me is interesting because some of the polling early on suggested that vaccine mandates for employers was not that popular. But in fact, what we see is the trend line is going upward.

Look at this, a poll that was just out yesterday. And 55 percent of employers say that they support the idea of vaccinations to work at their workplace.

That is up, if you look compared to a Kaiser Family Foundation poll in June when it was just 37 percent.

So the trend line seems to be going up. More folks are in support of vaccine mandates in order to work at their workplace.

CABRERA: You say the strategy of how to fight coronavirus is playing a big part in the California recall of Governor Gavin Newsom. How so?

ENTEN: Yes, look, this race is really, really close. That's happening in only about a month's time that Gavin Newsom might get recalled. The polls are really, really close, 48 percent to 52 percent.

What is Gavin Newsom and the Democrats doing to make sure he doesn't get recalled? They're pushing the idea of vaccine mandates.

[13:55:02]

And what we see in California, vaccine mandates are very, very popular. For health care workers, 69 percent, customers and indoor spaces with lots of people, 61 percent.

So I think it could be a major play for Newsom going forward, playing up the vaccine mandates. It may carry him to victory.

CABRERA: As always, Harry Enten, lots of good information there. You speak faster than I can read. (LAUGHTER)

(CROSSTALK)

CABRERA: -- listening to you. Thank goodness you're bringing it to us in both ways.

Thank you, sir.

ENTEN: My pleasure. Thank you.

CABRERA: Thanks for being with me at home. And I hope you'll come back tomorrow at 1:00 Eastern. Follow me on Twitter, Ana Cabrera.

The news continues next with Alisyn and Victor.

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