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U.S. Ramps Up Efforts To Get Americans & Afghan Allies Out As Many Struggle To Reach Airport; What Role Does Pakistan Play In The Fallout Of Afghanistan?; 7B Tons Of Rain Fell On Greenland's Ice Sheet. Aired 2-3aET
Aired August 20, 2021 - 02:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[02:00:00]
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MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (on camera): Hello and welcome to our viewers all around the world. I'm Michael Holmes. Appreciate your company. Coming up here on "CNN Newsroom" --
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HOLMES: Frantic evacuation efforts and mayhem at Kabul's airport as we learned U.S. diplomats wrote an internal memo last month warning of a potential catastrophe in Afghanistan.
Hospitals in Haiti are overwhelmed, earthquake victims streaming in and they're the lucky ones.
And another stark reminder about the health of our planet, rain at the summit of Greenland's ice sheet for the first time ever.
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HOLMES (on camera): The chaotic rush to evacuate thousands of Afghans, Americans, and other foreign nationals from the Kabul airport is growing more desperate by the hour.
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HOLMES (on camera): At times, the crash of Afghans outside the airport's gate grew so large and so unpredictable that soldiers fired weapons into the air to push the crowds back. U.S. President Joe Biden, meanwhile, expected to address the deepening crisis in the coming hours.
Thousands of Afghans who assisted U.S. and coalition forces and have a lot to fear from the new de facto rulers have been blocked from entering the airport by Taliban fighters. The Pentagon says in daily communication with the Taliban about letting people with proper documentation through the gates.
The U.S. says it has evacuated about 9,000 people in recent days, including 350 Americans on Thursday. But that, of course, is nothing compared to the thousands of Afghans now clambering to get into the airport and the tens of thousands who can't even get to the airport.
CNN's Nick Paton Walsh with the latest.
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NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR (on camera): It's America's final acts in Afghanistan in its longest war and it involves getting many Americans, many Afghans loyal to America to run a kind of gauntlet from the center of Kabul up to the main airport, where they hope to get flights to the United States, maybe elsewhere, and start a new life in safety. For that, they must go through an extraordinary challenge.
(Voice-over): What should be the easiest drive in Kabul is the reason the city is on edge. Head up to main airport road since Monday when I drove it when you run into the Taliban, then they were beating people back, perhaps to clear the civilian runway crowded with desperate people then.
By Wednesday, it had gotten worse when they were clearly stopping people from using their escape to America, and accosting CNN. Taliban control that road, the entrance at the end of it, and the road to the left. Now, many are trying to get in from the north road, but that has led to devastating scenes at the north gate.
When I was there, the crush was dangerous but the numbers have just grown further still. At night, stun grenades have been thrown when huge crowds still brave roaming Taliban in the dark, in the hope the numbers at the gate have dropped. In the day, it got nastier still.
There were moments of hope, but they carry risk. When people see one success, they might want to try the same thing en masse. Later in the day, U.S. troops had to repel the crowd. Another gateway, what seems to be British soldiers struggled to push back crowds, and huge queues have formed blocking the streets.
America has a numbers problem getting enough people on, but also claiming huge progress while not really knowing how many priority cases they are really seeking.
UNKNOWN (voice-over): How many Americans, American citizens remain in Afghanistan?
UNKNOWN: I don't know.
NED PRICE, U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESMAN: What we do know is that 6,000 people are now at the airport. Six thousand people have been able to make it, have made it through the processing. And as of a couple hours ago, we received only a small handful of reports otherwise from the Americans.
PATON WALSH (voice-over): Inside, it is messy, but there are flights, often, many of them where lives are walked on to C17 and changed forever when the doors closed. The story of the airport, the last place America controls in Afghanistan, where the chaos outside the wire means the promises inside fall perilously short.
(On camera) Now, the U.S. talked of lofty goals of trying to get five to 9,000 people flown out every day.
[02:05:00]
PATON WALSH (on camera): And they claimed that they have now on their airport 6,000 people processed and ready to get on aircraft. That will be extraordinary if that had indeed occurred.
But they do also admit, as you heard there, that they don't know how many Americans are out there in Afghanistan hoping to get out. Extraordinary not to have that basic number there to quantify how big a task is ahead.
So, for the days ahead, there are concerns that once again in Afghanistan the reality of the ground, those terrifying scenes outside the airport even today, are simply not matched or recognized by the statements from American officials.
Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, Doha.
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HOLMES (on camera): Untold numbers of Afghans are desperate to find a way out of the country. Getting them out is one challenge, figuring out where to send them is another. Several nations have pledged to resettle refugees and have begun to process applications.
The U.S. plans to accept 30,000 Afghans, the U.K. and Canada 20,000 each. But some leaders are nervous of another migrant crisis. Turkey's president is calling on Europe to take more responsibility and accept more refugees, saying his country will refuse to bear the burden alone.
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RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN, PRESIDENT OF TURKEY (through translator): Turkey does not have a duty, responsibility or obligation to be Europe's refugee warehouse. Once we strongly close our borders and send the current irregular migrants home, it's up to them to decide where they will go.
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HOLMES (on camera): CNN's Jomana Karadsheh joins me now live from Istanbul. I mean, it's frankly a mess at the airport, Jomana, and now there is a very strange scenario where you got the U.S. negotiating with the victor, the Taliban, to get -- quote, unquote -- "safe passage" for people just to get to the airport, let alone get in.
JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Quite stunning, Michael, that the U.S., the U.S. Military is now relying on the Taliban to ensure that this operation at the airport, these evacuations continue.
We've known the U.S. officials have been in direct contact with the Taliban for quite some time when it comes to the political negotiations that have been taking place in Doha. But right now, what we understand from U.S. officials is that there are several channels that are open, they are in constant continuous daily negotiations with the Taliban.
This effort is being led by the top U.S. commander on the ground in Afghanistan, talking to what they describe as his Taliban counterparts, to ensure that this operation, these evacuations continue.
One of the problems they are finding, Michael, is that while these negotiations are ongoing, while they are reaching results in some cases where you are seeing some of these flights and evacuations taking place, some U.S. officials are describing the results as mixed at best, because one of the problems they're facing is they don't really know the structure, the command of the Taliban really well.
They don't know who is in charge of what. They don't really know what is being negotiated between U.S. commanders and the Taliban commanders. It is actually making its way down to the streets of Kabul, to the actual Taliban fighters who are on the streets. And that could possibly explain some of what we've been hearing, what we have been seeing from our team on the ground, reports of people being harassed, people being beaten up as they try to make their way to the airport.
Clearly, Michael, the U.S. right now is in this damage control mode after what is being described best right now as a mess at Kabul airport. The messaging coming from Washington, clearly trying to show that they are trying to run this operation smoothly, that they are doing everything they can to make that happen.
Just to quickly update you, a short time ago, a White House official said that on August the 19th, Thursday, the U.S. evacuated approximately 3,000 people from Hamid Karzai international airport on 16 C-17 flights. Nearly 350 U.S. citizens were evacuated.
They also had additionally evacuated members of -- family members of U.S. citizens, applicants for the special immigrant visa, and other vulnerable Afghans. They are saying that since August 14th, they've managed to evacuate 9,000 people. And they say additionally in the last 24 hours, the U.S. Military facilities the departure of 11 charter flights.
Now, 3,000 people on Thursday, Michael, that clearly fall short of their targets where they say they have the ability to evacuate five to 9,000 people a day.
[02:10:00]
KARADSHEH: As we have seen, getting people on flights is just one of the many challenges that people face. It's getting to the airport, getting through that process that has been very complicated. And the U.S. officials, State Department, and the Pentagon have made it clear that there is nothing they can do at this point to ensure safe passage to get to the airport. They don't have the capability to go out there and pick up people and get them to the airport. All they can do is run that, what has been described, as a catastrophic operation at the airport. Michael?
HOLMES: The reality is -- I'm hearing directly from people in this situation heartbreaking messages. I mean, so many of those that the U.S. wants to get just cannot get there, as you've been reporting, or they risk running the gauntlet of the Taliban who want to kill them. I mean, the reality is a lot of those people who helped U.S. forces and others are not going to get out.
KARADSHEH: I mean absolute nightmare stories. Again, Michael, it's these different layers of this nightmare that people are facing, whether it is the messaging, whether the process, how do they do this, are they on the list to get out, has their paperwork been processed by the State Department. This is why the U.S. has been criticized about how slow this whole process was.
Yes, this happened faster than they expected, but why was this not done before, why did they not ensure that people were ready to get evacuated out of the country, as you've heard also in next reporting earlier. Also confusion about how many people they need to get out of the country. U.S. officials can't even get the number straight. The estimates are tens of thousands.
It is a really, really, messy chaotic situation. And you've got people who are now risking their lives, not knowing what to do. You've got so many who are taking the risk to try and get to the airport, coming out with horror stories on the flights, bloody because of what they had to go through. People who are really traumatized, they've lost their belongings along the way. And you've got others who are trapped in Kabul, not knowing what to do.
A short time ago, Michael, right before we came on air, I got a message from an Afghan refugees who I met here in Turkey a few years ago, telling me that his family members are trapped in Kabul. They worked for a European company, a European NGO, and they just don't know how to get out right now.
HOLMES: Yeah, yeah, I think a lot of us who spent time in the region are getting those messages. I've had three tonight. It is heartbreaking. Jomana, thank you. Jomana Karadsheh there in Istanbul.
Now, the last time the Taliban were in charge of Afghanistan, women were, of course, denied basic freedoms like access to education. A few believed the militants have really changed their ways. My next guest is an Afghan woman and teacher who joined us on the phone from Kabul. We aren't revealing her name due to safety concerns, obvious concerns.
I want to thank you for speaking with us at what is a difficult time, where you are. I want to start by just asking you what the mood is like in Kabul right now. How are people feeling about what's happened over the last week?
UNKNOWN, TEACHER (voice-over): Thanks for having me, Michael. I'm from Afghanistan. I'm happy to be interviewed (ph). Afghanistan situation is discussed in almost every corner of the world, its disturbing scene around. It is four decades of war. It's going to enter the fifth, which is half century (INAUDIBLE). It is a long period.
All people are worried, panicked. They really don't know what would be their destination. They really don't know. They are panicked. They just want to save themselves. The entire city is in violence.
HOLMES: Yeah. I can only imagine. You are a woman and you are an English teacher. Those are two things the Taliban does not believe go hand in hand. What do you think your future is now?
UNKNOWN: I'm confused. I'm hopeless. I don't know what is coming my way, where I will go, how I will spend my life, my future, the achievements that I had. I know that all this will be simply taken away. Basically, I don't have a future right now.
HOLMES: The Taliban has said -- I will just quote them -- they said that there will be no violence against women, no discrimination against women, within the framework of Islamic law. What do you think that means and do you believe anything the Taliban says on issues when it comes to women working or girls' education?
[02:14:58]
UNKNOWN: Regarding the Taliban, if the Taliban want to develop their image, they should respect the basic human rights of the Afghan people. If it is not respected, their mission would be (INAUDIBLE). We do believe that actions speak louder than words. (INAUDIBLE) it's hard to accept.
They don't do any change as of now because all the women are at home (ph). We judge Taliban (ph) on their actions and words are untrustworthy. If they want to gain people's trust, they must show their strategy, their plan. They are just doing (INAUDIBLE) but we have not seen anything in action.
HOLMES: You just got married less than -- you got married less than three weeks ago. But now, you are hiding with your parents without your husband because he was worried about you being alone while he worked. I can't imagine what that's like for you. What do you see is your future?
UNKNOWN: Again, my future is uncertain, because what Taliban did, they went door to door, looking (ph) for women and girls age between 12 and 45 years old and who are asked and forced to marry them.
Now, I am worried because I can't stay alone at home. I can't spend time with my in-laws. It is a giant family. So I'm worried about my life. My husband sticks in his decision that I must live with my parents. But for how long I can stay here with my parents? So it's very uncertain.
HOLMES: You are a teacher, as we said. What damage do you believe will be done to the gains that were made over the last 20 years in terms of educational opportunities for girls and women in the workforce, like yourself? What will be lost, do you think?
UNKNOWN: Sorry, I couldn't understand.
HOLMES: You -- yes, certainly, you are a teacher and I just wonder what do you think will be the loss in terms of what has been gained in educational opportunities for girls and for women in the workforce like yourself? What damage, do you think, this will do?
UNKNOWN: The last 20 years have given hope to the people of Afghanistan and people have stopped going to schools and girls and women (INAUDIBLE) and all fear of life. But today, the changes (ph) we saw are fading away. There is no hope for future because all the achievements will be taken. As I said earlier, they don't allow women to go.
Previously, I had freedom to go alone home, right, to school, and come back home. Right now, I cannot go without a man. There should be my husband or my brother or husband to get me to school and bring me back. I can't have that freedom as I had before, no one.
There were women but they were working and injured (ph). There were women but they are working as a teacher in many schools. But now, they can't.
HOLMES: Very quickly, what is your message to the world, to those watching this and listening to you right now? What would you say to them?
UNKNOWN: To the entire world, international community, you should intervene so that (INAUDIBLE) achievements made by women and girls should not be compromised. Because you saw, you know the (INAUDIBLE) of Taliban. So don't leave us alone. Do something for us. Our education should not be taken away.
All the women are at home. You cannot see a single woman on streets. We do have women, but they are the only persons being source of income. But now, people don't have money to eat something. They don't have income from work, as they are not allowed to work. Sorry, can you hear?
HOLMES: Yes. We have to leave it. But I want to thank you for your courage. And thank you for talking to us and helping people understand what you are going through. Thank you so much.
UNKNOWN: Thank you so. Thank you.
HOLMES (on camera): Well, an emergency meeting of NATO foreign ministers will be held just a few hours from now with the futures of Afghan refugees at the top of the agenda. European diplomats have been sounding the alarm about conditions on the grounds that are preventing many evacuations as we have been discussing. Our Melissa Bell is in Paris for us.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE) MELISSA BELL, CNN PARIS CORRESPONDENT: A dire warning from Europe's top diplomat about the dire situation around Kabul airport. Josep Borrell described it as catastrophic, with some 300 Afghan nationals who've helped European delegations along the years unable to get into the airport and therefore on to the aircraft that might bring them back to the safety of Europe.
Josep Borrell also warning, however, that Europe would simply not be able to take all Afghans out of the country. It comes as the G7 foreign ministers met today virtually ahead of a G7 meeting next week that is being held to discuss the crisis in Afghanistan.
[02:19:05]
BELL: They called on the Taliban to respect their commitments, to protect civilians, but also to allow the safe passage of those who needed to get there to Kabul airport.
One of those foreign ministers, Dominic Raab, the British foreign secretary, is now in trouble in the United Kingdom. The British press is calling for his resignation. He was on a holiday as the catastrophe unfolded last week.
It was a junior foreign minister who made contact with his afghan counterpart, the British press says, leading to the delay of the evacuation of British nationals and those Afghans who helped them.
The longer term problem for Europeans is very much what it will mean for migration. Beyond the immediate question of how to get European nationals and those who helped them out, what happens over the coming weeks and months, with 18 million Afghans understood to be in need of humanitarian aid. That's according to the United Nations.
The European Union is still reeling from the migrant crisis of 2015. The political consequences of that continue to be felt in so many European countries. Six years on from the 2015 migrant crisis, a common coordinated policy for how to arrange for the safe arrival of migrants and fairly distribute them around the European Union has yet to be found, even as a fresh migrant crisis looms.
Melissa Bell, CNN, Paris.
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HOLMES: Some earthquake survivors are waiting for days to receive the medical care they need. Coming up, medical crews rush to evacuate injured survivors, but time is not on their side.
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HOLMES (on camera): And you're looking at images there from Southwestern Haiti in the aftermath of that devastating earthquake. Survivors are reeling from the disaster, waiting for days just to receive the most basic aid, if they get any at all. Humanitarian assistance has finally started to trickle in, but with an estimated 600,000 people needing that aid, it's not nearly enough. The earthquake also left local hospitals overwhelmed with far more patients than they can begin to treat. One doctor even said that some people may lose limbs or not make it at all, if they are not evacuated soon.
But as Joe Johns reports, medical evacuations are picking up speed.
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JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The helicopter convoy bringing the most seriously injured from the earthquake zone to Port-au-Prince, Haiti, running from sun up to sun down. Today, they are greeted by a surgeon, a broken bone specialist, who quickly evaluates their condition.
The 7.2 magnitude earthquake left more than 2,000 people dead and over 12,000 people injured, causing hospitals in Haiti to be completely overwhelmed. A short distance by air from Les Cayes to Port-au-Prince, but getting here can be a slow process.
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JOHNS (voice-over): This 23-month-old girl suffered a laceration running from thigh to ankle in Saturday's earthquake. When she finally was flown into the capital, her leg was badly infected.
JEAN WILDRIC HIPPOLYTE, ORTHOPAEDIC SURGEON: It took a long time to get her. So it's about 3 days. The facilities are pretty good over there. It's an issue that they are dealing with in the countryside.
JOHNS (voice-over): Many of the patients coming in are children.
UNKNOWN (through translator): As I was sleeping, the bed was shaking, and then I ran. And there was a brick in front of me that fell on my feet.
JOHNS (voice-over): From the airport, ambulances fan out across the city, taking the patients to hospitals that should best suit their needs. Here at the hospital run by doctors without borders, on the west side of town, where the staff have been dealing with more than just the rapidly filling beds.
JOHANNE PAUL, PHYSICIAN, MEDECINS SANS FRONTIERES (through translator): The hardest part is when a staff member knows or receives a patient whom they may be related, and it's tougher for them.
JOHNS (voice-over): The stories of the patients are heart-wrenching.
GLADYS CASIMIR, LOST TWO SONS IN EARTHQUAKE (through translator): My first son died next to me, this mother of four says. She lost not one but two sons in the earthquake, both dying right next to her when their house collapsed on top of them. She was pinned in the rubble for hours before being rescued.
When I started digging and they made a hole, I grabbed one of the people's feet so they knew I was alive.
JOHNS (voice-over): After being pulled from the rubble, her right leg was amputated, but she says her spirit is unbroken.
CASIMIR (through translator): I have a sister and a mother who are living in the states. I want them to know to stay strong, because God has given, God will take away.
JOHNS (voice-over): Joe Johns, CNN, Port-au-Prince, Haiti.
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HOLMES: Many nations worried about the Taliban takeover in Afghanistan. China, apparently, not so much. We'll take a look at how Beijing views the militants in Kabul and the unlikely partnership it seeks.
Also, still to come on the program, Afghan interpreters who worked with the U.S. now find themselves in mortal danger. We'll tell the story of one man and the American friend who is desperately trying to get him out. We'll be right back.
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HOLMES: Welcome back. I'm Michael Holmes. You're watching "CNN Newsroom." In the coming day, President Biden is scheduled to deliver remarks on the evacuation of U.S. citizens from Afghanistan, as well as vulnerable Afghans and allies.
[02:30:05]
In the past hour, the White House announcing 3000 people were flown out of Kabul airport on Thursday. Thousands are still waiting at the airport for a chance to escape. Others still struggling to get there.
The Biden administration says it is ramping up efforts to process the influx of applications. And the U.S. military says it has been in constant communication with the Taliban over airport security. Meanwhile, we're now learning U.S. diplomats in Afghanistan sent a secret cable to Washington last month warning of a potential catastrophe.
The so called dissent memo called on the State Department to speed up the evacuation of Afghan allies. And it's not just the U.S. and its allies who are concerned by the Taliban's takeover of Afghanistan, China is keeping a close eye on how events are unfolding on its far western border. But as CNN's David Culver reports, Beijing likely to take a very different approach than the West.
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DAVID CULVER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Just weeks before the Taliban seized power in Afghanistan, China made a very public display of growing closer to the group's leadership. Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi, meeting a Taliban delegation in northern China in July, giving legitimacy and perhaps confidence to the militant group long regarded with fear and suspicion by the rest of the world.
As many global powers now rush to escape Afghanistan, China claims it remains one of the few countries to retain its embassy in the capital. But China's support for the Taliban comes with strings attached. China's help with reconstruction in exchange for the Taliban assuring regional stability.
HUA CHUNYING, CHINESE FOREIGN MINISTRY SPOKESPERSON (through translator): They will never allow any forces to use Afghan territory to endanger China.
CULVER: A deal brokered between awkward allies, a militant group representing hardline Islam and a Chinese government accused of cultural genocide against and mass attainment of its Muslim minorities at home. But China's relationship with the Taliban goes back a long way.
SEAN ROBERTS, AUTHOR, THE WAR ON THE UYGHURS: It established relations with the Taliban already in 1999 at the encouragement of Pakistan, which is one of China's closest allies.
CULVER: The relationship was seen as pragmatism to manage a potential threat as China shares a small border with Afghanistan through the Wakhan corridor, and China's multibillion dollar Belton road investments in neighboring Pakistan are at stake.
HENRY STOKE, POLITICAL RISK ANALYST: I think they are very wary to get involved militarily and so at this stage, I think trying to cultivate the top rungs of the Taliban promised lots of foreign aid and investments that is really the least worst option at the moment.
CULVER: The Taliban, for its part has not spoken out publicly against China's crackdown on its Uyghur Muslim population in Xinjiang. A silence replicated by many other Muslim majority countries such as Iran and Saudi Arabia. The Chinese government defends its Xinjiang policy and says it's trying to stamp up terrorism after several attacks, which it blamed on a group called the East Turkistan Islamic movement or ETIM, a tiny fringe group that began to dissolve when its leader was killed by the Pakistani military in 2003.
Sean Roberts, author of The War on the Uyghurs says the Chinese government used George W. Bush's war on terror to justify its harsh policies targeting the ethnic Muslim minorities.
ROBERTS: I think that shielded China from a lot of criticism for some of the draconian policies it carried out against Uyghurs.
CULVER: But other groups who could use the plight of the Uyghur cause to recruit Jihadis, a concern for Asia superpower as it tries to navigate the new political reality on its doorstep. David Culver, CNN, Beijing.
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HOLMES: Randy Amir is affiliated with Stanford University's Center for International Security. It's great to have your expertise on this. What - what is or might be different about the Taliban compared to the Taliban who ran the country prior to 911. Essentially the same leaders, aren't they.
ASFANDYAR MIR, COUNTERTERRORISM EXPERT, STANFORD UNIVERSITY: Thanks for having me on your show, Michael. The political echelon of the Taliban today has many leaders from the 1990s and due to that, as well as the mythical status of the founder of the Taliban, Mullah Omar, the core values of the Taliban very much remain the same. You know, this group is very committed to their so called Islamic Emirate. It sees the leader of the movement as a caliph-like figure, rejects elections and centers its favorite School of Islamic theology in its political vision for the country.
And I'd argue that they view on the role of women in society, a more like lack of the role of women remain the same, even if there are some changes on the margins. Yet, I think we have to recognize that the Taliban have fought the U.S. and international military coalition for now two decades. So due to that, due to that testifier they have improved. They're politically much sharper today than they were two decades ago.
[02:35:00]
They are good at international outreach from an initial and enduring alliance with the Pakistanis, they now have relationships with the Russians, the Chinese, the Indonesians, even the Iranians, and they are able to divide their rivals, quote some sideliner, militarily they have improved a lot as well. Yes.
HOLMES: That - that's a fascinating insight those 2.0, much like 1.0 in ideological sense. I wonder I speak from a counterterrorism point of view, what - what has been the reaction of jihadists around the world as they watch the Taliban essentially cruise to victory. What are they saying?
MIR: Global jihadists are absolutely electrified with the return of the Taliban, they are feeling triumphant. They are inspired by the example of the Taliban, which is generating a lot of euphoria. Jihadi leaders in South Asia, in the Middle East and parts of Africa, see the Taliban example as a validation of the doctrine of jihad.
And in Afghanistan, in particular, there are already a dozen or so jjihadi groups, with bases, you know, so it's not a question of establishing new bases. And these groups will directly benefit from the euphoria over the Taliban's win, and due to their enduring relationships with the Taliban, in groups, which will benefit directly include Al-Qaeda and its local units, anti-China jihadis, some Central Asian jihadists and some anti-Pakistan jihadists as well.
And my sense is that it will take less than 24 months that the Biden administration initially argued was the timeframe for the regeneration of international terrorism from the country.
HOLMES: That - that is a frightening short time to be back to a pre 911 concern about terrorist camps and the like. It's not just the West at risk, though, is it? I mean, I wanted to ask you to about Pakistan, which has had a long standing relationship with the Taliban. Might Pakistan regret that relationship? What risks does it face?
MIR: Look, there are - as I mentioned, there are some anti Pakistan jihadi is based in Afghanistan, specifically eastern Afghanistan, and over the last eight to 12 months, these jihadists have been mounting violence against the Pakistani state. And this violence has been gradually incrementally growing up - going up.
One of the first things that the Taliban did, after taking Kabul was released prisoners, and one major group of prisoners that they released were these -- these - the people from the Pakistani Taliban, the Tehreek-e-Taliban Pakistan who have now joined their parent organization, so the Afghan Taliban have already contributed to the strengthening of some anti-Pakistan jihadists.
So I think, you know, this is going to be a very costly choice that the Pakistani government has made by supporting the Taliban all these years. I think Pakistan has some tough days ahead.
HOLMES: We've got we've only got a minute left. But I want to ask you real quick, how united is the Taliban leadership? Are there differences in ideology, perhaps, among those who were children or not even alive during the previous rule?
MIR: Look, the political cohesion, political union - unity of the Afghan Taliban, it has been a long standing counterterrorism concern. Many analysts worried that the Afghan Taliban will fragment. This was a concern during the peace process as well. And this is primarily because the U.S. strategy over the last two decades has been centered on dividing the group, driving wedges within this group.
We've heard about moderates and hardliners in the Taliban, though I'm - you know, I'm - I'm not as receptive to that particular argument. I agree that there is factionalism in the Taliban but I don't think these cleavages, this factionalism has calcified to a point that the group might break up in the near future. I think they've been able to take along some of the younger quarters which have joined the movement over the last two decades.
And what I noticed that there are no signs of publicly observable dissent. There has been no splintering in this group over the last many years. And over the - you know, the last two years or so, I think they have delivered on some major promises that they've made to the U.S. such as you know, holding fire against us personnel in Afghanistan, especially since the U.S. Taliban-Doha deal struck in February 2020.
HOLMES: Fascinating and worrying analysis, Asfandyar Mir, thank you so much.
MIR: Thanks for having me.
HOLMES: Now, for the first time since the Taliban takeover, India talking about the potential for terrorism. Sophia Saifi comes to us live from Islamabad. Yes, plenty of regional concern about what's happening in Afghanistan and India's Foreign Minister expressing concerns over terror, also making a pointed comment towards longtime foe Pakistan, bring us up to date.
SOPHIA SAIFI, CNN PRODUCER: Well, Michael, as we know when it comes to India and Pakistan, there are quite a few pointed comments that have been pointed towards each other for the many decades that have passed.
[02:40:00]
What I think is also interesting considering that this is the first statement that's come out of India since the Taliban came into power into Afghanistan is the fact that right before Kabul fell, there was a press conference by Pakistan's Foreign Minister and they had the spreadsheet, they had a PowerPoint presentation in which they claimed that an attack that killed around 14 Chinese workers, around 10 Chinese workers on the 14th of July, at a One Belt, One Road project in the north of Pakistan, was caused by Indian intelligence and Afghan intelligence which had hideouts in Afghanistan.
So things are changing very, very rapidly like, you know, we've heard from analysts have been speaking on the show previously, there are a lot of concerns with Pakistan and invest - and China's investment in Central Asia and right before even last week, Pakistan's Interior Minister had come out and said and spoken about a new and changed Taliban that are going to be different in the way that they, you know, address the issues with their neighbors.
You know, there is a situation in which Pakistan's Ambassador in Kabul who had actually been sent back because of this issue of the daughter of the Afghan Ambassador being kidnapped and harassed in Islamabad. But that happened just like, two-three weeks ago. And he's now back in Kabul. You know, Afghanistan had recalled its ambassadors, that's obviously completely changed.
You have the Pakistani ambassador in Kabul on a diplomatic offensive, he's met the Chinese ambassador, he's met the Russian ambassador. He's now having meetings with Karzai and Abdullah Abdullah. Pakistan has come out and said that they are going to make a regional multilateral decision when it comes to acknowledging the Afghan Taliban as a legitimate government of Afghanistan.
So things are moving day by day. There are obviously concerns about security within Pakistan as well. And what I find interesting is that the night that Kabul fell, journalists were invited to a dinner with members of the former Northern Alliance who are still here in Pakistan giving press conferences, so we're just waiting to see whether Pakistan is flexing its power, what's going to happen whether it has any sway whatsoever on the Afghan Taliban anymore at all, Michael?
HOLMES: Yes, very complicated stuff. Sophia, thank you. Good to see you Sophia Saifi there. Now the U.S. military says that it is in constant communication with Taliban militants over the security at Kabul airport. 1000s of people as we've been reporting, are waiting there for a chance to escape. Among them, an Afghan interpreter who worked with U.S. Marines. CNN's Sourav with his story.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) CYRIL VANIER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: On the other side of this crowd, the only way out of Afghanistan, Kabul International Airport. Families, women and children, 1000s rushed here to be evacuated after the Taliban sudden takeover of the country. Some are being turned away, it seems. Others are settling in for a long wait.
The man who shot this video Haji, his identity protected for fear of retribution. Haji's journey to the airport really started here, 10 years ago, Helmand Province, the heart of the Taliban insurgency. Haji sided with the Americans a translator for the U.S. Marine Corps.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, at least one of those kids is a fighter. Would you agree?
HAJI: Yes. It's different. They bring weapons here, definitely they bring IED here.
VANIER: The Taliban never forgave him. He's been on the run with his wife and young children for five years. This is what Haji said to CNN only a few weeks ago.
HAJI: If they found me, they'd kill me and they'd kill my family because I was an interpreter with the U.S. marines.
VANIER: Denied a Special Immigrant Visa for the U.S. twice, Haji was running out of options when a former platoon mate stepped in.
LANCE CORPORAL JIMMY HURLEY, US MARINE CORPS (RET): I kind of had a moment where I realized that he - he would not be able to do this by himself at all. And I felt like if I didn't see it through, there was zero chance of him getting out.
VANIER: From half a world away former Lance Corporal Jimmy Hurley applied for a new visa and a few days ago started crowdfunding, anticipating hard times ahead.
HURLEY: OK, really fighting not to get emotional here but I was pretty blown away at $2,000 from friends and family and then the CNN story aired, and it you know, it turned 10- 13-18. How quickly it grew. It's been really, really cool, really overwhelming.
VANIER: But the Taliban's lightning advance forced some difficult decisions. Haji, you 100 percent need to get to Kabul, Jimmy writes. Have you gotten the money?
[02:45:00]
Hours go by. And finally this from Haji. Getting to Kabul, walking, running, hiding, walk in mountain and in forest. Haji and his family taking every risk, skirting Taliban checkpoints, including this one, and rushing to the airport gambling that their visa application would be enough to get them to safety.
What happened when you tried to get to the gate?
HAJI: We tried to go in I told them I've got this document they said no. You have to have someone inside this airport. They come out for you, they will take you inside.
VANIER: So Haji waits for an elusive email, crowds now looking like this outside the airport. The Taliban biding their time as the U.S. improvises a mass evacuation. Haji's life in the hands of the Americans, for whom a decade ago he risked his own. Cyril Vanier, CNN, London.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Still to come here on the program, Hong Kong's decision to allow actress Nicole Kidman to skip quarantine, sparking outrage across the city. Why local officials say she's exempt. We'll be right back.
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HOLMES: New Zealand and parts of Australia are tightening COVID restrictions as the Delta variant fuels the rise in cases. Sydney extending its lockdown through September. The State of New South Wales reporting nearly 650 new infections on Friday, most of them in Sydney. A nighttime curfew takes effect Monday for some of the city's most affected areas. And a nationwide lockdown in New Zealand will be extended until next week. The country went into a snap lockdown earlier this week. The Prime Minister said the length of the new restrictions will be reevaluated on Monday.
Now Hong Kong has some of the toughest quarantine rules but actress Nicole Kidman has managed to avoid the mandatory isolation. The government granting her a special exemption while she's in the city filming a TV series. CNN's Will Ripley joins me from Hong Kong this hour, ironically in quarantine himself.
Queue jumping as a movie star is one thing but this is really infuriated people, hasn't it?
WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the timing just isn't ideal Michael because I like a lot of people had to scramble to cut trips short, I cut my vacation short by two weeks. I had to rebook flights and hotels to get here just hours before Hong Kong put in even more strict quarantine rules because of the surging Delta variant in other places and the you know, relatively non-existent case numbers here in Hong Kong.
They have certainly done a good job of keeping the virus out of the city, but to do that, people who are traveling in from other countries have to go through up to a 21 day quarantine.
[02:50:00]
Where I was traveling from if I had arrived today, it'd be 21 days because I arrived last night, it's only 14 days locked in this hotel room where I have to basically wash my own laundry in the shower because you can't - nothing that comes into your room can leave. You are basically you know, whenever you have a meal delivered, you have to wear a mask at the door and make sure that you don't interact with the person who's in essentially a hazmat suit, you know, handing this to you.
So you're - you're treated - you're in total isolation when you arrive here in Hong Kong. And yet, Nicole Kidman and five members of her crew were able to fly to the city by private jet from Sydney where there is a currently very large outbreak of the Delta variant. And - and they within two days were spotted out and about around the city.
The Hong Kong government says that they are just performing essential job functions and that they, as members of a film crew at a time that Hong Kong is trying to revive its image are essential workers, like the people who deliver food to the city and the people who provide essential services who are also granted quarantine exemptions.
But it's infuriating for people who have to play by a different set of rules, who have to wait for five hours at the airport, get, you know, multiple COVID tests and are locked inside these hotel rooms. And of course, Michael as somebody who's actually able to travel, I'm one of the lucky ones because there are many people here in Hong Kong, who don't have the kind of job that would allow them to afford a $3,000 to $6,000 self-paid quarantine stay every time they want to travel, which means that people can't see their families, they can't see their parents, they can't leave the city.
And so for those people to see somebody, a Hollywood star and her crew kind of fly in and be able to walk around, you know, granted, they are tested for COVID, you can see why it's certainly striking a nerve here.
HOLMES: Certainly can Yes, yes, you're not bitter, are you at all? No.
RIPLEY: I'm not bitter. This is a decent view for a quarantine. I'm doing all right.
HOLMES: I was just going to say, you have a nice view, it is a very nice view. Good to see you my friend, Will Ripley, there in Hong Kong with a view. Now the planet has been issued a new warning to humans about climate change. This time, it's rain where it doesn't belong. The story and what it means for the future, coming up.
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HOLMES: Now this isn't good news. For the first time on record, it rained at the summit of Greenland's ice sheet. The summit is three kilometers above sea level and any precipitation has always fallen as snow. The rain this past Saturday lasted for several hours. In July, the ice sheet experienced one of its most significant melting events in the past decade losing more than 8 billion tons of surface mass in a single day.
That's enough to submerge the entire state of Florida in two inches of water. Meteorologist Derek Van Dam here with more on the situation and what it means for our planet. I mean yet another example of things happening where they shouldn't be happening.
DEREK VAN DAM, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes, rain where it's supposed to be snowing. The highest point on Greenland, the summit there experiencing rain. Here's the proof. This is a picture taken of a window at the mobile environmental laboratory. And again, the highest point in Greenland, that's over three kilometers above sea level. Temperatures there rose for the third time above freezing within the past decade and that warmth fueled an extreme rain event that dumped over get this 7 billion tons of water on top of the ice sheet.
[02:55:00]
And that, of course cause more melting. That's enough water by the way to fill the Reflection Pool at the National Mall in the nation's capital, Washington DC over 250,000 times. Now comparing this to previous events, we're talking about an entire season record melt in 2019. That's when we saw 532 billion tons. That's also when the world noticed a 1.5 millimeter increase in sea level rise.
Now what we're talking about now is a three-day event that occurred with heavy rain and the resulting ice loss because of the warmth and the precipitation that fell but it is still significant. Looking back into July 18 point 4 billion tons lost in one week alone. And in one day alone, enough water equivalent of loss to cover the state of Florida with five centimeters of water. That's incredible.
What's happening here? Low pressure forms of the Baffin islands in Canada, high pressure to the southeast of Greenland, that fuels warmth driven in from the south. And you can see that red across central portions of Greenland, that is temperature anomalies above average.
We're talking five to 15 degrees Celsius above where it should be the ice melt, melt crept inland as well further than it had ever done over this three-day period. And why do we talk about this? Because melt water in Greenland is one of the largest contributors to sea level rise in the planet. If all of Greenland were to melt, we would have a seven meter rise in sea levels. That is incredible because as human caused climate change continues to warm our planet, it is increasing the severity of our coastal sea level rise as well.
Earth has already lost 28 trillion tons of ice since the mid 1990s. We certainly don't want to see the repeat of these extreme ice loss events taking place. Again, it is the pattern that we are seeing that is quite concerning for scientists, environmentalists, Michael.
HOLMES: Yes, yes, exactly. And us. Yes, Derek. Appreciate and thanks for that. Derek Van Dam there. And thank you for spending part of your day with me. I'm Michael Holmes. You can follow me on Twitter and Instagram @HolmesCNN. Do stick around. I'll be back with another hour of world news in just a moment.
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HOLMES: Hello, welcome to our viewers all around the world. I'm Michael Holmes.
