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90 Afghans, 13 U.S. Troops Killed in Kabul Attack; Biden: "We Will Hunt You Down and Make You Pay"; More than 90 Afghans, 13 U.S. Service Members Killed; 14,500-plus Evacuees pass through U.S. Air Base in Germany. Aired 1-2a ET
Aired August 27, 2021 - 01:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[01:00:06]
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.
JOHN VAUSE, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm John Vause at the CNN Center with our breaking news coverage from Afghanistan.
U.S. military is warning of continued terror attacks in the hours and days ahead, targeting Kabul's airport by a group known as ISIS-K, an offshoot of the Islamic State, which claimed responsibility for Thursday's double suicide bombing just outside the airport's perimeter.
At least 90 Afghans and 13 U.S. troops, mostly marines, were killed in what has been described as a sophisticated and complex attack, which played out almost to the level of warnings which have been issued just 24 hours earlier.
First came attack by a suicide bomber at the Abbey Gate, a key entry point to the airport terminal. Then, another suicide bomber targeting the nearby Baron Hotel. And a warning now, especially if children are in the room, you are about to see very graphic images from the scene of the attack.
It's difficult to watch, but it is in reality -- the cruelty and brutality of a terror group which has no regard for human life. ISIS-K called this a martyrdom operation, and praised the suicide bomber who will not name for getting so close to American forces. The bomber detonated his explosives where many more in line to be processed for flights.
The closed cement surroundings meant it would most likely intensify the power of the blast.
The U.S. President Joe Biden visibly upset as he condemned the attacks, saying the America will not be intimidated and terrorists will not win, and adding the airlift, which has flown more than 100,000 people to safety, will continue as planned.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: For those who carried out this attack, as well as anyone who wishes America harm, no this. We will not forgive. We will not forget. We will hunt you down and make you pay. I will defend our interest and our people with every measure at my command.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: For much of this ill-planned and chaotic U.S. evacuation, CNN senior international correspondent Sam Kiley has been there. He reports now what is the darkest day so far of the U.S. withdrawal from Afghanistan. And once again, a warning, his report has images at the aftermath of the explosion, which are graphic and difficult to watch.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Thirteen U.S. personnel and scores of Afghans have been killed in a terror attack at the Kabul airport.
U.S. Central Command says that 18 other service members were also wounded and a complex attack which the Afghan Ministry of Public Health said injured more than 100 other people.
The scenes of horror come in the waning days of Americas unprecedented civilian airlift.
Central Command's General Kenneth McKenzie said more attacks were anticipated.
GEN. KENNETH MCKENZIE, COMMANDER, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: We believe it is their desire to continue those attacks and we expect those attacks to continue, and we're doing everything we can to be prepared for those attacks.
KILEY: The bombings targeted many who are trying in vain to get into Kabul airport and get on one of the last evacuation flights. The Taliban condemned the murders and pledged to punish those behind it.
The blast just outside Abbey Gate, one of the main entrances to the airport, and near a hotel controlled and occupied until recently by British forces. It's an area that has been packed for days with Afghans wading through sewage canals, founded by blast holes, those conditions will surely have amplified the explosion.
American officials have been warning about potential ISIS-K attacks for days. On Wednesday, they stepped up the alarm, talking about a very specific threat stream from ISIS-K, and about a planned attack on crowds outside the airport. The Americans were killed when in close contact, screening and searching evacuees at the Abbey Gate.
General McKenzie, pledging that this atrocity would not affect the evacuation efforts.
MCKENZIE: ISIS will not deter us from accomplishing the mission, I can assure you of that.
KILEY: But this is a dangerous time for the U.S. led coalition mission. It is due to end by August 31st deadline. Those troops withdraw, and they become more vulnerable.
And it is damaging for the Taliban, too. Sworn enemies of ISIS-K, they promised the U.S. airport security and safety at home for Afghans. These attacks suggest that they have delivered on neither.
Sam Kiley, CNN, Doha.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[01:05:02]
VAUSE: CNN's Anna Coren was recently in Kabul and continues to be in contact with many inside the country and CNN's Jomana Karadsheh is also standing by with more on the terror group ISIS-K, an offshoot of the Islamic State. Jomana extensively covered the rise and fall of ISIS in Iraq.
Anna, first to you. We have word from U.S. intelligence that other attacks are imminent. Where and when and with the authorities in Kabul also known as the Taliban are doing to try to disrupt these plans.
ANNA COREN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, John, what we are learning is that these threats of more attacks in the coming days are extremely credible. They fear that they could be rocket attacks. They could be car truck bombings and that ISIS-K fighters may try and again breached the airport. This is what we are learning.
And this is highly embarrassing for the Taliban that, you know, was working in conjunction with the United States military to try and get these people through into the airport. There job was to protect the outer perimeter of the airport. You know, just a day beforehand, they had been saying that there were no ISIS-K operatives in Afghanistan. Well, that is clearly not the case and experts have been telling us the United States government has also been telling us this.
The warnings have been going on for the Biden administration since last weekend as to the fact that there could be these terror attacks committed by ISIS-K.
I was speaking to an expert, this time yesterday, John, when he said he was puzzled that they had not actually been any attacks. And 12 hours later, it happens.
This just, you know, further complicates the situation on the ground for the thousands of people were still outside the airport desperately trying to get in those twin bombings claiming the lives of 13 service U.S. members, now, 90 Afghans, more than 115 injured. It is not deterring these people who are so desperate to get out.
You know, John, when Afghanistan fell to the Taliban, about 2,000 ISIS-K fighters were released from prison. You've got about 100 that were killed in the recent weeks by the Taliban, because obviously the two groups do not like each other, but you still have 1,900 of them, if not more, roaming around.
We know that there are cells in Kabul, we are hearing reports that some disillusioned Taliban members may be working with ISIS-K. These are some of the details that are coming into us.
VAUSE: Good details.
Let's get a little more on ISIS-K. Let's head over to Jomana right now in Istanbul.
So, Jomana, when it comes to ISIS-K, it's still a relatively small group. Does it have the capability to carry out back-to-back attacks in a very short amount of time? I guess that's the question right now.
JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, John, even before this latest attack, even before the imminent threat that U.S. officials were warning of, U.S. defense officials have always considered ISIS-K to be a major threat. They have managed to carry out some really devastating attacks in the country since 2016.
And we've seen that in recent months, targeting government targets, foreign targets, civilian targets, minority groups. I mean, if you look back in May, there was a devastating, horrific attack targeting school girls, where more than 80 people, many of them school girls, lost their lives. That is believed to have been carried out by ISIS-K. A month later, an attack on a British-American charity, also believed to have been carried out by ISIS-K.
So, it has the ability to carry out the sort of horrific attacks, as we have seen recently, and as Anna was mentioning, the estimates of how many fighters they have, how many militants are part of that group, estimates around 1,500, possibly, and the concern has been these prison breaks as the Taliban swept across the country, there were several major prison breaks, hundreds are estimated to have joined ISIS-K's ranks since then. Many of them ready members of the group.
Now, if you look, John, at Thursday's attack, you know, unfortunately, it does not take much to create this sort of horror, this sort of maximum casualty attack as you, someone we have large crowds, we have bombers, we have attackers that are able to make their way into these crowds.
We've seen this in the past. This is the M.O. groups like ISIS, ISIS- K, other affiliates, these are the kind of attacks that they have carried out in the past.
[01:10:06]
We're going to have to wait and see the forensics from this attack. What U.S. officials will have to say about the bomb-making capabilities, what kind of explosives were used? Was this a suicide vest? What was used to carry out this attack?
What I think is also interesting, John, U.S. officials have said that this was a complex, coordinated attack. Two bombs, small arms fire. But when you look at the statements, the claim of responsibility that came from ISIS-K, they're saying it was one fighter that carried out that attack, and which is very concerning, John, about that is they say he was targeting U.S. forces in what they described as the collaborators, translators and others who worked with U.S. forces, really highlighting how vulnerable the U.S.'s partners, the Afghans who worked with the Americans are right now, not just to the Taliban threat as we've been reporting for days, but also as we've seen, they are a main target for groups like ISIS-K that have described them as collaborators, John.
VAUSE: Very good point to end on.
Jomana, thank you. Jomana Karadsheh there in Istanbul. Also thanks to Anna Coren live in Hong Kong.
Colin Clarke is a senior research fellow at the Soufan Center. He's also author, "After the Caliphate: The Islamic State and the Future of the Terrorist Diaspora".
Colin, welcome back. It's good to have you on today.
COLIN CLARKE, SENIOR RESEARCH FELLOW, THE SOUFAN CENTER: Thanks for having me, John.
VAUSE: Again, with the U.S. and others have very good intelligence about where, when, how this attack is going to happen. Even after before those warnings there were concerns that coalition troops at the airport as they're trying to board the evacuation flights were huge risks.
So, where was the weak link here? Would allow the suicide bombers to carry out this attack?
CLARKE: Well, look, I mean the marines were sitting ducks. They were sitting out there. You've seen some of the images coming from Kabul and around Hamid Karzai International Airport. There is just no perimeter. There is no white space between them and these throngs of people.
So, to have suicide bomber infiltrate that crowd actually was not all too difficult. Moreover, we are depending on the Taliban to do security, to figure out who is vetted, who gets to come into these inner rings of the perimeter and get closer to our soldiers. So, I think there have been numerous missteps along the way in terms of planning.
VAUSE: With regards to the Taliban providing security, there does seem to be not a lot and the Taliban's interests who allowed the attack to go forward. And after this attack, where does it say about security across the country especially once the U.S. forces are out?
CLARKE: Look, the Taliban were effective insurgents but it's a bit more dubious how they'll be governing the country. They're going to be stretched thin. There's no mistake about it. With that said, it is going to be impossible for them to establish a monopoly on the use of violence and force when they need to.
That means that wing groups like ISIS-K are going to have the operational space to grow, to regenerate and there is going to be spillage. You're going to see beyond Afghanistan's border throughout the region and potentially further afield.
VAUSE: What happens is that when a terror plot is revealed and public warnings have been made, that attack just never seems to have -- or very rarely. This seems to be a rare example of the attack actually taking place with the group following through. You know, all the details were made public, so how unusual is it to take place once everyone knows about it?
CLARKE: It's a good question. You are right. There are times when warnings are made and they tend to be more generic and then the attack does not take place, because the plot was disrupted. The terrorists get cold feet. Someone has turned within the organization, and they're able to disrupt the cell.
This just felt different from the beginning. Actually made a comment on social media this morning, because there were a lot of people doubting it, saying something smells fishy and this doesn't smell right. Why are they giving us these warnings?
And, you know, my comment was essentially, the threat is real, ISIS-K has the capability and, you know, they're going to take the opportunity and sure enough they did.
VAUSE: ISIS-K has not been seen as an A-list terror crowd if you'd like. Why do we know about these guys? How has this attack changed their status? It was fairly complex. There were multiple explosions, high numbers killed and hurt, the bloodiest day in Afghanistan for U.S. forces in more than a decade.
CLARKE: Yeah. I mean, what this reminds us is never to underestimate the Islamic State. You know, you just mentioned they were not part of the upper echelon, and you are right about that, but things can change. And moreover, you really only need a small presence on the ground in an organized fashion to cause significant amounts of havoc and that's exactly what we saw.
[01:15:00]
This is a group that still maintains between 1,500 and 2,200 fighters in the country. So, more than enough fighters to mount a spectacular attack and certainly, they clearly have the reach and capability to strike in Kabul.
VAUSE: So what happens between now and Tuesday?
CLARKE: It's a good question. I think there's a lot of concern, of what's going to have been over the next couple of days. Tensions are high. The military is going to be on high alert, and I would fully expect the Islamic State Khorasan to attempt more attacks. I think to me, it almost feels inevitable. The question is whether they can be disrupted before they can occur.
VAUSE: OK. Colin Clarke, appreciate it, thank you for being with us.
CLARKE: Thanks for having me.
VAUSE: The U.S. president, insisting that evacuations from Afghanistan will continue, on as planned.
But up next here on CNN, new reporting on what could be an accelerated timeline, as U.S. military begins a total troop drawdown, in earnest.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VAUSE: Flags have been lowered to half staff at the White House and U.S. Capitol for those killed in the Kabul terror attack. They will stay there until Monday. The eve of the U.S. deadline to formally withdraw from Afghanistan, and in the coming hours, that will be a focus of the meeting of the president, vice president, and the national security advisers.
Joe Biden was already under fire for the way he ended America's longest war, especially that unwavering commitment to the deadline.
Now, the criticism is only growing louder. Some Republicans demanding his resignation, and after the death of 13 U.S. troops, they're accusing Biden of having blood on his hands. The White House says, this is not the time for politics.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: These ISIS terrorists will not win. We will rescue the Americans from their. We will get our Afghan allies out, and our mission will go on. America will not be intimidated. I have the utmost confidence, in our brave service members, to continue to execute this mission with courage, and honor, to save lives, and get Americans, our partners, our Afghan allies, out of Afghanistan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: CNN White House correspondent, Arlette Saenz, is live at this late hour, in Washington.
Thank you for staying up, Arlette.
So, is there any chance the administration will change course here, and extend that deadline, like so many on both sides of the aisle have been calling for?
ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, John, President Biden showed no signs of budging from that August 31st deadline. And, in his remarks today, even said that the evacuation mission continues, despite this terrorist attack, outside of the Kabul airport.
Now, the president has said that the U.S. remains in contact, with Afghans, who are with Americans, who are in the country who wants to leave, that they have established those contacts, and those Americans are trying to find time to make it to the Kabul airport, to be able to leave the country.
[01:20:06]
He also noted that there are some Americans who, simply, just do not want to leave the country. Perhaps it is because they have large families, who would be unable to travel with them. But, the president insists, they're working to get all Americans who want to leave the country out of Afghanistan by August 31st.
And what you heard from the president, in his remarks, was him doubling down on his decision to withdraw the American military presence, from Afghanistan. He said that these terror attack today is one of the things that they are trying to avoid. And that is why the U.S. needs to leave Afghanistan.
But, he did not show any signs of budging from that August 31st deadline, but he did say, there could be other ways to extract, and evacuate Americans after the fact. But, for the time being, he still appears intent on having U.S. troops out of Afghanistan by Tuesday.
VAUSE: We heard on Thursday, was essentially the darkest of the Biden presidency. Are they prepared for worst states to come, especially with more deadly terror attacks in Kabul? What are they saying?
SAENZ: Well, they've been pretty clear eyed about the situation at hand. They have been warning for days that this attack from ISIS-K could potentially happen. And so, yes, today was certainly the worst nightmare for the president. He did not want to see any loss of American lives, in Afghanistan.
But, right, now what you really have, the U.S. military, and the president, engaging in, are these missions. One is to evacuate Americans, and as many Afghan allies as possible, but secondly, the president has said that they are prepared to go after the perpetrators of this attack. He said that the U.S. will retaliate, and hunt down those responsible. The president, specifically, said that he ordered the military to present him with options, potentially ordering strikes against ISIS-K assets, and their leadership team. But, they are working to ascertain who, exactly, was responsible for this attack.
But, what you have heard from President Biden, and other officials, both in the military, and the administration, is that there is a possibility that similar attacks could be carried out, in the coming days, especially as that withdrawal deadline, of August 31st, approaches.
So, right now, the American mission is not just to get those responsible for this attack, but also to rescue, and evacuated, as many Americans as possible.
VAUSE: Arlette, thank you. Arlette Saenz there live for us at this late hour in Washington -- thank you.
SAENZ: Thanks.
VAUSE: Josh Rogin is a "Washington Post" columnist by day, CNN political analyst by night. He is with us now, joining us this hour.
So, Josh, it is good to see you.
JOSH ROGIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Likewise. VAUSE: OK. This decision to withdraw from Afghanistan, it was seen as
a good call, but it's the exit which was the disaster here. Up until this point, the silver lining was always, this argument that Biden can make, at least know U.S. troops have died.
Well, obviously, that is no longer the case. Notably soldiers have died from Afghanistan since February of last year. Biden is facing, which seems to be the worst of all outcomes.
ROGIN: That is exactly right. This is the lowest point in the Biden presidency, and the lowest point in the U.S. foreign policy, as far as I can remember. And that's not really the most important thing right now. We still have attacks going on in the ground, in Kabul. There are still Americans in danger, Afghans in danger, international personnel in danger, right now.
And, there is a very high likelihood, according to my sources, that this will get worse, before it gets any better. So, I think inside the Biden administration, they are conflicted between the fact that they need to spend all of their time and energy on trying to minimize the ongoing threat, and try to minimize the damage and death from here on out. At the same time, getting the narrative right, and trying to convince people in Washington and failing to do so that they handled this well.
And, you know, it's very clear, the Biden administration bungled the evacuation, and is bungling the withdrawal and that many of the decisions that they have made, put them in a position where they're out of options. They're out of leverage, they're out of time. And when I hear from my sources, on the ground, is that there are no speeding up the withdrawal, they want all of the military personnel, and assets, to be out by 48 hours, right now. They are in the process of destroying their own equipment, inside of the airport, so it doesn't fall into Taliban or ISIS hands.
And, back home, the storyline, and the narrative for the fate of the Biden administrations, and their agenda going forward, just gets more and more grim.
VAUSE: So, right now, essentially this Tuesday deadline that is gone by, we are now looking at 48 hours, from this point on.
[01:25:00]
So, I guess it raises a few questions. What does it say about the commitment hitting Afghan allies out safely? What does it say about the commitment to getting Americans out safely? There is plenty of concern about their fate post-Tuesday. I mean, that clearly, that timeline has left a lot more people exposed.
ROGIN: Right. To be clear, officially the timeline is still August 31st. I'm telling you, I'm hearing from my sources inside the government, that, unofficially, they are looking to speed up their withdrawal. What that means, is that evacuations essentially have to stop, if they haven't already now. For Afghans, it has been almost impossible to get into the Kabul airport for days now. But, for Americans, and for some select friends of the Americans, they have been able to get in, until the bombs hit. Now, what the State Department is telling people is, they should shelter in place, and hide, or to pursue methods that are not involving going to the Kabul airport.
And that could be a number of things. That could be, you know, waiting for Special Forces to come rescue you before they leave town. It could be heading for a border, but none of those are good options at all. And as the violence on the streets of Kabul goes, the ability of the Biden administration to claim any capability, to save Americans, or Afghans, is vanishing very, very quickly.
After August 31st, basically, the administration said is, they will use diplomatic, power and leverage, to support Afghans, and Americans, getting out who want to get out. But, you know, I've talked to many Americans on the ground, I've talked to many Afghans on the ground, and none of them believe that. None of them see how that makes any sense. Once the last U.S. troop leaves, I think, our leverage leaves with him or her.
VAUSE: So, what is it with the gaslighting coming from the administration when it comes to Afghanistan? Trying to convince people of a situation that is, clearly, not the case?
ROGIN: You know, they're looking ahead towards the 2022 midterm election, and the 2024 election. And they are trying to make sure that they set a narrative that they can defend when President Biden and his party have to go face the polls, face the voters. Now, again, that's not really the most important thing right now, but it's something that can't seem to shake.
So, their narrative is, well, we had to get out, that's disputed, and then the narrative is, well, it will always be messy, well, not this messy. And then their narrative is, we've done everything right since then.
And I don't think that's very credible at this point. So, they've got a huge political problem, but they're thinking about, and trying to mitigate in advance, but that seems to me to be not quite as important as the immediate problem, which is the fact that bombs are going off all over Kabul.
VAUSE: And it's set to get worse in the coming days.
Josh, thank you for being with us. We really appreciate it. Josh Rogin there.
ROGIN: Anytime.
VAUSE: CNN political analyst, thank you, sir.
There's a lot more to come on CNN NEWSROOM: including the U.S. president who wants military options to strike back at ISIS-K, the terrorist group responsible for the terror attack at Kabul airport. More details in the moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[01:30:21]
JOHN VAUSE, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks for being with us. I'm John Vause. You're watching CNN NEWSROOM.
The U.S. President has issued a stark warning to the terror group ISIS-K. Quote, "We will hunt you down and make you pay." That's for the double suicide bombing which killed some hundred people. And these are live images of the airport in the Afghan capital. It's about 10:00 on a Friday morning. The scene of so much heartbreak and emotion even before the terror attack.
And a warning now, you are about to see some very graphic images from the immediate aftermath of the first suicide blast. They're difficult to watch but show the real life impact of this attack, the unbelievable cruelty of killing and maiming moms and dads and their children waiting in line to board a flight for a chance at a better life.
The carnage, the fears of further violence, the nagging questions about what could've been done differently.
It's all made what, for Joe Biden's aides, have called it the worst day of his young presidency. Biden pledged (INAUDIBLE) to evacuate the U.S. citizens and at-risk Afghans would continue as scheduled. He also has asked the military to prepare plans to target the leadership and assets of ISIS-K.
CNN Pentagon correspondent Oren Liebermann has that -- and again, the same warning: his report contains some graphic images.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The chaos outside Kabul Airport became a catastrophe Thursday afternoon when two bombings tore through the crowds, killing 13 U.S. service members an dozens of Afghan civilians.
President Jo Biden promising the U.S. will strike ISIS-K and any others who attack.
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: we will not forgive. We will not forget. We will hunt you down and make you pay. I'll defend our interest and our people with every measure at my command.
LIEBERMANN: This graphic video laying bare the horror of the attacks. The victims thrown across the street. This man able to sit up after the attack, unlike so many others.
Afghans so desperate to flee the country, now racing to get the wounded medical help, even pushing some of the injured in makeshift wheelbarrows. GEN. KENNETH MCKENZIE, COMMANDER U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: The threat from ISIS is extremely real. We believe it is their desire to continue those attacks and we expect those attacks to continue.
LIEBERMANN: On Wednesday, the U.S. warned of threats to the airport telling Americans to stay away from three different gates -- Abbey, East and North Gates. And only to approach the field when instructed.
The suicide bomber passed through a Taliban-controlled security checkpoint somehow, and approached the Abbey gate where U.S. forces do another round of screening. It's a moment of vulnerability. U.S. service member face to face with an unscreened outsider.
MCKENZIE: These gates where people actually come on the airfield, there's no substitute for a young man or woman, a young United States man or woman, standing up there, conducting a search of that person before he let them on.
LIEBERMANN: These are the first U.S. troops killed in Afghanistan since February of last year shortly before the signing of the agreement that began this withdrawal.
The news of troops killed coming just five days, about 100 hours before the August 31st deadline to withdraw from Afghanistan. Still, the evacuation operations continue, including for the few hundred U.S. citizens the State Department believes are still in Afghanistan.
BIDEN: We will continue after our troops are withdrawn, to find means by which we could find any American who wishes to get out of Afghanistan. We will find them and we will get them out.
LIEBERMANN: The Taliban say they will seek justice for the attack as coordination between U.S. forces and the Taliban continues. U.S. commanders on the ground have asked the Taliban to push out the security corridor around the airfield and shared some information to prevent attacks.
MCKENZIE: We believe it's possible that others have been forwarded. We cut down the information we give the Taliban. They don't get the full range of information we have. But we give them enough to act in time and space to try to prevent these attacks.
LIEBERMANN (on camera): Biden vowed that the U.S. military would attack ISIS-K in the wake of these twin terrorist bombings, but it's a far more difficult challenge.
First, the assets are certainly there, whether it's attacking from overhead with fighter jets or gunships, or carrying out a drone attack.
The difficult problem is in terms of intelligence. Without U.S. Troops on the ground to gather intelligence about ISIS-K, it becomes increasingly difficult to know where and whom to target as the U.S. is looking for how to carry out a retaliatory strike for these twin bombings.
[01:34:49]
LIEBERMANN: It's also a question of what is the risk involved here. Do you want to carry out these strikes why there are still U.S. troops and U.S. personal on the ground? or do you wait until the withdrawal is complete and then carry out what the Pentagon has called over the horizon strikes from outside of Afghanistan?
Oren Liebermann, CNN -- at the Pentagon.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: Joining me now is CNN military analyst and former NATO supreme allied commander, General Wesley Clark. Welcome back, sir. It's good to see you.
GEN. WESLEY CLARK, FORMER NATO SUPREME ALLIED COMMANDER: Thank you.
VAUSE: What are the chances of another terror attack in the coming days and maybe not just carried out by ISIS-K, but one of at least six other non-terror groups currently inside Afghanistan?
CLARK: They're there. They're a threat. If they can attack, they will.
The United States and our allies there at the Kabul Airport are large fixed (ph) vulnerable target. So ISIS-K has shown how it can be done. You could be sure there are other groups that will attempt to copy.
Can they do worse? Can they do an assault on the air base itself? On the airport itself? Sure. They could. And if they can, they will probably try.
So you have to prepare for a number of contingencies. There may be another strike just like this one. There may be mortar or rocket attacks. There may be a ground assault. We just don't know.
We've got to be ready. It's our commanders' job on the ground and that is the responsibility of the U.S. Central Command Commander who is backing them up.
VAUSE: So obviously, you have to prepare for the worst, but how do you prepare for the worst when you're in the middle of essentially a troop drawdown, which probably gets away in earnest maybe a day or so away from now? So what measures can be taken to increase security while also reducing manpower?
CLARK: So first of all, you've got to look at what is happening at the gates. You've got to try to find a way to reduce the exposure of the Americans at the gates.
Can it be done? Maybe. Maybe there is a different way of doing this. Maybe there is a way of using fewer people out front. You've got to count on some degree of cooperation from the Taliban. Maybe not a lot, but the Taliban are not cohesive.
There may be people who talk and say, you know, we got to help the United States get out of here successfully so we could get money from them. But you can be sure there are a lot of people down below who say I want to take some blood before the United States gets out. And so we cannot trust the Taliban at every level.
And then as far as the other possible threats, the airborne assets orbiting overhead continuously. You need airborne reconnaissance. You need electronic intelligence. You need the ability to respond by air to amassing of forces of to the sight of a mortar being set up.
Can we do this? You bet we can do this. I'm sure we are preparing this right now.
VAUSE: Well, at the request of the president, operational plans are being drawn out to hit back at the ISIS-K group, targeting their leadership, their assets. How much harder does that get after Tuesday, when there's no real military presence in the country?
CLARK: Well, we are getting intelligence from a lot of sources, and one thing that is different today and 20 years ago, is Afghans are full of cellphones. People talk.
Just look at this. What's going on right now. If you have to compare it to let's say the British evacuation at Dunkirk, there are planes coming in. People talking to people. Non governmental organizations. Frantic calls going out from all over Afghanistan.
A lot of those people won't be getting out, but they will be reporting what they see and hear. So there are many sources of intelligence on the ground.
Is it targetable? Can we rely on our allies in the Gulf to give us information? What can we do overhead? We've got a lot of very smart people working those issues right now.
VAUSE: You know, the U.S. had been relying on the Taliban for security outside the airport. And I guess at first blush, that may not seem like the best idea. But for the Taliban, there doesn't seem to be a lot to be gained by allowing this sort of attack to take place. Can they be trusted moving forward?
CLARK: The Taliban said that they don't support ISIS-K. Well, you know, it's a little hard to assess who the Taliban is right now, and what their aims are. They're talking about a 12-man council.
Afghanistan is a tribal country, and there are tribal leaders out there that are pulling the strings behind the scenes, sometimes on the Taliban.
So these people do not want chaos. You know what, Afghanistan is a (INAUDIBLE) state that's been invaded hundreds of times over the existence of mankind there. And people there fight initially and then they bend and they survive. That is why there are still people living there.
[01:39:48]
CLARK: So they're going to want the Taliban to try to put together a semblance of order and a government. ISIS is against that. So it's reasonable to believe that ISIS is not going to be supported by the Taliban
On the other hand there are bound to be connections there. There are relatives, there are friends, there are neighbors who know each other that are in these groups. And so it's not like there are aliens there.
So there is always a possibility that they will get some kind of support, and especially in these early days when the Taliban's less well-structured, less organized, but then more chaotic on the ground.
There's a very good chance that we'll see a repeat by ISIS-K or another terrorist group on this attack.
VAUSE: And certainly it does seem to be the reality going forward.
General Clark, thank you so much. We appreciate you being with us, sir.
CLARK: You're welcome.
VAUSE: With that we'll take a short break. We will be back in a moment with a lot more on the ongoing situation inside Afghanistan.
You are watching CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VAUSE: Australia has announced an end to its evacuation mission. Australian forces have flown more than 4,000 people out of Afghanistan. As for Australian citizens who may be left behind, the defense minister says many will likely make their way to other borders, but added that it's best to be realistic about the circumstances on the ground.
Let's find out about those circumstances on the ground.
Nabih Bulos is the Middle East bureau chief for the "Los Angeles Times". He's with us, not far from Kabul Airport with the situation there.
The day after the blast, what's it like? What is the scene like right now? Are people still gathering in large numbers? What's the security presence like?
NABIH BULOS, MIDDLE EAST BUREAU CHIEF, "LOS ANGELES TIMES": Well, obviously I haven't actually gone out yet at the moment. I mean today's Friday so everything is already kind of a little bit slower at the moment here in Kabul.
But the fact that the Taliban actually -- even yesterday, right -- I mean even yesterday there were attempts to actually empty out (INAUDIBLE) so we managed to go and visit after the blast.
The Taliban have set up very, very difficult checkpoints quite far from some of those gates. And the situation will be changing throughout. And of course, I mean
there is now increasing desperation among people who want to get to the airport, but the ones who have already the permission to leave, they're being told to go to alternative areas -- so for example they're told to go to a hotel or to a compound there. They are either (INAUDIBLE) helicopter to get to the airport.
I mean that just seems like another, you know, hoop over hand to jump in what is already been an incredibly difficult process to get out.
And just before you answer that Nabih, I just want to say we are looking at your images right now, which you shot for "Los Angeles Times". And they're quite compelling.
But, you know, just talk to us about now basically what these people are facing to get on a flight?
BULOS: Sorry, can you please repeat, (INAUDIBLE) because the line cut for a second.
(CROSSTALK)
VAUSE: Sure, what are the conditions like? You talk about this new process that people have to go through to actually get on to an evacuation flight?
[01:44:54]
BULOS: Oh, the conditions are simply horrific. I mean the fact of the matter is it's a confusing process. Many, many people are trying to figure out a way to get -- the attention of someone who can ok the application.
I mean, for example, you know, it involves actually -- I mean I'm going to give you -- actually I had an affiliation with some kind of foreign force here. I mean you had an affiliation with (INAUDIBLE) for an organization then you have to have petition in some fashion like (INAUDIBLE) it's unclear what will actually work. It also depends on how willing the people of the country itself are (INAUDIBLE) throughout as well.
I mean there are thousands of moving parts in this. And the fact of the matter is that, you know, time is so short and the effort is so frantic. And there are also so many people that at this point -- I mean a lot of people will be forgotten.
For example, I knew someone yesterday, you know, at the blast who was trying to (INAUDIBLE) SIV application two weeks ago, if you'd believe. I mean who just are desperate enough, I mean he had worked on a U.S. base in the past as a guard. And the only reason to (INAUDIBLE) SIV application. And so of course, it wasn't going to be ready in time.
He was actually went to the area yesterday to the airport and now he's in a hospital. He in fact needed a blood transfusion and is actually still there recovering from his injuries. VAUSE: You know, this is just tragedy heaped upon tragedy. And we're
hearing from the U.S. president that the airlift will continue as scheduled. Is there any indication that the number of evacuation flights compared to earlier in the week has changed in any way? Has it increased? Has it decreased? What can you tell us?
BULOS: I mean I would be astonished if evacuations continue in the same high numbers that they had reached. You know, like they may reach because the fact of the matter is that now the processing will be much slower.
I mean the reason why ISIS-K suicide bombers were able to come so close was because you actually had some kind of an oversight by the U.S. guards there. I mean he mentioned in his statement that he was within five meters of American guards -- I mean American soldiers.
And so, of course, it's all going to shift, right. I mean possibly (ph) is going to happen. It's going to involve the use of translators, et cetera, but even then they'll have much harsher search procedures.
And all this means you're going to have a slow down. And so therefore, I mean the window really is closing I mean from the time but also from the complexity of the situation.
VAUSE: Yes. It's difficult to move before. Now it's next to impossible. Nabih Bulos, "The Los Angeles Times", reporter there in Kabul. Thank you for being with us. We appreciate the update.
Let's stay with the security situation longer. CNN reporter Natasha Bertrand is with us, live.
One of the biggest fears is that a U.S. withdrawal would lead Afghanistan to once again become a safe haven for terrorist groups. Is it too early to say mission accomplished?
NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN REPORTER: I think so because part of the Biden administration's goal here is to continue counter-terrorism operations in the country because they recognize that there will be certain ungoverned spaces in Afghanistan that will allow potentially these terrorist threats to flourish.
So groups like al-Qaeda, groups like ISIS Khorasan on -- these are terrorist organizations that the Biden administration is very concerned about.
Now of course, one of the major questions is how that counterterrorism capability is going to manifest itself on the ground, especially because we are pulling out our forces, we don't have bases there anymore. And it remains to be seen how we are going to have the same kind of capability, if at all to counter terrorist operations coming out of that country.
So that was one of the main thrust of the peace deal that was signed last year between the Trump administration and the Taliban, was that the Taliban would essentially prevent the country from becoming a base of operations, terrorist operations against the United States. Now what we're seeing is that the Taliban seems to be struggling to control the terrorist presence in Kabul. And so the question is, you know, the president said earlier today that he intends to have his -- the Pentagon go after ISIS assets and ISIS leaders, and try to neutralize that threat.
But of course ultimately the situation on the ground is going to be controlled by the Taliban moving forward, and those counter-terrorism operations that continue to be carried out by the Defense Department here are going to be very important to maintaining stability in that country.
VAUSE: I just wondered if we are seeing kind of a glimpse of the future where we have these rival terror groups competing, you know, for territory inside Afghanistan with these horrendous bombing attacks and essentially the people who are dying, the innocent villains, the moms and the dads. And their numbers -- their death toll numbers just keep climbing.
BERTRAND: That's right. And again, it remains to be seen whether the Taliban is actually going to be able to achieve some level of stability there, because the Taliban, of course, is fighting ISIS as well. That is what U.S. officials have told us is that it is clear that the Taliban and ISIS are sworn enemies, at least for now.
That is a little bit different when it comes to al-Qaeda, obviously there are elements of the Taliban that are very much affiliated with al-Qaeda. And so that deal that the Taliban struck with the United States last year about preventing again the country from becoming that base of operations against U.S. interests in the region, and of course the United States itself, is going to be very significant.
But the people that are going to likely suffer the most here are, of course, going to be the Afghans in that country moving forward especially because the government is not formed yet.
[01:49:53]
BERTRAND: There is no government there yet, the Taliban is doing, you know, what they can to ensure security. But as we saw today, things slipped through the cracks to devastating consequences.
VAUSE: Yes. And it seems like there will be many more devastating -- days of devastating consequences to come.
Natasha Bertrand, thanks for being with us at this late hour, live in Washington.
When we come back, the U.S. airbase in Ramstein, Germany, a stopping point. A brief stopover on the way to a new life.
Thousands of Afghan evacuees have passed through there and we will go there in a moment.
VAUSE: World leaders are using words like barbaric, despicable, vile to describe the horrific suicide bombings outside Kabul's airport. And as a group of Afghan refugees arrive in London on Thursday, the British Prime Minister says the U.K.'s evacuations is almost complete. And Boris Johnson insists British evacuation flights will continue despite the elevated security risks.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BORIS JOHNSON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: We always knew that this was a moment where, of course, that were going to be particular vulnerabilities to terrorism, to opportunistic terrorist attacks.
We condemn them. I think they're despicable. But I'm afraid that it's something that we've had to prepare for. It is not going to interrupt our progress. We are going to get on with this evacuation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: Similar sentiment from the Elysees Palace insisting French evacuation flights will continue through to the end. The statement came after President Emmanuel Macron said he could not guarantee success because of the security situation in Kabul which is progressively getting worse.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
EMMANUEL MACRON, FRENCH PRESIDENT (through translator): It is obvious that the tension is increasing greatly. We have all known that risk since the beginning. Considering the confusion in Kabul and the tension that has been there since the beginning at the military airport.
The next hours will remain extremely dangerous in Kabul and at the airport.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: And Germany's chancellor has promised Afghan allies and their families will not be left behind. At a press conference in Berlin, Angela Merkel called the attack malicious and vile and added that Germany is in negotiations with the Taliban to get evacuees out safely.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANGELA MERKEL, GERMAN CHANCELLOR (through translator): We see in this attack this afternoon that the risk is immense and that this is a very high pressure situation of trying to get the people evacuated and to maintain the airbridge.
We know that the window of opportunity is closing. Tens of thousands have been rescued, but I want to say again today, we will not forget those people who could not be rescued by the airbridge. Rather we will do everything we can to enable their evacuation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: As for those who've safely made it out of Afghanistan, what is next? Thousands of evacuees have already passed through the American airbase in Ramstein, Germany on their way to a new life in the United States. But that relief and anticipation is mixed with fears and concerns with families and friends left behind. Their fate now in the hands of the Taliban.
Atika Shubert has their story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Hangar 5 at Ramstein Airbase has become the gateway to a new life for thousands of Afghan evacuees.
[01:54:47]
SHUBERT: (on camera): Now this military airplane hangar has essentially become an international airport terminal. And we are standing in what would be the check in area, and the goal is to get as many evacuees as possible on to those commercial planes to the United States.
(voice over): Many are happy to be leaving but also fearful for family left behind. Ahmad Shah Shirzad (ph) checks in for his flight with his sister and father
AHMAD SHAH SHIRZAD, EVACUEE: They're remaining there, I have four sisters and two brothers.
I come here with my one sister. Yes, it is very hard to do this, honestly.
SHUBERT: While the military has handled the evacuation from Kabul, it is the State Department and Homeland Security that are responsible for getting evacuees to the U.S.
ANDREW HALUS, SPOKESPERSON, U.S. CONSULATE FRANKFURT: The military brings them in, and they stay here for a short period of time. And then we bring them out so they can go back to the United States.
It has been slow-moving, but now we are getting into a process. Flights are leaving.
SHUBERT: Volunteers packed toys, coloring books and snacks into backpacks for the kids before the flight.
JESSICA BLEDSOE, VOLUNTEER: It doesn't even have to be anything fancy or that makes noise. And they'll go from wailing to content and happy and smiling to us. It's unbelievable.
(CROSSTALK)
SHUBERT: On the tarmac, the flight arrives. Delta's A-350 flagship plane. For the entire crew, an emotional experience.
JOSHUA MILLER, DELTA FLIGHT ATTENDANT: We saw some of the evacuees standing up by the hangar, and I think that's really when it clicked. We were all like, ok, this is game time. These are people that we are bringing back to the United States to, you know, escape.
SHUBERT: Hope that the normalcy of a commercial flight might provide some measure of comfort after the hasty evacuation.
DANIEL THAMES, DELTA FLIGHT ATTENDANT: We did everything we could to make everyone comfortable and feel protected, and quite frankly, loved.
SHUBERT: As the plane is ready for boarding, Ahmad Shah Shirzad and his family weigh their backs. All they were able to bring. Then they waved goodbye to board their flight to a new life in America.
Atika Shubert for CNN at Ramstein Airbase in Germany.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: Thank you for watching. I'm John Vause.
Before we go, live images right now from Kabul Airport. We can see, it is a quiet scene now. a start contrast to what has happened over the last few days. There are people waiting to board a flight.
With that I will say goodbye.
Michael Holmes takes over at the top of the hour. More CNN NEWSROOM in just a moment.
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