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Sources Say, Border Crisis Sparks Disagreement Within Biden Administration; South Carolina Lawyer Accused of Hiring Hit on Himself Released on $20,000 Bail; 2021 Primetime Emmy Awards Welcomes Audience, Vaccines Required. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired September 17, 2021 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ERICA HILL, CNN NEWSROOM: For The New York Times, who has also reported extensively on DHS.

[10:30:04]

And maybe we start there. What is happening right now? We have some -- there is a lot of concerns about what is happening within the agency and what is not happening, frankly, at the border.

ZOLAN KANNO-YOUNGS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: No, absolutely. There are multiple factors that are contributing to this, some outside of the government's real control and some within.

Now, you can point to the fact that you have to look at many of the migrants that are currently have been positioned under that bridge in Del Rio waiting to cross the border are Haitians. What has been going on in Haiti this year? We've seen natural disasters. We've also seen a recent assassination of their president as well. All of that is going to continue to push people to make this dangerous journey. It is similar to what we've seen in previous years as well with Central American migrants making the trek, because of natural disasters and the pandemic. So that is outside of the government.

But also let's be clear, the border and border crossings in how to manage it, how to balance deterrence with President Biden's pledge to restore a system of providing protection for people crossing the border has been a major challenge throughout the administration. They have struggled to balance maintaining the policies that Trump did put in place, that have forced many of the vulnerable to return to those dangerous areas in Mexico while also surging enough staff and resources to actually process these folks you in a human way.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN NEWSROOM: Well, one of the ironies here, right, which I think a lot of folks are aware of, is that the Biden administration, except for the wall, have actually preserved a lot of tough Trump administration policies, one being title 42, right, giving the ability based on COVID dangers of deporting people or even flying some of these folks caught at the border down to the Southern Mexico border as well. So, those policies remain. What is -- how do we attribute then the continued influx in surge?

KANNO-YOUNGS: No, absolutely. You have got it absolutely right there, that they have maintained. One of the policies that honestly was, you know, zero tolerance and family separation aside, one of the policies that allowed President Trump to close off asylum-seekers to the United States, they have maintained that. What has changed, however, is that title 42, when it was first implemented, border agents were basically able to expel migrants back across to Mexico throughout the border.

But what has changed earlier this year, because of a lack of shelter capacity on the Mexican side of the border and as well as some Mexican authorities not accepting the migrants that the U.S. was attempting to return to Mexico, the administration has now applied this half hazard approach where some areas in Texas, they are expelling folks, some areas, they are not.

Now, it is also important to note there was a recent court decision this week that has now ruled that the administration is not going to be able to expel families, at least in the short-term. So, many of those folks, families that you see there, they will not be able to expel. They should be able to come across and have their chance to ask for a asylum.

The other update is, it's worth noting, that also a recent court ruling also said that the Biden administration is going to need to restore another restrictive Trump administration policy that requires for asylum-seekers to wait in Mexico until they receive a decision on their case.

So, going forward, it is going to be interesting to see, one, in the short-term, how this administration is going to -- they're saying they're going to surge agents to that area to try and get those -- many of them vulnerable assistance. But it will also be interesting to see how they balance who gets to come in and get their (INAUDIBLE) asylum and who rather will be forced to remain in what we're seeing, those dangerous areas.

SCIUTTO: Yes. I mean, listen, the fact is that the smugglers are often lying to the folks coming across, saying that the doors are just going to be wide open for you, and, by the way, they make a lot of money along the way. Zolan Kanno-Youngs, thanks so much for coming on.

KANNO-YOUNGS: Thanks so much.

SCIUTTO: Still ahead, the South Carolina lawyer arrested for insurance fraud after planning a botched hit on himself, well he's out on bail this morning. Still many questions surrounding Alex Murdaugh and his family. The latest from South Carolina is next.

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[10:35:00]

HILL: Prominent South Carolina Attorney Alex Murdaugh, who is embroiled in a scandal involving drug abuse, a botched suicide attempt and insurance fraud, is out of jail on a $20,000 bond. But that bond was much higher for the man who police say Murdaugh hired to shoot him so his surviving son could get $10 million in insurance. Curtis Smith had to post a $55,000 bond to get out. SCIUTTO: I mean, the layers of the story just remarkable. Murdaugh's lawyer argued in court that he's not a flight risk and is not, quote, a man of significant means any more. His lawyer also making it clear his defense will involve Murdaugh's opioid addiction, which will claim spiraled out of control after the murders of his wife and son this June.

CNN Correspondent Dianne Gallagher is live in Varnville, South Carolina, this morning. I mean, this is a sad, it's an alarming case, it's complicated. I understand another player involved is now responding to those claims?

[10:40:01]

DIANNE GALLAGHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Jim and Erica, there are a lot of players involved in this because, as you said, new investigations keep popping up around Alex Murdaugh. As state investigators began looking into his alleged suicide for hire, insurance fraud scheme and the murders of his wife and son, they developed information that has caused them to open new investigations, like a criminal investigation into the 2018 death of the Murdaugh family housekeeper, Gloria Satterfield. She died after a trip and fall incident inside of the Murdaugh home.

Well, they're now looking into the circumstances of her death after the coroner made a request and the state law enforcement division says they determined new information there. Well, the attorney for the Satterfield family said that this defense that appears to be laid out right now by Alex Murdaugh's attorneys saying that he had this 20 year opioid addiction, they don't buy it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ERIC BLAND, ATTORNEY FOR ESTATE OF MURDAUGH FAMILY HOUSEKEEPER: That is just nothing but lawyer spin, casting a defense that doesn't exist. The Murdaugh family has been, throughout this whole process, not transparent. They have -- with this family, the Satterfield field, they have lied to them, they have taken money from them, they have misled them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GALLAGHER: Now, in talking about taking money, the attorney there is referencing a settlement payout over a wrongful death settlement that he says that family did not receive from Alex Murdaugh.

In the meantime, the prominent South Carolina attorney who comes from a prominent legal family that goes back almost a century in this part of the low country in South Carolina, he's in an out of state drug rehabilitation facility. Again, his attorneys have said he had a 20- year opioid addition that was exacerbated by the murder of his wife and son. He also left his law firm, which was founded by his family, after he was accused of misappropriating funds. The state is investigating that as well, Jim and Poppy. His attorney is saying that he's no longer a man of significant means and -- yes -- Erica.

HILL: All right. Dianne Gallagher with the latest for us, Dianne, thank you.

Joining us now to discuss, Criminal Defense Attorney, CNN Legal Analyst Joey Jackson. Joey, good morning.

I mean, there are so many threads, as Dianne said, to this story, that latest one we just heard from the attorney for the family of the housekeeper who died a couple of years ago saying that talk of the opioid addiction, in his words, was lawyer spin, that the family was not being transparent. You've also got him out on this $20,000 bond versus $55,000 for the man that he allegedly hired to do the hit to make it look like a suicide.

I mean, when you're putting all of this together, Joey, what is your gut here? What does all of this tell you about what is really going on?

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: So, Erica, good to see you. There is a lot amiss here, right? So, first, addressing the bail conditions, which I think to be wholly deficient, right? The justice system has to address everyone equally. You have a person here who is involved in a major scheme to kill himself. It involves $10 million apparently payout that he was doing it for. These admissions by his lawyer on national T.V. that, in fact, he did it, so he's admitted to all of the elements of this particular crime. He calls on September 4th saying he has no idea and, by the way, yes, I was involved. So he's now essentially talked to the police and you have $20,000.

I mean, I practice in a very progressive jurisdiction in New York and I could tell you, $20,000 for far less of what bail conditions are, perhaps it has to do with his connections and everything else. And so there is say lot here. And then we look at, really, a whole bunch else, Erica, that is going on here as it relates to other deaths involved in his family. We know that back in June, right, that his wife apparently was gunned down, his son was apparently gunned down, yet he indicating that he had no involvement. We have got a housekeeper that is dead a couple of years before that. So I think it tells me that someone, right, is not being forthcoming and I think that opens that all up as it relates to were you really involved with those things, were you lying then, are you lying now.

Final point. When we talk about these issues if terms of opioid addictions and he was going through so much, those are not defenses. That is what we call mitigation. What is the difference? Mitigation is your clients is convicted and you go to the judge and you say, your honor, my client was in a tough time, his wife and child died, he was in opioids, he was doing this, he was doing that, that's mitigation. It doesn't go to explain the specifics to the defense of this crime. I think there is none, which is why his attorney was waxing poetic, as to all these admissions on national T.V.

[10:45:00]

HILL: We're going to continue to stay with that one. There are also a lot of questions about Gabby Petito, who is the missing 22-year-old, last heard from by her family in late August, as we know, her boyfriend who she was traveling cross country with home in Florida, he's not talking to police. I spoke with the public information officer for the local police department in North Port, Florida, earlier this morning. He said very clearly that the boyfriend -- fiance's family has not been cooperative.

Their attorney said in a statement that they are going to stay in the background. It was a short, pretty sterile statement. Joey, as a defense attorney, when you look at that statement, what is it really saying?

JACKSON: So, Erica, it is important to note, the family obviously is ailing, they're in pain and they want their daughter back and they want answers. And who can provide those answers but the fiance, who she was on this trip across the country with, knowing what she was doing, where she was at, what they did together, et cetera. But the fact is that as much as a public relations, it would help him to be out there saying I miss here too and everything else, it is not from a legal perspective very helpful.

So he has right, the family certainly doesn't want to hear it, no one does, to remain silent and I think that his attorney is saying, I'm exercising that right. So what it tells me is that he has information but he can implicate himself.

And how often, Erica, have we seen in past cases that you and I have dealt with even where you have instances, Scott Peterson, for example, where he says, I want my wife back, I just want my wife back and he's involved. So the best course of action any defense attorney will say is to keep your mouth shut.

Final, final point, and that's this. I think this case will be unraveled by all of the evidence that is out there, right? And hopefully she's okay. Thank God, I hope she is. But you have Instagram posts, they indicate where they were, what they were doing, who they were with. You have this instance in Utah where the police approach because, apparently, there was a domestic violence incident. So you have all of this digital trail and we live in a surveillance-oriented society.

And I think the FBI involved and then the resources are going to track back to where she was and I think, really, there will be major breaks in the case. I think we have significant law enforcement resources and personnel and hopefully that will bring a lot to bear on what happened, when and perhaps she's still okay.

HILL: And perhaps some information on anybody that either the fiance or the two of them may have interacted with on that trip as he was making his way back to Florida. Joey, always good to see you, my friend, I appreciate it. Thank you.

JACKSON: Thank you, Erica, always.

SCIUTTO: And still ahead, what to watch for at this weekend's Emmys. Will Ted Lasso win a trophy? I think it should. Will The Crown reign? That's all coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [10:50:00]

SCIUTTO: Well, the Emmys are back and with an audience and fewer COVID restriction this is year.

HILL: Although there is one big sort of COVID-related requirement for anyone at the show, vaccinations.

CNN's Stephanie Elam has a preview.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): From space suits to hazmat suits and what was mostly a really big virtual meeting, this year's Emmys are shedding some of last year's COVID constraints and getting back to a live audience.

MATTHEW BELLONI, PUCK NEWS FOUNDING PARTNER: People don't want to see award shows on Zoom. They just don't. It takes you away from the experience. They need to see those actors up close. They need to feel like they're at an event with them.

ELAM: Cedric the Entertainer hosts, telling People Magazine he plans a return of the big opening number.

CEDRIC THE ENTERTAINER, EMMY HOST: We're excited that we're watching a few of these other award shows this weekend, that we're going to elevate the game a little bit.

ELAM: the ceremony will take place in a tent outside in a L.A. Theater. Attendees must be fully vaccinated and provide proof they are COVID negative.

What could be similar to last year, a dominant comedy.

Ted Lasso has all of the momentum.

BELLONI: Jason Sudeikis is a star. People know. And it got 20 nominations. However, there is a dark horse. I would you say it is Hacks, which is a smaller show on HBO Max and it is a very insider Hollywood show that people who vote for these type of awards may gravitate towards.

ELAM: On the drama side, The Crown could take the Emmy.

BELLONI: The Crown is one of the great achievements of television of all time and it has never won the series Emmy.

ELAM: Real life drama could factor into the ceremony with the death of Michael K. Williams, who became a star in The Wire. this year, he's nominated for another nuanced performance, though Emmy votes were cast before his death.

BELLONI: And he wasn't even nominated for playing one of the most iconic characters of all time. He's been a great character, actor for two decades now. And the fact that he's never won an Emmy is kind of crazy. So people thought he might win for Love Craft Country this year.

ELAM: The Emmys move to CBS, where a football lead-in could lift it above last year's record low ratings.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ELAM (on camera): And we know that these award shows have been having a tough time when it comes to ratings. So this will be the first big test to see if people tune back in now that it doesn't look like one big Zoom meeting. And, of course, having Cedric the Entertainer as a host, that's going to bring some energy. He points out that everyone was turning to T.V. during the pandemic and so he wants to make sure that they are going all out for a great show come Sunday, Jim and Erica.

SCIUTTO: Full disclosure, I'm going to be rooting for Ted Lasso. Stephanie Elam --

ELAM: Everybody is.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Thanks so much.

And thanks to all of you for joining us. We hope you have a great weekend. I'm Jim Sciutto.

HILL: And I'm Erica hill.

[10:55:00]

I used my Ted Lasso mug happily this morning.

At This Hour with Kate Bolduan starts after a quick break.

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[11:00:00]

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN AT THIS HOUR: Hello, everyone, I'm Kate Bolduan.

Here is what we're watching At This Hour. Capitol threat, homeland security says there is a risk of violence.