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President Biden Gets Booster Shot; Biden Agenda on the Brink?. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired September 27, 2021 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: And it's starting off with a literal boost.

Just moments ago, the president rolled up his sleeve for his COVID booster shot. And he talked about what this means for the country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We're going to have well over 1.1 billion shots. And we're going to continue going. We're going to do our part. We have also given a great deal of funding to COVAX, which is a vehicle that does this.

So we have plenty, plenty of opportunity to make sure we get everyone in the world to play our part, the largest part of the world, to getting everyone vaccinated.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: This is President Biden's third dose of the Pfizer vaccine. He received his second dose on January 11, and this shot just days after the CDC green-lit Pfizer boosters for adults 65 and older, those deemed high risk and those who work in front-line and high-risk occupations.

CNN senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen is here.

So, Elizabeth, there's still confusion about the guidance for boosters and exactly how long people are supposed to wait and what order they're supposed to wait in line for it. So, somehow, President Biden getting it publicly, does that, I don't know, clear up some confusion or send a message?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I think it does clear up some confusion.

Let's take a look first at his schedule. So, as you mentioned, he got his first shot on December 21. He got his next shot on January 11. And then he got a shot today, on September 27. So take a look at that, and you will see he got Pfizer, and he's more than six months out from his second shot.

And so that's -- that's the first thing. In order to get a booster right now, you're supposed to have gotten Pfizer, not Moderna or J&J -- that may come later -- and you're supposed to be more than six months from your second shot.

Now let's take a look at other people who are eligible for their third shot. So, again, if you're six months out from that second shot, over age 65, if you're a front-line worker, like a doctor or a teacher, if you're an adult who lives in a high-risk setting, like, let's say, a prison, a congregate setting.

Also -- and this is a big one, Alisyn -- adults with underlying conditions, such as obesity, high blood pressure, diabetes. There's actually a pretty long list. I mean, that's a lot of people. So, 42 percent or so of the United States is obese. So, right there, 42 percent qualify for boosters.

So when you put this whole list together, it's more than half of the United States. It's a lot of people. But you're supposed to fall into one of these categories and be more than six months out from your second Pfizer shot -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Elizabeth Cohen, thank you very much for explaining all of that.

Now, it could just be a matter of weeks before children under 12 are eligible to be vaccinated against COVID-19. Pfizer's CEO says the company is ready to ask the FDA for emergency use authorization for children aged 5 through 11. And they will apply within days.

CNN's Nick Watt joins us now.

Nick, what do we know?

NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Biden just got his booster, as you said, Alisyn. Another huge chunk of the American population is going to be eligible pretty soon.

But, listen, as we have seen throughout this vaccine rollout, it's never a perfectly plain sailing.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WATT (voice-over): COVID-19 vaccines for kids could be coming very, very soon.

DR. ALBERT BOURLA, CEO, PFIZER: I think we are going to submit this data pretty soon. It's a question of days, not weeks.

WATT: Last year, when Pfizer submitted the data for adults, applied for authorization, the green light from the FDA came just three weeks later.

BOURLA: If they approve it, we will be ready with our manufacturing to provide this new formulation of the vaccine, because the vaccine that the kids will receive, which is 5 to 11, it is a different formulation. It is almost one -- not almost -- it's one-third of the dose that we are giving to the rest of the population. WATT: Today is a big vaccine mandate deadline day in the Northeast.

In Connecticut, school bus drivers must now be vaccinated or take weekly tests. Reportedly, some won't do either.

GOV. NED LAMONT (D-CT): You're in a tight congregant setting, a bus, and are surrounded by kids who aren't vaccinated.

WATT: In New York state, deadline day for medical workers. Thousands still haven't gotten a shot. A staff shortage looms. In New York City, today was supposed to be deadline day for school employees, but a court issued a temporary injunction. There's now a hearing set for Wednesday.

Meantime, around 38 percent of the NYPD remain unvaccinated.

DERMOT SHEA, NEW YORK CITY POLICE COMMISSIONER: Right now, we have eight members of the NYPD in the hospital, all eight unvaccinated.

WATT: Is there a connection between vaccination and hospitalization rates? Well, take West Virginia, lowest vaccination rate in the nation right now, and the highest hospitalization rate.

GOV. JIM JUSTICE (R-WV): We are going through the peak, and it looks like we're starting to turn now.

[14:05:05]

WATT: The Delta-driven surge is still rolling around the country, but:

DR. SCOTT GOTTLIEB, FORMER FDA COMMISSIONER: I think, by Thanksgiving, it's probably going to have run its course across the whole country. Prevalence should decline on the back end of this Delta wave. And, hopefully, we get back to more of a semblance of normalcy, especially when vaccines hopefully will be available for children as well, and people will feel more comforted by the fact that they can protect their kids also.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WATT: Now, even when those kids are authorized for the vaccine, even with the booster rollout, we're not anticipating a shortage of the Pfizer vaccine, which, in one sense, is great news. In another sense, it's terrible news, because it means the demand for first doses isn't that high, and there are still more than 70 million Americans who still haven't gotten their first shot -- back to you.

CAMEROTA: Nick, thanks for explaining the good news/bad news parts of this story. Really appreciate it.

Joining us now is CNN medical analyst Dr. Leana Wen. She is the former Baltimore health commissioner and "Washington Post" contributing columnist.

Dr. Wen, great to see you. So, the CDC, of course, is facing some criticism because there's

always confusion, as there has been all along throughout this whole COVID-19 saga. But there -- we have seen long lines and wait times in some cities that were not ready for the influx of people who were eager to get boosters.

So just help us understand. If you're over 65 years old, should you race out and get your booster today? Or should you wait the eight months until after -- since your last shot?

DR. LEANA WEN, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: So, this is a really good question, Alisyn. And I think we should differentiate it into two categories, people who should get their booster right now vs. people who are allowed to, they can get the booster, but maybe don't need to do it right now.

And so the people who are recommended to get their booster now are people who are got the Pfizer, two doses, and are at least six months out of their second dose of that Pfizer vaccine and who are either over the age of 65 or over the age of 50 with underlying medical conditions.

Those are the people who the FDA and CDC are saying should get their booster. President Biden is in that category, people who should get the booster. On the other hand, there are also people who the CDC and FDA are saying they are allowed to choose to get the booster if they wish.

That's people over the age of 18, so all adults, who have either an underlying medical condition or who have high risk of occupational exposure. Those people can make a decision with their doctors, if they're six months out from Pfizer, about whether to get the booster. And I think that's really important, that you should get a booster vs. you can and are allowed.

Those who should probably should try to do this relatively soon. Doesn't have to be today, but in the next several weeks. Everybody else can maybe wait and also think through the risks and benefits when it comes to their own risks of getting COVID and whether they want to get a booster at this time.

CAMEROTA: Is there any risk to getting the booster too soon? If you get it at six months, before -- instead of eight months, is there any risk?

WEN: Well, right now, the CDC and FDA are recommending after six months. So the eight months was what the Biden administration initially said. I note that's also part of the confused messaging.

But, actually, the recommendation now is six months. There is a -- not necessarily a risk to getting it before six months. But, rather, we think that it might not be as effective if you get it -- if you for just finished your vaccine, for example, and now you're rushing out to get a third dose, it's probably not going to be that effective for you.

So waiting at least six months is the right recommendation.

CAMEROTA: Tomorrow, there are some new mandates that go into place in New York City for state workers, like public school employees, and all health care workers.

In some states, we have seen groups of nurses who are willing to lose their jobs, rather than get vaccinated. And so here are just a couple of their rationales.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LAURIE SCHERBEKOW, NURSE: But it absolutely is about our freedom. We should have the freedom to choose.

BRITTANY MINAHAN, NURSE: So I quit a job that I literally loved because I didn't want to put something in my body.

STEPHANIE DEFONTE, NURSE: I'm young. I'm healthy. I have no comorbidities. Like I said, I had COVID already. So I don't understand why I would have to be forced to get the vaccine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: Dr. Wen, it's so counterintuitive for those of us out of the health field, because it's like, these are people on the front- line who see how COVID can ravage people. I mean, these are the -- some of the nurses who have watched people die.

And so I don't know if you have had to confront some of this. But what about that argument of, my body, my choice, I don't want to put something into my body?

WEN: Except this is not just about you.

I mean, we have vaccine mandates for all kinds of other things for health care workers for a reason. Doctors, nurses, techs, pharmacists, we take an oath to protect the health and well-being of our patients. Part of that oath is not transmitting an infectious disease that could potentially kill our extremely vulnerable patients who are immunocompromised who are coming to us for care.

[14:10:00]

That's the reason why health care workers every year are required to get the flu vaccine. We're required to be vaccinated against hepatitis against measles, mumps, rubella, chicken pox, and so on and so forth. And we really need to see the COVID vaccine as no different.

I think that -- I mean, I understand that some hospitals are in a tight spot because they don't want their workers to quit. But this is the reason why a federal mandate really makes sense, because that levels the playing field. You don't want to have people quit one hospital, only to work for another that doesn't have these mandates in place.

I think it's really important that we as a country say we have certain values, and those values are, yes, you have individual choice, but if it's to the point that you can infect other people with a potentially fatal disease, you don't have that right, especially if you choose to work in health care.

CAMEROTA: Former FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb said that the current -- his prediction is that the current surge of coronavirus may spike in some places, in other words, we will see a surge in some places for the next month, and then he expects it to die down across the country by Thanksgiving, which would obviously be wonderful news.

It's nice for people to think that there's a light at the end of the tunnel. Do you agree with that timeline?

WEN: I certainly hope that he's right.

If we look at other countries and the Delta surge that went through them, it makes sense. I think part of the issue in this country is that we have large pockets that don't yet have high rates of vaccination. And we will really depend on kids, younger kids, getting vaccinated in order to increase the overall immune protection.

Part of this also is, we don't know what's going to happen to the winter. This coronavirus is still a winter respiratory virus. And I'm not sure that we can predict at this time that we're not going to see another winter surge. Of course, I hope that's not going to be the case.

But there may be variants that develop, that we may also see a winter resurgence as people start going indoors. And then let's not forget about influenza and RSV and other problems that can arise at the same time as COVID-19. So I don't think it's -- I really think it's too early for us to celebrate and to say that the worst is behind us.

CAMEROTA: As for kids, Pfizer says that they're going to be applying in -- I think maybe even the next few days for that emergency use authorization for children 5 through 11 years old.

When do you think that they might get shots?

WEN: Well, the best case scenario is that the FDA will review the application within a matter of three, four, maybe five weeks. And so the ideal outcome, again, is that we're still looking at the end of October for the first shots going into the arms of 5-to-11-year-olds, which would mean that a lot of kids could be fully vaccinated before the winter holidays, before Christmas, new year and so forth.

I think that would be really important because there are so many families that are living as if they are not yet vaccinated because they want to protect their young kids. And to have that level of reassurance will help the individuals, but also help so many families, so many parents return to some semblance of their pre-pandemic lives.

CAMEROTA: Dr. Leana Wen, thanks for covering all of this with us.

WEN: Thank you, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Well, it's been a make-or-break week for President Biden's agenda. It will be, I should say.

A vote on his infrastructure plan now scheduled to come just hours before a possible government shutdown. What this means for you and millions of Americans.

And the FBI returns to Brian Laundrie's family home -- why investigators are now inspecting his personal items.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:17:48]

CAMEROTA: It's a make-or-break week on Capitol Hill for the president's domestic agenda and the federal government staying open.

Tonight, the Senate will vote on that continuing resolution necessary to keep the government funded and to suspend the debt ceiling. Republicans are expected to block that bill.

Also happening today, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi will caucus with Democrats and try to bridge the gap between that $1.2 trillion infrastructure bill and the $3.5 trillion Build Back Better Act and how to make them work together.

A short time ago, the president talked about how high the stakes are for him and the Democrats.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

QUESTION: Any progress on a reconciliation deal today, Mr. President? How close do you think you are?

BIDEN: You know me. I'm a born optimist. I think things are going to go well. People are going to get it done.

And -- but I have meetings tonight, tomorrow and for the next little bit.

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: What is at stake for your agenda and your presidency with what is happening on the Hill this week?

BIDEN: Victory is what is at stake.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: Let's break all this down with CNN senior White House correspondent Phil Mattingly and CNN chief congressional correspondent Manu Raju.

So, Manu, I understand that you have some new reporting. Does it -- do you have a sense that the logjam between the moderates and the progressive Democrats is breaking somehow?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Not yet. And it's going to take some time to get there, and in large part because of -- Senators Joe Manchin, Kyrsten Sinema and the House progressives are simply just not on the same page on that larger social safety net expansion.

Now, breaking this down, that infrastructure vote that passed, that bill that passed the Senate last month to put money into roads, bridges, waterways, broadband, that is scheduled for a Thursday vote.

But progressives say they're going to vote against that plan unless there's a commitment from senators like Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema, other moderates as well, on that larger social safety net expansion.

They want some sort of agreement that the moderate Democrats can sign onto as well. But just moments ago, CNN caught up with Joe Manchin and asked him directly, can he get behind something as soon as Thursday? And he made clear that timeline may be overly ambitious.

[14:20:08]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOE MANCHIN (D-WV): That's a heavy lift. There's a lot to do and a lot to talk about. But everybody has to keep trying to work in good faith the best you can.

There's a lot in that bill, the 3.5, the reconciliation bill, tax codes, climate change, social reforms. There's a lot. And people need to know what's in it. So it's going to take a while.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: So this is a real challenge for Democratic leaders, because if Manchin is not on board by Thursday, at that point, those progressives could say, we're going to vote against this infrastructure plan, because we want to pressure Manchin and Sinema to get behind the same bill as we do to deal with climate change, to deal with health care, to deal with education, to deal with a whole range of issues that are central to Joe Biden's agenda.

One progressive source told me that they expect more than 40 to sink that infrastructure plan if Manchin and Sinema don't sign on, and that will be far more than House Republicans who may vote to vote for this bill. So that will be enough to kill that measure going forward.

So it just shows you the high hurdles facing the Democratic leadership to get everybody on board, because there is no margin for error in the Senate. One Democrat like Joe Manchin can seek that larger plan. Just three Democrats, if they break ranks, could also think that larger plan.

And the progressive votes on that bipartisan infrastructure plan, that could be it for that. So it just shows you how significant the next few days are to getting Democrats in line. CAMEROTA: Phil, tell us about this memo that the White House is

circulating that spells out what the administration says are the political advantages.

I mean, obviously, there's also just the general human advantages, I think, that the country feels about an infrastructure plan. But I know that there's -- this is a political issue. And this is a domestic agenda issue.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, look, I think what you're seeing right now from the White House is an inside and outside game.

And that memo was part of an outside game that they have really been engaged in over the course of the last several weeks, due to some palpable frustration over the constant fights and intraparty battles over top-line numbers or about political strategy, or about timing and deadlines, and not about what's in the packages.

And when you take the items, particularly on the economic and climate package, the second piece of the president's agenda, and poll them in isolation, they have almost always polled very well, whether you're talking about universal pre-K, free community college, family and paid medical leave, issues like that are not just issues that Democrats have long cared about, but also issues that poll very well.

And the point you're hearing from the White House, particularly on the messaging side of things, is focus on those issues. And don't get caught up on maybe smaller policy issues or smaller policy fights that could sink something that Democrats have been trying for over the course of several years, if not longer, particularly on the climate piece as well.

When you look at the scale of what could be done on the climate side of things inside this legislation, it would be something with no precedent up to this point. So that's what you're hearing from the White House on kind of the messaging side of things.

And then there's the behind the scenes. The president was in Camp David this weekend, was on the phone most of the weekend, his top legislative teams meeting in person via Zooms, via phone calls over the course of the last several days, really trying to hammer out the details that are so critical here.

One thing I would note. The president, I asked him earlier, how is he going to measure success by the end of this week, given the convergence of all the different deadlines, self-imposed and otherwise? And he made clear everything might not get done this week, kind of alluding to what Senator Manchin told CNN earlier today. But he made the point that, as long as they're still alive, as the negotiations are ongoing, he thinks they can get things across the finish line.

And I think that's kind of the point right now, even though there's a Thursday deadline for that infrastructure vote. It's kind of survive and advanced mode right now. Keep conversations going, keep pressing, because there's a belief that, based on what the president has laid out, and based on its popularity in polling, that if they can just kind of get there, it'll pass.

CAMEROTA: Yes, if they can just get there. Sounds simple.

MATTINGLY: Yes.

CAMEROTA: But thank you for spelling all of that out, Phil Mattingly, Manu Raju. Really appreciate it.

Let's bring in CNN chief political analyst Gloria Borger.

Gloria, let's just start there with what Phil was touching on, because I think sometimes we get so caught up in the congressional, the Capitol Hill chess game that we forget to apply it to regular people. I mean, what we're talking about here -- and I will just start with transportation -- this would be, I mean, a sort of seismic shift for the country.

This is about these tax credits for more electric vehicles in terms of trying to combat climate change. This is about more charging stations for them, the electric vehicles, because that's sometimes a deal- breaker for people, more high-speed trains in terms of mass transit.

In terms of health care, Medicare would expand to cover dental, vision and hearing. Those sound important.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Very important.

(CROSSTALK)

CAMEROTA: I mean, price cut for prescription drugs, including insulin, which so many people are on.

Like, these are things that we have on the screen here, Gloria, that are not partisan issues. These are human issues, and still all of this infighting.

BORGER: Right.

And when you poll each of those issues separately, they're very popular with the American public. But when you ask the American public, do you want Democrats, big tax, big spending, the numbers can change, and that can be less popular.

[14:25:09]

And so, internally, what the Democrats are trying to say is exactly what you're saying, which is, talk about what we are trying to do for the American people, as opposed to standing up there and fighting with each other about what can and cannot go in these measures, because then you're playing into the Republicans' hands.

I mean, this is a governing moment for the Democratic Party. Either they can prove -- they have the White House, they have the House, they have the Senate. Either they can prove that they can govern together, or they can't. And this may be the last opportunity. We don't know what's going to happen in the midterm elections, but this may be their last, best chance right now.

We know their margins are slim. So they have to try and do something because the alternative of failure is completely irrational for them. I mean, they have to get something done. And right now, they're letting Republicans just kind of sit back and watch them fight.

And Republicans are saying, OK, we don't need to vote either to raise the debt limit. We're going to hang back on that, which is ridiculous as well. So they're giving them a present, which is, if I were Nancy Pelosi or the president of the United States, I'd be saying, guys, you got to figure out a way to deal with this, because, otherwise, you're putting our majorities in jeopardy.

CAMEROTA: I mean, President Biden, we just heard him say, you know me. I'm a born optimist.

Is that unrealistic at this point? Because every time we talk to one of the so-called moderate Democrats, one of the so-called progressive Democrats, they sound far apart.

BORGER: They do. They do.

I don't know -- at this point, it's really hard to say. I mean, the only thing I can think of right now is that they set aside certain things and promise each other they're going to do them in a month, or two months, or three months, or heading into the next election.

I mean, they all have to figure out a way to make their constituents understand that they're trying to work on their behalf, and not work against them. If you promise things during an election, you don't have to give everyone all of it at the same time. You can do it in bits and pieces.

So, I think the only way I can think of it is that they kind of come up with a general plan of action that kind of makes everybody happy. But you do have people like Manchin and Sinema who are standing there trying to slow down this train. And in the end, that may work a little bit for the Democrats.

We just have to see if the two sides, the moderates and the progressives, can get together, or a lot of them may lose their seats.

CAMEROTA: Yes.

BORGER: Particularly moderates.

CAMEROTA: Yes, and, of course, all of this against the backdrop, of will democracy survive?

BORGER: Yes.

CAMEROTA: And I don't -- I don't believe I'm overstating that, particularly when you hear Donald Trump proudly proclaim, as he did this weekend, that he did try to engage in election fraud. So I want to play this sound for you. And I also want people to keep

in mind that there's a word that he embeds in this that our relentless fact-checker, Daniel Dale, says, when you hear President Trump use the word sir when referring to himself, chances are some of this conversation is a fabrication.

He has studied this now for four years. So, listen to this sound.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I hope you can help us out and call a special election and let's get to the bottom of it for the good of the country. Let's get to the bottom of it for the good of your state.

Let's go. Election integrity, what could be better than that?

Sir, I'm sorry. I cannot do that. Well, I said, you cannot do that. And that's why -- let me tell you, this guy's a disaster. He is a disaster.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: OK, there's so much to unpack there. He's talking about a conversation with Governor Brian Kemp of Georgia.

BORGER: Right.

CAMEROTA: He is admitting he called him and tried to get him to call a special election and engage in election fraud.

BORGER: Right.

CAMEROTA: I mean, there it is. It's just out -- that's illegal. But he's just talking about it openly.

BORGER: And he's being investigated for it at the same time, as you know, in the state of Georgia.

I mean, it's remarkable to me that Donald Trump can't get past his own emotional issues with losing an election and talk about something else. If he wants to run for the presidency again, and he wants to be president again, maybe he could talk about some of the issues that the Republicans are trying to talk about.

But, instead, he keeps going backwards, because he doesn't really care about Republicans winning control of the Senate, for example. What he cares about is vengeance against those people who voted for impeachment, those people who didn't do what he wanted them to do post-election, like Governor Kemp.