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Military Leaders Face Second Day of Questions in House Hearing; Cheney to Travel to New Hampshire, Fueling 2024 Speculation; Judge Expected to Rule on Britney Spears Conservatorship Case. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired September 29, 2021 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: Top military brass return to Capitol Hill today to answer more questions about the chaotic U.S. withdrawal from Afghanistan. Joint Chiefs Chairman, General Mark Milley, Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin, and CENTCOM Commander General Frank McKenzie spent more than three hours under oath before the House Armed Services Committee.

Lawmakers demanded more details about the recommendation that at least 2,500 troops should have stayed in Afghanistan. Advice that President Biden told ABC News he never heard. General McKenzie said the President was also told of the risks of keeping a troop presence behind.

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GEN. KENNETH F. MCKENZIE JR., COMMANDER U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: Had we held the 2,500 which I stated was my position, and as the secretary as articulated, there would have been a clear risk that the Taliban would have begun to attack us as we move past the 1 May deadline. However, it was my judgment then that that would still have given us a platform to continue negotiations with the Taliban to perhaps force a political solution.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: Joining me now is CNN military analyst retired Air Force Colonel Cedric Leighton, he is a former CIA counter-terrorism official. Colonel, great to have you.

Isn't that the heart of the matter right there which is that President Trump had set this May 1st deadline? President Biden felt that he had to oblige it on some level, but he moved it originally to September. But that if he left the 2,500 U.S. troops behind, every day would have gotten more dangerous because the Taliban wouldn't have complied after May 1st. I mean do I have that right?

COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Yes, basically, Alisyn. I mean the real problem is I think President Biden felt that he was put in a box, right. He was looking at all the different possibilities of how to handle Afghanistan, and he has this agreement, the Doha Agreement that was negotiated during the Trump administration.

There were a lot of problems with that agreement, but basically what it says is you've got to get out of here by that time, May 1st. The deadline was extended until the 31st of August, and that is in essence what President Biden felt he had to live with. So, as a result of that, we had a very hasty, well, perhaps mal-planned way of evacuating this, this theater of operations that we've been in for 20 years. And that I think was a real dilemma for the administration.

CAMEROTA: General Milley also was asked about and talked about whether or not we are safer -- well, Afghanistan is safer, I suppose, now than it was, and then we were in the days right before 9/11. So, here's that response.

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MILLEY: I think, right this minute, it is lesser than it was in 9/11, however, I think the conditions are set.

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The conditions could be set for a reconstitution of al Qaeda and/or ISIS, and I gave some specific times in my statement, and I stand by those. I think that the -- it's a real possibility in the not-too- distant future, 6, 12, 18, 24, 36 months, that kind of time frame, a reconstitution of al Qaeda or ISIS.

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CAMEROTA: OK, so to be clear, he's saying the risk is less today than it was right before 9/11, but that could change in the next 12, 18, 24 months. So, where does that leave us? What is the U.S. supposed to do about that?

LEIGHTON: Well, Alisyn, and you know what General Milley was talking about there was the threat to the U.S. homeland, so Afghanistan as a springboard for terrorist activities, you know, within six months to 12 months to 18 months, he wasn't quite sure, you know, what the timeline would be, nor I don't think could anybody be sure.

But what the real answer here is, is that Afghanistan requires a degree of intelligence overwatch, that we did not have before 9/11. And that degree of overwatch is going to be pretty extensive, and it's something that's going to be really hard to do given the fact that we don't have boots on the ground in Afghanistan. We don't have a real collection architecture on the ground there.

We do have of course other assets, the so-called over-the-horizon assets, and that is something that can be used. But there are some difficulties with that, and the intelligence may not be as accurate as we will want or need in order to protect the U.S. homeland.

CAMEROTA: As we learned tragically when U.S. troops were killed, sometimes that intelligence is faulty. Colonel Cedric Leighton, thank you very much. Great to talk to you.

LEIGHTON: You bet, Alisyn, absolutely.

CAMEROTA: So, CNN is getting a closer look at life inside Afghanistan nearly a month after the U.S. left. The Taliban has since retaken control of the country, leading many Afghans particularly women and girls quite vulnerable.

So, let's bring in CNN chief international correspondent Clarissa Ward, she is in Kabul there on the ground for us. So, Clarissa, just give us the big picture. I mean tell us about the changes you have seen since you were last there.

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I think there's no question, Alisyn, it does feel different on the ground. It's less fraught. It's less chaotic. It's less kinetic in terms of violent activity. But there is this sense of tension underpinning it all. Because a lot of people here in Kabul believe this is a lull. This is a transitional period where the Taliban wants to show the international community that it can be more pragmatic. It's keen to be integrated and accepted by the international community, and it's desperate to make sure that funding and aid that has been frozen by the World Bank, by the IMF, by the U.S. is unfrozen because this country is also dealing with a major liquidity crisis.

A huge economic bombshell, poised to explode here, Alisyn, with teachers' salaries not getting paid. Health care salaries not getting paid. Food prices rising, fuel prices rising, and people waiting in line for often six hours to try to take out their weekly $200 from the bank. So, there is a serious economic crisis.

And then more than that, there is deep seeded anxiety about what will happen when the Taliban really starts to show its true colors. And we have seen some indications of what that might look like. Girls now, can't go to school here beyond 6th grade. The Taliban says that's because it needs to make sure that the correct Islamic environment is created. But people here remember, Alisyn, back in the '90s. That's the exact same excuse that was used and girls never ended up going back to school.

Similarly, women are being told, don't go to the office, don't go to university, we need to organize safe transportation for women. We need to organize complete segregation. But these small things, they're not small, actually. I shouldn't call them small things. These significant things really do portend ominous signs down the line about what this country will look like and what this city will look like once the Taliban feels more comfortable to show its true colors -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Clarissa, it's so helpful as always to have you on the ground there because you can just see it with your own eyes and then you bring it to us how the Taliban is already thrusting a large portion of the population back into the stone ages. And so, we get to see it up close and personal. So, thank you very much for your reporting.

OK, back here, Representative Liz Cheney still one of the Republican Party's most vocal Trump critics. She's plotting her political future, and she's marshaling some support from some important Republicans. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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CAMEROTA: Congresswoman Liz Cheney is one of former President Trump's most vocal Republican critics on Capitol Hill, and now former President Trump is backing her primary challenger.

Cheney's announcing her own future plans in the first presidential primary state of New Hampshire later this fall, and that adds to the speculation that the congresswoman may have political ambitions beyond her Wyoming congressional district.

CNN's Melanie Zanona joins us now. So, Melanie, you're following reporting that Congresswoman Cheney is doing more than just visiting New Hampshire, what's she doing there?

MELANIE ZANONA, CNN CAPITOL HILL REPORTER: Well, Liz Cheney isn't talking about running for President but it's also not something she's ruled out, and certainly she's making moves that suggest she's exploring a political future beyond the state of Wyoming.

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She raised eyebrows this week when she announced that she would visit the state of New Hampshire which of course is home to the first presidential primary. She also was profiled by "60 Minutes" where she reversed her opposition to same sex marriage. She also has a high- profile role on the January 6 Select Committee where she serves as vice chair.

And also, has been beefing up her political operation, which includes raising boat loads of cash. In fact, next month, former President George W. Bush will host a fundraiser for Cheney. There are also a number of prominent GOP figures who have donated to her campaign, including Mitch McConnell, Mitt Romney, and former Speaker Paul Ryan.

Now all of these moves can help her if she chooses to run for higher office one day but 2024 is a long way away, and right now she is focused on defending her congressional seat against a Trump backed primary challenger.

And look, Cheney, I have talked to her before, I've talked to people close to her, she views this race as so much bigger than just about herself. Just take a listen to how she is framing this in an interview with 60 Minutes.

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REP. LIZ CHENEY (R-WY): I think it's going to be the most important House race in the country in 2022. And it will be one where people do have the opportunity to say we want to stand for the Constitution.

LESLEY STAHL, CBS 60 MINUTES: Do you think a vote against you is a vote against the Constitution? CHENEY: A vote against me in this race, a vote for whomever Donald

Trump has endorsed is a vote for somebody who's willing to perpetuate the big lie. Somebody who's willing to put allegiance to Trump above allegiance to the Constitution, absolutely.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZANONA (on camera): So, Cheney clearly views this race as a battle for the heart and soul of the Republican Party, and she is not going down without a fight -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, Melanie Zanona, thank you.

ZANONA: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: All right, a hearing on Britney Spears' conservatorship case is set to begin in minutes. After 13 years, could this be the day it finally ends? We're going to hear from a leader in the Free Britney movement next.

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CAMEROTA: A crucial court hearing for Britney Spears starts soon. The pop star is expected to appear virtually as a Los Angeles County Judge weighs whether to end her father's role in her conservatorship. Britney has called this arrangement abusive.

Joining us now from outside the courthouse is Leann Simmons. She's a leader with the "Free Britney" movement. Leann, thanks so much for being with us. I know that you're on pins and needles about what's going to happen today. In fact, you recently retweeted somebody who said, if Jamie Spears is not removed -- which is the dad -- at the very, very least, we're going to have to take things up a notch. What does that mean?

LEANN SIMMONS, LEADER OF FREE BRITNEY MOVEMENT: Well, you know at this point we've heard from Britney several times. We know how she feels about her father. Their relationship is very contentious and there have been allegations of abuse. So, at the very least, it is Judge Penney's duty as an honorable judge to remove Jamie Spears from this arrangement. Of course, the end goal is to free Britney entirely from this conservatorship which is fraudulent and unjust. But getting rid of her father I think is an excellent first step.

CAMEROTA: But just out of curiosity, if that doesn't happen today, what would the Free Britney movement do?

SIMMONS: We're going to have to brainstorm. I don't want to give away any of our tactics. You know, this is a social justice movement. This is much bigger than Britney at this point. We are continuing to uncover a lot of really unsettling facts about the probate court system. And we're not going to stop. We're going to be loud. We're going to get louder. We're going to keep screaming and we won't give up until we effect change that not only helps Britney and conservatees across the country.

CAMEROTA: OK, on the flip side, if Britney Spears were to be freed entirely from her conservatorship today after 13 years, what would you do?

SIMMONS: I think we might pop some champagne. I think there will be celebrations. Everybody will hug and cry and we'll just be really proud as a movement. We fought really hard for this and our end goal is of course for Britney to have her own voice and her own freedom. So, the moment that comes -- I know it's coming soon. I don't know if it's today, but I do hope that it's soon.

CAMEROTA: I mean just to let people know. This is not a lark for you. You have been involved in this since 2019. You've done a deep dive into court documents. You guys are the ones who got the momentum for all of this going. Who grabbed the national spotlight and attention so that people are now focused on this and you may have changed her trajectory. I mean the course of whatever happens today, I think she gives you tremendous credit. So, do you think you will see Britney today? Is that what you're expecting?

SIMMONS: I don't think anyone expects to see Britney. Again, it's just about getting her, her freedom. We support her. We support her as a human being more than anything. Of course, a lot of us came into this as fans who support a pop star, but it's evolved from there. And as we've learned about the abuse she's faced and other conservatees in similar arrangements have faced.

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My fight is not over when Britney's free. I will continue fighting for conservatorship reform, laws to change and maybe even abolishment of the system because I do think it is a very fraudulent system and it allows for exploitation.

CAMEROTA: We only have ten seconds left. What do you want to say to Britney?

SIMMONS: Britney, you are not alone. We're here for you. We won't stop until you're free.

CAMEROTA: Leann Simmons, thank you. We'll be watching closely with what happens.

And THE LEAD with Jake Tapper starts after a quick break.

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