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January 6 Committee Subpoenas Organizers of Stop the Steal Rally; Judge Suspends Britney Spears' Father as Head of Her Conservatorship; Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) Speaks as Infrastructure Vote Remains Uncertain. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired September 30, 2021 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DANIEL STRAUSS, SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, THE NEW REPUBLIC: -- stand their ground and are successful and not seeing too much, the ultimate price tag of the reconciliation bill would be a sign that this faction of the Democratic Party needs to be at the table for major negotiations on Capitol Hill.

[10:30:15]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN NEWSROOM: Fine, they're at the table though. But if the table gets you nowhere, what is the accomplishment, right? Well, what's the message in 2022 and 2024? We just had Representative Steve Cohen say to Erica that if we cannot govern, talking about the Democratic Party, they're going to get punished in 2022 and 2024.

I mean, the big question for folks at home who are probably sick of hearing all the back and forth, is there a path forward? I mean, is there a middle ground between the progressives and the moderates or conservatives, as you call them, in the Senate?

STRAUS: I mean, Jim, as of right now, it doesn't look like it. I mean, you know, the moderates and centrists in the Senate and Congress expect some kind of agreement in the end, but the progressives not so much. As I reported in my piece, they already feel that they've conceded grown. They already feel that they've agreed to -- they've made agreements to back a $3.5 trillion reconciliation bill instead of a $6 trillion bill. So I don't know, man. It doesn't look like there's a clear path out, very little time left.

ERICA HILL, CNN NEWSROOM: To your point, and we've heard that a number of times, as you've reported here and we've also heard progressives really feel like, look, we've given a lot. We wanted $6 trillion, we've settled on $3.5 trillion, we're letting other things go. But just to follow up on Jim's point there, how much of the discussion within the progressive caucus is about the ultimate toll that this could have moving forward, not just on the agenda right now but even further down the field?

STRAUSS: I mean, so that, I think, is where there is broad agreement. Across the board, Democrats right now feel that if they don't pass this domestic policy agenda, both the infrastructure bill and the reconciliation bill, they're going to feel the punishment for that in the ballot box at least in 2022. They know that this is what their candidates in the next election need to run on. And they need it passed right now. Otherwise they don't have much.

HILL: Daniel Strauss, good to have you with us this morning. Thank you.

STRAUSS: Thanks.

HILL: Still ahead, our next guest blew the whistle on the Trump administration, downplaying threats. How that is still impacting security today.

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[10:35:00]

SCIUTTO: The House select committee investigating the January 6th violent insurrection has issued its latest batch of subpoenas. This time, they target those who planned and organized the so-called Stop the Steal rally, which preceded the Capitol attack. Many of those people walked from there up to the Capitol. The list includes 11 people who were affiliated with the organization, Women for America First, which held the permit for the rally.

A short time, I spoke to Congressman Adam Schiff, a member of the select committee, about why the particular focus on this group.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA): We know there was strong participation of these white nationalist groups, the Proud Boys, the Three Percenters, Bugaloo and others. We want to know what knowledge there was in advance that these groups with a propensity for violence were going to be participating.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Joining me now to discuss the threat from these groups and more is Brian Murphy. He was the acting undersecretary for intelligence at DHS during the Trump administration. He's also a whistleblower who says that he faced intense pressure to manipulate intelligence to fit a political narrative on several topics, including the dangers posed by the rise of white supremacy. Mr. Muprhy, thanks so much for taking the time this morning.

BRIAN MURPHY, FORMER DHS WHISTLEBLOWER: Thanks, Jim.

SCIUTTO: First of all, thank you for your candor in this. It's a difficult thing to do in the current environment. You say you were told to, quote, modify the section on white supremacy in a manner that made the threat appear less severe. I wonder, by downplaying that threat, did the Trump administration make the country less safe from these groups?

MURPHY: Absolutely. I think by downplaying the threat or trying to and forcing the intelligence committee in every way they could to try to not even look at threat, we certainly had the conditions set for January 6th. That road to January 6th started well, well months and years beforehand and by the time January 6th came to be, there was really nobody left looking for these social media clues, which CNN and many other outlets have reported. These people weren't hiding. They were out there in plain sight for anyone to find. But the federal government it was not looking.

SCIUTTO: Was there protest -- you protested. You refused to do much of this. What reaction did you then get from the Trump administration officials as you pushed back?

MURPHY: Well, Jim, thanks for bringing that up. So my first whistleblower complaint was in 2018, about five months after I arrived at DHS. And it was on a separate. It was on the border wall funding at the time and during the longest government shutdown. But I followed up in March of 2019 with my second complaint. So, really, by the time I got to the third complaint, there were a number of related issues in my mind where the threats were, you know, happening at the same time, whether it Russian disinformation, white supremacy, but the pattern by the administration to suppress this and change, manipulate the facts had been ongoing the whole time.

[10:40:06]

SCIUTTO: On Russian disinformation, because this is another part of your complaint, as you note, that there was pressure to downplay what the intelligence showed, which was that Russia in 2020, as in 2016, wanted to help Trump and denigrate his Democratic opponent. I wonder, did that pressure to downplay make the country less safe from Russian interference in 2020?

MURPHY: Well, I think it's important to put Russian disinformation in context. So, the short answer is yes, but the threat from disinformation absolutely goes far beyond Russia. And we just do not have the technology in the federal government right now, or the innovation, to provide answers and solutions to other areas of government and nongovernment organizations that need to spend the time building resiliency so that they understand what they're looking at online.

I mean, I'm lucky in my next job I get to continue this work passionately and working it logically (ph), which is a U.K.-based company, and I'm going to continue that work.

SCIUTTO: Which we appreciate. And, by the way, it's something I've covered a lot too, and one constant point, right, is that we as a country make it easy for them. Russia and other countries to dive into the most divisive issues we have here.

I do want to ask about the border because we see a continuing surge at the border. Republicans say that it is Biden's approach that is to blame here for, in effect, inviting these migrants to come. I've been down at the border with border patrol agents. They say they're working just as hard today as they were prior. We've seen Biden administration officials say to migrants, don't come, right? But I wonder, who do you blame for the current situation at the border?

MURPHY: Look, I blame all of us in terms of the American citizens by not demanding enough from Congress to fix the system. You know, the real problem is that we demand, unfortunately, drugs, and we send money and guns back to these cartels. The people coming up who are seeking a better way of life, they are just a commodity to these cartels. So this is a very deep issue which needs to get fixed, and it really starts with all the American people demanding that we get this situation fixed.

And I'll just go back to the disinformation, if I can. People take this very perilous journey coming up to the United States based on false information that they deliberately receive from these coyotes and others. And it's dangerous journey, as you well know.

SCIUTTO: No question. They're lied to. They're told there's basically an open door, which they don't find when they get there.

Brian Murphy, again, I know you face great risk and challenge in coming forward like this both during the administration and after, thank you for your service.

MURPHY: Well, thanks for having me. I appreciate it.

SCIUTTO: Erica?

HILL: Still ahead, Britney Spears, her father now speaking out after being removed as his daughter's conservator. Why he says yesterday's hearing was a loss for Britney.

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[10:45:00]

HILL: For the first time in 13 years, Britney Spears is now free from her father's control over her life. The singer is scoring a major legal victory yesterday when a Los Angeles judge suspended Jamie Spears as conservator of Britney's estimated $60 million estate of a judge also designating a temporary replacement to oversee her finances.

SCIUTTO: CNN Entertainment Reporter Chloe Melas joins us now.

Chloe, Jamie Spears, he just released a statement defending his actions as her conservator. What did he say?

CHLOE MELAS, CNN ENTERTAINMENT REPORTER: Hey, guys. Well, just moments ago, Jamie Spears releasing a lengthy statement to CNN saying that this is a loss for his daughter, Britney Spears, maintaining that he has always worked to serve her faithfully, that he's loved her unwaveringly and always acted in her best interests.

Now, this is the opposite of what the judge clearly decided yesterday when I was in the courtroom, calling it a toxic environment for Britney and appointing, like you said, that certified accountant, John Zabel, instead.

Now, this is a temporary situation. I know many people are wondering, well, is this really a victory for her. Well, Britney said in two emotional testimonies this summer, she doesn't want her father controlling her life or finances anymore, something that he's done for 13 years. Not to mention that the Free Britney Movement and many people don't believe that Britney should have ever been put under a probate conservatorship.

So, this next hearing is going to be November 12th, so mark your calendars. It looks as though Judge Brenda Penny will officially terminate is conservatorship at that point. This is more of a formality.

And also something interesting to point out, the fact that Jamie Spears has now been suspended means he has to turn over all his bookkeeping, accounting, and a lot of private paperwork that he's kept for the last decade-plus. He would not have had to do this if the judge had terminated the conservatorship yesterday. So, Mathew Rosengart raising the point that perhaps he just doesn't want Britney Spears' legal team to look into whether or not there was sort of financial mismanagement going on there.

HILL: We'll be watching for any of those developments. Chloe Melas, I appreciate it, thank you.

SCIUTTO: Still ahead this hour, CNN visits the Afghan family still waiting for the U.S. to contact them after a drone attack killed ten family members.

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[10:50:00]

HILL: House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, as we wait to see if this bill will come to the floor today, speaking now. Let's listen in.

REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): -- involved, first of all, keeping government open. Right now, a little later this morning, the Senate will be voting on a continuing resolution, which they will send back to the House, which we will pass and send on to the government, to the president to keep government open.

We hope that this can be a strongly bipartisan bill because it keeps vital services running, protects up to hundreds of thousands of workers from furloughs and protects the economy from a shutdown. A shutdown is not anything anyone wants. It was never thought we would have one, but nonetheless, it will happen today.

Yesterday, as you know in the House, we voted for the other item on the agenda for this week by lifting the debt ceiling. I was very pleased that we were able to send that legislation back over to the Senate. You know how cataclysmic that would be. It would trigger the loss of 6 million jobs, $15 trillion in household wealth, 4 percent decline in the GDP and massively increase costs. And if you a car loan, a home mortgage, a credit card, all of your interest rates would go up. And I'm worried about that across kitchen tables across America.

Only 3 percent of the debt that we are talking about here is incurred under the Biden administration. And this is about not as we go forward. This is about paying the bills the way you have to pay your credit card bill, so does America.

As I've said to you before, the 14th Amendment says the full faith and credit of the United States of America should not be in doubt.

[10:55:00]

For some reason, we've put ourselves in a situation to vote on this each year. We'll have to examine that process.

But for now, yesterday, I was very proud of the members once again lifting the debt ceiling. As you recall, we had done so the week before with the continuing resolution to keep government open and 100 percent of the House Democrats and then 100 percent of the House Democrats voted -- the Democrats voted for it, the Republicans voted against it. 100 percent of the Republicans in the Senate voted against lifting the debt ceiling and keeping government open, even though many of them in the House and the Senate had families in their district suffering from Hurricane Ida, many of them wanting to help the Afghan evacuees in our country. Nonetheless, I thought it was a good idea to vote no. Hopefully, today on the C.R., they will vote yes. And I'm hoping that it will be a very positive bill.

So, I know you've come here about what else comes next. We have two items, the bipartisan infrastructure bill, the BIF, and, of course, the reconciliation. I just told members of my leadership that the reconciliation bill was a culmination of my service in Congress, because it was about the children, the children, the children, the children. Their health -- it's about their health, the education, the economic security of their families, a clean, safe environment in which they could thrive, and a world in which they could succeed. This is more about the domestic first four parts of that. So remove all doubt in anyone's mind that we will not have a reconciliation. We will have a reconciliation bill. That is for sure.

Today, the question is about we are proceeding in a very positive way to bring up the bill of -- the BIF, to do so in a way that can win, and so far so good for today, it's going in a positive direction. It's impossible though to persuade people to vote for the BIF without the reassurances that the reconciliation bill will occur, and it will. And we cannot, because of rules of the Senate in terms of parliamentarian having to pass on any bill before it comes to the floor and pass on any language, we cannot really guarantee what I'd hoped in terms of having a more legislative forum, but, nonetheless, the framework that, if it pleases, that it's okay with the president of the United States, who has this vision for our country.

As I've told you before, he said I want to work on the bipartisan bill for infrastructure, but I will not confine my vision for America to what is in there. We have to build back better. And to do so in a way that honors our climate goals, honoring our responsibility to our children to convey this planet in a responsible way, that does so that respects the needs of -- not needs, the opportunities for working families with issues. So, all jobs, jobs, green technology, jobs for women in the workplace, dads who may need home help, so all the things, child tax credit, child tax care, child care issues that relate to universal pre-K, home health services, if you have a senior, a person with disabilities in your home. Some of you know this, you hear it every time you come here, but I just want to make sure it is reinforced as to why this is important, because it's jobs for women, it's jobs for people who have been previously underrepresented. Build back better. So when we build the infrastructure of America, you're doing so with a workforce that has workforce development, can be involved in those decisions.

And it has a justice to it that the president has insisted upon that we're not building ways in the past that separated communities and perpetuated environmental injustice but nonetheless, but instead build back better with justice. And then, of course, the health care issues which are so important, extension of Medicaid, the strengthening of the Affordable Care Act, expanding benefits for Medicare, all of that as part of the health piece, and those are jobs as well.

So, again, I think we're in a good place right now. We're making progress. I can't stay here too long because I have to deal with -- step by step with this. But I'm only envisioning taking it up and winning it.

REPORTER: Madam Speaker, I don't have to tell you.

[11:00:01]

You've got a Senate problem on your hands. Joe Manchin said last night that the reconciliation bill is the definition of fiscal insanity, talked about vengeful taxes.