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Capitol Police Officer Indicted For Obstruction Of Justice Related To January 6th; Nine Months After Insurrection, Trump Tightens Grip On GOP; Trump Turns On Republicans After They Came To His Rescue; Kyrie Irving Speaks Out After Being Sidelined For Vaccine Refusal; NBA Legend, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Discusses Kyrie Irving Vaccine Refusal & Police Reform; Right-Wing Media Tries to Make the New War on Christmas Happen; Buttigieg Fights Back after Tucker Carlson Mocks Him for Taking Paternity Leave. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired October 16, 2021 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:23]

JIM ACOSTA, CNN HOST: You are live in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Jim Acosta in Washington.

The site of the January 6th insurrection, Capitol Hill, became a poignant place of reflection today as the National Peace Officers Memorial Service honored fallen officers from all across the country. The president and first lady in attendance and paying tribute.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Particularly appropriate today is here nine months ago your brothers and sisters thwarted a constitutional attack on our nation's values and votes. But because of you, democracy survived.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: And new video released by the Department of Justice shows us exactly what officers were up against on January 6th. One of the videos shows what the Justice Department says is one of the first breaches of the Capitol. The person you see right now is using a riot shield to smash a window. That's a member of the so-called Proud Boys. And then more than a dozen rioters climbed through that window.

The second video also shows a breach of the building. People rushing through a door and down a hallway where they eventually have a confrontation with Capitol police officer, Eugene Goodman.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey. Where are they counting the (EXPLETIVE DELETED" votes?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Don't do it. Don't do it. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey. Hey. Where are they counting the votes? Where

are they counting the votes? Where are they counting? Where are they counting?

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Definitely not tourists. Just unbelievable. I want to bring CNN's Jessica Schneider.

Jessica, along with that new video, we're also learning about a Capitol police officer who's been indicted? We were talking about these charges in the last hour. What can you tell us?

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, this is notable because this is the first U.S. Capitol police officer who was actually on duty that day, but not inside the Capitol, to be charged here. These are hefty charges. Two counts of obstruction. They each carry a maximum sentence of 20 years in prison. So it's a six-page indictment. It was unsealed yesterday.

This officer appeared in federal court and it lays out these details about how this officer, Michael Angelo Riley, allegedly instructed a rioter who was present inside the Capitol on January 6th to delete all evidence that he was inside the Capitol off of his Facebook account. Oddly enough, these two became friends at the beginning of January and then one day after the riot, this officer got in touch with the rioter and said you have to take down those messages because the FBI is investing this.

In this indictment, it lays out what that officer said. This is what he said in part, he said, "Hey, I'm a Capitol police officer who agrees with your political stance. Take down the part about being in the building. They are currently investigating and everyone who was in the building is going to be charged. Just looking out."

So this indictment saying that this Capitol police officer essentially tipped this rioter off to the fact that there was even an FBI investigation. But then there's the second part of this indictment, the second obstruction count. This is because this Capitol police officer allegedly went in after the fact and deleted all of these conversations with this rioter once he found out that this rioter had been arrested and had been talking to the FBI about his communication with the Capitol police officer.

So these two separate obstruction charges for a 25-year veteran of the U.S. Capitol Police, but now indicted. He appeared in court yesterday. Just an initial appearance. He's expected to be arraigned, Jim, on Tuesday.

ACOSTA: Just incredible. All right, Jessica Schneider, thanks so much for following all these details. It's remarkable to see these things being laid out over the course of the last nine months.

SCHNEIDER: It is.

ACOSTA: And these new details, very disturbing. SCHNEIDER: Absolutely.

ACOSTA: Jessica, thank you so much.

Last hour, I spoke with U.S. Capitol Police Sergeant Aquilino Gonell. He was at the Capitol on January 6th when rioters stormed the building. He was assaulted, doused in chemical spray, and called a traitor as he sought to defend his fellow officers and the Capitol from the insurrectionists. Now months later, Gonell told me he wants those involved to be brought to justice.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SGT. AQUILINO GONELL, U.S. CAPITOL POLICE: When you hear the former vice president saying that that one day in January. Well, I'm still living through that one day and still counting. My injury had not gone away because of that one day in January. So all those people that are trying to play it off and diminish the danger that we encountered that day, not only to ourselves, but to our democracy and our government, it's very challenging for us to -- and a disgrace as well because --

[16:05:14]

ACOSTA: You're angry.

GONELL: Yes. And frustrating, angry, because of what the level of disservice that they're doing and this is coming from people who swore an oath to protect the country, the Constitution.

ACOSTA: What does justice look like to you?

GONELL: I think anybody who took part, who's aiding and abetting those individuals, and if it happened to be some of the Capitol police officer after they're fully investigated as well and they go through a process, I don't have no sympathy for them because that's what they are condoning this. And every four years, this could come back and be the norm.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: He's certainly right about that. Let's bring in Michael Gerson, he is a former speechwriter for President George W. Bush and a columnist for the "Washington Post." Also with us, "USA Today" columnist and CNN senior political analyst, Kirsten Powers.

Michael, let me start with you. Great to have both of you on. Really appreciate it. Let me start with your op-ed that summed up the Trump threat that the sergeant was I think laying out also, you know, eloquently just a few minutes ago, but you write, "Trump has strengthened his identification with the seditious forces he unleashed on January 6th.

He has embraced ever more absurd and malicious conspiracy theories. He has shown even less stability, humanity, responsibility and restraint, and his support among Republicans has grown. Trump and his strongest supporters are in a feedback loop of radicalization." As the kids say, find the lie. No lie there. Are America's democratic

institutions built to withstand an ongoing assault like this? You know, we said it before. It feels like the insurrection hasn't ended.

MICHAEL GERSON, FORMER SPEECHWRITER FOR PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH: Well, gosh, we're going to see. This is a case where as those events were taking place that we just saw on the television, the president was making direct, positive efforts to change the leadership at the Department of Justice, or get them to do things that would undermine the election.

This was a serious, concerted effort to undermine the incoming administration and prevent the Constitution from doing important work. And that's, you know, and the Republican Party has become enablers of sedition in this circumstance. They've taken this up as a cause.

And that -- it's just, it's beyond belief. We now have one party that is not a responsible governing party. And that, and given the normal rhythms of American politics, that party could be back in power and that will be a constitutional crisis different than we've ever faced, at least in my time.

ACOSTA: Absolutely. And Kirsten, the House Select Committee is moving to hold Trump ally, Steve Bannon, in criminal contempt. I mean, talk about things we haven't seen in many years. Is this the outcome that Bannon wants, though? I mean, I think that's part of the conversation that needs to be had.

KIRSTEN POWERS, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, I think that's a great thing to raise because, obviously, he loves to play this role. He loves the sort of, you know, poking the bear role and he's going to just get more listeners to his podcast.

He's going to raise more money off of this and get more attention and kind of drag this out and, you know, this is somebody who said the day before, on January 5th, the day before the attack on the Capitol on January 6th, that all hell is going to break loose.

Now how did he know that? And I think that that's a big question and I think that that's why it's so important for them to talk to him. And so there may be also an element here that perhaps it would be worse for him to talk to them than to defy the subpoena, but President Biden has said that he thinks that this should be enforced, though it is a Justice Department decision, so now it goes to the Justice Department and we'll see whether they're willing to enforce compliance with this subpoena.

ACOSTA: And Michael, this week, Trump e-mailed his supporters saying Republican voters will stay home in the midterms and beyond if the GOP doesn't solve, quote, "The 2020 election fraud issue." Again, this is an imaginary issue, it's an issue that he's made up and others have embraced in the party.

Isn't he describing the Georgia effect? I mean, essentially what handed the Democrats the Senate?

GERSON: Yes. Every single Republican dreads that kind of language because turnout is important.

[16:10:03]

And the president, anything the president does to undermine the turnout of his supporters is going to be, is going to be bad for their cause. So, yes, I mean, the former president is not doing rational interventions in American politics, but there are destructive interventions, and you know, he is solidifying control of a party when he is not either a great strategist or, you know, having a governing vision.

The only cause that the Republican Party is rallying around is a personal cause. A cause of the 2020 election being rigged and essentially the grievance of a former president is the agenda of the Republican Party. And under those circumstances, you know, mainstream Republicans, the ones that are left, see how destructive this is going to be in the long run.

ACOSTA: And Kirsten, switching gears just a bit. President Biden was asked about the two Democrats holding up his social safety net bill. The Build Back Better bill. Let's watch a little of that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Do you have a message to Senator Sinema and Senator Manchin right now?

BIDEN: Yes. I'm just about to deliver it.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Yes, right after that, we learned that Senator Manchin is forcing a key climate provision on to the chopping block. It sounds like that's not going to be part of this final legislation, although some of the progressives in the Democratic Party are saying hold on, that's not the case. But who's in charge here?

POWERS: Well, I mean, the president's in charge, but he's not king. He's the president. So he has to actually get votes to go along with his agenda and there are 48 Democrats in the Senate who agree with his agenda. So this has been cast kind of as this divide like there's two equal sides but there's not really two equal sides. The majority of the Democratic Party, at least, you know, the people who are making decisions, completely support this.

And then there are two people who are holding it up. And, you know, Joe Manchin is talking about holding up these provisions because of the fact that he comes from a state with the big coal industry, but at the same time, the White House has been talking to him about having retraining and moving people who are working in the coal industry into moving into industries that are more industries of the future and that are obviously safer jobs and probably better jobs.

And he has said he doesn't want to do that because he sees this as some, I guess as welfare or something, which of course it's not. It's just recognizing that this is an industry of the past and that we need to move into something cleaner because of the environment and it's where pretty much every country is moving.

So, Joe Biden, it's not really Joe Biden, there's nothing he could do other than to continue to negotiate with these two holdouts and try to figure out a way to get something in the end that resembles the kind of bill that he wants and that he thinks is necessary for the country.

ACOSTA: Yes. And Michael, while I have you, let's talk about your old boss, former President Bush. On Monday, this is going to be pretty remarkable. He's holding a fundraiser for Congresswoman Liz Cheney, who has been under fire in her own party. We have not seen former President Bush do a lot of politics since leaving office. He occasionally comes out. He gave those moving remarks on the anniversary of 9/11, but how significant do you think this is that he is trying to help Liz Cheney?

GERSON: Well, he would be doing this under any circumstances. I mean, she is part of his political family. He's a very loyal guy. And if she wanted him to do it, he would be doing it under any circumstance. I think we need to say that. But if you look at the people that are going to be in Dallas at this fundraiser, it's essentially what's left of the non -- you know, Trump Republican Party.

I mean, supporting this event are John Boehner and Paul Ryan and Bolton, the former, Trump's former national security adviser. He's giving money. So it is an attempt to say that there is an alternative to Trump and not that that is going to win, but it needs to survive. And right now, to survive is an alternative. And right now, Liz Cheney is playing an essential role in determining if this alternative for the Republican Party is going to survive as an option. And I think a lot of Republicans know that.

ACOSTA: All right. Michael Gerson, Kirsten Powers, we'll leave it there. Thanks so much. Appreciate the insights as always. Great to see you this afternoon. Thanks so much.

Coming up, the Kyrie Irving debate. The Brooklyn Nets star explains why he won't get vaccinated.

[16:15:01]

Plus, I'll get reaction from Hall of Famer and vaccine advocate, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. Next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: This is a big moment in the investigation into the Capitol insurrection. Democrats in Congress and Justice Department officials now have to decide whether to seek criminal referrals to force a handful of key Trump aides and associates to comply with subpoenas issued by the January 6th committee. In part to see what Trump adviser Steve Bannon meant when he said this on January 5th.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE BANNON, FORMER TRUMP ADVISER: All hell is going to break loose tomorrow. And tomorrow it's game day. I've met so many people through my life said, man, if I was in the revolution, I would be with Washington at Trenton. Well, this is where -- this is for your time in history.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: These men have plenty to say. Bannon has a podcast as you heard just there. Former White House chief of staff Mark Meadows has a new book coming out.

[16:20:01]

The publisher says this about the book, "'The Chief's Chief,' Mark Meadows, known simply as the chief around the West Wing, tells the harrowing story of how he and a close team of loyal advisers helped President Trump bring the country back from the brink of catastrophe. Meadows pulls back the curtain on the West Wing as it was run by President Trump."

It begs the question, why can't Meadows pull back the curtain for the committee? Meadows is no shrinking violet, seen here on his book jacket, standing behind Trump looking like Clint Eastwood. Kind of like the West Wing meets Dirty Harry, go ahead, Chuck Schumer, make my day. But the chief's chief's hands may be dirty, too. Meadows was backstage with the first family before Trump took the stage on January 6th.

I wonder if that's in the book. Then there is the six-step memo written by one of Trump's attorneys at the time John Eastman that reads like an insurrectionist's cookbook. Detailing how election results could just be tossed out by then vice president, Mike Pence, who was evacuated as we know from the Senate chamber amid chants of hang Mike Pence.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED RIOTERS: Hang Mike Pence. Hang Mike Pence. Hang Mike Pence. Hang Mike Pence.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Yes. Yes. Some of the insurrectionists were there for a purpose and it wasn't a tour of the Capitol. Prosecutors noted this in a brand-new court filing alleging that one of the Oath Keepers sent a text message that read, "civil war starting," just as the riot was getting underway.

But the longer this drags out there is a risk that we'll never get to the bottom of what happened. No surprise nine months later, some Trump supporters have constructed their own fantasies about what happened that day. Case in point, a rally this week in support of Virginia Republican gubernatorial candidate Glenn Youngkin. The event included the Pledge of Allegiance using a flag from the insurrection.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I also want to invite Kim from Chesapeake. She's carrying an American flag that was carried at the peaceful rally with Donald J. Trump on January 6th.

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I ask you all, I ask you all to rise and join us as Mark Lloyd leads us in the pledge.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: At least they didn't pledge allegiance to the Trump flag. Youngkin, who did not attend the rally, has sought to distance himself from the event.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GLENN YOUNGKIN, REPUBLICAN NOMINEE IN VIRGINIA GUBERNATORIAL RACE: If that is the case, then we shouldn't pledge allegiance to that flag. And oh, by the way, I have been so clear, there is no place for violence, none, none, in America today.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: By the way, Steve Bannon was there and Trump called in to offer his support to Youngkin.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I hope he and others, by the way, but I hope Glenn gets in there and he'll straighten out Virginia, lower taxes. Do all of the things that we want a governor to do.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: What does Trump want Youngkin to do? Youngkin has made the non-issue of election integrity a big part of his campaign even though there was integrity in the last election. It's just that Trump lost. But as one Trump adviser told me recently, the GOP is now being held hostage by the former president who is threatening sabotage if he doesn't get what he wants.

He released this statement, "If we don't solve the presidential election fraud of 2020 which we have thoroughly and conclusively documented," no, they have not, "Republicans will not be voting in '22 or '24. It is the single most important thing for Republicans to do."

By the way, you've seen this? Trump is now fundraising off of that threat. Grifting on his hostage taking.

Republican operatives are privately grumbling that Trump is repeating what he did in the last Georgia Senate race, encouraging his supporters to stay home and helping Democrats capture the Senate. If it happens again next year Democrats would keep control of Congress. Now you might say Trump won Republicans years ago that he would eventually turn on them. Just listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TRUMP: On her way to work one morning, down the path along the lake, a tenderhearted woman saw a poor half frozen snake. His pretty colored skin had been all frosted with the dew. Poor thing, she cried. I'll take you in and I'll take care of you. She hurried home from work that night and as soon as she arrived, she found that pretty snake she had taken in had been revived.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Yes. It's Trump reading his favorite story about the half- frozen snake and the woman who rescued him only to be bitten in the end. But with Trump, of course, this is not a poem. It's projection.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: She clutched him to her bosom. You're so beautiful, she cried.

[16:25:03]

But if I hadn't brought you in by now, oh, heavens, you would have died. She stroked his pretty skin again and kissed him and held him tight. But instead of saying, thank you, that snake gave her a vicious bite. I have saved you, cried the woman. And you bit me. Heavens why? You know your bite is poisonous and now I'm going to die. Oh, shut up, silly woman, said the reptile with a grin. You knew damn well I was a snake before you took me in.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Trump's political career would have ended had Republicans just finally given up on him after January 6th. Instead, they took in that half frozen snake and they gave him another chance. In return, Trump is threatening to poison the party once again.

It's a lesson not just for Republicans, but the rest of the country. Letting Trump and his aides off the hook for what happened at the insurrection would almost certainly breathe new life into his chances for 2024. As the snake warned all of us, you knew I was a snake before you took me in.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:31:00]

ACOSTA: Despite the NBA having a high vaccination rate, it was Brooklyn Nets all-star, Kyrie Irving, grabbing headlines this week for his refusal to get the shot.

Irving went on social media to explain his decision after the Nets announced he wouldn't be allowed to play or even practice with the team under the city's vaccine requirements.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KYRIE IRVING, GUARD, BROOKLYN NETS: In order to be in New York City, in order to be on the team, I have to be vaccinated.

I chose to be unvaccinated. And that was my choice. And I would ask you all just to respect that choice here.

It's not a political thing. It's not about the NBA. It's not about an anti-vaccine position. It's about my life and what I'm choosing to do.

Don't believe that I'm retiring. Don't believe that I'm going to give up this game for a vaccine mandate or staying unvaccinated. Don't believe any of that (EXPLETIVE DELETED), man.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: All right, my next guest is an NBA legend and an outspoken advocate for getting the COVID vaccine, six-time champion and Hall of Famer, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, famously featured in a PSA showing him getting the shot.

Kareem, it's an honor to have you joins us. And thanks for being such a great example on this important issue.

Let's jump right to this. What do you make of Kyrie Irving saying it's not about being anti-vaccine? It's about what feels good to me. What's your reaction to that?

KAREEM ABDUL-JABBAR, HALL OF FAMER & SIX-TIME NBA CHAMPION: I can understand that he wants to do what feels good to him. But what feels good to him can endanger other people, his teammates, their families and the other people that work in the Nets organization.

If he's going to be around them unvaccinated, he's a risk. So at that point where he is exposing his teammates and people that he works with to the risk of infection, he's not being a good teammate. And he has to understand it.

They have to protect themselves to the extent that they can. And masking and vaccinations have been proven to be effective to that end. So I don't know what he's talking about.

ACOSTA: Yes. It's a tough issue because you know, I think a lot of people out there want to you know, give him the space to figure this out, but the season is upon us so we're out of time.

ABDUL-JABBAR: Yes.

ACOSTA: What do you imagine is going on behind the scenes with his teammates inside the locker room, with the coaches? I assume they're starting to turn to tough love as the approach to dealing with this right now.

ABDUL-JABBAR: I think that tough love is the only way out for them because they've got to think about the whole organization.

They can't just think about one player and have him waste their time and effort and money trying to cajole him into playing, given that the rules in New York City. He has to accept it. ACOSTA: Right, and he doesn't seem to.

And we've seen some public officials on the right embrace Kyrie Irving as a hero. I'm sure you've seen some of this. But some of these tweets are kind of shocking, but maybe not surprising.

Here's just a couple. From Donald Trump Jr., "Kyrie just sacrificed more than Kaepernick ever did."

Former congressional candidate, Laverne Spicer, she says, "They let Magic Johnson play basketball with full-blown HIV but won't let Kyrie Irving play because we won't get a COVID shot."

Obviously, all of that stuff is ridiculous. But if these are the people that who are supporting him, shouldn't Kyrie Irving see that as a warning sign?

ABDUL-JABBAR: I think he should. He doesn't seem to understand the people that he's aligned himself with and the position that he's aligned himself with, which is that it doesn't matter if they're vaccinated or not. Just like this COVID -- (INAUDIBLE).

[16:35:05]

And we can't have that. We have to protect ourselves.

And Kyrie went to school in America. In order for him to go to grade school, he had to be inoculated against rubella, measles, Polio and a couple of other things. He's already been vaccinated, if he's not aware of that. Oh, yeah, and chickenpox, I forgot that.

So if he's not aware of that and doesn't understand that he's already been vaccinated, he's way behind in terms of knowledge and understanding of what the problem is.

ACOSTA: Let me ask you about something else, some star players who have been vaccinated like LeBron James. Took him a while to get around to getting vaccinated. Of course, there was a lot of coverage about that.

But some of these folks have declined to publicly advocate the vaccine for others in the way that you're doing right now, Kareem.

Are you disappointed in some of those players, like LeBron? And do you think it's fair to demand more of him than other players because he has that bigger platform? Does he need to take on a leadership role in this do you think?

ABDUL-JABBAR: I think LeBron has the discretion to take on issues that he feels are important.

For LeBron and his family, they're vaccinated. He's not making a big deal of it. But if you want to understand how LeBron feels about it, just look at the example that he gives us all in his life without talking about it.

LeBron has to worry about the beginning of the season. It starts -- just started. So you know, that's what he's supposed to be focused on.

And maybe he has taken the position that he's going to focus on that and let people who have more time, like me, talk about the necessity of everybody of going along with vaccinations and wearing masks.

ACOSTA: Kareem, I want to talk to you about another issue you've been very vocal about and you've shown a lot of leadership on this. It's police reform.

You wrote a piece recently that people can check out at Substack.com. I need to get one of these Substacks, by the way. It's great that you have one.

It's about the trials and tribulations of growing up in the '60s and '70s with a black cop for a father.

There's a story you tell about what happened after the white owner of a grocery store accused your mother of shoplifting.

Can you tell us about that?

ABDUL-JABBAR: Well, it was just something that my mom didn't feel like dealing with.

My mom was born in North Carolina and she had to deal with Jim Crow. And living in New York, she didn't feel that was something she had to cope with.

And they wanted to look at my mom's bag and she wouldn't let him. She pulled me out of the grocery store and I think I knocked over a big pyramid of bread on the way out.

But we had to return at another time. My mom and dad returned. My dad withdrew his badge and asked what the problem was with my mom. We never had any more problems like that.

But you know, people treat me under the wall sometimes and it escapes people on how it can affect you and make your life miserable.

ACOSTA: And, Kareem, what do you make of the fact it looks like Congress is not going to do anything with police reform right now. Those talks, that effort just completely fell apart.

What are your thoughts on that?

ABDUL-JABBAR: Well, you know, that's usually what happens. It just gets to the point where people can't talk about the reality of the situation and nothing gets done. And more people die needlessly.

We've got to put an end to it and we have to have the political will to do that.

ACOSTA: Absolutely. No question about it.

All right, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, thanks for showing some will to join us and talk about these important issues, especially about COVID and police reform.

Great talking to you. Big honor to have you on with us. Thanks so much for your time. We appreciate it.

ABDUL-JABBAR: Not a problem. Nice talking to you.

ACOSTA: I'm a Wizards fan so I can't say go, Laker, but just this once.

ABDUL-JABBAR: OK.

(LAUGHTER)

ACOSTA: Thanks, Kareem. Take care. Appreciate it.

And I'm definitely a Kareem fan.

Coming up, it's not even Halloween, so why is FOX already yelling about a new war on Christmas. It doesn't make sense to me. Maybe it makes sense to somebody.

[16:40:54]

Plus, Pete Buttigieg fighting back after Tucker Carlson mocks him for taking parental leave.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: It's not even Halloween but the right-wing, anti-Biden media is already going after the president, accusing him of being the Grinch who stole Christmas.

With us now, CNN's Brian Stelter.

Brian, it's a little early for Christmas references. What's this all about?

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDICA CORRESPONDENT & CNN HOST, "RELIABLE SOURCES": This is very strange and nothing merry about this, but I think it's about the right-wing media needing to create content against Biden.

[16:45:02]

Let me show you what I mean.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LAURA INGRAHAM, FOX NEWS HOST, "THE INGRAHAM ANGLE": The Biden who stole Christmas.

STELTER (voice over): Christmas has come early for the anti-Biden media.

SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS HOST, "HANNITY": You'll get your Christmas presents next year. STELTER (voice-over): From the network that brought you the original war on Christmas --

BILL O'REILLY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Some far-left folks want to diminish Judeo-Christian tradition and rename the Christmas tree, "The Holiday Tree"

STELTER: -- comes as sequel inspired by the commander-in-chief.

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Thank you all so very much.

(CROSSTALK)

STELTER: The GOP highlighting that line on social media, as incredibly complex supply chain concerns exacerbated by a global pandemic, are being boiled down into a simple holiday tune.

AINSLEY EARHARDT, FOX NEWS CO-HOST, "FOX & FRIENDS": We begin at the White House where the administration is trying to protect the president from being the "Grinch Who Stole Christmas".

STELTER: If that sounds familiar, it's because another host said the exact same words one hour early.

PETE HEGSETH, FOX NEWS CO-HOST, "FOX & FRIENDS": Now to the White House where the administration tried to protect the president from being the "Grinch Who Stole Christmas".

STELTER: It's like an annoying Christmas carol stuck on repeat. Fox is repeating this notion of Biden ruining Christmas.

INGRAHAM: Grinch has nothing on these people. The fact is the Biden administration has broken our economy.

STELTER: Laura Ingraham even showing cartoons.

NARRATOR: Then he went up the chimney himself. And the last thing he took was the log for their fire.

STELTER: And on "Newsmax," the exact same theme. Just remember it's still the middle of October.

GRANT STINCHFIELD, NEWSMAX HOST, "STINCHFIELD": They are now, officially, the White House that stole Christmas.

STELTER: Marketers call this Christmas creep, putting out trees and toys earlier every year. Right-wing media calls it content. They've been rerunning talking points the way Hallmark reruns holiday movies.

UNIDENTIFIED NEWS ANCHOR: Maybe that's why Fauci, the Grinch, tried to cancel Christmas.

STELTER: But the same show, on the same night, also declares that there's a war on Halloween because a single Seattle elementary school called off a Halloween parade.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You mark my words, Thanksgiving is next. Presidents Day is next. The Fourth of July is next. It's coming.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

STELTER: It sounds like it's hard to have happy holidays with all of those threats coming.

But back in the reality-based world, you go out, go to the pumpkin patch, you realize it's not even Halloween yet and Christmas will be just fine. We've all got a little bit of time to buy presents still -- Jim?

ACOSTA: Yes. I think FOX News got run over by a reindeer, but that's just me. I don't know.

ACOSTA: Brian --

(LAUGHTER)

ACOSTA: -- Tucker Carlson made some controversial comments about transportation secretary, Pete -- I shouldn't say controversial.

(CROSSTALK)

STELTER: Yes.

ACOSTA: I should say ugly, bigoted comments about Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg. You need to get back to work amid a national supply chain crisis.

Let's talk about that. Let's watch what was said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TUCKER CARLSON, FOX NEWS HOST, "TUCKER CARLSON TONIGHT": Pete Buttigieg has been on leave from his job since August after adopting a child. Paternity leave, they call it. Trying to figure out how to breast-feed. I wonder how that went.

But now he's back in office as the transportation secretary, and he's deeply amused, he says, to see that dozens of container ships can't get into the country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PETE BUTTIGIEG, TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: I guess he doesn't understand the concept of bottle feeding, let along the concept of paternity leave.

But what's really strange is this is from a side of the aisle that used to claim the mantle of being pro-family.

What we have right now is an administration that's actually pro- family. And I'm blessed to be able to experience that, you know, as an employee.

(END VIDEO CLIP) ACOSTA: Yes, I mean sounds like a war on paternity leave. Why would you criticize that? I don't understand.

STELTER: First of all, what he was saying is homophobic when he talks about, how are these gay men going to breast feed? There's a reference there that seems homophobic.

And Buttigieg has taken this opportunity to turn it around into a positive, taking the offensive remarks from Carlson and responding, going on television.

He's going to be on "STATE OF THE UNION" here on CNN tomorrow. So he's trying to turn it around and point out that paid parent leave is a very good thing.

In fact, at FOX News, they have paternity leave. And some of Carlson's male colleagues --

ACOSTA: Of course.

STELTER: -- have thanked FOX and raved about the value of having that time with their newborns.

Look, Jim, I regret not taking all the time that CNN offers for paternity leave. I wish I had taken more weeks of paternity leave.

This is something so many parents can relate to. And that's why it's so strange to see someone like Carlson taking the fringe minority stance on this when everyone is moving in the direction of taking care of families, giving more support, not less, both to mothers and fathers.

ACOSTA: Right. And is he against dads being home helping out? Isn't that what dads should be doing? You know, what a concept.

All right, Brian Stelter. We could go on and on about this, but we won't. Thanks so much. Great to see you.

[16:50:02]

STELTER: Thank you.

ACOSTA: And be sure to catch Brian's show. It's must-see TV. "RELIABLE SOURCES," tomorrow at 11:00 a.m.

And we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: A scary moment for Motley Crue frontman, Vince Neil. He was performing in Tennessee last night when he stepped forward and suddenly fell off the stage and suffered broken ribs.

A member of the band said Neil wanted to continue the show but was having a hard time breathing and was urged to get treatment.

We hope Vince is doing OK. And a lot of fellow Gen-Xers can remember a lot of his Motley Crue songs. I hope he's doing all right.

[16:55:03]

In the meantime, conspiracy theories have always been around but now, with social media, they reach millions. And it seems no one is immune. That's the subject of an all-new episode of "THIS IS LIFE."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LISA LING, CNN HOST, "THIS IS LIFE": These algorithms, can they be built to work differently to stop spreading information that is not true?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You'd have to agree on a source of truth then feed that truth into the algorithm. And then you'd have to tell the algorithm create engagement, meet the profit numbers, but do it without lying.

The reason that's not happening, in my view, is the incentives aren't there. Even though I believe it is within their capability.

LING: You mean that Facebook wouldn't make money?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They wouldn't make as much money.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: "THIS IS LIFE" with Lisa Ling airs tomorrow night at 10:00 on CNN.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)