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FL Surgeon General Under Fire for Refusing to Wear Mask in Office of Lawmaker with Breast Cancer; Interview with State Sen. Tina Polsky (D-Florida); Vaccine Mandate Protesters Stop Traffic in New York City; Jury Selection Begins in Trial over Deadly Far-Right Rally; Doctors Often Unaware of Only FDA-Authorized Early COVID Treatment; FDA Advisory Panel Meets Tomorrow to Discuss Pfizer Vaccines for Kids 5 to 11; Biden Touts Agenda as Democrats Close in on Economic Deal. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired October 25, 2021 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00]

ANA CABRERA, CNN HOST: In a letter, the Republican president of the Florida State Senate calls what the doctor did "unprofessional" and says it "will not be tolerated."

Adding, "The prayers of the entire Senate family are with Senator Polsky as she begins her treatment."

However, it shouldn't take a cancer diagnosis for people to respect each other's level of comfort with social interactions during a pandemic.

And the State Senator Tina Polsky is joining us now.

Thanks for being with us.

(CROSSTALK)

CABRERA: I heard that you started radiation therapy this week. How are you feeling today?

STATE SEN. TINA POLSKY (D-FL): Oh, thank you, Ana, for having me on.

I'm actually starting Wednesday. I had all the preparation procedures. So far, I'm feeling OK. And I'm hoping that it won't be too difficult during the radiation starting Wednesday.

CABRERA: Well, we are certainly wishing you the very best for your health and your strength and just giving you, you know, courage to go through that health ordeal.

Walk us through the moment Dr. Ladapo walked into your office without a mask on. What was going through your mind and what happened next?

POLSKY: So I was very concerned. He was there with two aides so there were three of them not wearing masks. And it's a very small waiting area in my office. And my office is not very large either. So before we started doing all of our advocacy and constituent meeting, we set up a system with requiring masks.

And I've been very strict with everyone who has come to my office. And I've had dozens and dozens of meetings. And we have a sign outside the door. And we have masks available.

And, you know, before I came back to Tallahassee for these committee meetings -- we had been up there for several months -- I had the cancer diagnosis.

And I knew I'd be meeting a lot of people in fulfilling my duties as a State Senator. So I wanted to do what I could to protect myself.

So we set up the mask policy. And absolutely nobody has ever refused me. This was the very first time,

So they are all standing around in my waiting room not wearing a mask and it became really uncomfortable and basically a negotiation happening and it went on way too long.

CABRERA: Wow. With you being immunocompromised, we know you're at higher risk for severe disease and death from COVID. You're also more likely to have a less robust response to the vaccine.

So his refusal to wear a mask seems not just careless but reckless and dangerous.

From what I understand, Dr. Dr. Ladapo, at one point, suggested that you have the meeting outside rather than him putting on a mask.

But what kind of reasoning did he give you as to why he simply would not put one on?

POLSKY: He said he doesn't do interviews with a mask on, and I said I can hear you perfectly. I've had many meetings here because I was wearing my mask.

And this was an interview. He needs to be confirmed by the Senate, if not this session, then the one next year. So he's going around to Senators trying to get our vote. And yet, he refused to wear a mask.

He wanted to kind of discuss, I think, the scientific or, in his case, unscientific ideas as to why outside was better and why he wouldn't wear a mask.

But I didn't want to engage in conversation because he wouldn't wear a mask.

So he was basically trying to have a meeting or a debate with me. All of us were standing there. There were five people.

I'm masked and my aide is masked and the three of them were not and it's a small space. So the whole thing became very uncomfortable.

He was trying to negotiate. He thought by suggesting outside he was giving me an accommodation. And I said, is there a reason you can't wear a mask, and he didn't give me one.

And I said I have a very serious medical condition. I have not come out publicly about my breast cancer diagnosis. And I told him that several times.

I'm like back up into my aide's office because I'm becoming really uncomfortable and he wanted to just keep discussing it.

And I think he was really just trying to have fun with me, as he said later on when he left office, and kind of push my buttons. I was really frustrated that he wouldn't respect my wishes.

I've never had a problem before. And I don't understand why as a doctor himself --

CABRERA: Yes.

POLSKY: -- as the current top medical professional in the state --

CABRERA: Right.

POLSKY: -- not to respect my wishes.

And that's what it's a matter of, respect. Not a lot to ask -- not too much to ask to wear a mask for 10 to 15 minutes.

CABRERA: And given his specific role, you're sharing actions that are anti-science and counter to what the medical community has outlined is important for COVID mitigation.

Words matter, too. And there's so much misinformation out there about COVID.

Dr. Ladapo also said this last week about COVID-19 vaccines.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. JOSEPH LADAPO, FLORIDA SURGEON GENERAL: The reality of what -- how safe these vaccines are is absolutely not public.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: And that's just not factually accurate.

The CDC have held several open meetings discussing vaccine safety and efficacy data. And there have been many studies published, all with the same conclusion that the vaccines are safe and are effective.

[13:35:03]

So Dr. Ladapo oversees the health guidance of the entire state of Florida. Why has the governor put this man in charge?

POLSKY: I wish I knew the answer to that.

But I can tell you, from that clip alone, my concern and the reason I came forward -- I really wasn't expecting this much publicity, nor did I seek it.

But there's another problem going on. Childhood vaccines are not keeping up to date with the normal routine that they are supposed to do. So discussions like that and words like that, as you said, matter.

So if he's being cautious about even taking any vaccine or stirring doubt in people, then children are not going to get their vaccines in due course.

And, again, he's in charge of all public health, not just COVID, and so what message are we sending?

I have no idea why this person was chosen, except for, you know, political points with people who don't believe in science.

And that's why I had to come out. Everyone had to know what kind of person he was to treat me this way and to not respect my wishes.

And this is a -- we're a community. We have to treat each other with respect and take care of each other. And it was the exact opposite experience that I had with him.

CABRERA: As we mentioned, the State Senate president, a Republican, and backing you up, essentially saying the same thing.

I understand that the doctor will need to be confirmed by the Senate to his position after his appointment. Should he be confirmed?

POLSKY: He should not be confirmed. And I'm so grateful to have the support, the bipartisan support of the Senate body.

There's only 40 us. And we do -- but we have political differences. We do really believe in each other and respect each other. And decorum and professionalism has always been at the heart of the Senate.

And I'm really proud to be a part of that. And I really thank the Senate president for having my back on this one.

CABRERA: Florida State Senator Tina Polsky, thanks so much for speaking with us. And we wish you a speedy and full recovery.

POLSKY: Thank you, Ana. Appreciate it.

CABRERA: Turning now to New York City. For the second straight day, people are protesting the city's vaccine mandate.

CNN's Brynn Gingras it is on scene where the crowd is marching on city hall.

Brynn, what are you seeing?

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We're seeing an enormous crowd all around us, Ana. City workers from all departments, the FDNY, the NYPD, Department of Sanitation, the Parks Department, and a number of different departments. And peoples in the thousands crossed over Brooklyn Bridge and are right here behind now at city hall. I'm going to get out of the way so you guys can get a look at this.

This all started a little bit earlier this afternoon. Of course, their deadline is by the end of this week to get that vaccine.

Remember, when the city announced this, they tried to sweeten the deal by telling workers that they will get a $500 incentive in order to get vaccinated, that first dose, or they are going to go own paid leave.

These people here, some of the people that we talked to, they say to us the issue isn't about the vaccine. The issue is about being told that they have to get the vaccine, which is something that we've heard echoed all across the country.

This is just an enormous crowd in lower Manhattan outside of city hall right now. They're in the street, saying to Mayor Bill de Blasio, we will not listen to you, we will not get the vaccine.

We're going to stay here and continue to report to you guys.

But this is, again, an incredible crowd of a number of city workers across all different departments, really voicing their thoughts on this vaccine -- Ana?

CABRERA: Brynn, thank you for that reporting.

[13:38:30]

Hate is on trial in Virginia. Four years after a deadly extremist rally in Charlottesville where people carried torches and chanted Jews will not replace us. This case, a big test on whether rally organizers will be held accountable. We're there live, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:43:38]

CABRERA: In Charlottesville, Virginia, jury selection is under way in a crucial domestic extremism trial stemming from the deadly Unite the Right rally that took place there in 2017.

This is a civil case. It's the most sweeping attempt yet to hold the organizers of that rally and associated white supremacist groups accountable financially.

CNN's Jason Carroll has details.

And a warning to our viewers, this report contains some graphic content.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CROWD: Jews will not replace us! JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Chilling

images from the night four years ago in Charlottesville, Virginia, where hundreds of Neo-Nazis and White Supremacists gathered for a Unite the Right rally.

(SHOUTING)

CARROLL: White Nationalists chanted anti-Semitic slogans during the march, which ended in violence and death.

Among those groups was James Alex Fields, now serving two life sentences.

(SCREAMING)

CARROLL: He was convicted on state charges, including murder and federal hate crime charges, for deliberately driving his car into counter protestors. He injured more than two dozen people and killed one, 32-year-old Heather Heyer.

But some argue there is still more justice to be served.

AMY SPITALNICK, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, INTEGRITY FIRST FOR AMERICA: These defendants orchestrated the violence, came to Charlottesville to engage in the violence, and then celebrated the violence as a victory for their movement.

CARROLL: Amy Spitalnick is Executive Director of Integrity First for America. It's a nonprofit organization behind a civil suit underway in federal court.

[13:45:98]

Nine plaintiffs, who were injured four years ago, are suing the organizers of the rally for monetary damages, alleging, "Individuals and organizations that conspired to plan, promote, and carry out the violent events in Charlottesville."

"Conspired" is key as lawyers will be relying on a 150-year-old law known as the Ku Klux Klan Act. The law empowers victims of racial violence and civil rights violations to sue for damages if they can prove a conspiracy.

Plaintiffs say there is plenty of evidence showing conspiracy, including memes some of the defendants shared on social media ahead of the rally showing a car hitting protestors.

SPITALNICK: The mountain of evidence in this case makes crystal clear that it was planned meticulously.

CARROLL: Fields is one of 24 defendants named in the civil suit. The defendants include a number of hate groups such as the National Socialist Movement, a Neo-Nazi group.

An attorney representing that group says the plaintiffs' case is based on emotion and vengeance, but not evidence. Saying, "Plaintiffs have yet to produce a single piece of evidence to

support their claim of a conspiracy to commit violence in Charlottesville. If not for the fact that the defendants are mostly White Supremacists, the suit would have been dismissed years ago."

(SHOUTING)

CARROLL: Defendants argue they're protected by the First Amendment, that they were exercising their rights to free speech and assembly.

But some legal experts say that will be tough to prove in this case.

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: But when that protest turns into really, you know, an assault upon people of color, an assault upon members of the Jewish community, an assault upon people who really are just counter protesting and exercising their rights, you've gone too far.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CARROLL: And, again, this is a civil case, not a criminal case.

Basically, what the plaintiffs' attorneys are trying to do is to cripple financially the defendants as much as they can, bankrupt them if they can.

In fact, one of the defendants named in the civil suit, Richard Spencer, who coined the phrase Alt-Right, is actually in court right now representing himself. He says already the case has cost him thousands -- Ana?

CABRERA: Jason Carroll, thank you.

It's the only FDA-authorized treatment for early COVID-19, but some doctors aren't mentioning it to patients. CNN investigates, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:52:33]

CABRERA: Monoclonal antibody treatment, it is the only FDA-authorized treatment for early COVID-19 infection. But many patients who might need it say the doctors never mention it.

CNN senior medical correspondent, Dr. Elizabeth Cohen, has been investigating this.

Elizabeth, it has been a year now since antibodies were first authorized by the FDA. Why aren't doctors recommending it for patients that qualify?

DR. ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Ana, we don't know the answer to that. So many patients we talked to and doctors said a lot of doctors just aren't getting the message that these antibodies could mean the difference between life and death. I want to introduce you to Mira Arana (ph). She's a mom and wife in

California. And she got leukemia. She's recovering from leukemia. Then she caught COVID.

She called her family doctor who knows that she's immune compromised because of her leukemia, and he told her to go home and rest as much as she could.

She got worse. And she happened to call her oncologist, who said you should be getting antibodies. She got antibodies and she's doing quite well, recovered from the COVID just fine.

That's just one story but there are actually large-scale clinical trials that show that monoclonal antibodies can dramatically reduce the risk of hospitalization or death.

Let's talk a little bit about who they are for. They're for people like Mira (ph), who is in the first 10 days of the illness of early COVID.

They're immunocompromised or they have a medical condition. For example, maybe they are overweight. Or it can also be used to prevent infection after exposure.

Again, only for certain people, but people who have been exposed to COVID and want to make sure they don't get infected and sick.

And also for Regeneron, which is one of the brands of antibodies for immune-compromised people who did not respond to vaccination, monoclonal antibodies can be used, in effect, instead of vaccination because it didn't work for them.

As far as why exactly this is happening, there seems to be a real communication problem. Also, even once patients know about antibodies, they could be so hard to find.

There are places like, say, the Mayo Clinic in Minnesota that are doing large numbers. But then there are also other major well- resourced hospitals that are hardly doing any monoclonal antibody treatments at all.

Dr. Fauci has implored doctors and hospitals to make better use of this medicine.

One doctor we talked to, he said the whole situation is unconscionable that these medicines are out there and they're not always getting to the people that need them -- Ana?

[13:55:06]

CABRERA: Elizabeth Cohen, thank you.

Let's get more on the latest developments in the fight against COVID.

Joining us now, Dr. Richina Bicette-McCain. Dr. Bicette, I want to get your reaction to Elizabeth's reporting. The doctors are not recommending this monoclonal antibody treatment, a treatment that works.

DR. RICHINA BICETTE-MCCAIN, MEDICAL DIRECTOR, BAYLOR COLLEGE OF MEDICINE: I'm not sure if doctors are not recommending it because they are against the treatment or because they just aren't sure how to get the treatment for their patients.

This is a little bit different than just writing a prescription for a pill that you could go pick up at a pharmacy.

These treatments are I.V. infusions. They take two to three hours at a time. And they're typically done in specialized setting. So doctors have to have access to send their patients to get treatment.

CABRERA: The FDA advisory panel meets tomorrow to discuss whether Pfizer's vaccine should be authorized for children ages 5 to 11.

Listen to what Dr. Fauci said over the weekend about vaccines for this younger age group.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY & INFECTIOUS DISEASES: So if all goes well, and we get the regulatory approval, and the recommendation from the CDC. It is entirely possible, if not very likely, that vaccines will be available for children from 5 to 11 within the first week or two of November.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: That could be as soon as next week.

Yet, there are still patients and parents who are worried that not enough is known about this vaccine and they're questioning whether they should get their kids vaccinated.

What do you say to those parents?

BICETTE-MCCAIN: Absolutely. The American Academy of Pediatrics continuously reported data. And for the week --

(CROSSTALK)

CABRERA: Forgive me. Let's listen in to the president speaking in New Jersey.

(APPLAUSE)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Lieutenant commander.

(LAUGHTER)

BIDEN: Well, Governor Murphy, so many national challenges we're confronting are areas where's you're already leading. And that is not hyperbole.

And whether it is making health care or preschool or college more affordable, providing paid family leave, and replacing lead in pipes and protecting public health.

So thanks for showing the way, pal. Thanks for showing the way.

(APPLAUSE)

BIDEN: It is also good to meet my old friends, a lot of my friends in Congress.

But, Bill, you and I have been doing this a long time, pal. Thanks for the passport back in New Jersey in your district.

(LAUGHTER)

BIDEN: And Josh Gottheimer has been the best go between I've had trying to get all this done, whether it is the Build Back Better portion or the infrastructure portion.

And Tom Malinowski has done a hell of a job. And Don Cain (ph) and Frank Malone (ph).

And I keep telling them, Frank, remind them, we've been doing things together a long time.

I know Delaware is small. I know how important New Jersey is. But Delaware owns the Delaware River up to the high-water mark in New Jersey.

(LAUGHTER)

BIDEN: So you know what I mean?

(LAUGHTER)

BIDEN: And one of my favorite members of Congress, who I campaigned for, and she won in spite of it, Mikie Sherrill, lieutenant commander, United States Navy, naval graduate, Georgetown Law. Incredible person.

And I want to acknowledge both Senators Booker and Menendez, who represent you so well in Washington. And they're down there trying to get this all moving.

I'm here today to talk about what is fundamentally at stake for the families of New Jersey, the whole region here, and for our country.

For most of the 20th century, we led the world by significant margin, not just led the world but by significant margin. because we invested in ourselves, we invested in our people.

Not only in our roads and our highways and our bridges and -- but in our people and our families.

We're among the first to provide access to free education, 12 years of free education for all -- anyone who is an American, beginning back in the late 1800s and the early 1900s.

And that decision to invest in our children and our families was a major part, a major part of why we were able to lead the world for so much of the 20th century.

But somewhere along the way, we took our eyes off the ball. Our infrastructure used to be the best in the world. Not hyperbole, but the best in the world.

Today, according to World Economic Forum, we rank 13th in the world. Twelve other nations have superior infrastructure to us. And China has trains that go 230 miles per hour for long distances.

And we got money to do that back in the administration of Barack Obama and Joe Biden. And you had a Republican governor who didn't want it. Didn't want any parts of it.

[13:59:54]

So we used to lead the world in educational achievement. Now the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development ranks America 35 out of 37 countries when it comes to investing in early childhood education and care, 35 out of 37.