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Interview With Houston Mayor Sylvester Turner About The Astroworld Stampede Accident; Eyewitness Recounts The Tragedy At The Festival; U.S. Opening To Vaccinated International Travelers Tomorrow; Why Critical Race Theory Has Become So Politicized; Iraqi Prime Minister Survives Exploding Drone Attack; Democrats Blame Infrastructure Bill Delay For Virginia Governor Loss. Aired 7-8p ET

Aired November 07, 2021 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[19:00:03]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILLY NASSER, ATTENDED ASTROWORLD FESTIVAL: People were getting trampled. They're losing their balance and then tripping over the people on the floor. And people were just dying left and right.

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A death trap. That's one man's description of the deadly surge at a Houston music festival. Tonight new questions about crowd control at the venue.

SEN. TIM KAINE (D-VA): We are going to get these bills done. They're great for every zip code in this country.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A vast majority of Americans are not for the second bill.

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: After passing the bipartisan infrastructure bill, Democrats move full steam ahead on their bold social spending plan. But Republicans aren't on board.

MUSTAFA AL-KADHIMI, IRAQI PRIME MINISTER (through translator): The cowardly missiles and drones do not build our countries nor our future.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Iraq's prime minister vowing to punish those responsible after he escaped an explosive laden drone attack inside the Green Zone.

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Midnight Monday Canadian and Mexican citizens finally able to come into the United States for non- essential travel after more than 19 months of restrictions.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: I'm Pamela Brown in Washington. You are in the CNN NEWSROOM on this Sunday evening.

And we begin tonight with the tragedy in Texas. Two teenagers are among the eight people killed in a sudden and massive human stampede at a music festival in Houston. Many more are injured after fans rushed the stage during a performance by rapper Travis Scott at the Astroworld Music Festival in Houston.

Video from the sold-out event shows the moment Travis Scott pauses and looks on in confusion as an ambulance moves into the packed crowd of about 50,000 fans. Witnesses describe the crush of people squeezing against them, leaving them with nowhere to go.

And I'm going to be bringing in Mayor Sylvester Turner to talk about this. He is in Houston.

I know things have been just rapidly unfolding for you, Mayor, since this tragedy happened. If you could, bring us up to date with the latest of what we know, how did this happen?

MAYOR SYLVESTER TURNER (D), HOUSTON, TEXAS: Well, that's the question that we're working feverishly to determine. We want to look at every single detail, looking at the site plans, the security plans, talking with the producers of this concert, Live Nation. We want to visit with as many witnesses or if people have any information, please call that information in to the Houston Police Department.

We are waiting for the medical examiner's report, but that is a question. We want to know what happened, how it happened, and to make sure that we have all the details such that this will not happen again. But right now, we're focused on these families. As you indicated, eight persons lost their lives, so we are praying for their family members. There are still two individuals who are critical, in critical condition in our hospitals. So we're are praying for all of them.

BROWN: Police have put out a picture of one of the victims who had not been identified, asking for the public's help. Do you know if they have received any more information about him and who he may be?

TURNER: And the answer is yes, that person has now been identified and contact has been made with his family. And again, we want to offer as much support to all of these families, whether it's counselling, whatever assistance we can offer. We're certainly offering our prayers. But in addition to our prayers, we want to provide them with whatever assistance they need because this is a permanent loss for them.

And even if you lose one person, and one person dies, that's one too many. So our hearts and prayers and thoughts go out to all of these family members, but we want to offer to them any support that we can.

BROWN: And Mayor Turner, CNN just confirmed that the performer at the time of the stampede, Travis Scott, as well as the concert promoter and Live Nation, are all now being sued. They cite negligence and failure to properly plan and secure the festival. Will your office be involved in this lawsuit?

TURNER: We are involved in the investigation of this manner, as you know. There's a criminal investigation that is under way at this point in time. Look, we don't want to leave any detail unreviewed. So we want to look

at every single thing. I will tell you that my team met today, this morning, reviewing, starting to review a detailed review of everything that has taken place. It will take probably weeks if not longer. And I'm sure that what took place will be looked at from many different angles. As well as it should be. So this investigation is very active.

[19:05:03]

It's very early. There's a lot that we need to know. But we want to make sure, and we owe it to the families and everyone else to have all of the details as it relates to this incident.

BROWN: Mr. Mayor, this venue and the crowds that arrived on Friday was never in complete control. I mean, we're seeing video of the entrance gates being overrun. The metal detectors destroyed. Security guards overwhelmed. This is that video on our viewers' screens.

Who are you going to hold accountable for this? Was that breach of the entrance gates not a warning of what might happen later?

TURNER: That was an initial breach that morning, that breach was fixed. This is the third time that the Astroworld Fest has taken place in the city of Houston. On this particular -- for this particular concert, the security was beefed up. We had over 500 Houston police officers at that event. In addition, the private security, there were over 700 private security, significantly more than what existed in 2019.

But look, we owe it to every single concertgoer to do everything, all of those, all of the stakeholders, to do everything that we can to make sure that this is a safe venue for those who come, regardless of their ages. This is a concert. There are certain things that you should anticipate. And so we owe it to each and every one of them to make sure that this setting is as safe as possible.

And that's why we are determined to look at every single detail to make sure that no stone is left unturned and to make sure that we can answer what happened, how it happened, where there were shortcomings and what we need to do going forward to make sure that an incident of this kind does not happen again in this city.

BROWN: Do you have any update on what we learned yesterday about the security guard who apparently was pricked in the neck and had to be revived with Narcan, and whether there was a larger situation going on where someone was going around and injecting people with drugs? Can you give us any update on that?

TURNER: That is still under review. Look, anything that we hear, anything that is reported to us, we are going to follow it to the very end. And that's why we encourage people, if you have any information, please provide that information and we will track it down. So whatever we are hearing, we're going to follow through on it to check it out, to verify it, to see whether or not that in fact was the case.

And I suspect this investigation will go in many different directions, as we look for all possible answers to determine what took place on Friday night.

BROWN: And just last question for you, you said this was the third time that Astroworld Festival had been held there. If it continues, will you allow it to be held in Houston in the future? And what are you going to do to make sure that other festivals being held at that venue, that the same thing doesn't happen?

TURNER: Well, right now, that's highly premature. My focus right now and the focus of others in the city, to make sure that the families of those who have lost loved ones, that their needs are being met, that we provide all the support services for them. In addition to our prayers that they need. That's number one. The second is to those who remain in the hospital, to make sure that they get all the care that they need, in addition to our prayers. So that's number two.

And then thirdly, it's important for us to answer the question, what happened, why did it happen, how did it happen, whether or not there were any shortcomings, and then how can we best proceed going forward. Once we have done that, then we can make a determination as to what will happen, you know, next year and down the road.

BROWN: OK. Houston Mayor Sylvester Turner, thanks for joining the show and for your time tonight.

TURNER: Thank you for having me. Thank you.

BROWN: I want to bring in an eyewitness to the tragedy that unfolded. Reese Bludau was a concertgoer at the Astroworld Music Festival.

Reese, thanks for joining us.

REESE BLUDAU, EYEWITNESS, ASTROWORLD MUSIC FESTIVAL: Thank you for having me.

BROWN: Just the stories coming out from the concertgoers have just been so awful. I mean, there's no word in the vocabulary to describe, you know, what people are conveying. Tell us what you went through when you were there, and we're seeing video here at the concert. What did you go through?

BLUDAU: So initially when I got there, things were pretty erratic, but I guess typical for a music festival. But once Travis Scott came out, about 45 minutes before his set is when I knew things were getting a little bit edgier. I mean, it was definitely getting pretty tight.

[19:10:01]

And I knew anyone who was a smaller person was going to be definitely struggling to breathe and just maintain their space. It was definitely chaos, and about midway through is when I really started to notice some circles forming, people giving CPR erratically. I saw a lot of distraught faces. And it's definitely a very scary time.

I myself, I felt pretty comfortable, but I knew a lot of people around me were very much on edge. It was pure chaos, if that's the word I could use. BROWN: So why did you feel comfortable? Like what was it about the

situation where you weren't necessarily concerned for your safety, but you knew that there was essentially a crisis unfolding?

BLUDAU: I knew there was a crisis unfolding. I had, you know, you had people shifting around you the whole time. And I kind of was, every time I would see some new face, I'm like hey, we got each other, like don't let anybody fall because once somebody falls, it's very hard to get them back up because that space would just fill in.

I'm a little taller so I was able to look up and breathe, and get a free nose. It was cold air, it's was actually a pretty good weather weekend. But being able to look up and catch a fresh breath was definitely a huge factor. I just told myself to stay calm and make sure I could try to keep other people up and not get in the way. It's almost hard, you don't want to get up because then you might cause more damage and more people falling. So you just had to stay and remain calm was my main goal.

BROWN: It's just fascinating. I mean, because of your height, you were able to breathe. Right? But if you were shorter, we keep hearing from some of the concertgoers, they couldn't breathe. And they were panicking. How much of the crowd in that area do you think was oblivious to the crisis that was unfolding? Because, you know, in a lot of these concerts, it does get pretty rowdy, and people are pushing into each other.

Can you just help paint a picture of what it was like and what the crowd, how much of the crowd was sort of oblivious to this?

BLUDAU: I would say probably about 60 percent of the crowd was potential oblivious. I looked at some shots. There was a lot, I ended up actually getting pretty close when I look back at the film I had. I'd say about 60 percent to 70 percent were oblivious. Definitely a majority started to notice later in the concert. You would hear chants, I was right next to a pretty strong chant of, stop the show and help us. People screaming.

I mean, it was streaming on Apple Music and you could hear in between songs some distraught noises. Definitely were suspect.

BROWN: Reese Bludau, thank you for coming on, for sharing your experience with us.

BLUDAU: Thank you so much. Condolences to all the families, and prayers.

BROWN: Absolutely. Our condolences for sure.

And starting tomorrow, the U.S. will open its land borders to vaccinated international travelers. The policy change affects nonessential visitors, and the border communities that they'll travel through, which were hit particularly hard during the coronavirus pandemic.

Let's go now to one of those communities. CNN's Priscilla Alvarez is in El Paso, Texas.

So, Priscilla, how will this work?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, starting tomorrow, more people will be allowed to come into the United States via land crossings like the one behind me, as these restrictions are eased. And to do so, travelers will have to have a couple items. Primarily, proof of vaccination. That can be digital or paper. Now, as far as what vaccines the U.S. is accepting, they say they accept FDA and WHO authorized or approved vaccines.

Now children under the age of 18 will be exempt from these vaccination requirements and COVID tests will not be required. That is different from air travel passengers who will need to have COVID tests.

Now U.S. Customs and Border Protection is anticipating longer wait times and larger travel volumes as this kicks up tomorrow. But the overall consensus from border mayors is that this is a positive development.

Representative Veronica Escobar of Texas who represents El Paso told me it is a, quote, "long awaited day." So a positive day ahead, many hope, as they start to bolster up their economies -- Pamela.

BROWN: Priscilla Alvarez, thank you so much.

And tonight, Iraq's prime minister vowing to punish his attackers after surviving an assassination attempt using drones rigged with explosives.

Also ahead this hour, Democrats taking that bruising loss in Virginia as a major learning lesson ahead of the midterms.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAINE: I think Congressional Dems just blew the timing of the infrastructure and work force and education bills. Bluntly we blew it.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: And pro-football star Terry Bradshaw rips into Aaron Rodgers for pretending he was vaccinated.

TERRY BRADSHAW, NFL HALL OF FAMER: We got players that pretty much think only about themselves, and I'm extremely disappointed in the actions of Aaron Rodgers.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:19:01]

BROWN: In Houston, Texas, police have launched a criminal investigation into the deaths of eight people at the Astroworld Music Festival.

The crushing sea of fans surged toward the stage on Friday night as rapper Travis Scott started to perform. Many fans trapped in the vice- like squeeze and unable to move as the air was squeezed out of their lungs. Some collapsed and were trampled.

Here you can see some people reaching into the crowd, trying to rescue others by pulling them over the barricade to safety.

On CNN a short time ago, we spoke to one woman who was grateful to be alive.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DANA SCHLOMOVITS, ATTENDED ASTROWORLD FESTIVAL: It was -- it was just terrifying. It was the only word I have to describe it. With everyone around us just trying to take each individual breath, and there was just no air left for anyone to breathe. We were too closely compact. Everyone was too pushed up against each other.

[19:20:04]

There was just nowhere to go and no air to breathe. I just started screaming, help, help, please help me. I can't breathe. And finally, some people around me told me they were going to pick me up and they just started saying crowd surf her to the medics.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: And joining me now, criminal and defense and constitutional law attorney Page Pate.

Page, good to see you. So we are just getting word in, the past few minutes, that a $1 million lawsuit has been filed against Travis Scott, Live Nation, and concert promoter Score More, following this tragedy. Surely more will follow.

What is the potential civil liability for these parties?

PAGE PATE, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Pamela, I think potentially these parties are liable for many millions of dollars, not just $1 million. In a case like this, I think it's going to be somewhat difficult to prove civil liability on behalf of Travis Scott himself, although he was clearly, I think, getting the crowd into this, engaging them, even when he should have had noticed that it was a very dangerous situation.

The concert promoter, I think, is also being targeted for civil liability. Live Nation, anyone who had any responsibility for either insuring security, crowd control, or on-site medical treatment and evaluation could potentially be liable. And they should expect that. I mean, this was a situation that perhaps you could have expected some sort of crowd interaction like this, but once it happens, you need to be able to take control.

This is not the first time they have had an incident at a Travis Scott event. They should have been ready for it. They should have expected it. And if they're not, they're going to be liable.

BROWN: You mentioned Travis Scott's behavior. He has a history of encouraging chaos at his shows, daring fans to rush past security barriers. Could he be criminally liable for egging fans into dangerous behavior?

PATE: I think he can, Pamela. I don't think this is the first time that someone has suggested that he could be criminally charged. But I think in the past, it's been more of, OK, this is disorderly conduct. This is some sort of a misdemeanor. But people died in Houston as a result of what happened at that festival, at that concert. And under Texas law, where this occurred, if you are reckless and cause someone's death, you have committed manslaughter.

If you are criminally negligent and cause someone's death, that's criminally negligent homicide. Those are serious charges that carry serious prison time. Now, the investigation is still early. Who knows what the facts are? But we all know a couple of things. One, it was a very dangerous situation. He should have been aware of it, and yet he continued to egg people on. That's negligent.

BROWN: He posted on his Instagram, and his Instagram story, talking about this. Just saying how horrible he felt, that he's trying to, you know, help authorities, that had he known the extent of it, he would have stopped everything. And you know, you've heard from performers that say, look, it can get rowdy at these concerts. Sometimes they, people pass out because they're overheated and so forth. And they may not understand the extent of it. Could that be a defense for him?

PATE: It can certainly be a defense up to a point. Yes, when you go to a Travis Scott concert, I assume you know you're going to be in a situation where there are crowds of people who get rowdy, who get inspired by the music and who may take it a step too far. But the issue here is, once that starts to happen, you have a responsibility to do something. And you don't wait until someone dies. You don't wait until people are trampled and then say, I'm very sorry.

The insurance company will pay you off. No, once this happens, you have a responsibility. This cannot be a surprise to Travis Scott based on the behavior of the crowd and based on his prior shows.

BROWN: All right, Page Pate, thank you so much.

PATE: Thank you.

BROWN: We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:28:20]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CECILY STRONG, "SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE": Critical race theory is something you talked about a lot. What is critical race theory?

ALEX MOFFAT, "SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE": Simple. It's what got me elected.

STRONG: Right. But what is it?

MOFFAT: It's not important. What's important is parents. Everyone knows they should run schools.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: "Saturday Night Live" having some fun there with a relatively recent rallying cry among conservatives. Loud voices on the right railing against critical race theory, demanding it be banned from public schools.

And it popped up a lot in the very close race for Virginia governor, but funny skits asides, it's true that many people struggle to put into words exactly what the words critical race theory mean. One basic definition is this, the theory that systemic racism is part of American society and challenges the beliefs that allow it to flourish.

Let me bring in CNN's Sara Sidner.

Sara, thanks for joining us tonight. Whenever critical race theory comes up, a lot of people tend to get wrong. Where does it exists if it does at all, what's the fact, what's the fiction here.

SARA SIDNER, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Here's what parents and folks in the community who show up to some of these school board meetings have been rallying about. They feel that critical race theory, which is something that, by the way, is generally taught at not just the higher education level, not just the university level, but actually in law school, is generally where critical race theory is taught and debated.

But they're worried that it is being taught in K-12. And the short answer to whether or not it is being taught widely in K-12 schools across America is no. It's not.

[19:30:00]

We have talked to several of these school districts, where some of these very volatile and sometimes violent school board meetings have occurred. And all of them have said, look, this is not a part of our curriculum.

However, there have been some schools who have taught things that parents didn't like when it came to diversity training and inclusion training. There have been some books that have been some books that have been recommended as extra reading that parents really saw as problematic, not just conservative parents but parents who are Democrats as well.

And the big worry here, and this is what's gotten everyone riled up, is -- the big worry from parents is are our children being taught that it's bad to be white, and if so, is that making our children who are white feel bad about their whiteness, something they cannot help, just like someone cannot help anything else that they are born into, any kind of ethnic background.

So, that's the underlying worry of all this, if you will, Pam.

BROWN: So, how did this become such a widespread issue, and energize so many against it?

SIDNER: Well, it's a really good question, and we went to find the answer to that. And it boils down to this one person, his name is Christopher Rufo, and we did a report that included him and we talked to him, but he basically was able to use the term, critical race theory, something that's generally taught in law school, and use it and make it a big tent about teaching about racism in America and whether or not racism is intrinsic and part of the American fabric or whether racism is something that can be solved. Here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: You tweeted that it is you are going to create something toxic when it comes to the way people think about critical race theory. That's what you yourself tweeted. Isn't that bad for America?

CHRISTOPHER RUFO, SENIOR FELLOW, THE MANHATTAN INSTITUTE: That's inaccurate. Critical race theory is intrinsically toxic. I'm merely revealing it. And I'm merely exposing it. And I'm merely creating a framework for people to understand it. But it's not that I have turned critical race theory toxic.

SIDNER (voice over): Good but that is not what he tweeted in March. His tweet, we have successfully frozen their brand, critical race theory, into the public conversation and are steadily driving up negative perceptions. We will eventually turn it toxic as we put all of the various cultural insanities under that brand category.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER (on camera): So you saw there what he tweeted. You saw him denying that he was trying to create this toxic scenario with critical race theory and dumping everything that people are afraid of into that, under that roof.

But then after he tweeted that, he actually ended up on Fox, and he talked directly to the president. He asked the president to immediately issue an executive order and get rid of what he called destructive and divisive ideology, and he was talking about critical race theory.

Not long after that, the president announced critical race theory and almost a couple weeks, a few weeks later, Trump did sign an executive order banning critical race theory trainings in the federal government.

So, he was able to really get the eye of the president on this issue. An issue many will argue isn't an issue. But now parents think it is, and they are extra concerned about what is being taught in schools.

I will tell you this. I have been to several of these board meetings, these school board meetings, and what is really fascinating is often the people who I talk to do not have children that are in the school district. They are citizens, they are certainly allowed to show up to these board meetings. But it is interesting that there is a confluence of a whole bunch of different people, and the parents that are there are truly concerned. I don't think that should be negated.

They are now looking deeply at what actually is being taught, but most school districts will tell you, this is not widespread if it is being taught, it certainly isn't being taught all over the United States.

BROWN: Sara Sidner, that is such important information, separating the fact from fiction on this issue. Thank you so much for coming on to break it down for us.

And up next, from the impact of suburban moms to the Trump factor.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Most people don't like him, but he's a wonderful guy. Okay, tall, rich, like my sons. Okay, Glenn, you like my son.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Please don't say that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: SNL has their funny take, but what really happens, explains what happened in Virginia's governor's race. Two great guests are here to discuss, up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:35:00]

BROWN: Well, tonight, global condemnation after an assassination attempt against the prime minister of Iraq. Iraqi military saying an explosive laden drone targeted his residence in Baghdad, the Iraqi government vowing to bring those responsible to justice, quote, criminal armed groups, a term that was used in the past to describe Iranian-backed militias.

The attack comes after weeks of rising tensions following the October 10th elections. President Biden today spoke out against the attack, saying those who carried it out, once identified, need to be held responsible. No one has claimed responsibility for the assassination attempt.

Startling election losses in Virginia and New Jersey serving as major warning signs to Democrats as they scramble to learn the lessons of Tuesday's election night bruising.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TIM KAINE (D-VA): I think congressional Dems just blew the timing of the infrastructure and workforce and education bills. Bluntly, we blew it.

[19:40:00]

RON KLAIN, WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: Well, look, I do think the voters sent a message on Tuesday. They wanted to see more action in Washington. They wanted to see things move more quickly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Joining us to discuss is Scott Jennings, Columnist at USA Today and former political adviser to Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, and Kurt Bardella, a former Republican turned Democrat, now an adviser to both the Democratic National Committee and Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee. Great to see you both, gentlemen. Thanks for making time for us tonight.

So, Kurt, let's start with you. Who bears the blame for what happened on Tuesday and how does the party move forward?

KURT BARDELLA, ADVISER, DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE: Well, I think that what we saw on Tuesday was an overall problem that Democrats have had, the big challenge when it comes to branding the Democratic Party and our policies.

For too long, we have allowed Republicans to hijack a number of issues, from infrastructure to the price tag, to the bill that just passed, to education, to the green new deal, to voting rights, you name it, Democrats have had a hard time getting their message out in a way that connects tangibly to everyday working Americans.

Hopefully, now, with the passage with this historic infrastructure bill, a bill that's also a jobs and economic growth-generating package, they can have the tangible deliverables to convey to the American people every single day between now and the midterms what they're doing for you.

The conversation about government overall, Pamela, has been so much framed in a way where it's what government is doing to you. Now, Democrats have a chance to talk about what government is doing for you and the ways it will tangibly and concretely and in a very real and impactful way have a positive impact on American people and their wallets.

BROWN: So, Scott, one of the big issues in the race in Virginia, as well know, is education, and you had Youngkin, among other things, pushing this idea of schools being overrun with critical race theory, which is not true, per CNN's fact check. That was not the case. Here is part of SNL's spoof of this last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Group of parents and I put together our list of books that should never be allowed in the classroom, Holes, sounds sexual, Pride and Prejudice, prejudice is fine, but pride is a term that has been co-opted by the gays, for some sort of Lady Gaga-themed movie parade. Invisible Man, what's he doing? Where is he? Can he see me in my home or what I Google? The Great Gatsby, too much jazz. Moby Dick, now that was is a toss-up. Title is dirty, love that the whale is white.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: So there is not evidence critical race theory has been explicitly taught with any frequency in Virginia public schools. Is this a case of Republican fear-mongering on this issue, Scott?

SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No, it's a case of Democrats fundamentally misunderstanding the voting electorate in Virginia. You had a bunch of parents who, A, spent 18 months with the schools closed, B, have to live through all of the COVID back and forth and the mandates, C, for the first time, I imagine a lot of parents are getting a real look at what their curriculum really is in the schools, and D, deciding to show up and ask some questions about it.

And Democrats essentially flipped them off and told them, we don't want you here, in some cases, they treated them like common criminals. Terry McAuliffe was campaigning with the head of the teachers union in the last week of the campaign. It was a big, hey, you don't belong here. We'll take it from here and parents don't like it.

Whether you call it critical race theory or whether you're just worried that teachers in classrooms are telling white kids, hey, there's something inherently wrong with you because of the color of your skin, or they're telling all students, hey, there's something inherently wrong with our country and its founding, that's what parents have questions about.

And let me tell you something. If Democrats want to make fun of parents for another year the way they made fun of them leading up to this election, they'll be even madder than they were last week and they'll vote in even bigger numbers and it will be an even bigger wipeout. So, by all means, American left, continue to make fun of parents who have questions about their schools. We'll see where it gets you in next November.

BROWN: And, Kurt, I spoke to several white suburban moms in Virginia who told me they do have valid issues, that there are valid issues with the education that their kids were receiving in Virginia that had nothing to do with critical race theory. And as I just pointed out, it is not taught with -- explicitly with frequency in Virginia schools. There were other issues they were concerned about, and they said, they told me they felt like Democrats were ignoring their concerns. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DANA JACKSON, VIRGINIA VOTER: Definitely the education, the learning loss was number one for me. Everything else was below that.

SHAWNNA YASHAR, VIRGINIA VOTER: Mandates and CRT did not influence my decision at all.

BROWN: How about for you, Sandra? KAY GREENWELL, VIRGINIA VOTER: No. Mine was all about the school closures. I know people that have those issues and voted accordingly, but for me, it was 100 percent the school closures and the learning loss.

BROWN: And you feel like even right now, not enough is being done to address their learning loss, and you view that as a crisis.

[19:45:03]

YASHAR: Yes. Our kids are in crisis. The learning loss is real. The slide is ridiculous.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: So the question to you, Kurt, is by reducing a lot of these concerns to Republicans just trying to stir up the culture war, are Democrats overlooking some legitimate concerns?

BARDELLA: Well, I don't think those things are mutually beneficial or exclusive here. I think that both things can actually be true. Democrats could have misread the trend on education, but there's zero doubt Republicans like Glenn Youngkin use the invented issue of critical race theory to try to scare the crap out of parents.

Hey, it clearly worked. There's no denying that. It's a playbook that Republicans have washed, rinsed and reused time and time again on a number of issues, using the issue of race as a weapon. It is pure racism masquerading as a policy debate because, as you pointed out, critical race theory is not taught in any K-12 school in America. There is no teacher out there that's trying to force people and students to think that there's something wrong with them because they're white.

But we also cannot ignore the reality that our country is founded by a bunch of white people, privileged rich white people, and that test colored the way that our system is set up, which is why there are so many blind spots in our education and justice system. This is just a reality. It's a fact. But there is truth to the reality, that Democrats need to understand how to talk to people about education.

And I want to tell you something. If in the aggregate, Republicans want to make every election going forward about education, about who is most interested in teaching our students, in funding our schools, in narrowing the achievement gap, we are happy to have that debate, because time and again, Republicans are the ones who have voted against measures that would improve education in America, that would pay teachers more.

BROWN: I got to get Scott in here to reply.

JENNINGS: Yes, listen, I don't have much to add because I'm for Kurt for Democrat National Committee spokesperson. I hope Kurt gets hired to say this over and over and over again. If you want to tell parents, hey, you're crazy, don't believe your own eyes. Don't believe it. By all means, go ahead. If you want to thrown it in with Randi Weingarten and close on the school book, by all means, go ahead.

BARDELLA: (INAUDIBLE). Do not misrepresent what I said.

BROWN: Stop, really quick. Kurt, hold that one second. I'll give you a second to say your piece. Really quick, Scott, are you wrapping up because I have to get Kurt in to respond to that?

JENNINGS: Hey, here's the deal. Republicans, for the first time, in my political career figured out that education matters to voters and they were able to talk about it in a way that met voters where they were. Democrats, on the other hand, figured out how to throw in with the teachers union and all the education people who want parents to be treated like common criminals at school board meetings. And we saw where the voters lined up.

Pam, you just interviewed a bunch of moms who were ultra concerned. And whether you have a kid in the school system or not, if you're a taxpayer or just a citizen, you have a right to know what's going on in these schools, what's going on in classrooms and are we teaching kids things that shouldn't be taught.

BROWN: Quickly, I have to get Kurt in because we're all running out of time. Kurt?

Scott made some serious claims there, so go ahead. Kurt?

BARDELLA: Well, Scott unsurprisingly is lying and misrepresenting what I said. No one in the Democratic Party is saying teachers can't be involved in education. No one in the Democratic Party is saying that teachers --

JENNINGS: Terry McAuliffe said it explicitly.

BARDELLA: And, oh, by the way, last time I checked, it's Ted Cruz that's picking a fight with Big Bird right now if you want to have a great education debate. You want to have that one? Let's do it all day long.

JENNINGS: Relax, Kurt, everybody knows what happened on Tuesday.

BROWN: Fact check, true, and you can't say that's wrong, Scott. He is picking a fight with Big Bird. Man, all right, we're out of time, wish we had longer. But you guys will be invited back. That was a really interesting discussion. Scott Jennings, Kurt Bardella, thank you.

And we'll be right back.

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[19:50:00]

BROWN: The new CNN original series Diana takes a fresh look at the modern woman behind the people's princess. And this week, we find out what happens when Diana and Charles' troubled marriage finally comes to an end.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JULIE MONTAGU, VISCOUNTESS HITCHINGBROOKE BROADCASTER: One person, Diana, took on the royal family and now she needs to take a step back and figure it out.

RICHARD KAY, JOURNALIST AND HUSBAND: Diana was even more isolated after her divorce. She hadn't just lost the royal family and her ex- husband but the whole backup, the palace machinery. The one saving grace, if you'd like, for her was, of course, William and Harry. But when they were not around, she was quite alone.

PATRICK JEPHSON, DIANA'S PRIVATE SECRETARY: She would go back to the palace and there would be nobody there to welcome her home, to say, well done or let me pour you a drink.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She'd lost her sense of trust in security.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Joining us now is Rachel Bowie, Host of the Royally Obsessed podcast. Hi, good to see you, thanks for coming on.

So, this week, we see Diana and Charles finally agreeing to get divorced. What changed for Diana once her marriage was over?

RACHEL BOWIE, HOST, ROYALLY OBSESSED PODCAST: So, when Diana finalized her divorce agreement, she walked away with a few different pros. For one thing, she was able to maintain her residency at Kensington Palace. She also was given about $20 million as part of her divorce agreement.

And she was allowed to continue be an active player in the upbringing of her boys, William and Harry. But one of the biggest blows for Diana was the loss of her HRH title. That was her status. It meant that, going forward, she would have to courtesy to her boys, William and Harry,

In addition to that, she also was feeling incredibly isolated and lonely. She was newly single. She was figuring out what was ahead for her and she knew she had a lot to prove.

[19:55:03]

BROWN: So, as an estranged member of the royal family, Diana really embraces the role of humanitarian activist. How does she do that and what is she able to accomplish?

BOWIE: Well, what is fascinating to me is that Diana never played it safe. She causes that were t controversial, unfashionable even. For example, when she traveled to Angola with the Red Cross and walked through a field of landmines, it was Diana getting too political, too progressive, but Diana was adamant that this was all a part of her humanitarian work. She knew that wherever she went, the cameras would follow and she used to that to her advantage.

At the time, someone was injured or killed by a landmine every 20 minutes. Diana likely saved hundreds of thousands of people with her activism work. She really invented the role of celebrity activist.

BROWN: The media, however, as we know, was a double-edged sword. And while she courted them to support her humanitarian causes, they wanted access to everything, including her personal and dating life.

BOWIE: Yes. At the time, Diana quickly realized that she couldn't have it both ways, unfortunately. She would call the press about her humanitarian philanthropic work but she was devastated by the attention she got over her personal and dating life.

The media had actually had an obsession with her love life, so much so that when she started dating a Hasnat Khan, a Pakistani heart surgeon, she really felt like she had finally found true love and happiness but the media would not leave her alone. The attention was too much. And it ended up resulting in the end of their relationship.

The media just up until the end, as soon as she started dating Dodi Al-Fayed really in the last four weeks of her life, she really had no protection from the paparazzi at all.

BROWN: Rachel Bowie, thank you so much. And the all-new episode of the new original series, Diana, airs tonight at 9:00 Eastern and Pacific only on CNN.

Well, NFL Hall of Famer Terry Bradshaw is slamming Aaron Rodgers and dishing out some advice to him, don't lie. The Steelers legend is calling out the Green Bay Packers quarterback for misleading fans about his vaccination status.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TERRY BRADSHAW, NFL HALL OF FAMER: I'd give Aaron Rodgers some advice. It would have been nice if he'd just come to the naval academy and learn how to be honest.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

BRADSHAW: Learn not to lie, because that's what you did, Aaron, you lied to everyone.

We are a divided nation politically. We're a divided nation on the COVID-19, whether or not to take the vaccine and, unfortunately, we got players that pretty much think only about themselves, and I'm extremely disappointed in the actions of Aaron Rodgers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Rodgers, who has tested positive for COVID and missed today's game against the Kansas City Chiefs, had claimed back in August that he was immunized and now blames the, quote, woke mob for the backlash that he has gotten. The reason he got that backlash is because of his own words and actions, just to set the record straight.

Thank you so much for joining me this evening. I'm Pamela Brown. I'll see you again next weekend.

Up next, the CNN original series, "DIANA."

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