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Parents Of School Shooting Suspect Arrested After Manhunt; Chilling Red Flags Before High School Shooting; Parkland Dad Demands Meeting With Biden Over Gun Control Promises; U.S. Intel: Russia Gathering Up To 175K Troops On Ukraine Border & Biden Administration Warns Russia; Interview With Dr. Tom Frieden, Former CDC Director; Fauci Responds To FOX Host Comparing Him To Nazi Doctor. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired December 04, 2021 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:00]

JIM ACOSTA, CNN HOST: They're now charged with four counts of involuntary manslaughter. A judge setting bond at a half million dollars each after officials say the Crumbleys tried to run, turned off their phones and withdrew $4,000 from an ATM. Their son, Ethan, is accused of killing four students and injuring seven others.

And while parents in the U.S. are rarely charged for shootings carried out by their children, the prosecutor says the Crumbleys committed egregious acts from buying a gun on Black Friday to resisting his removal from school on the day of the tragedy. Even when they were confronted with the drawing their son made with a message blood everywhere and the thoughts won't stop, help me.

CNN national correspondent Athena Jones is following the story.

Athena, take us through how the Crumbleys were captured. This was some dramatic stuff overnight and this arraignment that just happened earlier today.

ATHENA JONES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Sure. Hi, Jim. Well, we know the Crumbleys were found in the wee hours of last night in essentially a warehouse in Detroit and we're getting some new reporting and a few more details from my colleague Mark Morales about that arrest. We know the Crumbleys were found inside an art studio on the third floor.

We also know that Detroit Police are interested in what they are calling a person of interest. An unknown person who helped guide the Crumbleys' car into the parking space at that building and we believe helped them gain access to the building.

We're also learning that the Crumbleys arrived at that warehouse during daylight hours. So they were scheduled to be arraigned at 4:00 p.m. The sun set at around 5:00 p.m. yesterday. We know certainly before sunset that the Crumbleys had arrived at that building. But as you mentioned they were found overnight and arraigned this morning.

The prosecutor, the Oakland County prosecutor, Karen McDonald, explaining why in this very rare occurrence, she's going to be bringing charges against the parents of this high school shooting suspect because she believes they were criminally negligent. They missed warnings or ignored warnings that their son Ethan Crumbley was potentially going to carry out a violent act. Listen to some of what she said in this morning's arraignment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAREN MCDONALD, PROSECUTOR, OAKLAND COUNTY, MICHIGAN: Both defendants were aware that he was searching ammunition on his phone at school. Instead of reacting to that as a concerned parent and worried about safety, Mrs. Crumbly texted, "LOL, I'm not mad, just the next time don't get caught."

And then obviously on this very tragic day on the 30th, they were called to the school about their son's drawing, which clearly depicted threats and acts of violence, and instead of disclosing to the school that he had full access to this weapon, they chose not to. Chose not to take their son home. They chose not to tell anybody that he might be dangerous when it was clear and they had every likelihood that he was, and instead they left.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

JONES: And said they left and soon after is when Ethan Crumbley allegedly began shooting, killing four teenage students. This prosecutor saying these parents were criminally negligent. If they had taken the action they should have, they could have saved these four teenagers' lives -- Jim.

ACOSTA: And Athena, what was the argument from the defense today?

JONES: Well, interestingly, the lawyers for Jennifer and James Crumbley argued that they were never trying to escape. They were always planning to turn themselves in. Listen to some of what one of their lawyers said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHANNON SMITH, ATTORNEY FOR JENNIFER AND JAMES CRUMBLEY: Last night and throughout the day, we were in contact with our clients. They were scared. They were terrified. They were not at home. They were figuring out what to do, getting finances in order. This case is absolutely the saddest, most tragic, worst case imaginable. There is absolutely no doubt. But our clients were absolutely going to turn themselves in. It was just a matter of logistics and all the prosecution had to do was communicate with me about it.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

JONES: So that's what we're hearing from the Crumbleys' lawyer. This was all about miscommunication. Of course the Oakland County prosecutor saying while they withdrew $4,000 from an ATM very near where they were meant to turn themselves in. So clearly the just, listening really to the prosecutor, setting $500,000 bond for each of them, Jennifer Crumbley and for James Crumbley. Both of them entering not guilty pleas on all four counts of involuntary manslaughter -- Jim.

ACOSTA: A heck of a miscommunication that's at issue here.

All right, Athena Jones, thank you very much. As Athena mentioned, there were a lot of red flags, too many regular flags on the days before the deadly shooting at Oxford High School. CNN's Tom Foreman takes us through it.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Before the gunfire, the terrified students, police and ambulances, there were warnings.

MCDONALD: There was absolute reason to believe this individual was dangerous and disturbed.

[15:05:04]

FOREMAN: Authorities suggest the immediate trouble starts November 26th, when James Crumbley takes his 15-year-old son, Ethan, to buy a Sig Sauer 9-millimeter pistol at a local gun shop. Although the dad fills out the paperwork, the son posts a picture on social media.

MCDONALD: Along with the caption, "Just got my new beauty today."

SHERIFF MICHAEL BOUCHARD, OAKLAND COUNTY, MICHIGAN: No, no. Legally that's not his.

FOREMAN: The sheriff says by law the gun can't actually belong to the boy, raising key questions.

BOUCHARD: Was it given to him? Was it allowed to be picked up and taken freely at his discretion? Or was it stolen?

FOREMAN: November 27th, prosecutors say the mother, Jennifer, posts, "Mom and son day testing out his new Christmas present." November 29th, a teacher reports the boy is searching for ammunition on his cell phone in class. Officials say the school calls and e-mails the mom. No response. But Jennifer texts her son, "LOL, I'm not mad at you. You have to learn not to get caught." The next day another teacher sees the boy with a note.

MCDONALD: A drawing of a semiautomatic handgun pointing at the words, quote, "The thoughts won't stop. Help me," end quote. In another section of the note was a drawing of a bullet with the following words above that bullet, quote, "Blood everywhere," end quote.

FOREMAN: There is also, prosecutors say, a drawing of a bloody body, the words, "My life is useless. The world is dead." Shortly after 10:00 am, officials say his parents come to a meeting at the school, are told their son must get counseling, but they resist taking him out of school, don't mention the new gun and the boy returns to class. His parents leave.

BOUCHARD: We have to believe that he had the weapon either on his person in his backpack or somewhere secreted in that travel route. FOREMAN: Just before 1:00 pm, investigators say Ethan goes into a

bathroom with his backpack, comes out, gun in hand, firing. Four students were killed, seven wounded. He is apprehended minutes later. At 1:22, officials say, his mother texts, "Ethan, don't do it." His father --

MCDONALD: Upon hearing that there was an active shooter on that day, Mr. Crumbley drove straight to his home to look for his gun.

FOREMAN: 1:37, the dad calls 911 to report his gun missing and to say his son may be involved. But in the wake of the note just hours before the violence, officials clearly thought there should have been more.

MCDONALD: The notion that a parent could read those words and also know that their son had access to a deadly weapon that they gave him is unconscionable. And I think it's criminal.

FOREMAN (on-camera): Of course there are questions about whether school officials acted properly. But the prosecutor says simply anyone who saw the warning signs, who could have stopped this, should have done something.

Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ACOSTA: And let's discuss with former FBI deputy director, Andrew McCabe. He's also a CNN senior law enforcement analyst.

Andrew, so many red flags that were just missed and it's heartbreaking. Ethan Crumbley's parents pleaded not guilty to involuntary manslaughter charges this morning, but they missed their initial arraignment yesterday. Police say they were found hiding in a warehouse overnight after an hours long manhunt. They turned off their phones.

Law enforcement analyst says they withdrew thousands of dollars from an ATM, and yet the defense was claiming there was a miscommunication, I guess, or something. You know, and that's why they didn't appear at their arraignment. I mean, that happens after you withdraw $4,000? What's going on here, Andrew? What do you think?

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: I don't know, Jim, I think it's hard to communicate effectively when you're hiding in a warehouse and you turn your phone off. So, I think, look, from the law enforcement perspective, and I say this as someone who's, you know, been involved in and overseen many, many manhunts for different people, as soon as there's a warrant for your arrest, and that warrant, you have any reason to know that that warrant is out there and you are not in custody, you're considered to be a fugitive.

That's clearly what they were. Taking money out, turning off your phone, leaving town, hiding in a warehouse where you don't live, those are all things equal you are fleeing from law enforcement. It's also very easy, after the fact, to say oh, I was going to turn myself in when you didn't do that. They didn't need an appointment with the prosecution. They could have

rolled into any police precinct in Oakland County, and said, hey, we heard you're looking for us. That's what people who aren't running from the law do. So I think to the arguments today were a little hollow.

ACOSTA: Yes. And the fact is there were warning signs as Tom Foreman was just laying out a few moments ago.

[15:10:01]

One teacher reported that Ethan was searching for ammo on his phone the day before the shooting. There was that disturbing drawing showing a person being shot with the words, blood everywhere, which was reported by a separate teacher on the day of the shooting. At what point do these teachers just need to bang on the principal's door and say, you know, call the cops, this is out of control? Or are we sort of in a murky area where it is difficult to make that call?

MCCABE: I don't think that it's that murky. You know, especially in a situation like this where you had a sheriff's deputy, a police presence in the school as a resource officer for presumably exactly that reason. It's hard for me to understand how having been rightly concerned about his behavior and about his searches for ammunition and about this note with all this disturbing stuff on it, it's hard for me to understand why they didn't at least let the resource officer know, whose job is to be there and to assist in the security precautions in the school, hey, we might have an issue with this young man.

So I don't think there's any, I'm not aware of any legal prohibition on them making that sort of contact. I get it. You're not going to tell the police officer about every single behavior problem in a big high school. But this one certainly seems to have reached the level they should have considered doing that.

ACOSTA: And prosecutors have highlighted some of the text messages that Ethan's mom sent her son. One message she sent after a teacher saw Ethan searching for ammo on his phone was, LOL, I'm not mad at you, you have to learn not to get caught. Another on the day of the shooting said, Ethan, don't do it.

What does this say to you, Andrew, that, you know, these texts were being sent by the mother? You know, folks out there having this discussion, you know, how can we charge the parents in all of this? Your thoughts.

MCCABE: Well, it's really remarkable, Jim, on a couple of levels. First, you talk about all those warning signs that the people at the school saw. They didn't have access to or didn't know the one absolutely crucial piece of this puzzle, which the parents did know, and that was that they had purchased him a gun over the weekend.

So, you know, to then look at the texts from the mother around this incident with knowledge that she had armed him essentially over the weekend. Taken him to the range and presumably practiced shooting the weapon. It's really confounding. And you know, you have a case here where the prosecution's going to have to prove essentially that this couple acted unreasonably and those are typically tough cases.

It's hard, you're putting that into the hands of a jury. It's a very subjective analysis, but those text messages are going to be very influential in potentially convincing that jury that these parents did not in fact act reasonably under the circumstances and that's what could lead to a conviction.

ACOSTA: Yes, and I suppose whether or not they're convicted, a message has been sent by these prosecutors in Michigan.

All right, Andrew McCabe.

MCCABE: Absolutely.

ACOSTA: Thanks, as always. We appreciate it.

MCCABE: Thanks, Jim.

ACOSTA: And coming up, the Michigan school shooting is the 32nd since August. That spurred the father of Parkland shooting victim Joaquin Oliver to stand outside the White House demanding a meeting with President Biden. There he is right there. He'll join me live. Next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:17:35]

ACOSTA: Four children gone this week at the hands of another. Their lives taken in an attack that has become sadly so uniquely American. The family of 17-year-old Madison Baldwin was supposed to watch her graduate high school this spring. She had already been accepted to multiple colleges, some with full scholarships. We're told she was an artist who loved to read and write. She leaves behind three younger siblings.

Tate Myer was a star football player on the school's varsity team. He helped his team make it to the playoffs this year.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TATE MYER, 16-YEAR-OLD HIGH SCHOOL FOOTBALL PLAYER: Man, it feels awesome. I mean, it feels great. In the rain. This is where we live. Rain is just like actual football. Tough, muddy. Everything about us is tough.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Just last month, his family watched him play in what would be his final game. Tate was just 16 years old.

Fellow student Hannah St. Juliana was just 14 years old. She was on the school's women's basketball team and her teammates describe her as kind and silly. Tuesday night, the day of the shooting, Hannah was set to play in her first Oxford High School game.

Justin Shilling was incredibly smart and hard working. He was part of the school district's baccalaureate program and a lettered athlete. He was also an organ donor. And last night, look at this, a crowd gathered outside the hospital where he had been kept on life support since the shooting. They were there as Justin's parents told him good- bye and he was wheeled away to surgery. His single life now saving multiple others. Justin was only 17 years old.

And this is the deadliest school shooting in the U.S. since 2018 when 17 people were shot and killed in Parkland, Florida, then a few months later when 10 were shot and killed in Santa Fe, Texas.

Manuel Oliver's son Joaquin was killed in the Parkland shooting. He has since co-founded Change the Ref, a non-profit hoping to end gun violence.

Manuel, you're here in D.C. because you wanted to meet with -- and by the way, thank you for being with us. We've had you on before. Always appreciate you coming on. You were here in D.C. You were hoping to meet with President Biden about his gun safety plan. I want to talk to you about that in a moment, but first, let me talk to you about this latest shooting in Michigan. And get your reaction to the fact that these parents have now been charged.

Is it time to send this kind of message to parents out there, that you could be held responsible for the actions of a school shooter?

MANUEL OLIVER OF PARKLAND SHOOTING VICTIM, JOAQUIN "GUAC" OLIVER: Absolutely. Actually I think that's a small victory that we see that happening. Sometimes you stay with whoever was able to stop the gun and that's it, and you don't - that happening. Sometimes you stay with whoever that happening.

[15:20:02]

Sometimes you stay with whoever was able to stop the gun and that's it, and you don't go back to what happened before that, and how this minor had access to a gun. So I'm very glad that this time they are not only doing that but also putting it out there on the media so everyone knows that that's also something that could happen.

ACOSTA: And I'm sure you've been following this case and so often, we talk about the warning signs that were missed. The red flags that were missed. In this case, the accused gunman was searching for ammunition. He was drawing pictures that were alarming to the teachers. He was writing the words, help me. What do you make of what happened here? With how the school officials handled this? And does it remind you of warning signs that were missed before Parkland?

OLIVER: Oh, yes. 100 percent. Actually, I see a lot, a lot of red flags and warnings here in this particular case. And yes, the school should have, they had the chance to do something. To prevent this from happening. For some reason, they didn't. And now they will be part of a problem. So we should work in that area, too. Like how anyone that received that message of this is not good, we should say something, and then didn't say anything, I think it should be part of being guilty in all this situation. ACOSTA: Yes. And Manuel, you were here in D.C. to stand out in front

of the White House this past week. There you are, there's some video of you right there. You were hoping to meet with President Biden about what happened to your son, Joaquin, and all of the other lives that were lost at Parkland and all the lives that have been lost since to these senseless school shooters. What do you hope to accomplish in meeting with the president? Meeting with the team at the White House? And are you hearing any updates in terms of whether you're going to get that meeting?

OLIVER: No, no, no updates. But the whole thing is that I keep fighting against this for the last four years. This for my family, it's already beyond Joaquin. 150,000 people have died since our son was shot four times inside a school. So what have we learned from this experience? Probably nothing. When I saw this happened a few days ago, I decided to, you know what, I've been saying and preaching enough is enough.

What if I really act right now? Whatever I have done hasn't been enough. And I've done a lot. And you know. But the message is not strong enough. So I'm sick of this. And I need to do something. So I took a plane, came to D.C., and I decided I wanted to talk to Biden because Biden promised me and my wife, Patricia, that he will know how to fix this. That he already did it and he will be able to do it again.

So that promise, I need to know what happened to it. And I've been standing outside of the White House trying to get this conversation. I was planning to fly to Florida tomorrow and that's not going to happen. I'll be here. I'll stay here. This is my duty. OK. This is not something that I like doing or want to do. This is something that I must do for Joaquin and for all those kids (INAUDIBLE).

ACOSTA: Yes. And we were just showing pictures of Joaquin a few moments ago. A beautiful young man. I mean, just a beautiful kid. And when I look at his picture, it reminds me of the pictures we were just showing a few moments ago. The young teenagers who died in Michigan. Just gorgeous kids. Beautiful kids. And they're no longer with us. It's just, it's just astounding. It's heartbreaking.

I want to show you something we just picked up on social media in the last several minutes. Put this up on screen. This is a tweet from Republican Congressman Thomas Massie from Kentucky with the caption, "Merry Christmas, PS, Santa, bring more ammo. Please bring ammo." He tweeted this today right after this school shooting that happened in Michigan. And there's his whole family there holding, you know, these assault rifles and whatnot.

I mean, what's your reaction when you see something like this?

OLIVER: Well, that's a huge part of the problem. We have, with someone, elected leaders like this one that think that, I don't know if they're trying to be ironic, funny, or what, but it's a worst case ever that you could handle on social media. This is also something that should teach us who should we elect and not. It's a very nasty post and I think that -- [15:25:05]

ACOSTA: Does something like that, does it cause more pain for folks like you?

OLIVER: No. No. Listen. Pain is not the problem here. Because the way that we treat these and this is probably a message for those families in Michigan. I have a reason to keep on being a father. A strong reason to keep on being a father. And it didn't happen, I didn't feel this immediately after I lost Joaquin, but you start feeling that urgency of doing other things as a father.

I don't feel sad when I see this kind of weird messages from people or threats. I receive them all day long. I feel that I need to do a better job. It's not working and the reason why it's not working is the amount of victims that I just mentioned. So if you're doing something and it's not working and the result is more victims, you need to change the strategy.

ACOSTA: Gives you more motivation.

OLIVER: And -- yes. I want my pain with me. Don't get rid of my pain. And it's actually irrelevant how I feel. Because you know what, a month ago, I heard from a judge how my kid was shot twice, still alive, and the shooter came back and shot him again two more times. So do you think I'm going to be concerned about my pain and my sadness? No. This is about the pain of my son, suffering, dying, thinking about me. Thinking about his mother.

I need to stay outside of the White House in front of the White House to talk to the president for a year, I will. But I'm going to get that conversation. I want to see what's happening. I want to see if there's a plan and if there's a plan, I want everyone to see it.

ACOSTA: All right. Manuel Oliver, I think you're going to succeed. We appreciate it. Keep us posted. Let us know.

OLIVER: Thank you.

ACOSTA: Thanks for your time.

OLIVER: It was a pleasure. Thank you.

ACOSTA: And we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:31:39]

ACOSTA: U.S. alarm is growing over Russia's military buildup along its border with Ukraine.

U.S. intelligence says Russia has been amassing troops along the border and believe that number could grow to 175,000. That's prompting fears Russia could launch a military offensive in Ukraine within a matter of weeks. The Biden administration is warning of severe consequences if Russia

invades Ukraine.

CNN's Matthew Chance is following this for us from Kiev in Ukraine.

Matthew, President Biden will be talking soon with Putin. How do we think that's going to go?

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it's going to be obviously a fraught conversation. We confirmed, in the last few hours, that the direct virtual summit, as it's being called in Moscow, will be held on Tuesday, the 9th of December, a couple of days from now.

It'll be held in the evening Moscow time, so in the morning approximately in the U.S. No exact time has been given.

But it's clearly going to focus squarely on the concern over Ukraine, all those U.S. expressions of intelligence, concern, that the Russians are building up forces close to the border with Ukraine. Tens of thousands already there.

And as you mentioned, up to 175,000 estimated could be put in place by Moscow ahead of any military action against Ukraine.

The United States warning that any aggressive moves like that towards Ukraine will have consequences for Moscow.

Take a listen to what President Biden had to say about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: What I am doing is putting together what I believe to be -- will be the most comprehensive and meaningful set of initiatives to make it very, very difficult for Mr. Putin to go ahead and do what people are worried he may do. But that's in play right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CHANCE: Well, the Russians, Jim, have decided to spell out what it is they want to prevent them from doing that.

And one of the things they want is an ironclad legal agreement, they say, a new security guarantee that would prevent NATO, the Western military alliance, the United States, from expanding its presence eastwards towards the Russia border.

They say that's a red line for them. They say it's a matter of Russian national security.

The U.S. has already pushed back on that. And the Ukrainians have pushed back as well, saying it's up to us, it's up to Ukraine to decide what negotiations we have with the Western military alliance.

And they've called the Russian demands for an end to NATO expansion eastwards of being illegitimate -- Jim?

ACOSTA: All right, Matthew Chance, we'll keep our eyes on it. We know you will as well. Appreciate it.

Coming up, a new warning on just how contagious the Omicron variant may be.

Plus, what President Biden's new travel restrictions may mean for you. That's next.

[15:34:33]

You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: CDC director, Dr. Rochelle Walensky, with a new warning about the Omicron variant spreading around the country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ROCHELLE WALENSKY, CDC DIRECTOR: What we do know is that early data and even mutation data are telling us that this may well be a more transmissible variant than Delta. So this is going to take some time to sort out.

We are prepared though. We are doing genomic sequencing in all these states. But it may very well be that we may start to see more Omicron than we have Delta. And we will be following that very carefully.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Former CDC director, Dr. Tom Frieden, joins me now.

Dr. Frieden, the CDC director says that variant could become dominant in the U.S. That is concerning considering how much trouble we've had with Delta.

[15:40:01]

We already know that, in South Africa, COVID cases are up 300 percent since this new variant was detected. Are you concerned about this?

DR. TOM FRIEDEN, FORMER CDC DIRECTOR: Jim, the plain truth is that it's shaping up to be a bad winter. Delta is bad and Omicron could

well be worse.

We've already got lots of Delta in the U.S. Lots of spread. Increasing in many places. Flu season starting. And now the risk that Omicron will be here widely spreading.

And there's a lot that we still don't know about it. But it's COVID and it can kill you.

ACOSTA: And starting Monday, all incoming air travelers to the U.S. must test negative a day prior to entering. But when asked about just having a vaccine requirement for domestic flights, which is the question that keeps coming up over and over again --- I've asked it, others have asked it -- here's what the president said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: I continue to rely on the scientists and asking them whether or not we have to move beyond yesterday. Right now, they're saying no.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Where are you on this, Dr. Frieden?

FRIEDEN: There are three things we need to do. First, vaccinate. Second, mask up. And third, balance risks and benefits.

Vaccinate means everyone not vaccinated needs to get vaccinated. That's what's driving the increased hospitalizations and deaths.

Everyone who should get boosted should get boosted, because the more immunity you have, the better you'll be ready to confront Omicron or whatever COVID throws at us next.

And third, vaccinate around the world because that's going to risk our lives if we continue to fail to ensure there are vaccines everywhere.

Second, mask up. Especially if you're older or immunosuppressed, you need to up your mask game. We need to be masking indoors. We're in a new environment now with a highly infectious variant.

So I know we wish we didn't have to wear masks, but the fact is that when many people are together indoors where COVID is spreading, masks are a low-risk, low-burden way to save people's lives.

And we have to look at risks and benefits. There are choices people will have to make to get together with friends and family, and to travel. And there are choices people can make.

Making vaccines required for domestic travel, that may be difficult at this point for a variety of reasons.

But the fundamental truth is that everyone has to make their own decisions about their level of risk. But if you don't vaccinate and mask, your decision could kill somebody else.

ACOSTA: Right. If people aren't vaccinated and they're determined and stubborn about it, and they're just not going to get vaccinated, and they catch this Omicron and get on the plane and spread it around that plane and at the airport, they're spreading it around.

I mean, needless to say, they're spreading it around.

And, Dr. Frieden, a new study finds the variant carries a stretch of genetic material that comes from a distant relative of the common cold. That is interesting. Do you think Omicron is just something we're going to have to live

with, that it's just going to be around like regular colds? What do you think?

FRIEDEN: One of the things that COVID is teaching us is that we need to get the data. We need to find out what's happening.

To respond effectively to a health threat, you need three things. You need to learn. You need to communicate. And you need to act, need to do.

Right now, there's a lot we know about COVID and a lot we don't know.

It does look like Omicron is even more infectious that Delta. Whether that's because it gets around our immunity or spreads more readily, we don't know.

Whether it can evade our vaccines, we don't know yet. Whether it's more serious, more deadly or less deadly, we don't know yet.

But we do know that vaccinating, masking and assessing your risk and benefit can save your life and the lives of people around you.

ACOSTA: Earlier this week, the CDC strengthened recommendations for booster doses, saying all adults should get boosted six months after the second doze of Pfizer or Moderna's vaccine, or Johnson & Johnson, two months after.

Do you think the definition of fully vaccinated means that you have your booster? Is that what it needs to be defined by now?

FRIEDEN: It's too soon to say a booster is required. But we can certainly say you're better off confronting COVID, including Omicron, if you're fully vaccinated and boosted. So every adult should get boosted when eligible.

ACOSTA: I got my booster and it was pretty easy. Just went to the pharmacy and knocked it out. Took a little while. There were people in the store. But it wasn't that big of a deal.

All right, Dr. Frieden, thanks for your time.

FRIEDEN: Thank you.

ACOSTA: Appreciate it.

Coming up, comparing vaccines to the Holocaust and Nazi Germany. How Facebook is making a profit off of some truly disturbing rhetoric.

[15:44:41]

Plus, join CNN's Elle Reeve for a new documentary, "WHITE POWER ON TRIAL, RETURN TO CHARLOTTESVILLE." That airs tomorrow night at 9:00 p.m., right here on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) ACOSTA: Dr. Anthony Fauci says he is astounded that FOX News is staying silent after one of their personalities, Lara Logan, compared him to the Nazi "Angel of Death," Dr. Josef Mengele.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY & INFECTIOUS DISEASES: Not only is she being slanderous and disrespectful to so many people who were killed in the concentration camps by Dr. Mengele, but she absolutely has no idea what she's talking about. She's completely incorrect in everything she says.

What I find striking, Chris, is how she gets no discipline whatsoever from the FOX network, how they can let her say that with no comment and no disciplinary action. I'm astounded by that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[15:50:02]

ACOSTA: What's even more appalling is that Lara Logan is hardly the only one trying to compare the U.S. COVID response to Nazi Germany.

New CNN reporting uncovered Facebook ran and also profited from ads comparing vaccines to the Holocaust. Of course, those comparisons are totally ridiculous.

CNN's Donie O'Sullivan joins me now.

Donie, this is very disturbing stuff. But kudos to you and your team for uncovering all this.

Take us through what you found.

DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's pretty disgusting stuff, Jim, what Facebook is allowing to run on its platform.

Take a look at some of these ads we came across.

One is comparing current U.S. COVID restrictions to Nazi Germany. It says, "I'm originally from America but I currently reside in 1941 Germany.

Another one is very direct. It shows a syringe, a reference to the vaccines, and "Slowly and quietly." But it's the Holocaust.

Then another just condoning political violence saying, "Make Hanging Traitors Great Again." This, of course, just less than a year after we saw gallows outside the U.S. capitol.

And, look, oftentimes, Jim, Facebook will make the argument to say, look, we have billions of users. We have billions of posts on our platform.

But these aren't just random posts. These are actually ads. Ads that Facebook is accepting, taking money for, then targeting its own users with.

So it's not like these are just random posts -- Jim?

ACOSTA: Right, of course not.

And Facebook whistleblower, Frances Haugen, reacted to your reporting and how this disgusting material gets on the platform.

Here's what she said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FRANCIS HAUGEN, FACEBOOK WHISTLEBLOWER: Facebook's business model is conditioned on fixing problems after they find them.

Facebook has known since 2018 -- Mark has publicly made comments on it, Mark Zuckerberg, has made comments saying prioritizing content or ads based on their ability to provoke a reaction from you.

What is usually the most extreme and polarizing content is dangerous because people are drawn to engage with extreme content.

But Mark said at the time, it's OK, A.I. will save us. Only problem is, A.I. misses lots and lots of problems. In the case of hate speech, only 3 percent to 5 percent of hate speech is caught.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Donie, what is Facebook saying about what you uncovered?

And don't they have -- do they have a reasonable answer to what you were saying, which is, hey, I found this stuff, we found this stuff, why can't you find this stuff and get rid of it?

O'SULLIVAN: Exactly. So when we asked Facebook about this, the first two ads comparing the vaccine to the Holocaust and the U.S. to Nazi Germany, Facebook said they go against their rules and those ads are wrong and they won't let those ads run again.

Incredibly, when it comes to the "Make Hanging Traitors Great Again" post, Facebook doesn't have a problem with it. So they'll still allow that ad to run.

To Haugen's point there, this is a trillion-dollar company. It's one thing to try and monitor the billions of posts their users post, but these are ads this they are accepting, right, that they are taking money for.

And part of the reason, of course, why Facebook is so profitable is because they don't want to bother having humans review these ads in a way. So that is how they're making so much money.

And this is all, of course, central to their business model. It's in the design -- Jim?

ACOSTA: Yes. How about take some of those billions of dollars and hire, you know, I don't know, 10 or 15 people, you know, maybe 100 people to ferret the stuff out and get rid of it? It's just garbage.

Donie O'Sullivan, you shouldn't have to do that for them. But thank you so much for doing it.

Appreciate the reporting as always. Thanks so much.

The top-10 "CNN Heroes" of 2021 have been announced, one of whom will be named the Hero of the Year by you, our viewers.

In our last week of voting, let us re-introduce another one of our incredible top-10.

When COVID struck the island of Bali, thousands lost their jobs and were at risk of going hungry. This top-10 CNN Hero found a way to help his community by implementing a simple plan, empower people to trade in collected plastic waste for rice.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JANUR YASA, CNN HERO: I kept going with this mission because people empower. Because people get excited. Because of the community that respond to this initiative.

I see the smile in their face. I see the cleaner environments. And also I see they can provide for their family.

This initiative is so simple and we can do this in every community.

We clean the environments. We feed the people. And they're proud doing this.

My goal is to really spread this movement. I want to inspire people that everything is possible. There's no small dream.

[15:55:05]

If you believe and you do it with the community, then you will succeed.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Go to CNNheroes.com right now to vote for him for CNN Hero of the Year or any of your favorite top-10 heroes.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)