Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Omar Calls McCarthy a Liar and a Coward; Andrea Kendall-Taylor is Interviewed about Russia; Restarting Remain in Mexico. Aired 9:30- 10a ET

Aired December 06, 2021 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:33:06]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Congresswoman Ilhan Omar says that she is confident Democrats will not let Representative Lauren Boebert off the hook. Omar says that Speaker Nancy Pelosi vowed to take decisive action against the Colorado Republican this week after House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy refused to hold Boebert accountable for making not just one but a series of anti-Muslim remarks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ILHAN OMAR (D-MN): McCarthy's a liar and a coward. He doesn't have the ability to condemn the kind of bigoted Islamophobia and anti- Muslims rhetoric that are being trafficked by a member of his conference.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Why doesn't he have the ability to do that?

OMAR: Because this is -- this is who they are.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Joining me now to discuss, Rachael Bade, CNN political analyst, co-author of "The Political Playbook."

Rachael, good to have you this morning.

RACHAEL BADE, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Hi.

SCIUTTO: So, here's a question. We know McCarthy's not going to go any further, but are Democratic leaders themselves reluctant to go any further in penalizing Boebert?

BADE: I mean, they have been, up until now. It's been more than a week and a half since this controversy has exploded. The reality is that there's growing pressure on Nancy Pelosi from the prerogative community, Ilhan Omar and her allies, to do something. There's a sort of feeling that if they were going to rebuke Paul Gosar, the Arizona Republican who posted this anime video of himself killing Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez a few weeks ago, they rebuked him, they took him off his committee. If they're going to do that for him, why aren't they doing the same thing for Boebert? There's sort of ja concern about a double standard for Islamophobia.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BADE: And so there's a lot of pressure on Pelosi to do something.

The interesting thing is, just a week ago I was talking to senior Democrats who were reluctant to do anything. And the reason is because, you know, Boebert, in this instance, unlike past instances with Republicans, actually issued an apology.

Now, people will say it was a phony apology. It wasn't sincere.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BADE: I think a lot of Democrats feel that way. But there was a fear of rebuking and doing something against a member who did make an effort, she tweeted an apology, and reached out to Ilhan Omar.

[09:35:04]

They, obviously, got in a very ugly spat on that phone call. But there was a reluctance to do that. And so we'll have to see if this pressure is enough to sort of push Pelosi this week to do something. There's certainly going to be a lot of members talking about it on The Hill.

SCIUTTO: OK, so this tweet you're familiar with it, it's sparking a lot of reaction this weekend, understandable. One, why a Republican member of Congress would consider this Christmas appropriate. We can show this image on screen. But also coming days after a school shooting in Oxford, Michigan. Let's show that picture.

So, this is his family. "Santa, please bring ammo," he says. I just want to draw attention to the weapon that Thomas Massey himself is holding. That is either an M-60 or a weapon modified to look like an M-60, which is a -- is a very high velocity, large round. In the Vietnam War was used to defend hillsides. And he was holding it in the Christmas photo here.

What does this say about the current state of guns in politics in this country? Because he clearly -- this was not accidental.

BADE: Yes.

SCIUTTO: This was deliberate. And I imagine he's probably fundraising off of that right now.

BADE: Absolutely. I mean, politically, incredibly insensitive to the moment we're in right now.

Look, the reality is that Republicans, when it comes to guns and the Second Amendment, even after these tragedies, you know, they -- they more so cling to their right to bear arms. And so you have a lot of Republicans for years who have, you know, used images of them holding guns, standing in front of guns, shooting guns.

SCIUTTO: It's almost required now in -- BADE: Yes, exactly, to win primaries, to raise money. But specifically coming after this shooting, where a 15-year-old was given -- gifted a gun for Christmas, and went up and shot the school and killed a bunch of people is -- it's just -- it's outrageous, but outrage, unfortunately in this time, makes money and makes people popular. And so, in the Republican Party right now, you have someone like Thomas Massey who I wouldn't be surprised is going to take sort of the criticism of this tweet and the rebukes of this tweet and actually try to raise even more money from it.

SCIUTTO: Let me ask you this though, Democrats have the White House, the House and the Senate, granted by small margins, but they have it. Is there any actual appetite or momentum among Democratic leaders to push gun control legislation?

BADE: Yes.

SCIUTTO: Other than Chris Murphy, right, who --

BADE: Yes, Chris Murphy was on TV talking about it yesterday.

Look, nobody's talking about it for right now.

SCIUTTO: No.

BADE: I mean it's sort of the sad reality. We saw this a few years ago in Sandy Hook where a bunch of elementary school kids were gunned down and nothing was done in Washington. And so, you know, I wouldn't expect anything to change in the next few weeks and months. Yes.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

Meanwhile, you keep seeing these pictures of young kids who lost their lives in school.

Rachael Bade, thanks so much.

BADE: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: This is just in to CNN.

Sources tell CNN that President Biden is now considering new sanctions against Vladimir Putin's inner circle. This as the two are set to speak directly tomorrow. Details on what that call will look like as Russia amasses more troops and weapons on the Ukrainian border.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:42:30]

SCIUTTO: New this morning, sources tell CNN that U.S. officials are now weighing a wide set of sanctions on Russia, including targeting members of Vladimir Putin's inner circle in order to deter Putin from launching a full-scale invasion of Ukraine. This comes as President Biden is set to speak with Putin via video call tomorrow. Their call comes amid escalating tensions after new U.S. intelligence

findings estimate Russia could begin a military offensive in Ukraine in a matter of months, as soon as next month, as it amasses up to 175,000 troops along the border.

Joining me now to discuss, Andrea Kendall-Taylor, she's the former deputy national intelligence officer for Russia and Eurasia, senior fellow now at the Center of New American Security.

Andrea, good to have you on this morning.

ANDREA KENDALL-TAYLOR, SENIOR FELLOW AND DIRECTOR, TRANSATLANTIC SEC. PROGRAM, CENTER FOR New AMERICAN SECURITY: Hi, Jim. How are you?

SCIUTTO: Sanctions. I'm curious, what sanctions, in your view, would bite here? Because it's been seven years since Russia invaded, annexed and now controls Crimea. Sanctions have been in place, putting a price -- economic price on Russia, but clearly not moving them, not changing the calculus on the ground.

What kinds of sanctions, in your view, would make a difference?

KENDALL-TAYLOR: Well, it's a great question and I think it's important for us all to remember how difficult it will be to deter President Putin in this situation. There are very few issues other than Ukraine that he cares about more. Sanctions have to be an important part of the package. It is important for the United States and its allies to raise the economic costs should Putin escalate. And we know that the administration has said that they have all options on the table. Last week, Secretary of State Blinken was as NATO where he talked about U.S. willingness to use economic measures that it has previously refrained from using. So that could include things like sanctions on Russian oligarchs, on the Russian energy sector and on Russian sovereign debt. It's also important to recognize, though, that if we move forward in that direction, it's important that we do that in very close consultation with our European allies because many of those economic measures impact their economies much more than ours because they're more closely intertwined.

So, I would say that I don't think, though, that sanctions in and of themselves will be enough to deter Putin and so we'll be looking to the administration, I think, for some additional steps to try to shape Putin's calculus.

SCIUTTO: I mean the other worry, of course, right, you'd impact the international energy markets right there and drive up oil prices and then everyone -- everyone pays, in effect.

OK, on the weapon -- the other piece of this, and we've seen this, is accelerating or increasing lethal military aid to Ukrainian forces.

[09:45:06]

So far that's included things like TOW missiles, which is an anti-tank armor piercing missile, which the U.S. has applied before. But I also know that there are some on The Hill here that are impatient for more and quicker assistance. Does that military assistance, in your view, change the calculus by raising the potential costs of a Russian invasion?

KENDALL-TAYLOR: I think it's got to be another important piece of the package. We have to help Ukraine defend itself. And, again, like you're saying, raise the cost that Russia would face for any escalation.

But I think what the missing piece so far is, is for the United States to -- in addition to those costs, to talk about a broader -- kind of have a broader security discussion with President Putin and articulate that if he were to invade in Ukraine or escalate the situation, that it would force the U.S. to change its broader security posture in the region. So it would really give us no choice other than to put more forces into Europe, introduce new weapons systems, like theater missile defense, or to move forward with a permanent presence in the Baltics.

And I think in doing so, the message would be to Putin, you might have some small gain in Ukraine, but it would really change the security landscape, the security architecture in Europe in ways that Putin really would not like. And I think, you know, there are very few things other than Ukraine that Putin cares about, but I think that broader security conversation might be one of those.

SCIUTTO: You have Russia demanding publicly now some sort of guarantee that Ukraine will never join NATO. Now, by the way, we should note, that's over Ukraine's objections. We should also note that the NATO Secretary-general, he was on our broadcast making the point, that should be up to Ukraine and NATO, not Russia.

Do you see a scenario here where the U.S. does an end around right on Ukraine, to make a commitment to Russia that staves off an invasion for now, but leaves Ukraine high and dry, right, by making a commitment that it's not prepared to make itself?

KENDALL-TAYLOR: Yes, no, I don't think that is something that the administration should consider at all. Secretary Stoltenberg made a brilliant case. You know, it has been longstanding U.S. policy that we don't accept Russia's veto over the foreign policy decisions of its neighbors. It doesn't have a choice over NATO's decisions either. And so I think that is really a non-starter and is not something that this administration would really even entertain.

SCIUTTO: Well, that would be good news for Ukrainian officials. I know they're nervous about that possibility.

Andrea Kendall-Taylor, thanks so much for joining us this morning.

KENDALL-TAYLOR: Thank you for having me.

SCIUTTO: Well, right now, on Capitol Hill, and at the White House, flags are flying at half-staff, this in honor of long-time GOP senator, former presidential candidate, Bob Dole. He passed away Sunday after announcing he was being treated for lung cancer back in February. President Biden released a statement calling Dole, quote, an American statesman like few in our history. A war hero and among the greatest of the Greatest Generation. And to me, he was also a friend whom I could look to for trusted guidance.

Dole got a Purple Heart, two bronze stars serving in World War II. He received the Purple Heart twice along with those two bronze stars. He went on to serve 27 years in the U.S. If you haven't read an account of the injuries that he suffered in World War II, you can find them in the book "What It Takes." They were daunting and harrowing. They're worth reading yourself.

He kept his sense of humor about never winning the presidency when he was awarded the Medal of Freedom back in 1997.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BOB DOLE: I had a dream that I would be here this historic week receiving something from the president. But I thought it would be the front door key.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Dole survived by his wife, former Senator Elizabeth Dole, as well as a daughter, Robin. He was 98 years old.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:53:44]

SCIUTTO: The Biden administration is preparing to restart the Trump era remain in Mexico policy, this due to a federal court order. The revamped Border Patrol program will allow the U.S. to send asylum- seeking migrants back to Mexico to await their immigration court hearing.

CNN's Matt Rivers live in Mexico City this morning.

So, Matt, what does this mean for immigrants once they're in Mexico? I mean how -- typically how long do they wait for those hearings to progress?

MATT RIVERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, during the Trump administration, Jim, the administration came under a lot of fire, frankly, for this program that saw tens of thousands of people waiting in Mexico for even those with -- that had legitimate asylum claims in the United States. They weren't allowed to wait in the U.S. They were forced to wait in Mexico for months, even years, in some terrible conditions. These tent cities popped up all along the southern U.S. border with migrants waiting to have their legal proceedings take place in the United States.

The Biden administration actually wound down this program months after Biden took office, but over the summer a federal judge said that in doing so they actually violated federal law, which meant that the Biden administration was forced to reimplement this program.

They can't do that without Mexico, obviously, and so negotiations took place between the U.S. and Mexico, which leads us to today, which sees this program restarting with some changes that include vaccines will be provided to migrants before they come back here to Mexico.

[09:55:12]

They're going to be asked if they fear going to Mexico. Asylum claims will intend to be processed within six months and also categories of vulnerable migrants exempt from the program will be expanded. But critics of all of this, Jim, would say that is not good enough because they'll -- they fear that what might happen is the same kind of scenes that we saw back in 2019, 2020, where you saw migrants living in horrible conditions. The Biden administration says they want to wind this down eventually. The courts are preventing them from doing so. But this is what's happening now as of today on the U.S. border.

SCIUTTO: Matt Rivers, there in Mexico City, thanks very much.

Still ahead, New York City has announced new mandates that would require young children, as well as their parents, that proof of vaccination to enter restaurants, indoor entertainment. It's the latest step in the fight to stay ahead of, among other things, the omicron variant.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)