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Questions Swirl After Multiple Reports of Tom Brady Retiring from NFL; Widow Recalls Angish of Officer's Death, Calls Out New D.A.'s Policies; 1/6 Committee Subpoenas 14 Bogus Trump Electors; 1/6 Panel Subpoenas Former Trump White House Spokesman Judd Deere. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired January 29, 2022 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:00:15]

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: You are live in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Phil Mattingly in Washington. Jim Acosta is off today.

And we begin with the breaking news.

Questions are swirling after multiple reports that the greatest quarterback of all time, Tom Brady, plans to retire after 22 seasons in the NFL. The 44-year-old led the New England Patriots to six Super Bowl titles. The Tampa Bay Buccaneers, one Super Bowl title. That's seven. That's more than anybody else ever.

No quarterback has thrown for more touchdowns, more yards, or won more playoff games than Tom Brady. Brady has also played in and won more regular season games in his career than any other quarterback.

Now, according to ESPN, Brady's agent put out a statement which reads quote, "I understand the advance speculation about Tom's future. Without getting into the accuracy or inaccuracy of what's being reported, Tom will be the only person to express his plans with complete accuracy. He knows the realities of the football business and planning calendar as well as anybody so that should be soon."

Joining us now is CNN Sports anchor, Andy Scholes. And Andy, there appears to be some confusion about whether Tom Brady will retire, won't retire, definitely retire, just hasn't announced it yet. What is going on right now?

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Well, yes Phil. Social media is going nuts right now because, you know, for what -- a good half hour to an hour, it was Tom Brady's retiring. We were all reflecting on, you know, the greatest football career we've ever seen.

And then comes you know, some other reputable NFL reporters out there reporting that well, you know, it's not a done deal yet and actually Brady may have not made his decision yet at all.

So we're kind of in limbo right now. But you know, Adam Schefter, Jeff Darlington, very plugged in NFL reporters, they were the ones to break this news, you know.

So Tom Brady is in fact retiring, it certainly is, you know, a sad day for sports fans, especially an extra sad day Phil, for anyone born in the late 70s or early 80s because Tom Brady was the oldest superstar we had left, you know, 44 years old. He's pretty much the only guy older than a lot of us that we could still root for, you know.

So we'll wait and see if this was Tom Brady's final season. It's safe to say we're never going to see another Tom Brady.

You know we said that after Michael Jordan retired. You know we'll never see another Michael Jordan. Then came Kobe Bryant. Then came Lebron James. Kind of filled that void very nicely.

But you can 100 percent pretty much say there will never be a Tom Brady. There'll never be another guy drafted in the sixth round, six 199s who goes on to win seven Super Bowls. Never going to happen. Never going to see another like guy like him. And we were all privileged to live in an age where we got to appreciate the greatness of Tom Brady.

MATTINGLY: Yes. I will not recognize if there are professional players that are younger than me. I just won't do it. I will not acknowledge it.

Andy, one of the things that is, I think most interesting in the last week after that epic game against the Rams that once again, Tom Brady almost came back and won, he did a podcast with Jim Gray where he talks about his considerations in terms of the next step forward.

And I think that was kind of the moment where a lot of people said, oh, wow, he's actually considering hanging it up. What were kind of the considerations that Brady was weighing as he went into this moment.

SCHOLES: Yes. Well, he said it was going to be all about his family. It was going to be really a group decision. What did Gisele want, his wife. You know, he said it hurts her to see him get hit every single Sunday.

You know, a big decision had to be his kids. You know, he always said it was so cool that his kids got old enough to really appreciate who he was and how much he was able to win. They were there, old enough to enjoy all those Super Bowls. As you see these picture we're seeing right now, the kids got -- you know, Brady would have his son at practice running routes, you know, catching passes.

And so you kind of saw some signs that this could be his final year. Right there at the end. You know, we kind of took it for granted this entire season just because Tom Brady said yes, you know, I can play to 50. So we were all deep in our heads thinking oh, yes, this isn't Tom Brady's final season.

Then when it, you know, came to that Rams game, it was kind of like when they lost and he came back in spectacular fashion was walking off the field, you know, that when it kind of hit me. It was like, oh man, is this the last time we're watching Tom Brady walk off of an NFL field then to hear what he said in that "Let's Go" podcast, it really became a real possibility and, you know, it had to come at some point, Phil. You know, it would be hard for Tom Brady to go out winning another Super Bowl. You know, we take it for granted that he's just won so many. We just figured, oh, he's going to lift the Lombardi trophy and walk off into the sunset.

You know, that's not realistic for a lot of people. Peyton Manning was able to do it. But that was just, you know, his second Super Bowl title. And he was -- big part of that, you know, Peyton Manning, he was not the best player on that Broncos team that won. They almost won almost in spite of him at that final season.

[17:04:59]

SCHOLES: And I think part of Brady's greatness is that he wanted to walk out on top. He led the NFL in passing. He led the NFL in passing wards. He led an epic comeback in that playoff game against the Rams. If this is truly Brady walking away in retirement, you know, he's walking away still one of the best.

MATTINGLY: I think that was my biggest question, right. And your analog was perfect because -- and I love Peyton Manning. Easily top two or three quarterback in the history of the NFL, but at the end, there were just a lot of throws he couldn't make, right. Like that team was not a Peyton Manning driven team only.

Tom Brady this last year, the Bucs were a Tom Brady team. Great players all around, but leading the NFL in passing yards, leading the NFL in touchdowns. He was still at his height and yet willing to potentially hang it up.

I think it's an interesting dynamic, that as you can see maybe why a lot of people were surprised to some degree, right.

SCHOLES: Certainly, you know, everyone's thinking, well look, you were so amazing this season, you're likely going to end up second in the NBC (ph) to Aaron Rodgers. You know, why not come back for another season?

But you know, I think he really, you know, Tom Brady -- one of the things about him is he's not going to do anything without giving it 100 percent. So if he knows that if he's playing another season, that means he's got to wake up early, go through all of his workouts with his trainer, Alex Guerrero. He's going to go to Montana, do his passing camps that he does every single summer.

That takes time away from his family. And I'm sure that's factoring into this decision greatly because you know, it's not just oh, strap on the pads come September. If Brady's going to go at it, he's going to start gearing up for it and all summer. And I'm sure he knows about his mind.

You know, next season, he'd be 45 years old. It's only going to get harder. So you know, again, I'm certainly -- I'm not in Tom Brady's head, but I'm sure these are some of the things he's just factoring in. And how much time it's going to take away from his family.

MATTINGLY: Yes. Contrary to popular belief, he is human. At some point that's going to play a role.

Andy Scholes appreciate it, my friend. Thanks so much.

SCHOLES: All right, Phil.

MATTINGLY: All right. And joining us now is NFL -- former NFL offensive guard, Damien Woody. Damien, you won two Super Bowls with Tom Brady. You were on his offensive line.

I'm not going to ask you to explain exactly what's happening right now although you're more than welcome to tell me if Tom has called you and told you what he's going to do.

I think one of the interesting things right now is you know, as somebody who knows him, as somebody who's played with him and understands how he operates, would it be a surprise to you or was it a surprise to you when you saw some of your ESPN colleagues report earlier today that he was going to hang it up?

DAMIEN WOODY, FORMER NFL PLAYER: You know what, Phil, it wasn't a surprise. You know. I mean think about it. The guy's 44 years old. Played 22 years in the National Football League. And you've, you know, gone down the laundry list of accolades that Tom Brady has accomplished.

And you know for me, it was the podcast -- the podcast with Jim Gray. There was a specific word that Tom Brady used in that podcast and that was the word "satisfied".

And when you're talking about the greatest of the great athletes, you know, whether it's Tom Brady, Michael Jordan, Muhammad Ali, you never really hear them say satisfied.

I remember someone asking Tom Brady, what's the best Super Bowl ring that you have? And he would always respond the next one. And so for him to use the word satisfied, it was almost like he was just reminiscing over, you know, his whole career and saying you know what, this is a job well done. Maybe it's my time.

MATTINGLY: What do you think is happening right now? Is this, you know, he wanted to announce it himself. There's a lot of people thinking a lot of things. You know the league inside and on the outside perspective. Walk normal people through kind of the dynamics of what's at play.

WOODY: Yes. My colleagues Adam Schefter and Jeff Darlington, they're pretty plugged into, you know, Tom Brady and his camp. You know, they were the ones that broke the story. And you know, I don't like to speculate too much. But, you know, for them to break that type of story, obviously, you know, they wouldn't do it without someone's blessing.

So you know, maybe it's a situation where you know, the story got out before it was supposed to get out, but you know, I have faith in my colleagues in Adam Schefter and Jeff Darlington that the story is accurate.

But be it as it may, you know just reflecting on Tom Brady's career, I mean we're talking about a guy in his 20 years in New England, went to ten Super Bowls. Think about that. Half the time that he was in New England, he was in a Super Bowl.

I don't know if we're ever going to see that again. And he obviously leaves New England, you know, the storied career goes to Tampa Bay the very next year and wins a Super Bowl there.

So I just think from a guy who was drafted in the sixth round, the 199th pick, who was a fourth string quarterback when I first -- when I was there that moved his way all the way to the starting position and created that type of legacy. I don't think it's, we're going to ever see anything like that again.

MATTINGLY: May I ask you about that? And again, I think for -- maybe for people who don't follow the NFL on a regular basis, but if you were drafted 199th, you're not going to make it. I'm not really sure how better I can put that. If you're the third or fourth string quarterback in camp, you're not going to make it. The start of his career is the most unfathomable thing.

[17:09:59]

MATTINGLY: Everybody obviously know about it because he's never let anybody forget about it. But when you were playing with him back in '01, did you guys see him and say before he took the starting position say yes, that guy's the future? Like he's going to be -- he's going to be one of the best?

WOODY: Listen Phil, no one could foresee the accolades and everything that Tom Brady has accomplished, but the one thing you could see was the intangibles -- the work ethic, the chip on his shoulder.

He rode that chip all the way throughout his career. I mean he would constantly, you know, talk about, you know, how he was the you know, the -- there were 12 other quarterbacks that were picked ahead of him, you know, in that 2000 draft.

I mean imagine, you know, the work ethic -- you combine the work ethic, the chip, and just the football acumen that the guy has and the drive to win and you combine all those things and you end up with Tom Brady.

MATTINGLY: Yes. And the amazing thing is he can still name every single quarterback (INAUDIBLE) many, many times.

From a locker room perspective, you know, you get the comparisons to the sports worldwide. You get MJ or Kobe or Lebron. Whoever the best is in any league and yet, unlike maybe Michael Jordan and Kobe, who were always known to be very hard on their teammates to try and drive them to be better, the drive was there with Brady, but I've never gotten the sense that he was really, I felt that he was understood to be a locker room guy or good teammate.

What was he like as a teammate?

WOODY: Listen, he was definitely a great teammate, there's now question about it. But he would definitely get on you on the football field because he's just perfectionist. He wanted things done the right. He wanted to win so, so bad.

And I think people would see that, people saw that more so in the latter part of his career. He always was like piss and vinegar. He always had that about him, you know, out there on the football field, whether it's talking trash or getting on his teammates on the sideline when things weren't going well.

But you know, that's just a sign of an ultimate competitor. A guy who wanted to win in the worst way, a guy who was elevated than other players around him.

MATTINGLY: Yes. It felt like the back and forth at the time last year's Super Bowl was just like a small window into probably what you guys dealt with at practice.

What was it like? You know, you played with him with the Patriots, you played against him with the Jets. What was the difference playing on a team with Tom Brady and playing on a team not with Tom Brady?

WOODY: Well listen, when you're playing with him, you feel like we're going to win every game because if a team gives you the ball back, you know, with any amount of time, we've got 12 back there. We've got a guy that know how to operate any situation and who's going to will us to win.

And so being on the flip side of that, my time with the Jets, you're always nauseous because you feel like you're going toe to toe with Tom Brady. And any time you gave him, you're like, oh, man, here we go. And that's really with every team that played against Tom Brady. Any time that you gave him, even the announcers would say it during the broadcast. "Here we go. Let's see what magic Tom Brady can you know, can bring out."

So it was just -- it was just a treat to play with Tom Brady, to watch Tom Brady. I'm always in awe of greatness and that's what we saw week in and week out with him.

MATTINGLY: Now that you're out of the league, I've been texting back and forth with my wife during commercial breaks, my 6-year-old somehow became a Tom Brady fan which is offensive because he's a Michigan guy and I'm (INAUDIBLE). And I heard everything about that.

But he's, you know, bawling, basically locking himself in his room right now, but the 6-year-old who loves a 44-year-old player. That's the kind of range of Brady's fandom. What was it like when you were outside of the league and you would meet people when it came to Tom Brady? Like the perspective you would see particularly as somebody who was once in the room with him. WOODY: So many people couldn't stand Tom Brady but the reason they

could couldn't stand him is because they couldn't stand his greatness. You know, that was the thing. It was like can we please have somebody, you know, another quarterback in the Super Bowl besides Tom Brady?

That should show you the deep respect that people had for Tom Brady because again, seemed like every other year, he would find himself in a Super Bowl.

So again, I'm going to say I just don't think we're going to ever see another quarterback like Tom Brady again rising from the sixth round, 199th pick and to be able to work his way up and put together the resume that he put together. There's a lot of envious people you know, out there that they look at Tom Brady's career and they're like man, this dude really was like Captain America.

MATTINGLY: Yes, there's not a lot of people who like, even the haters have to acknowledge, like yes, all right, like he's the best. He's the best.

Damien Woody, I'm always a fan of your work. Thanks so much for taking the time and sharing your perspective, my friend. I really appreciate it.

WOODY: All right. Thanks a lot, Phil.

MATTINGLY: All right.

Coming up, President Biden says he'll send U.S. troops into eastern Europe as a top military official warns Russian invasion on Ukraine would be horrific. So why is Ukraine saying there's no reason to panic?

[17:14:54]

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MATTINGLY: President Biden has raised the stakes in the standoff between the U.S. and Russia over Ukraine. Yesterday, he promised thousands of U.S. troops will head to eastern Europe in the quote, "near term". This as two senior defense officials tell CNN Russia appears to be moving blood supplies to the Ukrainian border, another potential sign of an offensive. Now, Ukraine says that report is not true and Russia denies an attack is in the works at all.

U.S. military officials say an invasion would have quote, "horrific consequences".

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEN. MARK MILLEY, CHAIRMAN, JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF: Given the type of forces that are arrayed, the ground maneuver forces, the artillery, the ballistic missiles, the air forces -- all of it packaged together, if that was unleashed on Ukraine, it would be significant. Very significant. And it would result in a significant amount of casualties. [17:19:52]

MILLEY: And you can imagine what that might look like in dense urban areas along roads and so on and so forth. It would be horrific. It would be terrible.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: I want to bring in now a senior member of the House Armed Services Committee. Democratic Congressman John Garamendi.

And Congressman, thanks for your time. I think what we're trying to figure out right now, and it's obviously a very fluid and fast-moving situation, but the president has ruled out U.S. troops on the ground in Ukraine during a potential conflict. Obviously, there are NATO allies surrounding Ukraine where any additional troops would go.

The decision to send those troops before any Russian action, why do you think that would come into play here?

REP. JOHN GARAMENDI (R-CA); It's just one more signal to Putin, don't mess around. In THIS case, don't mess around with any NATO country. There's always been a threat particularly in the Baltics that the Russians could easily take over those three countries. And so that's an ongoing threat and perhaps, that's where some of those troops are going.

This is really not new however. For the last six years, we have had what we call the European Defense initiative, somewhere between $3 and $5 billion dollars a year to shore up NATO'S defenses on the eastern part of Europe.

That's training, that's preparation. That is bringing the year. Those countries' military up to readiness.

In this new (INAUDIBLE) others that we can do and on of these is in the hands of Congress.

There's a bill that Senator Menendez in his Senate Foreign Relations Committee has put forth and it is a very strong rebuke to Russia.

If they are to do any kind of an invasion or cyber ops or try to topple the Ukrainian government, then the sanctions that are in that bill would automatically go into place. And those sanctions are heavy duty.

Putin, all of his assets wherever they are around the world, frozen. Russian banks, frozen. Access to the international currency market, gone. Oil, gas -- not allowed to be exported. Silicon chips, not allowed to be imported.

Those kind of things need to be done and frankly, the Senate and the House need to get on with it and pass that legislation to strengthen President Biden's hand and also to strengthen the hand and to strengthen the will of Ukraine and to give Putin some very serious kick back should he try anything. MATTINGLY: You know, one of the things the administration I know has

been working particularly on the technical side in the sanctions legislation that Congress is considering right now, but I think they're also very cognizant that they don't want to be limited or cornered to some degree in terms of their response options.

Do you feel like they will be supportive of whatever Senator Menendez and the bipartisan proposal that they're working on now?

GARAMENDI: In fact, the White House has already signaled support for the Menendez bill. My concern it was 12, 13 days ago that the bill was put forth. They got to get on with it.

Congress needs to do its piece here. We need to make sure that we are supporting the president with appropriate legislation. In the House, on the Armed Services Committee. We're also looking at additional military support for Ukraine. Also ramping up the cyber operations that we can do to make sure that Russia isn't messing around anywhere else in the world as well as Ukraine on the cyber front.

And so there are things that are being done in both houses, but I really think this legislation is critically important because it was a signal that the Congress is unified with the president on these sanctions as well as on the material being delivered to Ukraine for their defense.

And yes, it will be bloody, but nonetheless, this is where we have the opportunity now with a very strong sanction and other programs coupled with diplomacy to give Putin pause.

MATTINGLY: Congressman, can I ask, you know, you mentioned the unity. Menendez is working with Senator Jim Reich (ph) who's the ranking member on the committee over there as well. Traditionally particularly when it comes to NATO, there's bipartisan consensus in the foreign policy world in terms of the coalition and what it's brought to the world for the last 70 plus years.

But we know some lawmakers are getting calls from constituents asking them why are they being so hard on Russia. You know, Tucker Carlson who's been very influential on that front, pushing the idea that's borderline Russia apologist rhetoric. To the point where he even got pushback from -- I think one of the questions right now is are you concerned that we are in this moment in time where the understood U.S. policy and kind of western alliances is no longer just a given inside this country for the broader American public?

[17:24:47]

GARAMENDI: Well, let's remember we've come up four years of the previous president. Donald Trump made it very, very clear that he was not in favor of money for NATO. He trashed NATO multiple times and made it very clear in his rhetoric and then he sometimes would back off.

But in the four years that he was president, he gave a lot of running room to Putin by putting down NATO, putting down the European union, and not bolstering our support for NATO.

Now the NATO parliamentarians and members of Congress were in Portugal about four months ago and we made it very, very clear that there is a new day in Congress and a new president that clearly support NATO.

So yes, there is a hangover from the Trump administration that created great concern throughout NATO. Great concern throughout the United States and undoubtedly led to running room for folks like Tucker Carlson to, you know, cozy up to Russia.

MATTINGLY: Yes. It's been an interesting development over the course of the last several years.

All right. Congressman John Garamendi of California, thank you so much, sir always for your time.

GARAMENDI. Thank you. Thank you, Phil.

MATTINGLY: All right. And coming up, is he or isn't he? New questions following reports that legendary quarterback Tom Brady is retiring.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:30:47]

MATTINGLY: Welcome back. And we're staying with our breaking news. And questions swirling about reports that NFL quarterback, Tom Brady, the greatest quarterback of our time, is retiring.

Joining me now by phone is former NFL tight end, Ben Watson.

Ben, thanks for the time.

I'm not going to ask you to try to decode what's going on right now.

(LAUGHTER)

But as somebody who played with Tom Brady, won an NFL championship with Tom Brady, I believe the first touchdown pass you caught in your career was with Tom Brady.

If this is the end, what will you take away as your memory of him?

BEN WATSON, FORMER NFL TIGHT END (via telephone): I appreciate you not pressing me. Because I have no idea what's going on.

But I do know that with Tom, I'm sure he would love to be the one to make that announcement.

For me, even in hearing the news and telling my kids, honestly, there was a sense of a little sadness because this guy's been playing quarterback position for 22 years.

For many of us, and for me, my first touchdown pass, seven years playing with the Patriots. And other than that, just being a fan of the game and of excellence, what I take away is a guy who came to work every day and elevated the play of so many other people around him.

MATTINGLY: Can you explain what it's like to be a high-round draft pick first round, I believe in your case, and walk into a locker room where Tom Brady is your quarterback?

What's that like as a rookie --

(CROSSTALK)

MATTINGLY: -- running into Tom Brady for the first time.

WATSON: Even for me, and when I came in, Tom was I believe in his fourth or fifth year, but he had already won two Super Bowls already and was about to win another one. And so he was already a legend even though he was young.

As I came back to the Patriots in my last year, year 16, and to see the way he interacted with college players, whether they were first round picks, whether they were second or third or fourth round picks, he has a way of making everyone feel comfortable.

It didn't matter if you were a guy that came in the first round. Didn't matter if you were a free agent coming in and you wanted to say hello to him. Will you sign this for my dad because he's a fan as well. You never saw him turn teammates away.

That's one of the things that sets him apart because there comes to time for every player where you start to feel like you're older than the game.

And you start to feel a disconnect between yourself and younger players.

And what he mastered was the ability to make everybody feel like they were on the same playing field as him even though quite obviously, whenever he makes his announcement, he should go into the Hall of Fame that very next minute.

MATTINGLY: What was the difference? You mentioned a fascinating window in terms of being with him in your first year and in your last year.

In that separation of time when you were away from playing with him, what changed? Was his approach different? Was how he played different?

What changed in terms of who he was as a player?

WATSON: As a player, he still was able to compete and have fun.

I can remember times early in my career when I was in New England and he would yell back and forth with the defense on every single drill. Wanted to win everything. Whether it was practice, an offseason program. We would be lifting or running sprints, he'd want to win.

Then I come back 10 years later, he's still the same way. But to me, while that stayed the same, what was different was family.

The old guys in the locker room, me and him together, we got to know each other in a different way than before. And to see how he loves his wife, his children. Talked about them all the time. Face timed him before he went out to practice.

That was different than when I left before. But on the field and in the classroom, he still had the same intensity.

And again, I can't overemphasize the fact that that's what, that's the toughest part of this game because it is a 24/7 grind to keep that after you get up in years, after you win seven Super bowls, is what separates him from everyone else.

MATTINGLY: You played with Drew Brees. And I'm not going to ask you to compare and contrast the two.

As someone who has played with multiple really good if not great quarterbacks, what separates Tom Brady from everybody else?

[17:35:07]

WATSON: You know, I'll go ahead and answer the question with Drew as well because I thought of him a lot even over today as you know, we've talked about Tom Brady's career.

It's the details. And it sounds cliche. It sounds like, of course, these guys are pro athletes, everybody pays attention to details. And everybody does. You don't get to that level without doing that.

But to play that position and play it well, you have to be able to anticipate so many things before they happen.

And whether it was Tom Brady or Drew Brees, I can remember seeing them mentally going through the gymnastics of what the other team was going to do before they did it.

There's a certain confidence you have when you go into the huddle and you have one of those guys, and you know they're going to give you the best chance to win.

And if you don't know what you're supposed to do, they know because they've studied it over and over and over again.

Those times away from the camera is what makes those guys different.

And for Tom specifically, I will say he found out early on what it would take for him specifically to be great, which would be different than anybody else.

He found out what his body needed, how much it needed, and how mentally, physically, spiritually, he could put those things together long-term.

Not only that, but he dedicated his time to doing that in a way that I think inspires people outside of football. You know, his stardom is greater than football. It goes around the

world, to fashion, to health and wellness.

I think that's what everybody's kind of grappling with is that, you know, he was able to spill outside of the NFL.

MATTINGLY: Yes. And certainly will be a huge part of whatever happens next.

Ben Watson, really appreciate your time and perspective, my friend. Thanks so much.

WATSON: Thank you.

MATTINGLY: We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:41:44]

MATTINGLY: A sea of blue in New York City as thousands of officers line the streets to honor fallen NYPD Officer Jason Rivera. He was shot and killed a week ago on a domestic dispute call.

Rivera was just 22 years old and had got married three months ago.

During the funeral, his young widow in tears recalled meeting him in elementary school and the anguish of losing him.

She also called out the Manhattan D.A. whose new charging and sentencing policies have faced criticism from police union leaders.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DOMINIQUE LUZURIAGA, WIDOW OF FALLEN NYPD OFFICER JASON RIVERA: Jason is so happy now that all of you are here through pain and sorrow. This is how he would have wanted to be remembered. Like a true hero. Or like I used to call him, Big Po Rivera.

You have to whole nation on gridlock. And although you won't be here anymore, I want you to live through me.

The system continues to fail us. We are not safe anymore. Not even the members of the service.

I know you were tired of these laws. Especially the ones from the new D.A. I hope he's watching you speak through me right now.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: The D.A., Alvin Bragg, was present at the funeral when those comments were made.

He said afterwards, quote, "Violence against police officers will never be tolerated. And my office will vigorously prosecute cases of violence against police."

Joining me now, CNN legal analyst and former federal prosecutor, Elliot Williams, and my buddy from the White House, CNN White House correspondent, John Harwood.

Elliot, I want to start with you.

The policeman's widow gave gun wrenching remarks, a standing ovation for attacking the D.A. who's sitting right there.

What does that say about the dynamic between the D.A. and the police?

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANAYST: The dynamic is not great, Phil.

In the midst of this long, national conversation we're having about policing and public safety and race and so on, what gets lost a lot are the stories of police officers.

And if you read Jason Rivera's own words about why he joined and his own issues with police growing up, they're very, very powerful.

This is somebody with an uncle and cousin who are both NYPD officers and those were powerful words to hear.

Now, as of the specifics police versus the D.A. in Manhattan, there's a few things going on.

One, that could be causing the significant rise in violent crime in the city. The pandemic, policing decisions coming from the D.A. and the mayor and so on.

But also the prevalence of guns. There's a lot of factors going into this. It's painful. And hopefully, the city can work through it.

[17:44:57]

MATTINGLY: Yes, it's complicated and there's nuance to it.

And, John, that's kind of what I wanted to get to with you.

Everyone remembers Donald Trump campaigning on the promise there would be law and order if he were president. Republicans railed against so- called lawlessness under Democrats.

How big of a concern? I believe the president is going up to New York to meet on this very issue.

How big of a concern is this for Democrats going into the midterms when it comes to crime?

JOHN HARWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: I think it's a big concern in these circumstances, and it's why saw after the 2020 election, moderate Democrats and some of the democratic campaign types emphasizing that the popularity in some corners, not the majority, but in some corners of the Democratic Party of defund the police and related initiatives hurt them in 2020. Part of the reason why down-ballot below the level of Joe Biden they

didn't do as well.

Joe Biden has been very emphatic that he is not for defunding the police. In fact, he wants more. There was money for police in the American Rescue Plan.

When he was in Pittsburgh, I was there with him on Friday, and when he visited the fallen bridge, he was talking to first responders, which included police and firefighters. He said there's money for you, too.

So this is something that Democrats need to make a distinction on, need to shield themselves from this charge. Because as you indicated, Republicans are going very hard on this.

Obviously, this is a couple of year trend in a rise in violent crime. You can't hang it on Biden. But politically, when he's president, and this is happening, he's got to defend himself.

MATTINGLY: Yes.

Elliot, to shift gears a little bit, the January 6th committee issued subpoenas to 14 Republicans from seven states who served as, quote, "bogus electorals" for the Trump scheme to subvert the election results. With others like Rudy Giuliani and Steve Bannon stonewalling the committee.

Do you think these individuals are the best shot at finding out how this plan was actually hatched?

WILLIAMS: Even if they're not the best shot for finding out if the plan was hatched, they provide more data and information.

Whenever building an investigation, you want to go to people at the top and also people down low, and see who you get information from.

It appears that what kind Congress is looking into right now is some link between members in the Trump orbit and the planners and people who signed these electors, these fake election certificates.

Of the seven, five of them are really bad. They're false statements filed to the federal government with lies on them and people's signatures on them.

So Congress can get to the bottom then refer to the Justice Department that is at least aware of this information and potentially opening an investigation at some point.

MATTINGLY: And, John, the committee also subpoenaed former White House spokesman, Judd Deerr, because they want to ask him about a meeting in the Oval Office a day before the insurrection.

Where Trump reportedly asked attendees, quote, "What are your ideas for getting the RINOs, Republicans in Name Only, to do the right thing tomorrow? How do we convince Congress?" How crucial that might be when it gets to Elliot's point about trying

to bring in people you can, not necessarily the big names, but who might know things.

HARWOOD: I think it's important to fill out a picture that seems fairly clear. We know Donald Trump was encouraging people to raise hell on January 6th.

The question is, was he encouraging them to do exactly what they did?

And many of the enablers around Trump were doing the same thing. Many of those Congress people, Mel Brooks. Rudy Giuliani said it out loud at the rally.

I think the challenge for prosecutors as well as the January 6th committee, is that Trump always manages to preserve a little bit of deniability. He speaks somewhat elliptically. He doesn't write things down.

So I think you can get more and more circumstantial evidence that points toward the idea that he incited this. He wanted something dramatic to happen.

But if, as for linking that to the actual crimes, the assaults on police officers, I think that's going to be a challenge for prosecutors.

And we haven't seen indication that they believe they can make a case certainly against Donald Trump yet.

MATTINGLY: Yes. Not yet. Still many more steps to come.

Elliot Williams, John Harwood, thanks so much, guys.

WILLIAMS: Thank you.

[17:49:30]

MATTINGLY: All right, coming up, Elon Musk always reaches for the stars, but this time, he could hit the moon, literally, thanks to an out-of-control space rocket.

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MATTINGLY: It could be a crash of cosmic proportions. A rogue rocket booster could collide with the moon in a few weeks.

The SpaceX Falcon 9 rocket stage was used in 2015 to launch a deep space climate observatory. It has been floating in outer space ever since.

Weighing three to four tons, the rocket booster is expected to hit the far side of the moon in March and could potentially carve out a 65- foot crater. How about that?

And there's a new member of the Biden family living in the White House. Meet first cat, Willow.

She's a short-haired two-year-old gray tabby. Willow was named after Willow Grove, Pennsylvania, the first lady, Jill Biden's, hometown.

Jill Biden first met Willow at a 2020 campaign spot when the cat jumped on stage and immediately bonded with the first lady.

Last time there was a pet cat at the White House was in the George W. Bush administration. As a dog person, I remain skeptical. We'll see.

[17:55:06]

All right, thanks for joining us. I'm Phil Mattingly in Washington. Jim Acosta is back tomorrow at 4:00 p.m. Eastern.

For now, I'm turning it over to my pal, Pamela Brown. She takes over in the CNN NEWSROOM, live, after a quick break.

Have a wonderful Saturday night.

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