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Podcast Host Says She's Pausing Spotify-Exclusive Series; GOP Sen. Graham Praises Fellow South Carolinian and Potential Supreme Court Nominee J. Michelle Childs; Top Lawmakers Confident About Bipartisan Deal on Russian Sanctions; Interview with Rep. Ami Bera (D- CA); Russian State TV Claims Western Media is Provoking War; Thousands Left without Power after Record Snowfall; Anti-Vaccine Protesters Hold Rally in Ottawa for Second Day. Aired 2-3p ET

Aired January 30, 2022 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:00:28]

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. Thank you so much for joining me this Sunday. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.

U.S. officials are watching a new development along the Ukraine border with Russia. Two senior defense officials tell CNN there are indications Russia has now positioned blood supplies in the area. The U.S. meantime placed as many as 8,500 U.S. troops on heightened alert last week to prepare to deploy to NATO allies in eastern Europe.

Republican Senator Rob Portman said today the U.S. is firm in its commitment to support Ukraine. And other lawmakers say a bipartisan deal on Russian sanctions is also about to get through Congress.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SENATOR ROB PORTMAN (R-OH): President Zelensky obviously is trying to maintain his economic growth in his country which by the way, is pretty strong right now, and keep the country from panicking while having them be prepared. But we're together. That's what's important.

SENATOR ROBERT MENENDEZ (D-NJ): There are some sanctions that really could take place up front because of what Russia has already done. Cyberattacks on Ukraine, false flag operations, the efforts to undermine the Ukrainian government internally.

JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON SPOKESMAN: Imminent means it could happen really honestly at any time. Now when I say "it", it depends on what Vladimir Putin might want to do.

Again, as Secretary Austin said on Friday, he has a lot of options, a lot of capability available to him. He could do something on a small scale or he could do something on a fairly large scale. And he continues to add troops to that border with Ukraine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: The U.S. has also called a meeting of the United Nations Security Council tomorrow to work on a diplomatic solution. The U.S. ambassador stressing they want real diplomacy to happen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LINDA THOMAS-GREENFIELD, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO THE UNITED NATIONS: We're going to go in the room prepared to listen to them, but we're not going to be distracted by their propaganda, and we're going to be prepared to respond to any disinformation that they attempt to spread during this meeting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right. Let's bring in Congressman Ami Bera. He's a Democrat from California and member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee. He was also part of a bipartisan congressional delegation that went to Ukraine earlier this month. Good to see you, Congressman.

REP. AMI BERA (D-CA): Good to see you, Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: All right. So Russia continues to make moves to support its troops at the Ukraine border, including possibly sending blood supplies to the region. Is this Vladimir Putin doing military theater, or is this Russia really preparing for any imminent invasion?

BERA: You know, you never can tell. We were in Brussels meeting with our NATO allies last week as well as our European Union allies and then in Kyiv. We flew home last night.

And, you know, we're taking this very seriously. And if they are indeed moving blood supplies, that often is an indication of an imminent invasion. That said, it could also be Putin playing a poker hand and bluffing to try to get a better hand in negotiations.

Our message to the Ukrainians in a bipartisan way is Congress is with you. I mean this is a young, budding democracy. When you talk to the citizens on the street, they don't want to go back to a Soviet way of life and they are ready to fight for their freedoms and their country.

And those of us that value democracy, value the rule of law and freedom of choice have to be there to support the Ukrainian people.

WHITFIELD: At the same time, are you at all concerned about Ukraine's president's message that the U.S. and allies talking about an invasion is unnecessary, if not at the very least unsettling, inside his country? How do you handle that?

BERA: Yes. We met with President Zelensky. We also met with his foreign minister and minister of defense. I understand his concern about the impact, you know, very broad statements about imminent war is having on his economy and so forth.

That said, he reassured us that the country, Ukraine, is getting ready to defend itself and the people will be ready to stand up and defend themselves. They just need the support of the European Union, the United States, and other democratic nations, as well as, you know, some economic support and the military support.

And I think President Biden has been pretty firm in his conviction that we're going to do everything we have to do to help support the Ukrainian people as they defend themselves.

WHITFIELD: There's a bipartisan package of Russia sanctions moving its way through Congress right now. Do you think the U.S. should be sanctioning Russia and Putin before any military action?

[14:04:58]

BERA: You know, there's a debate taking place on whether you do preemptive sanctions or wait until Russia does something.

You know, I fall on the side that says let's have those sanctions ready. Let's make sure the president has the authorities that he needs to both give aid to the Ukrainian government and people, but also to have the sanctions that would be very binding on the Soviet Union and the Soviet people to try to deter president Putin from making a decision that shouldn't really have a role in the 21st century.

WHITFIELD: Besides support, what else did President Zelensky say to you and the delegation when you all met with him earlier in the month?

BERA: You know, he understands that the United States is standing with this young democracy in Ukraine. That we stand with the Ukrainian government and the people of Ukraine.

And, you know, our conversations with the European Union is, for the most part, all the European allies are also standing with Ukraine as well as NATO. He wants us to be ready and prepared.

Obviously, he has some concerns that, you know, our preparations do look like there's an imminent war that's going to take place. But we don't -- we're planning for the worst and again hoping that Mr. Putin comes to his senses here.

WHITFIELD: So Russia's Putin has said he doesn't want Ukraine to be able to join NATO. Either, what's the message or even what's the role the U.S. can or should play in that?

BERA: You know, that's up to the Ukrainian people, as well as the various NATO countries. At this point, there's not an imminent move for Ukraine to join NATO. And they're not asking for NATO troops to enter Ukraine. They're fully prepared to defend their own country.

It's not up to Mr. Putin to decide. It's up to the people of Ukraine and the government of Ukraine to decide what their path forward is.

WHITFIELD: U.S. Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin said Friday that Russia was following its playbook and maybe looking to undermine the Ukrainian government from within the country. Some of that already appears to be going on. In your view, might that escalate? BERA: You know, certainly we have to be prepared for all the tools

that Mr. Putin may use. Asymmetric warfare, cyberattacks, which he's already done on Ukraine as well as internal upheaval. You know, his history is that he tries to create chaos in a country and then tries to come in and act like he's the peacekeeper to maintain the peace.

That's not happening. You know, I was in Kyiv yesterday in the morning and talked to folks and that isn't the case. There's relative calm. This is a young, budding democracy and again, the people there have said they don't want a path that goes back to the Soviet Union. They want a path that protects their freedoms and their individual choice to determine their own future.

WHITFIELD: On that trip, before you departed last night, were you able to gauge what ordinary Ukrainians are thinking and feeling?

BERA: We were. We were able to go out and meet with ordinary citizens, chat with folks. And they understand the potential threat. They're also very, you know, they reminded us that they've been at war with Russia since 2014 when Russia occupied Crimea.

They continue to have daily loss of life and weekly loss of life in the Donbas Region. So they've been fighting with Russia for the last eight years and are ready to escalate that fight should Russia choose to invade or use other asymmetric methods.

WHITFIELD: All right. Congressman Ami Bera, good to see you. Thank you so much.

BERA: Good to see you, too. Thank you.

WHITFIELD: All right. While the crisis along the border with Ukraine continues to simmer, the propaganda war in Russia is already full blown.

CNN's Nic Robertson has been looking at this. Nic, what have you found?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes. I mean, look, the Kremlin has really cleaned out independent media from the pretty much from the media scene in Russia. So there are key state broadcasters and really push the Kremlin line. And they take western media, parody it, point out everything that's wrong with it.

There's one particular, or a couple of particular coverages that they like. Tucker Carlson from Fox is one of those, and the Russian broadcasters here are putting on their air. They like the things that he's saying because for them it fits in with their image of what's happening.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROBERTSON: On Russian state TV, western media are getting ridiculed. Like it or not, they think independent journalists are propagandists for the U.S. government, creating a provocation for war.

[14:09:50]

VLADIMIR SOLOVYOV, TV HOST CH 1: You have no idea what's happening in our mind. You have no idea about our history. You have no idea what Russia is about. You have no idea what Ukraine is about. About our mutual history. Why we have a problem.

ROBERTSON: Vladimir Solovyov hosts his own show, proudly pushes the Kremlin's views and Fox anchor Tucker Carlson.

SOLOVYOV: He's a funny guy. Has his own point of view. He hates Biden, loves Trump. So what?

ROBERTSON: No irony that in Russia, unlike America, criticizing the president is off limits and never more so than now. In the past year, independent media here have been almost completely crushed.

EKATERINA KOTRIKADZE, HOST, TV RAIN: It's a feeling of tense. And it's all the time. You can never be -- you can never be sure that tomorrow you will be -- you will be all right. You can never be sure that tomorrow your TV station will still be alive.

ROBERTSON: Ekaterina Kotrikadze is an anchor at TV Rain, one of Russia's last independent stations. It is designated a foreign agent, (INAUDIBLE) Kremlin law that can snuff it out. She's all too familiar with state TV's manipulations. How they use western media and play Carlson against his broadcast colleagues.

KOTRIKADZE: They just like that there is a person who says, are we going to fight Russia because of this corrupted eastern European country that we even cannot find on the map? So as soon as he says something that is not in the direction that they need, he's not going to be a friend anymore.

ROBERTSON: In Russia's propaganda war, truth doesn't matter. What counts is stopping a war they are convinced America is fomenting.

TUCKER CARLSON, FOX NEWS HOST: So at this point, NATO exists primarily to torment Vladimir Putin.

ROBERTSON: At home facing accusations of being a pro-Putin stooge, Carlson has defended some of his pro-Russia comments and said he is not a Russian agent. So will he lose his war-stopping value in Russia?

SOLOVYOV: Come on, sir. This poor guy from Fox News? Well, I like that you think -- Russian spy, colonel of Russian (INAUDIBLE)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ROBERTSON: Yes. It's not really the way any respectable journalist would want to be portrayed but that's part of the problem here. Once you get caught up in the Kremlin's spin cycle here, there's no way of telling how the machine is going to spit you out, Fred.

WHITFIELD: Yes, very unsettling, but a great viewpoint that you just presented to us. Thank you so much.

Nic Robertson, appreciate that.

WHITFIELD: All right.

Still ahead in the NEWSROOM, records broken across the northeast of the U.S. as cities dig out from that historic storm. The snowfall may be over, but the bitter cold and biting winds are sticking around.

Plus, much of downtown Ottawa brought to a standstill for a second day as a convoy of truckers and their supporters protest vaccine mandates. And Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and his family, who live nearby, now at an undisclosed location.

And later, the troubles for Spotify continue to mount. We'll tell you the latest big name to drop the streaming platform.

[14:13:21]

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WHITFIELD: All right. Today thousands in the northeast remain without power after this weekend's bomb cyclone nor'easter. The powerful winter storm that knocked out power lines also broke snowfall records in several cities.

While the worst of the snow has passed, the danger is not over yet. Strong winds mixing with cold temperatures are creating windchills of 10 to 20 degrees below zero in some areas. Also states as far south as Florida are feeling this arctic chill with the coldest air there in over a decade.

The storm also continues to create headaches for travelers with more than 1,400 additional flight cancellations in the U.S. today.

CNN's Polo Sandoval is live for us in a very chilly, brutally chilly Boston. Polo, describe what you're experiencing there and everybody else.

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Fred, at least you could see me now, right. Remember about 24 hours ago, there were blinding, snowy conditions. It's amazing what 24 hours can do.

Now, the biggest, biggest concern are power outages right now in parts of Massachusetts which at last check only about 50,000 people still in the dark and that's a number that has been dropping since officials and first responders have been able to get out and fix that.

In terms of aftermath (INAUDIBLE) well, this I the extent of it. It's blacktop. I mean, the city doing a heck of a job making sure that these roads are clear. In fact, at daybreak when we were out here earlier this morning, these roads were already clear.

So clearly Boston knows how to get it done in terms of just digging itself out. Now, it doesn't mean that some of those side streets, some people are still going to have their cars basically buried by the snow. You're looking at 23.6 inches that fell in Boston. That tied the record for single day snowfall that was set back in 2003. So yes, this neck of the woods definitely used to seeing winter storms.

But these kind of storms are few and far between. The last official blizzard that Boston experienced was back in 2018, that is until yesterday. So really just kind of adds a little bit of context in terms of what it's looking like today, it's definitely a winter business day as usual here in Boston. A lot of stuff is open. A lot of people out and about. A lot of people are sledding.

So again, the biggest, biggest, biggest worry right now are some of those folks who have -- are still in the dark getting them back online, travel also. It's not going to be very easy. There's still a lot of flight cancellations in and out of Boston Logan and all surrounding areas as well.

WHITFIELD: All right. Pretty tough for a few more days at a minimum it seems.

All right. Polo Sandoval, thank you so much.

SANDOVAL: Yes.

[14:19:49]

WHITFIELD: All right.

Well, this weekend's storm didn't stop one Rhode Island couple from tying the knot.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I now present to you, Mr. And Mrs. Sally and Adam Irujo (ph).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: The happy couple say they had a wedding date of January 29th set for more than a year and despite warnings of this historic blizzard, they proceeded with their plans to get married outside of Providence's public library surrounded by friends and family.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SALLY IRUJO, MARRIED DURING MASSIVE BLIZZARD: It feels amazing to have all these people we love around us here to share this day with us and celebrate and have a snowball fight hopefully once I get some gloves on these fingers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right. Despite nearly two feet of snow recorded in Providence, this happy couple said snow problem and said their I dos.

All right. Still ahead -- a massive protest is under way in downtown Ottawa over vaccine mandates in Canada. And the prime minister moved to an undisclosed location.

We're live in Ottawa with the latest next.

[14:25:55]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right.

A growing anti-vaccine mandate protest in Canada's capital as Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and his family move to an undisclosed location away from the protests. Big rig trucks, cars and protesters now filling the streets of downtown Ottawa for a second day. The truckers drove cross-country in a so-called freedom convoy to rally against the country's vaccine mandates.

Ottawa police say several investigations are under way following the desecration of a national war memorial during the protests.

CNN's Paula Newton is in Ottawa for us. So Paula, what is the situation today?

PAULA NEWTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, I just got back from the protests, as close as I could get. I can tell you the downtown streets are still gridlocked. And there was a lot of enthusiasm there as well today, Fred.

You know, yesterday perhaps we had more people and more rigs but city of Ottawa police are really doing a good job of trying to keep it contained to the downtown core. In that downtown core, it is gridlock. And that means, you know, a lot of the stores have had to close.

And as you just described, there have been some disturbing moments. The one on the war memorial, there was making the rounds on social media and that disturbed many.

Just to remind everyone. This was to be a truckers' mandate right -- protest, pardon. And they were protesting that mandate to get vaccinated. That applies not just in Canada, Fred, but in the U.S. as well. Still they started this cross-country voyage and that's when it touched a nerve with so many Canadians that said look, we are fed up with these public health restrictions.

Take a listen to what some of them said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're here for the future of Canada.

You can't lock up healthy people and expect them to remain healthy, ok? So the children have not been in school. I personally believe that is wrong.

They -- we need to drop the mask, drop the mandates and start living our lives again. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This convoy is all about freedom. It's not only

with the truck drivers. It's actually for every single person. You, me, buddy down the road. It doesn't matter. It's all about your free choice.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NEWTON: Now Fred, I want to point out that is a significant and vocal minority but it's still a minority. Nearly 90 percent of all eligible adults in this country are now vaccinated.

That is not (AUDIO GAP) protest. The point is there are thousands of people and hundreds of cars and rigs stalled in this city. Parliament is supposed to return tomorrow. How do you unwind this?

And that's what has a lot of people here on edge. You mentioned that Prime Minister Justin Trudeau is in an undisclosed location with his family. The house --

WHITFIELD: Looks like we lost that signal. Thank you so much, Paula Newton, for that report.

We did got the gist of it, though. Still unclear when Trudeau and his family might return.

All right. Still ahead, more artists are threatening to take their work off Spotify as the streaming service sides with Joe Rogan and his dangerous COVID misinformation campaign over some of the greatest artists of all time.

We'll discuss straight ahead.

[14:28:23]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:33:03]

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN HOST: All right. First, music giant Neil Young, then icon Joni Mitchell splitting ways with Spotify. And now, Brene Brown, the host of two exclusive podcasts, says she's hitting pause on releasing new episodes on the platform.

"The New York Times" best-selling author apologized to fans in a tweet but stopped short of offering a reason for her decision.

Brown's move comes after big stars that I just mentioned and others, including Prince Harry and Meghan Markle have spoken out about Spotify's role in vaccine misinformation spread.

CNN's Natasha Chen joining us now with more on this.

Natasha, how is Spotify responding if at all, right now?

NATASHA CHEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Fred, Spotify has not responded to CNN's request for comment, but the platform did give a statement to "The New York Times" on Wednesday saying essentially that they have a great responsibility in balancing the safety of the listeners and the freedom of the creators. Also adding that Spotify has removed about 20,000 podcasts related to COVID since the pandemic began.

Spotify also said that it regrets Neil Young's decision to remove his music but hopes to be able to welcome him back.

Now since then, this has gone far beyond Neil Young. Brene brown now putting out her statement and most recently we're hearing from Nils Lofgren for Bruce Springsteen's E Street Band. He said: We encourage all musicians, artists and music lovers everywhere to stand with us all and cut ties with Spotify.

Of course, Lofgren was also part of a band very closely associated with Neil Young. And also Prince Harry and Meghan Markle.

They have a deal with Spotify to host and produce a number of podcasts for the platform. And here's what a spokesperson for their foundation said: Our co-founders began expressing concerns for our partners at Spotify about the all too real consequences of COVID-19 misinformation on its platform.

[14:35:09]

We look to Spotify to meet this moment and are committed to continuing our work together as it does.

So the spokesperson there also said this has been a conversation they've had with Spotify starting in progress of last year. This all follows an open letter to Spotify written earlier this month by about 250 doctors, nurses and scientists, very concerned about the spread of misinformation, particularly naming Joe Rogan's podcast but saying that's just an example of the type of misinformation that is spread on the platform, saying that it really damages the trust in science and data-driven guidance offered by the medical professionals, citing really crazy claims about the mRNA vaccines being gene therapy, promoting Ivermectin as a treatment to COVID-19, discouraging vaccination in young children and young people.

So a lot of problematic statements that the scientific community has flagged and, of course, now we're seeing all the celebrities come forward in this movement -- Fred.

WHITFIELD: All right. We'll see what's next or what the next chapter might be.

All right. Natasha Chen, thanks so much.

Meantime, let's discuss based on the information we do know. With me now is "Variety's" senior music editor Jem Aswad.

Jem, good to see you again.

So, one has to wonder with all of this criticism, you know, that Spotify is facing, do you expect that they will continue to stand by Joe Rogan?

JEM ASWAD, SENIOR MUSIC EDITOR, VARIETY: Well, they have to do something. They may stand by him. I'm sure they're in deep conversation with Neil Young and Joni Mitchell's management, possibly Nils Lofgren's as well. And there are other podcasters having problems with it.

They have to fix this. Whether that means they cut ties with Joe Rogan, that seems the most extreme option. Or he says he's not going to talk about vaccines anymore on his show. They've got to find some kind of compromise.

It seems something has to happen because it's just going to get worse and worse. There's a rock band that posted a sign on their Spotify page saying, delete Spotify, which is -- I don't really mean to laugh at that, but it's kind of funny because people see it when it says recommended for you and it's a rock band called Belly and what they see is delete Spotify on Spotify.

WHITFIELD: I mean, the pressure is mounting clearly from a lot of the musicians. But if Spotify has already said in a statement that "The New York Times" had that it has a great responsibility, you know, in, quote, unquote, balancing messages, when that does not sign post that they're going to try and give any artist or anyone who shares this platform any kind of ultimatum.

ASWAD: One hundred percent. But this is business. And the decision to effectively side with Joe Rogan over Neil Young, over Joni Mitchell was a business decision. And if podcasters are not going to be doing their shows, if they're going to be outspoken in their opposition to this stance, they need to figure it out.

And, you know, it's going to reach a point where sticking with Joe Rogan or at least in his current form, becomes more damaging for their business, than not sticking with him, that's a choice they're going to have to make.

WHITFIELD: Do you see that this, you know, there will be some kind of added momentum, you know, in what Neil Young and the stand that Joni Mitchell, the stand that they are taking that other artists will say, wait a minute. I recognize that the money and influence that I might have would actually be used for some real big universal good here to try to make sure that misinformation just doesn't continue to run rampant.

ASWAD: Well, yes. And the reason this is such a big deal doesn't have as much to do with Neil Young. It's just tying into the larger anti- vax conspiracy conversations.

And what we're seeing right now is a lot of other streaming services and a lot of other music companies are trying to like sort of jump into the gap. Like Apple Music is trying to use the situation to get more listeners. And Neil Young even pointed to Amazon saying like, oh, you can hear my music in great quality over here on Amazon.

Well, those companies are hardly occupying moral high ground. You look at their -- some of their employee policies. You look at how much taxes they have paid. You know, there's -- there is no moral high ground in this universe, despite what they're saying.

WHITFIELD: So you see another argument, a similar argument is going to be made about Sirius XM Radio, which relaunched a stadium featuring music from Neil Young.

[14:40:05]

But then that service also hosts shows by a number of far right figures or has controversial programming that, you know, shares some similar views to, say, a Joe Rogan.

So do you see a real conflict here for, you know, someone like Neil Young leaving Spotify but then finding home at Sirius XM?

ASWAD: Well, there's certainly a contradiction at work there. I'm not sure that Sirius XM's right-leaning broadcast has anywhere near the audience that Joe Rogan's does because you're talking about one show on a giant network.

But, yeah, there are an awful lot of contradictions to point at here and, frankly, Neil Young has always owned the contradictions in some of his stances, like the news section on his website is called contrarian times. But you know, it's a -- there's nothing perfect. There's no, like, really white streaming service you can have and they're really very similar on the face of it in a lot of ways.

So, you know, I -- what I see happening is Spotify coming to terms with Neil Young and Joni Mitchell because they've reached the point where they kind of have to and things move on from there and once they've resolved the dispute with Neil and Joni, then the other artists will have less reason at least outwardly for the stance they're taking.

WHITFIELD: Interesting. All right. Jem Aswad, good to see you. Thanks so much.

ASWAD: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: Still ahead --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC): I can't think of a better person for President Biden to consider for the Supreme Court than Michelle Childs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: We'll hear more of Senator Lindsey Graham's glowing endorsement of J. Michelle Childs for the Supreme Court and why he says it's good not to have someone from Harvard or Yale.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:46:31]

WHITFIELD: A key Republican is praising President Biden's only confirmed candidate for the U.S. Supreme Court. It's believed the president is considering several black women to replace retiring Justice Stephen Breyer. He said so.

But so far, the White House has only confirmed South Carolina Judge J. Michelle Childs on that publicized list of candidates. Today, South Carolina GOP Senator Lindsey Graham gave Childs a glowing recommendation.

For more on this, let's bring in Suzanne Malveaux on Capitol Hill.

Suzanne, how important is it that Graham is supporting her in this way?

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, hello, Fred. I mean, it does offer some bipartisan -- potentially bipartisan support which is always a good thing, but Senate Democrats don't believe it's really necessary. They believe that they have the 50 votes to push it forward in the Senate. The 48 Democrats, the two independents that caucus with them.

But they would like to see some possible Republicans. Senator Murkowski, Lisa Murkowski or Susan Collins or even a Senator Lindsey Graham, all of them who supported the Obama administration nominees to the Supreme Court. But they do express a sense that they are ready for this process.

We saw Senator Dick Durbin, the chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, this morning saying that his committee will be ready for when the president does pick that nominee. They will have their papers, their staff together for those hearings that will take place in the course of a couple of months.

But the reason why Senator Graham essentially is making news today is because he is departing from some of his colleagues, Republican senator roger wicker being one of them who have floated this very offensive notion that this is some sort of beneficiary of affirmative action policy, a not-so-veiled implication here that these candidates would not be qualified for the position.

Senator Graham outright this morning rejecting all of that and pushing for his support for the candidate from his home state. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRAHAM: I can't think of a better person for President Biden to consider for the Supreme Court than Michelle Childs. She has wide support in our state. She's considered to be a fair-minded, highly gifted jurist.

She's one of the most decent people I've ever met. She's highly qualified. She's of good character.

And we'll see how she does, if she's nominated, but I cannot say anything bad about Michelle Childs. She is an awesome person.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: And House Majority Whip James Clyburn, as you know, also from South Carolina, making it no secret that he has been pushing and lobbying for her. The course of the last several years and has the ear of the president. Really saved his campaign, if you will, and that is his candidate of choice.

He makes the case here, Fred, that she is diverse within this diverse group, that she is from the south, that she doesn't have an Ivy League background, but, again, don't want to get ahead of this whole process here.

There's a number of very distinguished people that the president is considering on that list, including Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson as well as Leondra Kruger and many others, Fred. So we'll see how this plays in the months ahead.

WHITFIELD: All right. Will indeed. Thank you, Suzanne Malveaux.

Philando Castile, Daunte Wright, Walter Scott. These are some of the men now known all across the country after being killed during traffic stops.

[14:50:03]

And they're not alone. Black drivers are twice as likely as white drivers to be pulled over. And they are four times as likely as white drivers to be searched according to a University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill study.

CNN's Sara Sidner has been investigating these traffic stops. We'll hear from her, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:55:02]

WHITFIELD: Traffic stops are the most common interaction between police and civilians, which can be potentially deadly for both. So should the way police enforce traffic be reformed? Not just for civilians but for the safety of police, too?

CNN's upcoming special report "Traffic Stop: Dangerous Encounters" explores that and more. Here's a preview.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHIEF LERONNE ARMSTRONG, OAKLAND POLICE: What we're trying to do is get away from the old practice of saturating areas with police officers and stopping everybody you can until you find the right person. When we focus in on specific vehicles that we know are responsible for certain crimes like a shooting. When we have a video of a car that was just shooting at another individual, or responsible for a homicide. SARA SIDNER, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): And they

turn video or photos or information around as soon as they get it.

So you're getting real time information coming in as you're working?

SGT. GEDAM GEBREMICHAEL, OAKLAND POLICE: That's correct.

SIDNER: That's what happened shortly after we stopped by the scene of a shooting at a gas station.

GEBREMICHAEL: So this information was sent out, the actual suspect vehicle from this shooting right now.

SIDNER: Oh, wow. I mean, this just happened and you've already got the suspect vehicle.

GEBREMICHAEL: Exactly. And it's distinct. So, now, throughout the day, I'm looking for this car. If I see a Cadillac I'm going to pull up this picture.

SIDNER: And as we drive, he does just that.

GEBREMICHAEL: Let's look at that photo. That one has a spoiler. This one doesn't.

SIDNER: So no stop.

A short time later, we spot another Cadillac parked. Plates stripped. Nobody inside.

GEBREMICHAEL: And if you compare the photo, you're comparing the rims, right?

SIDNER: Look. Look. There's a hat. It looks exactly the same.

GEBREMICHAEL: Let's see.

SIDNER: Are those bullet holes?

GEBREMICHAEL: I think you need to be a detective.

Can I get a cover unit, code two?

SIDNER: It turned out to be the alleged shooter's car.

ARMSTRONG: We have reduced the number of overall stops by nearly 60 percent. And that's intentional. We need to stop stopping make traffic stops that are not actually meeting our overall goal, which is reducing violent crime.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: Detective -- I mean, Sara Sidner joins us now.

Sara, so I wonder in that clip we just saw, it just reminded me, a lot of us reporters have done police ride-alongs in our careers. But one thing that is distinctively different now is that real-time video that you just showed us. What else is different about the, you know, what police are up against and the tools they're using now?

SIDNER: Look, you heard from Chief LeRonne Armstrong there, and he's the chief of the Oakland Police Department. He is an Oakland native. He has been in that department for a very, very long time and has risen to the position of chief.

And he talked about how intelligence-based policing, when it comes to these things like traffic enforcement, is really, really important in that city. Mind you, the city has had an explosion, several other cities in this nation have had, of homicides. And so they're trying to balance with a fewer number of police officers and the number of traffic enforcements that they used to do with this rise in violent crime, especially homicides.

He says, look, if we use intelligence-based policing in the streets as we would with anything else, we will probably come across and the numbers have shown, they have fewer stops, traffic stops, but more arrests for things like violent crimes because they have this real- time video. It's sent out to all of the officers on the street. They know if there's a make and model of a car involved in a homicide or shooting. They know what that is.

They'll be able to look for that specific make and model as opposed to just pulling over some any old person that may not have noticed that their back light is out and they say it seems to be working, according to their numbers. It's something they've been doing for a while as policy and it's not necessarily something legislated, for example.

But the police are recognizing this relationship, especially between black drivers in particular who get pulled over many more times than white drivers, and the police, that relationship is aggravated if you keep pulling people over for very small things and asking them about guns and drugs and holding them and only then finding nothing most of the time. That aggravation lifts that level of problems between the community and policing.

So they're recognizing that and trying something different. They say it's working, Fred.

WHITFIELD: And, so, Sara, that word reformed is bounced around a lot whether in the civilian community or police community. And it can also be received in very different ways. So what are you finding?

SIDNER: Yeah. There are a couple of reforms in other cities, one in particular that has police unions and police officers very concerned. One of those is in Brooklyn Center, Minnesota. You know what happened there with Daunte Wright and the officer who was convicted of manslaughter.

In that city, they passed legislation that says they're looking to try to create an unarmed civilian force that goes around and stops people for very minor traffic violations. The police unions and some police officers are saying, whoa.