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Boris Johnson Lifting COVID Restrictions; Ottawa Police Clear Out Trucker Protests; Putin Set to Speak as U.S. Warns Russian Invasion Could Be Hours Away. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired February 21, 2022 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:00]

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN HOST: "LBJ: Triumph and Tragedy" continues tonight at 9:00 p.m. Eastern time on CNN.

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ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

DANA BASH, CNN HOST: Hello to our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Dana Bash, in for Ana Cabrera.

The breaking news this hour, the man fueling the crisis with Ukraine, Russian President Vladimir Putin, is set to speak very soon. We will bring that to you live, this as U.S. National Security Adviser Jake Sullivan says an extremely violent attack on Ukraine could begin in the coming days or even hours.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAKE SULLIVAN, U.S. NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: We also have intelligence to suggest that there will be an even greater form of brutality, because this will not simply be some conventional war between two armies.

It will be a war waged by Russia on the Ukrainian people to repress them, to crush them, to harm them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Frantic attempts at a diplomatic solution to the crisis are continuing. Secretary of State Antony Blinken revealing to me on CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION" that President Biden would be open to a summit with Vladimir Putin, but only if Russia does not invade Ukraine. And, today, a senior U.S. official is telling CNN that the U.S. sees no slowdown in Russian military preparation and readiness.

And it's happening in plain sight. New satellite images you see right there, they show Russian troops ramping up their activity close to Ukraine's northeastern border. The U.S. also says it has new evidence that Russia is identifying Ukrainians to be killed or sent to camps if there is a full invasion.

We have got our CNN correspondents covering all of the developments on the ground and around the world.

Jim Sciutto, you see, is in Ukraine. Kaitlan Collins is here in Washington at the White House. Nic Robertson is in Moscow.

And I want to start with you, Nic.

What do we expect to hear from Vladimir Putin when he speaks shortly?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes, he spent the afternoon on television having a big national security gathering of all his top officials, security officials.

And the briefing was trying to decide whether or not to recognize the independence of Luhansk and Donetsk, those two pro-Russian separatists regions in the Donbass area in the east of Ukraine. And at the very end of that meeting, President Putin said: "I will have an answer today."

So I think there's a huge expectation that he's going to announce his answer. It's not clear what it will be. But he's absolutely been teed up by all his officials towards the point of recognizing them. There's already been a vote in Parliament about a week ago. It is President Putin's decision to take right now.

His officials were telling him that Ukraine no longer has an interest in Donbass. The former prime minister and former President Dmitry Medvedev said, actually, they don't want the Donbass region anymore. He was told by one of his top negotiators that the Ukrainians no longer want to negotiate in good faith, they no longer want to negotiate the Minsk peace agreement.

So Putin has been primed here to potentially now recognize the independence of these pro-Russian separatists areas. What that means is, it means, it would appear, that he is shutting down the avenue of politics and diplomacy to solving that conflict in Ukraine.

It doesn't mean he will necessarily order his forces into Ukraine, although that may be a follow-through result of what he says tonight. But, at the moment, Russia is prepped and primed for a very big speech by President Putin, one that could be momentous. And if it does send troops into Ukraine, then, of course, that Would define a whole new era between Russia, the United States, Europe, NATO. It will be a different world if he does.

BASH: A different world, a whole new era that we haven't seen since 1945, the end of World War II.

And, Jim Sciutto, you have been talking to sources in the American government and governments in and around the region. I want to hear what you're hearing from them, but also just to play off of what Nic was just reporting about the Donbass region in Ukraine. And as we prepare for the Russian president to speak, if he does talk about the -- quote, unquote -- "independence" of that region, what will that mean in real terms?

Why is that so significant?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think one thing we have to note when discussing that region is that this is part of Ukraine, that this is inside the sovereign territory and borders of Ukraine.

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And this sort of movement for independence there did not happen spontaneously. It happened deliberately after eight years of Russian intervention there in a whole host of ways, including claiming crimes against ethnic Russians there that don't exist, that there's no evidence of, issuing passports for the people there, sending weapons into there, arming separatists there, putting a missile system in the Eastern Ukraine that shot down a passenger plane over Europe and killed 300 people.

So this is not a spontaneous event there. It is something that has been part of Russian efforts for nearly a decade now and will be as legal, right, in international terms as Russia's annexation of Crimea, which is still not recognized by the international community.

We should note that to push back on whatever description the Russian president might do if he were to make an announcement tonight. The other point I would make -- and you referenced just the U.S. view of the threat to Ukraine, Dana -- is that, while you have had this talk of diplomacy and a summit, et cetera, the facts on the ground have remained the same in terms of Russian military movements, and in fact, gotten worse, as you noted, more forces going closer to the border, as we reported last night, orders being sent to cat tactical commanders to prepare for the invasion.

And this morning, I was told by senior U.S. official that those movements and decisions are not slowing down, even as we have this talk of renewed diplomacy.

BASH: And, Kaitlan Collins over at the White House National Security Adviser Jake Sullivan was particularly blunt in his assessment today.

Talk about what he said with regard to really what Jim was talking about, the potential for not just a military invasion, but a pretty brutal one. And, also, as you answer that, the fact that the administration, their strategy is to be so public, so transparent with what they say they are hearing and seeing in intelligence has really been interesting and different from what we have seen in the past.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: It is. And it's on purpose.

They are intentionally doing that. And they say look at what they have been saying so far, and all of it has kind of played out. And, obviously, the White House will be watching this upcoming speech by President Putin very closely to see what he says, because if he does say that they are going to grant this so-called recognition of these breakaway Ukrainian regions as independent, that's kind of feeding into exactly what the White House has been saying would happen leading up to a potential invasion, saying that he is going to create and manufacture excuses to put more Russian forces in certain places.

And that could be part of that whole narrative of building that up and justifying why he would send Russian forces into Ukraine. And so you heard Secretary Blinken say yesterday the playbook, as they have been talking about it, has essentially been playing out all along.

And Jake Sullivan saying this morning that right now every indication they have is that they are still headed for a major attack. And he's talking about the nature of what this is going to look like, saying that, in his view, based on the intelligence that they have gathered, this isn't going to be some kind of conventional warfare.

He says the intention of Russia is to go in and to crush the Ukrainian people, to repress them, saying that this is going to be -- quote -- "extremely violent" if it does happen. And they are saying that they are on the path to they do believe it's going to happen.

And there has been some talk, of course, overnight after the French president put out a readout of his calls yesterday with President Biden and President Putin, of this idea of a potential Biden-Putin summit, kind of similar to the one that we saw in Geneva last year.

But the White House is really downplaying the likelihood of that, saying that there is no format, there is no date, there is no time figured out for that yet, because they believe, of course, that summit -- and they say that they're open to one happening and open to dialogue between these two presidents -- is contingent and dependent upon whether or not a Russian invasion happens.

And they are basically saying that we could be hours away, days away from a Russian invasion. And so they're very much downplaying the likelihood of a summit like that happening at all.

I think they're kind of waiting to see how this meeting on Thursday between Secretary Blinken and the Russian foreign minister goes, and we should note that, as this is going on today here at the White House, we have not seen President Biden, but he is getting briefed by the CIA director, by the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, all of these top national security officials who have been here at the White House. BASH: All right, Kaitlan and Jim, don't go far. We're going to get

back to you if and when -- not if and when -- when we hear from Vladimir Putin.

Jim -- excuse me, Nic and Kaitlan, stay with us.

Jim, I want you to join the conversation that I'm going to have right now with Colonel Cedric Leighton. He is a CNN military analyst and retired air force colonel.

Thank you so much for joining us.

So, Colonel Leighton, the question about what Vladimir Putin has been saying all day that Nic just reported, the indication that perhaps what we're going to hear from him momentarily, that -- it suggests that he is, just to say in layman's terms, preparing to go into what's known as the Donbass region, which is in Northeastern Ukraine.

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What is the significance of that?

COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, Dana, it's usually significant, because what that means, just like Jim was mentioning, is it really upending every single thing that we have come to believe about international relations in the last 30, 40 years.

What we're talking about is taking another country's territory by force without any treaty arrangements with that country that you're taking stuff from. And that is going to be a significant change. I think, from a military standpoint, in addition to the political or diplomatic angle, what you're seeing is a tightening of the noose, a potential tightening of the noose around Ukraine.

We already, of course, have Russian soldiers there. We have Russian- sponsored separatists in Eastern Ukraine. Their efforts are going to be enhanced, going to be, in essence, legalized in Russia's eyes. And that really forces the Ukrainian state into a smaller area, at least in terms of the geopolitical landscape.

In fact, that's already happened. But now we're looking at a realization, a deep realization of the de facto part of that.

BASH: And, Jim Sciutto, on the ground and Ukraine, it was fascinating to hear the Ukrainian president, Zelensky, say over the weekend that, given the fact that we see, what, 160,000 to 190,000 troops surrounding Ukraine, the noose that Colonel Leighton is talking about, Putin's already inflicting harm, economic harm.

He said their economy is getting crushed, even without an invasion. Are you seeing that for yourself with your own two eyes?

SCIUTTO: Well, I will tell you, what I have been amazed and my colleagues as well have been amazed as we have been in Lviv and in Kyiv and traveling across the country is just how calm Ukraine and Ukrainians have remained, as best they can. Listen, they're aware of the forces arrayed around their country. They

speak -- and I have spoken to Ukrainians who say, listen, I have a weapon at home. I will fight if they come in here. I'm not going to let Russia take over. At the same time, they're going to get coffee in the morning, right? They're going to school. They're going to work as best they can. But the economic costs are real.

Flights are being canceled in this country, right? That means business. That means trade. And that, by the way, is part of Vladimir Putin's plan. It's gangster. It's gangster tactics. It's gangster brinksmanship. We cut you off. It's extortion, really. It's extortion at the point of a gun.

And Putin knows that. And he has tried it before. And he will likely try it again.

BASH: And that's a really important point. We don't know -- even though we have been hearing from U.S. officials for days, even a week now that a military attack could be imminent, even if it doesn't happen, there is a different kind of economic warfare, psychological warfare and other happening.

But, Colonel Leighton, when we hear from the U.S. that it has credible information that Russians have developed a list of Ukrainians targeted for assassination, for detention, you say that that comes from an old Soviet playbook.

LEIGHTON: It certainly does, Dana.

When you look at what the Soviets did back in the post-World War II era, look at what happened in countries like Hungary, the old Czechoslovakia, Poland, Romania, all of the governments that were in place that were -- had anti-communist elements in them, all of those people were either disappeared, were murdered, or were forced into exile.

They did not provide any opposition at all, any practical opposition to the Soviet governments that were installed later. And that's precisely the type of playbook that we're seeing roll out here. And if that comes to pass, Ukraine will be in a very tough area, and especially the people that will be affected by this will really fall into really hard times at this point.

BASH: And, Jim Sciutto, I interviewed the president of Finland over the weekend, and I did that because he is somebody who's known as the Putin whisperer.

He speaks to Putin frequently and tries to interpret it for the West. I want to talk big picture before we let you go about where he told me that he sees the state of relations right now between the East and West.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAULI NIINISTO, PRESIDENT OF FINLAND: I think that we are actually almost in a colder situation than we were during that traditional Cold War, because, then, we had at least some agreements between the United States and Soviet Union limiting arms and so on.

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Now we do not have actually anything, no agreements anymore. So this makes the situation, in my opinion, much more vulnerable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: And, Jim, I wanted to play that to you because you have written a lot about the Cold War, as he says, a colder war, which is quite frightening.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Yes.

BASH: But as we were playing that sound bite, we got some news that I want to also put to you, which is that Russian state media...

SCIUTTO: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: Go ahead. You tell us.

SCIUTTO: Well, listen, and apologies for -- the news is coming in as we are sitting here on the air.

That is that the Russian President Putin told the French president, Emmanuel Macron and the German chancellor, Olaf Scholz, that he intends to sign a decree on Donbass soon. This is according to Russian state media.

That's important, because that, of course, gets to the question that we entered this conversation with, with Nic and Cedric, which is, will the Russian leader announce to the nation tonight that he is doing just that, in effect, declaring independence for these eastern provinces there, which -- again, we should be very clear, which are slicing off for Russia pieces of a sovereign nation, Ukraine, for the second time.

Already did it with Crimea. So this would be a second time. And, again, this is this is what he apparently told Macron and Scholz. Of course, we haven't heard it from the mouth of the Russian president yet.

BASH: And before I let you go, Colonel Cedric, I wanted to tell you that, based on that news, we just went back and went to an interview that I did with the secretary of state, Tony Blinken, on January 23.

I asked specifically, would recognizing or seizing the entire Donbass region qualify as an invasion? And he said that, across the board, they're prepared for a calibrated and unified response, and that that could include doing what our reporting says and what Russian state media is saying that Putin is going to announce shortly about Donbass.

LEIGHTON: Well, it sounds, Dana, like we're getting into the realm where at least sanctions are going to be imposed on Russia. And that could happen, I think, very quickly.

Clearly, this is kind of reminiscent of the late 1930s. And it's changing the landscape, the geopolitical landscape as we speak.

BASH: OK, Colonel Cedric Leighton, Jim Sciutto, stay with us.

We are waiting for President Putin to speak. That is going to happen in moments. Don't go anywhere. We're going to take a quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:22:03]

BASH: And we're back with the breaking news on the situation in Ukraine.

I want to get back to Jim Sciutto, who is on the ground there.

And, Jim, as we wait for Vladimir Putin to speak, can you tell our viewers what you have heard, what we have heard from sources about what we expect him to say?

SCIUTTO: And we do have some more detail now. I will get to that.

But, in short form, state media in Russia is reporting that Putin communicated to the French president, Macron, and to the German chancellor, Scholz, that he intended to issue a decree on the status of the Donbass area in Eastern Ukraine.

This is important because Russia is claiming now, with not evidence, without evidence, crimes against ethnic Russians there, et cetera.

I have more now from the Kremlin statement on this. It says that: "Today, the leadership of the DPR and LPR" -- that's what these regions are known as -- "received appeals to recognize their sovereignty in connection with the military aggression" -- again, this is a Kremlin statement -- "of the Ukrainian authorities, the massive shelling of the territory of Donbass, as a result of which the civilian population is suffering."

And the Kremlin went on to say that Putin will issue a corresponding decree soon. That would seem to indicate that he is at least leaning in the direction of recognizing them. Again, we would need to hear those words from the Russian president's mouth.

We go on to hear from the Kremlin statement that both the German and French leaders expressed their disappointment with this development. We do know that they, as does the U.S. and NATO, oppose Russia recognizing the independence of these areas, because they are, after all, within sovereign Ukrainian territory.

But, as we noted just before the break, Dana, this would not be the first time that the Russian president took pieces of sovereign territory of Ukraine. 2014, they did it with Crimea. They still control Crimea eight years later. If we hear from the Russian president shortly as he addresses the Russian nation that he's doing the same with parts of Eastern Ukraine, that would be quite a development, quite a development, one we know the U.S. opposes, NATO opposes.

Then, of course, we'd be waiting to see what the U.S. And NATO response would be.

BASH: That's right.

And, Jim, as I go back to it, just wanted to show that map again, because, first of all, when you say that the Russian president will talk about the independence of that region, obviously, that is a clever diplomatic term to suggest that they're going to potentially take it.

But you can see there, the Donbass region, why the Russians would want that, because it is just an additional piece of land that goes into the sea, that among other reasons.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BASH: Go ahead.

SCIUTTO: Dana, I was thinking, picturing it from -- in terms of, say an American perspective.

So picture Russia arming for eight years Americans in Alaska, right, and then claiming evidence of crimes of ethnic Russians in Alaska over those eight years that they don't have proof of, making up pictures. We have seen attempts that the U.S. has described quite openly, right, attempts at false flag operations, claiming terrorist attacks that don't exist.

[13:25:09]

BASH: That's right.

SCIUTTO: And, over the course of nearly a decade, then saying, well, now, Russia, we have to recognize that this part of Alaska, right, is in fact Russian territory, which of course, would not stand up in an international court of law, and which, by the way, the United States of America might have a problem with, as does Ukraine with yet another piece of its territory being taken away.

BASH: Yes.

And if he does actually say what Russian state media says he's going to say, which is probably safe to assume, we have to remember the reason, as you say, Jim, this is so significant is because the U.S. and its allies in Europe have been saying, just Blinken, in particular, the secretary of state, if a single additional Russian force goes into Ukraine in an aggressive way, that would trigger a swift and severe united response from us and from Europe.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BASH: So that is why this is so significant. All right. We're going to still stand by for the Russian president to

speak. Jim, we will get back to you shortly.

We want to get to some other news, police in Canada cracking down on hundreds of truckers, and demonstrators who took over streets around Parliament there for 24 days, all in protest of Canada's COVID-19 measures. Officers use pepper spray, towed vehicles, froze funds and made nearly 200 arrests. And more could come.

Want to get to CNN correspondent Paula Newton, who is in Ottawa.

So, Paula, police say it's not over yet. Why?

PAULA NEWTON, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and not only police, but the prime minister, Justin Trudeau, says the same thing.

They say the situation's fragile, and they're very, very cognizant of the fact that protesters continually tried, they say, to really crowd out the streets in Ottawa, to intend to have these encampments. They say they need this Emergency Measures Act in order to keep the peace and order, and not just in the city of Ottawa, Dana, but as we have been seeing in the last few weeks those all-important border blockades that so affected the United States and that crucial supply chain as well.

I want you to listen now, to Justin Trudeau, though, and what he says about the fact that they are using this Emergencies Act. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JUSTIN TRUDEAU, CANADIAN PRIME MINISTER: You can disagree with elected officials. You can certainly disagree with me. But you can't harass your fellow citizens who disagree with you. You can't hold a city hostage.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NEWTON: Now, that -- is going to have a vote in Parliament this evening at 8:00 p.m. If that goes through, it means that Emergency Act is going to be applied right through Canada if they need it to be, the Trudeau government being very clear that it will be defined in scope.

But, Dana, I also want to bring up that what was extraordinary about this were the financial measures as well. And imagine being a protest organizer and you have had your bank account frozen. You cannot pay your mortgage, you cannot go an ATM. And that's what this law allows to happen.

I just want to let that police say 206 personal business accounts already frozen. This is interesting too; 253 Bitcoin wallets have been disclosed. They have been trying to use cryptocurrency; $3 million in U.S. dollars out ere frozen. That meant that if you tried to donate to this movement with a credit card, that that payment process was frozen, plus 70-plus vehicles towed. Dana, I just want to leave you with this as well, though. In the

sidelines of these conversations that Biden has been having with Justin Trudeau, Trudeau has brought up again and again the fact that there's foreign funding of this, and he insists that a lot of it does come from the United States -- Dana.

BASH: Paula Newton, thank you so much for that report.

And British Prime Minister Boris Johnson is lifting all remaining COVID restrictions in England just one day after Buckingham Palace announced that Queen Elizabeth tested positive for the virus.

CNN royal correspondent Max Foster joins us now.

So, Max, how is the queen doing?

MAX FOSTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, she is in isolation. They are current guidelines, at least. And she does have symptoms, so she is in there on her own.

But in her own style, Dana, as you would expect, she's not letting this hold her back. She's at her desk. She is working. She sent a letter of condolence to the people of Brazil, actually, just this afternoon, over the many deaths that have been caused by the flooding there.

So she's showing that she's well enough to work. But, certainly, she is receiving medical attention, I'm told. She's also got some mobility issues. We saw that last week. She struggled to walk forward to meet some senior generals she was meeting. So, she does have a few medical issues there.

But she does seem OK. Rather unfortunate timing, this self-isolation, because, as of Thursday here in England, you don't have to isolate after catching COVID.

BASH: Yes.

I mean, when I got it, I was on the couch watching streaming TV. I don't see the queen doing that.