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Site of Recent Shelling in Donetsk; Ukraine Enacts State of Emergency; Biden's Sanctions Market New Target; Alexander Vindman is Interviewed about Russian Sanctions. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired February 23, 2022 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:25]

BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN ANCHOR: Get out now. Ukraine warning its citizens to immediately evacuate Russia as Ukrainian officials announce they will declare a state of emergency across the country.

Good morning, everybody. I'm Bianna Golodryga in New York.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Jim Sciutto reporting from Lviv, Ukraine.

This morning, Russia has announced it has begun pulling its diplomatic staff from Ukraine to, quote, protect their lives and safety. And new satellite images show Russia adding troops, tents, field hospitals, near Ukraine's border. This as Russian President Vladimir Putin claims his weapons are, quote, have no equal in the world.

The Pentagon is taking action as well, moving fighter jets, attack helicopters and other military equipment to NATO's eastern flank, while repositioning some 800 U.S. troops within Europe to the Baltic region. That is right on Russia's border.

Putin's aggression leading to widespread condemnation and strict sanctions from several world leaders.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This is a flagrant violation of international law and it demands a firm response from the international community.

BORIS JOHNSON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: He is going to end up with a Russia that is poorer as a result of the sanctions that the world will implement. A Russia that is more isolated. A Russia that has pariah status. SCOTT MORRISON, AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: And there cannot be any

suggestion that concessions should be provided to a bully and a thug in return for not following through with threats of violence.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: We're going to begin this morning here in Ukraine.

CNN's senior international correspondent Sam Kiley, he is in the Donbas region, recently around there in homes damaged by shelling.

I -- we also have CNN's senior international correspondent Matthew Chance in the capital of Kyiv.

But, Sam, I want to begin with you.

You say the shelling in recent -- in the recent minutes has increased. Tell us what you're seeing.

SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, so we've spent most of the day in Novoluhans'ke, which is about 500 meters from the line of contact. There's been audible shelling all day. And we were spending a great deal of time investigating what had happened here two days ago when one person was killed and a family narrowly missed being wiped out when a shell landed in their home and destroyed two floors of that home.

But we've had to move out rather rapidly because the shelling got increasingly close and we could hear the detonations and indeed feel the concussion from detonations that were landing, we're not exactly sure how far away, but they're fairly close, if you can feel the concussions. And now we're actually bugging out, frankly, in a vehicle.

But this -- we're leaving behind, though, a town still peopled (ph) by youngsters, by teenagers, by Veronica, whose bedroom we visited, that had been blown apart, her cuddly toys ripped up by shrapnel as a result of a -- some kind of artillery round that landed in her home. A hundred meters from that location on the same time during the same salvo, Roman, a local worker, he was killed trying to put his car away, rather vainly trying to hide it, a valuable asset among the extremely poor people who live here on the front line. He died trying to save his car effectively.

We went to his funeral. Local people are extremely angry. Not just with what Vladimir Putin has recently announced with his declaration that the so-called Donetsk People's Republic and Luhansk People's Republics, these two breakaway Russian enclaves, now getting recognized as independent states by Russia, but also that they're laying claim to the land that we're still on. I'm still in Donetsk Oblask (ph), the province of Donetsk. We're driving (INAUDIBLE) away from shelling, leaving civilians behind, a handful of military too visible there. The military tried to stay out of sight. This is Ukrainian government military. While the whole country has been put on a state of alert. But no sign at all that local civilians are being evacuated from a town that locals tell us that this is a fifth day of sustained bombardment that they have been enduring. And, frankly, we're fairly hairied (ph) old characters in this team and it certainly got uncomfortable enough for us to get out of town. And that's exactly what we're doing.

SCIUTTO: Listen, that's been, as you know, Sam, the location of a slow burn war for some eight years, 14,000 casualties killed, in fact, during that time. And now we're seeing that slow burn seem to heat up.

[09:05:03]

Matthew, in the capital Kyiv.

Watching the government here amp up its sense of urgency, issued a state of emergency today, but it also notably told all its citizens to evacuate Russia. That's not an insignificant step given the ties across the border between these two countries.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: No, it's a great indication, though, isn't it, of the level of tension between these two countries. That order being issued by the Ukrainian foreign ministry for those citizens to leave.

The state of emergency that you mentioned, it's going to be debated in the parliament, it's going to be approved, it's going to extend for 30 days and it's going to mean extra powers to the security forces here, and extra patrols outside key transportation installations and key government buildings as well for a 30-day period. It could be extended further. But, again, another sign of the level of tension that exists in this country as it really braces for what will happen next, what will come from the Russian side and from those areas of Ukraine that have now been recognized as independent states by Moscow.

There's been more diplomacy as well taking place, more shows of support for the Ukrainian government. President Zelenskyy of Ukraine standing next to his Lithuanian and Polish counterparts earlier today, giving a press conference, saying this, the future of European security is being decided in Ukraine. President Zelenskyy praising the sanctions that have already been imposed on Russia for its recent actions, for its recognition of those rebel republics in the east of Ukraine.

But he's calling for more, more tough sanctions to now be imposed on Russia. This is what he said, we want decisive, immediate and harsh measures on Russia. You know -- you know, to paraphrase him, you know, in order to show them that the international community is serious about resisting what Russia is now doing.

Jim.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Yes, certainly more diplomatic support for Ukraine. Sadly, less diplomatic contact, it seems, between Russia and Ukraine in the west.

Matthew Chance there in the Ukrainian capital, thanks so much.

So, as this conflict escalates, grows more urgent, the U.S. is moving additional forces and military equipment already in Europe to NATO's eastern flank, closer to Russia, to strengthen in particular Baltic allies and Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania. These forces comprise of an infantry battalion task force of approximately 800 personnel shifting from Italy to the region. The U.S. also plans to move eight F-35 strike fighters from Germany to several operating locations along eastern Europe. Again, along or close to the Russian border.

Twenty AH-64 helicopters also to move from Germany up to the Baltic region. And an attack aviation task force, those are 12 AH-64 helicopters, they will move from Greece to Poland.

Bianna, these are significant steps and it's a measure of the greater nervousness felt by those eastern NATO allies. They feel threatened by Russia today. Certainly more than they did even before his speech on Monday.

GOLODRYGA: Of course. And since then we've heard from President Putin overnight as well, really coming down hard on military strength, if needed, by the Russian side.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

GOLODRYGA: New U.S. sanctions, meantime, provoked by Russia's increased aggression toward Ukraine aimed to hit close to home. The White House working to disrupt Moscow's efforts to evade restrictions, slapping individual restrictions on key members of Putin's inner circle and their children and their families.

CNN's Phil Mattingly joins me now from Washington.

So, Phil, Russia has all along said that they've been prepared for sanctions. They've had sanctions imposed on them for years, since 2014. Will these sanctions, in at least the White House's opinion, do enough damage to make at least Vladimir Putin and the Kremlin think twice about going forward?

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: You know, Bianna, I think White House officials acknowledge that this is the first tranche, the first phase. It is not as far as they could go, but they do underscore the capabilities that they have. When you look at the two banks that were sanctioned, imposing full blocking sanctions is a step that the U.S. hasn't taken up to this point. Cutting off Russian's sovereign debt markets from the western world while Russia is largely insulated based on their economic actions over the course of the last several years when it comes to sovereign debt, it is a significant step.

But one of the most interesting elements of the package that was announced yesterday was those individual sanctions. For years the U.S. and their European allies have slapped individual sanctions on President Putin's inner circle, his top officials, even oligarchs as well. But what the U.S. did yesterday was an evolution. It expanded those sanctions to the children of some of those in the inner circle.

You're looking at the pictures of three of them right now. Denis Bortnikov, whose father is actually the head of the Russian's domestic intelligence service, the FSB. He was slapped with sanctions. He is a prominent businessman in his own right, a bank executive, but going after him was a new step.

Also when you continue to go down the line, one of President Putin's top domestic policy advisers, his son as well, Vladimir Kiriyenko, was targeted.

[09:10:02]

And also the third individual that was targeted is actually the CEO of Promsvyazbank, the military bank that was sanctioned, which is the primary reason he was targeted, but his father as well is the former head of the foreign intelligence service over in Russia.

And the rationale here is essentially that they believe that many of these top officials have been shielding their wealth as they've been sanctioned inside their families, with their children, with their wives. They're now trying to target that as deputy secretary of the Treasury, Wally Adeyemo, laid out this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WALLY ADEYEMO, DEPUTY TREASURY SECRETARY: One of the things we did yesterday was in addition to going after the named individuals, we went after their children. And our goal will be, as we continue, is to make sure that we target the individuals around them, to ensure that the money they're sending to places like London and New York through those individuals can no longer flow, and we constrict the ability of this money to flow back to President Putin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: You know, I think U.S. officials I've spoken to are candid. They don't believe that this is behavior changing type of action when it comes to those individual sanctions, but they are trying to unsettle and make uncomfortable those closest to that inner circle. An inner circle that's largely been insulated due to their own domestic wealth and the support of President Putin.

What I was told by administration officials over the course of yesterday, the target list, when it comes to family members, sons, daughters, wives, is long and expect them to get hit in the weeks and months ahead.

Bianna.

GOLODRYGA: All they have to do is follow their credit card bills in Europe and in the United States as well to find out where they spend their money. Many of them wearing these sanctions publicly in Russia as a badge of honor. But, clearly, this is a hit for them as well.

Russia, no doubt, says that they will respond and that Americans are going to be feeling some of the consequences of their responses via sanctions. Russia has a $1.5 trillion, right, economy, so there's not many imports coming from Russia or that we send to them that would make Americans think twice about these sanctions and how it would impact them.

But the big question is, would Russia respond with any sort of cyberattacks? We know that we've seen that from them in the past, Phil.

MATTINGLY: Yes, there's been significant preparation behind the scenes over the course of the last several months, really since November, according to senior administration officials, preparing for a potential cyber risk, meeting in close concert with senior executives at the largest banks, the largest U.S. consumer banks, domestic banks here in the United States, utilities as well, trying to lay out not only what could come, maybe tabletop exercises about the types of things that could play out in the wake of sanctions, but also to prepare them.

I think from a broader economic perspective, the real concern with administration officials, the real pain will come from broader economic market implications. You see it in gas. You see it in natural gas. You see it in agriculture as well. That is the reality of the uncertainty of this moment. But administration officials, while they know the pain is coming, believe they have done everything they can, at least at this stage, to prepare, particularly on the cyber front, Bianna.

GOLODRYGA: And this is coming as Americans have been having to deal with rising gas prices, you know, in the previous year, month leading up to this crisis as well as inflation.

Phil Mattingly, thank you so much.

And up next, Lieutenant Colonel Alexander Vindman joins CNN live with his take on the potential for war in Ukraine and whether the U.S. is doing enough to deter Vladimir Putin.

Plus, President Biden has met with at least three potential Supreme Court nominees. Find out who.

And later, we're live in Pennsylvania as the Senate race heats up. Celebrity Doctor Mehmet Oz is locked in a tight Republican primary and many of the candidates are battling for Trump's endorsement.

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[09:17:51]

SCIUTTO: President Biden laid out what he called a first tranche of U.S. sanctions against Russia. These targeting two financial institutions, Russian sovereign debt, also Russian elites and their family members. The question now, will they be enough to deter further military action.

Joining me now, retired U.S. Army Lieutenant Colonel Alexander Vindman. He previously served as the European affairs director for the National Security Council.

Good to have you on, Alexander. Thank you. LT. COL. ALEXANDER VINDMAN, U.S. ARMY (RET.): Thanks, Jim.

SCIUTTO: So, let's begin with where we stand today. As you well know better than me, Putin is the master of the half measure, the tactical delay and retreat and pause. Big picture, has the war in Ukraine, in your view, already started, the invasion?

VINDMAN: Yes, I think so. We've seen the first phase, which was the recognition of these territories in the east as independent territories and Russia start to provision them with Russian-armed forces. I received some information that, you know, that folks on the line of contact, the Ukrainian folks, are receiving messages that Russia is going to attack and that they're -- that they need to go ahead and surrender now to save their lives.

We're going to see probably -- we can see one of two major things unfolding. Either this is going to be a phased operation where Russia is going to first initiate ground combat on those two regions and expand the foothold they have there. It amounts to one-third of the entire territory of these two regions. And then suck in Ukrainian armed forces or it could be a full -- full on assault. I think both of those are quite viable.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

VINDMAN: But, ultimately, we end in the same place, which is a major ground offensive, a major offensive against Ukraine in the coming days.

SCIUTTO: You have said previously that the Biden administration, the U.S., its European allies, have done too little, too late. Yesterday we saw a range of sanctions starting with Germany going to the U.K., the EU and then the U.S. Is it still too little, in your view? Is any of this enough to deter Putin?

VINDMAN: It's not. And, frankly, I don't necessarily agree with the premise that these are deterrent sanctions.

[09:20:03]

They are punitive sanctions. They are sanctions taken in response to Russian actions. They're not -- deterrent sanctions might be something, you know, that you do, like a graduated response where you signal that war is coming ahead of time. It's proactive.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

VINDMAN: This is punitive. This is in response.

And I think a lot of this stuff now is -- I hate to say as lightly as window dressing, it's not. It's more than that. We're definitely still trying to see if we can avoid this major confrontation. But it's probably not -- it's not going to be meaningful enough to deter what Vladimir Putin has committed to. In taking the steps he did over the past couple of days in recognizing these territories, he's eliminated his key leverage over a diplomatic off ramp. This idea of getting Ukraine to buy into Minsk, where Russia has a veto over Ukraine's geopolitical orientation.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

VINDMAN: He's given that away. So his only option now is military force to achieve his objectives. And I think we're locked into this course of action with very few options. We're going to do what we can to support Ukraine, but it's not going to be nearly enough.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

So let's talk about support to Ukraine. I've been told the Ukrainian forces are outnumbered by Russian forces, outgunned by many times, multiples, really. The U.S., NATO, they've supplied anti-tank missiles, armor busters. They've supplied antiaircraft shoulder fired missiles. Is there any military support that the U.S. and NATO can provide that would make this even close to a fair fight, or would you expect it to be over quickly?

VINDMAN: I don't know if I would expect it to be over quickly. I think the morale of the Ukrainian forces is quite high. They just changed the number calculus on the field. They activated their operational reserves and those amount to another couple hundred thousand troops.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

VINDMAN: So, in terms of numerical superiority, Ukraine will have that. The biggest mismatch is in terms of capabilities. The Russians will have air dominance almost instantaneously. They have long range artillery. They'll have aerial bombardment. And that -- those are the capabilities that the U.S. could have started to offer months ago and it didn't.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

VINDMAN: So, I think what we're -- I think there's still something we could do, frankly. This has -- if this is an ongoing operation, the Ukrainian forces can stand to receive logistical support. And that's something that we should be offering, a ground pipeline of logistical support to sustain Ukraine as it conducts this operation. There's all sorts of things we can do with regards to ammunition, fuel, medical supplies.

SCIUTTO: OK.

VINDMAN: We should be doing that now.

SCIUTTO: Let me ask you this, because in the U.S. we have a remarkable reality now where we have the former president, who, of course, you worked for and have had run-ins with before, you have the former secretary of state, you have many prominent right wing media figures defending, praising Putin even.

I want to play former President Trump's comments about Putin's decision earlier this week to recognize those republics, supposed republics, in the east. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: So Putin is now saying it's independent, a large section of Ukraine. I said, how smart is that? And he's going to go in and be a peacekeeper. That's the strongest peace force. We could use that on our southern border. That's the strongest peace force I've ever seen. There were more army tanks than I've ever seen. They're going to keep peace all right.

No, but think of it, here's a guy who's very savvy, I know him very well. Very, very well.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Does that support from an American -- former American president as Russia threatens to invade a sovereign country, does that embolden Putin? Does it help him?

VINDMAN: Absolutely. I think there -- there is blood on President Trump's hands. There is blood on the key Republican support their hands also.

But I think, frankly, this is a catastrophe for the Republican Party and for those who got support from Donald Trump. They are now infected with the fever of Trump, who is notoriously self-destructive. And it's OK for them to say something like, well, to cheer lead for Putin right now, when there are no casualties. When casualties start pouring in, including the likelihood of American citizens being killed in this massive offensive, they will own it. And this will be -- this is not something they could walk away from.

If they had the presence of mind and the forethought and perspective to look a little bit forward, they would understand what's about to unfold. And self-preservation would rain over the situation. They're going to own this situation because they contributed to it, they're complicit.

SCIUTTO: Yes. And it's not like they don't have evidence of what Putin's already capable of. Recent history, the crimes committed against Ukrainian people.

Lieutenant Colonel Alexander Vindman, very good to have you on this morning.

[09:25:02]

VINDMAN: Thanks, Jim.

Bianna, quite a strong comment there. He says they will have blood on their hands for this kind of support.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. Yes. And, Jim, you know, hearing the former president describe Vladimir Putin as savvy just reminds me of Vladimir Putin describing Donald Trump as (speaking in foreign language) bright, remember that, many years ago.

SCIUTTO: Yes. GOLODRYGA: So the two, the mutual admiration there between them is striking and obviously it still continues.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

GOLODRYGA: Well, still ahead, Trump's former attorney is fighting to keep secret more than 100 emails concerning his communications around January 6th. His line in the sand, up next.

And we are moments away from the opening bell on Wall Street. Stock futures rebounding on news of President Biden and world leaders levying the first wave of sanctions against Russia. Right now stock futures are surging and oil prices are easing. Investors are also watching comments from Fed Chair Jerome Powell. Later today he will be testifying in a semiannual report to Congress. Of course, we'll be watching all of it for you.

We'll be back after a quick break.

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