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New Images Show More Russian Military Gear Near Border; Blinken Cancels Lavrov Meeting As Russia Moves On Ukraine; U.S. And Allies Move To Push Moscow With Sanctions; Mandatory COVID Testing in Hong Kong Amid Case Surge. Aired 2-3a ET
Aired February 23, 2022 - 02:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Michael Holmes coming to you live from Lviv in Ukraine. And ahead this out, the West hits Russia with severe sanctions. But as these new images show so far undeterred, Vladimir Putin continues through a massive military at the border.
ROSEMARY CHURCH, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: And I'm Rosemary church live from CNN world headquarters in Atlanta. We will take a closer look at how the sanctions against Putin could impact the global financial and energy markets with Russia vowing that ordinary citizens in the U.S. and elsewhere will feel it in their wallets.
HEILEMANN: Welcome, everyone. The U.S. and its allies moving to punish Russia with sanctions as Moscow escalate its military threats over Ukraine. On Tuesday, the U.S. President Joe Biden describing Russia's actions as "The beginning of a Russian invasion," but Russia shows no sign of backing down. New satellite images show more Russian troops and military equipment deployed to the Ukrainian border area.
Hopes for Democracy also seemed to be growing demur. The U.S. Secretary of State calling off a meeting with his Russian counterpart. The White House says a diplomatic solution is still on the table. For now, Mr. Biden says the U.S. will move more troops and equipment into Europe. Biden saying the move intended to strengthen Baltic Allies near Russia not provoke a conflict.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Let me be clear, these are totally defensive moves on our part. We have no intention of fighting Russia.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEILEMANN: So far, the U.S. and its allies largely relying on sanctions to deter Russia. The U.S. and U.K. targeting Russian banks and some of the country's powerful elite. Germany dealing a major blow by halting the certification of Nord Stream 2, a valuable pipeline that would send fuel directly from Russia to Western Europe. The E.U. delivering sanctions on the Russian lawmakers who backed the decision to recognize breakaway areas of Eastern Ukraine as independent states.
Now in the last few hours, Japan and Australia also announcing sanctions of their own is the Australian Prime Minister.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT MORRISON, AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: Australians always stand up to bullies and we will be standing up to Russia. Along with all of our partners.
The Australian Government will immediately begin placing sanctions on Russian individuals in response to the aggression by Russia against Ukraine.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEILEMANN: Russia has now responded to the west sanctions calling some illegal and warning that the impacts will be felt well beyond Russia's borders. Meanwhile, Mr. Putin on Tuesday increased support for Russian-backed separatists in Eastern Ukraine, saying Russia recognizes the independence of the entire Donetsk and Luhansk regions. Those separatists control only a portion of that.
Now, Russian lawmakers also approving formerly the deployment of troops to Eastern Ukraine on Tuesday. Mr. Putin won't say when troops will enter the region although U.S. officials say Russian forces have been supporting separatists there since 2014. Meanwhile, Ukraine says it is ready for whatever path Russia chooses.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DMYTRO KULEBA, UKRAINIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: We have two plans. Plan A is to utilize every tool of diplomacy to deter Russia and prevent further escalation. And if that fails, Plan B is to fight for every inch of our land, and every city and every village.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HEILEMANN: CNN's Matthew Chance is in Kiev with the latest on Russia's troop movements and how the West is responding.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Disturbing movements in Donbass. The rebel areas of Ukraine are now recognized by Russia as independent states where Russian forces have been ordered to maintain peace. It's still unclear if fresh Russian hardware has moved in. But unmarked military vehicles, including these tanks and armored personnel carriers have been spotted on the outskirts of the main rebel city.
If Moscow has ordered in more troops, do we see as yet another hostile act.
BIDEN: Last night --
[02:05:03]
CHANCE: Already, there's been strong condemnation by the U.S. President of Russia's recognition of the two Ukrainian rebel areas. The Biden administration issuing new economic sanctions on Moscow.
BIDEN: Who in the Lord's name is Putin think gives him the right to declare new so-called countries on territory that belong to his neighbors. This is a flagrant violation of international law and demands a firm response from the international community.
CHANCE: The self-styled People's Republics of Donetsk and the Luhansk both backed by Moscow were born out of the bitter fighting of Ukraine's brutal war. Problem is they control a much smaller area of Donbass than they claim. Ukrainian cities like Kramatorsk and Mariupol are run by the Ukrainian government, but they're located in territory the separatists say is theirs.
The concern is, the newly recognized and emboldened Republic's backed by Russian forces could launch a new offensive to capture more land, especially now their Kremlin sponsor says he supports all their territorial claims.
VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): The best solution for our colleagues in Western countries not to lose face would be if the current Kiev authorities refused to join NATO, and essentially maintain neutrality.
CHANCE: But with tens of thousands of Russian forces still poised near Ukraine's borders, like these observed by CNN. There's little sign of that compromise being made. Already the U.S., several of its allies have imposed new sanctions on Russia, notably Germany, putting on hold the Kremlin-backed Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline. The decision to suspend the strategically important project, which would massively boost supplies of Russian energy to Europe has drawn immediate scorn from Moscow.
Welcome to the brave new world tweeted a former Russian president and close Putin ally, where Europeans will very soon pay 1000s of dollars for their gas, a snarky reminder that sanctions can cut both ways. But as President Biden says, freedom comes at a cost. For the U.S. and its allies, the focus now is simply trying to stop Russia in its tracks. Matthew Chance, CNN, Kiev.
HEILEMANN: All right. I want to bring in Scott McLean in Paris with more on E.U. sanctions. Also, White House reporter Jasmine Wright is in Washington for us. Jasmine, let's begin with you. Tell us more details about the sanctions that have been levied and what might be still to come.
JASMINE WRIGHT, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, Michael, this is President Biden's first steps he says in trying to punish Russia for their continued aggression, but also trying to deter any more aggression on their part when it comes to the situation in Ukraine. And so, what he called today at the White House, a first tranche, I want to kind of read you some of the sanctions. He outlined them on two large state-owned Russian financial institutions. Comprehensive sanctions on Russian sovereign debt and sanctions on five Russian elites and their family members. As you can see on the screen right here. we have those two banks as well as Russian elites and their family members. And the point he said, is to cut off Russia's government from Western financing.
And now we know, Michael, that for months, U.S. officials have been really previewing what dire consequences that Russia could face. Should they do exactly what U.S. officials are now saying that they're doing, which is beginning their invasion into Ukraine. But let's be clear here, because President Biden said that he has more things that he could implement to really bring the hammer down on Russia, should they continue.
So, they are reserving some of their tougher sanctions for any more actions on Russia's part. And of course, in addition to those sanctions, the President today and what he called it offensive move, ordered more U.S. troops as well as military equipment to those Baltic ally countries really trying to put more boots on the ground. They're in that defensive mode. But the President still said that he is hoping really for a diplomatic solution.
Really hoping to work things out in a diplomatic way. But to be honest, it's kind of hard to see where that diplomacy fits into things right now, especially after Secretary of State Tony Blinken announced that he would be canceling that meeting with his Russian counterpart, Lavrov that was supposed to happen Thursday in Geneva to talk about a potential summit between President Putin and President Biden.
Because the condition of the meeting with Blinken was that Russia should not invade Ukraine. And now we know that the new language from U.S. officials is that Russia has actually begun that invasion. Michael?
[02:10:00]
HEILEMANN: All right. Jasmine, thanks so much. Appreciate it. Scott McLean, let's turn it over to you now in Europe. They were able to pretty quickly turn around this package of sanctions. But are there signs that they're likely to have an effective impact?
SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, good morning, Michael. Yes, so at the moment, Vladimir Putin is not talking like a man who is afraid at this point. But ultimately, it's his actions that will count. As you mentioned, it is very clear that the E.U. has been coordinating with the United States and with Canada, and with the U.K. because their package of sanction sounds very similar to the American ones.
We're talking about sanctions against 27 people and entities. These include banks, military personnel, politicians, that kind of thing. They're also sanctioning 351 members of the lower house of the Russian Parliament. And they're also making it more difficult or cutting off Russia, essentially from being able to access Western financing for its debt. Now, this is not the full package of sanctions that would have come or had been prepared in the event of a full-scale Russian invasion, but it's what they were able to get done quickly and with relatively little pain.
Here in France, for instance, the economy minister said yesterday that they were hardly exposed to potential negative consequences since Russia accounts for less than one percent of French exports. They're also keeping some powder dry, of course, in the event of further Russian aggression. They want to have more tools they can use at their disposal. But I think the point here is that look, they have to get 27 member States to agree.
And they don't always necessarily see eye to eye. E.U. officials will tell you that it is no secret that Hungary is much more sympathetic to Russia than many other countries. On the other hand, you have the Baltic states which would very much like to punish Russia for what they're doing in Ukraine. And in fact, Lithuania, the foreign -- the Lithuanian foreign ministers said yesterday that he is not convinced that these sanctions will do a whole lot to deter Vladimir Putin.
In fact, they might actually be an invitation for him to go further. Yesterday, the E.U.'s top diplomat Joseph Borrell acknowledged that in these discussions with these 27 E.U. member states, obviously, there were disagreements. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOSEPH BURRELL, E.U. FOREIGN POLICY CHIEF: We could have gone further. Some thought that we could go further but I think we've struck a balanced point in the view of all concerned and it's sufficiently strong. And we have made scope -- we've left scope for further improvements.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCLEAN: Obviously, the E.U. would prefer that all of the countries are united on their sanctions, but if they can't reach consensus going forward in the future, well, will of course, they -- countries, I have the option as well of going it alone as we saw Germany do with the Nord Stream 2 pipeline in their decision to pause the certification of that project. Lithuania's Prime Minister said yesterday that that is the project, Michael, that Putin probably wasn't expecting and that is most likely to actually hurt him.
HEILEMANN: Yes, yes. Appreciate the reporting there. Scott McLean, Jasmine Wright, you as well here in D.C. Thanks so much. Now, we have heard a lot from world leaders about the crisis in Ukraine. But what are the people in Ukraine and Russia have to say? Well, CNN has just released the results of an exclusive poll carried out in both countries from February 7 to 15. First, the poll asked Russians and Ukrainians if it would be right or wrong for Russia to use military force to accomplish various goals to prevent Ukraine from joining NATO.
Fifty percent of Russian say it would be right to use military force. 25 percent said it would be wrong. Meanwhile, unsurprisingly, 70 percent of Ukrainians said it would be wrong and just 13 percent said it would be right. How about using force to reunite Russia and Ukraine? A plurality in both countries say it would be wrong. 73 percent of Ukrainians think so compared to 43 percent of Russians.
But more than a third of Russian said it would be right. Both Russians and Ukrainians think their countries should separate the separate nations, just one in 10 Ukrainians say the two countries should be one. But a third of Russians say it should. Nearly two-thirds of Russians believe that Russians and Ukrainians are one people while two-thirds of Ukrainians believe the opposite that they are not one people.
And you can see much more of the exclusive poll at cnn.com. Now to talk more about all of this aspect of the crisis and important aspect, public opinion in Russia specifically. I'm joined now by Denis Volkov. He's the director of the Levada Center in Moscow. That's a research organization that conducts regular monitoring of Russian public opinion. It's great to have you on. So, what is your polling telling you about support or otherwise for a Russian war in Ukraine?
DENIS VOLKOV, DIRECTOR, LEVADA CENTER IN MOSCOW: No, you see, I think it's important to understand how Russian public see this conflict. It's a little bit -- it's -- I would say different from the view that Western public has. Here in Russia -- they blame the United States for the conflict. The majority understand it's like this -- but the United States pressures the Ukrainian government, Ukrainian government tries to do something about this rebel republics of Donetsk and Luhansk.
And so, Russia has to step in. And to help these Republics as there are a lot of Russian speaking population, people with Russian passports and so on, and so forth. So, it's not about supporting military operation, I mean, an invasion like many in the West states, seen by the public, of course, helped by the Russian state T.V. channels to see and understand this as a kind of a support operation, helping operation.
In this sense as the majority support -- supported but I would say, the blatant use of force, especially outside this republic, I'm not sure that many Russians will support this kind of operation.
HEILEMANN: Yes. I'm curious whether you find a difference in attitudes and support for the Russian position among age groups. Do younger people think differently?
VOLKOV: Surprisingly, we do not see this. We see differences on many other political issues, and how young and old people understand events differently. But on these topics, we do not see this difference. And well, we're trying to explain why it is happening. Probably the answer is that first, the majority of the public don't want to know much about what's happening. Over the years, the majority of Russian public is tired of this topic.
And we see that on Russian media, especially on Russian state-run T.V. channels. This is one of the main issues and people hear about it. But at the same time, as they are not interested, they do not explore different points of view, different interpretations like they usually do when they're interested. So, this -- because they are tired -- of this, because there were -- there was too much of Ukraine over the years here, probably because of this. People don't go online and trying to find different views different interpretations, but because of this, we do not see differences in age groups or actually in any other social groups.
HEILEMANN: Your group is well known as being impartial. I mean, I'm curious how difficult it is to do the job of pollster in Russia. Are you free to run the polls as you see fit?
VOLKOV: Yes. I think the main difficulty is to stay independent and stay in business being an independent organization. Apart from this, usually there are no big difficulties in running surveys as we choose. So, we do not have to -- well, show our wordings pride survey to anybody. So, we decide what we should do. But the problem is to stay independent. And also, there are sometimes topics we feel that people are not comfortable to speak about.
Like speaking of (INAUDIBLE) with young people after the -- well, crackdown on protests. Many young people were not comfortable discussing such topics. Otherwise, it's more or less fine.
HEILEMANN: Well (INAUDIBLE) has a great reputation. It's instructive to get your point of view on this and thanks for the work you do. Denis Volkov, thanks so much.
VOLKOV: Thank you.
HEILEMANN: All right. We will have much more from Ukraine at the bottom of the hour. For now, though. Let's go back to Rosary Church in Atlanta with the day's other stories.
CHURCH: All right. Thanks so much, Michael. Appreciate it. And still to come. The West is hitting Russia with sanctions in an effort to stop its march into Ukraine. A look at what's being done to deter Vladimir Putin, that's next.
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[02:22:12]
CHURCH: Welcome back, everyone. Well, Russian President Vladimir Putin's actions spot swift condemnation and the West has been quick to impose new sanctions on Russia. Germany is drawing praise from Ukrainian officials after halting the certification of the multibillion-dollar Nord Stream 2 natural gas pipeline.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OLAF SCHOLZ, GERMAN CHANCELLOR (through translator): These are very difficult days and hours for Europe, close to 80 years after the end of World War II, there is the danger of a war in Eastern Europe. It is our job to avert such a catastrophe. And I appeal again to Russia to help in the process. Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHURCH: For weeks, the German Chancellor appeared to hedge when it came to using the gas pipeline is leveraged against Russia. And a Ukrainian expert says Russia won't be able to retaliate and cut off the gas supply to Europe. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
YURIY VITRENKO, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, NAFTOGAZ: I don't think that Gazprom and Russia in general at this point, can decrease flows of gas to Europe. So, that's a bluff. And somebody call -- needs to call this bluff. And that's exactly what Germany is doing at the moment.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHURCH: The U.S. has also announced sanctions on two Russian banks, including Russia's military bank, along with sanctions against Russian elites and their family members. And Russia's ambassador to the U.S. has responded to it saying this, there is no doubt that the sanctions imposed against us will hurt the global financial and energy markets, the United States will not be left out where ordinary citizens will feel the full consequences of rising prices.
U.S. President Joe Biden is also acknowledging that Americans will likely see rising prices at the pump in the coming months.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: As I said last week, defending freedom will have cost for us as well and here at home. We need to be honest about that. But as we will do -- but as we do this, I'm going to take robust action to make sure the pain of our sanctions is targeted at a Russian economy, not ours. I want to limit the pain the American people are feeling at the gas pump. This is critical to me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHURCH: So, let's take a closer look at all of this with Ryan Patel, Senior Fellow at Drucker School of Management at Claremont Graduate University. Thanks so much for joining us.
RYAN PATEL, SENIOR FELLOW AT DRUCKER SCHOOL OF MANAGEMENT, CLAREMONT GRADUATE UNIVERSITY: Good to be on with you, Rosemary.
CHURCH: So, as we just heard Russia responded to these new U.S. sanctions saying they will hurt global financial and energy markets as well as Americans. And we've already seen oil and gas prices surged while global financial markets plummeted. A trend already in play of course before this new invasion.
[02:25:04]
CHURCH: But what more can we expect in terms of economic pain across the globe on the back of this first wave of sanctions?
PATEL: Well, the first wave of sanctions is still -- I mean, very mild still, right? We're still saying, you know, it -- Joe Biden, the President Biden and the U.S. administration is saying, if you further go in further invade, we're going to put more economic sanctions, I think the clear -- the clearer where we see the oil prices going to 95 to 100 bucks to 120, you know, that -- when it gets to 120 oil, you know, per barrel price wise, that is when we're going to start seeing the consumers to start to feel the pressure.
And the clip that you just played when President Biden said, there is going to be some feel for the American consumer in these sanctions and how long it goes. That's why you saw the U.S. really made hedge bets around trying to get their hands on, you know, more all with the Saudis and other countries to be able to keep the prices to a reasonable matter, while the sanctions go on for -- who knows how long.
CHURCH: Yes. And of course, so we don't know if these new sanctions will have any impact on what Putin's next move might be. But what impact could this first raft of sanctions have on Russia's economy, particularly in conjunction with Germany's decision to suspend the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline from Russia? And, of course, the U.K. and E.U. sanctions?
PATEL: Yes, yes. I mean, we saw the Moscow, MOEX stock dropped 1.5 percent yesterday. It's around 20 percent year to date. Obviously, the oil companies of their -- of the Russian aspect are -- have been dropping from a stock perspective. You know, it's funny, the Nord Stream 2 -- the price -- there's conversation around that, it was going to affect the E.U. prices of German prices and energy and maybe down the road.
But, you know, it didn't really dramatically change the price outlook for Germany because the pipeline hadn't been really expected to come online until the second half of the year. So, it's interesting to see how that's more of a leverage play behind that. And again, it's really back to, you know, in the fact of inflation, you know, does that going to come -- have an impact with Russia? And obviously, the ability to sanction back, right?
When the sanctions are coming from this other partner, you know, other global, you know, global countries, will Russia hit back with certain amount of sanctions that puts their economic GDP potentially at a minimum one percent decrease right now in the first wave of sanctions?
CHURCH: Yes, that's a big question, of course. And Ryan, Putin has built up vast financial reserves of his own, of course, sheltered overseas and inside Russia. So, he's not going to feel any economic pain himself. But the oligarchs will, along with the Russian people, particularly once the West applies the full extent of what they're calling severe economic sanctions. So, what impact will all those combined sanctions likely have on Russia's economy in the end going forward?
PATEL: Yes, you hit it right on top of the button there. It's the financial institutions, the banks, right? E.U. with Swift, being able to make it harder for, you know, Russia to be able to get money out of the country. And that affects, you know, there are people that are obviously the rich, you know, the rich investors that are going into places like the U.K. and the U.S. And, you know, the E.U. has done it to Iran many years ago. So that's not a bluff. And obviously, what we saw with President Biden with putting more sanctions on the financial institution. So, that, to me is a full force. If they put full force on the financial institutions, it affects the money flow going in and out of the country. We've seen it in other countries, like in Venezuela and Latin America. And certain places where you can't convert the currency to another currency. And that at the end of the day, limits the power and hurts the GDP of Russia.
CHURCH: Yes. And there's a lot of pressure for the United States to go ahead and do that and use the full force of those sanctions. But Ryan, also wanted to ask you, U.S. officials have told businesses to watch out for potential ransomware attacks after President Biden announced those new sanctions against Russia. So, what are the potential economic consequences of cyberattacks, especially if businesses haven't already moved to adequately protect themselves from such attacks?
PATEL: I'm smiling because you and I both know that the U.S. businesses haven't moved fast enough. By 60 to 70 percent of cyberattacks hit on small businesses are not even prepared. And in the new, you know, when the markets are, you know, surprisingly resilient at this point when the word invasion means, you typically think of what the military crosses the borders. Well, that's not the only way we live in a different world now that cybersecurity on specific companies, specific industries, supply chains, right?
Just don't think about one specific company could be certain supply chains that could cause a ripple effect. And that is really, really impactful and really does cause uncertainty and chaos potentially to earnings and lead to a ripple effect.
[02:30:07]
And that's why it's really interesting to see how, you know, the -- you know, economists and analysts, and including myself, look and break down where the impact. This is not just an energy. It leads to one country, one small disruption, it leads to a bigger disruption and different industry and does have overall impact.
CHURCH: Yes. It is a wakeup call for those businesses to move right now. Ryan Patel, many thanks. As always, appreciate it.
And still to come, Vladimir Putin has given the order for Russian troops to move into Eastern Ukraine. But whether or not the invasion has begun, well, that depends on who you ask.
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HOLMES: Hello everyone. I'm Michael Holmes live Lviv, Ukraine. U.S. President Joe Biden calling it the beginning of a Russian invasion of Ukraine. All though it's not yet clear if any Russian troops have actually moved across the border. The U.S. and other Western countries have hit Moscow with a first round of economic sanctions making it clear that a further invasion will bring even more punishment. Now, we've just heard from Vladimir Putin who says, Russia's interests and security are nonnegotiable. That, he is open, however, to dialogue on the most difficult problems.
Meanwhile, new satellite pictures show Russian forces and military equipment in Belarus and parts of Russia moving closer to the border with Ukraine. They include vehicle convoys, dozens of military tents, and even a field hospital. The Russian President, he says his recognition of independence for Ukraine's Donetsk and Luhansk Republics extends to the entire region. This is significant because, currently, pro-Russian separatists only control the areas shaded in red on the map.
The Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov using some creative reasoning to explain why Russian forces are moving in.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SERGEY LAVROV, RUSSIAN FOREIGN MINISTER (through translator): I don't think anyone can claim that the Ukrainian regime, since the 2014 coup d'etat represents all the people living on the territory of the Ukrainian State. What happened in Crimea, what happened in Eastern Ukraine, shows how much the government, this regime, rejected my millions of Ukrainians at that time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Now, America's top diplomat has canceled a meeting with Sergey Lavrov, which had been scheduled for Thursday. Anthony Blinken meeting Tuesday with his Ukrainian counterpart, however, in Washington, he says Russian President Vladimir Putin's intentions towards Ukraine have been clear for the whole time.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[02:35:00]
ANTONY BLINKEN, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: His plan all along has been to invade Ukraine. To control Ukraine and its people. To destroy Ukraine's democracy, which offers a stark contrast of the autocracy that he leads to reclaim Ukraine as a part of Russia. That's why this is the greatest threat to security in Europe since World War II.
DMYTRO KULEBA, UKRAINIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: The entire world stands today with Ukraine, and rightly so. Putin wants much more than a war- torn piece of Ukrainian land and people living there. What stops him is only our unity and resolve.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Now, CNN International Security Editor Nick Paton Walsh is live for us this hour in Vinnytsia in Ukraine heading to the Southern Port City of Odessa. A very critical, strategic place. Nick, let's start with this. Do we think the sanctions are going to have any meaningful impact?
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR: It doesn't appear to be the case at the moment. I think that probably in the Kremlin they weren't expecting to see Nord Stream 2 cutoff, that's the significant pipeline to Germany, possibly feeding gas to the rest of Europe as well. That's an enormous financial loss, possibly, for Kremlin. As they say, the certification of it has been delayed. So, there's a possibility it could be revived in a sort of a sunnier climate months down the line. But that is certainly, I think, something I am guessing that Vladimir Putin was counting but still persists regardless of his actions.
The other sanctions we heard, some of these targeted people who are already known, frankly, many of these targeted banks that had already been on some sanctions lists. So, they're unlikely to have been too much of a body blow and Russia has been preparing itself, frankly, openly stating how ready it is for further sanctions, talking about its fortress economy at times. And so, it doesn't appear that we'll be heard yesterday is necessarily going to change whatever Vladimir Putin has decided to do.
The broader issue is whether the future sanctions down the line might alter that calculus and quite whether or not the surprise of Nord Stream 2 has changed anything. You may also argue that he simply thinks he can go for broke now but damage is going to be done. He knows the extent of it, and therefore doesn't need to divert on the plan ahead. But the fact that we heard Sergey Lavrov just talking about how the government of Ukraine didn't represent millions of people here, essentially shows the Kremlin's logic when it comes to democracy. I mean, many countries have millions of people who did not vote for the government in question. It doesn't necessarily mean that a neighboring country militarily intervenes to represent them.
So, we're into a very different narrative here from Russia, extremely persistent and quite strident. And despite the fact that there's always the suggested maybe diplomacy can win out at the end. The dynamic of this Russian narrative, attacks that they claim against the separatists, the request for troops to go in. The authorization of that from the federation council. Vladimir Putin saying, we'll always talk about dialogue but our interests of security are paramount.
It is that slow-moving machine that, frankly, from outside of Russia, it does look a bit clumsy and choreographed. But may possibly, in the mindset of those in the Kremlin, feed a domestic narrative that people trying to convince internally, if they frankly care that much about public opinion.
HOLMES: Yes, yes. Indeed. That's a great point. You've lived in Russia. You covered Putin. I mean, what do you think could his possible next moves be?
WALSH: It is extremely hard to tell, frankly. As I said, I didn't think -- if you're looking at the -- what seems to be visible on satellite pictures around the borders, the movements of troops are definitely going in the wrong direction if you are here in Ukraine. Continuing to mass and move forward. The Western official couple of days ago said, look, you know, they can't keep this up forever. It's a matter of days that these troops can remain in what they call tactical formation. Talking about soldiers sleeping in vehicles, frankly, being constantly ready to move. So, you would imagine, probably, that a decision to move across the border must be taken at some point in the next week. But we have been saying this for weeks, frankly. So, that part of the calculus is hard to understand. They've certainly lost any elements of surprise. And with Ukraine calling up its reserve -- reservists here, but not calling for a general mobilization. There's clearly a bit here to be ready. Although, I think, most military analysts will suggest that the Ukrainian military doesn't have much of a chance against a full- fledged Russian attack.
So, it is essentially with Vladimir Putin how far he wants to go. Many suggests that he can't really weather the sanctions that are likely to be imposed for just a very small incremental gain. And so, that raises the specter of the awful motion being pushed around by Western officials for quite some time now of a more broad full-scale invasion here.
Still, to me, that has always sounded an extraordinarily stupid move for Moscow because of it's unsustainability, because of the loss of Ukrainian lives, many of whom the Kremlin narratives suggests their brothers who need protecting.
[02:40:00]
And so, we are into very difficult days ahead. We're essentially the window for Putin's decision appears to be smaller and smaller. And the avenue for diplomacy, now Secretary of State Anthony Blinken said he is not going to meet Sergey Lavrov. That sort of high stakes, big stage kind of deal making, which seems to sometimes sate Moscow's appetite for attention. That window does appear to be closed. And so, it is essentially, I think, a time whether Vladimir Putin decides that his bluff is going to be called or not here. And we need to see quite what that means on the grounds and that has to transpire, I would suggest, very soon.
HOLMES: All right. Good to have you on there, Nick. Nick Paton Walsh there in West Central Ukraine. We'll check in with you in the hours ahead.
Now, Vladimir Putin, while he is refusing to give a specific timeline of when Russian troops might move into Eastern Ukraine. But CNN reports a large number of military vehicles on the move across the border in Russia. More now from CNN's Alex Marquardt.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voiceover): The Kremlin is calling them peacekeepers, but that isn't convincing anyone that the Russian troops being ordered into the breakaway regions of Eastern Ukraine couldn't soon do more. Putin today didn't say when the troops would be deployed. But the head of NATO said, a further invasion is underway.
JENS STONTENBERG, NATO SECRETARY GENERAL: Russia has been present in different covert operations in Donetsk and Luhansk for many, many years. What we see now is additional Russian forces and troops moving in. And this makes the whole situation even more serious.
MARQUARDT (voiceover): The Kremlin's recognition of the territories adds up to what could be, with Crimea, essentially a land grab of seven percent of Ukrainian territory. If you think his campaign stops here, more than 150,000 Russian troops and the modern arsenal of weaponry still surround Ukraine on three sides. To the North, in Belarus, the Russian presence is apparently open-ended. There are fears, also, for Ukraine's Southern Coast on the Sea of Azov, thought to be a potential target for Putin to further connect illegally seized Crimea to Russia.
MIKE ROGERS, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY COMMENTATOR: They want to cut off more of the Azov Sea, strategically that's important for Russia, as well as it is this romantic notion of Putin's that Ukraine is really a Russian State and it should have been all along.
MARQUARDT (voiceover): And in Eastern Ukraine, that frontline for the past eight years has now suddenly changed, posing new dangers. A meandering unmarked, unrecognized frontier, the prospect of Ukrainian troops a few hundred meters from Russian troops. The rubble enclaves that Moscow recognized are just one third of the provinces that they're in. But Putin today said they believe the so-called republics can claim the rest of the land. An issue, he said, that will be worked out in talks between Kyiv and the Kremlin backed separatists.
JULIA IOFFE, FOUNDING PARTNER AND WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, PUCK: Just last week, they said they were withdrawing troops, turns out they weren't. They said they wouldn't -- Putin last week said he wouldn't recognize these breakaway republics because it would violate the Minsk Accords. He recognized the breakaway republics.
MARQUARDT (on camera): Some observers believe that Kremlin may even have much of Eastern Ukraine and its sights coming all the way here to the Dnieper River, which divides West and East Ukraine. It's one of the few natural barriers and what is a largely flat country.
MARQUARDT (voiceover): Some officials and experts fear that Putin's next move could be fast and heavy. Others believe it will be incremental and gradual. Either way, designed to weaken the Kyiv government and expands Russia's reach. Alex Marquardt, CNN, Zaporizhzhia, Ukraine.
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HOLMES: All right. We'll have much more from Ukraine coming, up. For now, let's go back to Rosemary Church in Atlanta. Rosie.
CHURCH: All right. Thanks so much, Michael. See you soon.
Still to come, Hong Kong plans to put every single resident through multiple stages of COVID testing to slow the spread of the virus. We're live in Hong Kong with the latest on the new initiative.
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[02:45:00] Hong Kong Chief Executive Carrie Lam is ordering mandatory COVID test for all residents beginning in March. The precaution comes amidst surging new infections that officials say has exceeded the government's ability to handle. CNN's Ivan Watson joins me now live from Hong Kong with more on this. Good to see you, Ivan. So, what's been the reaction there to Hong Kong imposing mandatory COVID testing starting next month along with other tough new measures?
IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Anecdotally, a lot of confusion and actually, I would say, fear with some Hong Kong residents that I'm seeing in messaging boards, in WhatsApp groups talking about trying to get their families out of here before the mandatory testing begins.
You know, Hong Kong is one of the most isolated places in the world right now, Rosemary. Its border boundary with mainland China is largely closed and it is cut off, really, from the outside world with strict quarantines and flights to nine countries completely banned, the U.S., Canada, Australia, France, Pakistan, India, Australia, Nepal. What Carrie Lam announced on Tuesday, the Chief Executive of Hong Kong, was that those flight bans would continue until the end of April. As with the existing social distancing measures, effective lockdown underway and that that would be strengthened.
And basically, the bubble that Hong Kong had maintained had -- its fortress against COVID has completely shattered. We are now counting more than 6000 cases a day. The Hong Kong University has models projecting up to 180,000 cases a day in two or three weeks. And the Hong Kong government is doubling down on China's zero-COVID strategy. So, it is announcing that it is going to conduct mandatory testing of the entire population in March, at least three times.
It is also sticking to its existing policy, where if you test positive, you are taken away and put into hospital isolation. Last week we saw some hospitals overwhelmed. They simply couldn't handle the numbers at this early phase of the fifth wave of infections. So, the government has announced that it is building new camps, medical camps, trying to create tens of thousands of additional units for isolation of people.
The scenario is that you have to line up for mandatory testing in a couple of weeks times with your families, if you test positive, you then have to go into isolation into one of the camps that is now under construction. Another measure being imposed, these schools, their summer holidays are being pushed forward to March, basically, next week. And schools will be used for testing and for isolation facilities as well.
Dramatic measures that are being imposed here that Carrie Lam, the top official here -- appointed official was asked about the legal foundation for this. Also, for possibly sending test samples to Mainland China to laboratories there if the labs here are overwhelmed. And this was her response.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) CARRIE LAM, HONG KONG CHIEF EXECUTIVE (through translator): In this wartime environment, this emergency, we cannot let existing laws stop us from doing something we should do. This is not the mentality for fighting a war.
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WATSON: She's calling this a war against COVID, saying that after this storm there will be a rainbow here in Hong Kong.
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But it is leading critics to question the viability in the future of this city as being an international trading hub. Rosemary.
CHURCH: Yes, a lot of people worried. Ivan Watson joining us live from Hong Kong. Many thanks.
Well, the White House and Pentagon are making plans to prevent a possible trucker blockade in Washington similar to the one that caused major headaches in the Canadian capital and beyond. There are reports of a potential convoy that may be traveling to several American cities in the coming days, including Washington. Possibly to disrupt the U.S. Presidents upcoming State of the Union Address on March 1st. 700 national guard members will be deployed. But it's unclear if the convoy will actually materialize.
Truckers in Canada were protesting COVID vaccine and testing mandates. American truckers' online discussions started the same way but morphed into talk of shutting down the government and protesting the 2020 presidential election result.
Western powers are on the hunt for really rich Russians. Why the Kremlin and the oligarchs who bolster it are being hit with vigorous new sanctions. But will that be enough to rattle Russia? We'll take a look. Stay with us.
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HOLMES: Hello everyone. I'm Michael Holmes live in Lviv in Ukraine. Now, a short time ago the Russian President announced that his country's interests and security are non-negotiable. But the Kremlin is open to finding diplomatic solutions to the most difficult problems, his words. That's after the Western powers, of course, impose sanctions over what the U.S. called the beginning of an invasion.
Meanwhile, satellite images do indicate an increase in Russian forces and equipment near the border with Ukraine. Moscow insists it has no troops inside yet. But the NATO chief says they have really been there since 2014 when the areas became self-declared republics and that this is actually a reinvasion.
Meanwhile, Germany is hitting the brakes on its Nord Stream 2 pipeline with Russia which was meant to deliver natural gas to Europe. The pipeline is built but not yet operational. The German chancellor now says, no one should bet on its future and that Russian actions this week have been, "A great disappointment."
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OLAF SCHOLZ, GERMAN CHANCELLOR (through translator): These are very difficult days and hours for Europe. Close to 80 years after the end of World War II, there is the danger of a war in Eastern Europe. It is our job to avert such a catastrophe and I appeal, again, to Russia to help in the process. Thank you.
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HOLMES: Over wealthy rations who have sway with President Putin could soon feel the squeeze of sanctions and some might eventually be kicked out of the Western countries where they keep their properties and they prefer to live. CNN's Tom Foreman explains why Russian oligarchs are coming under fire.
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TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voiceover): The West is hunting rich Russians, their yachts, homes and hidden bank accounts. All the assets of Vladimir Putin's billionaire boys club.
JOE BIDEN, U.S. PRESIDENT: We will also impose sanctions on Russia's elites and their family members. They share in the corrupt games of the Kremlin's policies and to share in the pain as well.
[02:55:00]
FOREMAN (voiceover): Many Russian oligarchs, who often spend a lot of time outside Russia at their foreign properties have deep ties to Putin.
Newly-named to the U.S. sanctions list, Denis Bortnikov, an official at a Russian bank and son of the director of the federal security services, the modern KGB. Petr Fradkov, a banking official with strong ties to Russia's defense industry. Vladimir Kiriyenko, son of Sergey Kiriyenko, the former prime minister who oversees Putin's domestic policy, who has also been sanctioned. And the list could grow.
BLINKEN: Other Russian elites and their family members are on notice that additional actions could be taken against them.
FOREMAN (voiceover): The Brits have name to.
BORIS JOHNSON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: And we are sanctioning three very high net worth individuals, Gennady Timchenko, Boris Rotenberg and Igor Rotenberg.
FOREMAN (voiceover): Timchenko is one of the richest people in Russia with "Forbes" estimating his net worth at $24 billion. His business deals integrated the illegally seized Crimea into the Russian financial system. The Rotenberg's have strong interest in gas and energy companies. And plenty of Russian banks and businesses are also on the list. Edward Fishman was formerly with the U.S. State Department.
EDWARD FISHMAN, FORMER U.S. STATE DEPT. OFFICIAL: These individuals have kind of had a tacit agreement with the State where they support Putin politically and as a result they're allowed to benefit -- practices.
FOREMAN (voiceover): Some of Putin's pals were hit with sanctions when Crimea fell in 2014.
BARACK OBAMA, FORMER U.S PRESIDENT: All there is to change his calculus.
FOREMAN (voiceover): Analysts believe that did slow Russia's role into Ukraine. And this time, many say the economic consequences for Putin should be steep. And for the oligarchs, their wives and mistresses, and their assets that they shelter abroad.
FISHMAN: They're not going to, you know, turn a Russian billionaire into a pauper. But what they will do though is create substantial frustration and annoyance in their lives.
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FOREMAN (on camera): The sanctions could freeze assets for many of these superrich Russians. They could block new investments, stop them from traveling, maybe even keep their kids from attending Western universities. But will all of that rocking of the ox be enough to make Putin change his direction? Smart money says, maybe. Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.
HOLMES: Thanks everyone for watching and spending part of your day with us. I'm Michael Holmes, live Lviv, Ukraine. Rosemary Church and I will be back after this short break with more news. You're watching CNN.
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