Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Biden Nominates Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson to Supreme Court; Sources: U.S. Expected to Impose Sanctions on Putin as Soon as Today; Ukrainian President: We Are Alone in Defending Our Country; Ex-Ukraine Leader: We Stand in Line to Get Weapons Against Russians; Ukrainian Fighters Before Dying: "Russian Warship, Go F Yourself"; NATO Response Force Activated for First Time Ever; Ukraine Confirms Arrival of Convoy "Full of Ammunition" from Poland. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired February 25, 2022 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:30:00]

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: In so many ways, she became so relatable to people. And I think that is the most important thing we saw today.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Jeff Zeleny, to you.

We know that Judge Brown Jackson was just confirmed over the summer with the support of three Republican Senators, Murkowski and Collins and Graham.

The president actually mentioned the mayor of Miami endorsed this nomination. He doesn't have a vote. But it was interesting.

(LAUGHTER)

BLACKWELL: Do we know what the Republican narrative is? Is the fight shaping up? And what is the White House expecting?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: The fight is shaping up, Victor, in predictable fashion, and it wouldn't have mattered who the nominee was. The fight, at least in the early hours, would have been similar.

Senate Republican Leader Mitch McConnell was careful to not criticize her credentials but he did criticize the process, suggested that dark money groups from the liberal left are behind her.

Of course, not mentioning similar groups on the right that have also played a role in previous and recent Supreme Court processes.

So the reality is she'll be confirmed by a very narrow margin, if she is confirmed. It will be a handful of Republicans at the most.

But the three Republicans who did vote to confirm her last year, Lindsey Graham, he was already coming out against her earlier this morning.

He favored a South Carolina federal judge, Michelle Childs, who was another finalist. So the White House is not expecting Lindsey Graham.

Senator Susan Collins, Senator Lisa Murkowski are a couple of Republicans that are likely to be among those supporting the candidate. Perhaps a couple of others but that will be it.

But the reality here is this is a divided Washington, a divided capital, and no Supreme Court justices will get the broad approval that only a decade or so they did.

But I thought interestingly, she gave a nod to Justice Breyer. She clerked for him in 1999. And she said, it will be up to the Senate if I fill his seat but I cannot fill his shoes.

But that is the experience that Judge Jackson brings to this. She has been in the halls of the Supreme Court.

So that is what she's going to take into meetings next week on Capitol Hill when she begins to meet with Senators.

She'll be meeting with Democrats and Republicans alike. And the hearings will begin in a number of weeks.

So at this point, things always can come up during a confirmation process. But she has the rare sort of history of being confirmed three times recently.

Of course, this is the mother of all confirmations, but the White House is fairly confident that she will be confirmed.

But the next six weeks, of course, will be a Washington process, often messy, often noisy. But at the end of the day, her credentials will guide this.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: Joan, I'll read the tweet from Senator Graham this morning that he sent out because he wasn't fully supportive of this.

He said, "If media reports are accurate and Judge Jackson has been chosen as the Supreme Court nominee to replace Justice Breyer, it means the radical left has won President Biden over yet again."

"The attacks by the left on Judge Childs" -- his choice -- "from South Carolina, apparently worked."

And there were some progressive groups that felt that Judge Childs had been too corporate, had worked in high-end corporate law firms and they didn't like that.

But basically, do you have a sense of why President Biden went in this direction? Was it just chemistry after the meetings?

JOAN BISKUPIC, CNN LEGAL ANALYST & SUPREME COURT BIOGRAPHER: No. I think there were several things.

I think, did he have chemistry with her? And it is always important, especially for someone like Joe Biden, to sit down with an individual before he's going to make any kind of a nomination.

But I want to address fundamentally what you're asking, Alisyn, and what Victor was talking about, for what is coming ahead.

She already began making some points to Senators like Lindsey Graham and others about points that they might be going after, not just the dark money that you've referred to, that really she was not part of it, but issues of crime and her work as a public defender.

When she was before the Senate Judiciary Committee for her current position on the D.C. circuit, they asked a lot about her work, possibly helping accused criminals go free.

And they wanted to know what she had done there. And crime is such a hot topic now.

But I thought it was so fascinating how, suddenly, she wove in her law enforcement cred in some ways.

She said, some of you have heard that I have an uncle who was sentenced to prison and it was in a drug situation where he was sentenced to life and then got clemency under President Obama.

But she said, I have two other -- I have two other uncles who are part of law enforcement. I have a brother who is part of a law enforcement and the military. And she stressed the public service of her parents.

So even though this presentation, you know, for the first time for a televised audience to be seeing this nominee, was so warm and personable, there were also messages underlying it.

That, I think, show us the first step of how she will present herself to the Senate and present herself against some of the narratives that might be coming from her opponents -- Alisyn?

[14:35:07]

BLACKWELL: So this is the introduction. The process now begins.

Joan Biskupic, Abby Phillip, Laura Coates, Jeff Zeleny and Gloria Borger, thank you.

CAMEROTA: OK, ahead, U.S. Intel sources fear that Ukraine's capitol could fall within days.

The Ukraine government asked citizens for help, to makes things like Molotov cocktails to defend their country. So we go live on the ground there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAMEROTA: We are just getting information into our newsroom. Sources tell CNN that the U.S. is planning to impose sanctions on Russian President Vladimir Putin.

BLACKWELL: CNN's Phil Mattingly is in Washington. He's with us now.

[14:40:01]

Phil, what are you hearing?

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, we heard President Biden yesterday tell Kaitlan Collins that it was something that was on the table, the idea of sanctioning the Russian president directly.

Over the course of the last several days, we've seen, as the U.S. has rolled out two rounds of sanctions, that they have targeted a lot of members of Putin's inner circle and some of their family members.

Now they will escalate things. I'm told that as soon as today, according to two sources familiar with the proposal, that the U.S. will apply sanctions to President Putin directly.

Now this is a complicated issue. President Putin doesn't have a regular bank account and investment broker.

So the actual strategy of getting to his finances, trying to find where they are and then impose sanctions upon them has been a complicated one for years.

So how the U.S. Treasury Department ends up deploying these sanctions will go a long way to telling how much of an effect they have.

But there's no question it will have a major symbolic effect.

And it comes just a few hours after the European Union agreed to sanction President Putin and Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov, freeze their assets.

And it kind of underscores that, throughout the course of the sanctions we've seen over the course of the last several days, particularly since the Russian invasion of Ukraine, that those sanctions can move.

They could be ramped up. They could be dialed up. Whether it is on the individual side or more broadly. And it is a sign of things to come.

There's no question about it, however, that the decision by the U.S. to directly sanction the leader of Russia is something that doesn't have a significant amount of parallel.

They've gone after the ayatollah before. Kim Jong-Un, I believe, has been sanctioned, as well as other leaders as well.

But they're willingness to do this at this moment in time underscores the severity of what they're seeing and the intent to send a message both to the president directly, his top advisers and their family members directly.

But also the broader Russian economy as they try to impose as much pain as possible in the wake of what Russia doing on ground in Ukraine -- guys?

BLACKWELL: certainly is a significant escalation of these sanctions.

Phil Mattingly, for us in Washington, thank you.

CAMEROTA: So Russian forces are moving towards the capital of Kyiv, Ukraine's largest city of nearly three million people.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(EXPLOSIONS)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: The skies over Kyiv there lighting up with missile strikes.

U.S. Intelligence believes that the capital could fall in the next several days. Western intelligence predicts Vladimir Putin plan is to install his own puppet government if Kyiv topples.

To the southeast, U.S. defense officials say an amphibious assault is happening west in Mariupol, adding that thousands of Russian naval infantry could come ashore there.

BLACKWELL: While Ukrainians are under attack, the president weighs in, offering to talk with the Russians. Volodymyr Zelensky fist suggested the meeting to stop the death of people.

He's also pleading for help to other world leaders as his own citizens are being directed to make Molotov cocktails and take down the occupiers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): This morning, we are defending our country alone, just like yesterday. The most powerful country in the world looked on from a distance.

Russia was hit with sanctions yesterday but these are not enough to get these foreign troops off our soil. Only through solidarity and determination can this be achieved.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: CNN Anchor Erin Burnett joins us from Lviv, Ukraine.

Erin, Ukraine versus Russia is really a David versus Goliath situation when it comes to military assets.

But we're learning that U.S. Intelligence believes Ukrainians are putting up a tougher fight than Russia expected?

ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR, "ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT": Yes, that is what intelligence is suggesting and certainly what we're seeing in Kyiv where they're saying there's a stiffer resistance than might have been anticipated against the Russian onslaught.

Part of it is that you can't really measure the strength of belief and passion and patriotism and fortitude that we just see from person after person.

And certainly after the young men, who are now not allowed to leave the country because they have to stay and fight. And that is -- that is the reality on the ground here.

I should say that, you know, when I highlight the young men between 18 and 60, obviously, the other end there, they're not young.

But that is the age group that are no longer allowed to leave the country because it is under martial law. They are staying. And that is what you see.

You do see plenty of women around. But when you go to the border, where almost 50,000 people try to cross in the past day or two, just along the Polish border, I mean, it is incredible the onslaught of people. And it is just the beginning.

You're seeing a vast majority of women and children because men can't leave.

And people are desperately trying to get out of the country.

Today, when we were driving on our way to a story, we saw a clump of people. Yesterday, anytime you saw a clump of people, it was at an ATM.

So we said, what is this group of people? This is the Polish consulate, Alisyn and Victor. And if was fascinating. I went over asked them what they were doing.

These were Ukrainians who had given their passports to the Polish consulate because they wanted to get work visas to go to Poland before this started.

[14:45:02]

Well, now this is happening, they desperately want to get out of the country right away and they don't have passports.

So every time that door opens, there was a crush of people. They were polite but very desperate because they just want to get in there and get their passport so they could go to the border an get over it.

And that is the reality of what you're seeing here.

That being said, while people are fleeing, you do have all of these particularly young men who are staying. And 18,000 guns, they say, in the city of Kyiv and that region were given out to Reservists, all of whom have been showing up.

And you have this unity in this country, this passion, as I said, and patriotism.

Zelensky obviously speaking, putting out those Facebook posts every night and the early hours of the morning.

His chief rival, who is facing charges for treason, that people say are politically motivated, Petro Poroshenko, is now arm in arm with Zelensky standing behind his country.

And here is what he said earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PETRO POROSHENKO, FORMER UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT: We are standing in line for the weapons. We are standing in line to give our blood to the -- our soldiers.

And with this situation, definitely we demonstrate a unique quality that we can stand against Russian aggression. We can stand against Russian occupation. We are united together with the whole world.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: That is the exact reality of what we see on the ground.

And you see it also in that story of how 13 Ukrainian border guards made the ultimate sacrifice for their country when we saw that actually happen. It has gone viral.

An audio recording came out. And I'm sure some people may have seen it. But I want to share it.

This captured the border guards' final moments on Thursday as they defended an island called Snake Island from a Russian warship. That island is 30 miles off Ukraine's coast in the Black Sea.

So the Russians told the Ukrainians to surrender. The Ukrainians told the Russians -- they literally said, "Russian warship, go F yourself."

Listen to it.

(BEGIN AUDIO FEED)

UNIDENTIFIED RUSSIAN SOLDIER: I am Russian military ship. Propose to put down arms or you will be hit. Acknowledge.

UNIDENTIFIED UKRAINIAN SOLDIER (NOT THROUGH THE RADIO): F it as well.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (NOT THROUGH THE RADIO): Just in case.

UNIDENTIFIED UKRAINIAN SOLDIER: Russian warship, go (EXPLETIVE DELETED) yourself.

(END AUDIO FEED) BURNETT: Ukraine's president said the fighters killed have each been posthumously awarded the title of Hero of Ukraine.

And, Alisyn and Victor, that is the latest from the ground.

CAMEROTA: That is just incredible bravery, obviously, to hear. It is chilling to hear how they had to make that choice in that second that they knew would end their lives.

BLACKWELL: Yes, certainly.

CAMEROTA: Erin, thank you.

Erin Burnett was there in Lviv for us.

Meanwhile, Ukrainian officials say that a convey full of ammunition from Poland has just arrived. This is the first publicly known shipment of military aid since the invasion by Russia began.

And for the first time ever, the NATO Response Force has been activated. President Biden joined the NATO summit today where leaders met to create a plan of action.

Let's discuss with Nic Robertson, CNN international diplomatic editor, in Moscow. And also with us, retired U.S. Army Brigadier General Peter Zwack. He's also a global fellow at the Wilson Center's Kennan Institute.

General, let me start with you and the significance of the activation of this NATO Response Force beyond what we've seen the deployment from other NATO members and the U.S. at the top of the list of forces to the region.

BRIG. GEN. PETER ZWACK, U.S. ARMY, RETIRED & GLOBAL FELLOW, WILSON CENTER'S KENNAN INSTITUTE: Thank you, Victor.

It is very significant. What it shows, the Russian Federation -- (AUDIO PROBLEM) -- in supporting the stability of Europe, of the assurance of the protection of its allies and stability for the region.

It is a direct and -- and -- the unity aspect of it is critical at this time.

This was evolved -- (AUDIO PROBLEM).

It looks like one of the main efforts of the Kremlin was to divide Europe, to divide the -- to divide NATO, the E.U. And even neutrals, E.U. members are behind this.

So this is very, very important, as much symbolically as physically.

CAMEROTA: Nic, we've also heard that sanctions -- the U.S. and the E.U. are now going to sanction Vladimir Putin personally.

Now this is something that President Biden had resisted just yesterday.

I mean, 24 hours ago, we watched his press conference and our Kaitlan Collins asked him, why not sanction Putin personally, and the president deflected. But today, that is happening.

[14:50:02]

And why is that so complicated? And what will that mean for Vladimir Putin?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes, we've heard the same thing from the British prime minister, saying that fairly soon it appears that the U.K. will invoke the same sanctions or similar sanctions on Putin and his foreign minister, Sergey Lavrov.

It's certainly a way of getting President Putin directly. It's probably not going to undermine his wealth. He has a lot of money that's looked after for him by oligarchs. Some of them are overseas. Some of them will now be under sanction as well.

But his wealth is broadly believed to be hidden away, hidden behind other names in shell companies and under other ownership. Hard to trace.

He has some wealth that's on display in Russia, the huge palace he has down in Sochi. Human rights organization, one of sort of the chief oppositions people at the moment, Navalny, highlighted just how much money has gone into that palace.

But actually targeting Putin this way --- you know, this was raised as a question for President Biden maybe six or seven weeks ago.

At that time, Putin's spokesman responded to that. And he said, you know, essentially, that's not going to work. That's only going to put bigger political divisions between us. It's not a path to anything useful.

Well, of course, Russia has now invaded Ukraine. Paths to political cooperation are clearly out of the window.

I think, for those people that watch Putin and watch how he runs the country and hides his wealth, I think the expectation will be this won't have a serious impact on his wealth and on his desire and ability to run the country.

The sanctions, I think, are going to work broadly over time.

And it's probably worth saying, at this point, there's been a lot of criticism that SWIFT hasn't been invoked by the E.U., by the United States, by the U.K., exiting Russia from using the SWIFT financial mechanisms.

This working together to target Putin and the foreign minister go perhaps some way to try to address what appears to be a lack of unity on the bigger, bigger sanctions that might have serious impact. BLACKWELL: General, the U.S. Intelligence assessment is that the

Russians are a bit surprised by the degree of fight that they are seeing from the Ukrainians. More resistance than they expected. That's over the last 48 hours or so.

But is that sustainable considering what we know about the disparity in resources?

ZWACK: Great question. I think that -- yes, the Russians have had a disdain for, I think, overall, Ukraine as an independent nation, as a subset of its military capability.

However, you go back to 2014 and '15 during the first battles, if you will, in Donetsk, that's where really I believe modern Ukraine was born. Because they did fight the Russians. They did stand up.

And then, over the last eight years, they have been in this sort of ugly gray zone battle with the Russians and their proxies and the Russians behind them.

But there's still that sustained -- I think, at the beginning of the offense yesterday, overt piece, there's just much about a shock-and- awe piece to cow the Ukrainians.

But the Ukrainians, I think, are fed up. They don't want to fight the Russians. They see each other as Slovik brothers and all that.

But the Russians have pushed it. They are being attacked. People have been killed. The Russians are on their land.

As far as the sanction on Vladimir Putin and all that, whether the effects, it assigns direct responsibility now, internationally, to an individual and a group behind them that's started the most consequential and possibly most dangerous war in Europe since the beginning of World War II.

CAMEROTA: In fact, Nic, President Zelensky is beseeching the U.S., it sounds like to me, and Europe to see Ukraine as part of Europe. Don't see them as a non-NATO member.

He's saying it's time to see us as part of Europe. Europeans are being attacked.

He's saying -- here is something specifically he said:

"Europe has enough strength to stop this aggression. What to expect from European countries?"

Basically, they expect the abolition of visas for Russians, disconnection of SWIFT, as you mentioned, complete isolation of Russia, the withdrawal of ambassadors, oil embargo, closing of air space.

[14:55:00]

"All this must be on the table today." He wants the E.U. and U.S. to go much further.

ROBERTSON: He does. And he has good reason. Because the sanctions, as they are being applied right now, are not without consequence. But they are without immediate, huge consequence.

This is war that's happening for Zelensky. And his people are being killed by the minute, by the hour. His people, his nation are dying. He wants to save lives right now.

Unless you put the full force of everything that's available on Russia and bring it to bear in such a way that it's not just on President Putin's table but it's Russians who see it.

I was speaking to Russians today. Some of the banks here that have been affected that weren't affected with the first round of sanctions earlier this week, they are banks where plenty of Russians have their money.

They are wondering and asking the question, can I get my money? They're watching the loss of value in the Ruble. Can they pay off loans they have got? What is this going to mean for them going forward?

Those question -- this is what Zelensky wants raised up. He wants the level of debate in Russia about the pain that everyone will feel, the economic pain, not the physical pain his people are feeling.

But raise that level to a point where people are really questioning Putin and coming out on the streets.

There are two things I think that's broadly assessed that are going to -- or it's, in essence, one thing that will stop President Putin. And that will be recognizing that popular opinion has turned against them. It hasn't so far.

And there were two roots to that. It's hammering the economy of Russia so that people complain and criticize and it becomes part of daily conversation.

The other is what President Putin has warned about, about the attrition to his military forces, the loss of soldiers.

British government officials today -- a minister, a minister for defense forces said that he estimated 460 Russian servicemen have been killed.

If the numbers increase like that, if the numbers are accurate -- we don't know if they are -- but if they continue to increase, that will be hard for President Putin to explain to his population. That will drive up the conversation.

I think that's what President Zelensky is trying get up, to drive the narrative up now, stop Putin now, not in a few months when the sanctions have a more biting effect.

BLACKWELL: Nic Robertson, Gen. Zwack, thank you.

CAMEROTA: Well, the U.N. says tens of thousands of Ukrainians have already fled the country, many heading west to the border with Poland. We have more on that ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)