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Russians Have Taken Control Of Ukrainian Town; Ukraine Continues To Hold Off Most Russian Forces; Putin Puts Russia's Deterrence Forces On High Alert; Interview With Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D- MN); Thousands Of Russian Protesters Detained; Ukrainians Defy Russia's Onslaught; Ukraine Soldiers Prisoners Of War. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired February 27, 2022 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:01]

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN HOST: Thanks so much for joining me this weekend. I'm Fredricka Whitfield. The NEWSROOM continues with Jim Acosta right now.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN HOST: You are live in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Jim Acosta in Washington, and we begin with breaking news.

We are getting reports that the Russians have taken control of a southern Ukrainian town with a population of about 100,000 people. It also has a small naval base. That disturbing news coming on a day that saw the courage of the Ukrainian people on display.

This is the scene earlier in Ukraine's second largest city Kharkiv. The commander of the Ukrainian forces there says dozens of Russian troops surrendered and he says the captured soldiers complained of fuel shortages, demoralization and confusion about their mission. We also saw incredible video from the outskirts of Kyiv where Ukrainian forces destroyed Russian armored personnel carriers and other vehicles.

The two sides have agreed to meet for talks at the Belarus border on Monday. Ukraine saying it has no interest in surrender, only peace.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRES. VOLODYMYR ZELENSKY, UKRAINE (through translator): I will say this frankly, as always I don't really believe in the result of this meeting. But let them try. So then later on no citizen of Ukraine would have any doubt that I, the president, did not try to stop the war when I had a chance. Small as it was.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Russia's Vladimir Putin already a pariah on the world stage has put his country's deterrence forces which include nuclear weapons on high alert. The move has been condemned by the White House and NATO secretary general. And in Russia, for Putin, it's no bed of roses. It's yellow and blue flowers, the colors of Ukraine's flag are covering the streets near the Kremlin as Russian citizens show support for Ukraine. This anti-war protest in St. Petersburg is one of many across the

country. You can see it right there. Russian authorities have detained nearly 6,000 people for protesting the invasion. And we have just learned that the U.N. Security Council has voted to send the Ukraine issue to the U.N. General Assembly for a special emergency session.

Let's begin with CNN's Matthew Chance in Kyiv.

Matthew, a lot of big developments just in the last several minutes. And this very concerning news that a small Ukrainian town has been captured by the Russians. Ukraine reports 352 civilians have been killed since the invasion began.

Matthew, what more can you tell us?

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well, I mean, a lot of developments taking place around the country. Obviously, Jim, that one in the south of the country on the Sea of Azov. It's a port city, it's called Berdyansk. It's got a naval base there. It's a strategically located place and it's just across the water. The Sea of Azov divides Ukraine and Russia.

Russian forces moving in, informing the local residents that they've taken over all of the administrative buildings. And, you know, that seems to be the end of a situation in terms of that particular town, population of 100,000. Doesn't seem to be any fighting at the moment to repel the Russian forces that have arrived there.

That's not true of Ukraine's second city Kharkiv where as we saw from those images you were just playing, very ferocious fighting in the streets of that city. It has been still kept from out of the control of Russian forces. And so the Ukrainian military putting up a very strong fight indeed. Despite the fact that they are heavily outnumbered and heavily outgunned in defending some of these big cities and towns and locations across the country in the face of that Russian advance.

You know, you can see that illustrated very well indeed by the absolutely stunning images of a Russian armored column to the west of Kyiv, the city from which I'm speaking to you now, which is obviously making its way probing into the city. It's obviously come under attack. There are no signs of any Russian soldiers, but every one of those vehicles, armored vehicles, trucks, have been totally destroyed.

It's not clear what was the cause of that, whether it was an ambush by Ukrainian military. It's been suggested that it could have been something else responsible for it, possibly some kind of air strike. And so we're trying to get more clarity on that. It is dark now so we're unable to visit that location. But hopefully we can bring some reporting to you about that as soon as we can.

In the meantime, we are just a few hours away now from what could be a major diplomatic opening. We're not talking about peace talks here, but we're talking about talks at least between the Russians and the Ukrainians on the border between Ukraine and Belarus to the north where we will get a picture of whether there is a possibility of this conflict being brought to an end through the diplomatic path or whether the war will resume.

[16:05:19]

ACOSTA: All right. Matthew Chance, thank you very much for that. We appreciate it.

CNN's Nick Paton Walsh joins us now from Mykolaiv, a city near the Black Sea in southern Ukraine.

Nick, what are you seeing there?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR: Yes, Jim, we've actually moved away since Mykolaiv to the larger city of Odessa partly because of the violence that was encircling that important town on the Black Sea. We're there 24 hours and saw frankly the heroism, see the grit and determination of those living there and the fear they have of saboteurs in their midst. Here's what we saw.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WALSH (voice-over): The bridge here hasn't been raised for as long as they can remember. But neither has the sleepy port town of Mykolaiv been invaded.

The clack-clack is likely exchanges with Russian paratroopers who we're told landed nearby. Locals struggling to keep up with their wealth here collapsing, and soldiers edging. The fear here, Russian saboteurs like these two suspects, thrown to the ground by soldiers.

Then the sirens go off. And it is back in the basement for mothers and cats.

Here the noise of what Russia would do to these towns in the name of subjugation and geopolitical gain.

Police trying to turn lights off it seems in businesses that closed in a hurry. Life persisting caught between hoping this is short lived and wondering if it may go on forever. Behind it all, in empty streets the fear they may be overrun. And whether each huge blast would be the decisive strike that lets Putin's troops enter.

The shelling just went on and on. The next morning we saw where it hit. It's likely a missile tore up these Ukrainian tanks, but nobody left, feels broken.

(On-camera): How do you feel?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good. Very good.

WALSH: Good. Yes?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

WALSH: They tried to come into the town. He is saying the Russians tried to come in last night but the town of Mykolaiv beat them. And you can see what it looks like here. He is saying look around here, I'm asking how do you feel living here looking at all this. This is where you live, right? As I look at this, look at these windows that are blown out.

Yes, so the words of Russian ministers who have been saying that they are not going to hit civilian infrastructure here, he is repeating them back to me saying look, look at this, they say that they are not hitting civilian infrastructure, look at this damage around here.

(Voice-over): Putin's rockets may have shattered glass, but not dented the anger here. As they take stock, you have to ask yourself, why Moscow ever thought that these towns would gladly be occupied and what Russia's end goal is.

Tempers fray here. Blood has been spilled. But despite Russia's overwhelming firepower, they did not pass.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALSH: But the fight does go on. Just a matter of hours ago, the mayor of that town called his citizens to organize a circular defense and grab a Molotov cocktail. It's clear they're going to be facing similar firepower again. But you do just have to ask yourself, Jim, what on earth does the Kremlin think it's going to achieve by forcing its way into a densely populated area like that and then try to run these towns for what seems to be potentially they think a significant amount of time in the future.

Startling to see and baffling to work out what the game plan is here -- Jim.

ACOSTA: Absolutely. How do you win hearts and minds when you are conducting an operation like this? All right. Nick Paton Walsh, thank you very much.

Let's go now to CNN's Jill Dougherty in Moscow where many Russians are standing in solidarity against the war in Ukraine.

Jill, this has been pretty surprising to see. But I want to ask you about this alarming order by Putin for Russia's deterrent forces to be on high alert, those forces apparently include nuclear weapons. Is this saber rattling from Vladimir Putin? Is he getting desperate? Is he trying to send a message that he's ready to escalate things quickly if he doesn't get what he wants? What are your thoughts, Jill?

[16:10:07]

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: I think he's definitely sending a message. I think he's serious about this. And it's really a message to the West. And if you look at what he's been saying this entire week, right at the beginning of the conflict, he was kind of heading in this direction. He's been talking about Ukraine as a weapon in the hands of NATO. The danger of NATO. The possibility of nuclear weapons, et cetera.

So he's mentioned things like this. But today's decision to order the military to put as he put it special combat regime of the nuclear forces is very significant. Now, why did he do it? He justified it by saying that it was sanctions, that it was also aggressive statements by NATO. It is quite a step. The White House is not answering in kind interestingly. They are saying that this is essentially a manufactured threat that doesn't exist, and that U.S. forces, nuclear forces, are sufficient the way they are right now. But it is definitely very, very provocative.

And Jim, I have to mention also today in the military realm that briefing by the spokesperson for the Ministry of Defense who for the first time admitted that Russia actually has lost people dying and wounded, no numbers, but this is the first time they've actually admitted that, in the same breath the general who was briefing said it's far fewer than the Ukrainians. But this is another important moment.

I'll give you one more quote, just kind of like that slamming of the door by Moscow to the West, the former President Medvedev, I'm sure you remember him, he said, why do we need, you know, diplomatic relations anymore, we ought to padlock the embassies and we can look at each other through binoculars and gun sights. So the rhetoric as well as actual actions are increasing. And then getting back to those protests, that's another sign.

Those protests by average Russians on the streets of Russian cities across the country are not ending. In fact some of them are getting bigger. There was some quite significant ones in St. Petersburg today, second largest city in Moscow. The police usually try to shut them down very quickly with arrests. But there has been quite a bit of protests.

Now, again, overall you'd have to say that most Russians or at least, you know, significant numbers do support -- what I was going to say the conflict because the way they would put it is Russians are in danger. Russians in the eastern part of Ukraine are in danger. You don't see any polling showing that they want a war. It's more the feeling that war is being forced on Russia. But in any case, there is some protests and that it is continuing -- Jim.

ACOSTA: A couple of things there, Jill, I mean, one is if that is the attitude among many Russians, that this conflict is being forced upon them, that is a sign that Russian propaganda is working with a significant portion of the population. But at the same time, we're looking at these images right now of St. Petersburg, where they are -- Russian police are getting physical with these protesters. And it says to me Putin cannot keep a lid on this in his own country -- Jill.

DOUGHERTY: Well, that's true. I mean, you know, these people are very brave because over the period of actually a number of years, people have gone into the streets but the police have taken different techniques and initially they would arrest like everybody. Back in the 2012, pretty much, 2017, they got more selective. And so what they are doing now is arresting people, they can hold them I believe it is for 48 hours.

And then there is a direct process. It will be very interesting to see what they are charged with. Because often here in Russia they would charge them with breaking COVID regulations. I do not know specifically what they are being charged with. But the point is the protests really are out there.

ACOSTA: All right. Jill Dougherty, it's hard to understand how Putin expects to convince people when they're roughing up grandma in the streets of St. Petersburg. But we know you'll stay on top of it.

Jill Dougherty, thank you very much.

Coming up, sources telling CNN Russia is having trouble supplying its forces as it meets stiffer than expected resistance from the Ukrainian military. I'll get reaction from former Defense secretary and CIA director Leon Panetta, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:17:58]

ACOSTA: Updating you on our breaking news, we are getting reports that the Russians have taken control of a southern Ukrainian town with a population of about 100,000 people. It also has a small naval base. Across Ukraine resistance, though, is built on the backs of some volunteers some of whom have virtually no experience handling a gun.

CNN's Matthew Chance spoke to some of them.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHANCE: So you shot a gun in school. You work in an office but now you're defending your city.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Correct. I didn't think I would join this unit just two days ago. I thought that, you know -- I don't know how to handle the guns and yesterday it came to me that, you know, Russians are in the city. I mean, it is close to the point that I have completely changed my mind and I have decided that, you know, I should do something about it.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Ukrainian citizens have also been encouraged to make Molotov cocktails and have them ready as Russia advances.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHANCE: Is it -- it's a petrol bomb.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

CHANCE: Those are your Molotov cocktails.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

CHANCE: Show me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is (INAUDIBLE). This is what I have to use to stop them.

CHANCE: These are your Molotov cocktails. Your petrol bombs.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

CHANE: And you make these yourself?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, the people from Kyiv bring me this.

CHANCE: The people from the local --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From Kyiv, they bring me this.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Joining me now is former Defense secretary and CIA director under President Obama Leon Panetta.

Mr. Secretary, thanks so much for joining us. The will of the Ukrainian people has been nothing short of remarkable. We just saw that video right there where the gentleman was telling one of our reporters the Molotov cocktails came from the apartment building across the street. So the Ukrainian citizens are certainly pitching in. But what is your reaction to this news about the town in southern Ukraine that was taken by the Russians about 100,000 people in that town and a small naval base. It does show that the Russians are advancing.

[16:20:12]

LEON PANETTA, FORMER DEFENSE SECRETARY UNDER PRESIDENT OBAMA: Well, look, there is no question we understood from the beginning the overwhelming force that the Russians were using as they invaded the Ukraine. But the encouraging thing is that the Ukrainians are putting up a hell of a fight. And, you know, we've always known that fighters who are dedicated to their cause sometimes are much better fighters than those who are invading like the Russians.

I think that even though you are going to see some towns fall, what I'm impressed by is that the Ukrainians continue to stall the Russian advance. And I think that's an important message that they need to continue to work at.

ACOSTA: Yes, I was just speaking with a Western diplomatic official here in Washington who was saying there's no question the resistance has been stronger than what was anticipated. And a Ukrainian general says they've captured about 200 Russian soldiers, that some of them were 19 years old, not trained at all. Badly equipped. There have been reports of Russian soldiers becoming disoriented, saying we don't know who to shoot. They all look like us.

What does that tell you?

PANETTA: Look, I think the most important thing for the United States and our NATO allies is to continue to try to isolate Putin. And we're doing that, we're doing that obviously with sanctions, but we're also seeing that Putin himself in many ways is isolated from the Russian people in terms of their concerns about going to war. In addition to that, I think it's really important right now that we continue to provide military aid to the Ukrainians so that they can continue this fight.

They need ammo, they need fuel, they obviously need food. We need to help supply them with what they need in order to carry on this fight. The longer that fight goes on, the more isolated Putin will be and the more vulnerable Putin will be.

ACOSTA: They certainly need more than Molotov cocktails. That's for sure. And the Russians are supposed to meet with the Ukrainian delegation at the Belarus border tomorrow. But at the same time, you know, I need to get your reaction on this, Mr. Secretary, Putin putting his deterrence forces as they call them, his nuclear arsenal on high alert. I mean, Ukraine doesn't have a nuclear force. This is just saber rattling. What is going on?

PANETTA: Jim, I view what Putin said here as a sign of weakness, not a sign of strength. If things were going well, there would be no need for him to even raise that kind of threat to the world and to the Ukraine. He is obviously trying to send a signal to the United States and to our NATO allies. But I think it's very important that Putin should understand how strong we are when it comes to nuclear deterrence.

We've got a three-pronged nuclear deterrent that can respond to any threat. And I think it's important that he understands that if he tries to do anything that might involve nuclear weapons, that he is ending not only the Putin reign but his regime as well.

ACOSTA: And the Ukrainian President Zelensky says what Russia is doing shows signs of genocide and that this is not just about Ukraine, it is about the beginning of a wider war against Europe. He's calling on citizens all over the world to come and take up arms and fight with the Ukrainians. I mean, some of that obviously is not going to happen. But, you know, this -- I mean, this leadership that Zelensky has shown in all this, this courage, this passion that he has shown, has it taken you by surprise?

PANETTA: Well, I certainly give him tremendous credit for the leadership he is showing. I think we've always known that leadership is tested in crisis. And he has really responded to this crisis as the leader of a country that obviously is being invaded by a much stronger country in Russia. But I think his leadership is very important of trying to inspire Ukrainians to get out there and resist.

I think ultimately the ability to develop a resistance movement within Ukraine, and let's face it, that's what's going to happen even if the Russians take over more towns.

[16:25:05]

What's going to happen is that Ukrainians are not going to accept Russian rule. And I don't see -- I don't see the Russians' end game here. I think it's only trouble for the Russians, for them to think that somehow they are going to be able to bring Ukraine under their thumb. It isn't going to happen.

ACOSTA: And the European Union apparently is moving forward with authorizing the purchase -- the funding of purchasing of weapons for the first time to help Ukraine. Your thoughts on that. That is a big step.

PANETTA: I think that is a very important step. I think it's very important now for the United States, for our European allies, to continue to provide strong military aid to the Ukrainians and getting them to them anyway we can. They need help to be able to resist what is clearly overwhelming, you know, military force. But these are fighters. They are tough fighters. And they are fighting for a cause they believe in.

And I think if they can continue to put up a strong resistance, and stall the Russian aggression in the Ukraine, that what that means is that it will further isolate Putin in terms of what he is trying to accomplish. And that I think is -- should be our primary strategy.

ACOSTA: All right. They have certainly shown a lot of bravery, a lot of courage. It has been remarkable and inspiring to watch.

Secretary Leon Panetta, thank you very much for your time. We appreciate it.

PANETTA: Good to be with you, Jim.

ACOSTA: All right. Good to be with you.

And up next, as Russia continues their invasion of Ukraine, what can the U.S. do to stop Vladimir Putin? Senator Amy Klobuchar joins me next.

You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:30:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: Just as the Ukrainian president agreed to begin peace talks with Russia, Russia's Vladimir Putin decided to flaunt his nuclear arsenal today. Putin took the dangerous step of putting Russia's deterrence forces, which include nuclear arms, on the highest state of alert. Here's how the White House views this latest unprovoked escalation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEN PSAKI, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: This is, really, a pattern that we've seen from President Putin through the course of this conflict, which is manufacturing threats that don't exist in order to justify further aggression. And the global community and the American people should look at it through that prism. We've seen him do this time and time again. At no point has Russia been under threat from NATO, has Russia been under threat from Ukraine. This is all a pattern from President Putin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Democratic Senator Amy Klobuchar is with me now. And, Senator, you know, I have to ask you first about what Vladimir Putin is up to. I mean, he provoked this war. He's now flexing his nuclear arsenal, I guess you could say.

How should the world, how should the U.S. be dealing with him? We're, what, four days into this attack on Ukraine, and he's talking about the prospect of some sort of nuclear strike or something, or talking about his nuclear defenses? It's ridiculous.

SEN. AMY KLOBUCHAR (D-MN): Highly provocative. That's why he did it. And I think you know, we stand by the ready, when it comes to our nuclear defenses.

But I think we have handled it right, and that is to continue the focus on supporting the people of Ukraine. And I think Vladimir Putin thought that he was going to march into this country and that they were going to throw rose petals at him. And, instead, it was Molotov cocktails. That is exactly what happened here.

And when I met with President Zelenskyy, with a group of bipartisan group of senators, his very clear focus was on getting the weapons that he needed. We were already supplying some weapons. But you've seen the world now coming to his aid, with countries like Germany and Sweden today, Denmark, announcing that they would also send him weapons.

ACOSTA: And Republican Senator Mitt Romney, like many in the Senate, are calling for the U.S. to ratchet up sanctions even more. Let's listen to what he had to say earlier this morning on CNN, then I'll get your take.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MITT ROMNEY (R-UT): Let's keep on cranking up the sanctions against what is an evil regime.

John McCain was right. He said he looked into Vladimir Putin's eyes and saw the KGB. And that's what we're seeing. A small, evil, feral- eyed man who is trying to shape the world in the image where, once again, Russia would be an empire. And that's not going to happen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Your thoughts. Is the administration going far enough? Is the U.S. going far enough? What more can be done, do you think?

KLOBUCHAR: From the beginning, President Biden has made it clear that we cannot do this alone. And that is why, now, we've gotten to the point where, number one, we are going after him personally and the thugs around him. And this means everything from their yachts to their assets.

But we can't do that alone. He doesn't have most of his stuff in the U.S. It's all over the world. So, doing that with allies was very important.

The SWIFT system. The financial transactions. We -- I just -- Japan has just joined us in kicking Russia off of that SWIFT system. That's important. Going after export controls. This was all done very methodically and that's important.

And I -- you know, I agree with Mitt. We keep up the ratcheting but we make sure we're not going it alone. And that's what the Biden Administration has been very pointed to -- very focused on from the beginning.

And it's same with the intelligence. If we had just been out there, just us by ourselves, even though we did take the lead, and put that intelligence out there, it wouldn't have been as effective if we didn't do it with, say, Great Britain.

[16:35:03]

KLOBUCHAR: We joined forces with them. Put out the maps. Put out the information. And when this happened, the world believed us. They believed the democracies of the world, that Vladimir Putin was lying when he said that he had no intention and that he was provoked. It was a lie and we called him out on it. But you can't do that in one day.

ACOSTA: Right. But let me ask you this, because Leon Panetta, the former defense secretary, former CIA director for President Obama, he was just on with us a little while ago. He said we need to make sure we're sending in as many weapons as possible to the Ukrainians.

We've been seeing anecdotal pieces of video after anecdotal pieces of video of the Ukrainians making Molotov cocktails and that sort of thing. They're taking matters into their own hands. But it -- wouldn't it be better for them to have American weaponry going in there and making sure we get it in there before the Russians take over more territory in Ukraine?

KLOBUCHAR: Of course. And we have already sent $650 million of aid and weapons, the most since 2014, actually. You go back to the days of when President Obama was in. And then, we are sending more by executive order. The President is doing this.

And next week, you're going to see Congress looking immediately at more assistance, not just humanitarian assistance but military assistance. And I would add cyber security, because he hasn't used all the weapons in his arsenal yet. We've seen him do that. That is his playbook from way back when Senator McCain and Lindsey Graham and I were there on the front line back in 2016.

We heard the story of how in Estonia, in Estonia, they had moved a statue and Russia was mad about it and they shut down their entire Internet. They have been doing this for a long, long time and it has escalated, and so it's really important we help with cybersecurity as well. And we are doing that.

But I think the news of this day and yesterday and the day before is that the Ukrainian people are courageous. It is a big country, over 40 million people. And they are determined to resist.

ACOSTA: And I have to ask you this, because you've had some dealings with President Zelenskyy. You've travelled to Ukraine several times. Met with him. Met with his people. Has this surprised you, the way that he has been able to inspire people in that country? And, in many ways, inspire people around the world.

You have world capitals lighting up their landmarks in blue and yellow. You have protests happening in major cities around the globe. And in St. Petersburg, in Moscow for example. What do you -- how do you make -- what do you make of Volodymyr Zelenskyy's handling of all of this and how he's performed in all of this?

KLOBUCHAR: He came into politics as a maverick. He was a reformer from the beginning. And when you come in that way, it usually sticks with you and your personality. And he has been very forceful.

I was on the stage, right after him, in Munich at the security conference with leaders from a number of countries. And I looked at the crowd, and I said, I know he just made you feel uncomfortable. And a lot of people thought he should just stay in Ukraine. That's not his style.

He came here and he pushed the envelope on behalf of his people. You know, and there's a reason he -- his -- Ukrainians gave us cease flags, when our bipartisan group visited. And it is a big piece of what he's doing. He is motivating his country against all odds to stand up in whatever way they can. And people see that. They see the authenticity of leadership.

And we may not agree with everything he says. That's OK. The point is, he's rallying his people, and he's staying where he's supposed to be. And he is putting it forward, in a very forceful way, that Vladimir Putin is a thug, and he should go home and stay out of their country.

ACOSTA: Let me ask you about the Supreme Court and the president's selection of Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson for that open seat. You know, Republicans have made it pretty clear that many of them are going to oppose her nomination to the court.

And I'm just curious what you think. Are you going to be able to get any Republicans to vote for this confirmation, or are we going to see, perhaps, the vice president? We've never had a vice president before break a tie on a Supreme Court nominee, to my recollection. Do you think we'll have it in this case?

KLOBUCHAR: I believe we will get Republican support for Judge Jackson. They have voted for her in every single confirmation she's ever had. And we have --

ACOSTA: It doesn't mean they'll do it here. KLOBUCHAR: OK. But we have two very strong senators, in Senator

Collins and Senator Murkowski, who have issued statements that they look forward to meeting with her and voted for her before.

The other thing she's got going for her is her incredible experience. I -- it gets lost in the historic moment that we are in, in which 115 justices and chiefs, you know, the first black woman to be nominated to the court.

[16:40:00]

KLOBUCHAR: But the other thing that gets lost is her experience. She has more experience as a judge than four of the people who are currently serving on the court. She is only matched by Justice Sotomayor with having actual trial experience for the court.

The fact that her brother is a police officer, or her uncle was the chief of the Miami police. There are many things about her, to me, that kind of cross the traditional view of liberal versus conservative. And someone that I think that they are going to look at seriously.

And she also did very well in her past hearings. The fact that she clerked for Justice Breyer who's known as a pragmatic decision maker, who is well liked by justices appointed by both -- presidents of both parties. I think all of that is going to matter, as well as her personal story that she gets it. She's the kid of schoolteachers, near and dear to my heart because my mom was a schoolteacher her whole life.

So, I'm really looking forward to the confirmation hearing. I know she's going to be outstanding.

ACOSTA: She'll certainly bring a different life experience to the high court. It'll be fascinating to watch.

KLOBUCHAR: Exactly.

ACOSTA: Senator Klobuchar, thank you very much for your time.

KLOBUCHAR: Thank you, Jim.

ACOSTA: We appreciate it.

And coming up next, Putin the pariah, the Russian president, if you want to call him a president. I don't like to call him a president. The Russian leader more isolated than ever before. Will his own people see through this disinformation campaign that he's been peddling in recent days? CNN's Fareed Zakaria joins us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ACOSTA: Nearly 6,000 people have been detained across Russia for protesting the war in Ukraine. This was the scene in St. Petersburg, Russia, as police cracked down on a large crowd of protestors. What makes this is so incredible is that Russia's media watchdog has banned news outlets from using the words, attack, invasion or declaration of war. But Russians are not in the dark.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (translator): I want to tell the Ukrainian people that they are not alone. That people in Moscow are also scared of the war.

[16:45:00]

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (translator): I wanted to show that we are like them. That we are also afraid of the war.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (translator): We love this country. We've always lived here. We're proud to be Russian. But this step, it's a disgrace. Simply a disgrace to the world. To all those people who are now dying there.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (translator): Even now, I can't believe it. I woke up in the morning in horror. I realized it was real. It's impossible to believe, I think. It's painful.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ACOSTA: Joining me now is CNN's own Fareed Zakaria, Host of "FAREED ZAKARIA GPS." Fareed, great to see you, sir. It is -- what do you think -- what is going on with Vladimir Putin? I mean, is he doing all of this because he deeply fears his own people? That they will demand the same freedoms as Ukraine has and throw him out of power? I mean, you know, that is what used to happen to Soviet-era leaders, as you and I both know.

FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it's a great question, Jim, because it is, in some ways, a surprise, the way in which Putin has acted. He's always been a thug. He's always been brutal. He's always been a very strong Russian nationalist. But he's been cold, calculating. He's weighed the costs and benefits very clearly.

When he went into Georgia, he just took the two pieces of Georgia that were Russian-speaking. And when he went into Syria, he only used the air force and then withdrew. This feels more emotional. You know, there is some kind of dream that he is going to be the next czar who reunites all the Russian-speaking people, totally oblivious to the fact that the Ukrainians do not want to be reunited.

He's calling on Ukrainians to rise up and overthrow their oppressive regime. The regime is an elected democracy. So, there's something strange going on. Bob Gates, the former Secretary of Defense on my show this morning, said he felt that Putin had gone off the rails. And then, now, this call for a high alert, you know, combat readiness of nuclear forces which is really crazy, given that the west and the United States has repeatedly said we're not getting involved militarily.

So, you raise, you know, an interesting question. Is it that this is a kind of existential fear for him that a Ukraine that is open, thriving, free, becomes a kind of symbol of everything Russia is not. And maybe that is at the heart, what, you know, the nature of the threat that Ukraine poses to Russia.

ACOSTA: Yes, it seems like Ukrainians, they don't want to become Russians. But you have a lot of Russians who, I suppose, if you gave them the choice, might want to be more Ukrainian, in terms of their way of life. And the way they have freedoms in Ukraine that they don't have in Russia.

You know, the Ukraine delegation, Fareed, has agreed to meet with the Russians at the border with Belarus. Zelenskyy -- President Zelenskyy has said he does not expect much but says, let's try. Let's see what happens. What do you think?

ZAKARIA: I very much doubt it will amount to much. Putin has escalated so much. You know, he has -- the nature of the attack is so brutal, so all-encompassing. You know, you are basically trying to take over -- he's trying to take over the whole country. And he has characterized the Ukrainian government in such extreme terms, you know, calling them a bad bunch of drug dealers and Nazis. Virtually ironic, given that President Zelenskyy is Jewish.

But from that -- from that position, can you deescalate? Can you make concessions to drug dealers and Nazis? I don't -- and Putin's demands are so far reaching. And Putin's demands are so far reaching. A demilitarized, neutralized Ukraine new government, giving up Crimea, giving up the Donbas. Tough to see where the deal is.

ACOSTA: And I have to wonder, you know, getting to what you were saying a few moments ago, about the way that Putin has lied about the Ukrainians. And said that they're going in to root out the neo-Nazis and so on. And the way he has attacked Zelenskyy in this fashion.

You know, does he -- does Putin suffer from sort of a cold war mindset? In that he thinks that what he tells the Russian people is going to taken as gospel. In the -- in the ways that it might have been in the old Soviet Union. When they have -- they have the Internet. They have social media in Russia.

And in Ukraine, I suppose when the Russian soldiers cross the border and come in contact with the Ukrainians, they're going to find out they're not Nazis. It just -- something does not compute for me when it comes to how Putin has set this up, and how he's explained it to the Russian people.

ZAKARIA: Yes, Jim, you're raising a very interesting point, which is we're watching a war which is, at one level, very old fashioned. These are tanks moving in and, you know, the -- in some ways, the scenes look like World War II.

[16:50:02]

ZAKARIA: But there's something very different about it which is the information space. The information battlefield which Putin cannot control. Which is much more complicated. Which is much more open and porous. And, yes, he controls all of the media space in Russia, in the sense of T.V. and things like that. But does he really control, you know, the ability to get news out? I'm not sure. He has -- he's really tried to control it. He's shut down lots of Russian dissident voices. He's jailed people. He's murdered journalists. But you wonder, you know, is this news getting through to Russians? You get the sense it is, from the kind of protests you were -- you were showing.

ACOSTA: Right.

ZAKARIA: And, you know, in some ways, I don't have a good answer to your question. But I do wonder. It feels like -- Russia is a vast country. A lot of very educated people. Ten time zones. They surely must realize that the picture that they are hearing, that's seen on Russian T.V. and what they're hearing from Putin, is not the real information. And what does that then look like, when you start to have truths finally seeping through to the Russian people?

ACOSTA: Absolutely, yes. And when you see Vladimir Putin on T.V., he looks like he's appearing in a hostage video or something. Where Zelenskyy, he's a folk hero on the streets, you know, posting these messages on daily basis. It's been very fascinating to watch that adjusted (ph) position.

All right, Fareed Zakaria, we'll talk to you later about this. Thanks so much for your time. We appreciate it.

ZAKARIA: Always a pleasure.

ACOSTA: Coming up, it was one of the incredible stories of bravery we heard out of Ukraine. And now, with a major twist. Ukrainian soldiers who we thought had been killed after telling a Russian worship -- warship to go F itself, may still be alive after all.

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ACOSTA: The Ukrainian soldiers, who told Russian invaders to go F themselves, may still be alive. The troops defending Ukraine's Snake Island, as it's called in the Black Sea, instantly became the country's first heroes of the resistance, thanks to this stunning exchange with Russian forces.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (translated): I am Russian military ship. Propose to put down arms or you will be hit. Acknowledge.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (translated): F it as well. Just in case.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (translated): Russian warship, go F yourself.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: And who can forget that? The Ukrainian government initially believed all the soldiers were killed when Russia captured the tiny island. But now, Ukrainian officials have a strong belief that those troops were captured and transported to Crimea as prisoners of war. We'll keep close tabs on that and let you know the latest, as lot of people are interested in those soldiers. And we'll be right back.

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