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Russian Strike Hits School In Kharkiv; Pentagon Gives Update As Russia Expands Assault On Ukraine. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired March 02, 2022 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:04]

WILLIAM TAYLOR, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO UKRAINE: So, one thing that stood out is his reiteration, he said twice, that the assistance -- the military assistance is getting in to where it needs to be. And that tells me that ammunition is moving across the border from NATO into Ukraine. I think that's very important to hear.

The Ukrainian resistance is fierce. It's expensive and it's using its military very well. But it has to have resupply. It needs to have resupply. So, I was struck with his assurance, his confidence that that military assistance is getting in.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: That is the -- I mean, that pipeline is essential in the days, weeks moving forward since no one else is coming to Ukraine's aid with actual military forces.

TAYLOR: That's exactly right. So, Ukraine will continue to resist in any case, Anderson. This will be -- this will be ongoing. No matter what the outcome around Kyiv. And so far, the Ukrainians have blocked the Russians from getting into their capital.

And you have already talked about and talked to the Ukrainians who are determined -- as determined as anybody you've seen to fight and resist. They will continue to resist no matter what the outcome. And we will continue to support that government in its current state or if it moves, we'll continue that. And that, so that provision of assistance to wherever it is, is important.

COOPER: Nic Robertson, as you listen to Secretary Blinken, what stood out to you?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yeah, there were -- there are couple of things. That weapon supply was interesting. Defensive weapon, I think that was one thing that Secretary Blinken stressed.

And that question from the reporter about this fighter jets that were heard in the week, Bulgaria was expected to supply 16 MiG-29, 14 SU- 25, Poland, 28 MiG-29, Slovakia, 12 MiG-29s, Blinken leaving the door open that for conversations despite him speaking about defensive military equipment and these being potentially offensive, having that offensive capability that still potentially grew for discussion this week. But the other thing in the context of those talks that could not be

happening, and he said it wasn't clear if those second round of talks is going to happen between Ukrainian and Russia officials, and he stressed twice there that Russia needs to take, Russia needs to stop shooting, needs to stop bombing, needs to take its planes out the air because that can be the only context for diplomacy to go forward. I thought that was interesting because it creates a context there for Russia. Something the Ukrainians have been pushing for, and again, that if Ukraine sees something useful that it can pursue at this table diplomatically than the United States is willing to back it.

I think the assessment in Moscow at the moment, not from the government, but those who reasonably understand the government, Putin is not minding for a compromise but if there is to be one, it's going to involve a third party. Secretary Blinken didn't talk about a third party there.

So, that to me, that tells me, and the context of him saying that he's not sure if the talks will happen, this puts a bit of a cloud over those talks to me at the moment, Anderson.

COOPER: And, Natasha Bertrand, it's not just the United States supplying weaponry. The European Union has stepped up in the last several days. Germany reversed long standing policy in supply weapons. Sweden has said that they too will supply weapons as well. Secretary Blinken saying that weaponry is still going through.

NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: And that's exactly one of the reasons that he will be coming here to Brussels in a few days to meet with European counterparts and NATO allies to reinforce that idea that they're going to continue to send lethal assistance to Ukraine. What will that lethal assistance look like? How will it be coordinated to actually get into Ukraine because remember, the air space is very precarious right now, so they're kind of coordinating the way that they're actually going to deliver those weapons.

And, of course, the financial penalties, and the economic penalties that the U.S. is continuing to impose on Russia in response to this war. One of the things that really stood out to me during that press conference was he announced sweeping new sanctions on Russia's defense sector. He also said the U.S. is going to be expanding export restrictions on Belarus.

Of course, Belarus has played a key role in this Russian invasion, even perhaps troops in themselves.

So, two major things announced there.

[15:05:00]

I think one of the things that stood out the most is when he addressed the Russian people directly. This is a strategy and tactic we have seen repeatedly over the last several days, including from Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky who had been appealing directly to the Russian people to -- basically saying to them, how does this war help you? How does this war actually help you in your day-to-day lives? And appealing to the Russian people to kind of protest this decision to attack Ukraine and reiterating that America and the West are fully behind the people of Russia and also reiterating that the sanctions that are being imposed by the U.S. and by the West on the Kremlin, on oligarchs, on Russia's economic sector are not aimed at the Russian people.

Now, of course, it is inevitable that that is going to have -- those sanctions will have significant collateral damage. But here, he was expressing solidarity with the Russian people, saying the U.S. is not trying to punish them but trying to foment this dissent against the leadership and the decisions that the Kremlin has made over the last several weeks.

COOPER: Yeah.

Natasha Bertrand, William Taylor, Ambassador, and, Nic Robertson, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

Our correspondents, as you know, are deployed throughout Ukraine. Also in Russia and Poland.

CNN senior national security correspondent Alex Marquardt joins me now from near Kyiv.

We just learned Russian military strikes hit a school in northern Kharkiv and a major heating people was damaged in a missile strike on Kyiv. What more information is there on that?

ALEXANDER MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, Anderson, these are the two latest examples that Russians claim they are not hitting, targeting, going after civilian infrastructure, residences is just not true. Obviously, we don't necessarily know what their intention is, but we do know the results. We know that they are hitting those civilian buildings and that they are killing civilians. So, just in past few moments we heard about these two different instances in Ukraine's two biggest cities.

And here in the capital Kyiv, there was a gas pipeline near the central train station that was targeted, resulted in the large boom that was heard all across the city, it was heard by our colleagues who are in downtown Kyiv. This is one of the -- if not the closest strike to the center of the city. You know, we've been talking for days about how we're hearing explosions and distance, blast in the distance, in the outskirts.

As you know, earlier today, I was about three miles from the city center, an attack that happened yesterday against the TV tower. That was fairly central as far as the attacks go. This is right downtown next to the main train station. Of course, many Ukrainians have been trying to get out of the country, many people from Kyiv have been trying to get out of the country, many of them taking the train.

We don't know at this point what the obviously, we won't find out, what the intended target was. But make no mistake, this hit a civilian target in form of a gas pipeline. Now, over in Kharkiv, which is tucked right up against the border with Russia about 20 miles away, a school, school number 17 is its name, was also hit in a Russian military shelling.

According to witnesses, there was a -- there is a large hole in the wall. There's lots of debris, lots of destruction. This happened in the northern neighborhood of Kharkiv. That's a neighborhood where we have seen attacks by the Russians earlier on residential buildings, in the past few days.

So, Anderson, just today, again, we heard from the Kremlin, claiming that it is completely out of the question they would target civilian infrastructure, target civilians. But day by day, the civilian death toll is going up. We know from Ukraine's emergency services, they claim the civilian death toll is now more than 2,000. The United Nations has a much lower number, but they admit the toll could rise.

So, now, we are, tonight, we will be a week into this Russian invasion. It shows no sign of abating. In fact, Russia just trying to step up their efforts against those two major cities, and always in the case with these horrible wars, it is civilians who are suffering the most -- Anderson.

COOPER: Yeah, Alex Marquardt, I appreciate it, near Kyiv, thank you.

NATO's former deputy supreme allied commander for Europe told CNN he believes Vladimir Putin is humiliated by the slow advances of his troops. He also seized at least one strategic objective to what Putin is trying to accomplish. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICHARD SHIRREFF, FORMER NATO DEPUTY SUPREME ALLIED COMMANDER FOR EUROPE: It's quite clear, but Putin is pushing for a land corridor to Crime. I mean, that is an obvious objective. He's had Crimea under his -- in the Russian Federation since 2014.

[15:10:05]

He's only been able to supply it across the Kerch Strait Bridge. And so, of course, he's looking to establish that land corridor down on the coast of the Sea of Azov.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: CNN senior international correspondent Fred Pleitgen is near Belgorod, just across from Kharkiv, Ukraine.

What have you been seeing on the Russian side today?

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Anderson.

Well, certainly, believed to see an uptick in military activity. Of course, one of the interesting things about our vantage point that we have here, is that we sometimes see the things the Russians are bring towards the front lines, some of the weapons also that we're seeing deployed here on this side of the border that then sometimes plays out on the other side of the border. And certainly, what we saw today was a lot more Russian jets in the

air circling above the area and certainly also apparently flying towards Kharkiv and flying towards the battle front there, but also a lot of artillery and rocket artillery being fired. And that seemed to being fired a lot closer to Kharkiv than we have seen in the past couple days.

Now, of course, as Alex just mentioned, there were a lot of the buildings in civilian areas, civilian buildings that were hit throughout the course of the day. You have that school that was hit later today but then also the police station, the university being hit as well. Pretty heavy weapons also being employed in all of that.

And, you know, certainly seems to us as though on the board, the Russians seem to be stepping up their offensive not just around Kharkiv but of course have the former general there saying that attempted land corridor he believes Vladimir Putin is trying to create and that's something a lot of people have been talking about for an extended period of time. You know, if you look at Crimea, that's been a strategic location for Vladimir Putin, especially the port of Sebastopol for a very long time, and they had a lot of trouble time resupplying those that place for a very long time, as the general there said, just the Kerch Bridge which was a difficult bridge to build because the water is treacherous there in the Azov Strait.

So, that certainly could be a strategic objective. One of the things we've seen, Anderson, unfold is the Russian military when they started their advance from Crimea but also the Donbas republics, from Crimea, they sort of went eastwards then, then linked up with the armies of Donbas Republic and that certainly does appear to show that they seem they are trying to form that land corridor from Crimea from Russia and the Donbas republics to have that land corridor ready to resupply those areas, Anderson.

COOPER: There's heavy snowfall expected across eastern Ukraine in the coming days. How might that affect Russia's effort?

PLEITGEN: You know what, I'm really glad you mention that, because we have seen a lot of major snowfall throughout today. There was even major, more snowfall for tomorrow, been standing that through the course of the day at our vantage point for the final check point before the Kharkiv front line and I think it affects military operations a lot more than you think.

One of the things we have to keep in mind is the area here in this part of Russia is known for farm land to have rich earth but also earth you can seriously get stuck in if you're trying to advance militarily going off the roads. It's a very difficult place to operate in when the weather gets treacherous.

The other question is what about Russian jets operating if it's seriously overcast, heavy snow, which is forecast. What about rocket troops, how accurate are they going to be.

So it certainly could be well a concern and having stood on the ground here today in some of that snowfall coming down I can tell you it is very, very heavy and certainly something that could make a difference, whether or not it could hold the Russians up, definitely, you know, very hard to say from our vantage point here.

But one of the things we also have to point out, Anderson, if you look at Kharkiv specifically, Russians essentially thought they would take Kharkiv six days ago, first day of invasion, still haven't managed to do that, still being held by Ukrainian forces. So that whole offensive seems to be going a lot more difficult than the Russian military have thought and with this weather, certainly doesn't stand to get any easier for invading army to they take that city, Anderson.

COOPER: Yeah. Fred, appreciate it. The -- appreciate the reporting from Russia, along the Ukrainian border.

I want to go to the Pentagon now for update on Russian invasion of Ukraine.

Let's listen to John Kirby, the spokesman.

REPORTER: About the situation in Ukraine. You described the last few days, the status of this large Russian convoy north of Kyiv, I think you described as either bogged down or stalled. Can you explain, has it moved at all in the last day or so?

[15:15:01]

Have Ukrainian forces began attacking any part of it?

And as a second question, can you give a picture of what's going on in the south, or the Russian forces made the amphibious landing, are they extending that part of the campaign? Thank you very much.

JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY: Yes, sir. So on the convoy, what I would tell you is we still assess that that convoy, but more broadly speaking, the northern push by the Russians down south, towards Kyiv remains stalled. They haven't, from our best estimates have not made any appreciable progress geographically speaking in the last 24 to 36 hours. Again, nothing very significant.

It is difficult for us to know with great specificity all that is going into this stall if you will, but in general, we believe there's a couple of reasons for that. One, we believe the Russians are deliberately, actually, regrouping themselves and reassessing the progress that they have not made and how to make up the lost time. Two, we do believe they have experienced logistics and sustainment challenges, challenges that we don't believe they have fully, they fully anticipated. And three, they are getting resistance from the Ukrainians.

And we have some indications that nothing we can 100 percent independently verify, but we have some indications that the Ukrainians have, in fact, tried to slow down that convoy. And we have no reason to doubt those reports but we can't speak to it in great specificity.

In the south, the Russian forces appear to be experiencing, in general, less resistance than they are up in the north. That said, the town of Kherson, which we know they were moving on out of Crimea towards the north west, that is in our estimation, at least from what we can see, still a contested fight. I know the Russians claim they got the town of Kherson, we're not in a position to call it either way, it appears the Ukrainians are certainly fighting for that town.

Coming out of Crimea to the northeast, we knew they were advancing on Mariupol, major population center in the south. We believe that that advance is ongoing. We don't believe that they are in the city center and we have every indication Mariupol will be defended. So they're branching out to both the northeast and north west, but they are beginning now, our assessment is as they get closer to these two population centers down in the south, we believe they're facing more resistance.

Yes. Anybody here?

REPORTER: Have any other changes been made to U.S. nuclear forces to put them on higher alert readiness level? And secondly, while the convoy is stalled, there are some indications that maybe the window is closing here to be able to get aid into cities that may become under siege. What is the U.S. and NATO partners doing to maybe maximize the amount of aid to get in while there's still a window open.

KIRBY: So on the second question I would just tell you that security assistance continues to flow, not just from the United States but from many of our allies and partners and as recently as even just the last 24 hours. So we are making every effort to get as much security assistance as we can to Ukrainians as fast as we can.

And on the humanitarian side, again, we're going to continue to work with international organizations and NGOs to try to stem and assist in whatever way. That, not from a military perspective, I'm talking about from administration perspective. We estimate or have seen numbers coming out of the U.N. of, you know, more than 500,000 people now leaving the country as well as perhaps tens of thousands if not more internally displaced.

So, clearly, Putin is causing a humanitarian crisis as well.

Jen?

REPORTER: (INAUDIBLE)

KIRBY: Oh, I'm sorry.

So first I would say this delayed task is not affecting our strategic nuclear posture and deterrents. It's not canceled. We're just moving it to the right a little bit.

[15:20:03]

And I won't talk about the specifics of our deterrent posture except to repeat what I heard the secretary say many times that he's confident and comfortable that the strategic deterrent posture we have in place is up to the task of defending the homeland and our allies and our partners. Jen?

PENTAGON: John, what will the U.S. government do if President Putin's soldiers kill or harm President Zelensky, what will the consequences a be?

KIRBY: Look, you know, I'd rather thought get into individual hypothetical scenarios, Jen. Clearly, we know that Mr. Putin wants to topple this government and replace it with his own, and he's already caused the loss of life of innocents. He's already caused destruction of civilian infrastructure.

And all that blood on his hands and anymore blood that's shed is still going to be on Mr. Putin's hands, but I won't speculate about particular outcomes here with respect to individuals.

REPORTER: These videos that are circulating of Russian soldiers who are being held as POWs, can you --

KIRBY: We can't, I'm sorry, we've seen the same videos we have. We've seen no reason to doubt them but can't independently verify them.

REPORTER: We heard a lot about false flags leading up to the invasion, are you still seeing indication of false flags. One specifically that's sort of out there today is a local mayor in Luhansk allegedly kidnapped and killed. There's some speculation that this might be another attempted Russian false flag.

I know it's hard to talk about specific cases like that, but have you heard anything on that happen or also more false flags?

KIRBY: I haven't heard of that particular one. I'm happy to go, take a look and see if we have anything on that, but that's the first I have heard of this particular report. We did see false flags. I mean, you know, car bombings and that kind of thing before he launched his invasion, not to mention ridiculous, ludicrous claims in the state media about Ukraine being a threat to security and being shelled by Ukrainian forces in the joint operations area so we did see them run that play on false flags.

I'm not aware of such false flag operations going on now, not to say they couldn't or wouldn't do it, but he's already tried and failed to create a pretext to go in so just decided he's going to go in and he's done that now.

REPORTER: And the ICBM test, should we take as was it a sort of reciprocal action that you saw any indications that is maybe what Vladimir Putin is planning here, is anything like a missile launch or anything like that?

KIRBY: No. Obviously, we would -- as I said in in my opening state, would certainly like to see Moscow reciprocate by taking the temperature down on rhetoric about nuclear posture, certainly would like to see them deescalate by coming to a cease fire and deescalating and moving the forces home and getting out of Ukraine. But this decision was the secretary's decision and it was based on making sure that we were being very clear about our responsibilities in the nuclear realm. So, no, it was not tied to a specific action or inaction by Mr. Putin but rather a decision by the secretary to make it clear how responsible we are going to behave in the nuclear space.

Let me go around, Dave.

REPORTER: Russian forces have been described as risk-averse. How does that translate on the battlefield? What does that mean? You said the Russians are encountering less resistance in the south, is that the only reason for the fact in the south they seem to be making progress or something else about --

KIRBY: Yeah, so on the south, I mean you also have to remember, they started out on that, those two southern lakes, started out in Crimea so their lines of supply and sustainment are short, and they've been in Crimea since 14. So they had already built up a pretty sophisticated and healthy architecture to support their operations.

I would also add, David, a quick look at the map would show you they're not far from the base of operations in Crimea.

[15:25:01]

So we'll see how this goes. They're meeting resistance in Kherson and they're going to meet resistance in Mariupol.

So, I think we'll see how it plays out. I saw the comments about risk- averse. I would just say that, and you can see for yourself, I mean, this is not stuff that you guys aren't seeing in imagery of your own. I mean, we're seeing vehicles abandoned. We're seeing sustainment problems in fuel, not just fuel but in food. We're seeing indications here early on that though they have sophisticated combined arms capabilities, not beak necessarily fully integrated.

So they have made some missteps and they are working their way through that. I want to be clear as we've been before that we have to be, as we look at this, be pragmatic. The Ukrainians are fighting bravely and creatively. The Russians have a significant ability of combat power, applied in Ukraine and they still have significant combat power they have not engaged in the fight. And we just, we need to be mindful to that.

As I've said before, they will try to learn from these missteps and try to overcome these challenges.

Jim?

REPORTER: Is it just a matter of time before the Russians provide --

KIRBY: I'm not -- I don't think that's too soon to make that argument. They have been surprised by the stiff resistance they are facing by the Ukrainians, and I don't believe they fully factored that in. So I'm certainly not going to be one to call it one way or another here. The Ukrainians are fighting for their country and making a difference.

Jim?

REPORTER: First, I second everything you said about Bob Burns. And secondly, are you seeing the Russians bring in rivers from outside the areas that they had concentrated in before. Are you seeing them bring in more aircraft, more troops, perhaps, to apply to the struggle in, apply to the invasion in Ukraine.

KIRBY: No, Jim, we haven't. We haven't seen any indications that Mr. Putin is feels the need to bring in additional reinforcements from elsewhere in the country. He began to build up this combat power starting in the early fall, and what is at his disposal more than 150,000 troops, more than 120 battalion tactical groups and while we assess that the vast majority, the majority of that combat power is now in Ukraine, that doesn't mean that he doesn't have stuff that's not committed and doesn't mean what he has in Ukraine has been diminished. They have lost a sense of momentum here, but that doesn't mean they still don't have the power at their disposal.

The Ukrainians also retained a lot of combat power our assessment is and are fighting back bravely.

REPORTER: Thank you, John. On the nuclear issue own Ukraine, and nuclear issue in addition to the press announcement basically, to Russia, like said of the responsible behavior, in this nuclear realm. Is there any context now what the Russian counterparts on this nuclear issue to try to bring down attention, and Ukraine, Russian forces, whether they have basically met any of the objectives of this operation so far on the seventh, day, did they achieve anything they wanted to achieve based on the schedule they may have had?

KIRBY: On the nuclear question, I have no communication to speak to. I think the secretary's decision today speaks volumes.

On your second question, you have to forgive me for not having perfect knowledge of the Russian plan.