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Kyiv Sets 35-Hour Curfew as Capital City Faces Russian Shelling; Biden Pressured to Deliver Soviet Weapon Systems to Ukraine; U.S. Tells Allies That China Signals Willingness to Help Russia. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired March 15, 2022 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ERICA HILL, CNN NEWSROOM: Ongoing pause, but ongoing.

[10:00:01]

Communications remain open. Russia's assault though on the Ukrainian capital is only in increasing.

Our team there reporting here in two very loud explosions overnight.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN NEWSROOM: Russian forces struck at least several residential areas, this is one of them, at least four people killed in those strikes. The violence prompted officials in Kyiv to impose a rare 35-hour curfew extending throughout the day through the night into Wednesday. The mayor, Vitali Klitschko, remain defiant as he toured some of the damage today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR VITALI KLITSCHKO, KYIV, UKRAINE: We never think to leave. It's our home. We defend our children, families, our buildings, our city and our future, future of Ukraine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: The invasion has now trapped hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians in cities across the country where they themselves have increasingly become targets. The international organization for migration says that the number of people now fleeing the war tops 3 million. That's just in less than three weeks.

CNN is following all the developments here in Washington and across Europe. Let's begin with CNN International Correspondent Scott McLean. He is in Lviv, in Western Ukraine.

Scott, tell us about the damage in Kyiv, because we've been seeing more and more in recent days, are deliberate attacks on civilian targets in a city like Kyiv. What's the damage?

SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Exactly. And so, you know, yesterday, you had a senior U.S. defense official, Jim, saying that from their assessment, many of the ground forces that the Russians have in and around the city, have not been able to make a whole lot of progress, that their closest point, they're still about 12 or 10 miles out, excuse me. And so it seems like at this point, the Russians are resorting to lobbing artillery fire, lobbing explosives into the city and it is having some deadly consequences, and many of those are hitting residential areas.

So, just this morning, you've already had four residential buildings hit on the west, just a little bit north of the city and then south as well. In one case, it was a 16-storey apartment building that obviously burst into flames. You had flames running up many levels of that building. In another area of the city, which is just a stone throw, I should mention, from the actual city center, you had five stories of a 10-storey apartment building being burned out there, all told, we know from all the attacks, four people have killed, many injured, many about to be rescued as well.

So, it's not surprising at this stage of the game, Jim, that the local authorities in Kyiv have announced this curfew that will start beginning tonight. Obviously, there is normally a curfew in place from 8:00 A.M., but this one will extend all the through tomorrow to Thursday. The only way that you can leave is with permission for emergencies or, of course, to go to some kind of a bomb shelter, if you have that at your disposal.

All of this makes it so much more significant and so much more surprising, frankly, that you have prime ministers of the Czech Republic, of Poland and Slovenia, headed to Kyiv right now by train. The latest word that we have is that they left early this morning at 9:00 or before 9:00 to make that journey, so that's more than seven hours ago. We know that the train journey takes a long time, probably a good part of the day because the trains don't go any faster these days than, really, 50 miles per hour or so, or even slower than that, and they are going into a very dangerous area. So, we don't have any more details on exactly where they are or when they might arrive, when this meeting with the prime minister may take place.

I just wanted to read you something really quickly, and that's what the Polish prime minister wrote on his Facebook page earlier today. He said, at such breakthrough times for the world, it is our duty to be where history is forged because it is not about us but about the future of our children who deserve to live in a world free from tyranny. So, obviously, Jim, this group of delegates obviously believes that the risk is worth it.

HILL: Scott McLean, I appreciate it. Thank you.

I want to turn now to CNN's White House Reporter Natasha Bertrand who joins us from NATO headquarters in Brussels.

So, Natasha, I know you have been reporting on the growing pressure on the White House to supply Ukraine's military with specific Soviet-made weapons. Where does that stand at this hour?

NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: That's right, Erica. So, what we are learning is that the White House is coming under increasing pressure from lawmakers, from President Zelenskyy of Ukraine, of course, to provide Ukraine with MiG-29 fighter jets as well as S-300 surface-to-air missile systems, which could essentially help Ukraine regain control over its airspace. That airspace, of course, is still contested at this point.

And the problem though is that it would be very difficult, a lot of officials believe, to get those fighter jets into Ukraine. Of course, we saw the controversy last week with Poland, where they would need those fighter jets if they transfer them to Ukraine to be backfilled by the U.S.

[10:05:00]

And, of course, getting those missile systems into Ukraine would be difficult because the U.S. does not actually have those, the allies do. So, the question again arises of how do you backfill those countries to then allow them to send those missile systems into Ukraine?

But logistically, also, this is difficult because it is a war zone. And Russia has said that it is willing to target convoys that are bringing in military equipment from the west into Ukraine. And, you know, NATO now is trying to figure out the individual member countries, the best way to continue allowing that assistance to flow into this country.

I want to read you something a senior defense official said earlier this week. He said, we have not put out specifics on the inventory. There are certain systems we still have not acknowledged that they are getting. We don't give out numbers, we don't give out timing of the shipments, we don't provide context on the locations or the ground routes on which it's arriving because we want to keep that security assistance flowing as much and as fast as it can to assist them in the fight.

So, this is part of what we've been told by NATO officials as well is that NATO, as a bloc, is not actually providing that defensive assistance to Ukraine, right? It is actually the NATO members. And they have actually been told not to even discuss it amongst themselves what kind of weaponry they're sending and at what transit points.

NATO is really playing no coordinating role when it comes to providing weaponry to Ukraine. And this is all because of security, right, because the Russians have made that statement about potentially targeting those weapons convoys, they need this to be as disparate and as hidden as possible as they try to get those equipment in. Erica, Jim?

SCIUTTO: Well, it's operational security, right, and we have seen additional strikes in Western Ukraine, including in airfields there. It seems targeting those supply lines coming in.

Natasha Bertrand in Brussels, thanks very much.

U.S. officials are now publicly and privately warning China it will face consequences if Beijing assists Russia in its invasion of Ukraine. The U.S. has new information suggesting Chinese officials expressed some openness to providing the requested military and financial aid to the Kremlin.

HILL: CNN National Security Correspondent Kylie Atwood joining us now from the State Department with more here. So, Kylie, do we know specifics about what China could be supplying Russia with at this point?

KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, it could be a wide range of things, right? When you look at what Russia needs on the ground militarily, they do need more weaponry. So, it could have been weaponry. Jim has reported there was a request for drones as part of this request from Russia to China.

We also know from our colleagues that MREs, those are meals ready to eat, that military folks eat when they are out in the field, they can't get normal food, they have these lasting meals, that is something that Russia has requested from China, demonstrating just the fact that they don't even have the basic necessities that are needed for the Russian troops on the ground right now in Ukraine.

And then, of course, there is also the possibility of China providing Russia with economic support, for funneling their economic system, which has, of course, been pummeled because of these international sanctions.

Now, the White House said late last week that it seems that, up until this point, China has still been complying with the sanctions that have put into place. And we heard over the last few days that the United States believes that China has indicated that there is a willingness to provide Russia with support, but they have not said that China has actually provided any of that military or economic support to Russia yet. That is what they're watching for.

And, of course, this reporting comes on the heels of National Security Adviser Jake Sullivan citing concerns very clearly about China providing any support to Russia at this time when he met with Chinese officials yesterday and saying very clearly there would be implications for China, not just for the U.S./China relationship but also for China's relationship with countries around the world.

SCIUTTO: The question is, would the U.S. sanction China the way it has sanctioned, if it were to provide that support? Kylie Atwood at the State Department, thank you.

Joining us now to speak about all this, retired U.S. Army Brigadier General Kevin Ryan. He was former defense attache in Moscow, Senior Fellow now at the Harvard Belfer Center. Good to have you on, sir.

You, like other military analysts that we speak to on this program, not all of them, but some of them have said that there are signs that Russia's military is stretched out thin, struggling to achieve its goals, stalled to some degree. I wonder, is that reversible and could Chinese military assistance be the key, perhaps, to reversing that for the Russian army?

BRIG. GEN. KEVIN RYAN, U.S. ARMY (RET.): Well, I think requesting the materials and the assistance from China is an indication that, yes, they are in trouble, the Russian military in trouble, and it could prolong the war or prolong the Russian operation in Ukraine, if China were to give complete or a large amount of assistance.

You know, we would expect that if Russia is having trouble in this war in Ukraine, you would see large Russian units moving from elsewhere in Russia to the Ukrainian theatre.

[10:10:03]

This is what they did before the war to get themselves troops. So, where are these units now? Well, they're simply not available. Russia is out of available combat forces to put into this fight. So, they're turning to foreign fighters and Chechens and mercenary groups, like Bogni (ph).

SCIUTTO: Remarkable.

HILL: We've heard a lot about how Russia may have miscalculated here, right, certainly didn't plan on this fierce resistance that they're seeing in Ukraine. We're also seeing Ukraine's military cut them off in a number of different ways. And I just want to get -- I know you've had a chance to look at them. I wonder if you could talk us through what you're seeing in this video specifically.

So, we have this drone video, Ukrainian drones taking out Russian tanks hidden there in the streets. How significant is that and how much more do you think this may be happening?

RYAN: Well, this video is even more complex than drones finding vehicles and shooting them. This is a drone that is targeting, finding the target, finding the location. And then it's hard to tell with this video, but I counted at least 20 impacts or explosions. So, this is an artillery barrage coming from another location. So, you've got a surveillance drone telling an artillery unit where the targets are and they're working in tandem. So, this is a very complex and it shows a lot of training on the Ukrainian part.

SCIUTTO: General Ryan, you said you do not believe Putin will use chemical weapons because of the likely western response. We spoke to a member of the Ukrainian parliament last hour who expressed his concern that if Putin were, in effect, cornered, backed up against the wall facing defeat, that the calculus changes. I want to play his comments and get your reaction.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR OMELYAN, FORMER UKRAINIAN MINISTER OF INFRASTRUCTURE: We should always remind of Hitler. His last days in bunker where also (INAUDIBLE) Wunderwaffe, a miracle weapon to change the world and to destroy the world. I hope and I believe that Putin will not be able to push the red button during the last days in his bunker.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Now, he's not the only one to say that if cornered, Putin might consider those outlier options, and I wonder whether chemical weapons or even tactical nuclear weapons, battlefield nukes. Do you share that concern?

RYAN: Yes, I share that concern but I think maybe Hitler is an instructive example. Hitler didn't use them. He didn't even, up until the last moment, didn't use them. Putin and his government have said they would use weapons of mass destruction, nuclear and chemical -- well, not chemical but nuclear, but if the regime's survival is at stake, and I don't think we're there yet.

HILL: Before we let you go, former DNI James Clapper said, at some point, we're going to have a confrontation with Russia, that it is not a question of if, it is a question of when. Do you agree?

RYAN: I agree completely. You know, this is a war with NATO. Russia sees itself as at war with NATO and the battle in Ukraine is only a phase of that. So, the United States and NATO, I think, need to figure out when and how they're going to engage in this conflict with Russia. Apparently, we don't want to do it right now, but I think we should begin to have a presence in Ukraine.

SCIUTTO: Wow, that would be quite a development, indeed. Brigadier General Kevin Ryan, thanks so much for joining us.

RYAN: Thank you.

HILL: Just ahead, you will hear from a man in Kyiv who's joined the fight against the Russians. Why he's volunteering to defend his country, what he is seeing and what he thinks, comes next. Stay with us.

SCIUTTO: Plus, the difficulties of reporting the truth, the facts about the war in Russia. We're going to be joined by one person in Ukraine trying to organize journalists there also in the face of dangers.

And later, U.S. oil prices now dropped below $100 a barrel. It has not yet affected gas prices but it's notable given all that's going on in Ukraine and Russian threats. Will you and I get a break at the gas pump anytime soon?

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[10:15:00]

SCIUTTO: We have this sobering update this morning. The Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelenskyy, says that at least 97 children have been killed in Ukraine just since the start of Russia's invasion. That's less than less than three weeks ago. Russian forces are now bombarding civilian targets, including schools, hospitals, residential buildings. That's the scene of one of them there. That's a residential building.

The president's grim announcement comes as ordinary civilians are now taking up arms against Russia to protect children, their family, their homes.

CNN's Ivan Watson has more on how these volunteers are mobilized. IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is a village outside of the city of Vinnytsia, and were getting a sense during our visit here of how the local population has been mobilized by Russia's invasion of Ukraine. So, all of this has been erected in the last two weeks and it's all homemade, just kind of concrete blocks, spare tires, sandbags, you know, just kind of metal rebar that's been kind of welded together, netting here that locals have sowed here.

[10:20:07]

And we're going to spin around and you can get a sense of what the guys who are volunteering here, they have their Molotov cocktails at the ready, and this is entirely a voluntary effort. I've been speaking with some of the guards here. One of them is a fireman. One of them is a retired police officer. Another one is an electrician, all an example of how the local population has mobilized here.

A local official I talked to, he estimates that about 20 percent of the population of more than 12,000 people in these villages have gone into the Ukrainian army, have gone into the Ukrainian territorial defense. He estimates maybe 10 percent have fled, and the rest, he says, are very active in the volunteer effort, in the war effort. That means people who help out with humanitarian assistance that's being brought in from Europe and that is collected here and is then loaded into other trucks and shipped back out to frontline cities where people are in such tremendous need right now.

SCIUTTO: Ivan Watson there showing the swell of refugees still out of the country.

Joining me now to discuss the war on the ground is Illarion Pavliuk. He is a Ukrainian writer, documentary filmmaker, journalist, who's now turned soldier. He's joined the fight against Russia. Illarion, thank you so much for joining us this morning.

ILLARION PAVLIUK, UKRAINIAN WRITER, FILMMAKER AND JOURNALIST: Thank you. Thanks to United States for everything you're doing. Thank you.

SCIUTTO: You left your family, four children, to join this fight on the frontlines. Can you describe what you have seen so far? Have you been in combat?

PAVLIUK: All right. I haven't been in any combat yet. I spent like the week training some newcomers because I had some military training back in 2015 and I had some military experience. What do I see now, I'm in Kyiv. I used to live here for 20 years. I love this city and, of course, it is painful to see this city pierced (ph) defensive structures and block posts, checkpoint on every corner. And from other hand, Kyiv now is a citadel. I am absolutely sure Russians will never get here.

So, what do we see here? The scene here in Kyiv is pretty calm, air raid and some strikes. They struck with bombs last night. But otherwise, it's pretty much calm. SCIUTTO: You -- it's not the first time folks watching now should know that you've volunteered to serve. You were an intelligence officer after Russia invaded Crimea back in 2014. Folks may forget, this is the second Russian invasion of Ukraine. Did you ever expect to have to fight again for your country?

PAVLIUK: Well, yes, I'm not an officer, I'm just a soldier. Did I expect? Well, yes. Did I believe in my heart that I will experience it again? No. All the time, it was like an illusion that it is impossible in the 21st century in Europe, but it is possible and it is what is going on.

SCIUTTO: I kept saying the same thing while I was there. It's a war in Europe in the 21st century.

You were born in Ukraine but you spent ten years living in Russia as a child because your parents, they were persecuted as journalists. How do you make sense of how this campaign started, how Russia chose to invade Ukraine, a country with so many personal and family ties to this day? And you believe that Russians know what's really happening there?

PAVLIUK: Okay, the first thing, this war is just the continuation of what we had back in 20th century when Russia invaded Ukraine, when Russia made here artificial Stalin, killing millions of people, et cetera, et cetera. So, they're just doing it again.

Yes, I lived in Russia. And what I learned there, they do not consider us equal to them. They do not consider Ukrainians equal to Russians. They do not consider us even a nation. They do not think we have the right to have our own language. This is truth. This is my life experience. This is history of Ukrainian people.

Do their people understand? Yes, they do. Yes, they understand. They don't care. You can hear, there are a lot of records of phone conversations between soldiers and their moms, wives, and soldiers say that they've stolen some stuff from Ukrainian houses and they've been told by their mamas, okay, well done, that's good. Kill kozels (ph). They call us not Ukrainians, kozels (ph). Killed that kozel (ph). A lot of people saying like that, lots of people, millions of Russians saying I don't care.

My classmate, many of my classmates told me, I don't care because they are poor, I don't care. That is it. Whether they know, they do not want to know. And I don't know whether it is better or worse when you just don't want to know.

SCIUTTO: That's heartbreaking to hear. Before we go, Ukraine faces enormous odds against the full might of the Russian military. Do you believe Ukraine can defend itself effectively?

PAVLIUK: Absolutely. Absolutely. You can see what's going on and what is happening right now. Absolutely, we will. And not only because Ukrainians want to do it and have like passion to fight for their country, but because all the world helps us and the United States as well, many countries, we have everything we need to defend ourselves. And there are hundreds of thousands of people like me volunteering for the army right now.

So, we have no other choice. We are going to win this fight.

SCIUTTO: I've met some of those volunteers and also members of the Ukrainian military. Illarion Pavliuk, we wish you safety.

PAVLIUK: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: and we'll be right back.

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