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Russians Fire Missiles At City Of Lviv, Miles From NATO Territory; Hackers, State Department, Schwarzenegger Messages Aimed At Getting Truth About War To Average Russians. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired March 18, 2022 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:05]

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Europe is very important to China. I think the president wanted to get across the Europeans and United States are very aligned on this. And China should keep that in mind with whatever actions they take next -- guys.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Phil Mattingly for us at the White House -- thank you, Phil.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BLACKWELL: Top of the hour on CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Victor Blackwell.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Alisyn Camerota.

Russian missiles hit Lviv today. That's the western Ukrainian city that is just 43 miles from Poland.

Ukraine's forces said Russian war planes over the Black Sea fired six missiles toward Lviv. Four of them struck an aircraft repair plant. The city's mayor said work at that plant had already stopped.

Lviv has been a haven for refugees fleeing the Russian attacks. The region also serves as a crucial weapons supply route, so today Russian state media reported the Kremlin will consider any weapons shipments entering Ukraine as a, quote, legitimate target for Russia.

BLACKWELL: U.S. and several NATO countries have pledged hundreds of millions to support Ukraine. Villages and cities throughout Ukraine continue to be ravaged by Putin's war.

Look at this. There is a son in Kyiv surrounded by all the rubble just crying there for his mother.

The man beside his mother's body in the aftermath of a downed rocket that landed in a neighborhood yesterday.

Today, the city of Lviv setup 109 empty strollers to symbolize the 109 children killed in Ukraine so far in this war.

CAMEROTA: Anderson Cooper joins us once again from Lviv.

So, Anderson, two of those missiles we understand missed the plant there in Lviv. What happened to them?

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: Yeah, Ukraine's armed forces say some air defense systems were actually able to intercept two of what they believe were six probably cruise missiles that were fired that were meant for this area. Now, this is the first time Russia has hit a target inside Lviv city limits. As you know it has been a pretty safe city thus far.

There have been a couple of strikes in other spots in the west of Ukraine just in the last week. One of them was recently killing 35 people much closer to the Polish border. That was a training camp where some foreigners were training for the part of the fight here as well as possible training of other Ukrainian forces as well. Lviv is also the refuge for some 200,000 Ukrainians who have been fleeing attacks elsewhere in the nation.

So the city is very crowded. There are air-raid signs -- air raid signals that go off almost on a daily basis now the last couple of days. But for the most part, there have not actually been attacks and many times people ignore those air-raid sirens because there haven't been attacks. In some sense, there was reminder to people here that the war is getting closer, and of course, the situation here stands in stark contrast to the kind of bombings we've been seeing in the east in Kyiv, in Mariupol, where obviously some of the civilians have been killed. Ukraine's capital and largest city of Kyiv saw another ripped apart.

One person was killed there. CNN's Sam Kiley walked through the aftermath of that strike. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is the scene in the northern edge of Kyiv where a cruise missile landed here in the small hours of this morning. Now, officially according to authorities it was shot down. That would mean the warhead but clearly that is not the case. Beyond this truck here, beyond the JCB working, a kindergarten, mercifully no children in it because of the level of bombardment of Kyiv, because the kindergartens are closed. It's right opposite another school for older children.

But look at the ferocity of the burst. That is what remains of a vehicle right at the center -- the epicenter of this blast, absolute scene of devastation. If we look over this way you can see extraordinary level of devastation in this very densely populated residential area. These are homes, humble homes of ordinary Ukrainians struggling to get by, working with dignity hoping that one day to join the European community, possibly even NATO.

And this from Vladimir Putin's perspective is the result. If you walk over this way, you can see just how devastating the size of these weapons.

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It's quite extraordinary. This is the result of one single blast, a blast that has ripped through this community peppering cars with shrapnel holes. Every one of those would have torn through dozens of people, every one of those bits of flying hot metal designed to rip into human flesh like a razor, white hot and burning. And, of course, mercifully no children playing in the kindergarten.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COOPER: Sam Kiley joins us now live from Kyiv.

What more are you learning about the downed rocket and what has been going on throughout the day?

KILEY: Well, Anderson, I think the key is this rocket was down. We don't know what it's eventual target was, it may have been what should have been a precision weapon presumably fired at a more important strategic target than ordinary Ukrainians. Of course we have seen in Mariupol similar sized weapons used directly against civilians, at least not in the theater recently and prior to that in the hotel.

Now, the prospect of these continued attacks against civilians has galvanized the response from the Ukrainian armed forces and volunteers that support them to such an extent today that the deputy chief of staff for the Ukrainian armed forces put out a statement saying that a counter attack conducted by Ukraine is effectively in their view at least in their view for now save the city. Kyiv is in much less danger than it was a week ago.

They say they've pushed the Ukrainian, I'm sorry, the Russian forces back in the southwest and more importantly perhaps in the east in the district they've pushed them out. Ukrainians claim to an extent of 70 kilometers.

Now, if that's true that puts the Russian forces beyond artillery range. It would represent a very significant success from the Ukrainian perspective. And they also say they're putting in two lines of defense and preparing a third, which means, of course, they know that the efforts to try to take this capital or encircle it are certainly not over, Anderson.

COOPER: Yeah, Sam Kiley in Kyiv, thanks so much, Sam.

Victor and Alisyn, important to point out we can't independently verify those statements by Ukrainian forces about what they say are advances in pushing the Russians back. Obviously, you know, the situation is as we all know where movement is extremely difficult, and -- and try to talk to as many people in as many different places as you can. But it's very hard at some point to know what is going on in specific location at any one time.

CAMEROTA: Yeah. Absolutely, and that's why it's important for us to have you on the ground with what you're seeing. Anderson, thank you and we will check back.

BLACKWELL: Rescue workers are combing through what is left in that bombed out theater in southern Ukraine. Look at this. This is the town of Mariupol. Russia blew up this building earlier this week. It was clearly labeled as a shelter for children. President Zelenskyy has confirmed more than 130 survivors have been pulled from this wreckage, but there are fears many people have lost their lives who are still trapped inside.

Joining me now to discuss is Maksym Borodin. He is part of Mariupol city council. He is now in Western Ukraine.

Thank you so much for being with me.

First, let's start on the theater. Do you have anymore more information, know any information about those who have been injured, other people coming out of there, or the scene there at the theater?

MAKSYM BORODIN, MARIUPOL CITY COUNCIL DEPUTY: I don't know for now. As I know, a lot of people stay under ruins. And the problem is Russian terrorists don't let the people who have to destroy this ruins to help out other peoples. They don't let them do their work. They don't stop shelling, and in the center of the city, totally war. So it's hard to say how many people, how many children under this ruins.

BLACKWELL: You make a good point and one that President Zelenskyy also made today about these humanitarian corridors that are set up across the country. Mariupol for the another day is supposed to be one of those where people are allowed to leave, some humanitarian support to get in, but the president says that there has been continued shelling.

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Do you know if there's any passage out of Mariupol for people to get to some safer place?

BORODIN: Our government tried to make real green corridor so people can go out from the city and help can go into the city. With the humanitarian convoys can help to those who don't have cars and can't go out in the city.

But Russians, as I call them terrorists, because they hold hostage more than 300,000 people in Mariupol, they don't let the convoy in. They only -- they say they're ready to go only if the city totally surrender. So, there's no real green corridor. Some of the people on there on risk of life go out from the city, a lot of people do this, but some of them get shelled in the process of get out.

So there are no real green corridor. There are no humanitarian corridor, and Russians still destroy -- destroying totally Mariupol, and today they're bombing the factory. There are video and it's terrible. There are no prosperous Mariupol which I know about three weeks ago. They totally destroyed the city.

And a lot of people now in totally humanitarian crisis without water, without electricity, without food or without any medical help. We don't know how much people die even now and how much people stay in the city.

BLACKWELL: Yeah. We learned from officials that 80 percent of apartment buildings, the residential areas there are destroyed. As you point out 350,000 people are still hiding in that city in shelters, in basements. You make the point they can't get food, water, medical supplies in.

But we've also learned that Ukrainian forces are fighting back. They are trying to fight off these Russian forces. Is there any evidence of any progress by Ukrainian forces against the Russians?

BORODIN: It's a real problem because Russian terrorists do -- how you say -- go to Mariupol, move to Mariupol, a lot of troops, a lot of cannon fodder, most of them not professionals but people from so- called dikta (ph) who they take and hostages and they go to the war or they will kill you.

So there's lots of people who don't make war with Ukrainians, with Mariupol, but Russian terrorists made them do this. And today, it's a real problem to the great Mariupol because a lot, a very big quantity of Russian troops and a lot of armor, a lot of planes, and if Ukraine have additional planes which we need, MiG-29, can give us with the help of the USA. So it will be easy to clear Mariupol from these terrorists. But now, I don't know how it ends.

BLACKWELL: Hundred of thousands of people are living in that city. We were showing some of the video from Mariupol as you were speaking, and it says on the screen the center of hell as people described it.

Maksym Borodin, thank you so much for being with us.

BORODIN: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: So from the State Department to Arnold Schwarzenegger, the grassroots efforts to break through the information iron curtain and reach every day Russians with the truth of what's happening in Ukraine.

BLACKWELL: Plus, palaces, yachts, bank accounts. Ahead, how President Putin and his network of oligarchs share the wealth with each other.

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CAMEROTA: A full-scale effort is under way to deliver the truth about this war to Russian citizens. The messengers include Ukrainian hackers, the U.S. State Department, even Arnold Schwarzenegger.

BLACKWELL: CNN's Kylie Atwood is at the State Department.

Kylie, Russian censors have essentially created this digital iron curtain. Are any of these messages breaking through?

KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: It's hard to measure or characterize if these messages breaking through this censorship that Russia has setup, this disinformation that they have flooded the zone with in Russia. But it is interesting that we have collected a number of individuals

and groups that have really been trying to puncture that censorship that he has setup. And it's not just limited to one group or one individual, one platform or another. The U.S. government is involved in this. The State Department is really the tip of the spear on the public messaging.

And for example one thing they did a few days into in Ukraine war to setup a State Department account on Telegram. That is a popular Russian messaging platform. And on that platform, they're saying things like, this is Russia's war.

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They're being very clear that the Kremlin is putting out disinformation and saying that very explicitly.

But then you also have individuals who are getting involved in this. We saw a video this week from Arnold Schwarzenegger talking about his experience traveling to Russia, his affinity for the Russian people, as a child how he looked up to Russian bodybuilders. And what he said is he wants to tell the Russians the truth about what is happening in Ukraine, and he called it an illegal war. Just listen to some of what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER, FORMER CALIFORNIA GOVERNOR: This is not a war to defend Russia the Ukraine fathers and Ukraine grandfathers fought. This is an illegal war. Your lives, your limbs, your futures are being sacrificed by a senseless war condemned by the entire world. And for those in power in the Kremlin, let me just ask you, why would you sacrifice these young men for your own ambitions?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ATWOOD: And you also have hackers around the world in Ukraine and different countries that have essentially setup these independent efforts. So the Ukrainian IT army some are calling them, and one thing they're trying to do is hack into Russian news websites. Of course, those are state-backed media, so they're only telling the Kremlin's version of what is happening in Ukraine, and they are hacking those websites to try and provide some information about the number of Russian casualties happening in Ukraine as a product of this war, really trying to break through that iron curtain, but yet to be determined if this is enough and what more they can do -- guys.

CAMEROTA: It is fascinating to see this different front that this war can be fought on.

Kylie, thank you for that reporting.

Joining us now is CNN national security analyst Beth Sanner. She's the former deputy director of national intelligence. Also with us, retired U.S. Army Major Mike Lyons. Beth, it is very interesting as we said to see these different roots,

these different, you know, obviously unconventional paths. Do you think that a Twitter post from a movie star like Arnold Schwarzenegger with all his followers, can that break through the information curtain? Will regular Russians even have access to that?

BETH SANNER, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, definitely they will. And I think it's -- you know, I don't want to pooh-pooh any one particular thing. I think what he did was, you know, pretty (INAUDIBLE) in its production. But I also, what we learned during the Cold War as we used disinformation or really information in most cases the truth is what matters. There are a couple of things, a couple of lessons from that, one is that it has to be done by people who are kind of on the inside and trusted.

And so, you know, some of this has to be by Russians themselves. That's really going to stick a lot more, and it has to be sustained over time. You're not going to have one tweet or one Telegram message change peoples minds who honestly don't even believe their sons and daughters who are living in Ukraine today.

BLACKWELL: Major, the Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov says that Russian shipments coming into Ukraine are legitimate targets. Of course, the U.S. just announced $800 million in additional weapons and security assistance going to Ukraine. How do I answer this? Does that threat put U.S. troops in danger?

MAJ. MIKE LYONS, U.S. ARMY (RET.): I don't think so. We shouldn't be surprised by that threat. We should expect them to try to interdict those weapon supplies that are coming through, but the kind of weapons we're sending for individual soldiers should be able to trickle through that border there. That's the red line. The border is the red lean between Ukraine, Russia, Romania and the rest of NATO. And so, we've been successful at it, and we're getting those weapon systems to the hands of the front line soldiers, as the Russians have not learned anything tactically yet, and they've not changed their ways and Ukraine has shifted to fighting to what I think is a guerilla war.

And it's -- they're doing things guerilla tactic-like, fighting in small units, creating havoc with your regular formations, not using any big large formations anymore. So, the war has pivoted already and we'll continue I'm sure to leak these supplies in because they're not very big.

Now, they try to bring strategic weapons in, the MiGs and the S300. That's not going to work. They're going to become targets. But the small unit ammunition, that stuff will make its way through.

CAMEROTA: Today, there was this pivotal call between President Xi of China, President Biden. And I'm interested in the Chinese read out of this call, because this is the message they want to push out to the world. So I'll just read you a portion of it.

They say that -- President Xi said, as permanent members of the U.N. Security Council and the world's two largest economies, we must not lead the development of China-U.S. relations down the correct path, but also shoulder our international responsibilities and make efforts for world peace and tranquility. I mean, those are all the right things to say.

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But what do you take away from that message and this call?

SANNER: Well, there are a couple of things that come out. One is that China wants to be seen through that statement you just read, but they also did not condemn Russia.

And part of what was said, and in fact in the Chinese version of the read out of this call, it was even more clear that they are holding the United States responsible for a lot of, you know, the root, the root causes of this. Xi ended the call with a phrase that he likes to say, let he put the fell on the tigers neck take it off.

Putin is the tiger, and we are the people in Xi's mind who put the bell on the neck. And so, by saying that he's saying we're responsible. So I don't think Xi is going to drop this idea that Putin still is his major partnering crime when it comes to challenging the U.S. and the U.S.-led Western order. But he's just not going to do it in an overt way that makes China or Xi look like they're siding with this Russian aggression.

BLACKWELL: Fascinating.

Major, you mentioned in your last answer the trickle of these weapons across the border into Ukraine, which I think is interesting because we heard from President Zelenskyy today he doesn't want a trickle, he wants a flood. He said the weapons are coming in from the West, U.S. and others are coming in too slowly.

Now we understand his people are the ones who are dying, and he wants as much as he can as quickly as he can, but is that a legitimate criticism of what's coming from the U.S., that it's not coming in more quickly?

LYONS: I don't think so. I think it gets back to logistics and getting there as fast as possible. When you think about the fact the third week of February the Pentagon planners literally cleared their desks and got supplies there in six days and a tremendous amount of weapon systems. But we destroyed they travelled on main thoroughfares in order to get to where it needs to go.

So, it has to go this way. It has to go into different U.S. points and I'm sure that's what our military is doing, we're probably helping with those passages. The amount of irregular for example that come back to help, mercenaries that have come back to help, it's likely going through.

But it's kind of going through really one at a time. The flood will come. It'll show up where it needs to be, but if we serve it at a risk, if you try to put it into a main highway and roll it into Kyiv like it's not going to be attacked.

BLACKWELL: All right. Retired Major Mike Lyons and Beth Sanner, thank you.

On paper, Russian President Vladimir Putin makes a salary of $140,000 a year, but he's reportedly worth billions. More on his finances, ahead.

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