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Russia Claims It's Reducing Assault on Kyiv and Chernihiv; U.S., U.K. Skeptical Russia is Scaling Back War on Ukraine; Ukrainians Say They Don't Believe Mosco's Words; Survivor Recalls Deadly Attack on Mariupol Theater; Refugees From Ukraine Living in Limbo in Poland. Aired 4-4:30a ET

Aired March 30, 2022 - 04:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[04:00:00]

ISA SOARES, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and a very warm welcome to our viewers joining us in the United States and right around the world. I'm Isa Soares in London and we are following breaking news coverage of the war in Ukraine. And just ahead right here on CNN NEWSROOM.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN ANCHOR: Russia says that it has drastically pulled back its assault on Kyiv.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But these signals don't drowned out the explosions of Russian bombs.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There seems to be a wild artillery battle going on as we speak right now.

JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY: We think this is more of a repositioning, probably to use troops elsewhere in Ukraine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nothing has changed. The ultimate goal of Russia is to take over Ukraine. Putin wants to take as much as he can.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

SOARES: Thanks for your company, everyone. It is Wednesday, 30th of March 9 a.m. here in London, 11 a.m. in Ukraine. And we'll begin this hour with what U.S. intelligence officials say it appears to be a major strategy shift by Russia in Ukraine. Russian forces are pulling back in some areas in the north and that includes the capital, to focus on gains in the south as well as the east. But the latest figures from Kyiv tells a rather different story. A CNN crew reports major rocket, as well is artillery fire around Kyiv and intense fighting in the northern suburbs -- as you can hear there. Ukraine's president said he believes the Russians are scaling back military operations when he sees it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): The signals that we hear from the negotiating platform can be called positive but these signals don't drown out the explosions of Russian bombs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: Well, the U.S. and the U.K. are echoing that same skepticism. The British defense ministry reports some units have returned to Russia and Belarus to reorganize and resupply after suffering heavy losses in Ukraine. The Pentagon says a small number of Russian forces have moved away from Kyiv in the past day or so but Russians can still inflict massive brutality on the city.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We'll see. I don't read anything into it until I see what their actions are.

ANTONY BLINKEN, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: There is what Russia says and there is what Russia does. We're focused on the latter. And what Russia's doing is they continue brutalization of Ukraine.

JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY: We're not prepared to call this a retreat or even a withdrawal. We think that what they probably have in mind is a repositioning to prioritize elsewhere.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SOARES: Well, I have to warn you, the next video is graphic. It shows the absolute destruction in the key suburb of Irpin. And you can see dead bodies in cars and on the streets. It's too dangerous for residents to go out and collect their neighbors and loved ones and give them a proper burial.

Ukraine's military claims it pushed Russian forces out of the city in the past few days. But by the looks of this new video, there's not much left -- as you can see there -- of Irpin. And this map shows the places near Kyiv where Russian troops are operating mostly to the northwest -- as you can see there -- and the northeast of the city.

CNN's Fred Pleitgen spoke with residents and Ukrainian troops in Kyiv to find out what they make of Russia's promise to scale back assaults on the capital.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): Even after Russia announced it plans to withdraw most forces from around Kyiv, the fighting continues. Residents we spoke to told us they don't believe Moscow's words are for real.

On the one hand, they retreat and on the other they will transfer their efforts to other positions, Alexander (ph) says. So, it's difficult to talk about it withdrawal.

I do not believe in it. It's probably just a rotation says Yuri (ph). It's a regrouping of their troops.

Despite its forces being stalled near Kyiv for weeks, Russia claims it will withdraw because it has achieved its military objectives and now wants to make a positive gesture to Ukraine, Moscow's negotiating team said after talks in Istanbul.

A decision was made to radically, at times, reduce military activity in the Kyiv and Chernihiv directions, said Russia's deputy Defense Minister.

[04:05:00]

But the Russians also made clear this is not a ceasefire and the sounds of heavy battles still reverberate around the capital. But the territorial defense forces at this checkpoint say make no mistake. If the Russians really do withdraw, it's because they lost.

YURIY MATSARSKI, UKRAINIAN TERRITORIAL DEFENSE FORCES: From the first days of war, it was obvious that the Russians will be defeated on the battlefield, in the diplomatic field, in political field. It was out of aggressions.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): While many here hope the battle for Kyiv could end soon, the total both in blood and infrastructure is massive. And parliamentarian Roman Hryshchuk tells me he's not sure Ukrainians will ever be able to trust Russia again.

PLEITGEN: How long do you think it could take to make relations better again before there can be trust between Russia and Ukraine again?

ROMAN HRYSHCHUK, UKRAINIAN MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT: I don't believe --

PLEITGEN: Or trust towards the Russians, I would say.

HRYSHCHUK: I think it will be years and years, may be hundreds of years. And you know, every people in Ukraine lost all the house of relatives, of friends in this war. And our children, they have a night in shelters, they listen to these bombs, and it's for ages.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): While both Ukrainian and Russian negotiators say talks to end this war are progressing, few in the capital trust that peace could be coming soon.

Fred Pleitgen, CNN, Kyiv, Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SOARES: Let's get more on all the latest developments. Claire Sebastian is live here in London with me and international diplomatic editor Nic Robertson joins us from Brussels. But first I want to go to our Phil Black who joins us in Lviv, Ukraine. And Phil, there is big skepticism not just in Ukraine but also from its allies to Russian's pledge to reduce hostilities. Give us a sense of what the reality is on the ground if Kyiv as well as Chernihiv.

PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So, Isa, Ukrainian officials say is they are seeing some Russian units and equipment being moved north across the border into Belarus but there is not yet any noticeable reduction in Russian aggression across all battle fronts in Ukraine. But notably around the capital of Kyiv and around the northern city of Chernihiv. These are the two areas where Russia has said that it will reduce military activity as a gesture of goodwill in order to create an atmosphere so that peace talks can continue constructively.

The overwhelming analysis of that I think is that this alleged goodwill gesture is really cover for the fact that these are areas where Russian units were performing poorly. Where they effectively failed in their tasks of taking these cities quickly or in the case of Kyiv at least, encircling the capital.

The Ukrainian response is to assume that this withdrawal is really about resupplying and redeployment. The question is where. It is possibly it could be to the east where Russia has said that it's going to focus its efforts. But the Ukrainian government is not assuming that Russia has given up its ambitions on the capital just yet -- Isa.

Phil Black for us there in Lviv, Ukraine. Thanks very much, Phil.

Our Clare Sebastian is here with me now. And Clare, as you heard Phil Black there. They sold this yesterday at those Istanbul talks as a goodwill gesture. But you know, what's their strategy here? Is it a retreat? Is it a redeployment?

CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well certainly, if you listen to the Pentagon, they say that this is not a withdrawal. This is more likely a repositioning -- as Phil was pointing out. Ukraine says it means that the Russian enemies did not meet the goal of its offensive operations. So, the fear is that this is not so much strategy for Russia as it is necessity. That essentially, they are saying that this is a goodwill gesture, that we want to progress the talks. We want to support the talks.

But actually, they have to do this. They have to move these units out from around Kyiv and Chernihiv in order to resupply. And we heard this from the U.K. Ministry of Defense this morning, Isa.

Saying on Twitter: Russian units suffering heavy losses have been forced to return to Belarus to reorganize and resupply. Such activity, they say, is placing further pressure on Russia's already strained logistics and demonstrates the difficulties Russia is having in reorganizing is units in in forward areas with Ukraine.

And crucially they continue. That this can actually make this a more dangerous moment because they say Russia will likely continue to compensate for its reduced ground maneuver capability with mass artillery and missile strikes. And if you listen to our teams on the ground they are still here in bombardments around Kyiv.

SOARES: Indeed. And Nic, to you. I mean, it's clear from what Clare has just outlined, Nic, that there's a lack of trust here. There was a genuine feeling of optimism yesterday following those peace talks in Istanbul. At least both sides looking -- starting to make some sort of concessions. Are European leaders seeing signs of real seriousness by Russia?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: They're not. They're still waiting to see actions on the ground. There's a huge degree of skepticism about Russia, about what it says. It has its credibility rating, if you will, in the EU is about zero. But Russia has persistently lied about its intentions, about what it's going to do, about what it's not going to do. Its demands that it's putting on the table.

[04:10:03]

President Putin yesterday had a phone call with President Macron of France from the European Union had the most direct contact with President Putin. And the Kremlin's readout of that was that if President Macron who's trying to organize humanitarian corridors for about 170,000 people left in that pulverized city of Mariupol. The Kremlin's read of that is -- and explain to Macron -- tell the Ukrainian forces they're to put down their weapons, essentially surrender.

Russia from the very top is telling the European leadership that it will continue to prosecute the fight and not just in the Donbas region -- as we heard from the Ministry of Defense yesterday in Moscow -- but also in that southern corridor area of which Mariupol is an important part that would help if Russia secures it to link Russia with the Crimean Peninsula.

So, in terms of where the EU stands, it's keep the sanctions tight, fill the holes in the sanctions where Russia is getting work arounds. Not a lot of trust. Yes, optimism out of the talks yesterday. But that is always the way at peace negotiations. There is always a sense of optimism when you can see the lay of the land ahead and see the potential path to peace yet that there are so many pitfalls along the road on that path. And that's the reality of how peace talks go. And Russia is really not committed at the moment.

SOARES: Yes, and we don't know where they stand on Ukraine's proposals following from that meeting. Nic, do stay with us. Let me go back to Clare. And Clare, in the last hour or so, I was reading the German government is triggering an early warning level for gas supply. Why is that? I mean, do they believe that they're going to t be cut off here?

SEBASTIAN: Well, this comes from the German economy ministry. This is an early warning. So, it's sort of a first stage of the warning mechanism. It means that they're going to convenient a gas crisis team. They're going to be monitoring the situation on the gas network closely. And it's been triggered by Russia's demand over the past week or so that gas should be paid for in rubles. They are sticking with that demand that Germany and the rest of the G7 are saying no to that.

Now Germany is saying right now gas supplies for its consumers and businesses are guaranteed. There's not a lack of gas in the network. But they are saying to people -- and this is particularly interesting -- that they should start to reduce their use of gas. And we know for Germany -- which relies on Russia for about half of its gas supplies -- that any reduction in Russian gas would be serious problem. SOARES: Indeed, not just for Germany but indeed for the whole of

Europe. And just before we go, have a look at how the European stock markets are doing, especially the Xetra DAX in Germany that are down almost 2 percent there, but red arrows right across the board. Yesterday was a very different picture following from that meeting in Istanbul, those peace talks. Will keep an eye on the markets for you Clare Sebastian, as well as Nic Robertson, thank you to you both.

Now we are getting a better look at the destruction caused by Russian attacks in the city of Mariupol. These are some of the first images we're getting from the center of the city. Not released through Russian state media. The satellite images show what used to be a neighborhood with houses and two separate apartment complexes. The homes -- as you can see there -- are completely destroyed and you can see the residential streets filled with debris. And these images show the exact same spot where the center of the city before and after the Russian siege. Dozens of homes -- you can see there -- completely ravaged by explosions.

While a survivor of the Mariupol theater terror attack speaks to CNN about her families terrifying experience. About 300 people were killed when Russia bombed the theater earlier this month, according to Ukrainian officials. The theater was being used as a civilian shelter in the besieged city housing up to 1,300 people. Here CNN's Ivan Watson with one woman's heartbreaking story of survival.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This was the Mariupol drama theatre before Vladimir Putin invaded Ukraine, a cultural and architectural symbol of the city. And when the Russian military laid its deadly siege of Mariupol, the theatre became a safe haven.

MARIA KUTNYAKOVA, FAMILY SURVIVED MARIUPOL THEATER BOMBING: Six people like with a cat, we go on the street and Russian then started to shooting us and we're running. It was craziness and then we go to the theatre. And you know what, in the theatre was a lot of people, they was like, be OK, we have a food, they give us a tea. And they said, like, you should find a place where you could -- like a bed.

WATSON (voice-over): This woman and her family recently escaped from Mariupol.

KUTNYAKOVA: My name is Maria Kutnyakova, I'm from Mariupol. I'm Maria from Mariupol.

WATSON (voice-over): On the morning of March 16, Maria, her mother, sister and cat joined hundreds of other civilians sheltering in the theatre.

[04:15:00]

Footage from March 10 shows families huddled there in the dark, feeling protected perhaps by the signs, "deti," children in Russian that volunteers posted outside the building. Shortly after arriving, Maria, went to check whether an uncle who lived nearby was still alive.

KUTNYAKOVA: Now, I hear in there noise of the plane, like bombs plane. We know how it's, you know, how this noise because it is bombed every day.

WATSON (voice-over): She returned to the theatre to find it destroyed.

KUTNYAKOVA: So, I understand that my family in this theater. And everyone screaming the names, you know, like mama, papa Lucia, Sasha (ph). And I started calling like, mom, Gala (ph).

WATSON (voice-over): Footage of the immediate aftermath shows dazed civilians covered in dust, while the roof over the main auditorium had completely collapsed.

KUTNYAKOVA: When the theatre was bombed, my sister was standing with a window and the window was like blow up, and she's fallen down. And my mom was in another part of the theatre and wall fallen to her.

WATSON (voice-over): Maria's mother and sister were wounded but survived.

WATSON: Your sister, is she doing all right?

KUTNYAKOVA: No.

WATSON: Really.

KUTNYAKOVA: She's like concussive.

WATSON: She's got a concussion.

KUTNYAKOVA: She's -- yes, yes, yes.

WATSON (voice-over): Shortly after the initial strike on the theatre, Maria says what was left of the building came under a fresh artillery attack.

KUTNYAKOVA: Everyone starts screaming that theatre is on fire. So, we should run. And we run in, but Russians bombed it. So, we run in from the theatre and bombs was like this, this, this.

WATSON (voice-over): It eventually took nine days for Maria and her family to get through Russian checkpoints and reach relative safety in Ukrainian controlled territory.

WATSON: You seem very positive and upbeat right now.

KUTNYAKOVA: I understand that I'm very lucky. I'm very -- I understand like thousands and hundreds people still in Mariupol and they bombed. They have no food, no water. They have no medicine, nothing. And I understand that I'm very lucky. Like I have my arms, I have my legs. What I need anymore, nothing.

WATSON: And your family.

KUTNYAKOVA: Yes, and my family. My cat is safe, so all right.

WATSON: This is little Musca (ph). She's a two-year-old cat and she survived the bombing of the Mariupol theatre with her family. And they're now headed to Western Ukraine in this bus.

WATSON (voice-over): But no one knows how many people may have died under the rubble. Russia has denied that its forces bombed the theatre and Russian state TV recently showed what was left of it after Russian troops moved into this part of the city.

Judging by the damage, the Russian reporter claims, it was bombed from the inside. He alleges there is information that Ukrainian nationalists organized a terrorist attack here. A claim that people inside the theatre strongly reject.

WATSON: Are you angry right now?

KUTNYAKOVA: No, I want that Russian just go away. This is Ukrainian territory. I don't understand why they come in and tell me that it's not my land. They're not fighting with the army, they're fighting with every citizen, you know? They bombed hospitals, they bomb city gardens, they bombed the houses of peaceful people. They not fighting with the armies.

WATSON (voice-over): Maria and her family rushed to a waiting van. The driver will take them for free to Western Ukraine where Maria hopes her sister can safely recover from her injuries.

Ivan Watson, CNN, Zaporizhia, Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SOARES: Well, the Ukrainians who fled the country are talking about the lives they left behind and what they lost and it's a lot. We'll hear some of their stories just ahead.

[04:20:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SOARES: The latest round of talks between Russia and Ukraine are over. But in adviser to Ukraine's president says negotiators will keep discussing a humanitarian cease-fire. Because safe corridors are desperately needed in many parts of the country. In the last few minutes, in fact, a Ukrainian official has announced that three humanitarian corridors will operate today. One of those being in Mariupol -- the besieged city of Mariupol.

Well, the U.N. says Russia's invasion has forced more than 10 million people in Ukraine from their homes. An estimated 6.5 million are displaced and nearly 4 million others have fled the country. Well on Tuesday, Ukrainian President accused Russia of wanting to ensure that nothing remains in Ukraine but, quote, ruins and refugees. Most of those leaving the country are crossing into Poland where they're waiting -- as you can see there -- in long lines and really living in limbo. Some are looking for work, others are heading to other parts of Europe grieving the life, of course, they've left behind. Our Kyung Lah has their story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KYUNG LAH, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): They fled from Russian missiles, now wait for Polish papers, but all they want is to be in Ukraine.

We have been waiting for four hours, yells this woman out of frustration. I have a special needs child. But every refugee here, almost all of them women and mothers, has needs. The more than 2 million Ukrainian refugees in Poland will have to show document if they want a Polish national identification number for official services.

YULIA ISAYEVA, UKRAINIAN REFUGEE: You can work.

LAH: You want to work?

ISAYEVA: Yes.

LAH (voice-over): Yulia Isayeva and her two children waited since 3:00 in the morning. Six hours later, they got that national number so she can work.

I wish I could continue my old life, says Isayeva. There, she had a job, family. Her husband now fights in the war. It was taken away, she says, of her life. I have to live here by force.

While she's grateful to build a safe life in Poland for her children, I want to go to Ukraine, she says.

[04:25:00]

You hear the story repeated again and again from the women pulled from their lives, stuck in a purgatory of passing time while a war rages at home.

IRINIA YASINOVSKA, UKRAINIAN REFUGEE: And live here.

LAH: This is where you live?

YASINOVSKA: Yes.

LAH (voice-over): This cot is Irinia Yasinovska's life now.

YASINOVSKA: I work in Ukraine. I'm a police.

LAH: You're a police officer?

YASINOVSKA: Yes.

LAH (voice-over): She was. She now grabs a neon vest instead. She's a volunteer at a Warsaw refugee center, where she herself arrived in early March fleeing bombing in Kyiv. Most refugees leave here in days for temporary housing or other countries, but it's been a month and she refuses to, unless it's to go home to her life in Kyiv where her brothers are on the frontlines.

LAH: Do you think you'll see them again?

YASINOVSKA: Yeah.

LAH: Yes, she says, they talk twice a week at most.

I think everything will be fine, she says. At least I hope for it. Not just my brothers, but everyone.

But life outside the war doesn't stop, even though Yulia Isayeva wishes it would. If I have to, she says, I'll do it. We'll start.

LAH: The extraordinary thing in talking to these refugees here in Warsaw, is that they believe this life in Poland is temporary. They are seeing the same news. They are seeing the same images. They're having to explain this to their children, yet they all tell us they believe that they are going to be able to return to Ukraine and pick up life where it stopped.

Kyung Lah, CNN, Warsaw, Poland.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SOARES: If you would like to safely and securely help people in Ukraine who may be in need of shelter, as well as food and water, please go to CNN.com/impact. There you will find several ways that you can donate and you can help.

And still to come right here on the show, more on the top story. Russia promises of a pullback around Kyiv are punctuated with artillery fire around Ukrainian capital, as well as skepticism from around the world. So, where do the peace talks go from here? Will dig deeper on that angle just ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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