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Horrific Scenes Emerge as Russian Troops Leave Kyiv Suburb; Horrific Discovery of Mass Grave Site in Bucha, Ukraine; World Leaders Condemn Bucha Killings; U.K. Warns Russia Refocusing Offensive into Donbas Region; Father Signs to Newborn Son Inside a War Zone; Family of Missing Journalist Say She's Being Held by Russia. Aired 4-4:30a ET

Aired April 04, 2022 - 04:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[04:00:00]

MAX FOSTER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and a warm welcome to our viewers joining us in the United States and around the world. I'm Max Foster in London. We're following breaking news coverage out of Russia's war on Ukraine just ahead.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is a brutality against civilians. Attacks will continue.

We can't become numb to this. We can't normalize this.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now is the time to double down on the pressure.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Indeed, this is genocide.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We can conclude that Russia is worse than ISIS.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

FOSTER: It is Monday, April the 4th, 11:00 a.m. in Ukraine. We're following breaking news out of the southern Ukrainian city of Odessa. In the last few hours officials will confirmed an overnight air-strike in the city. We're still waiting to hear about any casualties there.

To the east in the besieged city of Mariupol, the Ukrainian officials say a humanitarian corridor will be working today. Efforts to evacuate citizens have been hampered as fighting continues around the hard-hit port city.

It comes as Ukrainian officials continue searching for bodies in Bucha and other towns near Kyiv. Russian forces have retreated from that region, but Ukraine says danger from land mines have slowed search efforts. Meanwhile, new images reveal the extent of the horrors visited upon Bucha.

A warning this video is very disturbing. It is very hard to watch. A CNN crew capturing these images of a mass grave at a church in Bucha. The mayor says up to 300 people, many of them civilians, could be buried there. These satellite images taken just last week show a long trench dug into the ground at the church where the mass grave was found.

Russia has denied targeting civilians in Ukraine claiming the images coming out of Bucha are fake. But world leaders are buying it. Many are not demanding an investigations into potential war crimes. It is not clear. Just on Sunday Ukraine's president echoed their calls.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): The world has already seen many war crimes at different times on different continents. But it is time to do everything possible to make the war crimes of the Russian military the last manifestation of such evil on earth.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Stories of brutality by Russian troops have been emerging across Ukraine. On Sunday the regional military governor of Kharkiv said there were 23 casualties including children after Russian forces fired on part of the city. A human rights watch says it is documented allegations of war crimes in areas around Kyiv, Kharkiv, and Chernihiv. Our Fred Pleitgen traveled to Bucha to see firsthand the atrocities carried out during, what the Kremlin calls, it's special military operation and warning his reporting includes disturbing and graphic images.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): As Russian forces retreat from the area north of Kyiv, in their wake, scenes of utter destruction. Whole blocks of houses flattened, Ukrainian authorities saying that they believe dead bodies are still lying underneath. But here, the dead also lay in the open. Ukrainian National Police showed us this mass grave in Bucha, saying they believe up to 150 civilians might be buried here but no one knows the exact number. People killed while the Russian army occupied this town.

This is what it looks like when the hope is crushed. Vladimir has been searching for his younger brother, Dmitri, now he's convinced Dmitri lies here even though he can't be 100 percent sure. The neighbor accompanying him with strong words for the Russians.

"Why do you hate us so much," she asks, "since the 1930s, you've been abusing Ukraine, you just want to destroy us, you want us gone, but we will be, everything will be OK. I believe it."

Video from Bucha shows bodies in the streets after Russian forces left the area. Some images even show bodies with hands tied behind their backs. The Russian Defense Ministry denies killing civilians and claims images of dead civilians are, quote, "fake." But we met a family just returning to their house in Borodianka, which they say was occupied by Russian soldiers. They show us the body of a dead man, in civilian clothes, they had found in the backyard.

[04:05:00]

His hands and feet tied with severe bruises and a shell casing still laying nearby.

Russia's military appears to have suffered heavy losses before being driven out of the area around Kyiv. This column of armored vehicles in Bucha completely destroyed.

PLEITGEN: The way the Ukrainians tell us is that the Russians were trying to go towards Kyiv and they were then intercepted by Ukrainian drones, artillery and also the Javelin anti-tank weapons. It's not clear how many Russians were killed here but they say many were and others fled the scene.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): A national police officer says the Russian troops were simply too arrogant.

"They thought they could drive on the streets and just go through," he says. "That they would be greeted as though it's all right. Maybe they think it is normal to drive around looting, to destroy buildings and to mock people, but our people didn't allow it."

And now it appears all the Russians have withdrawn from here. Ukraine says it is now in full control of the entire region around Kyiv but it is only now that the full extent of the civilian suffering is truly coming to light.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Fred Pleitgen in Bucha, Ukraine. As Fred just reported, Russia denies killing civilians in Bucha and claims the images of bodies on the streets of the town are fake. Moscow also says it's been assisting in delivering humanitarian aid to civilians in the Kyiv region. CNN hasn't confirmed this is happening, but what is clear, Russia isn't done fighting.

The British Defense Ministry warns, quote, Russian forces are continuing to consolidate and reorganize as they refocus their offensive into the Donbas region. We've also learned that Russian forces are withdrawing with their equipment from the Sumy region. According to the reasons governor, that lies 30 miles or some 48 kilometers from the border with Russia. It was one of the first areas attacked in Russia's invasion.

I want to bring in CNN's Nada Bashir. She's looking at the international reaction here. Because whilst the Russians are saying these pictures are fake, other world leaders are clearly not buying that.

NADA BASHIR, CNN REPORTER: Yes, absolutely. And there has been a huge outpouring of outrage from pan leaders, from NATO allies over the weekend over these images we're seeing coming out of Bucha. NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg saying that we haven't seen this level of brutality in Europe for decades. We heard from Prime Minister Boris Johnson here in the U.K. describing those image as actions as despicable.

And the message we're hearing from European leaders, is really that those economic sanctions that we've seen placed on Russia needs to be reinforced. They need to be strengthened and Russia needs to be held account for these actions. We've heard from French President Emmanuel Macron saying he wants to see a total block on all oil and coal exports to European Union this morning saying, he wants to see a total block on all oil and coal exports to European Union countries this week.

We also heard from the European Council saying, they want to see those sanctions strengthened this week, too. So, we will see further action on that front over the coming days. But the other message that we've been hearing from European leaders, from NATO allies is that they want to see an investigation into these allegations of war crimes. Now, president Zelenskyy has called on the International Criminal Court to carry out an investigation.

We've heard from German Chancellor Olaf Scholz and other European leaders saying that they will be able to facilitate and offer their support in carrying out the investigation. They want to see independent investigators brought into Ukraine to really take a look at the evidence and the continued message we've heard from Zelenskyy is that Russia is carrying out war crimes in Ukraine, and he had said this amounts to genocide against the Ukrainians.

FOSTER: And the important thing is to get those investigators in, not just journalists, but investigators who gather legal evidence that can be used later on, get them in as soon as possible to try to document things. And Boris Johnson in his statement actually naming Putin as someone who's committed war crimes. So, I mean, how does this process play out? How do we hold them accountable?

BASHIR: Absolutely, that will be a key task for not only those independent investigators but for the European Union nations, NATO allies who have pledged their support to Ukraine to facilitate that investigation to gather that evidence as to who is responsible for these crimes are. Those Russian leaders have been highlighted as key perpetrators of these war crimes. Not just the Russian forces, but those who have given the orders. That was the message from Zelenskyy, too. He said that all those who've given orders to Russian troops to carry out these horrific attacks that we've seen that many journalists have seen, independent bodies have been in Ukraine. They need to be held to account for their actions. We've heard Russia be accused of war crimes before in cases like in Syria. But that would certainly be a key focus over the coming weeks.

FOSTER: OK, Nada, Thank you.

Meanwhile, Western leaders are advising skepticism and caution about Russia's shift away from the Kyiv region. CNN's Dana Bash spoke with the NATO Secretary-General on Sunday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JENS STOLTENBERG, NATO SECRETARY-GENERAL: What we see is not a real withdrawal, but we see that Russia is repositioning its troops.

[04:10:00]

And they are taking some of them back to rearm them, to reinforce them, to resupply them. But we should not, in a way, be too optimistic, because the attacks will continue.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

Let's get some analysis from Maj. Gen. Mick Ryan, formally of the Australian Army. He's a former commander of the Australian Defense College. And he's the author of "War Transformed, The Future of 21st Century Great Power Competition and Conflict." Thank you for joining us.

MAJ. GEN. MICK RYAN, AUSTRALIAN ARMY (RET.): Thank you.

FOSTER: What do you make of what we're calling a retreat from Kyiv? It, you know, shows that the Ukrainian defenses have been very effective, but what does that mean in terms of Russian strategy?

RYAN: Well, it means Russian strategy has failed. Right from the start they claimed on Kyiv and a capture the Ukrainian to force accommodations on the Zelenskyy government. They've totally failed in this endeavor. Ukrainian army has fought them to a standstill and forced them to retreat back over the border. It's unlikely we're going to see many Russians seeking to advance on Kyiv again. Notwithstanding their operations in other parts of the country.

FOSTER: That's the question, isn't it? Are they going back to Russia or are they acting as reinforcements to the south and the central part of the country where they appear to be focusing their efforts right now?

RYAN: I think it's likely that many of them will take some time to refit and to reinforce before they send to other bits of the country. Ukrainians have handled the Russians in the north a tremendous beating. One of those units are no longer combat effective. So, whilst some of them will move to reinforce units in the east. It will take them sometime to physically move, but probably much more time to reinforce and to reequip those units.

FOSTER: What do you make of the channel that they appear to be reinforcing down there, to the east, down to the south, what are they trying to achieve there?

RYAN: Well, I think it's just a continuation of the war that the Russians have waged in eastern Ukraine since 2014. The original statement from Putin and others has talked about a liberation of Donbas, and they will seek to get something out of this war that they can sell as a victory. They have not done that yet, and they will continue to throw troops at this problem in the east to try and get something that approaches a success for them, but they are a long way from that.

FOSTER: Could this be a temporary shift? Could they, you know, regroup and then go for Kyiv again?

RYAN: Well, it's always possible, but they're going to have to fight for that ground all over again. That doesn't make a lot of military sense, and the Ukrainians are even better set up to defend that ground now. It's most likely that they will continue to reinforce efforts in the east and try and get something they can call a success in that part of the country. But that will take them sometime. This won't be over in days or weeks.

FOSTER: Most shocking part from over the weekend's news is these images we've been getting out of the regions around Kyiv, in the areas where the Russians are retreating. And would you say from what we've seen there that there is very clear evidence of war crimes? And how do we investigate that?

RYAN: I think it's very clear evidence of criminal behavior by military commanders who have established a lawless and unethical culture in the Russian army. This goes all the way to the top. And to be frank, in an army that has for weeks indiscriminately targeted civilians in cities, we shouldn't be surprised that Russian soldiers feel comfortable then descending even further to the murder of innocent civilians.

FOSTER: This is a, you know, familiar technique, isn't it, by Russian forces in conflicts gone by.

RYAN: Unfortunately, that is very true. This is a playbook they used in Chechnya. In a playbook they've in Syria. In the Russian army coming into this war had based a lot of its transformation activities on what it learned in Syria. Unfortunately, a lot of the lessons learned in Syria were these very ones about the deliberate and systematic terrorization of civilians. These are not individuals going rogue. This is a systemic approach to terrorize the Ukrainian people right from the top of the Russian army.

FOSTER: This is about attacking civilians, you would argue, where you basically punish them for resisting.

RYAN: That's right. You're punishing them for resisting, but you're also punishing them in the hope that the Zelenskyy government will seek some kind of political accommodation. But it's actually had the reverse effect on the Ukrainians. It's made them fight harder because they know this is an existential fight for them.

[04:15:00]

FOSTER: In your experience, is this a very crucial stage in the process of really getting justice, so getting those investigators into those areas when, you know, the Russians have just left to try to get the best evidence against them at any future trials?

RYAN: Absolutely. The collection of evidence is probably already starting. I doubt the Ukrainians are ceasing that kind of activity there. Getting in there, collecting evidence. They will want to ensure -- just as we should in the West -- that that people responsible for these crimes and the commanders responsible all the way to the top of the Russian army are held to account, even if it takes months, years, or decades.

FOSTER: OK, Mick Ryan appreciate your perspective today. Thank you for joining us.

Coming up, Russia's continued strikes in Ukraine. They're complicating the humanitarian crisis there and making it more difficult to get civilians to safety. More details coming up.

And why the family of a journalist missing in Ukraine is holding Moscow responsible for her abduction. We'll have their story just ahead.

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[04:20:00]

FOSTER: As Russia continues to pound parts of Ukraine with devastating strikes, getting civilians to safety has become far more difficult. But according to a Ukrainian official, nearly 2,700 people were evacuated through humanitarian corridors on Sunday. Still the hostilities aren't likely to ease up any time soon. The latest report from the British Ministry of Defense confirms that Mariupol is still a hot bed for fighting, but also air-strikes.

That complicates the ongoing refugee crisis. Although numbers have slowed considerably, displaced Ukrainians continue to flee the country. More than 4.1 million refugees have fled since the fighting began.

Just outside of Kyiv, the suburb of Irpin is finally free of Russian troops, but the city lies in ruins. Too dangerous for civilians to return. One man there made it out, but just before Russian strikes destroyed his apartment building. Since then, he's been recording videos of life inside a war zone all whilst taking care of his infant son.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALEX DAYRABEKOV, FATHER, SINGING TO HIS BABY SON: Oh, yesterday was such an easy game to play I need a place to hide away ...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: His son was born just two weeks before the war started. And earlier he spoke to CNN's Jim Acosta about raising a son in a war zone.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAYRABEKOV: I will tell him that he started his life in the time, in the historic time when the entire country got together against this evil, against this devil, because this is, this is not even a war. It's a massacre. It's genocide. That they came to erase our nation and everyone is fighting, everyone is fighting in this country for our country, for our land, and for human values and for freedom. And I'm sure that what is happening now will change the entire history of the country, of Europe, and of the world.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Alex said he started singing to his first son 25 years ago during a time of peace.

Russian forces deny allegation that's they detained scores of civilians since the war began, but the family of a missing Ukrainian journalist isn't buying that denial. They are waiting in agony to hear from her again and know that she is safe. CNN's Ivan Watson has their story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Masha plays by the banks of the Dnieper River under the watchful eye of her grandmother. In a few days, she'll be turning four but her mother may not be there to celebrate. Iryna Dubchenko is missing. Taken captive, her family says, by the Russian military.

ALEXANDRA DUBCHENKO, SISTER OF MISSING JOURNALIST: This is my sister.

WATSON (voice-over): The family last heard from Edina on March 26th, when she called from her home in the Russian occupied village of Arazivka (ph), saying Russian soldiers had searched her house.

DUBCHENKO (through translation): She was very frightened. She told us that the Russian soldiers that we know everything about you and you should be shot on the spot for what you did.

WATSON (voice-over): The next day, neighbors say the Russians returned and detained Iryna who works as a freelance journalist. They haven't heard from her since.

DUBCHENKO (through translation): They don't know where she is right now. We have no information about her.

WATSON (voice-over): The alleged Russian abduction of Iryna Dubchenko fits a broader pattern. Ukraine's Commissioner for Human Rights accuses Russian forces of detaining at least 55 civilians since invading Ukraine on February 24th. A Kremlin spokesman has told CNN he's not aware of cases of disappearances but adds that they should be examined carefully.

At least 11 detained civilians are elected mayors like Ivan Fedorov. A security camera caught Russian troops kidnapping Fedorov on March 11 in the Russian occupied town of Melitopol. He says he was later released in a prisoner exchange for nine captive Russian soldiers.

"I would happily offer myself in a prisoner exchange for her freedom," Iryna's mother Larissa says. "Just let her go. She has a child."

Larissa and her husband tried to rescue Iryna from her Russian occupied village on March 7th.

WATSON: This is your mother's car. WATSON (voice-over): But they were forced to turn back after gunfire shattered their car window.

WATSON: Larissa is showing me a bullet and casing from around that she says hit her car on March 7th when she tried to reach the village that her daughter lives in. She says Russian soldiers opened fire on her vehicle.

WATSON (voice-over): At some point in the first weeks of the war, Iryna took in a wounded Ukrainian soldier.

[04:25:00]

DUBCHENKO (through translation): Iryna told me on the phone that this military guy was at her home that she was treating him changing his bandages.

WATSON (voice-over): When Russian troops search Iryna's house on March 26th. Alexandra says they detained the wounded Ukrainian.

DUBCHENKO (through translation): He was wounded in the arm and the leg. They handcuffed him and took him out right away.

WATSON (voice-over): On March 28th, after Iryna's alleged abduction, her mother made it safely to the occupied village. She says the Russian officer told her that Iryna had been taken to the Russian backed separatist city of Donetsk to be tried in court for sheltering the wounded Ukrainian soldier. But that's not a crime, according to international laws of war.

CORDULA DROEGE, CHIEF LEGAL OFFICER, INTERNATIONAL COMMITTEE OF THE RED CROSS: The first Geneva Convention is a convention that protects wounded and sick soldiers in the field.

WATSON: If a civilian treats a wounded combatant, according to the Geneva Convention, is that allowed?

DROEGE: That is not only allowed, it is also protected. Article 18 of the first Geneva Convention is crystal clear about it and says that no one may be molested or convicted for treating wounded.

WATSON (voice-over): CNN reached out to Russia's Ministry of Defense regarding the alleged detention of Iryna Dubchenko, the ministry never replied. Iryna's family now wait in terrifying limbo.

DUBCHENKO (through translation): Masha often asks, where is mama? Every day, I say, she's coming soon. She's coming tomorrow. She'll be here in an hour or two.

WATSON (voice-over): The truth is no one here knows when Masha will see her mother again.

Ivan Watson, CNN, Zaporizhzhia, Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE) FOSTER: World leaders are shocked and outraged by the horrifying images from Bucha in Ukraine. Strong reaction from the U.S. Secretary of State coming up for you next.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAYRABEKOV: Oh, yesterday was such an easy game to play I need a place to hide away oh, I ...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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