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UNGA Suspends Russian From Human Rights Council; Major Fighting In Eastern Ukraine As Russia Intensifies Attacks; Senate Confirms Supreme Court Nominee Ketanji Brown Jackson; New York Attorney General Asks Court To Hold Donald Trump In Civil Contempt. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired April 07, 2022 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

RYAN NOBLES, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: They've been handed over thousands of documents from the Trump White House including those call records which we broke the story about there being huge call log gaps during that period of time.

[15:00:09]

And now, just today, Victor and Alisyn, on a separate note, we're learning the committee is still interested on some level in actually talking to Donald Trump himself. This comes after the former president gave an interview to "The Washington Post" yesterday where he said that it is possible that he would talk to the committee but it would depend on what the request was. Well, I talked to Chairman Bennie Thompson about it today. He said the committee is going to discuss whether or not they bring Trump before them.

The key, though, Victor and Alisyn, they said if they do it, it will be a voluntary request. They don't have plans right now to issue a subpoena to Donald Trump -- Victor and Alisyn.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Ryan nobles on Capitol Hill, thank you, Ryan.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BLACKWELL: It is the top of the hour here on CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Victor Blackwell.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: And I'm Alisyn Camerota.

The United Nations just suspended Russia from the U.N. Human Rights Council for, quote, gross and systemic violations of human rights against Russia. The ejection is the first of its kind in more than a decade. It's in response to the Russian military's wanton mass killing in Bucha, Ukraine.

But as the world further isolates Russia, Vladimir Putin's military continues to wage war, especially in the east fighting on the ground is escalating in the battle for the Donetsk and Luhansk regions. America's top general, Mark Milley, said today Ukrainians are in for a, quote, long slog ahead, adding that all of Ukraine remains a combat zone.

Ukraine's foreign minister says the scale of Russia's operation will remind people of World War II.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DMYTRO KULEBA, UKRAINIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: The battle for Donbas will remind you of Second World War with large operations, maneuvers, involvement of thousands of tanks, armored vehicles, planes, artillery. This will not be local operation based on what we see in Russia's preparation to it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: New images show the devastation the Russians left behind in Borodianka. That's a suburb of Kyiv.

And like Bucha, bodies are scattered there on the streets. Dead civilians show signs of torture and the actual killing of one couple in Kyiv. Now, this video we're about to show you disturbing. There's drone footage and it shows the husband getting out of the car, you see there hands up and two seconds later, he's killed. The man's wife was also killed.

Their 6-year-old son was in the car when this happened. We're told the Russians took the boy and a family friend but later released them.

Let's go now to CNN's Ed Lavandera in the southern port city of Odessa.

New satellite images show the trenches the Russians dug in exclusion zone around Chernobyl. What do we know about this and the troops' exposure to radiation?

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: This is really a stunning development. This is an area around the Chernobyl nuclear power plant known as the red forest, an area so toxic that even people who work at the Chernobyl power plant aren't even allowed to go into this area, and the Ukrainian officials now say that they have drone footage of Russian soldiers that have dug trenches that very dirt and the likelihood of the soldiers and the heavy armor that was going through that area is very likely to have been highly contaminated with this radioactive waste.

So, the repercussions of this are incredibly significant for those soldiers that were in that area. We don't have any details as to, you know, if there's been any kind of exposure or effects of the exposure, I should say. That isn't quite clear yet. But given everything the Ukrainians are saying right now, the likelihood of that is very serious and very likely.

CAMEROTA: Ed, tell us what's happening in Bucha. Of course we've all seen the hideous images of the aftermath there, but I understand there's a curfew today. Who is still in Bucha? Why is there a curfew today?

LAVANDERA: Well, a couple of officials are saying there's two reasons for the curfew. The first one is they are concerned about looting in the area. Apparently, that has been a significant problem so is one of the reasons it's happening.

To add to the misery everyone is working with now there's a high level of concern for land mines in that area, in that region. In fact, officials were saying today about 1,500 land mines were discovered just yesterday. So this is a very dangerous situation that people there who are part of the recovery process, part of documenting the possible war crimes are having to deal with.

[15:05:08]

And that is why they are urging people, they want people to stay away from this because there are efforts to basically demine the area. That's going to take some time. It is a dangerous situation for people, especially civilians, trying to walk around in that region.

CAMEROTA: Oh my gosh. Thank you, Ed Lavandera, for explaining all that and for reporting.

Let's bring in now, CNN's Jake Tapper. He joins us from the western city of Lviv.

Jake, officials in the U.S. and Ukraine, you heard, are predicting that the fighting in eastern Ukraine will be a long slog, it will be brutal, and a large number of evacuation corridors are open to try to get civilians away from the fighting.

As I'm sure you saw, CNN's Ivan Watson rode on one of the evacuation trains traveling to the east to Lviv where you are. But you told us, you know, how many refugees are already there.

Can the city absorb all of these people?

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: I think that it can. I think there's really no choice. The people of Ukraine are really rising to the moment.

We've been to any number of businesses and educational establishments and other places that are taking in refugee -- I guess they're not refugees, but taking in displaced persons, internally displaced persons. Some of them are on their way to becoming refugees by leaving the country.

Others are planning on just staying in Ukraine in this somewhat safer part of the country for the time being until they can go home. I do think that they will be able to absorb them, but, you know, they will continue to need the help of the West, the generosity of NGOs and various charities.

We visited this refugee -- I'm sorry, internally displaced person area today at a local university and, you know, they need food, they need toys, they need clothing, they need everything.

We met a woman and her daughter who left their homes in Kyiv and had a choice of either taking their dogs or taking a bag, and they opted for the dogs. That does, of course, mean they don't have any clothing or supplies. So yes is the short answer but with help is the longer one.

BLACKWELL: Yeah, just having to choose whatever they can carry makes difficult choices there.

Let me ask you about the talks that are continuing between Russia and Ukraine. Russia's foreign minister, Sergey Lavrov, says that Ukraine is changing its demands. What is he saying?

TAPPER: First of all, let me just give a little predicate to who Sergey Lavrov is. He's the foreign minister and he's a liar. He's been talking, he said before the invasion, that Ukraine was not going to be invaded. After the horrific scenes in Bucha were revealed to the world, he referred to that as hysteria and said it was just the West trying to sabotage talks.

Today, what he's objecting to is the idea that Zelenskyy and the Ukrainians have put forward the idea they want to talk about the status of Crimea which the Russians seized in 2014, and they want to be able to have military drills and exercises with other countries without having to get Russia's permission, and Russia objects to that as well.

I mean, all of this is kind of kabuki theater in the sense if the Russians want to end the war, they can stop slaughtering innocent civilians here and they can withdraw their troops. I mean, they invaded a sovereign country. That is technically what Mr. Lavrov is objecting to.

CAMEROTA: So, Jake, there was this regional leader in Luhansk. That's in eastern Ukraine who said all the hospitals in that city have been destroyed. We know you visited a hospital with patients who have had to travel for treatment. So tell us what you saw.

TAPPER: It's just devastating and we'll be bringing this piece to our viewers in the 5:00 Eastern hour today on "THE LEAD". People don't have hospitals in much of the country because as the Russians did in Syria, they are targeting hospitals here in Ukraine. They are bombing hospitals and medical centers.

So we went to a hospital in the western part of Ukraine where people have been brought from all over the country, and we met a number of the civilian victims of Putin's war, individuals who are decidedly civilians, decidedly posed no threat, who have -- you're seeing right now shrapnel in the hand of an anesthesiologist we met who is, I believe, from the Luhansk region.

We met a couple women, one of the women that we met who has been in a hospital bed for about a month. She may never walk again. She was a victim of a bombing, a Russian bombing on her apartment.

And another thing to think about is the degree -- that's her wound right there you see.

[15:10:02]

Another thing to think about the degree to which that a war is not just about the victims killed or injured by bullets or missiles, it's also the conditions that a war creates, in other words disease and starvation and panic and chaos. And we met another woman who was in a horrible car accident trying to flee her part of the country. And we'll bring that to you in the 5:00 hour.

"THE LEAD," of course, starts at 4:00.

BLACKWELL: All right. Looking forward to it. Jake Tapper -- again, Jake will have more reporting from Ukraine on "THE LEAD WITH JAKE TAPPER" next hour, 4:00 p.m. Eastern on CNN.

Former U.S. ambassador to Ukraine, William Taylor, joins us. He's also the vice president for Russia and Europe at the U.S. Institute of Peace.

Mr. Ambassador, welcome back. I want to start here with what we're learning about the Russian reaction to this U.N. Human Rights Council vote.

Russia circulated some threats, suggesting there would be consequences. A note shared with CNN, I'm going to read it, just one sentence. It's worth mentioning that not only support for such an initiative but also an equidistant position in the vote, abstention or nonparticipation, will be considered as an unfriendly gesture, handing out threats. And we know that in India where Foreign Minister Lavrov was just a few days ago with Modi abstained from the vote.

What do you think about what we're reading from Russia's reaction?

WILLIAM TAYLOR, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO UKRAINE: So, Victor, whatever the Russians say, let's be clear about unfriendly acts. The Russian invasion of Ukraine, which is the reason they're being kicked out of these organizations at the U.N., that's their act. You know, voting for Russians to be kicked out makes so much sense. It's crazy to have a nation that is perpetrating the human rights violations that it is perpetrating in Ukraine, the atrocities, the war crimes, in Ukraine to have that nation in the human rights council, makes no sense. So, it's perfectly reasonable. It makes all kinds of sense to vote them out.

CAMEROTA: Well, Mr. Ambassador, on that point the Ukrainian foreign minister said today they continue to negotiate with Russia to, quote, prevent more Buchas. But Russia doesn't even acknowledge Bucha. It doesn't even tell the truth that their troops are behind the killing of civilians. I mean, they're lying. They're claiming that Bucha staged this themselves.

How do you even negotiate with that mindset?

TAYLOR: Alisyn, that's the right question and it's a tribute to the Ukrainians that they are continuing to have these conversations with that kind of people that deny it, but the negotiations that the Ukrainians are engaged in are serious. The negotiations on the other side that the Russians, not serious.

As we heard about Lavrov's comments today about these changes in the Ukrainian position, the Ukrainians are trying to find a way to stop this war, in the first instance a ceasefire, in the second a withdrawal of Russian troops, but that's only going to be serious, Alisyn, those negotiations are only going to be serious if President Putin, not the negotiators having the conversation with Ukrainians, but only if President Putin realizes that he's not going to succeed on the battlefield.

He's probably figured out that he's not going to succeed in taking Kyiv. He's now moving -- he's giving up on trying to take Kyiv, and he's moving around to the east as we know. When he concludes that he's not going to win on the battlefield, his soldiers are not doing well and the Ukrainian military is doing very well, then he'll be ready to sit down, he will then go to the negotiating table. At that point, the Ukrainian proposals will be relevant.

CAMEROTA: Ambassador William Taylor, thank you very much for your expertise and sharing it.

So there was this historic moment on Capitol Hill. It was just moments ago. Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson was confirmed by the Senate to serve on the Supreme Court. She will be the first Black woman to ever sit on that bench.

BLACKWELL: And New York's attorney general took a formal step to hold former President Donald Trump in contempt of court. We have details on that ahead.

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[1518:46]

BLACKWELL: History was made today on Capitol Hill. Ketanji Brown Jackson became the first Black woman confirmed to the U.S. Supreme Court.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: On this vote, the ayes are 53, the nays are 47, and this nomination is confirmed.

(CHEERS)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: You hear the cheers from Democrats. Judge Jackson will soon replace retiring Justice Stephen Breyer.

Now, she says that her journey to this moment began by seeing her father, a man raised in the Jim Crow South, study his own law books.

With us now, Democratic Senator Alex Padilla of California who serves on the Senate Judiciary Committee.

Senator, thank you for being with me. We just got some sound in from Vice President Harris who presided over today's vote, and I want to you hear what she said about this moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: I think it makes a very important statement about who we aspire to be, who we are, who we believe ourselves to be. It's a statement about on our highest court in the land, we want to make sure there's going to be full representation and the finest and brightest and the best, and that's what happened today. I'm very proud.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Your predecessor in that seat.

[15:20:01]

This is your first vote for Supreme Court nominee. What did you feel today?

SEN. ALEX PADILLA (D-CA): Oh, Victor, good to be with you today.

Today is a day of celebration, tremendous news not just for, now Justice Jackson, but for America and for our history. Just as we say in elections that our democracy works best when as many American voices and perspectives are included and represented. So it is in the judiciary branch of our government including the highest court in the land and now that Justice Jackson will be there, we are closer to having that more perfect nation and because of not just the tremendous qualifications and credentials but the much-needed perspective and life experience that she adds.

BLACKWELL: What did you make of the proceedings today, the vote held open for Senator Paul who rushed in in casual clothes to cast a vote, Senator Graham wasn't wearing a tie, reportedly, so had to vote from the cloakroom. While Democrats were cheering, Republicans silently filing out quickly.

What did you make of that?

PADILLA: Yeah, as Senator Booker, I and other members of the Judiciary Committee, said at the end of the confirmation hearings a couple weeks ago, we're not going to let anyone steal our joy because this is a moment that should be celebrated. The nomination of now Justice Jackson was historic.

The confirmation hearings -- look, I'm glad most members of the committee, all the Democrats for sure and even some Republicans, came to the committee with appropriate, thoughtful questions about judicial philosophy and the law, et cetera. Sadly, Republican members of the committee came in with baseless attacks seeking to undermine a more than qualified nominee and the antics we saw today from Senators Paul, Graham, I think were disrespectful to the process, disrespectful to Justice Jackson, and disrespectful to the American people. But that notwithstanding, we're not going to let anyone steal our joy.

I will also add this, Victor --

BLACKWELL: Sure. PADILLA: -- as this confirmation is done, people are naturally looking ahead. We don't know when the next vacancy on the Supreme Court is going to be or what the next confirmation process will look like. But to me, it's a reminder of the stakes of these midterm elections. When Senator Graham says someone like Justice Jackson would never have gotten a hearing in judiciary committee or will not if Republicans resume the majority, that's telling, right?

The role of the Judiciary Committee is to deem the qualifications, the credentials of a presidential nominee, not to be biased to a political perspective. It's Senator Graham and Republicans that are further politicizing the process of Supreme Court nominations and confirmations, and the voters will have a say into whether or not to allow that this fall.

BLACKWELL: We heard something similar from Mitch McConnell saying that he won't talk about the strategy if Republicans get control of the Senate and there's a nominee from the White House in '23 or '24.

Let me ask you about another topic here. This is Title 42, this is the public health order that the White House determined will be lifted in about seven weeks used to, thus far, keep 1.7 million migrants out of the U.S. who are seeking asylum from the southern border mostly. There are at least half a dozen Democrats who believe that the president -- or trying to block the president's lifting of that order until at least the public health emergency is lifted or there is a plan to stop the expected surge of migration across the border.

Why not wait until that point?

PADILLA: A couple things, Victor. Number one, let's all remember what Title 42 is. Title 42 is not immigration policy. And I think we all are reminded of that. It is long pastime to modernize our nation's immigration laws.

Title 42 is a public health order because of the COVID-19 pandemic and we see what's going on across the country. Restrictions are coming down, vaccines are up, case counts are declining. We're losing our masks.

So, if the COVID justifications for Title 42 under Trump are no longer there, then I think what the president is seeking to do is a power play, and that being said, what we do want to insist on is a safe, orderly and humane process when it comes to immigration laws and immigration processing.

It is not illegal. It is absolutely lawful for someone fleeing persecution, fleeing violence, fleeing natural disasters to come to the United States seeking asylum. We need to have a process in place to consider those requests.

And so, those are the questions that we are asking. I'm also a member of the Homeland Security Committee asking questions of Secretary Mayorkas and others in the administration, what's the plan? Will we ready by May 23rd?

[15:25:01]

BLACKWELL: Well, we certainly have heard from some border state Democrats who believe that there should be some caution placed to make sure there isn't a surge across the border once that's lifted in May.

Senator Alex Padilla, thank you, sir.

PADILLA: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: So, today, New York's top law enforcement official is urging a state judge to hold former President Donald Trump in civil contempt. This is a new filing and Attorney General Latisha James accuses Trump of failing to comply with a subpoena for documents in her civil investigation into his businesses. James is requesting the court hold Trump in contempt and impose a $10,000 fine a day until he complies.

BLACKWELL: CNN's Kara Scannell sat down for an exclusive interview with the Manhattan district attorney who is overseeing the criminal side of the investigation into Trump's businesses.

What do we know? What have you learned in this conversation?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So, I sat down with the D.A., Alvin Bragg, and he wanted to send a message this investigation into the former president and his business is ongoing, it's active. He says they're interviewing witnesses. They're reviewing new evidence.

Now, of course, he makes this very unusual statement and grants us this interview because there had been a lot of speculation that the investigation had ended after two prominent attorneys who were working in the office had resigned. One of them in a resignation letter said he believed Trump was guilty of numerous crimes and that Bragg was wrong not to authorize an indictment of the former president in February. That's when those two resigned.

I asked Bragg about that today. Here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALVIN BRAGG, NEW YORK COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY: It happens that prosecutors can disagree on next steps and, like I said, I'm not going to presume to speak for anyone else. For me, I thought there were more avenues, more work to be done, more things we could follow up on, and that's what our team is in place doing each and every day.

SCANNELL: I just want to get your reaction to a couple of things that Pomerantz said in his resignation letter. He said the team that has been investigating Mr. Trump harbors no doubt whether he committed crimes. He did.

Do you agree with that statement?

BRAGG: I'm not going to get into sort of a line item. His letter speaks for itself. What I can say is that's his opinion. As the district attorney for Manhattan, the one who has to make the charging decision, I've decided to look at additional avenues, and doing that side by side with the team of career prosecutors, folks who have been steeped in state law practice, people who worked in the Manhattan district attorney's office, in some cases for decades.

SCANNELL: Do you think that you can get new evidence that would make you comfortable to bring charges?

BRAGG: Well, we are every day following up on new evidence we've secured. Investigations are not linear, right? So, we are following the leads in front of us and that's what we're doing. We're doing that right now. That's what we're saying in our statement today, the investigation is very much ongoing.

Obviously, Mr. Pomerantz has his opinion about how, you know, the investigation shouldn't fall, couldn't fall. This is what we're actively doing each and every day in this building.

SCANNELL: So, you're still interviewing witnesses?

BRAGG: We are, as our statement today says, we are interviewing witnesses. We're reviewing documents, following up on evidence that has not previously been analyzed and looked at or secured by the office.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCANNELL: Now, Bragg would not put a time line on this investigation, how long he would continue, but he did say the public will know either through an indictment or his office will issue a statement explaining their decision.

CAMEROTA: Great to get that interview. Kara Scannell, thank you very much for sharing that.

OK. Let's talk about this. Tiger Woods is back at the Masters. We're going to tell you how he's doing after that horrible accident.

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