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Desperate Scenes in Chernihiv after Russian Troops Leave; Germany Intercept Audio of Russian Troops Discussing Killing Civilians; Ukraine Requests Weapons from NATO Ukrainians Flee Eastern War Zone Via Train; Tactics, Ingenuity Held Off Russians in Strategic City; Turkish-Made Drone Helps Slow Russian Advance; Senate Confirms First Black Female Supreme Court Justice. Aired 12-1a ET
Aired April 08, 2022 - 00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOHN VAUSE, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Will be a long slog. But Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin admitting for the first time the U.S. is providing intelligence to Ukrainian forces in the Donbas region.
[00:00:10]
Ukrainian authorities claim Russian shelling has destroyed all hospitals and medical facilities in the Luhansk region. And Ukrainian officials say a Russian air strike has taken out a crucial railway link with the East.
About 500 evacuees now reportedly stuck at a nearby train station.
Further north, Kharkiv regional governor says Russian troops shelled a bread factory, killing one person, wounding 14 others. Russia denies it is targeting civilians.
But Ukraine's prosecutor general says search groups have found 26 bodies under the rubble of two houses in Borodyanka. The town northwest of Kyiv has been left in ruins by Russian forces. Ukraine's president says he expects more atrocities will be discovered there, proving Russia is the greatest threat on the planet to freedom and security.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): After Bucha, this is already obvious. And the work on dismantling the debris in Borodyanka has begun. It's much worse there, even more victims of the Russian occupiers.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: And the Kremlin spokesperson has made a surprising admission: that Russia has suffered significant troop losses in Ukraine and called it a huge tragedy.
This is a notable departure from late March, when Russia said only about 1,300 troops had been killed. Dimitri Peskov also said that the Russian retreat from the Kyiv and
Chernihiv regions was a, quote, "act of goodwill" to help the negotiations and lift tension.
CNN's Clarissa Ward visited Chernihiv and shows us the destruction left behind. And a warning: her report includes images many viewers will find disturbing.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): For weeks, Chernihiv was completely cut off from the rest of the country. Once a vibrant city of 300,000 people, now parts of it a wasteland.
Just 45 miles from the Belarusian border, it was quickly surrounded by Russian forces. There was no power, no water, and little food.
Seventy-one-year-old Ivan Ivanovich (ph) survived the relentless bombardment. But his struggles are far from over.
IVAN IVANOVICH (PH), SURVIVED BOMBARDMENT OF CHERNIHIV: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
WARD (on camera): (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE) He's saying that he's hungry. He needs something to eat. He's asked as if we have any groceries.
(voice-over): Less than one week after Russian forces left this area, Chernihiv is reeling, and the true scale of its loss is only starting to emerge.
Outside the morgue, makeshift coffins stand ready for the dead. Authorities say at least 350 civilians were killed in the bombardment, and they expect to find more.
Overwhelmed, morgue director Sergei Andreyev (ph) is now using a refrigerator truck to store the bodies of those who have yet to be identified. Their relatives likely fled the fighting or were killed in it.
He tells us hundreds more died as they simply couldn't reach the hospital.
"There was a constant flow of dead people like this in our morgue. The main reason was heart attacks, pneumonia, diabetes," he says. "And I believe all of this was because they didn't get medical treatment on time."
Cut off from the main cemetery by constant shelling, the city was forced to clear a wood to make room for the dead. Buried in large trenches, their names sign-posted for relatives to find.
(on camera): It's so heartbreaking to see as people here looking desperately, trying to find their loved ones among this massive new graves.
(voice-over): "Did you find him?" this woman asks. She's looking for her husband, Vladimir Shuga (ph).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
WARD: "I can't find him," her daughter tells us. "I need to keep searching."
Those who are lucky enough to find their family members can at least say goodbye, but the farewell brings little solace.
At one grave, relatives mourn the death of Vladimir Aduchenko (ph), Ukrainian soldier who was ambushed by Russian forces as he tried to recover the bodies of his fallen comrades.
His father, Leonid (ph), says it was 17 days before the Russians left that he could finally reach the place where his son was killed.
"I dug the ground with my own hands. I uncovered his face," he says. "And I recognized him."
[00:05:08]
"We waited for him, and then we lost him," Vladimir's wife says. "They took him, and we lost him."
Russia's war has taken so many from Chernihiv. And while its forces may have retreated, the grief will now remain.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: Now the word of radio chatter between Russian troops that could bolster evidence of possible war crimes. According to one source, Germany's intelligence service intercepted audio of Russian soldiers talking about shooting civilians.
To be clear, these are radio coms that could link Russian forces with the killings in Kyiv suburb of Bucha that have horrified the world.
There's no shortage of proof that atrocities have happened in Bucha. But this apparent German evidence could be a key factor in future war crimes prosecutions.
Joining me now, John Spencer, chair of urban warfare studies at the Madison Policy Forum, author of "Connected Soldiers."
Colonel Spencer, thank you for taking time to be with us. I want to talk with those radio intercepts by the German intelligence.
Earlier this week, Ukrainian security service also released what it said were audio recordings between Russian soldiers. In one example, a Russian soldier identifies two civilians traveling in a car. He radios that in. The audio comes back, "F-ing kill them all, for 'F's' sake."
So putting all of this together, does it now appear that the Russian military had some kind of premeditated plan for mass murder of Ukrainian civilians and to commit atrocities on this sort of industrial scale, as opposed to a few poorly-disciplined, rogue soldiers?
JOHN SPENCER, CHAIR OF URBAN WARFARE STUDIES, MADISON POLICY FORUM: Yes, in my opinion and as an old soldier and a leader of men in combat, I absolutely think this was an organized genocide in places like Bucha.
I mean, you fight disinformation with facts. And that's what the world is doing. And what happened this morning at the United Nations was amazing. And you fight disinformation. These are -- I don't even call it war crimes. I mean, there's a world of difference. This is just evil, premeditated. Call it what you will, it was -- it is wrong. And it -- again, it's clear what happened.
VAUSE: "The Washington Post" also reporting on this, that the radio traffic suggests that members of the Wagner Group, the private military unit with close ties to the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, and his allies, have played a role in these attacks on civilians.
The Wagner Group are notorious mercenaries. Would their involvement in these atrocities and just simply being here come from the direct orders of Vladimir Putin?
SPENCER: Yes, absolutely. They're not going to just walk themselves into the Ukraine war. They're actively fighting for Russia, absolutely.
VAUSE: And they're here because Putin would want them to be here? I mean, because they're high up the food chain?
SPENCER: Yes, absolutely. And we saw that, right? We saw Russia in chaos, talking about trying to recruit Syrians, bringing Wagner Group from places like Africa.
They're -- they're still in a really bad state. We're in a dangerous point, but yes, it would definitely come from the top.
VAUSE: OK, so the Ukrainian foreign minister was at a NATO meeting on Thursday. And he had this warning of what the next stage of this war will look like. Here he is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DMYTRO KULEBA, UKRAINIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: The battle for Donbas will remind you of the Second World War, with large operations, maneuvers, involvement of thousands of tanks, armored vehicles, planes, artillery. This will not be a local operation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: So from your perspective, from what you are expecting, how bloody will this fight get?
SPENCER: Yes, I think, unfortunately, I think this -- they lost the war. They lost the goal of why they invaded Ukraine. So now they're going to double down, and it's going to be vicious. It's more open, so the amount of firepower, I agree that -- with what
he said, that this is going to get much worse than we've seen up to this point. Because this is a fight about terrain.
Russia wants to get and encircle the Donbas and to get some type of win. So they're going to use everything they've got in high explosive, I agree, World War II style large formations in the open being destroyed. They need everything. I agree the statement that they need weapons, weapons, weapons.
VAUSE: So how can the Ukrainians actually put up a counter offensive and any kind of resistance right now as they stand against the Russian military in this new phase of the war?
SPENCER: I think you were talking just before what Secretary Austin revealed, is the No. 1 thing that helps Ukrainians win is intelligence. Surprise is everything.
There's no surprise where Russia wants to go. Now, Ukrainian needs the long-range capabilities, like artillery, long-range rockets, tanks that -- you know, that can see for miles. Because -- but the intelligence is what they need so they prevent surprise.
Now, there's problems, but there's also kind of advantages. Ukrainians own Ukraine. They have what's called interior lines. And that's why that rail head being hit is concerning. Because Russia has to come from outside, from Belarus, from Belgorod, everywhere, to bring more forces in that are already in a bad shape.
So this is very concerning. But the Ukrainians still have an advantage. And that's why they need these supplies to be able to push Russia all -- Russians all the way back to Moscow.
VAUSE: John Spencer there in Colorado Springs, we appreciate you being with us, sir. We appreciate your insights. Thank you very much.
SPENCER: Thank you.
VAUSE: Well, Moscow's brutal military offensive has now led to Russia's suspension from the U.N.'s Human Rights Council. Thursday's vote by the U.N.'s General Assembly was overwhelming, 93 to 24, with 58 abstentions.
The U.S. ambassador to the United Nations called the move important and historic. China notably voted against the resolution and warned it would set a dangerous precedent.
After the vote, Russia's ambassador lashed out, saying Moscow had decided to end his membership of the Human Rights Council anyway.
Russia has also been removed from a list of countries granted most favored nation status for trade for the U.S. And in Washington, lawmakers also passed a bill to block Russian energy imports, while the European Union has slapped a fifth round of sanctions on Moscow, including a ban on Russian coal.
But Ukraine says the economic punishment simply is not enough, as CNN's Nic Robertson reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Well, Ukraine's foreign minister arrived here, saying he wanted three things: weapons, weapons, weapons. And that he needs them urgently, the reason being Ukraine fears that Russia is building up for a big, new offensive in the East of Ukraine.
KULEBA: Either you help us now -- and I'm speaking about days, not weeks -- or your help will come too late. And many people will die.
ROBERTSON: Just a few days ago, NATO officials were talking about sending tanks, about sending armored vehicles. But when the meeting of the foreign ministers wrapped up here, NATO secretary-general Jens Stoltenberg wasn't specific when he was asked the question, so what will you be sending?
And the U.S. secretary of state, Antony Blinken, also opaque, as well, but saying that they were working with the Ukrainians and giving them what they think the Ukrainians need.
ANTONY BLINKEN, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: We are looking at, day in, day out, what we believe they most need, to include new systems that have not heretofore been provided. We're listening to them in terms of their assessment of what they need. We're putting it all together, and we're proceeding.
ROBERTSON: And Ukraine's foreign minister saying that they're still committed to negotiations with the Russians, but saying how those talks go, how the negotiations go depend essentially on two things: how the armies fight and how Russia feels the pressure of the sanctions.
And of course, what he's saying there is how the Ukrainian army fights depends on the support they get from right here.
Nic Robertson, CNN, NATO headquarters, Brussels.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: You're watching CNN. Coming up later this hour, CNN has exclusive access to the manufacturer of a drone which has become one of Ukraine's troops' most effective weapons.
Also ahead, we'll hear from the man who drove the last train out of the besieged city of Mariupol. He helped save thousands. He helped get them to safety.
Stay with us. You're watching CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[00:18:05]
VAUSE: Welcome back, everyone. Well, nearly 5,000 Ukrainians made it to safety via humanitarian --
humanitarian corridors on Thursday. Twelve hundred came from the besieged city of Mariupol. Mostly, they've been leading a convoy of buses since rail services stopped in late February.
But others in this war zone can still actually get out by train.
CNN's Ivan Watson has an inside look at their journey.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Ukrainian families, on the run. More than a month after Russia invaded, civilians are still fleeing from the threat of the Russian military, hurrying towards a waiting train.
An air raid siren rings out as the train begins to move. This couple, just a few minutes too late.
(on camera) The evacuation train is now leaving the station. There are about 1,100 passengers on board this train. All of them are evacuees who are traveling for free. They'll be traveling for the next 24 hours. This train, carrying this human cargo to safety in Western Ukraine.
(voice-over): The war forced everyone here to flee their homes, including the crew of the train. Head conductor Sergey Hrishenko ran the last train out of the city of Mariupol on February 25, the day after Russia launched its invasion.
There have been no trains from Mariupol since, as a monthlong Russian siege has destroyed much of the city.
SERGEY HRISHENKO, HEAD CONDUCTOR (through translator): My whole team, 20 conductors, everybody left with me. Many of them were made homeless, lost their apartments. Some of them lost relatives.
WATSON: Hrishenko says his team spent the next month living and working on the train nonstop, struggling to evacuate crowds of desperate and panicked Ukrainians, especially during the first weeks of the war.
(on camera): Sergey estimates that, during the month that he and his team were working, they evacuated around 100,000 people.
[00:20:07]
(voice-over): These days, the crowds have gotten smaller, but strangers are still packed together for this long trip. Everyone seems to be fleeing a different part of Eastern Ukraine.
Galina Bondarenko fled her village outside of the city of Zaporizhzhia with her 19-year-old son after enduring two weeks of Russian shelling.
GALINA BONDARENKO, FLED RUSSIAN INVASION: I feel outrage, complete outrage. And I feel fear, when they are shooting. WATSON: Some evacuees brought their pets.
(on camera): The kitten is handling the train ride a little bit better than the puppy.
(voice-over): The two families sharing this compartment met each other on the train for the very first time.
(on camera): I've been speaking with Katya (ph), who is eight months' pregnant right now. And she's traveling, alone with her daughter, heading West. Because they don't know what will happen.
And I asked, where are you going to give birth to your child? And she said, Well, wherever it's safe right now. And that's just -- that's just an example of one family. She's left her husband behind. He's serving in the military right now.
(voice-over): Further down the train, I meet a group of women and children who have just escaped Southern Ukraine.
(on camera): How long did you live under Russian military occupation?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One month. One month from the 27th of February.
WATSON: How would you describe that experience?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All this time, I went outside only two times. Just because, I heard a lot of cases of (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE).
WATSON: Rape?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Rape, raping.
WATSON (voice-over): In addition to hearing unconfirmed stories of rape, the women tell me they've seen drunk and filthy Russian soldiers asking residents for supplies like food and toilet paper.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They put flags on our building. My building.
WATSON: Which flags?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Russian flags. Just like that.
WATSON: On the police station?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Everywhere. They just love this, I think. And they think that flag can change our minds. Our Ukrainian minds. But it's not work like this.
I want the Russian people also come back on their land. They have a lot of land. Just a lot of land on the map. And I hope it will be enough for them. Just because enough. Stop, please.
It's very painful for everyone here. For everyone in this train and outside. It's -- it was very peaceful life without these attacks. WATSON: I've gotten off after a relatively short journey. This train
still has more than 20 hours to go across country. It will end up in the Western Ukrainian city of Lviv, but for most of the more than 1,100 evacuees on board, all forced to flee their homes by this terrible war, their final destination is likely unclear.
Ivan Watson, CNN, in Eastern Ukraine.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: If you would like to help the people of Ukraine, who are in need of shelter, food, or water, clothing, medical supplies, everything, please go to CNN.com/impact. And there, you'll find a number of ways to help, and be confident that your generosity will reach the people most in need.
We will take a short break, but just ahead, a small town in Southern Ukraine that dared to take on an invading army. How the outnumbered Ukrainians managed to beat back a much larger Russian force.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Are you worried that they're going to come back for revenge, after you guys embarrassed him?
GHOST, UKRAINIAN RECONNAISSANCE UNIT COMMANDER (through translator): No, it's them who should be afraid.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[00:28:13]
VAUSE: Twenty-seven minutes past the hour. Welcome back, everyone. I'm John Vause, live in Lviv, Ukraine.
And Ukraine's president now calling on foreign government to restore their diplomatic missions in Kyiv, now that Russian forces have withdrawn.
On Thursday, the Kyiv train station was busy with returning residents, who'd fled in recent weeks. Some cafes and restaurants are open once again, and life in that city is starting to feel, well, a little more normal. At least there is a sense of normalcy.
Now, to a big win by a little town. When Russian forces launched their invasion, one of their key objectives was a small but strategic town in southern Ukraine. But against all odds, outnumbered, outgunned, Ukrainian troops and civilians joined forces and stopped the Russian military.
CNN's Ed Lavandera has this remarkable story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LAVANDERA (voice-over): The sign into town reads, "Russian soldier, you will die here." The Russians didn't listen.
(on camera): This is the story of how the small city of Voznesensk fought off the Russian invasion in early March.
Yevgeniy Velychko is the mayor of the city of 30,000 people. He took us to the bridge, at least where the bridge used to be, where Ukrainian soldiers, volunteer fighters, and a fearlessly creative cast of civilians stared down the Russians.
(on camera): How close did the Russians get to taking over this city?
You can see over here, on the other side of the bridge in the distance there, just on the other side of the bridge, a row of tires and that's as close as the Russian tanks came.
(voice-over): The mayor says the Ukrainians blew it up so that the Russians couldn't cross into the heart of the city. That sparked a two-day confrontation, with thousands of residents were trapped on the other side of the bridge, the only section of the city Russian forces invaded.
[00:30:06]
This man, named Ivan (ph), lives in a house along the main road into town. Several homes and cars around him were scorched in the firefight. He hid inside, with his elderly mother, as the Russian tanks swarmed his neighborhood.
(on camera): He describes how terrifying it was. Several homes blown up around him; constant barrage of gunfire. But he tells us he actually didn't see it. He had to hide inside his home. But just the sound of it was terrifying.
(voice-over): Various cameras captured the images of the Russian military vehicles, with the letter "Z" emblazoned on the side. The mayor says three columns of Russian soldiers moved into the city. One military official says the Russians invaded with at least 100 tanks and armored personnel carriers, and as many as 500 soldiers.
(on camera): So, this is Ghost. He's asked that we not use his full name. And he is the head of a reconnaissance unit here in this town that was instrumental in fighting back the Russians.
And this was the spot. This was the spot where you fought the Russians.
He says he thinks he thinks that's a bloodstain there. Wow. The remnants of a Russian meal.
GHOST (through translator): When they were advancing towards the bridge, thanks to the Ukrainian military forces, the air assault brigade, the territorial defense, and our recon squad, we hold them off. Here, we showered them with artillery, and we destroyed them.
LAVANDERA: The Ukrainians blew up multiple bridges in the city to keep the Russians from moving into this town that sits at a strategic crossroads in Southern Ukraine and kept Vladimir Putin's army from invading deeper into the country.
(on camera): In this spot, just on the edge of the city, multiple Russian tanks were taken out here. We're actually standing in the ashes of one of those tanks. And there were at least two Russian soldiers that were killed in this very spot.
GHOST (through translator): We are strong. Our city is strong. Our spirit is strong. When the enemy came, everyone rose up, from kids to the elderly.
LAVANDERA (voice-over): Hiding residents called in the locations of Russian soldiers. Others ran ammunition and supplies wherever it was needed.
(on camera): The Russians had more firepower, had more weapons, than you guys had.
GHOST (through translator): They were powerful. They had tanks, they had APCs, a lot of wheeled vehicles. But we're stronger, smarter, and more tactical.
LAVANDERA: Are you worried that they're going to come back for revenge after you guys embarrassed them?
GHOST (through translator): No, it's them who should be afraid. They should know, if they come here, they will remain here as cargo (UNINTELLIGIBLE). We already have refrigerators for their bodies, and we can bring more.
LAVANDERA (voice-over): But the Russian soldiers weren't ready to face the grandmothers of Stepova (ph) Street. In a small village, on the edge of Voznesensk, 88-year-old Vera walked out, armed with her canes, and fired off an epic tirade of verbal artillery.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
GRAPHIC: I come out from the kitchen and I tell him, sorry for the language, "'F' your mother. Has your Putin gone mad, firing at kids? 'F,' is he mad? He is a bitch. He must die."
LAVANDERA: They say they were chased out of their homes and robbed, but the women relish telling this story with laughter.
I ask if they're worried the Russians will return to seek revenge. They tell me they're not going anywhere.
Ed Lavandera, CNN, Voznesensk, Ukraine.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VAUSE: I will have a lot more from Ukraine in a moment. Let's head back to Paula Newton, who's standing by there in Atlanta.
And Paula, there is no end to these stories of the resistance and the defiance which is being put up by the Ukrainians here against this, you know, mighty Russian military. The concern, though, is that this is now turning into a different war:
open fields, artillery, tanks, basically it will be a whole different confrontation. And the Ukrainians may not have the same advantages when it comes to sort of urban warfare, where they succeeded in Ed Lavandera's report just there.
PAULA NEWTON, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Yes. Especially with the Russians regrouping.
It's sobering though, John, to think that a woman who was born in the 30s is now looking at a situation where that war can be just as devastating, and in some ways, even more savage.
John, listen, good to have you there. You'll join us again at the top of the hour. And we'll have more live news from Ukraine.
Right now, though, we want to turn to some of the other headlines from around the world. Israeli officials say the gunman who carried out a deadly attack at a popular Tel Aviv dining area has been killed.
[00:35:09]
They say he was found hiding near a mosque and died in an exchange of gunfire with Israeli security forces. At least two people were killed and several others wounded in the attack in Tel Aviv on Thursday.
The shooting is just the latest in a series of violent incidents that have put Israel and the Palestinian territories on edge.
In one week last month, 11 people were killed in three separate attacks.
To Pakistan now, where the court there has -- the top court there has ruled, as called right now for lawmakers to return within two days after a ruling that Prime Minister Imran Khan's move to dissolve Parliament was, in fact, unconstitutional.
Mr. Khan moved to dissolve the lower chamber ahead of a no-confidence vote against him earlier this week. The court now says the vote, though, will go ahead.
Sri Lanka's president insists he will not quit as protests intensify over the country's economic crisis. Sri Lanka is suffering from a shortage of fuel, power and medications, with doctors warning that the entire health system could soon collapse.
Coming up for us here on CNN NEWSROOM, we'll learn about a Turkish drone that is apparently so effective, Ukrainian soldiers are singing about it. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[00:40:27]
NEWTON: So as we've been reporting, drones are playing a key role in Ukraine's counter offensive against Russia's invasion. One is proving so effective that Ukrainian forces are singing its praises, literally. CNN's Jomana Karadsheh has this exclusive report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(MUSIC)
JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This Ukrainian song has gone viral in Ukraine and beyond. It's an ode to a drone.
(MUSIC)
The Bayraktar, the Turkish-made weapon Ukrainian officials are touting as one of the most effective in their arsenal that's played a part in slowing down the Russian offense.
The Bayraktar TB-2 has been operational for years, described as a game-changer in recent conflicts like Libya and Nigona Careba (ph). But it is Ukraine that has catapulted it to worldwide fame.
Its success, not only on the battlefield. Videos of strikes against Russian military targets like this one, released by Ukraine's ministry of defense on social media, have also made it a key part of Ukraine's information war.
(on camera): We've gotten rare access to this production facility here turkeky yTurkeyin Turkey. Because of the nature of this industry, we are very restricted in what we can film and what we can show.
Selcuk Bayraktar, the drone's creator, gives us a mostly off-camera tour of the Bayraktar defense company's headquarters in Istanbul. The company's pride, (UNINTELLIGIBLE), the first unmanned fighter jet, has just hit the production line.
But the centerpiece here is the drone everyone is talking about.
SELCUK BAYRAKTAR, CHIEF TECHNOLOGY OFFICER, BAYKAR: Bayraktar TB-2 is a tactical mail class UAV. And it's doing what it was designed to do and what it was operated to do.
ABDELAZIZ (voice-over) : In this exclusive CNN interview, Bayraktar measures his words carefully. He's also the son-in-law of the Turkish president, who maintains a close ties with Russia and Ukraine and has emerged as a key mediator.
BAYRAKTAR: You know, I don't want to brag about the technology when because people are giving their lives up. People are resisting and defending their homeland from an illegal occupation. That's what the brave people of Ukraine and its leadership has done.
Just at the same time, of course, you need technology, you need high- tech. And you need your own indigenous defense capacity. But when people's lives are on the line, and when children are -- even children are dying and civilians are dying, I don't want to compare that to any sort of technology. KARADSHEH: Turkey's drone sales to Kyiv have been a major irritant for
Russia long before this war. Ukraine got its first Bayraktar TB-2s in 2019. It's ordered at least 36 of those drones so far.
But it's not only a client. It produces engines for the more advanced Akinci drone and was about to begin coproducing Turkish drones, plans that were disrupted by the invasion.
Bayraktar's heard the song dedicated to his namesake drone. He knows very well the phenomenon it has become in Ukraine.
BAYRAKTAR: I think it's one of the symbols of resistance. And it gives them hope, I think.
KARADSHEH: Hope in a battle Ukrainians are fighting on all fronts.
SAMUEL BENDETT, ADVISOR, CNA RUSSIA STUDIES PROGRAM: The Bayraktar drones are part of the larger social media campaign that is executed very well by the Ukrainian military and civilians.
And they are creating the impression that the Russian military is, in fact, losing, that the Russian military is vulnerable.
Again, Bayraktar is not the only solution out there, and it isn't necessarily a solution that is going to save the Ukrainian military, because after all, this is a ground war.
But having a drone like Bayraktar in the sky that can conduct surveillance, that can launch strikes, and having the videos of those strikes multiply on social media is a great morale booster. It is also a great tactical victory, as well.
KARADSHEH: This social media video shows civilians in the city of Kherson protesting against Russian forces. They played them the Bayraktar song.
One of the countless moments of resistance by a nation using all it's got to stand up to the invader.
Jomana Karadsheh, CNN, Istanbul.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[00:45:02]
NEWTON: OK. Coming up for us, an historic day in the United States. Finally, for the first time, a black woman will take a seat on the U.S. Supreme Court. We'll look at the scope of this milestone, when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
NEWTON: History was made on the floor of the U.S. Senate Thursday after senators confirmed the first black female to the U.S. Supreme Court.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: On this vote, the yeas are 53, the nays are 47, and this nomination is confirmed.
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: All right!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson watched the vote, as you can see there, with President Joe Biden. Of course, the two seemingly overcome with emotion. And why wouldn't you be?
The vote follows a contentious confirmation hearing. Despite that, the floor of the Senate erupted in applause after the vote.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[00:50:06]
SEN. CORY BOOKER (D-NJ): The energy in that room, and the overwhelming emotion was just laid evident. I talked to staff, people who work the floor in the Senate, that have been there for, you know, some of them decades. They said they'd never seen a confirmation vote like that, where you could just feel the electricity, the anticipation.
And when that final vote came, I just -- I just was overwhelmed. And, you know, it's almost like you could witness the arc of the moral universe bending a little bit more towards justice in our country. And the long pathway of struggle to be a more perfect union, to really be advanced.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: For more on this, we want to talk with our CNN senior legal analyst, Laura Coates. She's the host of "The Laura Coates Show" on Sirius XM and the author of "Just Pursuit: A Black Prosecutor's Fight for Fairness."
And Laura, good to see you. Before we get to the judicial and political issues, I want you to take a deep breath and please tell us what does this mean to you? What does this mean to America? And remember, just with your book, right, reminding everyone, you did write a book on bias in the judicial system. So, where are we now?
LAURA COATES, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, you know, as we're taking in that collective deep breath, we are really inhaling a moment in history.
We've seen over a 200 plus-year run in this country of Supreme Court justices that it has been taken up to the 116th time for a person to be confirmed, and that person is now a black woman. The first black women in this country to have the title of justice.
And the symbolism is not without merit. It's not what we can actually look at and really take in. Remember, black women in this country have been asked to wait in line over the course of modern American history and beyond. Whether it's issues surrounding the right to vote, after their white counterparts, whether it's issues surrounding their right to be free, discussions about their own agency over their bodies, all of these things are things where black women have been really asked to wait.
And now, the number 116 has finally come up. And it's come up with one of the most revered members of the judicial bench, in Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson. Her resume is impeccable. Her qualifications, frankly, second to none.
And yet, in spite of all of that, she was still forced to endure many indignities of the entire confirmation process. And it wasn't lost on, I hope, the United States, or the rest of the world, to see the challenges that were still posed, even with all the qualifications in the world, that she still had to fight through and endure.
And how she did so with such dignity and grace, really, I think is the most compelling aspect of what it will mean when she is a jurist on the Supreme Court of the United States.
NEWTON: Some justices have spoken in recent months about their fear that the Supreme Court would be seen to be too political. I want to get to the nitty-gritty of her legal work, though, and what did also come out in these hearings.
What kind of justice do you believe she will be? Because I found it so interesting that she may well be just slightly to the right of the liberal contingent in the court. And it's important to remind everybody about the kind of cases coming up. Right? Whether it has to do with abortion rights, gun rights, states' rights.
COATES: Well, you know, we have in -- in the Supreme Court right now, an abortion case out of Mississippi. A near abortion ban from the state of Texas, which already had a way of doing an end run around our precent of Roe v. Wade.
But they do have right now, and they'll get to actually decide on the future of Roe v. Wade.
Coming up next term, there's a case involving affirmative action at the college level. Of course, it involves her alma mater, and she's already indicated that she might recuse herself, because she was in a board position for the university and the college. And therefore, it might be seen to have some aspect, that she would not be impartial, whether that is true, or not.
But you know, at the end of the day, you're thinking about the ways in which it can change the discussion, if not the composition of the court.
She is replacing a justice who she is largely aligned with in her ideology. In fact, she was a clerk for that very justice.
But at the end of the day, when you think about the role of the Supreme Court, and what is actually expected of them, her background as a former federal public defender, her background as a former member of the U.S. Sentencing Commission, extremely impactful, because it provides the breadth of experience, both lived and professional, to be able to understand the gravitas and the impact of the laws of this country.
And although it might not change the ultimate vote, it will surely change the discussion. And that is part of what we look to our courts to look at.
The idea -- and I was a former prosecutor. I know full well that the deck is often stacked against the defendants in this country. And we do not have an adversarial, although it's largely regarded in Hollywood as this enemy-like, combative relationship.
[00:55:05]
It's a symbiotic one with defense council, where we both are equally invested, and ought to be, in protecting the constitutional rights of even the person who is accused.
Because, here, we have a presumption of innocence. And to have that make sense and be true, you have to honor the Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth Amendment rights of the defendant, including right to counsel, the right to due process, and the right against self-incrimination. All those things, the defense council is very well-versed in, and ought to be considered.
But you know, when people looked at her confirmation hearing, Paula, they often thought to themselves, a defense attorney. Well, that must mean you're soft on crime.
Well, I've got news for everyone. Even prosecutors, and judges, and the Supreme Court of the United States, they have to regard the constitutional rights of a defendant, which means, according to that logic, I guess we're all soft on crime. And that's obviously not the case.
NEWTON: No, obviously not. And she made that clear, in responding to some of those questions during your hearing.
Laura, I can't think of anyone better to help us take the measure of history. Thanks so much. We appreciate it.
COATES: Thank you.
NEWTON: Quite a historic day there.
I'm Paula Newton. Thanks for joining us. I'll be back with much more next hour, but stay tuned. We'll continue with our breaking news coverage with John Vause, live from Lviv. That's next.
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