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Zelenskyy: Mariupol Destroyed, Tens Of Thousands Dead There; Biden Announces New Rule Regulating Ghost Guns; U.N.: 4.5 Million Have Fled Russian Invasion Of Ukraine. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired April 11, 2022 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy says that tens of thousands of people have been killed in city of Mariupol after weeks of relentless shelling. Now CNN has not independently verified that. But these neutral images show what's left of the destroyed theater in the city. Hundreds are believed to have died there. The building served as a shelter for hundreds of Ukrainians. Many of them women and children.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Mariupol lies destroyed. Tens of thousands have been killed there and still the Russians won't end their offensive. They want to make an example out of Mariupol as a city ruined.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[15:35:00 will]

BLACKWELL: Dmytro Gurin is a member of the Ukrainian Parliament. He is with me now from Ukraine. So, thank you for being with me. Listen, every report we get out of Mariupol is more awful than the last. What do you know about the dead there and I guess as importantly, the people who are trying to survive in that city.

DMYTRO GURIN, UKRAINIAN PARLIAMENT MEMBER: The last I know that our information from result official channel and telegram, Russian troop used chemical weapons in Mariupol. They dropped unknown substance from drone.

BLACKWELL: So, you say that -- OK, so your claim is that Russian troops have now used chemical weapons in Mariupol. What is the source of that? Because this would be a dramatic escalation if it actually happened.

GURIN: Official channels of hour as of (INAUDIBLE) that is in Mariupol now.

BLACKWELL: OK, let me also say here that CNN has not independently verified that chemical weapons have been used in Mariupol. What was the result? Did it happen an hour ago or was it discovered an hour ago? GURIN: Well, by the message it happened hour ago and that's our last

news. You know that Mariupol was totally destroyed. Half a million people who don't have any more of the city. And thousands are dead and President Zelenskyy said 20,000, but my estimate as a person that lived there 15 years, I think more. I think not less than 30. And now we have about chemical weapons. They have (INAUDIBLE) today around 3:00 by Kyiv time. They are troops, these so-called (INAUDIBLE) Vaneska (ph) Republic. On the official channels they said that it's the time, you know, to ask our chemical troops to decide for problem, also Ukrainian army in Mariupol. They ordered in their official channels. So, now we have these news and what interest me really, where everybody going to act according. I mean, both societies.

BLACKWELL: When you say act accordingly -- again I want to be clear that CNN has not independently verified this report of the use of chemical weapons. But act accordingly, what does that look like from your position from the rest of the world.

GURIN: From my position it looks like that we have a choice to finish this war in the territory of Ukraine or finish this war on the territory of European Union -- a major territory. Because now we need a weapons. We need tanks. We need planes. We need air defense, naval defense and everybody from Ukraine, every day is talking and talking that we need offensive weapons to kick out Russian troops from our territory. And so, like everybody is just thinking. And let's think about it and maybe we can do it in six weeks. Now it doesn't go this way.

BLACKWELL: The president says --

GURIN: Of course, when we have weapons and you kick Russian troops from your territory. That is the war is our war.

BLACKWELL: The president says that you're ready. I mean, that's what he said in a televised address yesterday. What does that look like? Does that mean you have right now the hardware necessary? That you have the troops necessary for this escalation in the east?

GURIN: We are a nation and now we have a war of, you know, we need to survive. Because everybody in the world, I don't know why, but everybody is listening to what Putin says. And that's very (INAUDIBLE) because we have to see what they do. But nobody really the reasons what's Russian propaganda says. And that's a real source. Of course, they for their inner audience. But they are really saying what they are going to do. They at first, they said let's invade Ukraine. They have only three days, and all of this that also American secret service has said also. And now they are saying that the official information agency are in use. They said that all Ukrainian Nazis. That each person with Ukrainian ideas, that means is Nazi. And like millions of people in Ukraine have to be identified --

BLACKWELL: Yes, we have certainly --

GURIN: -- but with official news article.

[15:40:00] BLACKWELL: We have certainly reported on disinformation from the Kremlin and Russian sources. Not just interior, not just for the domestic audience in Russia but for the rest of the world. Dmytro Gurin, member of the Ukrainian Parliament, thank you, sir, for spending some time with me.

President Biden just announced his plan to crack down on ghost guns. They are made from a kit. They are hard to track and to regulate. We'll speak to Pennsylvania's Attorney General about next steps.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:45:00]

BLACKWELL: About 45 minutes ago, President Biden announced new steps to fight gun violence. The new regulations aimed at controlling the use so-called ghost guns. These are the untraceable weapons made from kits at home.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Last year alone, law enforcements reported approximately 20,000 suspected ghost guns to the Bureau Of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. That's a tenfold increase of these ghost guns from 2016. Tenfold in five years. These guns are weapons of choice for many criminals. We're going to do everything we can to deprive them of that choice. And when we find them and put them in jail for long, long time.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Josh Shapiro is the Attorney General for Pennsylvania who attended today's White House announcement -- also a Democratic candidate for governor. Mr. AG thank you for being with me. Listen, you urged the president not through some open letter or some public statement but face-to-face earlier this year to take some executive action on ghost guns. Let me get your reaction to what you heard today.

JOSH SHAPIRO, PENNSYLVANIA ATTORNEY GENERAL: While certainly, we've been sounding the alarm on ghost guns here in Pennsylvania for the last three years. This is an issue that we been pushing for and I was so pleased to see the president take this executive action today.

Look, here are the facts. Ghost guns have become the weapon of choice for criminals. In the city of Philadelphia alone we seeing a 489 percent increase in the number ghost guns recovered over just the last two years. These are dangerous. They're un-serialized. They're untraceable. And criminals are using them to wreak havoc on our communities. In fact, just week in the city of Philadelphia, a police officer was shot with a ghost gun. So, the action the president took today begins to rein in those ghost guns and will hopefully lead to greater safety and security in our communities.

BLACKWELL: Yes, you all in Pennsylvania tried to get something done legislatively a few years ago. We don't often talk about the fight in state capitals. We talk about this on a national platform and what can happen in Congress. But gun control or gun safety advocates, what are you up against in Harrisburg?

SHAPIRO: Well, I've been pushing the Republican led legislature to take some action. Look, it's common sense to just simply say we're going to keep guns out of the hands of criminals. But these ghost guns don't require a background check. And I've simply asked them to close the ghost gun loophole. They refused.

And so, I issued -- using my authority as the Attorney General -- legal guidance to regulate these as firearms. The deadly firearms that they are. And then I was promptly sued by the gun lobby which is why I've been pushing the federal government to act. And I'm pleased the Biden administration acted today.

But make no mistake, there is nothing stopping the Republican leaders in Harrisburg from acting right now as other state have done, to make sure that we just simply require a background check when people go to buy these ghost guns.

BLACKWELL: Mr. AG, I really think that there are a lot of people surprised about how common, that you say -- and we heard from the president -- that the use of these ghost guns are in part because they are untraceable. How does any police department know just how much of a share these weapons are in the crimes that we cover seemingly every Monday the spade of shootings over the weekend.

SHAPIRO: Will look, we partner with local, state and federal law enforcement. And more and more when we shut down these gun traffickers, we're seeing an increase in number of ghost guns we recover. And all we're asking in law enforcement is to simply say that someone's got to go through a background check when they buy these ghost guns. Because we're trying to keep guns out of the hands of criminals. Trying to keep guns away the people killing in our community. Who are wreaking havoc in our neighborhoods. This is a basic, common-sense step that needs to be taken. I was pleased the president acted today.

BLACKWELL: Let me get your thoughts on a different topic that we just got in. The city of Philadelphia is going to bring back its indoor mask mandate a week from today in the city at all public places. How do you get people, after so long now, not having to wear a mask indoors and public places to put those back on. It seems like it would be difficult.

SHAPIRO: Well, that's a decision that the mayor made. I certainly didn't make it. And I'm not a supporter of these mandates. What I'm a supporter of is educating and empowering the public so that they can make responsible decisions. But I think those kinds of mandates are counterproductive particularly at this time.

BLACKWELL: All right, Pennsylvania's Attorney General Josh Shapiro. Thank you, sir.

SHAPIRO: Thank you.

[15:50:00]

BLACKWELL: Breaking news. The United States says Vladimir Putin may be planning to interfere is upcoming U.S. elections. We're going to have the latest from Washington, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:55:00]

BLACKWELL: Ukrainians displaced by war are trying to get to neighboring countries. The United Nations says 4.5 million Ukrainian refugees crossed the border. UNICEF workers are across the region trying to meet the needs of children. Toby Fricker is UNICEF's chief of communication and partnerships. He's with us now from Lviv. Toby, you've been in Afghanistan, and Syria, Nigeria and Sudan. So, give us an idea of the scope and scale here of what we're watching in and around Ukraine?

TOBY FRICKER, CHIEF OF COMMUNICATIONS AND PARTNERSHIPS, UNICEF: Yes, and thanks so much. I mean, the scale of the situation in terms of displacement, in terms of the destruction is massive. And that is, of course, a massive issue for every child who has been affected. I think what we're seeing now in Ukraine is that every day this war goes on, the suffering gets worse and worse.

And actually, yesterday I was at Lviv at the railway station again. The station was packed with women and children who have been fleeing areas under heavy fighting. And what was particularly disturbing was when I spoke to a 16-year-old called Sasha, who came from an area in the southeast, he spoke about the lack of fear. He said the fear has gone. It was like, he was so used to the shelling and the fighting already, that he had no fear anymore. And was just not sure where the journey was going to take him next.

And mothers also talking about their 9-year-old sons and daughters saying, you know, I tell them that, not to watch the fireworks tonight. You know, to stay in the shower, because he didn't have a basement to go to, so they hid in the shower.

BLACKWELL: Toby, sometimes it is a tiny snap shot that drives home the atrocities that we're seeing. And put that picture back up of the stuffed toys. You tweeted this out, at a train station. Tell us about this.

FRICKER: Yes, so that was in the west of Ukraine. And that's a relatively safer area. Nowhere is completely safe but it is certainly safer than the east right now. And it was at the same time that the other side of the country in the east in Kramatorsk was the attack on the railway station and there were other pictures circulating I know on social media, where they were affected by the strikes.

So those teddy bears, those soft toys were waiting for children to arrive for our children relief, try to get they're who were there, and it was particularly tragic, looking at that. When across the country these strikes were happening. We actually had a UNICEF team in Kramatorsk very close to the railway station. They were offloading medical equipment for the authorities for the hospitals in the area when the strike happened.

BLACKWELL: Toby Fricker with UNICEF. Thank you so much. Those pictures of stuffed toys you say some children from Kramatorsk will never make it. Thank you for being with us.

We're just getting this in to CNN. The U.S. believes that Russian President Vladimir Putin may attempt to interfere with American elections in response to its support for Ukraine. CNN's Natasha Bertrand is part of the team breaking this story. Tell us what you know.

NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes, that's right. So, U.S. officials believe that as Putin becomes increasingly desperate, increasingly backed into a corner and increasingly angry about the West response to the Russian invasion of Ukraine, they believe that he could take more aggressive action against the United States particularly in cyberspace. In particular were told when it comes to U.S. elections.

U.S. officials tell us that part of a broad range of possibilities have been discussed including the possibility that Russia chooses to directly attack election infrastructure. Of course, there are the mid- terms this year. Of course, the presidential election is coming up. And the U.S. intelligence community believes that these could all be targets by the Russians as Vladimir Putin tries to ramp up Russia's activity against the United States in retaliation for the U.S. support for Ukraine in this war. And of course, in retaliation for the U.S. sanctions on Vladimir Putin and on Russia.

Now, there is no evidence as of yet that the Russians have actually decided to do this. That there is a plan in place to interfere in the elections, or to ramp up that activity. But they say that based on what they know about Vladimir Putin's past activity, about how his mind set and how his risk tolerance has changed since the war began, they do believe it a distinct possibility and they are preparing for it -- Victor.

JACKSON: Natasha Bertrand for us in Washington, thank you very much, Natasha.

Also, just into CNN, oil prices have just dropped to the lowest level since the start of the Russia war on Ukraine. U.S. crude dropped 4 percent to settle at $94.29 a barrel. Again, that's the lowest since the February 25 as the war was beginning and it marks a sharp decline from the peak last month of $130.50 a barrel.

San Francisco police -- OK. All right. We'll wrap there. We'll send it over to "THE LEAD" with Jake Tapper. He is live from Lviv. And that starts in just a few seconds.