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U.S. Russia Moving to Reinforce Forces in Donbas; Ukraine: Heavy Shelling in Kharkiv and Surrounding Areas; Ukraine Expects Full Donbas Offensive to Begin Soon; Growing Fears Russia May Use Chemical Weapons in Ukraine; EU Weighing Sixth Round of Sanctions Against Russia; India Defends Buying Russian Energy, Says Europe Buys More. Aired 4-4:30a ET

Aired April 12, 2022 - 04:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[04:00:00]

MAX FOSTER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and a warm welcome to our viewers joining us in the United States and all around the world. I'm Max Foster in London. We're following breaking news coverage of Russia's war in Ukraine. Just ahead.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Russia is preparing another offensive hoping to break our national alliance.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We should have no illusions that they'll break their tactics and make them less brutal.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If the evidence points to Vladimir Putin as a war criminal, and by all appearances it seems that it will, we will pursue that accountability.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If the Russian military thinks this kind of brutality is helpful in terrorizing the population.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't think we can differentiate between stages of hell that Ukraine is now going through.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

FOSTER: It's Tuesday, April 12th, 11 a.m. in Ukraine. Well, the departure of Russian troops in the north is revealing new atrocities. And Ukraine says Russia is laying the groundwork for the next phase of the war. As this map shows, Russian forces have largely left areas around Kyiv. But Ukraine's president said they left behind thousands of mines. A move he calls a war crime. Zelenskyy added that Russians didn't to ensure it would be dangerous for people to return to these areas.

Meanwhile, Russian troops appear to be consolidating to the south and the east -- the area there in red. Military analysts say Russia likely wants to take control of the entire Donbas region. A new video shows a long column of Russian military vehicles near Russia's border with Ukraine all of them pointing towards Donbas.

On Monday Ukrainian officials appeared to have gone on the offensive saying they destroyed a weapons depot in Luhansk. But Moscow backed leaders in the area denied that claim. Saying the strike destroyed homes and a fertilizer warehouse.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy says tens of thousands are dead in the besieged city of Mariupol following weeks of bombardments. CNN can't independently verify that claim. But Mr. Zelenskyy says more heavy weapons could help end the siege on the city. Meanwhile, Ukrainian officials say they are still defending the city despite recent reports suggesting Russian forces are gaining ground.

And on Monday there were unconfirmed reports of a chemical attack in the city. CNN can't independently verify that claim but both Ukraine and the U.S. say the threat of chemical attacks needs to be taken seriously.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NED PRICE, SPOKESPERSON, U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT: Before today there was credible information available to us that the Russians may have been preparing to use agents, chemical agents, potentially tear gas mixed with other agents. It's part of an effort to weaken, to incapacitate the Ukrainian military and civilian elements that are entrenched in Mariupol. Using these agents as part of an effort to weaken those defenses.

We shared that information with our Ukrainian partners. We are going to be in direct conversations with them to try and determine what exactly has transpired here and as soon as we gain additional fidelity, we'll be in a better position to say what this was or what this may have been.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Meanwhile, there's no letup in shelling in Kharkiv which is Ukraine's second largest city by population. You can see the heavy presence of Russian forces there in red. CNN's Nima Elbagir and her team were in Kharkiv when explosions ring out.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: You can see all around us just the sheer devastation. Right here is the crater from where a bomb was dropped just two days ago. North of here, about 25 miles away, is inside Russia. That's where the Russian positions are shelling. That's where they're throwing devastation and death into places like this in Kharkiv, into civilian areas. Most of the people who have been able to evacuate have already left the city. Those that remain have told us it's because they believe that nowhere in Ukraine is safe.

They wouldn't speak on camera because they're worried what will happen when and if the Russians finally arrive, and that is what U.S. and Ukrainian intelligence officials believe is about to happen. They believe Russian troops are amassing. That was just a mortar strike as we were talking. It's about the third or fourth that we've heard. It's coming from that direction over there. We're continuing to hear strikes.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[04:05:00]

FOSTER: Ukrainian authorities say the strikes have destroyed more than 2,000 homes across Kharkiv and the region of Kharkiv and that land mines remain a threat and that will hinder out efforts to plant new crops on agricultural land for a key area for agriculture. Ukrainian authorities say they've completed a temporary bridge meanwhile near Kyiv opening a route for humanitarian aid and reconstruction. This is for the suburb of Irpin where the Russian military has left behind evidence of bitter battles after their retreat. CNN's Frederick Pleitgen shows us the devastation and lingering dangers. But a warning his report does include graphic images that you may find disturbing.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The tour is a sad routine for the body collectors in the outskirts of Kyiv. Finding corpses has become eerily normal here. A house destroyed by an artillery strike, a body burned beyond recognition.

A mangled car wreck, two bodies burned beyond recognition. A house that was occupied by Russian troops, an elderly lady dead in the bedroom. These bodies evidence of a brutal Russian occupation and then a fierce fight by the underdog Ukrainians to drive them out.

A fight 81-year-old Kataryna Bareshvolets witnessed up close in her village.

"There were explosions. Explosions from all sides. It was scary," she tells me. "I am in my house. I cross myself and lie down and then I hear how it thundered and all the windows in the house were broken."

The Ukrainians tell us the Russian troops didn't even bother collecting most of their own dead. More than a week after Vladimir Putin's army was pushed out of here, they showed us the body of what they say was a Russian soldier still laying in the woods.

And that's not all they've left behind, this demining unit says they found hundreds of tons of unexploded ordnance in just a matter of days, including cluster munitions like this bomblet, even though the Russians deny using them.

LT. COL. MYKOLA OPANASENKO, UKRAINIAN ARMED FORCES (through translator): These weapons are extremely dangerous for civilians who might accidentally touch them, the commander says. There are about 50 such elements in one bomb, he says. This is a high explosive fragmentation bomb to kill people designed just to kill people.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): They blow up the cluster bomblet on the spot and then move the heavier bombs to a different location for a massive controlled explosion. The body collecting, the mind-sweeping and the clearing up of wreckage are just starting in this area. And yet this pile of demolished vehicles, both military and civilian already towers in the key of suburb of Irpin.

PLEITGEN: If you had to picture Russia's attempt to try and take the Ukrainian capital of Kyiv, it would probably look a lot like this. Destruction on a massive scale and absolutely nothing to show for it. Russia's military was humiliated by the Ukrainians and caused a lot of harm in the process.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): And they've devastated scores of families at Irpin Cemetery the newly widowed weep at a funerals for the fallen.

Ala Krutkiv (ph), her husband Igor (ph) fought alongside their 21- year-old son in Irpin and died in his arms on the battlefield. Yulia Shuktina (ph), wife of Dymitro Pasko (ph) killed by a Russian mortar shell. And Tetyana Lytkina, her husband Alexander Lytkina promised her he'd come back in a few hours but was killed defending this neighborhood.

TETYANA LYTKINA, WIFE OF SOLDIER KILLED IN IRPIN (through translator): I'm very proud of them, Tetyana says. He's a hero. We have many people in Ukraine who have not fled and are defending their homes." Sasha (ph) died just 200 meters from our house where we live.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): Laying the dead to rest, another sad task, they'd become all too efficient at performing in this area. Close by, the next funeral is already underway.

Fred Pleitgen, Irpin, Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Peter Zalmayev the director of the Eurasia Democracy Initiative. And Taras Berezovets, he is a Ukrainian political analysts and founder of Free Crimea Project. Thank you both for joining us. Peter, first a question for you and what we're seeing in terms of a buildup from the Russians towards the east of the country. What do you expect we're going to see there when this action actually, starts and full throttle as many experts are warning it's about to do?

PETER ZALMAYEV, DIRECTOR, EURASIA DEMOCRACY INITIATIVE: Well, indeed, Max. It's going to be full throttle. There's a very important day in the Russian calendar coming up, May 9th, which is the day of the Soviet victory over the Nazi Germany. It's a sacred day for Vladimir Putin. And it's a day when a parade marches up and down the Red Square. He knows that he is going to have to pony up some goods for his subject after this enormous amount of blood that has been spilled on the part of the Russian troops and the treasure that has been spent on this war.

[04:10:03]

We're going to see footage of the Ukrainian officials, Ukrainian experts. It's going to be a much more of a traditional sort of battle with a lot of tanks, a lot of artillery fire, aviation, et cetera. But when we say traditional, we also mean traditional by Russian standards. Russians don't play by the rules. We're already hearing reports that chemical weapons may have been used in Mariupol to try to knock out of the remaining bit of resistance there. So, we've seen Russians in action in Syria and Chechnya. They play dirty. And really, you know, all bets are off as far as what they will do to try to produce some sort of victory for Vladimir Putin by May 9.

FOSTER: Taras, we haven't had those reports confirmed, the use of chemical weapons in Mariupol, but the response you're generally getting from the West is that we need to be ready for that to happen even if it didn't happen on that occasion. What did you make of those reports?

TARAS BEREZOVETS, UKRAINIAN POLITICAL ACTIVIST: Yes, Max. Actually, my mother-in-law she escaped from Mariupol just nearly a week ago. I couldn't report this earlier because it was absolutely not secure. But luckily, she escaped with her mom who just by two days. And just quite far away from the hometown of Mariupol. And what she said was going on in there, it was completely nightmare.

The Russian tactics were so brutal attacking residential houses, killing people, raping women and doing every possible war crime. So, from this perspective of course, the Russians can do anything like this because for Russians, like Peter said, the sacred day of 9 of May is so important. To Vladimir Putin is so important that he will do everything possible to knock out Ukrainian forces. Ukrainian marines about 1,000 per hundred and still in Mariupol and they've taken a check for a soft spot. And because this location is so secure it's like a strong hold. For Russians, like they said, pursuing one of this territory. He actually stated on Russia state TV that they may use chemical weapons to kill Ukrainian military.

FOSTER: Peter, we're just hearing, you know, more testimony about rapes. Rape as a weapon of war. We've had multiple news organizations getting firsthand testimony. But even in the last 12 hours the Kremlin has denied that that is the case. But over time there will be evidence of this presumably. I mean, what do you make of the Kremlin's constant denials about any sort of abuses?

ZALMAYEV: Well, we're seeing this is the situation where a KGB man is running a country and is running a -- effectively running the military. It is all tried and true acted by the KGB, never to acknowledge any wrong. This is by the playbook. This is what the KGB officers are trained to do, to deny, deny, deny. And I mean, we are seeing that the Russian army are the dirtiest army, they play by no rules whatsoever. The Ukrainian general has already reported up to 6,000 war crimes that

have been committed in Ukraine. Ukrainians are collecting all the evidence. They have set up their own commissions. As you know, the American president has called for the creation of some sort of a truth commission. You know, we will but eventually get the true picture of Russian atrocity. But it will probably have to be after Vladimir Putin dies.

FOSTER: Taras, so sorry to hear about your family there in Mariupol. How did they survive so long there? How were they living?

BEREZOVETS: They were spending all their time -- a month. A month. They spent a month in shelter. And lucky enough they have some small stream of fresh water. They survived but many people from surrounding areas, they came to their bomb shelter to get the fresh water and because of Russian bombing, several people have been killed, including neighbors. Neighbors of my mother-in-law, she said they just came out to find out some bread and some food and they both have been killed by Russian bombs.

And the pictures which she describes to me were so horrible. Kids killed by Russian bombs because the kids, the families, they're all trying to escape the city. And they were killed in private cars. Killed just on the road.

[04:15:00]

Some people captured by Russians and Kadyrovite Chechens fighters. Like president Zelenskyy said, yesterday we would see hundreds, probably hundreds or even thousands of Ukrainians killed in Mariupol. Nobody knows how many civilians have been killed in there, but these pictures, you know, these people who escaped from Mariupol, they need assistance from medics, from doctors especially, psychiatrists because this makes some people, they go mad.

ZALMAYEV: Max, let me just add that whatever we've seen in Bucha, obviously, that's -- any sort of charges of genocide will have to be backed up by a very, very thorough investigation. But the Russians have already helped with the investigation. Two days after Bucha RIA Novosti, a major Russian outlet, has published a piece according to which, you know, Ukraine must be (INAUDIBLE). Ukrainians, all Ukrainians have been declared enemies of Russia and have to be cleansed. I'm quoting quite verbatim from that document. We already have the practical, you know, and the theoretical. What we are seeing is very much, I think, genocidal. Once again, it has to be proved, but we already have plenty of evidence.

FOSTER: Yes, and the Americans saying the evidence isn't there yet but as you say, it's so important to gather that evidence right now as the Russians pull out of those areas. Peter Zalmayev and Taras Berezovets, thank you very much indeed for joining us. And our thoughts with both of your families.

President Vladimir Putin is meeting with his Belarusian counterpart Alexander Lukashenko. Mr. Lukashenko has been an ally of Mr. Putin throughout Russia's war on Ukraine. Meanwhile Russia's chancellor -- sorry, meanwhile Austria's chancellor says his meeting with Vladimir Putin on Monday was very direct, open and tough. Karl Nehammer is the first European leader to meet face to face with Vladimir Putin since the war began. Nehammer says he addressed the alleged war crimes in Bucha and other places with the Russian President but says Mr. Putin blames the Ukrainians for those crimes.

Japan is freezing the assets of nearly 400 Russian citizens including President Vladimir Putin's two adult daughters. The new sanctions also target the wife and daughter of Russia's Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov.

Meanwhile, Ukraine's president is calling for an embargo on Russian oil as the European Union weighs additional sanctions against Moscow. Volodymyr Zelenskyy says anything less will be met by Moscow with laughter. For more on all of this CNN's Clare Sebastian joins me live here in London. What does he mean there by being treated with laughter? This is an idea that the Russians keep fobbing off the idea that the sanctions are having any effect.

CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right. Putin completely disconnects the whole idea of sanctions from any discussion of what he calls the a special military operation in Ukraine. But this Zelenskyy pushing as hard as he can for Europe to act. Because he believes and has believed for a long time, certainly if you listen to what he says, that really the only way to hit Russia is hit them where it hurts in terms of exports, and that's oil and gas. Oil actually is even bigger in terms of revenues for Russia. It's 2 to 3 times what Russia makes from gas it makes from oil.

So, while it's easier in theory for Europe to disconnect from Russian oil, it would hit Russia the hardest. So, this would be very, very impactful. But look, EU foreign affairs ministers met yesterday. They're meeting again today. You see them arriving this hour. They are supposedly talking about a fixed package of sanctions that could include oil. But as of right now they seem to be divided. Some of them are saying, yes, you know, we think we can do this, we'll do whatever we can. Others like Hungary have come right out and said, it's not possible for us. We just can't do it.

FOSTER: In terms of how they might respond then, there's going to be some compromise presumably. They can't come out of that meeting without some sort of result because there is a direct correlation between the money the Russians are making from oil. I mean, indirectly Europe is still paying for this war.

SEBASTIAN: Yes, I mean, Josep Borrell, the EU's top diplomat said it himself just last week. We've paid 35 billion euros to Russia since the start of the conflict. That's 1 billion euros a day, about $38 billion. They are financing this war. So look, you're right. They're sort of under a lot of pressure now to do something. So, I think there are compromises on the table. The likes of something like maybe a phased in approach. We saw that with (INAUDIBLE) going to take until August to do that. I suspect with oil it could be even longer, perhaps even tariffs or something else that supportively being discussed.

But I think given what we're seeing in Ukraine, given the fact that there are the atrocities that we've seen in places like Bucha and Borodyanka for the fifth package of sanctions now that we've seen in Kramatorsk, could have a potential offensive that was ramping up in the east, they are under pressure to do something. So, there's going to be a race to find consensus.

FOSTER: Back to you when we get some results from those meetings. Clare, thank you very much indeed.

[04:20:00]

Now White House officials says there was a candid exchange of views about India's neutral stance of Mr. Putin's war. At a virtual meeting on Monday between President Joe Biden and Prime Minister Narendra Modi, India's neutrality has caused increasing concern in Washington. But Mr. Biden didn't specifically ask the Indian leader to take a side. At a separate event America's top diplomat Antony Blinken pressed India and other countries to use their leverage with Russia to end the war. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTONY BLINKEN, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: India has to make its own decisions about how it approaches this challenge. We as a general proposition are consulting with all of our allies and partners on the consequences of Putin's war, the atrocities being committed against the people of Ukraine. In our judgment it is important that all countries, especially those with leverage, press Putin to end the war.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: CNN's Vedika Sud is following this story from New Delhi. How is all of this being covered in the Indian media then? Because it is very stark the way that Modi hasn't come out against the war, against Russia specifically.

VEDIKA SUD, CNN REPORTER: Right, Max. But that has been India's stand from the very beginning of this war, Russia's aggression in Ukraine. So, there's really been no change in stand and I don't anticipate one in the coming days. And that's essentially something the even the U.S. understands and that's something that I think Blinken also mentioned during a press conference, force to question ministerial dialogue on Monday where he said that we do understand the relationship with Russia and India share. And of course, Russia's there for India even when the U.S. was not.

So, they do understand the implications of putting that pressure on India to go ahead and withdraw and cease oil imports from Russia. In this question was in fact very interestingly put too, India's External Affairs Minister Sushma Swaraj during the press conference, where he was asked by a reporter, are you aware of the possible sanctions that can imposed on India if you continue with the oil imports from Russia? And here is what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SUBRAHMANYAM JAISHANKAR, INDIAN EXTERNAL AFFAIRS MINISTER: If we are looking at energy from Russia, I would suggest that your attentions should be focused on Europe. Which probably we do buy some energy, which is necessary for our energy security. But I suspect looking at the figures, probably our total purchases for the month would be less than what Europe does in an afternoon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SUD: Max, India has abstained from voting against Russia at the U.N. in successive voting resolutions. Because it shares those historic ties with Russia. For now, America understands that no sanctions can be imposed on India since there is no ban on importing oil from Russia. And they also understand their limitations when it comes to letting India know that they should cut oil imports with Russia but as of now they know Europe's importing a lot more -- Max.

Vedika Sud, it's true. Thank you very much indeed for joining us from New Delhi.

We're tracking a new round of severe weather across the U.S. meanwhile, including a barrage of hail and the threat of tornadoes for parts of the country. Our meteorologist Pedram Javaheri has the forecast for you.

PEDRAM JAVAHERI, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes, Max. You know, when you take a look at this fourth consecutive week where another multi-day severe weather outbreak ahead of us. We're going to follow this and the latest here coming up in a few minutes.

[04:25:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

FOSTER: Just a few hours away from the latest inflation report from the U.S. government. Economists predict prices surge by 8.4 percent versus last March. If that's accurate, it would be the highest inflation in the U.S. since January 1982. New survey by the Federal Reserve Bank of New York shows Americans expect prices to stay high over the next year. More households report being financially worse off than a year ago. And respondents say they're more pessimistic than their future finances.

Worries about slow economic growth are bringing down oil prices. The cost of a barrel of U.S. crude dropped 4 percent on Monday, to its lowest level since Russia invaded the Ukraine. The U.S. and its allies are releasing vast amounts of oil from emergency reserves and that's eased concerns about supplies out of Russia which is the world's largest oil exporter.

Now JetBlue airways will be cutting as much as 10 percent of its scheduled summer flights starting next month in spite of heavy demand. It blames a shortage of pilots and crew which is affecting other airlines as well. JetBlue says it's hired more than 3,000 new crew members this year to help address that shortage.

Now take a look at this. Golf ball size hail smashing into a pool in Arkansas. There were more than two dozen hail reports in Arkansas and Oklahoma on Monday. Along with the hail, a large, destructive and extremely dangerous tornado hit near Little Rock late on Monday. As part of a severe storm system lashing the U.S. South and Central Plains. Look at that. Meteorologist Pedram Javaheri joins me now with what to expect in the coming hours -- incredible scenes.

JAVAHERI: It really is. You know, anytime you see scenes like this play out a kind of speaks to the severity of what we have ahead of us here. And as you noted, that's golf ball sized hail. We have reports of even larger hailstones approaching baseball size hail in diameter. So, incredible stuff here. And you'll notice, a handful tornadoes, a handful of destructive when reports for the past 24 hours. But those vast majority of these storm reports coming in as far as those large hail reports centered across this region of Arkansas. And that's where we saw the baseball size hail storms in diameter in Mayflower, Arkansas. Had a report of a tornado across this community as well.

And this is the sort of setup here that spawned these sort of storms that will see over the next couple of days and pretty expansive coverage of severe weather for Tuesday afternoon. Especially once we get to 1, 2, 3 in the afternoon, you get sort of that daytime heating, it destabilizes the atmosphere. Some of these storms will once again produce large hail, damaging winds and few strong tornadoes. That's the threat here for Tuesday that encompasses at least 16 million Americans. And the concern is, once we transition into Wednesday, the area expands quite a bit more.