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Johnny Depp Faces Cross-Examination in Defamation Suit Against Ex-Wife; Russian Troops Loot, Vandalize Homes Across Ukraine; U.S. Supreme Court Issues Rulings on Significant Cases. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired April 21, 2022 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PHILIPPE ETIENNE, FRENCH AMBASSADOR TO THE UNITED STATES: Indeed, as far as France is concerned, we had the E.U. leaders coming, both Ursula von der Leyen, for the president of European parliament and the president of the European Commission, and recently the president of the European Council.

[10:30:13]

Our president is now running for reelection and we have the second round of the election next Sunday, but when he was asked, he said he was ready if it can be useful. And our president is in a very, very close contact with Volodymyr Zelenskyy. As you know, they have a very close relation. I remember wherein Paris, when President Volodymyr Zelenskyy for the first time, he was not even president, it was but before the election and France was the first country hosting Volodymyr Zelenskyy.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN NEWSROOM: President Macron has had ongoing contact in recent weeks and months and years, really, with Russian President Vladimir Putin. Does that diplomatic contact continue?

ETIENNE: We have seen this contact taking place some time ago. First, there was this visit in Moscow before the war. Our president was in Kyiv, in Moscow. He did, really, everything he could to propose together with our allies, together with the United States and other European countries, a solution, a political settlement.

And then, indeed, he had a number of conversations with the Russian president, not in the last time, but after the war broke out, it continued, like Olaf Scholz, the German chancellor, like the Israeli prime minister, like the Turkish president, but always, as far as we are concerned, in very close coordination with Volodymyr Zelenskyy, because there was no contact between because the Russian president has refused all the time to talk to President Zelenskyy. So, we have always had these conversations, which didn't take place in the last times, but until some two weeks ago, I think, there was this conversation always in close contact with Volodymyr Zelenskyy when our president talked to Putin.

SCIUTTO: But as you watch every day, civilians being slaughtered in this country as part, it seems, of the Russian war plan, cities leveled. These are visions of World War II. Is Europe moving too slowly to stop doing business with Russia to such a degree?

ETIENNE: We didn't move slowly because the sanctions we have taken at the very beginning of the war, so quickly, it never happened and in full coordination with others, like the United States and Canada, we had never been so quick and so far, especially crippling the banking system, freezing assets of the Russian central bank.

But on the other end, we see what happens with those war crimes. This is also the reason why we have sent our own investigators to help Ukraine and the Ukrainian justice, including forensic experts. And you're right, we have to increase price in which the Russians and the Russian leadership and the Russian economy have to pay for what's happening in Ukraine.

So, I think both point of views are correct but we must not underestimate already what we have done but we must increase, we must continue to increase both the support, including military support to Ukraine, humanitarian support, economic support right now discussed in Washington. We see IMF and World Bank meetings, and also, of course, increase the price paid by Russia for this war.

SCIUTTO: Mr. Ambassador, thanks so much for joining us this morning.

ETIENNE: Thank you, Jim.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN NEWSROOM: And our thanks to Jim.

Still ahead, a live look inside the Fairfax, Virginia, courtroom where attorneys for Amber Heard are cross-examining her ex-husband, Johnny Depp. We'll have the latest after the break.

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[10:35:00]

GOLODRYGA: Well, right now, Actor Johnny Depp is facing cross- examination in his $50 million defamation lawsuit against his ex-wife, Amber Heard. We heard emotional testimony over the past two days from Depp outlining details of his volatile relationship with her. He accused her of both verbal and sometimes physical abuse.

So, here to discuss is Criminal Defense Attorney Sara Azari. Sara, great to have you on.

Listen, this is a really disturbing case and I'm sure viewers would agree with me that when you hear about some of the details even through his testimony, it just makes you really uncomfortable. I'm just curious to get your thoughts on how you think the jury is taking all of this in.

SARA AZARI, L.A. CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Bianna, good to be with you. Domestic violence is uncomfortable, whether it's a man or a woman who suffered the abuse. But what we're seeing here is that, number one, we've seen a Johnny Depp that we didn't know before, someone who comes from a cycle of abuse, someone who comes from a chaotic household, a history of substance abuse, someone who is extremely vulnerable, and, therefore, likable to this jury. And I think that's very important, not just for the substance of this testimony but the form and his disposition on the stand.

The other issue is that this is so much bigger than whether he's going to prevail or not in this lawsuit. It's about him speaking his truth, something that we don't typically see with a high profile celebrity who's been going after somebody for defamation.

[10:40:05]

They don't do that. They don't do that for a lot of reasons because their P.R. steps in and also because there's a high standard that they have to show actual malice.

So, this is really new, so to speak. But he has been relatable, he's been vulnerable, and he's been, in my opinion, very credible. So, as uncomfortable as the topic is, I think we're starting to see that men too can be victims. You see this all over Twitter, the #mentoo, that it sounds like she was instigating and starting some of these altercations.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. But this wasn't his first lawsuit allegations of libel. The last one was in 2020 against a publication which accused him of domestic violence as well. He lost that case. You say this one is different.

AZARI: Yes. This one is different because we're in U.S. territory now. U.S. law, 12 jurors, not just one judge, different set of process, different set of laws, that he has to show actual malice here. He didn't there. There's no First Amendment there. There's First Amendment here.

But these are all distinctions, Bianna, without really a difference. What really matters is that he believes so firmly in his truth, which may or may not be the truth to the jury, that he has come forward not once but twice. So, that, to me, speaks volumes to how strongly he believes that he's innocent of these allegations.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. He's claimed that it has cost him his career. I know we'll be hearing from witnesses in the days and weeks ahead, however long this trial continues.

Sara Azari, thank you.

AZARI: Thanks, Bianna. GOLODRYGA: Well, still ahead, at what point would you hand over the coordinates to your home and then ask the military to bomb it? Well, we speak with a Ukrainian who faced that very situation.

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[10:45:00]

GOLODRYGA: While millions of Ukrainians have been forced to flee their homes over the last two months, some have since returned to find their homes reduced to rubble while others have found their homes trashed, vandalized and looted by Russian troops.

A prominent Ukrainian businessman recently directed the military to bomb his house just outside of Kyiv after Russian troops occupied the property and used it to fire high-powered weapons toward the capital city. And that homeowner, Andrey Stavnitser, joins me now.

Andrey, as I said in the break to you, we've heard so many stories, horrific stories that Ukrainians have had to experience over the last two months. Yours is a unique one though. You had left your new beautifully built home outside of Kyiv and had dismantled all of the cameras in the house except for one. Talk about what happened when then you saw 12 Russian military vehicles and troops take over your house.

ANDREY STAVNITSER, UKRAINIAN ENTREPENEUR: Good morning, Bianna. It's great to talk to you. Well, basically, on the 5th of March, I saw in my webcam that Russian military is pulling on my territory and a lot of soldiers are inside my house actually. And my security person who was in the house, I had no contact with him, so he was offline. As soon as I realized that he's in safety, I asked the Ukrainian military, I told them what I saw on the webcam and I told them about my house, my coordinates. And after some time, apparently, they have kicked him out and crushed those army vehicles.

We had 12 different vehicles on the ground, including rocket launchers, Tornados, Grads, et cetera, and these guys were shooting Kyiv from my house, basically from my premises.

GOLODRYGA: How long was it from the point where you reached out to the Ukrainian military and told them and gave them permission and the coordinates of your house and told them to bomb it to the actual bombing?

STAVNITSER: Unfortunately, I'm not able to answer this question. The army doesn't report to me yet, but it happened after a couple of days. So, they've probably done some reconnaissance and some ground footage, and after that, they've done direct shots at the military vehicles.

GOLODRYGA: Well, we saw the aftermath there of that bombing. I know that you had mentioned some of your own security team have stayed behind and you had been concerned about their safety. They had been let go by the Russian troops there into the wooded area surrounding your house. Are they all okay now? STAVNITSER: Yes, they are okay now but they had very difficult time. They were undressed, interrogated, their phones were destroyed. They were looking for some Nazi evidence, whatever. They should probably look in their phones for Nazi evidence, I guess. But after almost two days of working in the woods, my security came to safety and this is when we contacted the Ukrainian military.

GOLODRYGA: Well, Andrey, I know that your mission now is not just to rebuild your homes, you said walls are easy to put up, but it's to rebuild your country. What are some of the things you and your organization are doing in trying to get more aid into the besieged country as we're seeing so many people fleeing their homes?

STAVNITSER: Yes, we are trying to help our people with humanitarian cargos. We're trying to help our heroic and I think strongest army on the continent, the Ukrainian army.

[10:50:01]

We're getting as much supplies to the civilians and to the military people.

Basically, what we do is we try to fundraise and get as much humanitarian aid into Ukraine, also get the big humanitarian organizations to finally start delivering goods into the country. There are so many internally displaced people, there are so many people under siege, under attack and it's -- this is what a help Ukraine's center is basically doing on a daily basis.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. I know you traveled to the U.S. to help fundraise as well.

And as we conclude this conversation, I just want to quote from a piece that you wrote in the Atlantic Council. You said it's high time to take this personally. This war is no longer a Ukrainian crisis. It threatens the world order. It's time to save our world together.

Andrey, thank you so much for joining us and for all that you're doing there on a humanitarian effort to help those people in your country, best of luck.

STAVNITSER: Thank you, Bianna. Thank you. Stay safe.

GOLODRYGA: Thank you.

STAVNITSER: Bye.

GOLODRYGA: Well, up next, the U.S. Supreme Court just issued rulings on some significant cases. We'll tell you what they are. Stay with us.

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GOLODRYGA: We're following breaking news out of Washington right now, where we've learned that the U.S. Supreme Court justices have just issued rulings on some high profile cases. CNN's Jessica Schneider joins me now. Jessica, the high court has just ruled that U.S. citizens living in Puerto Rico can be excluded from some federal disability benefits. What more can you tell us?

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's exactly right. The Supreme Court issuing actually five decisions today, Bianna, not the big ones we might be expecting in the weeks to come on abortion and gun rights but still significant, nonetheless.

And the one you're referring to basically goes against a U.S. citizen who is living in Puerto Rico. That citizen sued because he wasn't able to get a type of social security benefit called supplemental security insurance.

And the court here is saying, it is within the right of Congress to exclude Puerto Rican residents from receiving this type of benefit. They say that Puerto Rican residents are treated differently in many aspects by Congress, including the fact that they don't pay many federal taxes, including a federal income tax.

So, Congress is within its right to exclude these citizens who won't be getting this benefit and they haven't, Bianna?

GOLODRYGA: And another ruling from the court on a rare case involving the return of a painting that had been confiscated by Nazis during the Holocaust.

[10:55:04]

What more are we learning about that?

SCHNEIDER: Yes. This is an interesting case. This is actually a Supreme Court ruling, a unanimous ruling, that's benefiting this family who's trying to actually get the return of a painting that was confiscated by the Nazis in 1939 from their great grandmother. As a technical case here, the Supreme Court ruling in favor of the family, saying that they'll be able to apply California law instead of a foreign law in working to get this confiscated painting back.

But still an extremely interesting case back from 1939 when this painting was confiscated, this family is now moving forward to get the return of this painting, and now they'll be doing it under the more favorable California law, Bianna, instead of the foreign law that was being argued should apply.

GOLODRYGA: So much needed closure for that family. Jessica Schneider, thank you.

Well, Russian opposition leader and fierce Putin critic Alexei Navalny has been in jail for more than a year. The story of how he ended up there after surviving an alleged murder attempt and then tracking down his own would-be assassins is told in the fantastic new CNN film, Navalny.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALEXEI NAVALNY, RUSSIAN OPPOSITION LEADER: You know that (INAUDIBLE) called it Moscow Four? What is Moscow Four?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. What is that?

NAVALNY: Well, the email of the very tall brass (ph) guy from intelligence was hacked several times. And his first password or Moscow One, and they hacked him. So his second pass code was Moscow Two and they hacked him as well, so the third time, he had password Moscow Three. And just guess what was his fourth password. So, Moscow Four is the explanation of the stupidity of the system.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GOLODRYGA: CNN Senior International Correspondent Matthew Chance joins me now.

And, Matt, I'm so glad we showed that clip because this speaks to this narrative that we've heard so much about Putin being a master strategist, right, and his relationship, clear obsession with Navalny, all these years now have elevated Navalny to be an international hero in ways that had not have been perhaps we wouldn't be hearing about him right now. Talk about it.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You're right. I mean, the fact that Alexei Navalny is kind of like, well, he was a normal guy, a normal Russian citizen that just chose to voice his opposition to the regime and to identify areas of corruption that transformed him into this incredibly powerful politician, has, and the crackdown on him as well, the targeting of him, the poisoning of him, they tried to kill him, for heaven's sake, that has transformed him into this kind of icon of international resistance and criticism of the Kremlin in its current form.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. You've been covering for years. Vladimir Putin still won't say his name, right? He calls him that blogger or many other things but still will not say Alexei Navalny. He's now serving an additional nine years, right, in a maximum security prison. What is his status now, especially in the midst of war amongst the Russian population there?

CHANCE: That's a difficult question to answer because it was difficult even before the war. And, of course, now, there is this horrific conflict in Ukraine. There's a temptation to think that the horrors that we're witnessing there have overshadowed the relevance of Alexei Navalny.

But I think that's the case at all. I mean, first of all, the experience Alexei Navalny had, the ruthlessness that he suffered at the hands of the Kremlin, the corruption, the bad practice that he identified, really very much foreshadowed the kind of ruthlessness and bad tactics and incompetence, perhaps in some ways, as he was saying there, that we're seeing on the battlefield in Ukraine as well, which is why Russian forces are encountering such heavy losses.

It's also important to remember that, you know, Russia is not a monolithic group. Russians are not a monolithic group of people. And even before this conflict, there are many people, perhaps millions of Russians that stood against what Vladimir Putin stands for, they're opposed to him and they're willing to speak up about that as well, and Navalny, of course, Alexei Navalny, is the figurehead these day in that group.

GOLODRYGA: He really mastered social media. And what's fascinating is to see him still active through his supporters, right, and his colleagues there continuing to tweet out, continuing to do investigative work. I'll never forget one Russian reporter told me that, Bianna, it's not that everyone in Russia supports him when they came out to protest he was arrested, we want the option to vote against him legally. And what we're seeing happen by his detention, his poisoning, that's what we're not standing for. It's fascinating.

Great to have you on set finally, nice to meet in person, Matthew.

And be sure to tune in to the all new CNN film, Navalny. That's premiering Sunday at 9:00 P.M. Eastern right here on CNN.

And thank you so much for joining us today.

[11:00:01]

I'm Bianna Golodryga.

At This Hour with Kate Bolduan starts right now.