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Ukrainian Intelligence Says Russia Plans To Conscript Ukrainian Civilians From Occupied Regions; Ukraine Denies Mariupol Has Fallen; Putin Claims City Was Liberated; Ukraine Warns Of Potential Russian Attacks During Easter Services; Two Russian Tycoons & Their Families Found Dead Within Days; U.N. Human Rights Office Documents 50 "Unlawful" Killings In Bucha; Mother, Three Children Escape Bucha And Reunite With Father In Spain. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired April 23, 2022 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

OLEKSANDR MARKUSHYN, MAYOR OF IRPIN, UKRAINE (through translator): And as a result of this battle, the city is 50 percent destroyed, but we are building up our defenses.

We were victorious over the second largest army in the world. We stopped their advance, and we will continue defending it, and I am sure that with our military on our land, we will be victorious.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Mayor, thanks very much for joining us.

MARKUSHYN (through translator): Thank you.

[18:00:26]

SCIUTTO: Good evening to you. I'm Jim Sciutto reporting live from Lviv, in Western Ukraine. I want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world. This is a Special Edition of CNN NEWSROOM.

The breaking news tonight, President Zelenskyy says that U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken and Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin are expected in the capital, Kyiv, Sunday. It is already 1:00 AM here in Ukraine, that would be today. It's a highly anticipated high-level visit to a country at war, but normally be kept secret deliberately until after arrival.

The public announcement in advance sure to have surprised the State and Defense Department security details. This visit, if it comes to be, comes as Russia's violence in this country, its targeting of civilians intensifies.

Today, it is Orthodox Easter Sunday in Ukraine, but a curfew is in effect across several regions. Officials warning of increased attacks during holiday celebrations and tonight, according to a U.K. military Intelligence report, Ukraine, now accusing Russia of planning to conscript Ukrainian civilians from the occupied Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions, that is force civilians captured here to fight for the Russian Army.

Several areas have been hit by Russian forces just over the past 24 hours including in Odessa, and in that attack, at least eight people are dead. Several others injured. It was another civilian target there, residential buildings, as well as a military facility nearby.

All this as Ukraine continues to fight back. Officials say Ukrainian forces struck a Russian command post in Kherson, killing at least two Russian Generals. The death toll among Russian senior officers has been large since the start of this invasion.

We begin tonight with CNN international correspondent, Matt Rivers. He is in the capital, Kyiv.

Matt, President Zelenskyy spoke very openly about what he wants to come out of this meeting with U.S. officials chiding them, you might say to come with more weapons. What else did he say tonight?

MATT RIVERS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, you know, it was interesting, Jim, he actually openly talked about the fact that he knows that he can be quote, "insolent" with other world leaders basically saying: Look, now's not the time for niceties. I know that perhaps they get annoyed with me when I constantly call for more weapons in a public way like this.

But he said basically, look, my people are fighting and dying. This is what we need. And so that is what we can expect from this meeting that he will have tomorrow, according to Zelenskyy himself, with Secretary of State Antony Blinken and Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin when they come here to Kyiv.

He specifically said that he will be asking for a specific list of weapons, much of which he has already outlined publicly. He said he'll bring those lists of weapons directly to those men. And when asked, why is it important for world leaders to come here to Kyiv, this is what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Why is it important for leaders to come to us? I will give you a pragmatic answer: Because they should not come here with empty hands now. We're waiting not for just presents or cakes, we are expecting specific things and specific weapons.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RIVERS: Now, of course, the Secretary of State and the Secretary of Defense, the latest in a long list of foreign leaders that have come here to Kyiv, we've seen lots of leaders of different Presidents or leaders of different countries rather from Europe. We have seen U.K. Prime Minister Boris Johnson come here recently. So this would be the highest level, really the only senior delegation from the United States to come here since the war began.

And it comes at a crucial time, Jim, as you laid out at the top of the show, the war has ramped up in the east. We saw missile strikes in the city of Odessa today killing eight people. Zelenskyy actually getting emotional when he talked about a three-month-old that was killed according to the Ukrainian government in that strike -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: Yes, this visit if it happens, it would follow the visits of more than a dozen other heads of state.

Matt Rivers, thanks so much.

Joining us now to discuss, retired Lieutenant General Mark Hertling, he is former Commanding General of the Europe -- Army Forces in Europe and Seventh Army.

Lieutenant General Hertling, you know how well details of high-level visits are protected, held secure as they come to warzones never revealed until they show up there.

If you were advising the Secretary of Defense now on this trip now that it is out there, would you tell him to keep his appointment in Kyiv?

[18:05:03]

LT. GEN. MARK HERTLING (RET), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: I would, Jim. Certainly it was a surprise that President Zelenskyy announced it. It certainly blows a little bit of the security, but I don't think the Secretary of State or the Secretary of Defense were all that much concerned about that. They've probably made great preparations.

This is an important meeting, though, especially for Secretary Austin. We don't know what Secretary Blinken is going to do regarding the U.S. Embassy in Kyiv and whether or not it will reopen, but the important point is, you've got a former four-star General who knows a lot about combat, who knows a lot about various weapons systems, who knows NATO very well, not only talking to a President truthfully, who doesn't, who doesn't understand the implications of different weapons systems, and what he may be asking for, in terms of the art of the possible.

But Secretary Austin is then going to go on Monday, I believe, to Brussels, and he is going to be able to have a face-to-face with all the ministers of the various Defense agencies within NATO. He will be able to translate the President's words to all of them face-to-face.

So this face-to-face meeting, in my view, is critically important not only for Secretary Austin to have the meeting with President Zelenskyy, but for what occurs afterwards in Brussels.

SCIUTTO: Okay, President Zelenskyy, he has wanted this meeting, but he also wants something to come with the meeting. He said it very openly tonight, don't come empty handed.

You and I have spoken about the acceleration of U.S. weapons supplies, coming in here with a focus on heavy artillery for that war in the east, what's missing?

HERTLING: Well, what is missing right now is more heavy artillery and a lot of rounds. But also the ability in my view for the Ukrainian army, and their supply system to get those weapons from the border of NATO into the hands of the people that need them the most. The fight in the Donbas is going to be very important. It's over -- as

we've talked so many times before, Jim, it's over a 300-mile front. What you're talking about is a push system of supply.

How do you get the weapons? How do you get the munitions and the other things to the right place at the right time? You know, Russia has done some interesting things in terms of their maneuver, but they are not very good in terms of their combined arms activity.

So what's on the Ukrainians is to find where Russia is going to break through, counter them very quickly, that's going to be driven by intelligence and targeting, and make sure that they have not only the weapon systems there, but the caches of munitions in order to use against the Russian advance.

SCIUTTO: Yes, the most recent weapons shipment, 170,000 rounds for those Howitzers. We were just showing pictures of them there. But before we go, the latest news this evening from a U.K. Intelligence report is that Ukrainians are accusing Russia of intending to conscript civilians who have been evacuated from some of these cities here, conscript them into the Russian Army.

I mean, this is -- it is again, practically out of a novel or a newsreel from World War Two. Have you ever heard anything like that? Do you expect the Russians to follow through on something like that?

HERTLING: I do, Jim, because they've done it before. You know, you mentioned earlier this is going to be in Zaporizhzhia and Kherson and possibly other places. The Russians have used this technique in Luhansk and Donetsk in the past.

It is, in and of itself a war crime to take prisoners of war or local conscripts and put them to use fighting for you. It's against all the rules of land warfare. Russia has been known to do it in the past, not only here, but in other places. And certainly, you know, will they do it? Yes, it is -- once again, the audio, they're saying what they're going to do is matching the video we have already seen them do it.

There is no surprise in any of this to me.

SCIUTTO: Yes, it's a great point. Listen to what they say. They say it out loud. Lieutenant General Mark Hertling, thanks so much.

HERTLING: Pleasure, Jim. Thanks.

SCIUTTO: In Mariupol, where the situation is just devastating and inhuman, the evacuation of some 200 civilians thwarted, stopped by the Russian military, something we've seen in a number of cities as officials have attempted to establish these humanitarian corridors.

And now, Ukraine, as we were mentioning there says that some of them are being deported to a far east region in Russia.

CNN's Scott McLean was in Mariupol.

So Scott, give us a sense of what the situation is like there. SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Jim, the situation in Mariupol surely

cannot get much worse, but lately, it isn't getting any better either.

Civilians remain trapped in the city by the tens of thousands. Ukrainian officials say that a humanitarian corridor failed to evacuate people to Ukrainian-held parts of the country and the civilians taking shelter under that sprawling steel plant.

[18:10:11]

MCLEAN: Well, they are no closer to safety either.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MCLEAN (voice over): Satellite images and aerial footage has long shown the scale of the destruction in Mariupol. It is difficult to know the full human cost of the siege, but now, there are new potential clues.

New satellite pictures of a cemetery east of Mariupol appear to show freshly dug trenches some 40 meters long. The Mariupol Mayor's office says that these are mass graves, CNN cannot independently verify the claim.

What is not unclear is the dire humanitarian situation inside the city. A new video from the Ukrainian military shows women and children taking shelter underneath the steel plant where Ukrainian troops are making their last stand.

Inside, the Russian word for "children" is spray painted on the walls. A Ukrainian soldier says he's bringing gifts, candy, and some food. The kids explain how they've passed the time. Many of the women and children are the families of plant workers here, many have been there for 50 days or more.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): I want to get out of here and see the sun. We've been here for two months now and I want to see the sun because they switch the lights on and off here. When they rebuild our houses, we can live in peace.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): We all really want to return home we want to return home alive. We all want to see our parents and families.

MCLEAN (voice over): There is little hope those wishes will come true anytime soon. Russian troops have surrounded the complex waiting for Ukrainian soldiers to surrender as food supplies dwindle.

For the rest of Mariupol, a humanitarian corridor opened leading west through Russian-held territory to Ukrainian-held Zaporizhzhia, though the Mariupol Mayor's office says that Russians tricked people into boarding buses bound for Dokuchaevsk, a town in Russian-occupied territory.

CNN could not immediately verify the progress of evacuation efforts in the city. In a press conference in a Kyiv underground station, President

Zelenskyy proposed to trade with Russia in exchange for Ukrainian civilians trapped in Mariupol.

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): We offer civilized people, we suggest humanitarian solution to the situation. We offer exchange of civilians. We offer exchange of the wounded.

MCLEAN (voice over): Zelenskyy said he is willing to meet with Putin, but promised peace talks would be abandoned if Ukrainians in Mariupol are killed.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MCLEAN (on camera): Zelenskyy also said that talks would stop if Russia held sham independence referendums in Russian occupied parts of Ukraine.

Beyond that those potential negotiations in person between Zelenskyy and Putin, well, the Ukrainian President say they depend on Putin's willingness to participate -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: Scott McLean in Lviv, thanks so much.

Still to come this hour, as Ukrainians wake up every day to heavy shelling, Russian violence against civilians, their faith is still a safe place.

We speak to an Archbishop to Ukrainian Catholics here in the U.S. about what this Easter Sunday is like in war-torn Ukraine.

Plus, not just one, but two suspicious deaths of Russian oligarchs in the past week. These tycoons, we see there, and their families found dead. What are the investigations finding?

And later, they escaped Bucha just in time. Now, they are safely away, but they're seeing the horrors, hearing the stories of the hell they left behind. How one family from Bucha is managing now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): We can see photos and on the internet of places we know, a lake with benches, a park where we used to take walks and now, there is a mass grave there.

It's really horrible to see.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:18:12

SCIUTTO: Right now, Ukrainian officials say the fight for Eastern Ukraine is accelerating. At the same time, as many Ukrainians are trying to celebrate the Easter holiday here, they celebrate it this week in the Orthodox Church.

At least eight people are dead following missile strikes in Odessa. Officials say the youngest victim there was just three months old.

Constant bombardment has been a way of life for many left in Ukraine's battered cities with civilians as the deliberate targets of Russian attacks.

CNN senior international correspondent, Ben Wedeman, he's been there. He takes us to the basement of a bombed out theater where people are finding shelter and praying for salvation.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): And it begins -- again.

Hell rains down, a dozen people are hiding in the basement of a bombed out theater in the town of Rubizhne.

(UNIDENTIFIED MALE speaking in foreign language.)

WEDEMAN (voice over): "Let it stop, Oh Lord," he says. Now, there is incoming.

A white flag hangs outside to no effect. The theater above has been bombed and bombed again and again. Yet, they stay.

Too poor, too old, too frightened to flee.

(NINA speaking in foreign language.)

WEDEMAN (voice over): Nina, 89 years old has been here for five weeks.

(NINA speaking in foreign language.)

WEDEMAN (voice over): "I want to go home," she says. "I've suffered too much. I've seen the fire and the smoke. I've seen it all, I'm scared." Nina's plea, simple.

(NINA speaking in foreign language.)

WEDEMAN (voice over): "Help us, help us." Her daughter, Liudmyla struggles to comfort her.

(LIUDMYLA speaking in foreign language.)

WEDEMAN (voice over): "We're praying to God to stop it," she says. "To hear us."

[18:20:10]

(INA speaking in foreign language.)

WEDEMAN (voice over): Ina says, "I have nowhere to go. I have no friends, no relatives." With the shelling intensifying, volunteers are finding it hard to

deliver food, as Russian and Ukrainian forces fight for control of Rubizhne, there are people down there, praying as hell rains down.

Ben Wedeman, CNN, Rubizhne, Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: As every day civilians, not just in the crossfire, but the targets of Russian fire. Joining us now Archbishop Metropolitan, Borys Gudziak. He is the highest ranking Ukrainian Catholic priest in the U.S. He is also President of the Ukrainian Catholic University, which happens to be very close to me here in Lviv. It is good to have you on, Archbishop. Thanks for joining us.

BORYS GUDZIAK, ARCHBISHOP METROPOLITAN, PRESIDENT OF THE UKRAINIAN CATHOLIC UNIVERSITY: Thank you for the service, you know, 14 of your colleagues have given their lives to bring the news to the world, and we're very grateful to all the journalists.

SCIUTTO: Thank you for saying that. Yes, a lot of journalists on the frontlines here. I want to ask you this because there's a quality of this war that has religion being weaponized. We see, for instance, on the Russian side, Russian Orthodox priests, egging the Russian invasion on even in the midst of all the suffering we're seeing.

Every war bring suffering, particularly suffering to this war, because civilians seem to be a target of this, not just the collateral damage of the war. As a priest when you see that, how do you react to that?

GUDZIAK: I think we all, as human beings, we too are human. We are devastated. But, you know, this is the story of the human race. Adam grabbed while God was giving; God gave Adam everything and said, don't take that fruit because you'll die if you take it, and what we're seeing is a mega grab.

Russia has 11 time zones, it is 28 times as big as Ukraine. And yet, the human being grabs for more and kills to do so. That's what Easter is all about. This week is full of this story -- death, life, friendship, betrayal, heroism, and you know, just the worst that the human being is capable of.

SCIUTTO: Well, you're right to cite, I've seen that through weeks of covering this war, that you have brutality, ruthlessness; you have courage, certainly. You also have enormous signs of generosity, for instance, the hospitality of neighboring countries who have taken in millions and millions of Ukrainians, just in the span of a few weeks.

You've been speaking to folks like that, folks who have escaped the war here, the lucky ones. Right? What do they say to you?

GUDZIAK: Well, you know, some of them are my relatives, and they're glad to be in safe places. They want to go home. These are not people who left by choice, they love to save their lives, and they do hope they will go home. And you know, the most inspiring conversations are with people in

Ukraine. I don't know, Jim, if you get this sense, but the people have resolve. They're in it for the long haul. They understand that this is freedom or death.

And Ukraine, we see it from the President, but the President is really a reflection of the whole population, it is Zelenskyy really that has made the country as it looks on the outside, but it's the people that have made Zelenskyy, and this is an epical battle of good against evil and the eyes of the world are riveted to it, because it is so evident.

SCIUTTO: Yes, it is, of course, past midnight here in Lviv. So it's Easter Sunday in the Orthodox Church.

How do you articulate a message about the reality of this war, which is clear before our eyes every day, but also some sort of hope? How do you articulate that? Of course, I know it fits with Easter message, right, a day to celebrate resurrection. How do you communicate that?

GUDZIAK: Well, one way is, you know, looking carefully at and in talking about the people in Ukraine, the greatest love -- Jesus says that the greatest love is when one gives one's life for one's friends. It's John 15:13.

[18:25:06]

GUDZIAK: We are seeing that greatest love manifested in different ways, whether it's the soldiers or journalists or volunteer workers, you know, the kitchen staff, the politicians -- people are together, and that will overcome.

You hear it from Ukrainians. You hear it from the President. There is a will and confidence in the fact that life will overcome, even in the middle of this devastation, and that is the message of the resurrection.

Now, it is coming in a strange, gruesome way. Russian soldiers are writing "Christ is Risen" on the artillery shells in this night. There are telephone conversations that have been intercepted, and we will see Patriarch Kirill deal who is egging on this war, proclaiming life in Christ today.

And, you know, there is a lot of paradox there's paradox in the church in the human race, but God's truth will prevail, and that's the story of this Easter.

SCIUTTO: Well, we'll be looking for those hopeful messages as best we can and try to chronicle the reality of the cruelty we're seeing as well.

Archbishop Borys Gudziak, thanks so much for joining us and we wish you a Happy Easter.

GUDZIAK: God bless you, Jim. We say "Khrystos Voskres," Christ is risen. Be safe and thank you again for the service that you're rendering. SCIUTTO: Thank you to your service.

Well, still ahead this hour, two Russian oligarchs and their families all found dead within days. What happened, the latest on investigations coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:30:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: The violent deaths this week of two Russian business tycoons and their families are raising hard questions. Russia state news agency says authorities are investigating the incidents as murder suicides, but is the timing of this just a coincidence? CNN's Brian Todd reports on the deaths that are some are calling suspicious.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Two unsettling cases, eerily similar, fueling more intrigue around the Putin regime tonight.

Within the span of 24 hours this week, two wealthy former Russian gas executives found dead with their families. On Monday Vladislav Avayev, his wife and daughter were found dead in Avayev's apartment in Moscow. Russia state news agency, TASS, citing a source in law enforcement says authorities are investigating the incident as a murder suicide.

The next day, Sergey Protosenya, his wife and daughter found dead at their home at a resort near Barcelona, Spain. A source close to the investigation tell CNN, Protosenya's wife and daughter were likely murdered inside the luxury home. Protosenya found dead in the garden outside.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL BROWDER, FINANCIER, PUTIN CRITIC: When Russian business people die, I think one kind of - has to assume the worst first.

PROF. LOUISE SHELLEY, GEORGE MASON UNIVERSITY: I think these deaths in my book are very suspicious, because they are so similar and they're both of prominent individuals who've made their money in the oil and gas sector.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TODD (voice over): If these were murder suicides, could these men have been under financial pressure from fallout over the Ukraine war?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BROWDER: We're in a very taut moment in Russia, money is scarce. All sorts of people are under a lot of pressure.

(END VIDEO CLIP) TODD (voice over): Few answers, but plenty of theories.

SHELLEY: There might be people in Russia connected to the security apparatus who don't like things that these individuals are doing. They could be patterns of retaliation against individuals who may be collaborating with foreign authorities or people in Russia that don't want certain information shared.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TODD (voice over): What's not clear tonight, whether Vladislav Avayev and Sergey Protosenya knew each other or communicated recently with each other. And the analysts we spoke to say it's not clear if either man had spoken out against Vladimir Putin or the war in Ukraine, could they have been targeted by Putin himself.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ELISABETH SCHIMPFOSSL, AUTHOR, "RICH RUSSIANS": It was almost something (inaudible) Putin to take measures against people of that low-ranking, it's not what he does, what he usually goes for is depict (inaudible) and only a very few of them in order to set a an example to the rest and tame them and bring them under control.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TODD (voice over): Still, some experts say if there was foul play, it wouldn't be the first time among Russian tycoons.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHELLEY: There's a pattern of suspicious deaths overseas. We're going to be seeing more pressures among the elite because there's a lot of suspicion and recriminations in Russia.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TODD (on camera): Professor Louise Shelley says there's another layer of suspicion to these cases. She says Spain where Sergey Protosenya died has among the highest numbers of Russian organized crime figures operating within its borders of any country, many of whom she says are tied to Russian oligarchs, Jim?

SCIUTTO: Brian Todd there. Still ahead, they escaped Bucha in the early days of Russia's attack on that suburb of Kyiv. Since then, we've only learned more about the unimaginable horror that follow. They're safe now, but they face the heartbreak of what they left behind and who they left behind. How one Ukrainian mother is helping her children and her family navigate the grief and move on and survive coming up.

[18:35:00]

Before we take a quick break, a quick preview, CNN's Sundance award winning film Navalny, you can watch the true story of the man who took on Putin, live to expose the truth tomorrow at 9 pm Eastern here on CNN.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VLADIMIR ALEXANDROVICH: Hello.

ALEXEI NAVALNY: Vladimir Alexandrovich, it's Alexei Navalny calling and I was hoping you could tell me why you wanted to kill me?

Hang up.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Remarkably, Vladimir Putin faces a legitimate opponent, Alexei Navalny.

NAVALNY: I don't want Putin being president.

I will end war.

If I want to be a leader of a country, I have to organize people.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Kremlin hates Navalny so much that they refused to say his name.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Passengers heard Navalny cry out in agony.

NAVALNY: Come on, poisoned? Seriously? We are creating the coalition to fight this regime.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you are killed what message do you leave behind to the Russian people?

NAVALNY: It's very simple. Never give up.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Navalny, tomorrow at 9 on CNN.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:40:50]

SCIUTTO: The number of civilians killed in this war is so hard, difficult to verify. But we know that many 10s of thousands have been deliberately targeted by Russia. The mayor Mariupol told us just in that city, 20,000 people have been killed.

The UN has documented the unlawful killing, including by summary execution of some 50 civilians so far in the town of Bucha. I'm sure you've seen some of the images from there. In the early weeks of the war, we met Yana Tiahla and her three children in an evacuation center here in Lviv. They had just fled Bucha.

They had to hide in their basement for more than a week and leave her husband and mother behind. Well, Yana children and her children, they're now safely in Spain and I got a chance to catch up with them and particularly find out what they've heard of those they did leave behind in Bucha.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Yana, first, it's so good to see you and your kids and you're safe and their smiles. I'm so happy you're in a safe place. How is everybody doing?

YANA TIAHLA, ESCAPED BUCHA, UKRAINE (through interpreter): It's much better than it was before.

SCIUTTO: When we last met your husband and your mother was still left behind in Bucha. They've been able to join you?

TIAHLA (through interpreter): Yes. We are together. We got as far as Lviv together and then I went - me and the children - went to Poland and we were waiting there for my husband and mom. He was allowed to leave because we have three children and right now in Ukraine families with three children and more, the husbands can leave.

SCIUTTO: When we spoke, we knew that the fighting was bad and Bucha, but we didn't know how bad. We didn't know about all the crimes, it seems, that Russian forces have committed there. Have you been in touch with family and friends who were left behind?

TIAHLA (through interpreter): Yes. We left in time and a lot of our friends managed to leave in time. But we do know people who stayed there for a long time yet and managed to leave literally very recently. So they have been telling us about all the horrors that I can now see in the internet on the photos and videos, but we left on the ninth day of the wars that we definitely left in time.

SCIUTTO: It must be so heartbreaking you - for you, frightening for you to hear all those stories, to see all those pictures.

TIAHLA (through interpreter): Yes, indeed. And we know people who died there. We have personal connections there. And we - so for example, Miraslava's (ph) teacher died and also Misha's kindergarten teacher has not been found yet. We don't know exactly how they died, but we know that they died and so we have a personal story as well. Because we know like Misha's kindergarten teacher we don't yet know - they can't find her. This is horrifying to see because we can see photos in the - on the internet of places we know, a lake with benches, a park where we used to take walks and now there's a mass grave there, it's really horrible to see.

SCIUTTO: How do you explain all that to your children?

TIAHLA (through interpreter): My eldest child is 11 and she understands everything. She has access to information she has a phone. She can see the internet. So she was inside this war and she knows war is war. With the youngest, I mean they've realized there's a war on - they understand what's good and what's bad, but we haven't gone into the horrific details with them.

[18:45:02] We've managed to keep them safe from it, so far. We've told our elders

daughter about her teacher. We - it took us a day to gather our strength to tell her. We didn't know - it was quite difficult. With the youngest, we haven't told him yet about his kindergarten teacher. He's too little. We're not going to tell him yet.

SCIUTTO: I get it. Do you have hope that you'll be able to go home again?

TIAHLA (through interpreter): Yes, we get asked this question a lot. Right now we can't go back to Bucha, because it's a completely destroyed city. There's problem with everything there. There's no water, no power, no gas and also there's a lot of rubble. They're still finding dead bodies. They're still digging people's bodies out of the rubble and also it's a totally booby trap city.

I get pictures that I get sent myself personally and there were - there are mines, there are booby traps found in the washing machines and cupboards. And it will take more than a month for us to be able to go back there with children. So right now we are trying to learn the language. We're trying to find a job and we're trying to keep our children safe and to get them the basic necessities food and basic - meet their basic needs. But yes, we want to go back to Bucha, eventually, because that's our - that's where our life is. That's where we lived. Right now here, we just have two backpacks.

SCIUTTO: I remember those two backpacks. I do.

TIAHLA: (Foreign language).

SCIUTTO: And your socks, right?

TIAHLA (through interpreter): Yes. We have a bit more than socks now because we got a lot of help in Spain.

SCIUTTO: It's so good to see you. I'm glad your family is safe. I really am and it's nice to see you smiling. I just hope you're able to go home soon.

TIAHLA (through interpreter): We would like that very much.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: They are some of the lucky ones. You heard the story she told there of that park they used to go to with their children that has now become a graveyard for some of their friends. CNN was able to get pictures of that particular park, also geo locate satellite images that show two graves there, a mother and her son killed in shelling now buried there.

That is a reality that we've heard in so many towns and cities and villages in this country during Russia's prosecution of this war. If you would like to help some of the millions of people who fled Ukraine and there are many millions, 5 million out of the country, some 7 million inside. There are safe ways to do that securely on cnn.com/impact, a whole host of charities they're doing great work here and you can find ways there to help.

Still ahead more special live coverage from on the ground in Ukraine. The Ukrainian President reveals plans for a special high level visit to you to Ukraine to the capital Kyiv, in fact, by U.S. cabinet officials. Will bring you the latest.

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[18:52:39]

SCIUTTO: As the Russian military moves through Ukraine, those forces are leaving more than destruction and heartbreak behind. CNN's Phil Black shows the dangerous weapons that remained, some of them deliberately targeting civilians.

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PHIL BLACK, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Weaving through the trees. This brave stretcher crew is carrying a delicate cargo, not the wounded, but something with the potential to seriously wound or worse. They're collecting the active munitions Russian forces left behind.

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BLACK (on camera): This forest is scarred by battle. There's blackened earth and splintered trees pretty much everywhere. The Ukrainians say their rockets rain down on Russian positions here. This is what's left of a Russian weapons system. They say the battle may have lasted hours, but the cleanup will take much longer.

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BLACK (voice over): Here among the natural debris lies the dangerous end of a Russian Uragan rocket.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Foreign language).

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BLACK (voice over): This soldier says it's filled with cluster munitions. Those weapons are banned by more than a hundred countries. This one, standing proud, shows why they must work quickly, when the soldiers last saw this damaged rocket, it was lying horizontally. Someone foolish, lucky and unqualified has lifted the warhead so it now points to the sky. The professionals carefully stretcher it away and add it to their growing collection.

That was a single 500-pound bomb and that's how you make it safe, according to this disposal team. They've got two more to go. The air- delivered bombs recovered from a downed Russian aircraft and they're going to destroy both at the same time.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Foreign language).

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BLACK (voice over): The big ones are easy to find and you get the feeling fun to destroy. Most of the effort hunting down mines and other abandoned ordinance is painfully thorough, careful work, scanning and prodding the earth with intense focus for hours at a time. But there's urgency too, because discarded and deliberately planted weapons are harming people weeks after the Russians left this territory.

[18:55:05]

This truck hit a mine north of Kyiv incinerating the driver. This emergency vehicle also ran over something explosive, injuring eight onboard. There are many painful legacies to Russia's brief presence in this part of the country. Ukrainians are working to ensure this one doesn't endure.

Phil Black, CNN in Ukraine's Kyiv region.

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SCIUTTO: Such important and such dangerous work. Thanks so much to all of you for joining us today. I'm Jim Sciutto in Lviv, Ukraine. Pamela Brown continues our coverage from the U.S. after a quick break.

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