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Three Separate Blasts Seen in Russia; Russia Warns Countries Not to Intervene; Ukrainians Trapped in Many Cities; Not Easy to be a Refugee; Russian Troops Advances in Donetsk Region; Beijing Conduct Mass Testing to Avoid Shanghai-like Lockdown. Aired 3-4a ET

Aired April 28, 2022 - 03:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[03:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ISA SOARES, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, and a very warm welcome to our viewers joining us in the United States and right around the world. I'm Isa Soares live in Ukraine, where Vladimir Putin is warning against western intervention in his unprovoked war, while the U.S. says it has credible evidence of Russia's barbaric tactics on the battlefield.

ROSEMARY CHURCH, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Rosemary Church, at CNN world headquarters in Atlanta. I'll have all our other top stories, including millions being tested in Beijing, as China doubles down on a zero COVID policy.

SOARES: Welcome to the show, everyone. The battle for control of eastern Ukraine is heating up. The Ukrainian military says Russian forces are now, quote, "exerting intense fire on multiple fronts, with a focus on making a breakthrough in the Izyum area. Another region facing growing attacks is Luhansk.

This video is from the aftermath of a strike on a hospital in Severodonetsk, we said to be one of the regions only functioning hospitals, one woman is reported dead. Officials say the hospital is still operating despite of course suffering that significant damage as you can see there.

Well, Severodonetsk, is among the hardest hit towns as Russia intensifies its offensive in the east. Meantime, Russian president Vladimir Putin is making a stark as well as direct threat about foreign interference in Ukraine. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): If someone intends to intervene in what is happening from the outside, and creates unacceptable strategic threats for us, then they should know that our response to oncoming strikes will be swift, lightning-fast. We have all the tools for this, one is that no one can brag about and we won't brag, we will use them if needed.

(END VIDEO CLIP) SOARES: Now, his threat came shortly after three explosions inside

Russian regions bordering Ukraine, this is an ammunition depot on fire in Belgorod. Ukraine has not said whether they are responsible for the blast, but an aide to Ukraine's president describes them as, quote, "karma." And those aren't the only explosions to rock territory under Russian control.

This is in the Russian occupied city of Kherson in southern Ukraine. Russian state-run media report the blast was caused by three missiles fired by Ukrainian forces. We haven't had any confirmation of that from Ukraine. It reportedly happened near a TV broadcaster, allegedly causing Russian channels to go dark in the city.

Joining me now from London, CNN's Nada Bashir. And Nada, a very good morning to you, clearly another veiled threat as we heard there from President Putin, that of course shouldn't be overlooked, but how much has the U.S. position, that is, that the Ukraine is winning, that they want Russia to be weakened rocking Putin here, Nada.

NADA BASHIR, CNN REPORTER: Well, look, Isa, we hear Putin stepping up that rhetoric, they are alluding that perhaps the use of tactical nuclear weapons. We've heard from the Pentagon press secretary John Kirby describing these remarks from President Putin as irresponsible rhetoric. But we have to note that this isn't the first time that President Putin has suggested that Russia might resort to using such weapons.

And in fact, earlier this month, we heard from the Austrian chancellor Karl Nehammer who had a one-on-one meeting with President Putin, and coming away from that meeting he said that he wasn't sure if Putin, whether or not he would resort to using such weapons, if he found himself to be cornered.

But he also noted that he felt Putin was aware that he could use the threat of these weapons, of tactical nuclear weapons against the international community.

Now Kremlin's spokesperson Dmitry Peskov has previously said that the -- that Russia would only resort to such weapons if the existence of the state was at stake, but this has obviously caused some concern. And we are seeing NATO allies stepping up their response to these remarks.

[03:04:59]

Just here in the U.K. yesterday foreign secretary Liz Truss warning allies that they could be in this fight with Russia for the long haul. Urging allies to step up their support for Ukraine, particularly on the military front. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LIZ TRUSS, BRITISH FOREIGN SECRETARY: The war in Ukraine is our war, it's everyone's war, because Ukraine's victory is a strategic imperative for all of us. Heavy weapons, tanks, airplanes digging deep in our inventory ramping up production, we need to do all of this. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BASHIR: Now this is particularly significant with the focus as well on the supply of warplanes to Ukraine, that has long been a call from Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy. We've seen just in the last few days that U.K. Canada stepping up their military support for Ukraine.

And on Tuesday, a major NATO U-turn, Germany now pledging anti- aircraft tanks to Ukraine. But as you mentioned that there are still diplomatic efforts ongoing, we are continuing to see the heavy bombardment of Ukraine. So that call for further support will certainly be intensified over the coming days.

We heard from the U.N. Secretary General, Antonio Guterres speaking to CNN. He said that this war will only end when the Russian state decides to do so.

SOARES: Yes. And he'll be meeting of course today with President Zelenskyy in Kyiv. Thank you very much, Nada Bashir for us in London. Thank you, Nada. I appreciate it.

Meanwhile, the United States says it has credible information that Russian soldiers executed Ukrainians who are trying to surrender. According to the U.S., it happened in Donetsk in the Donbas region of eastern Ukraine. At the United Nations on Wednesday, the U.S. ambassador-at-large for global criminal justice said the U.S. also has credible reports of civilians killed execution style, torture, and sexual violence against women and girls. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BETH VAN SCHAACK, U.S. AMBASSADOR-AT-LARGE FOR GLOBAL CRIMINAL JUSTICE: Let us be clear, those who unleashed perpetrated, and ordered these crimes must be held to account. And the evidence of this criminality is mounting daily. Our simple message to Russia's military and political leadership and to the rank and file is this. The world is watching, and you will be held accountable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: Meanwhile, intense Russian attacks in eastern Ukraine have left some of the most vulnerable desperate as well as trapped trying to hold on to any semblance really of normal life they can. But with shells constantly raining down, that is next to impossible. And just getting the minimum necessities of life, of course, is a struggle in itself.

As our Sam Kiley found out.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Severodonetsk on the front line with Russia, it's an artillery frontline.

UNKNOWN: Basement. KILEY: Let's go into the basement.

Local police are delivering aid to civilians unable to leave. There is no time to wait out the bombardment. There is no likely end to the shelling either, supplies need delivering and fast.

She tells me there are three people next door, including a granny of 92. Upstairs, a bedridden woman. She says that normally they stay in their flat and only use the basement when it's bad.

"Thank you for not forgetting us," she adds.

The urgency of these sorts of deliveries cannot be exaggerated. Just in this block, there's mostly old people. One gentleman is dying of cancer in front of his wife. She is saying she's living in a double hell. Since we've been here, there have been, I don't know, five, six, eight impacts very, very close. And almost every tree, every corner, very bit of this local neighborhood has got the signs of recent impact. The Russians are just a kilometer or maybe three away.

Russian guns are so close, you can hear the whole arc of their shells.

From Kyiv to Mariupol, from Kharkiv to here, this is the Russian way of war, pound civilians, flatten cities and maybe occupy the ashes.

Olexander (Ph) says, "we are in danger now, they are shelling us, so it could come at any moment and shrapnel could hurt us. We tried to hide there in the bomb shelter."

Two months of war has driven these people underground. And there is no end in sight. The fear, Olexander (Ph) confesses, he tries to keep inside, but it creeps out.

There is one more delivery that the police have got to make. But every time we try to get out the front door of this building, there is another impact. There is another one now.

[03:10:02]

They are saying that the hospital which is nearby is under heavy shelling. We were planning to go there, we can't get through, nor indeed at the moment can we even get out of this bunker.

The hospital was hit. Images of the damage done that morning posted online by the local administration. Officials said that one civilian was killed, others injured and several floors were badly damaged.

The humanitarian effort goes on. This woman asked only for the basics of existence, water and candles for light.

Hey, Joe, you do this every day?

UNKNOWN: Yes.

KILEY: Bogdan (Ph) tells me that most people left here now had nowhere else to go. They've lived here all their lives and don't want to abandon their homes.

Do you think the Russians are going to take Severodonetsk?

"Never," he says, "we will stand our ground to the last man. No one will leave here."

That may be a dangerous claim. It's likely that Ukrainians will destroy this bridge to hold up the invasion. And anyone still here will then be trapped in Russian hands.

Sam Kiley, CNN, Severodonetsk.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SOARES: Powerful report there from Sam Kiley and team. Well, according to the U.N. more than five million Ukrainians have been able to flee the violence, some 400,000 have gone to neighboring Moldova.

That's where we find Conor O'Loughlin of Catholic Relief Services. Conor, a very good morning to you. Thanks for taking time to speak to us. Give us a sense of what you and your teams have been seeing on the ground.

CONOR O'LOUGHLIN, COUNTRY REPRESENTATIVE, CATHOLIC RELIEF SERVICES: And good morning. You mentioned there the numbers that have come into Moldova, and we're still seeing 100,000 refugees in Moldova here at the moment. Many have passed through on to the European Union, but many have stayed here hoping to be able to return to Ukraine as soon as they can. But we know the situation hasn't allowed that yet.

And what we see at the moment is that Ukrainian families have to make decisions, and those are difficult decisions, where to live, how to get work, where to send their children to school. We are two months into this crisis now, and they are also separated from their spouses, and it is exhausting and stressful for, particularly for mothers and children, as they try to make decisions for themselves. What will they do in the future?

SOARES: Conor, those still making their way to Moldova, those you've been speaking to, give us a sense of the stories that you've been hearing.

O'LOUGHLIN: Well, we've heard many, many stories. I think people that have come into Moldova recently or even since the start of the crisis, you know, relay the trauma that they have experienced, and particularly that, you know, making decisions to leave their homesteads. And what we're seeing, really, what is so unique about this crisis, is the separation of families. You know, it is unprecedented.

SOARES: Yes.

O'LOUGHLIN: We are supporting many, many families here. But it is -- it is women and children, and it is elderly as well. And that feature of separating families, as you can imagine is hugely distressful for those refugees that are here. And dealing with that trauma, you really, really see the distress of

people, and for Catholic Relief Services here, a big part of our responses also providing psychological care, that counseling for people that have experienced that firsthand trauma in, you know, in a conflict situation. And that is incredibly difficult to witness, but it's also a really important part of this response as well, from a humanitarian perspective.

SOARES: Yes, so much distress on top of everything, of course, like you said they've gone through. I have been speaking to Ukrainians here in Lviv who have moved back, who've said, you know, I don't want to be away from my husband, I want to be home. They just somehow haven't been able, like you said, to find schools, find housing, are you hearing the same? Are you hearing stories of people wanting to come back?

O'LOUGHLIN: Absolutely. We hear the same stories here. We have witnessed some families returned across the border from Moldova to Ukraine. And that is back to the point on decisions that people need to make now, and are forced to make --

SOARES: Yes.

O'LOUGHLIN: -- to determine, you know, their long-term future is also. I happen to be in Lviv myself, last week, and those stories we also heard of people who are looking to go home because they want access to, for example, education. They want to check on their own houses as well.

[03:15:01]

SOARES: Yes.

O'LOUGHLIN: What we're also seeing is people going into Ukraine, but coming back over the border to Moldova again, if the situation is not tenable to stay also.

SOARES: Right.

O'LOUGHLIN: And so, it's a very dynamic and fluid context.

SOARES: Yes.

O'LOUGHLIN: And I think, here in Moldova, we are also preparing for any eventuality, really. Where we have 100,000 refugees in a country that is the most per capita in any country from this crisis as well. We must remember that Moldova is a very small country, and we're also preparing ourselves if there are further influx of refugees into the country.

We have to be ready to provide safe accommodation to people, to provide food and water, and have clean water also.

SOARES: Yes.

O'LOUGHLIN: And so that dynamic, fluid context is what we really faced with at the moment.

SOARES: And on that point, Conor, I mean, what are your biggest needs right now?

O'LOUGHLIN: I think our needs -- our needs currently are that we continue to meet the essential needs of refugee families. So Catholic Relief Services is providing cash assistance, we are providing food and hygiene assistance to families. We are going to need to continue to do that.

As I said, were two months into this crisis now. So, we need that sustained international support, really, to continue to meet accommodation needs, and basic needs, but what we are also seeing emerging, and I referenced this at the beginning, is the need for longer term support as well.

In areas like education access for Ukrainian children, particularly coming into the summer, you know, and also that support for host communities. So Moldovans have opened their hearts and their doors to Ukrainian refugees, we need to make sure their doors remain open and that Moldova and Moldovan families --

SOARES: Yes.

O'LOUGHLIN: -- can also support and sustain, you know, hosting Ukrainian refugees as well. That's a very important part of this.

SOARES: Such an important point. Yes. Such an important point there. Conor O'Loughlin, thank you very much for taking the time to speak with us.

O'LOUGHLIN: Thank you.

SOARES: And still to come right on the show, millions are being tested for COVID-19 in Beijing as China doubles down on its zero COVID policy. We'll have a live report, next.

[03:20:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHURCH: Welcome back, everyone. Well, we are seeing long lines in Beijing as millions get tested for the coronavirus to prevent a Shanghai-like lockdown. Just hours ago, China's capital announced the closure of some schools and major hospitals with almost no advanced warning. And more neighborhoods are now considered high risk that are being sealed off.

CNN's Steven Jiang joins us now live from Beijing. Good to see you, Steven. So what is the situation there right now, and how concerned are people in Beijing that this could end up being a severe lockdown similar to the one we've been witnessing in Shanghai?

STEVEN JIANG, CNN BEIJING BUREAU CHIEF: Rosemary, I'm actually outside one of the city's main children hospitals. Parents who come here actually are lucky because this one is still open. You may be able to see some people lining up for their mandatory COVID tests, not only to get into the hospital, but that's increasingly a prerequisite to access most public places, not just here in Beijing, but across China.

But as you mentioned, many parents like myself, woke up this morning on Thursday receiving that most dreaded e-mail announcing the immediate closing of many schools until further notice. Obviously, the schools are saying they are switching to online learning. But that was really counter who still have to go to work or parents with very young kids.

So, all those closures at major hospitals in many schools, really a very ominous sign that the worst is yet to come, despite the official tally here in the capital, a fewer than 200 cases in this latest outbreak out of 20 plus million residents. Most of us, obviously, have already gone through two rounds of mandatory COVID testing with one more round to go.

But already you notice the streets are much quieter, even during the morning rush hour, one reason for that could be that many commuters who live outside of Beijing's jurisdiction are actually now locked out. With one city Sanhe, for example, locking down its entire population of one million just because of one case.

Inside a city, for the most part, we're still free to move about, except for residents in sealed off, so-called high-risk areas. And supplies for now, still seem to be plentiful both in stores and online. But many people have been stocking up, being constantly reminded by Shanghai friends or family that things could change any moment, and officials promises that reassurances really do not mean anything.

So, Rosemary, increasingly grim reality. Many people are really become aware that zero COVID in its strict enforcement is here to stay. Rosemary?

CHURCH: Indeed. And let's hope that lessons have been learned from the Shanghai lockdown. Hopefully it will be better for Beijing.

Thank you so much, Steven Jiang joining us there.

Well, heartbreaking barely begins to describe how Mariupol residents feel about what is happening in their city. Next, we talk to people who watch Russian forces lay waste to their hometown, but can do nothing to stop it.

[03:25:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SOARES: Now, a Ukrainian commander is making a desperate new appeal to world leaders to help organize evacuations from his city. He says hundreds of civilians and wounded soldiers are stranded in a steel plant besieged by Russian troops. And he's begging world leaders to help, saying many more people will, quote, "simply die if they stay there." As you are about to see, the fighting is taking a horrific toll on the plant, the city, as well as the people.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SOARES: Ivan used to live on Mariupol's Peace Avenue.

"You want your city to remain the same as it was in your memory," he tells me. That city now lies in ruins, a shell of what it once was.

[03:30:01]

And the steel plant his family has dedicated three generations to suddenly finds itself as Mariupol's last line of defense. "Seeing your city being destroyed is horrible," he tells me, "You can compare it to a relative dying in your arms, and seeing him or her dying gradually, organ after organ failing, and you can do nothing."

For his colleague, Alexey (Ph), it's also personal. He has lost not just friends, but his mother-in-law to shelling when they first try to flee Mariupol.

How does this make you feel? You must be so angry.

"My emotions disappeared already there in Mariupol," he says, "that's why there is nothing but hate."

Alexey (Ph) has worked for the steel plant for 26 years. He's one of the 11,000 employees who have first the iron furnishes turning here. A major play in the metal's industry, Azovstal produces four million tons of steel a year.

Its metal shining brightly in Manhattan's Hudson Yards and London (Inaudible). Now as Russia pummels its plant and production jolts to a halt the CEO of the company behind Azovstal steel tells me at least 150 of its employees have been killed. And thousands are still unaccounted for.

YURIY RYZHENKOV, CEO, METINVEST: Out of the 11,000 employees of Azovstal, only about 4,500 people got out of Mariupol and gotten contact with us.

SOARES: "This is our plant as my papa says. He works here," says this little girl in a promotional video. Built in 1933 under Soviet rule, Azovstal was partly demolished during the Nazi occupation in the 1940s. Now it faces the wrath of a president who says he is de- Nazifying it, attacking the very foundation that his country helped built.

Hold up inside are thought to be around a thousand civilians hiding in shelters, women, children, and the elderly who haven't seen sunlight in more than 50 days. And then there is the injured in field hospitals like this one. Russian forces continue to encircle the plant. And they are not badging.

RYZHENKOV: I don't think that it's the plant that he wants. I think he's about a symbolism.

SOARES: A win in the port city of Mariupol will provide President Putin with a land bridge to Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula which Russia annexed in 2014. If fully taken, Rinat Akhmetov, one of Ukraine's richest man and the main shareholder of the group behind Azovstal steel tells me via e-mail, under no circumstances will these plants operate under the Russian occupation."

Alexey (Ph) agrees. Telling me, "after what they did, never."

A wall of steel defending to the bitter end the place they have called home.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SOARES (on camera): Now thanks to Ivan and Alexey (Ph) for taking the time to speak to us. And we'll send it back to Rosemary Church in Atlanta after the short break. You are watching CNN.

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(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHURCH: This week, CNN brings you the stories of trail blazers pushing the limits of science and health care. Once just this stuff of comic books and Hollywood blockbusters, holograms are now being used to help surgeons do more operations, and do them better.

CNN's Rachel Crane reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RACHEL CRANE, CNN INNOVATION & SPACE CORRESPONDENT: In this hospital in Israel, Elchanan Bruckheimer is mending a heart, using tools the width of pencil points called catheters. But he can't see the heart with his own eyes.

ELCHANAN BRUCKHEIMER, CATH LAB DIRECTOR, SCHNEIDER CHILDREN'S: Imaging is how we understand what's inside the patient, what's going on, where we need to move our catheters. My depth perception has to be down to the sub millimeter.

CRANE: In recent decades, advances in imaging technology like X-rays and ultrasounds have helped make this process more accurate and commonplace. But Bruckheimer believes that mixed reality technology can give surgeons an even clearer picture. He is developing a system that turns medical images into holograms.

That might sound like something out of a movie, like the three- dimensional projections you find inside Iron Man's suit. But Bruckheimer says his company, RealView, has been working on its telescope eye for almost 15 years. You need a specialized overhead device to see these tell holograms, though.

SHAUL GELMAN, CO-FOUNDER & CEO, REALVIEW IMAGING: It's like a 3D printer of points of light, so it allows the physician to see a hologram that is hovering in front of him, he can visualize the information, and he can interact with it.

CRANE: And as Bruckheimer sees it, that benefits both patients and hospitals.

BRUCKHEIMER: Doing complex procedures quicker, easier, and you can do more of those.

CRANE: Some bigger players in technology agree. Microsoft is partnering with hospitals and start-ups, like New York-Based Medivis to adapt its hollow lens to device for surgery.

[03:40:01]

How does Microsoft's cloud platform interact with this technology?

DAVID RHEW, GLOBAL CHIEF MEDICAL OFFICER & VP OF HEALTHCARE, MICROSOFT: The ability for us to be able to pull the data from the different sources like electronic health records, that's all cloud enable technology.

CRANE: One issue that caught our eyes -- slow bandwidth. This is according to Ngiam Kee Yuan from the National University Health System in Singapore, his team is collaborating with Microsoft to trial the technology for live operations.

NGIAM KEE YUAN, GROUP CHIEF TECHNOLOGY OFFICER, NATIONAL UNIVERSITY HEALTH SYSTEM: We are trying to test out use -- the use of 5G technology to improve our bandwidth and reduce our latency.

CRANE: Some are already working on what they see as the next milestone, projecting holograms right on to the patient's body. Microsoft believes that collaboration across the industry could help speed up progress. For Bruckheimer, it's all about what's best for the patient. But

BRUCKHEIMER: Any improvement we can have that can reduce suffering of our patients is my mission.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHURCH: Extraordinary, isn't it? For our international viewers, Inside Africa is next. For those in North America, I'll be right back with more news after the break.

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[03:50:00]

(INSIDE AFRICA)

JENS STOLTENBERG, NATO SECRETARY GENERAL: NATO E.U. cooperation has always been important but especially now when our core values, democracy and the rule of law, the respect for sovereignty and territorial integrity is challenged by the brutal invasion of Ukraine. It's even more important that European Union and NATO stand together. So, thank you so much.

UNKNOWN: Thank you, it's time for a couple of questions. Yes, please, (Inaudible).

UNKNOWN: (Inaudible) The first question to President Metsola. Since this is the first time you invited Mr. Stoltenberg to the conference of presidents, what is your personal message to him and what do you expect from NATO? Also, with your background of being in Kyiv a couple of weeks ago. And the question to you, Secretary General, there are two states partner states of NATO, Sweden and Finland, who might join the NATO. How fast with this go? How fast with the alliance take in those new members if they want to join? Thank you.

ROBERTA METSOLA, PRESIDENT, EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT: First of all, this will be a very open and frank exchange with questions ranging from all of the leaders of the political group. But which also will reflect the unprecedented unity that we have seen in this parliament since the 24th of February and the brutal invasion by Russia of Ukraine.

This parliament, in all of its resolutions, has been resolute and following on also from my discussions with President Zelenskyy, just over three weeks ago, that there was need for more military support. That there was a need for more effective assistance to Ukraine. That is something that we have called for.

We will continue to call for further sanctions, and we will further call for the enforcement of the current packages of sanctions in a better way and more effective way. This will continue also to discuss in (Inaudible) next week, but in our case, this parliament will continue to build on the momentum of this again, unprecedented coordination that we have, which is extremely important, because we share the fundamental values, and we share our defense, if you can say that, of Ukraine's rights to defend itself.

STOLTENBERG: It is, of course, for Finland and Sweden to decide, whether they would like to apply for membership in NATO or not. But if they decide to apply, Finland and Sweden will be welcomed with open arms to NATO.

Finland and Sweden are our closest partners. They are strong and mature democracies. E.U. members and we have worked with Finland and Sweden for many, many years. We know that their armed forces meet NATO standards, are interoperability with NATO forces, we train together, we exercise together. And we have also worked with Finland and Sweden in many different missions and operations.

So, if they apply, they will be welcomed and I also expect the process to be quick and they can join NATO after a formal process has been finalized.

UNKNOWN: Next question there, please.

UNKNOWN: From the Swedish News NTT. In Sweden and Finland there's a big discussion about what kind of guarantees NATO can give Sweden and Finland during the negotiation -- during before becoming members if applying. What kind of help, and how fast would that possible help go? And for the president, if Sweden and Finland join the European Union

it will be almost completely inside NATO except for four countries. How do you see this? What do you expect any having consequences?

[03:54:51]

STOLTENBERG: The reality is that, Finland and Sweden are already very close to NATO. And we worked together, we operate together, and we exercise together. And as soon as we take the decision to invite them, that will send a strong political message, that the security of Finland and Sweden matters for all NATO allies.

And then I'm also certain that we will be able to find arrangements for that interim period between Finland and Sweden applies and until the formal ratification is finalized in all 30 parliaments.

So, I'm confident that there are ways to bridge that interim period in a way that is good enough and works for both Finland and Sweden.

CHURCH: And we've been listening there to NATO and European Union leaders press conference. We heard there from NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg, he said that he was calling on Europe to stand with Ukraine and solidarity, he said democracy and the rule of law are being challenged by Russia.

He also mentioned there that Sweden and Finland if they applied to join NATO, they would be welcomed with open arms. And he said that would send a very powerful message.

Thank you so much for spending part of your day with me. I'm Rosemary Church. Our breaking news coverage of the war in Ukraine continues next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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