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DOJ Updates Excessive Force Policy; Interview With Lt. Gov. Geoff Duncan (R-GA); America Votes. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired May 24, 2022 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: Hello. I'm Victor Blackwell. Welcome to CNN NEWSROOM.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: And I'm Alisyn Camerota.

Election Day is in full swing for five states holding primaries today, Texas, Arkansas, Minnesota, and Georgia -- I forgot one in there -- Alabama.

Donald Trump is not on the ballot, but the power of his endorsement is, especially in the battleground state of Georgia, where Trump handpicked several 2020 election deniers to run for critical offices that oversee elections, like secretary of state, attorney general and governor.

BLACKWELL: Now, the primary race for governor is the race to watch today in Georgia.

Incumbent Brian Kemp is Trump's number one target in what's being called his vendetta tour. Trump is on a mission to bring down Republicans who refused to go along with his 2020 election lies. He enlisted and then endorsed Kemp rival David Perdue and headlined a tele-rally for him there yesterday.

Now, on the same day, Trump's former Vice President Mike Pence stumped with Kemp in Georgia.

CAMEROTA: We have a team of correspondents covering Election Day in Georgia.

So let's start with CNN's Jeff Zeleny, who is reporting on Governor Kemp's campaign.

Jeff, what's latest?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Alisyn, we're outside a polling location here in Atlanta.

And there are several hours to go until the polls close, about five more hours or so to go. And the Kemp campaign, Governor Brian Kemp, is hoping not only to win, but to win big, to avoid a run-off election in June, of course, Georgia, one of the handful of states that requires candidates to get more than 50 percent to avoid a run-off election. That is what he is eying in his race with former Senator David Perdue,

who, of course, is backed strongly by the former president. Now, this has at some -- oftentimes seemed like a race between Donald Trump and Brian Kemp.

Donald Trump has really been lambasting him for weeks and weeks, all because Governor Kemp voted to certify the election all the way back in 2020. So that has hung over this race from the beginning. But last night here in Georgia, former President -- former Vice President -- excuse me -- Mike Pence came in to rally for Brian Kemp, and had a message for Republicans.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'm here because Brian Kemp, frankly, is one of the most successful Republican governors in America.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

PENCE: And I'm here because Brian Kemp is the only candidate in tomorrow's primary who has already defeated Stacey Abrams, whether she knows it or not.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZELENY: So that's what this race ultimately is about, which Republican will be chosen to go on in November here in a very closely watched governor's race against Democratic candidate Stacey Abrams, who's running unopposed, but, clearly, Brian Kemp, the incumbent Republican governor, has the edge in this race.

But what this Tuesday will also decide -- this is the last Tuesday of the month of May, and every Tuesday so far has tested the strength of foreign President Donald Trump. This one will do it as well. His candidate, David Perdue, has not had the money to be on the airwaves advertising.

He is really limping into this Election Day contest. But Brian Kemp is hoping to win and win big tonight to avoid a run-off and, of course, a big win against former President Trump -- Victor and Alisyn.

BLACKWELL: All right, Jeff Zeleny for us there in Atlanta.

Jeff, thank you.

CAMEROTA: Now to Governor Kemp's prime GOP opponent. That's former Senator David Perdue. Perdue made a controversial closing argument to voters on Monday.

BLACKWELL: Yes, they were aimed at Democrat Stacey Abrams.

CNN's Kristen Holmes has details for us -- Kristen.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Victor and Alisyn, recent polls here in Georgia show former Senator David Perdue trailing incumbent Governor Kemp.

And this really will be a day of reckoning for former President Donald Trump, who recruited Perdue to run against Kemp. Now, Perdue has made the lies about the 2020 election a pillar of his campaign. This will answer the question that so many have asked, whether or not Republican voters are ready to move past this question about the '22 election and past the big lie.

Now, I do want to point out to one moment that happened on the campaign trail yesterday that didn't have to do with the 2020 election. And that was when it Perdue went beyond attacking Kemp. He moved on to Stacey Abrams, who will be the Democratic candidate for governor. And he called Abrams or accused Abrams of demeaning her own race.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID PERDUE (R), GEORGIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: When she told black farmers, you don't need to be on the farm, and you -- she told black workers in hospitality and all this, you don't need to be -- she is demeaning her own race when it comes to that.

[14:05:09]

I am really over this. She should never be considered for material for a governor of any state.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: And Perdue seemed to be referencing that comments that Abrams had made back in 2018 when she said that Georgians shouldn't have to be in the hospitality or agriculture industry just to make a living in this state, but some very controversial remarks on his final day of campaigning -- Victor and Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, Kristen Holmes, thank you very much.

Stacey Abrams now responding.

CNN's Eva McKend has that.

So, Eva, what are you hearing from Abrams?

EVA MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS REPORTER: Well, Alisyn, Stacey Abrams is a black woman running for governor in Georgia with a long political career in this state. So, certainly, she has heard this type of rhetoric before.

And she seemed to kind of brush it aside. More generally, though, her retort is that, whether it be former Senator David Perdue or incumbent Governor Brian Kemp, they are spending more time attacking her than talking about the issues that she's identified as of consequence to Georgians, like Medicaid expansion, like gun violence, like responding to COVID. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STACEY ABRAMS (D), GEORGIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: The challenge I have is that the answer from Republicans, from our former senator to our current governor, is to fight me, instead of fighting the problems that are facing Georgia.

And I urge everyone to pay less attention to rhetoric and more attention to the record and to the results. And I'm here to provide results for the future of Georgia.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MCKEND: At a news conference this morning outside of a polling precinct here in Atlanta, she really focused on the general theme of her tour, which is one Georgia.

She is trying to basically wake up voters who have not participated in the process before, bring everyone into the fold, less time so much on Governor Kemp and Perdue and more on what her mission is for this state -- Alisyn, Victor.

CAMEROTA: OK, Eva McKend, thank you.

BLACKWELL: All right, joining us now is Georgia's lieutenant governor, Geoff Duncan.

Sir, welcome back.

Let's start here with the Kemp-Perdue race. And the polls show, and we don't go into the specifics of the numbers on Election Day, but an advantage for Governor Kemp there.

To what do you attribute that? Do you believe that is more about David Perdue or about Donald Trump?

LT. GOV. GEOFF DUNCAN (R-GA): Well, I actually think it's about Brian Kemp.

He has put on incredible leadership over the last four years. The best way to test a leader is under pressure. And he has certainly felt the pressure over the last four years. And I think Georgians are proud of how we reacted during the pandemic, how we have dealt with a whipsawing economy, civil unrest. He's done a great job.

And I think he's going to be rewarded today handsomely by really beating David Perdue by a significant amount.

BLACKWELL: So, if he does that, and wins by a significant amount, what does that suggest, if anything, about the strength, the potency of a Donald Trump endorsement this cycle?

DUNCAN: Well, I think it's a huge sign that the Republican Party is moving on. And we're certainly going to send a message to the rest of the country.

I feel like, by every percentage point that Brian Kemp beats David Perdue -- and, by all estimates, it's going to be a lot -- it's an extra 100 miles we gain ground spreading the message around the country that it's time for a new direction. And it's -- look, this should be an easy period of time for us to show contrasts between our policies and plans for America and Joe Biden's.

And that's really where we should be talking about right now.

BLACKWELL: So, we all saw in -- was it January of 2021, the impact that the former president can have on Republican turnout, suppressing the vote there, in which he kind of told people not to have any faith in that run-off in the Senate races.

How do you then get the Perdue voters, those who bought into the big lie in Georgia that the election was stolen, to support Governor Kemp moving into November, which could be a tight race?

DUNCAN: Yes, first of all, I think Brian Kemp has earned the right to be the governor for four more years, and he's going to be rewarded even during the general election, and Republicans will show up.

But, look, if Donald Trump wants to dig in and cry about spilled milk and try to bring up the 2020 election again, we certainly run the risk of doing exactly what he did to David Perdue and Kelly Loeffler during the run-off, and that's a couple hundred thousand Republicans stay home and actually believe that their vote didn't count.

That would be wrong. It certainly would be the ultimate selfish move. We have seen it happen before. I hope we don't see it again.

BLACKWELL: You have said that Senator -- former Senator Perdue made a bad call about six months ago by saying that if he got the endorsement -- I'm paraphrasing here -- of Donald Trump, that would be enough to win the primary.

It certainly seems to be what's what's elevating Herschel Walker in the Senate primary there. Do you think he's the best candidate for Republicans to take that seat?

DUNCAN: Well, I think what's elevating Herschel Walker to the top of the -- top of the race at this point, based on the polling that I have seen, is that he's an incredible sports star.

[14:10:05]

He earned a Heisman Trophy, and he single-handedly carried the University of Georgia to the national championship. That certainly has gotten his name I.D. up there.

At this point, he's going to have to tackle some tough issues if he ends up winning this primary. He's going to have some tough issues to talk about. And, certainly, I hope he digs in and understands the issues and takes on a well-prepared Raphael Warnock. But, certainly, that race isn't over. There are some other folks that are that are really qualified running

in that race too. And we will see what the voters of Georgia pick.

BLACKWELL: Will you support him if he's the nominee?

DUNCAN: Well, I hope to see him tackle the issues and we will study him. And, certainly, he's going to have a difficult road ahead of him. But we deserve to have a Republican representing us in the U.S. Senate.

And, quite honestly, we should have had two Republicans representing us, with the unforced error we made during the run-off.

BLACKWELL: All right. That wasn't a yes nor no, but I have asked the question.

Let's move on now to another race here, Raffensperger-Hice, which really on the question of the 2020 election is as polarized as the this primary for governor. What are you watching here? And is this also a bellwether of the Trump influence?

DUNCAN: Yes, certainly, it is.

I mean, Brad Raffensperger did a great job in 2020. And he's continued to do a great job representing 11 million Georgians and protecting our elections and doing all the things that he needed to do to follow the letter of the law.

And I think he's going to be rewarded with, worst-case scenario, getting into a run-off and, best-case scenario, winning outright. Jody Hice, unfortunately, continues to carry the water of Donald Trump in some -- all the conspiracy theories.

I will be honest with you. I haven't really seen Jody Hice worked very hard. I don't know if I have seen a commercial on TV or seen a mail piece. I mean, maybe they're there, but they're just not getting to me. But Brad Raffensperger has put his head down and kept going to work every day throughout the last couple of years.

And I think we're going to see him to be able to be rewarded with a tremendous amount of support.

BLACKWELL: All right, you were pretty critical of some parts of the new Georgia elections law.

There's some members of your party who say that the surge in early voting is an indicator of the success. Democrats say it's far too early to determine that. Where do you stand on Election Day on the impact of the new Georgia voting law?

DUNCAN: Well, fortunately, a majority of the things I didn't like in the original elections bill were stripped out.

And so the final version actually had a number of bipartisan ideas and -- put into that measure that, and just lessons learned from the 2020 where we could become more efficient. And, certainly, it was painful to watch the fearmongering and watch Stacey Abrams cost us an All-Star Game and others around the country just kind of fearmonger around just the notion of election integrity.

But, look, at the end of the day, I hope -- I have said this for a couple of years. I hope a million more people vote in this election than the last one. I think our record proves as worthy of votes, as Republicans, here in the state of Georgia, and I hope it continues.

BLACKWELL: Georgia Lieutenant Governor Geoff Duncan, thank you.

DUNCAN: Thank you very much.

CAMEROTA: It is almost the two-year anniversary of George Floyd's death. And the Justice Department is making a seismic move when it comes to excessive force. We have the details ahead.

BLACKWELL: Plus: The next shipment of baby formula will soon be heading for the U.S.

We will tell you when desperate parents can expect to see some shelves stocked ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:17:35]

BLACKWELL: For the first time in 18 years, the Justice Department is updating its policy on excessive force. The DOJ will require officers to intervene if they see another officer using excessive force.

Meanwhile, President Biden is expected to sign an executive order expanding police reforms to other agencies.

CAMEROTA: CNN law enforcement correspondent Whitney Wild joins us now.

So, Whitney, tell us about these reforms.

WHITNEY WILD, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT CORRESPONDENT: Well, these are expected to build on reforms that banned choke holds and restricted no-knock warrants by extending those rules to the thousands of other federal law enforcement officers and agents even beyond the Department of Justice.

What we know today is more detail about the attorney general's directive to several federal agencies under the DOJ purview, which says: "Officers will be trained in and must recognize and act upon the affirmative duty to intervene to prevent or stop, as appropriate, any officer from engaging in excessive force. It is the policy of the Department of Justice to value and preserve human life."

Now, beyond federal law enforcement, this executive order is also expected to encourage local and state law enforcement to meet these minimum training standards, as well as minimum state certification standards. These are the products of months of negotiations. Originally, President Biden had pushed for sweeping police reforms through legislation. But those talks broke down on the Hill last year. And so that effort is now culminating in this rather limited, but still significant executive order that we expect to be released later this week, but, again, this use of force policy a major update to the Department of Justice's policy from 2004.

It is a much more detailed, much more robust policy that we will be seeing take place -- the expectation take place beyond the Department of Justice as well. And it's worth noting that there are tens of thousands of men and women carrying guns, members of law enforcement beyond the Department of Justice -- Victor and Alisyn.

BLACKWELL: All right, thank you, Whitney.

CAMEROTA: So, while Donald Trump's kingmaker status is on display in Georgia, the power of the Bush brand is being tested in Texas.

That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:24:23]

BLACKWELL: Voters are going to the polls in five states today.

And, yes, there's a lot of a focus on Georgia's Republican governor primary, but CNN senior data reporter Harry Enten is here to get us up to speed on the other races that might be a bit below the radar.

So, let's start with the other elections in Georgia, Harry.

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: So, Victor, the first one that I am most interested in, besides the gubernatorial race, is the Georgia secretary of state Republican primary.

Why? The incumbent, Brad Raffensperger, is receiving a challenge from Jody Hice, who has the backing of Donald Trump. Why did Donald Trump decide to back Jody Hice? It's because, how dare Raffensperger certify Joe Biden's legitimate win in the 2020 Georgia election?

[14:25:06]

You should notice here I say top candidates. Why? There are a few other candidates that are running. And keep in mind that, even if someone comes out leading in the vote count after tonight, you have to get at least 50 percent, plus one, in order to avoid a run-off. So that's something I'm going to be keeping an eye out on.

Another race in the state of Georgia that I think is really interesting is the Georgia Seventh Democratic district congressional primary. Why? This is a matchup of two incumbents. So, essentially, you have Bourdeaux and McBath. Their districts were merged in redistricting. And what essentially they did, the Republicans, who ran that redistricting process, was that both had represented swing districts. They merged those together to create one safe district that Joe Biden won by 26 points. So, we will see if either one of these candidates emerges, and we will see if they get over 50 percent of the vote plus one, Victor.

CAMEROTA: OK.

Harry, what about what's going on in Texas?

ENTEN: OK, so, Texas.

We were talking about potential Georgia races that might go to run- offs. Here are some Texas races that are in run-offs, the Texas Republican attorney general primary run-off. You might recognize the name here, George P. Bush, son of Jeb Bush. He actually kind of looks like Jeb Bush, right? He's facing off against Ken Paxton, who's the incumbent attorney general.

Paxton led in that first round that in the primary back in March 43 percent to 23 percent. Keep in mind, Paxton has the backing of Donald Trump. So this is another matchup of Trump against the Bushes. Another race on the Democratic side that I think is interesting is the Texas 28th Congressional District Democratic primary.

It's a run-off -- excuse me. And what do we have here? We have Henry Cuellar, who's the incumbent, Jessica Cisneros, who's challenging him. Back in the march primary, Cuellar led 49 percent to 47 percent, which forced a run-off, because they didn't get to 50 percent. Cuellar is one of the most conservative Democrats in Congress. Cisneros has the backing of a lot of progressive Democrats.

So this is going to be an interesting matchup between the progressive wing of the Democratic Party and the more moderate conservative wing, and we will see what happens in Texas tonight.

BLACKWELL: All right, what else you got for us?

ENTEN: What else do I got for you?

I got two other fun races for you. So, the Arkansas Republican gubernatorial primary. Sarah Huckabee Sanders, you may remember that name, of course, because Donald Trump is backing his former press secretary, Sanders. Sanders is also the daughter of former Governor Mike Huckabee.

One thing I will note, if Huckabee Sanders eventually wins the general election, she will become, with Mike Huckabee, the first father- daughter team to both govern in the same state.

Finally, here's the one other thing I have for you, probably my favorite race of the night. I'm saving the best for last, the Alabama Republican senatorial primary. What's going on here? Well, Donald Trump initially endorsed Mo Brooks, but withdrew that endorsement in March.

Very interesting. What will happen? Can Brooks actually emerge and enter a run-off tonight? Because Alabama, like the other states that I mentioned, to win, the leader needs 50 percent plus one. Otherwise, the top two run off on June 21. If Mo Brooks emerges in that run-off, quite an embarrassing result for the former president, who unendorsed him.

CAMEROTA: Harry Enten, your enthusiasm is contagious. Thank you.

(LAUGHTER)

CAMEROTA: Thank you for showing us...

BLACKWELL: I don't know what that is. I don't know what that is.

CAMEROTA: I have no idea.

ENTEN: It's exercise.

(LAUGHTER)

CAMEROTA: That's his version of exercise. That's what that is.

BLACKWELL: All right.

ENTEN: Exactly.

CAMEROTA: OK. Thanks, Harry.

ENTEN: Bye.

CAMEROTA: All right, CNN chief political correspondent Dana Bash has to follow that.

Hi, Dana. Great to see you.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: I will try to keep it at an 11.

CAMEROTA: OK.

BASH: I will try.

(LAUGHTER)

CAMEROTA: Thank you.

All right, let's talk about the significance of some -- I mean, these wins. Let's just start with Georgia, OK? And what are you looking for? And what will it mean for the future?

BASH: Well, that word at the end of that sentence that you just used, future, that really is the key.

And what has been fascinating about the way that those who are backing Brian Kemp, the incumbent Republican governor, about why he should be reelected, and not the challenger, the former Senator Perdue, who was encouraged and really pushed to run against Kemp by Donald Trump, the future is the terminology that everybody who has gone down to campaign for him has used, whether it was Mike Pence last night, or Chris Christie last week, or name your Republican either incumbent governor from another state or sort of establishment figure who are trying to put the brakes on this whole look-back to 2020 that Donald Trump is not only encouraging, but trying to demand from candidates and from voters.

It's been really interesting to see just again last night how Brian Kemp and Mike Pence, they didn't say Donald Trump's name. They didn't say even Perdue's, Kemp's Republican challenger's name. They talked about the future of the GOP and what it's going to stand for. And they talked about their race in the general election there in Georgia