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Texas School Shooting; Russia's War On Ukraine; Investigating The Insurrection. Aired 4-5a ET
Aired May 28, 2022 - 04:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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PAULA NEWTON, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Welcome to our viewers here in the United States, Canada and all around the world. I'm Paula Newton and this is CNN NEWSROOM.
Straight to our top story: 77 agonizing minutes. That's how long it took police to end the Texas school shooter's rampage at a school that left 19 children and two teachers dead on Tuesday.
That's according to the latest timeline released by officials. For much of that time, police waited in the hallway even as the gunman fired more shots and children inside the classroom he was holed up in called 9-1-1. Top police officials now admit it was a mistake to not engage the shooter earlier. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE PRODUCER: Why was this decision made not to go in and rescue these children?
COL. STEVEN MCCRAW, DIRECTOR, TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: the on-scene commander considered a barricaded subject and that there was time and there were no more children at risk.
Of course it wasn't the right decision. It was the wrong decision, period.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: Parents are outrages at the mistakes. One father telling CNN, he wonders if his daughter and others might have survived if authorities had acted more quickly. I mean, how can you not think about that?
We now know the names and faces of all 21 lives cut short. Funerals sadly set to begin next week. The Texas governor says police have a lot to answer for. CNN's Ed Lavandera picks up the story.
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GOV. GREG ABBOTT (R-TX): I was misled. I am livid about what happened. ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Explosive reaction from the Texas governor to new information about law enforcement's response on the day of the Uvalde shootings.
ABBOTT: The information they was given turned out, in part, to be inaccurate. I'm absolutely livid about that. And it is imperative that the leaders of the investigations about exactly what happened get down to the very seconds of exactly what happened with 100 percent accuracy.
LAVANDERA (voice-over): Governor's press conference coming after the Texas Department of Public Safety said police were wrong in waiting to go in and eliminate an active shooter after he started killing students and teachers.
MCCRAW: It was a wrong decision, there is no excuse for that. Texas embraces active shooter training, active shooter certification. Every officer lines up, stacks up, goes and finds where the rounds are being fired at and keeps shooting until the suspect is dead, period.
LAVANDERA (voice-over): The decision to back down from an active shooter was, according to officials, made by the school district's chief of police.
MCCRAW: The incident commander at the time was believed, you know, that in fact was a barricaded subject, that we had time, no kids were at risk.
LAVANDERA (voice-over): The admission comes after he laid out the timeline that day, 11:27 am, the teacher he said had propped open a door to go outside and grab a cell phone. Then the gunman fired shots at two people near the school grounds.
MCCRAW: There's multiple shots fired at the school at 11:32; 11:33, the suspect begins shooting in the room 111 or 112. At 11:35, three police officers entered the same door as the suspect entered.
LAVANDERA (voice-over): Gun fire continued while as many as 19 agents were still in the hallway but didn't go in the classroom until a janitor brought the keys. Second grader Edward Silva was in his classroom when the shooting started.
EDWARD SILVA, SECOND GRADER: At first they sounded like something like was popping. Like kind of like fireworks.
LAVANDERA (voice-over): Just after 12:00, the 9-1-1 calls began from a child inside the classroom, where shots were fired.
MCCRAW: She identified herself and whispered she's in room 112.
At 12:10, she called back, adviser, multiple dead; 12:13 pm again, she called on the phone; 12:16 pm called back, eight to nine students alive; 12:21 pm you could hear over the 9-1-1 call three shots fired; 12:36 pm, 9-1-1 call lasted 21 seconds, initial caller called back, student, child called back, told to stay on the line and be very quiet. She told 9-1-1 he shot the door. Approximately 12:43 pm and 12:47 pm she asked 9-1-1 to please send the police now.
LAVANDERA (voice-over): Eleven-year-old Miah Cerrillo was inside the class with the gunman, her aunt said she had to save herself.
BLANCA RIVERA, MIAH'S AUNT: Miah got some blood, put on herself and she pretended she was dead.
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LAVANDERA (voice-over): By the time the tactical team breached the classroom and killed the shooter, he had been in the room for more than an hour.
LAVANDERA: While the Texas governor says he was misled, he would not say who gave him the bad information.
CNN has also made multiple attempts throughout the day to reach the Uvalde ISD police chief. We have not been able to find him.
We did ask the superintendent of the schools and the city mayor if they thought that the ISD police chief and the city police chief should resign or be fired. Both men refused to answer that question -- Ed Lavandera, CNN, Uvalde, Texas.
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NEWTON: A witness says he called 9-1-1 after he saw the shooter crash his car in a ditch near the school and get out with a gun. The detail of what he says happened next before the shooter entered the school.
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JUAN CARRANZA, WITNESS: They exchanged fires. The police shooted (sic) at the gunman and the gunman was shooting at them. So they were taking (INAUDIBLE) protecting themselves. And I was right there on the fence, on the side, watching everything.
They were just protecting themselves. And whenever that happened, I couldn't see nothing in the back, wherever the gunman was, because he was in the back part. And it was a blind spot for me. I couldn't see it from where I was. But he shot some fires.
But I don't know where, if it went to the school or what. But that wasn't sure the cops. That was to the school.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: Now young survivors who should never have to witness such tragedy are now describing how they hid from the gunman as bullets were flying. Here's just one of those heartbreaking stories.
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JAYDEN PEREZ, ROBB ELEMENTARY SHOOTING SURVIVOR: It was very terrifying. Because I never thought that was going to happen.
There was like one, two, three, four, five of us hiding there and then the rest under a table. but that didn't stop one of my friends getting hurt.
The shooter shot through the window and hurting my friend and my teacher, like my teacher got hurt on, I don't know which but she got hit, like hit on the side. And then my friend got like shot through the nose.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: You heard Jayden there. Now he of course, he's 10. He says he doesn't want to go back to school.
Who can blame him?
Because he knows another shooting might happen. And no one can tell him otherwise.
And despite the mass shooting earlier in Uvalde, the National Rifle Association forged ahead with its convention in Houston. And it didn't stop protesters from venting their passions flared inside and outside the event.
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JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In the nation's bitter divide over guns, a tale of two America's on vivid display in Houston. Outside the convention of the National Rifle Association protesters of all ages pleading for an end to the string of deadly shooting massacres.
Inside the hall, thousands gathering in support of the Second Amendment and praising the politicians who say guns are not the root cause of the evil slaughter.
DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: And unlike some I didn't disappoint you by not showing up.
ZELENY (voice-over): As several Republican leaders backed away from attending the NRA meeting, former President Donald Trump came to voice his support for a group under siege in the wake of this week's Texas school shooting.
He read a list of victims with a tolling bell between each name. Trump took the stage to Lee Greenwood's classic, "God Bless the USA," even though Greenwood chose to stay away and not perform at the NRA out of respect for the families.
The school massacre in Uvalde, only three days and 300 miles away from the NRA convention in downtown Houston. Despite outcry as a protest, the show went on, with Trump leading the charge to change the subject.
TRUMP: If the United States has $40 billion to send to Ukraine, we should be able to do whatever it takes to keep our children safe at home.
ZELENY (voice-over): Texas Senator Ted Cruz rejected any new gun control measures, renewing his call to fortify schools with armed police officers or retired service members.
SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX): We must not react to evil and tragedy by abandoning the Constitution or infringing on the rights of our law abiding citizens.
ZELENY (voice-over): His fellow Texas Senator John Cornyn declined to attend the NRA meeting and has pledged to have at least an open dialogue with Democratic senators searching for solutions to the country's epidemic of gun violence.
Former Texas Congressman Beto O'Rourke, now a Democratic candidate for governor said it was time for all Americans to unite behind the solution.
BETO O'ROURKE (D-TX) GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: You are not our enemies. We are not yours. We extend our hands open and unarmed, in a gesture of peace and fellowship, to welcome you, to join us, to make sure that this no longer happens in this country.
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ZELENY (voice-over): While a majority of Americans support some form of tighter gun restrictions, the view of longtime NRA member Elizabeth Tom underscores the sentiment that echoed throughout many conversations here.
ELIZABETH TOM, NRA MEMBER: I know this may be somewhat controversial and I certainly don't want to hurt anyone's feelings but if any of those teachers had been armed this might have ended a lot quicker.
ZELENY: There is one gun manufacturer that is not here called Daniel Defense. They were the manufacturers of that AR-15 used in the Uvalde shooting. There simply is an empty space where their vendor was supposed to be.
The company said they didn't think was an appropriate time to be selling their merchandise. Instead, it's replaced by a popcorn stand -- Jeff Zeleny, CNN, Houston.
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NEWTON: Now last hour I spoke with Ashton P. Woods. I asked him what it would take to make meaningful gun reform happen in the United States and what a best case scenario would look like.
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ASHTON P. WOODS, CO-FOUNDER, BLACK LIVES MATTER, HOUSTON: The best case scenario right now would be to have governor Abbott call a special session to repeal the laws that were passed in 2019 and last year in 2021 that made what happened in Uvalde easier to happen. We can call it evil if we want to. But this is just as bad as governor
Abbott reducing this down to a mental health issue, where we don't have a great mental health care system. I'm sorry, non-existent mental health care system. We use our jails to address mental health.
But we must address the lack of health care access. We must address gun violence in a way that doesn't scapegoat the fact that Ted Cruz uses rhetoric that got children killed. Governor Abbott passed laws that got children killed. They must be held accountable and they must do their jobs.
NEWTON: Mr. Woods, though, even Daniel Hogg, on our air, a survivor from Parkland, said look, if everyone's just talking over each other, a compromise won't be possible. He's optimistic.
Are you optimistic that that compromise is possible?
And what does it look like?
Is it only on background checks?
Is it maybe moving the age?
What could be possible here?
WOODS: Well, you know, a lot of times as a Black person I'm still thinking about the 87-year-old woman who was murdered in Buffalo in a grocery store, who lived through Jim Crow. And she was told she had to wait. She was told she had to wait for incremental change.
Our children deserve better. These are Black and Brown kids, AAPI kids. And even our white kids, our children in general, should not have to wait for incremental change.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: Russian troops may be gone from some villages in Ukraine but they're not forgotten. CNN visits one town,, where a notorious Russian brigade terrorized residents for weeks. That story just ahead.
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NEWTON: The U.S. is now widely expected to begin supplying Ukraine with one of its most fearsome weapons. The Pentagon confirms it is looking at Ukraine's request for multi-launch rocket systems but no final decision apparently has been made.
The weapon could potentially strike Russian military targets hundreds of kilometers away. Ukraine made the urgent request, as the Russian army encroaches on the key city of Sievierodonetsk. You see it there on the map.
The Russians have moved into the outskirts but deny that the city is now surrounded. Adding to Kyiv's urgency, images of Russian crews repairing damaged rail lines near Kharkiv. The railway is a critical conduit for supplies to Russia's front lines to the south.
Ukraine's president says despite these difficulties, the country is prepared to do whatever is necessary to protect all of its sovereign territory.
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VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): The occupiers are trying to achieve and at the least in 100 days of war. The goals they hope to achieve in the first days after February 24th. Therefore, they concentrated maximum artillery, maximum reserves in Donbas.
There are missile strikes and aircraft attacks, everything. We are protecting our land in the way that our current defense resources allow. We are doing everything to increase them and we will increase them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: Meantime, a short time ago, Russian state media reported that the Russian-controlled city of Kherson has officially severed ties with Ukraine and closed its borders for, quote, "security reasons."
Withdrawal of Russian forces near Kyiv meantime is gradually revealing more evidence of alleged war crimes. And local residents are readily identifying some of the Russian troops they claim are responsible. Melissa Bell has our report.
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MELISSA BELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Russian tanks entering the village of Lypivka in late February. Now in charge here of life and of death.
Six weeks later, now back in control of the village, Ukrainian authorities begin counting the dead.
"I can't look," says one mother.
It was only after the tanks had withdrawn that Ukrainian prosecutors were able to start piecing together what had happened. They now suspect these men of crimes in violation of the rules and customs of war.
RUSLAN KRAVCHENKO, UKRAINIAN REGIONAL PROSECUTOR (through translator): On this street, nine soldiers of the 64th Brigade imprisoned unarmed civilians. They detained and tortured them for 10 days, inflicting bodily harm and carrying out mock executions.
[04:20:00] BELL (voice-over): We wanted to see for ourselves where some of these alleged crimes may have been committed. Going door to door with pictures of the soldiers, we meet Andriy (ph), who recognized one of them.
BELL: Is it locked?
BELL (voice-over): He leads us down to a cellar, where he says Russian soldiers tried to kill a group of men and women who had been hiding.
They used grenades and rifles, he says. But the civilians managed to survive by heading further into the darkness.
BELL: This is the scene of just one of the alleged crimes of the men of the 64th Brigade. It is littered with cigarettes and bullet casings.
BELL (voice-over): Back in Lypivka, we show Mikolaus Nak (ph), a local resident, a picture of commander Vasyl Lytvynenko. He recognizes him immediately and invited us into what is left of his home.
He and his family hid in the woods, he says, while his home was destroyed by the Russian artillery that killed his neighbor. When he tried to come back, he says the commander seemed surprised.
He said, "What are you doing here? You should have been burnt alive."
Mikolaus (ph) still doesn't know why he decided to let him live.
IRYNA VENEDIKTOVA, PROSECUTOR GENERAL OF UKRAINE: Rape enough people, torture enough people, for what?
Because they wanted to scare civilians, scare our citizens of towns, villages, cities.
BELL (voice-over): After withdrawing from the Bucha area, the brigade's men were promoted by Moscow. The Kremlin denies any involvement in the mass killings.
The 64th Brigade was created after the Georgian war, according to Ukrainian intelligence.
"The soldiers of this barricade," he says, "were noted for the robberies and rapes. But instead of bringing order to the brigade, the Russian command armed it," he explains, "with modern weapons and sent it into Ukraine."
Beyond working out exactly what the Russian soldiers who occupied this area north of Kyiv might have been responsible for, the big question for Ukrainian prosecutors now is where they are -- Melissa Bell, CNN, Kyiv.
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NEWTON: Now the allegations that we laid out there really never reach average Russians. That's because the Kremlin has control of the media. In that version of reality, Russian military operations are justified. Russia is winning and any negative information is a lie.
So are allegations of Russian atrocities. Many Russians are buying the Kremlin's line. My next guest is a senior researcher at the Monterey Initiative in Russian Studies.
Thanks so much for joining us. You are working on a book about this, set to come out next year, called "Russia's War." And you've been down right forensic about how disinformation and propaganda has systemically fortified its support for the war.
We talk about the influence of state TV.
What about young people on social media?
You say they are encouraged to picture themselves as heroes, that they are certainly trying to look at history and make it relevant to them.
How and why has that been effective?
JADE MCGLYNN, MONTEREY INITIATIVE IN RUSSIAN STUDIES: Thank you, Paula. One of the things I've been I looking into for the book is analysis into which of the social media posts, where young people are likely getting their information.
Unfortunately, they make for quite depressing results in the sense that, you know, soldiers with children, pictures of them mocking Ukrainians, there's a lot of humor.
But it's very dark humor and it doesn't necessarily point to the idea that younger generations are consuming a diet of more healthy media or media that is perhaps closer to what we know is really happening in Ukraine.
The other aspect that you spoke about there, which is the youth patriotic training, the military history camps, is another reason I think we should be concerned, maybe, about the legacy that this is going to leave, even as difficult as it seems now, thinking when this will end.
What will happen to those generations that have grown up under Putin?
He's been in power for 22 years -- well, 23 years, if you want to count 1999. And he has set up a system of patriotic education in the last decade that is really, really, I think, frightening --
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MCGLYNN: -- in terms of the militarism and the idea that Russia is surrounded by enemies that it inculcates children with.
NEWTON: Some of those social media posts are dehumanizing. They're not treating Ukrainians as humans, as if they should be treated differently. At first, Russia put out the message that we were saving Ukrainians
from the Nazis. Then all Ukrainians were Nazis. And now they've shifted the narrative again of pitting more the East against the West.
How persuasive is this for the Russian public?
MCGLYNN: That's exactly right. So as you say, after the initial, I think, shock, actually, of not being met as liberators, there was quite a drastic shift, was trying to make out that almost all Ukrainians were Nazis.
And that's when we saw this shift to really chilling language, that Ukrainians were regularly referred to as filth and scum and non-people in a way that was really quite chilling.
So this dehumanization, an attempt to cast them as Nazis, to justify killing them. But in the last sort of few days, perhaps week or so, as Russia started to make gains in Donbas, there's been a clear change in the way that Russian media is depicting Ukrainians.
And now they're trying to exploit what they perceive as divisions between East Ukraine and West Ukraine; in particular a technique which they quite like, which is showing clips of people's social media, which is impossible to verify, Eastern Ukrainians saying they're fed up with Western Ukrainians because they're not really doing the fighting.
And there's also pictures of West European, mocking those in the east and also use of the Poles, the idea that Poles are going to take people in Western Ukrainians and East Ukrainians don't want to fight for Poland. But I don't think these divisions truly exist anymore since the Russians invaded.
So it's unlikely to see how popular that will be.
NEWTON: You know, there has been a little bit of criticism, even on state television. We had that former Russian officer saying let's not drink those information tranquilizers. He insists Ukraine will fight on and Russia remains isolated.
Do any of these voices of dissent make any difference?
We keep hoping, oh, Russians will come to their senses.
But is that really realistic?
MCGLYNN: I think that's an important question. There's a couple of points there.
We have to ask ourselves why are we, in the West, so interested in this question of, you know, do all Russians know what's happening?
Because realistically, Putin doesn't need a majority of Russians to support the war. He can do it anyway. He isn't tethered by democratic demands. And it's difficult to see an end to this war. So there's this desire for some sort of outside force, some variable
in Russian public opinion, that will solve the situation. But I find that highly unlikely, firstly, because of the level of oppression and authoritarianism within Russia.
Secondly, because the propaganda really does work, not necessarily in motivating people to be ferociously pro war but certainly helping to at least accept the war, especially combined with the fear we spoke about.
So I think that expecting voices of dissent to in any way shift or alter the Kremlin's calculations is wishful thinking.
NEWTON: The way Russians view themselves historically, they believe they're on the righteous side. Jade McGlynn, really interesting stuff. Thanks so much.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NEWTON: Now still ahead for us, Texas governor Greg Abbott is dismissing calls for gun reform following the deadly shooting in Uvalde. What he says is the real problem behind such tragedies.
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NEWTON: Welcome back to CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Paula Newton, returning to our top story.
There's outrage and confusion in Uvalde, Texas, after officials again revise the details and timeline of the horrific shooting at Robb Elementary School. On Friday, 77 minutes passed between the time the gunman entered the school and the tactical team entered the classroom.
We've also learned that while officers were in the hallway, students locked in the room, if you can imagine, with the shooter, called 9-1- 1, calling for help, wondering where police were. Officials now admit that major mistakes were made.
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MCCRAW: I have a little bit of hindsight, where I'm sitting now. Of course, it was not the right decision, it was the wrong decision. Very. There's no excuse that. But again, I wasn't there. But I was telling you, from what we know, that we believe there should have been entry into that as soon as you can.
Hey, when there's an active shooter, the rules change. It's no longer, OK, it's a barricaded subject. You don't have time.
(END VIDEO CLIP) NEWTON: In the meantime, the two funeral homes in Uvalde say they
will cover all funerals for the victims at no cost.
Now Jennifer Gaitan was waiting outside the school, desperate for answers about her child. Thankfully, her daughter survived. But you'll want to hear what she told CNN.
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JENNIFER GAITAN, SURVIVOR'S MOTHER: My daughter had let me know that they heard shootings outside that were hitting the windows, that they didn't break. So the teacher, you know, quickly told them, hurry, get behind a table. Shut off the lights.
And that's exactly what they did. And apparently he did open the door and he thought nobody was in there. And he went on. And it is amazing to know that, if she thought so quick to what to do and got -- and I mean, it's amazing.
It's amazing how she thought so quick in a moment of, you know, trauma, you know. It is. But yes. She is, she saved that classroom's life.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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NEWTON: Gaitan says parents were begging police to take action while their kids were inside. Here's how she describes the chaos.
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GAITAN: We were behind the crosstape and, you know, we're asking and begging them to do something. And I mean, if you can see in one of the videos, the cop gives me a thumb's up. And that's after he's already had physical confrontations with me and tried to put me down.
And I mean, I feel like it was totally -- they were not concerned about the real trauma that was happening inside. Honestly, I think they did. They waited too long, too long. Because I was out here. I was out and I mean, I'm not the only parent who witnessed it. It's sad that a lot of parents witnessed it.
And then to see that they're saying that it was, you know, they got in here quick and handled business, that's not, that is not the way that it happened.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NEWTON: According to police, the gunman entered the building through an unlocked door and says it's horrifying to know that the school was so unprepared.
While many are calling for stricter gun control, Texas governor Abbott says the focus should be on mental health. CNN's Nick Watt with more on that. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK WATT, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Governor Greg Abbott isn't talking at all about gun control. But he does talk a lot about mental health.
ABBOTT: Anybody who shoots somebody else has a mental health challenge. Period.
WATT: This at his press conference the day after those 21 murders in Uvalde.
ABBOTT: We, as a government need to find a way to target that mental health challenge and to do something about it.
WATT: Nearly five years ago, after 26 were slaughtered in a Baptist Church in Sutherland Springs, he told CNN this.
ABBOTT: One of the challenges we have to deal with is not just evil but also mental health challenges.
WATT: Today, nearly five years later, mental health -- America's 2022 access to care rankings puts Texas dead last.
Governor Abbott clearly has other priorities. Just a month ago, he diverted nearly half a billion of mostly COVID relief surplus funds to what he calls the disaster at the southern border while taking a political pop at President Biden's open border policies. And he said this. Texans' safety and security is our top priority. And we will continue fighting to keep our community safe.
But undocumented immigrants have substantially lower crime rates than native born citizens, states of recent academic study of Texas the most aggressive immigrant removal programs have not delivered on their crime reduction promises and are unlikely to do so in the future.
To be fair, Operation Lone Star does also target illegal drugs seeping into Texas. But in the meantime, at least 388 people have been killed in mass shootings in Texas on Governor Abbott's watch while he has rolled back gun restrictions.
WATT: So briefly back to that, nearly half a billion that was diverted down to the border, now it was taken from various departments in Texas and they were essentially reimbursed with money that was surplus COVID relief funds.
Now the governor took more than $200 million from the Department of Health and Human Services. And that led some people to say, hang on, is he taking money away from health care?
His office tells me that is, quote, "completely inaccurate." The department tells me that all of their mental health programs are, indeed, fully funded.
Budgets for health care, mental health care have shown a modest uptick over the past couple of years. And the governor's spokesperson also tells me that he works hard to increase funding and access to mental health care in Texas.
But don't forget that Texas ranks last in the United States for access to mental health care -- Nick Watt, CNN, Los Angeles.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NEWTON: Now if you would like to provide financial support or blood donations, go to cnn.com/impact. You'll find several ways to help and a good credible source of information.
And there's more to come for you here on CNN, including criticism of the panel investigating the January 6 insurrection from a close ally of former president Trump. A report from Capitol Hill, next.
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NEWTON: House minority leader Kevin McCarthy is refusing to comply with a subpoena to appear before the committee investigating the January 6 attack on Capitol Hill. The panel wants him to answer questions about his communications with former president Trump and White House staff in the days before the attack.
Instead, McCarthy has issued a list of demands. CNN's Ryan Nobles has that story.
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RYAN NOBLES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The January 6 select committee is not having any success with their subpoena requests of a number of Republican members, who they are now requiring to participate in their investigation.
The latest is the House minority leader, Kevin McCarthy, who sent a letter to the committee on Friday, outlining a long list of reasons why he doesn't believe that he's legally required to comply with this subpoena.
Making the argument that he doesn't believe the committee was formed under constitutional grounds, that it's not legally valid and it's not working with a goal of a legislative purpose in mind.
He along with Jim Jordan, a fellow Republican member of the House, also under subpoena, penned an op-ed in "The Wall Street Journal," saying this step is a dangerous one and could lead to more gridlock in the coming years, especially if Republicans take control of the House in the fall.
Now this leads to the question of exactly what the committee will do now that the Republican members have essentially called their bluff.
What enforcement mechanism do they have at their disposal to require them to participate in this investigation?
And if they don't, how will they be punished?
The one option they have is they could submit a criminal contempt referral to the Department of Justice and ask them to indict these members of Congress for not complying.
There's a lot of uncertainty as to whether or not that is a firm legal ground for the committee to be on.
Or do they send this the route of the ethics committee, deal with it in house and have a group of both Republicans and Democrats determine whether or not the defiance of these Republican members rises to the level of requiring punishment.
Regardless, what it means in the short term is that the committee's just not going to get the information that they're looking for from these members of Congress.
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NOBLES: How valuable is that to their investigation in the long term?
The committee believes that they can piece together some of the information that they have or have learned about these members of Congress from outside witnesses, depositions, phone records and other pieces of information that they have discovered.
But one thing is clear, whatever information that they need specifically from these members of Congress will not be at their disposal at their hearings, which are coming up in the next couple weeks, the first one scheduled for June 9th -- Ryan Nobles, CNN, on Capitol Hill.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NEWTON: A jury has begun deliberating in Johnny Depp's defamation lawsuit against his ex-wife. Lawyers for both delivered closing arguments Friday after the court heard over 100 hours of testimony over six weeks.
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CAMILLE VASQUEZ, DEPP ATTORNEY: On May 27th, 2016, Ms. Heard walked into a courthouse in Los Angeles, California, to get a no notice ex parte restraining order against Mr. Depp and in doing so ruined his life by falsely telling the world that she was a survivor of domestic abuse at the hands of Mr. Depp.
Today, on May 27th, 2022, exactly six years later, we ask you to give Mr. Depp his life back by telling the world that Mr. Depp is not the abuser Ms. Heard said he is and hold Ms. Heard accountable for her lies.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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BEN ROTTENBORN, HEARD ATTORNEY: This whole case is about blaming Amber Heard for things she didn't do. But that's what Mr. Depp does. That's what he's always done, blame other people, refuse to take accountability.
But the problem for him here is he's running headlong into the United States Constitution, which says that you cannot hold Amber Heard liable for words she didn't write or publish. But here we are.
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NEWTON: Depp is suing Heard over an opinion piece she wrote for "The Washington Post" in 2018. In it she presented herself as a survivor of domestic abuse. Depp says she defamed him and caused him to lose acting roles. Heard has counter sued for $100 million.
Now the entire state of New Mexico, think about that, is under a red flag warning for wildfires right now.
Plus the Champions League final. We preview the matchup after the break.
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NEWTON: Parts of the U.S. are being threatened by severe storms and tornadoes this Memorial Day weekend. Significant damage, you see it there, has already been reported in some states. That's including at least 20 destroyed homes in Virginia.
The storms will stretch throughout several states and could disrupt travel for millions of people, expected to hit the roads during this holiday weekend.
On the other side of the country, thousands of firefighters are working against massive wildfires in New Mexico. The Hermit's Peak Canyon fire has burned more than 312,000 acres and is the largest the state has ever seen.
The Block (ph) fire could eventually overtake it. It's burned almost 180,000 acres so far and is only starting to be contained.
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NEWTON: And that wraps this hour. I'm Paula Newton. Stay with us. We'll be right back with more news in a moment.
