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Texas School Shooting; Russia's War on Ukraine; Colombia Votes; Australia Gun Laws; Human Rights Chief Visit to Xinjiang "Not an Investigation"; Tropical Storm Agatha. Aired 2-3a ET
Aired May 29, 2022 - 02:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us all around the world, I'm Michael Holmes, appreciate your company.
Coming up here on CNN NEWSROOM, hundreds gathered in a small Texas town to share their grief, remembering the 19 students and two teachers killed at an elementary school.
Chaos outside the Champions League final. Police used tear gas and pepper spray at security checks as fans blocked turnstiles after they found out they had bought fake tickets.
And a 14 year old Palestinian boy shot and killed by Israeli security forces in Bethlehem, the latest victim of a surge of violence in the region.
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HOLMES: We begin in Uvalde, Texas, a community still very much in mourning, beset by grief and outrage after a massacre that left a 19 children and two teachers dead at an elementary school.
Now in the coming hours, U.S. President Joe Biden and first lady Jill Biden will travel to Uvalde to do something they did just a couple of weeks ago in Buffalo, New York: comfort the victims of gun violence.
There is, of course, grief in Uvalde but also support for the community. On Saturday, a long line of mourners waiting to lay flowers at a memorial set up outside Robb Elementary School; 21 empty chairs placed outside a local business, each one for a lost life in Tuesday's rampage.
But as the community and the nation reel from yet another mass shooting, outrage grows over the timeline of events at this particular one and why a group of law enforcement officers waited so long before they rushed the gunman. CNN's Adrienne Broaddus is in Uvalde with the latest.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) ADRIENNE BROADDUS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We have seen a mix of emotions anger, frustration and disappointment after that 9-1-1 call timeline became more clear. But folks have wrapped their arms around the folks of Uvalde and its community.
I've seen lines like this, if you take a look, for folks waiting to purchase concert tickets or receive free food or other items. But these people are not waiting in line, in the oppressive heat, to get something. They're here to give and show their support.
Many have traveled from near and beyond. I talked to a person from El Paso. Some folks traveled from San Antonio, which is about 85 miles away, to lay flowers, balloons and stuffed animals on the lawn of Robb Elementary School, where those 19 students were killed and their two female teachers.
Parents we spoke to are stunned. They were shocked after they learned more than 80 minutes passed, between the time the initial 9-1-1 call came in and when the shooter was killed.
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JENNIFER GAITAN, ROBB ELEMENTARY PARENT: They were not concerned about the real trauma that was happening inside.
Honestly I think they did, they waited too long, too long, because I was out here. I was out here and I mean, I'm not the only parent that witnessed it. It's sad that a lot of parents witnessed it. And then to see that they're saying that it was, you know, they had gotten here quick and handled business, that's not -- that is not the way that happened.
ALFRED GARZA, AMERIE JO'S FATHER: Had they gotten in there sooner and somebody would have taken immediate action, we might have more of those children here today, including my daughter.
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BROADDUS: So not only are parents upset but this entire community is upset and, of course, grieving. On Saturday, family members and friends of one of the victims showed up here to the school.
And as they walked away from this overwhelming memorial, one of the relatives kept saying, "Oh, my God. Oh, my God" -- Adrienne Broaddus, CNN, Uvalde, Texas.
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HOLMES: U.S. Vice President Kamala Harris is calling for an assault weapons ban in the United States, in the wake of the shootings in both Buffalo and Uvalde.
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KAMALA HARRIS (D), VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Let's have an assault weapons ban. You know what an assault weapon is?
You know how an assault weapon was designed?
It was designed for a specific purpose: to kill a lot of human beings quickly. An assault weapon is a weapon of war, with no place, no place, in a civil society.
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HOLMES: She made those comments to reporters after attending the funeral for the oldest person killed in the Buffalo shooting, 86-year- old Ruth Whitfield.
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HOLMES: CNN's Joe Johns is in Buffalo with more.
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JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: The remarks of the vice president at this memorial service in Buffalo were brief and very impassioned. She did speak with the family members of victims of the shooting here in Buffalo.
She also talked, of course, with family members of Ruth Whitfield, the 86-year-old woman, who is being memorialized at Mt. Olive Church. But the initial guidance had been that she did not want to speak at the memorial service, because she was concerned that she might be accused of politicizing the event.
Nonetheless, she was called on to speak by reverend Al Sharpton during the eulogy. She talked about hate and fear, two of the things that she sees as tying together so many of the mass shootings in the United States.
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HARRIS: This is a moment that requires all good people, all God loving people, to stand up and say, we will not stand for this. Enough is enough. We will come together, based on what we all know we have in common. and we will not let those people who are motivated by hate separate us or make us feel fear.
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JOHNS: Before departing Buffalo, the vice president also talked with reporters about some of the policy issues facing legislators back in Washington, including the issue of an assault weapons ban and expanded background checks for guns -- Joe Johns, CNN, Buffalo.
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HOLMES: Turning now to Ukraine, that country's military says some of the most intense fighting of the war is now taking place in the eastern Donbas region.
According to Ukrainian officials, Russian troops are on the outskirts of Sievierodonetsk and a fierce battle is raging at a hotel on the city's northern edge. But Ukrainian forces are striking back. This Ukrainian video purportedly showing a Russian target being hit in one of the city's northern suburbs.
And Russian state media reports a Russian cargo ship has arrived in Mariupol to transport thousands of tons of Ukrainian metal to Russia. Ukrainian calls it looting.
Local Ukrainian officials say Russian shelling on Saturday killed at least one person in a residential area of Mykolaiv. That city lies near the southern end of the front lines. CNN's Sara Sidner visited one Ukrainian unit facing off against the Russian advance.
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SARA SIDNER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We're driving toward the front lines and you can see there is nowhere to take cover here. We have just seen an outgoing rocket that is headed toward the Russian position. But you always have to worry about what's coming back.
SIDNER (voice-over): We passed the remnants of a Russian army truck, blown to smithereens. Deputy Commander Nazar of the Ukrainian Army's 63rd Mechanized Brigade jumps out.
DEPUTY COMMANDER NAZAR, 63RD MECHANIZED BRIGADE, UKRAINIAN ARMY (through translator): This is what happens to Russians when they step on my dear Ukrainian soil.
SIDNER (voice-over): We move to the troop positions. We are told to hurry. This landscape is unforgiving. It looks like we're in a forest but this is what this part of Ukraine's Mykolaiv district looks like from a drone, a razor-thin line of trees, the only cover around.
SIDNER: We're now in the trench. The Russians are just past this camera, just past this area on the other side of a huge field.
SIDNER (voice-over): At this moment, he tells us, we're just two kilometers away, less than 1.5 miles from Russian forces.
NAZAR (through translator): Along this tree line, there are Russian positions.
SIDNER: The enemy is there. He is pointing to where their positions are.
SIDNER (voice-over): The soldiers are always watching from the ground. And sometimes, from their drone in the air, when they see the Russian target, they strike.
A direct hit to a Russian vehicle, then a second explosion from whatever catches fire inside it. But Russia has its artillery and drones, too. The faintest sound of one sends the deputy commander and his soldier back undercover. SIDNER: How brutal has this fight been on this front line?
NAZAR (through translator): The Russians are using artillery, conventional artillery, missile artillery. They work over the trenches with my units. They hit settlements and civilians, too. We didn't do anything to them.
SIDNER: What has your worst day been like in these trenches?
NAZAR (through translator): A direct hit, four soldiers dead in one strike.
SIDNER (voice-over): His troops have been battling here for a long time. But how long is classified.
SIDNER: What are you hearing and dealing with every day?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Almost every day, we have some incoming.
SIDNER (voice-over): But 26-year-old Pavel (ph) says at least he's with family, literally.
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SIDNER (voice-over): This is his 59-year-old father, Yaroslav, and his 34-year-old brother, Nazar.
SIDNER: You are a father. You have your two boys here with you, your two sons.
What's it's like fighting together?
YAROSLAV, NAZAR'S FATHER (through translator): Very simple. Very easy and simple.
SIDNER (voice-over): For them, trench life is easier, because they're fighting for each other.
SIDNER: What does their mother say about you all fighting together here in this most dangerous place?
NAZAR (through translator): Mother surely worries about us. She is nervous. Also, our wives and our children worry.
SIDNER (voice-over): She has plenty to worry about. A soldier shares his video of recent incoming Russian fire. The naked eye can easily spot where it landed.
When you are just over a mile from the front line --
SIDNER: Whenever we're out in the open, so we're out in the open, we have to run.
SIDNER (voice-over): Here, you're close enough to be killed by gunfire, not just shelling from a tank -- Sara Sidner, CNN, Mykolaiv district, Ukraine.
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HOLMES: The leaders of both France and Germany have again appealed to Vladimir Putin to stop the war. On Saturday, president Emmanuel Macron and chancellor Olaf Scholz urged the Russian president in a phone call to order a cease-fire and to end the blockade of Ukrainian ports. CNN's Nada Bashir has the latest for us from London, joins me now.
This has happened before. This isn't the first time European leaders have called on Putin to negotiate.
But have we seen any real progress on the diplomatic front?
NADA BASHIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, Michael, we have seen this before. Over the last few weeks we have seen the likes of France, Germany and other European nations committing their support to Ukraine, stepping up their military support for Ukraine.
But now of course, we're seeing France and Germany doubling down on those diplomatic efforts. It comes just ahead of the European Council summit, set to begin tomorrow.
But what we have heard from France and Germany is that both Macron and Scholz initiated this call with President Putin on Saturday, according to the German government. The call lasted about 18 minutes and it focused on four key issues.
Firstly, on renewing their call for a cease-fire and the withdrawal of Russian troops. They called on Putin to accept serious and direct negotiations with President Zelenskyy. That is key, because we have seen other Ukrainian officials and Russian officials taking part in talks with little success.
But this is a direct call for Putin to engage in the talks with Zelenskyy. Zelenskyy has said that he would be open to those direct negotiations.
They called for the release of Ukrainian prisoners of war and, importantly, urging Putin to lift the blockade of Ukrainian ports to allow for the export of grain. Of course, Ukraine is one of the largest producers of grain for the global market. Many parts of Africa and the Middle East highly dependent on Ukrainian grain exports.
We've heard over the last few weeks from the U.N. World Food Programme, warning that if those blockades aren't lifted, we could be seeing famine-like conditions in those regions. So a serious concern there, concern for the international community, of course.
And we have heard from prime minister Boris Johnson as well, on the matter of negotiations. He struck a different tone. He spoke on Friday to Bloomberg. And let me read you a little bit of what he said.
"How can you deal with a crocodile," in this case, Russia, "when it is in the middle of eating your left leg?" That was what Boris Johnson said on Friday. He believes that President Putin is trying to freeze the conflict and won't engage in any talks or attempts to create a cease-fire until Russia is in control of large parts of Ukraine.
The Kremlin did speak on Friday. They did say -- we've heard from Peskov, the Kremlin spokesperson, saying that Russia expects Ukraine to accept Moscow's territorial demands. But they also accused Kyiv of freezing the negotiation process. Michael.
HOLMES: Yes, creating effects on the ground as it were.
Also, interesting, we're hearing that the Kremlin is scrapping the age limit and nationality limits for enlistment in the army.
BASHIR: We've heard that just over the weekend. President Putin signing that law, scrapping the upper age limit for enlistment in the armed forces, for both Russian citizens and foreign nationals. Previously, at that age, it would've been 18 to 40 for Russian nationals, 18 to 30 for foreign nationals.
That age limit has been scrapped according to the Kremlin, because they believe that scrapping the age limit, allowing older nationals to join the Russian armed forces, will bring in further expertise.
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BASHIR: Specialist expertise in the medical field and engineering and using specific military equipment. So that is the explanation that has been given by the Russian government.
Of course, we've heard from numerous NATO Western sources that Russia has suffered significant troop losses. There have been issues within the upper ranks of the armed force, command issues, low morale.
The Russian military, the Russian government itself has acknowledged troop losses. So President Putin is focusing on strengthening the Russian military as this war continues. Michael.
HOLMES: Good to see you. We appreciate it.
Now Saturday marked 100 days since Russian officials detained the U.S. basketball star Brittney Griner. The WNBA Players Association is renewing calls for her release.
Now in a statement, the group ,said quote, "Brittney Griner is our teammate, our friend and our sister. She is a record breaker, a gold medalist, a wife, a daughter, a champion, a role model and all-star and so much more."
The two-time Olympic gold medalist was arrested in February at an airport in Moscow. Russian authorities claim they found cannabis oil in her luggage. The U.S. government are saying that Griner's wrongfully detained and the State Department is working to get her released. Jerusalem bracing for possible new violence ahead of nationalist
marches that are expected to get underway a few hours from now. Israeli right wing groups are set to march through the old part of the city to mark Jerusalem Day. The event has led to violence in the past. But now there's even more cause for concern.
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HOLMES (voice-over): Israeli troops shot and killed a 14-year-old Palestinian boy on Friday. His funeral, you see there, held on Saturday. But as Atika Shubert reports, there are different versions about how the teen was killed.
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ATIKA SHUBERT, JOURNALIST: Zaid Ghuneim had just finished dinner here at his parents' house when he stepped outside and started to walk to his grandparents' house, about half a kilometer away from here.
Now according to his brother, the 14-year old was not aware that there were clashes happening with Israeli soldiers near that area. We spoke to several eyewitnesses there. They tell us that he was chased into a nearby garage. And that's where he was shot once in each leg, twice in the back and once in the neck.
That is according to Palestinian medics who arrived on the scene. Now we asked the Israeli military for a response to explain what happened. They told us in a statement that Israeli soldiers were in the area, conducting quote, "routine security activity," when they came under attack with rocks and Molotov cocktails, quote, "endangering their lives."
And that is when Israeli soldiers responded with live fire, injuring one person. Now according to that statement, Israeli soldiers also performed first aid.
But according to the Palestinian Ministry of Health, once Zaid Ghuneim was brought to the hospital, he was pronounced dead. Unfortunately, this is the second minor in a week that has been shot and killed by Israeli forces. They are the latest victims in a surge of violence across Israel and the West Bank -- Atika Shubert, for CNN, near Bethlehem.
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HOLMES: Still to come on the program, Real Madrid wins the most prestigious championship in European football in a final marred by clashes between fans and police. We will have a report from Paris.
Also voters in Colombia set to pick a new president amid some turbulent times. We will show you what is at stake and who is leading at the polls. We will be right back.
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HOLMES (voice-over): Thousands of Real Madrid fans, you see there, are celebrating late into the night in the Spanish capital, after the team won its 14th Champions League title, beating Liverpool 1-0.
Not all felt like celebrating, though. Hundreds of people took to the streets of Madrid and fought with riot police instead.
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HOLMES: And in France, the match marred by clashes between police and fans outside the stadium.
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HOLMES: In the coming hours, millions of voters will head to the polls in the first round of Colombia's presidential election. Six candidates vying to lead the country. The front-runner is left-wing candidate Gustavo Petro, a former guerrilla fighter and mayor of Bogota.
Right-wing candidate Federico Gutierrez has been running second. He is a former mayor of Medellin.
And it's not just the top of the ticket that is drawing interest in this election. Stefano Pozzebon tells us why the next vice president of Colombia could make history.
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STEFANO POZZEBON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): When Francia Marquez left school at 16 due to a teenage pregnancy, she would have never thought, 25 years later, her name would be chanted on the streets.
It's a remarkable turnaround for a political leader, whose career began as a gold miner, then as a house cleaner, an environmental defender and now a candidate for the vice presidency of Colombia.
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POZZEBON (voice-over): This Sunday, the same name is on the ballot as the left-wing coalition tries to reach power for the first time in Colombia's history. And Marquez could become the first vice president of Afro-Colombian dissent, a significant moment she is fully aware of.
FRANCIA MARQUEZ, COLOMBIAN VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (through translator): I was thinking of that dream of Martin Luther King. I also have a dream. I have a dream to see my country at peace, to see my country full of joy and dignity. POZZEBON (voice-over): Her candidacy has energized a new generation
under the slogan of "Let's have a flavorful life," but has also been the target of hate and racist attacks. She held rallies behind gun shields after receiving death threats, while a famous singer called her King Kong on the campaign trail.
POZZEBON: Only the ballots this Sunday will say if Francia Marquez is successful and her quest for office a triumph. But even if it ended in defeat, her supporters say she has already made history, because the barriers she broke to come here date back from centuries.
POZZEBON (voice-over): The Afro-Colombian community traces its roots to slaves brought here in the 1600s. Marquez herself told CNN that one of her ancestors was enslaved in Africa and taken to Colombia to work in gold mines.
Columbia's Pacific coast is home to the second largest of her descendant community in South America but one that has been historically neglected and marginalized. Here, people say, it's easier to join the army than go to university. For young people like Marlin Garces, Marquez represents a change for the entire community.
MARLIN GARCES, MARQUEZ SUPPORTER (through translator): We're moving from struggle to power. We're showing this is not temporary. The community identifies with this battle.
POZZEBON (voice-over): Change often happens in an unexpected way. It was 2008 When hope and change swept the first African American president into office in the U.S. Back then, Marquez was a single mother of two, cleaning homes to make a living. Now, it's her supporters who chant, "Yes, we can" -- Stefano Pozzebon, CNN, Colombia.
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HOLMES: Many countries tightened gun laws immediately after mass shootings but not here in the U.S. Coming up, we will take a look at how inaction after gun violence is a uniquely American reaction.
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HOLMES: U.S. President Joe Biden will travel to Uvalde in Texas in the coming hours, in a role that has become far too familiar.
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HOLMES: Consoling a grieving community after yet another school shooting in America.
Tuesday's massacre at Robb Elementary School left 19 children and two teachers dead. But amid the grief, there is also growing outrage about why law enforcement officers waited so long to rush the gunman, even as children inside the school repeatedly dialed 9-1-1 for help.
Just hours away from Uvalde, both sides of the gun control debate are raising their voices, as the powerful gun lobby, the National Rifle Association, holds its meeting in Houston. CNN's Camila Bernal has more on day two of that conference.
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CAMILA BERNAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We have seen and heard two very different points of views here in Houston over the last couple of days. Inside of the convention and just hearing from NRA members, they say they're excited to be here.
They, of course, heard from the former president Donald Trump, who said that he was happy to be here, that he did not want to disappoint his supporters by not showing up, essentially, repeating this Republican message, focused on schools, saying that schools should only have one entryway and that, at the entrance, an armed guard should always be there.
Also saying that there are some teachers should be armed. He repeated a line that senator Ted Cruz had said earlier in the day, where they say that the only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. Here is part of former president Donald Trump's message.
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DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: A now familiar parade of cynical politician seeking to exploit the tears of sobbing families to increase their own power and take away our constitutional rights.
Every time a disturbed or demented person commit such a hideous crime, there's always a grotesque effort by some in our society to use the suffering of others to advance their own extreme political agenda.
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BERNAL: And outside of the convention, completely different messages, you're hearing the chants, "Shame on you." They are demanding change. They're asking for stricter gun control legislation.
They say that more can be done, including voting and getting their elected officials involved. Beto O'Rourke, the Democratic gubernatorial candidate for the state of Texas, spoke on Friday. And here's what he told his supporters.
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BETO O'ROURKE (D-TX), GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: The time for us to have stopped Uvalde was right after Sandy Hook. The time for us to have stopped Uvalde was right after Parkland. The time for us to have stopped Uvalde was right after Santa Fe High School.
The time for us to stop the next mass shooting in this country is right now, right here, today, with every single one of us. (END VIDEO CLIP)
BERNAL: And a lot of the people who have been here for the last couple of days say that voting is key and that they are going to get involved over the next couple of months to get that change that they so desperately want -- Camila Bernal, CNN, Houston, Texas.
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HOLMES: Mass shootings don't only happen in the United States, of course. But it may be the only country where they happen over and over again. CNN's Tom Foreman looks at how other countries have successfully dealt with this deadly issue.
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TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): When five people were gunned down in the United Kingdom last summer, the nation was shocked. It has had some of the world's toughest gun laws ever since a mass school shooting in 1996.
Gun deaths fell by half and mass shootings became extremely rare. So in the wake of the new attack, the government announced even tighter restrictions, including mandatory medical tests for mental illness or instability in would-be gun owners.
BORIS JOHNSON, U.K. PRIME MINISTER: My thoughts are very much with the families of all of those who have tragically lost their lives in an absolutely appalling incident.
FOREMAN (voice-over): Large-scale shootings have triggered new limits on gun ownership and access in numerous countries. And advocates for gun control point to them as proof that mass shooting incidents can be dramatically reduced.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A gunman kills more than 2 dozen people and injures several others.
FOREMAN (voice-over): Thirty-five people were killed during an Australian shooting spree in 1996. Despite a strong gun culture and stiff political resistance, the government launched a massive gun buyback program, banning automatic and semi auto weapons. Murders and suicides with firearms plummeted. And there has only been one mass shooting since.
JUSTIN TRUDEAU, CANADIAN PRIME MINISTER: There is no need in Canada for guns designed to kill.
FOREMAN (voice-over): Canada has enacted tough gun education, qualification and registration requirements in response to mass shootings there.
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FOREMAN (voice-over): A slaughter in Nova Scotia in 2020 spurred opponents to say those laws don't work. But again, gun control advocates note an overall downward trend in gun deaths over the past 20 years.
BARACK OBAMA, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We know that other countries in response to one mass shooting have been able to craft laws that almost eliminate mass shootings.
FOREMAN (voice-over): After 51 people were killed in New Zealand in 2019 by an Australian gunman, who targeted mosques, the government, in six days, went after military style semi automatic weapons, high capacity magazines and more.
JACINDA ARDERN, NEW ZEALAND PRIME MINISTER: Every semi automatic weapon used in a terrorist attack on Friday will be banned in this country.
FOREMAN (voice-over): And the prime minister said, just this week, they are not done.
ARDERN: There's still obviously guns that are misused in New Zealand. And so I won't sit here and say that our system is perfect. But we saw something that wasn't right. And we acted on it. And I can only speak to that experience.
FOREMAN: Gun rights supporters insist you can't prove these regulations reduced mass shootings or that they would work in America. But these countries believe they have found a key to cutting down on gun violence and it starts with the guns -- Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.
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HOLMES: Charles Watson is a spokesperson for Gun Control Australia, where that mass shooting led to substantial change to gun laws. He's also emeritus professor of Health Sciences at Curtin University. He joins me now from my hometown, Perth, in Western Australia.
Professor, it's good to have you on. You wrote after the Port Arthur massacre, about the initial political reaction in Australia. And I just want to quote it, because it's quite a paragraph. You said this in that paper.
You said, "The initial political responses to the Port Arthur massacre were predictable: condemnation of the act, sympathy for the bereaved, hopes that the tragedy would never be repeated, et cetera.
"However, these ritual lamentations fell short of specific commitments to gun law reform that might upset the shooting constituency."
Of course, there were changes in Australia. But listening to those words, you could be talking about America today, not Australia in 1996.
What changed for Australia?
CHARLES WATSON, SPOKESPERSON, GUN CONTROL AUSTRALIA: Michael, it's a very interesting question. Our lobby group, which in those days was called The Coalition for Gun Control, was a group of only five people.
But we jumped on the opportunity after the massacre to take control of the airwaves, where basically we were on every radio and television station for a week. And we had a fortunate thing happen.
Howard had just been elected as the new prime minister. He was looking for something to gain public popularity. And so he took it to the police ministers' conference and basically told them to join up with the national firearms agreement.
And of course, the most important thing in that agreement was the banning of assault weapons. There were other important things, registration, administrative things, registration of all guns and restrictions on getting a gun license and that sort of thing.
But there's no doubt that taking semiautomatic military assault weapons off the menu has made an enormous difference. There were about 13 mass shootings in the 20 years before Port Arthur. And there've been none with more than five people killed since that time.
HOLMES: Yes, going back and looking at that paper that you wrote, it was fascinating to me. And I want to quote from it again, actually.
You said, "The national response is a cultural turning point for Australia, an opportunity to become a society that does something about violence."
It's striking to me, because, you know, Americans will often say, that can't happen here. There's too many guns. The political will on the Right is not there. You know, it's about mental health and on and on, that meaningful reform just can't happen in the U.S.
What do you say to that from your own experience?
WATSON: Well, I think Kamala Harris is right. I think the one thing to start off with, you don't have to stop people owning guns. Just say you can't have military style assault weapons. That's -- that would make an enormous difference. That basically takes massacres out of the question by the time you do that.
And now, of course, the United States is a much more difficult opportunity than we had in Australia at the time. But nonetheless, there will come a point when the pressure of these events will turn things around --
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WATSON: -- people in the U.S., like Australia, want to be safe from guns; 90 percent of Australians want more gun control, not less. We've always been able to trade on that.
But in the U.S., there's a lot of people who don't want people going around with military style assault weapons and I -- there's just got to be some way of doing that. It might not happen through legislation.
It might have to be a national agreement, such as we had in Australia, because the country wasn't -- didn't have the legislative power to simply do it at a national level. And I think that may be difficult for the United States as well.
HOLMES: Yes, the political will is another thing. There is an outside influence, outsized influence from the Right, on what politicians do and do not do.
I wanted to ask you this.
When it comes to the gun lobby in Australia, how much influence does it have there?
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HOLMES: What are they arguing for?
What have they being successful in changing or watering down?
Because, you know, it's an ongoing thing, I imagine, for you.
WATSON: You're absolutely correct. In nearly all of the states, they've been able, with a lot of financial power -- and there's a reason for that, I'll come back to it in a moment, but to basically lobby the governments in order to water down the laws that exist at the moment.
There was one bit of good news, though. In my state, Western Australia, the government has just committed to a massive overhaul of all the legislation so the legislation will favor community safety over gun ownership.
And that will be in place within about a year's time. The current government of the state controls both houses of parliament and they'll introduce this, no matter what sort of opposition is put out.
But the opposition has been significant. There is a dreadful quirk in all of that. And that was that with the initial firearms ban, one of the conditions to being able to get a gun license, a license to own a gun, was that you belonged to a gun shooters club.
And it increased the membership in gun shooters clubs enormously and poured money into the gun lobby. That was a mistake which we're still suffering from.
HOLMES: Right. Interesting lessons learned and a fascinating perspective. I've been here 26 years and I've never gotten used to the gun culture here. Professor Charles Watson, we really appreciate you taking the time. Thanks so much.
WATSON: Thank you very much, Michael.
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HOLMES: The U.N.'s top human rights official visited China without investigating allegations of widespread human rights abuse. Why the agency is defending the trip as critics say the U.N. played right into Chinese propaganda efforts.
Also, a fight to survive amid a devastating famine in Somalia. We'll tell you how food became so hard to come by and why the causes were out of Somalis' control. We will be right back.
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HOLMES: The U.N. human rights chief is defending a rare and controversial visit to China. Beijing is accused, of course, of rampant human rights abuses, including against ethnic Uyghurs. But the U.N.'s Michelle Bachelet said that the trip was never meant to investigate those allegations. Selina Wang with more from Beijing.
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SELINA WANG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The U.N.'s human rights chief has wrapped up a controversial six-day visit to China. It marks the first visit by a top U.N. rights official to China in 17 years.
Michelle Bachelet's trip included a tour of China's far western Xinjiang region, where Beijing is accused of widespread human rights abuses, including detaining up to 2 million Uyghurs and other Muslim minorities in a sprawling network of detention centers, according to the U.S. State Department.
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WANG (voice-over): Bachelet also visited Guangzhou, met with organizations, business representatives and academics. At a press conference at the end of her trip, this is what she told reporters.
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MICHELLE BACHELET, U.N. HIGH COMMISSIONER FOR HUMAN RIGHTS: This visit was not an investigation. Official visits by high commissioner are by their nature high profile and simply not conducive to the kind of detail, methodology (INAUDIBLE), discrete work of an investigative nature.
The visit was an opportunity to hold direct discussions with China's most senior leaders on human rights, to listen to each other, voice concerns, explore and pave the way for more regular, meaningful interactions in the future.
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WANG: Foreign media was banned from traveling with Bachelet. human rights groups have criticized this trip as a carefully choreographed propaganda trap. The United States said it was a mistake for Bachelet to visit because she wouldn't have the necessary access to conduct a complete and unmanipulated assessment. China has repeatedly and strongly denied any allegations of human
rights abuses, insisting that the camps are voluntary, quote "vocational training centers," designed to stamp out religious extremism and terrorism.
In a video call with Bachelet earlier this week, Chinese leader Xi Jinping said China's human rights development, quote, "suits its own national conditions," adding that, on human rights, quote, "no country is perfect.
"There is no need for preachers to boss around other countries, still less should they politicize the issue, practice double standards or use it as a excuse to interfere in other countries' internal affairs."
Researchers say that in addition to mass detentions in Xinjiang, Chinese authorities have waged a campaign of forced labor, coerced sterilization and the destruction of Uyghur culture.
CNN has traveled to Xinjiang multiple times, witnessing the surveillance and repression in the region. Chinese authorities regularly block or intimidate journalists traveling in Xinjiang.
During CNN's last trip, our team spoke to the families who have been separated from their children. Uyghur refugees who escaped have told CNN about the torture and rape they endured in internment camps.
A Chinese detective turned whistleblower in exile revealed to CNN the extent of torture at the camps. He said it included violence, electrocutions and waterboarding.
At the press conference, Bachelet defended her trip to China and said she had open access to prisons in Xinjiang that Western governments and human rights group warned that Bachelet's trip could just become another part of Beijing's propaganda narrative -- Selina Wang, CNN, Beijing.
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HOLMES: More than 30 people have been killed in the northeastern part of Brazil, in landslides and flooding, triggered by heavy rains. Officials say most of the deaths were reported in just the last 24 hours. And hundreds of people are being forced to leave their homes.
So much rain has fallen that officials are urging residents in landslide prone areas to get out to safer areas. Some places have had more rain in a day than in the month of May.
And a hurricane watch is in effect for Mexico, as tropical storm Agatha forms in the eastern Pacific. This storm is expected to make landfall on the country's southern coast on Monday. Agatha was the first storm in the region for this year's hurricane season.
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[02:50:00] HOLMES: All right, Somalia is going through an awful crisis, the perfect storm of problems creating severe food surges so bad that tens of thousands of people can't get enough to eat. As Zain Asher reports now, some of the youngest Somalis never had a chance.
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ZAIN ASHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The bodies of twins are buried here. These babies only lived one day. They were born four weeks early after their mother could barely get enough food to survive.
This is the reality in southern Somalia, going through its worst drought in 40 year. According to the U.N., about 81,000 people are facing famine conditions in parts of the country.
RUKIA YACOUB, U.N. WORLD FOOD PROGRAMME, EAST AFRICA: his is the fourth consecutive drought that we see since 2011, since the famine. The food price are going up, the COVID impact is still there, the climate change is there and also conflict continues. So we have all the forces in addition to the Ukrainian crisis.
ASHER (voice-over): In addition to the drought, global attention and funding has been focused on the conflict in Ukraine. The war has halted food exports and is driving up prices, causing a global food crisis.
DAVID BEASLEY, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, WFP: Now 49 million in 43 countries are knocking on famine's door. What that means, if we don't reach that 49 million, you will have famine. You will have destabilization of nations and you will have mass migration. The conditions now are much worse than the Arab Spring of 2007, 2008, 2009.
ASHER (voice-over): To make matters worse, high commodity prices, fuel prices and shipping costs have compounded the problem. One Somali farmer is losing up to 80 percent of projected revenues because of both the drought and high inflation.
FAWZIA SALAH MOHAMUD, SOMALI FARMER (through translator): The high cost of fuel has also affected us. Most of the local farmers are not able to buy fuel as they used to and, as a result, they have incurred losses. Because of the high fuel costs, we are now feeling the spiral effect in the cost of transportation, food and all other essential commodities.
ASHER (voice-over): The United Nations plan to provide emergency aid is far from fully funded, not enough to help all Somalis in need and not in time to save children like these twins -- Zain Asher, CNN.
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HOLMES: Still to come here on the program, the latest would-be invader to reach Rome has four legs, tusks and a hearty appetite. We will report from the Italian capital as the city fights a battle against wild boar. (MUSIC PLAYING)
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HOLMES: Now Rome has survived invasions and occupations for centuries. But now an army of wild boar has besieged the Eternal City. And the surge of swine might impose a health risk to their domestic cousins. Barbie Nadeau has more.
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BARBIE NADEAU, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Rome, you could say, is going to the hogs. Well, boar, that is. City workers are doing everything they can to stop them from inundating the Italian capital but with little success.
Wild boar aren't just a nuisance to residents and concerned officials. There's also a risk that they carry swine flu, which is not dangerous to humans but could impact the food supply.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Together with the wild boar problem, we have a very grave problem. Because of them, the African swine flu is now in our territory. And that is very dangerous.
NADEAU: Part of the problem is that there's plenty to eat when the wild boar come into the city.
NADEAU (voice-over): There are a few options on the table to get rid of the pests.
NADEAU: So what do you think the city should do to stop the problem?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Kill them. It's the only way. The only way is to kill them because they are too much.
NADEAU (voice-over): The city of Rome is working on a plan to do just that, by bringing in a group of hunters to cull the herd.
Estimated to be around 20,000 in and around Rome, who come into the city to look for food. Romans are being told not to picnic in areas where the boar graze. They are also told to sanitize shoes and hands before leaving parks.
But not everyone agrees with the need to kill these beasts.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't like this solution. I don't want the killed, the wild boar now because I don't think they are dangerous. But I can good because I see the animals like if I lived in the country. But I live in Rome. And near to the center. So for me, it's good. It's very good.
NADEAU (voice-over): So far, the wild boar have scared a number of local dogs. But there is little choice since man and beast cannot coexist -- at least not easily -- Barbie Latza Nadeau, CNN, Rome. (END VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES: You don't want to mess with them.
Thanks for spending part of your day with. Me I'm Michael Holmes. You can follow me on Twitter and Instagram. Do stick around. Paula Newton picks up our coverage in just a moment. She's just over there.
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