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January 6 Committee Set to Hold Public Hearings; Tulsa Mass Shooting; President Biden Set to Deliver an Address on Gun Violence. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired June 02, 2022 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:50]

ANA CABRERA, CNN HOST: Hello, and thanks for being here. I'm Ana Cabrera in New York.

Tonight, the president will address the nation after three weeks of horror, three mass shootings, the latest hours ago in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Police there say a gunman burst into a medical building on a hospital campus and killed four people, including the doctor he blamed for his post-surgical pain.

We also learned from police that that killer bought an assault-style rifle less than three hours before the attack and a handgun only three days earlier.

We're also getting new details about last week's horrific school attack in Uvalde, Texas. The mayor says a negotiator tried and failed to reach the killer as he was barricaded in a fourth grade classroom. Today, two of his 21 victims will be buried.

And next hour in Buffalo, New York, the teenager accused of killing 10 people in a racist attack at a grocery store will be in court. He faces more than two dozen charges, including counts that are terror and hate-crime related -- 223 mass shootings already this year, more mass shootings than days so far.

And CNN is on top of all these developments.

First, I want to go to Lucy Kafanov in Tulsa with an update on the motive and the victims in that attack.

What can you tell us, Lucy?

LUCY KAFANOV, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Ana, we just heard from the police chief, as well as the mayor and officials from the hospital facility behind me.

They have identified all four victims, as well as the suspected shooter, as Michael Louis. We have a bit of a timeline in terms of what unfolded. We understand that Michael Louis went to the center behind me for back surgery on May 19.

He was treated by Dr. Preston Phillips. He was released from care on May 24. After his release, he called Dr. Phillips numerous times over several days complaining of back pain. He wanted additional treatment. We understand that Dr. Phillips on May 31 saw Mr. Louis again for additional treatment. And then, yesterday, June 1, Michael Louis called Dr. Phillips' office again.

He was complaining of back pain again. He wanted additional assistance. We know through ATF and gun tracing and the police that, at 2:00 p.m. yesterday, June 1, Michael Louis purchased a semiautomatic rifle, an AR-15-style weapon, from a local gun store. We know that he also purchased a semiautomatic handgun, a .40-caliber Smith & Wesson, on May 29 from a local pawn shop.

We understand that both were used in yesterday's massacre; 4:52 p.m. is when the first 911 call came through. It was actually a third party who was on a video chat off site with a doctor who was on site, the doctor telling that patient to call 911. And that is when the rampage began.

I do want to take some time to talk about the victims, the people who lost their lives.

They were Dr. Preston Phillips, as I said, the man who treated Michael Louis, Stephanie Husen, a physician in the orthopedic department. Amanda Green, she was a receptionist. She had a supervisory role at the clinic. And then William Love, he was just a patient who was there to get treatment. He actually held a door closed in order to get another one open to help someone else escape.

He was critically wounded and was taken away from the scene. He lost his life. Doctors were not able to save his life. And Dr. Phillips appears to be an incredible person, by all accounts. CNN spoke to someone who worked with him when he volunteered on medical missions in Africa. She described him as someone who was a guy you can rely on.

That's what she said, someone that you want to have in your life because he was such a fun and loving guy. On Facebook, her father wrote: "You can always call me a son and I can call you a father. You told me last week at work during lunchtime, do not stop this project in Togo" -- he was going to be volunteering in Togo -- "in case something happens to you. I did not know that you were giving me the last advice for our journey."

[13:05:05]

Four people lost their lives in America's 233rd mass shooting. The police chief saying that they have been training for these things. It's not about if, but when. And here we are just over a week after the Uvalde, Texas, shooting, where my team and I were for almost an entire week. We got back on Tuesday, and here we are, Thursday, covering yet another mass shooting -- Ana.

CABRERA: Yes. Wow, more than 200 mass shootings already this year. It's hard to keep up with all of them, how often they're happening. Thank you so much, Lucy.

Let's go to Nick Valencia now in Uvalde, Texas. And, Nick, the mayor there says a negotiator tried and failed to reach the gunman the day of the shooting. What more are you learning?

NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. Mayor of Uvalde Don McLaughlin sat down for his first at-length interview since the shooting happened over a week ago.

And in it, he says that he arrived to the scene within 15 minutes and was there at a nearby church with a negotiator who was trying desperately, desperately to get in touch with the gunman by phone. And while McLaughlin says that there was numerous numbers that were dialed to try to reach the cell phone of the gunman, they were ultimately unsuccessful.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DON MCLAUGHLIN, MAYOR OF UVALDE, TEXAS: The only person I had communication, when the negotiator was trying to get the shooter on the phone and so forth, I was in the room. The moment he went in that classroom, they started calling him.

I wasn't there at the initial, but at the moment he went in that classroom, they were trying to get numbers and call him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VALENCIA: McLaughlin went on to say, while like so many here he is frustrated with the shifting narrative of the local police, he still has faith and trust in the local law enforcement here and the law enforcement investigation.

Meanwhile, we're learning more details about what happened that harrowing day, that horrific day. Eva Mireles was a teacher, one of two teachers who was shot and killed at Robb Elementary School.

And according to "The New York Times," who was briefed by somebody -- who spoke to somebody who was briefed about the investigation, Mireles was on the phone before she died with her husband. While she was inside, her husband was outside desperately trying to get inside that classroom to get to her. And according to "The Times"' reporting, she said that she was dying.

Mireles, of course, is one of the victims, the 21 victims that lost their lives here in this shooting. This broken community still trying to make sense of it. But because we're not really getting much information from officials, they're not doing much to provide closure to these families who are very much so still grieving -- Ana.

CABRERA: Nick Valencia, thank you.

We need to keep lifting up those victims and their memories.

We are just minutes now from a court hearing for the teen accused of murdering 10 people inside a supermarket last month in Buffalo, New York. A grand jury returned a 25-count indictment on Wednesday, and we will learn specific charges at that arraignment today. Authorities say the suspect was motivated by hate; 11 of the 13 people shot were black. And CNN will stay on top of those updates.

But think about this, three mass shootings and 35 people dead in less than three weeks, a supermarket, a school, a hospital campus, all of the gunmen armed with AR-15-style weapons.

Let's get to CNN's Kaitlan Collins at the White House with more on what the president might say tonight.

Kaitlan, what do you know?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Ana, we know this address is going to be at 7:30 Eastern tonight, a rare evening address for this president. And it is going to be on guns and the recent mass shootings that you just noted we have seen in the last several days.

And, also, it's going to include a call for Congress to act when it comes to guns, something that we know the White House has been encouraging, but not deeply involved in the negotiations, instead letting them play out on Capitol Hill.

But this speech tonight came together after the president has been briefed three separate times on three separate shootings in recent weeks alone. Of course, just last night, he was briefed on what happened in Tulsa. Before that, it was on his way back from Asia on what had happened in Uvalde, and before that, of course, what happened at that grocery store in Buffalo.

And the president visited New York, he visited Texas, and he has been coming face to face with the victims of gun violence and of these mass shootings recently. And now they're going to have the president deliver this address. It remains to be seen what exactly he is going to call on Congress to do, because he has called on them to act.

But, so far, he has not said anything specifically for them to do because aides have said they wanted to let these negotiations play out on Capitol Hill and the president would get involved when the time was right. But you are also seeing fundamental differences between this president and some Senate Republicans on what they believe Congress should be doing, because you have seen Senator Mitch McConnell say that he believes they need to target the problem, which he thinks is mental illness and school safety.

The White House told me the other day they do not view that as the issue. That is not what President Biden thinks. He thinks the issue is guns specifically. And so those are going to be things to be watching closely tonight as this president is delivering this rests on guns at 7:30, Ana.

[13:10:03]

CABRERA: Kaitlan Collins, thank you for that preview.

And now to those ongoing talks on Capitol Hill. On the Senate side, we know a bipartisan group of senators has been meeting this week trying to reach some kind of compromise on measures to prevent gun violence. On the House side, the Judiciary Committee is poised to advance a bill with a slew of reforms. It's called the Protecting Our Kids Act, and it would raise the age to purchase a semiautomatic rifle from 18 to 21.

It would a new federal offense for large-capacity magazines, incentivize safe firearm storage, regulate how guns are stored and build on a ban of ghost guns and bump stocks, among other things.

CNN's Manu Raju is on Capitol Hill.

Manu, what are the chances we see actual legislation that could pass both chambers?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It's an uphill climb, in talking to people who are involved in the discussions, that, even though there are some bipartisan talks happening in the Senate, getting to a deal that can actually pass the Senate, that can get enough Republican support to break a filibuster, which requires getting at least 60 votes still seems uncertain at this point.

Those discussions are centering around a smaller set of changes, not as sweeping as that House bill that you just laid out there that is going through the House Judiciary Committee today, but will likely pass the House in the coming days, but stands no chance of breaking that 60-vote threshold in the Senate.

But on the Senate side, the discussions are looking at changing to so- called state red flag laws, to allow authorities in states to take away guns from individuals deemed a threat, some changes to the background check system, some school safety measures, as well as other provisions to provide money for mental health.

But there are a lot of land mines to get by in order to get a deal accomplished. Now, one of the key negotiators here is Senator John Cornyn, the Texas Republican who has been enlisted by Senate Republican Leader Mitch McConnell to lead the negotiations on the GOP side.

He tweeted last night about the issues about gun restrictions. So someone had asked whether or not he would support gun restrictions. Cornyn tweeted -- quote -- "Not going to happen."

I asked his office what he specifically meant by that. They declined to comment any further. But one of the issues at play here is whether or not to raise the age of purchasing a semiautomatic weapon from 18 to 21. That is a part of the House Judiciary Committee's bill. And I asked a top Republican on the House Judiciary Committee about supporting that provision and what he thought about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: What's wrong with raising the age for semiautomatic rifles?

REP. JIM JORDAN (R-OH): It's unconstitutional. Even the Ninth Circuit just said it was unconstitutional.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: So that is the argument there. A panel on the Ninth Circuit, in a 2-1 decision, said that it was unconstitutional to ban people under 21 from obtaining firearms, but that has not been decided by the full Ninth Circuit and certainly has not been decided by the Supreme Court.

And, Ana, that provision, raising the age, has not been a central feature of the Senate talks as well. So it seems highly unlikely that raising the age of those semiautomatic weapons, like AR-15s, will be part of the final agreement, if there actually is one -- Ana.

CABRERA: OK, big if still. Thank you, Manu Raju.

In a new op-ed, the former Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson argues that, in order for change to happen, we need an Emmett Till moment.

Johnson writes in part this -- and I'm quoting here -- "I lack the moral standing to tell a parent to accept and approve for the greater good the public display of photos of his or her dead child, nor do I suggest the release of any images in particular, but something graphic is required to awaken the public to the real horror of these repeated tragedies."

Joining us now is Dr. Chethan Sathya. He is a pediatric trauma surgeon at Cohen Children's Medical Center here in New York. He also serves as director for the Center for Gun Violence Prevention at Northwell Health.

Doctor, thanks so much for being here. This is such an important discussion. You do so much work. You're in service in so many ways and have great experience.

What do you think about what the secretary there wrote about this idea of people seeing with their own eyes what it looks like, a gunshot wound in a child? Do people need to see what you see?

DR. CHETHAN SATHYA, PEDIATRIC TRAUMA SURGEON: One hundred percent.

This has been something that we have been seeing as physicians, trauma surgeons for decades, right? We are talking right now about mass shootings. We're talking about children being killed. This is something we see on a daily basis.

Just even at our hospital here in New York, we have seen more kids with bullet wounds this year than any other previous year in history. So, it's just devastating. You have to understand that, as trauma surgeons and physicians, we see parents coming in with their kids, bleeding bullet wounds, with their bodies ripped apart.

And the devastation that these automatic weapons cause, these assault rifles, is just -- it's harrowing.

[13:15:00]

CABRERA: Yes, so many of these mass shootings are able to happen because of the weapon that is used, the assault rifles that allow so many bullets and so powerful wounds to result in.

And so do you see a different type of gunshot wound? Are they more severe? And what does it mean as far as your ability to save someone?

SATHYA: Yes, the truth is, it makes it way harder for us to save a life. You have to understand that, with these assault weapons, not only do you have more bullet wounds, but the caliber of those wounds is often greater. And the worst part is in a child, right? I encourage everybody to think about this as a parent, as an uncle, as an aunt.

In a child, all the vital organs are that much closer together. So each of those bullets causes irreversible damage. So it's absolutely devastating. And we really need to come together. I can't tell you how many parents we see in the trauma bay of kids who have bullet wounds that are both on the right and the left.

And they all agree, right? We want safer communities. They are for responsible gun ownership. Nobody, no matter where you sit, wants to see a child die, especially in this way.

CABRERA: Yes.

I think about what we have been discussing here and the response to the Uvalde shooting. And I think a lot of people are wondering if somebody had reached some of these victims sooner, if aid had been given sooner, could some of those 21 lives, 19 children included, have been saved? What do you think?

SATHYA: Yes, it's very likely.

We teach things like Stop the Bleed, for example, in schools, which allow folks to give some of this emergency care before first responders arrive. But, to be honest, a lot of these assault weapon wounds are non-survivable, especially in kids.

And that is why it is so critical that we set ourselves up for a good public health approach to this epidemic, again, not focused on the Second Amendment at all, but purely on safety, right? There are ways -- for example, Canada, high rates of gun ownership in Canada, but they have a public health approach. They focus on safe storage, licensing, background checks.

As a result, they don't have as much gun violence.

CABRERA: That is really interesting, when you compare the U.S. to other countries, which we have done. We have looked at a lot of laws and how other countries have responded to mass shootings and the actions they have taken, and the results that have been borne fruit in a lot of ways.

I wonder, for you personally, hearing that this latest mass shooting, the one in Tulsa, was at a hospital targeting a doctor, what goes through your mind learning that?

SATHYA: It just reiterates what, to be honest, we have known for many years as physicians, is that no place is safe. This affects all our communities.

People make a big deal often about the word gun violence, and that it might not affect different communities. We have to remember that that means firearm-related suicide, homicide, and unintentional injury. Eight kids are killed, for example, in the U.S. every day just because of unsecured firearms in the home.

And there are 4.6 million children in this country living in homes with unsecured weapons. So this is an issue that affects all of us, even hospital workers. This just brings it back to the forefront. And I really feel for my colleagues there. It's just absolutely horrific.

CABRERA: Quickly, if you will, what do you say to those lawmakers who argue guns are not the problem, it's mental health or schools that aren't secure enough?

SATHYA: I would just say, look at every other country in the world, right?

I mean, easy access to weapons allows people to either hurt others or themselves. And, for example, again, I will use Canada as a comparison, similar depression rates, the Scandinavian countries, very high suicidality rates and depression rates. However, very few people actually kill themselves with guns in those countries because they have limited access.

The sad part is that most people who do that never try again. So it's really access to weapons for those who should not have it at that time is an important thing. And this is an important part of a public health approach is also policy measures like this.

CABRERA: Yes.

And I know you're doing a lot of research to help guide the policy here to make an impact and a real difference in saving lives. Thank you so much, Doctor, for being here with us, for all that you -- Dr. Sathya.

SATHYA: Thank you.

CABRERA: Up next: The House committee investigating the January 6 insurrection is about to go public with major hearings this month. We have new details on whom they're asking to testify and what they're finding out.

And as Russia makes gains on Ukrainian soil, President Zelenskyy is accusing the Kremlin of -- quote -- "stealing" more than 200,000 children and moving them to remote parts of Russia. What happens from there?

Plus, we know the earth is warming, sea levels are rising and coastlines are flooding. How homeowners are forced to get moving.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This house was actually moved to this -- this is a new location back in the Outer Banks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Some are moving their houses as far as they can afford. They moved it from right to right there.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that was as far as they could go.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:24:10]

CABRERA: Today, CNN is learning that the January 6 Committee has started reaching out to witnesses ahead of the first public hearings. And those are set to begin a week from today.

People close to former Vice President Mike Pence are among the first invited to testify.

CNN's Ryan Nobles is on Capitol Hill.

What more are you learning about this, Ryan?

RYAN NOBLES, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it shows that the committee is getting serious, Ana.

We are now just one week away from what is expected to be their first big public hearing. It's expected to be a prime-time hearing, where the committee for the first time will reveal publicly all this work that they put into this investigation over the past 10 months.

And we're getting a sense as to exactly who they want to talk to you in a public setting. And you mentioned some of them. We know for sure that former federal Judge Michael Luttig, who was a part of the team that convinced Vice President Mike Pence not to go along with the efforts to try and stop the certification of the election results, has been asked to testify, as is Greg Jacob, who worked with Luttig to come up with a legal strategy to convince Pence that it was a bad idea.

[13:25:11]

He was, of course, Pence's former chief counsel. Also, Marc Short, who is a former Pence chief of staff, we are told that he's expected to be called in, but that invitation hasn't quite been revealed yet. So this is just an example, Ana, of the wide net that this committee has cast over these past 10 months to bring together all this information related to not just the insurrection itself, but the effort to undermine the election results shortly after the 2020 election.

And while they're ready to start asking questions to some of these witnesses in a public setting, their closed-door depositions continue. And, in fact, a big one took place today. We saw the former Attorney General William Barr enter the hearing room where the committee conducts their closed-door depositions. And we know that Barr has already had informal conversations with the

committee and expressed a willingness to cooperate with their investigation. Of course, Barr was no longer the attorney general on January 6, but he was in the White House around the administration during that period of time when Trump and his associates were trying to undermine the election results.

So, Ana, even as these public hearings are set to take place, this is by no means the end of this investigation, more likely just at the midway point -- Ana.

CABRERA: Ryan Nobles, thank you.

And joining us now is former Nixon White House counsel and CNN contributor John Dean.

And, John, of course, we're going to talk about your new upcoming CNN series on Watergate in just a moment. But let's start with what we just learned from Ryan.

And with these public hearings potentially as soon as next week, what kind of impact do you think they could have?

JOHN DEAN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: I'm thinking back to Watergate, and how they were a bust when they started. They really -- almost, the network said, we can't handle this. We can't deal with this. You have got to get something more lively, because they started with very basic witnesses that could describe big picture items.

It sounds like they're doing the same thing again to give the audience a broad picture, but they're doing it with much more powerful witnesses. Judge Luttig, when I heard that, he's one-time Supreme Court tender. He's really a very able judge. He speaks with great authority, knows the Constitution from a conservative and a liberal point of view.

So he can be a good witness. And I think...

CABRERA: Do you think they will cut to the chase more quickly than with these witnesses?

DEAN: I do. I do. I think they're going to get right down into the nitty-gritty, but get the basics out. So the audience knows what we're talking about.

CABRERA: Realistically, do you think we're going to learn a lot more when it comes to the January 6 investigation?

DEAN: I hope we do. I'm sure they're not going to show all their cards before they start.

And there's -- because there's clearly a theatrical aspect to this. There's just no question. There is in a trial. There is in a hearing as well. So they will have things up their sleeves, and they will get things they're not expecting. And there will be surprise statements. There will be maybe a surprise witness. I don't know. CABRERA: So you think that they will get things that they may not

even have known as they continue to question during the hearings?

DEAN: Exactly.

CABRERA: Let's turn to your CNN series. It's called "Watergate: Blueprint For Scandal." It was 50 years ago this month a bungled break-in at the Watergate Hotel in Washington, D.C., tipped off the biggest political scandal of the 20th century.

You were President Nixon's White House counsel at the time. And you're telling your story now like never before. Let's show a preview.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALEXANDER BUTTERFIELD, FORMER NIXON DEPUTY CHIEF OF STAFF: I heard about the break-in on the radio coming to work. And when I got in, I saw one of the secretaries.

And I said it's clear to me that we did it. I don't have any doubt of it. And she said, oh, of course.

BOB WOODWARD, "THE WASHINGTON POST": And when the judge said, where have you worked, and McCord said:

LESLEY STAHL, CBS NEWS ANCHOR: CIA. Oh, my goodness, OK. We're in a whole new territory, the CIA.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: McCord retired from the CIA and was hired by the committee to reelect the president as a security officer. The others had been hired by Hunt and Liddy, who had done work leading the plumbers operation in '71.

The White House understands immediately that this could lead back to them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: Wow. I love that little teaser.

DEAN: I'm not in that clip at all.

(LAUGHTER)

CABRERA: No, but we have seen you in the promos. And those are good. They are tantalizing.

DEAN: But, actually, I heard things that I have not heard other people say publicly before...

CABRERA: Oh, yes?

DEAN: ... already.

This is not a, here's a new story for you. This is a, here's the what really happened from people who know how it unfolded. So it's very authoritative.

And...

CABRERA: And you say Watergate really wasn't about the break-in or necessarily the cover-up. It was something more.

[13:30:00]