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America Divided After Roe V. Wade Overturned; Protests Expected Over Roe V. Wade; G-7 Leaders Vow To Support Ukraine. Aired 9:00-9:30a ET

Aired June 27, 2022 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:38]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: A good Monday morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Poppy Harlow.

This Monday morning, we are all waking up to a new America. An American in which a constitutionally protected right for half a century has been erased. The laws that govern this country, and have for decades, are being rewritten.

At least ten states have effectively banned abortion since Friday's Supreme Court ruling. And in total, 26 states have laws indicating that they are headed in that direction.

This also, to put it in context, in a country that has no universal health care, no universal child care, and no guaranteed paid family or medical leave.

SCIUTTO: This relates to a whole host of Supreme Court decisions coming through and still to come. This is an America that has seen more mass shootings than the number of days so far this year.

According to data from the Gun Violence Archive, year-over-year mass shootings in the U.S. are on the rise, yet you'll note the court has ruled that cities and states across the country can no longer enact their own gun regulations, at least within the limitations as defined by Thursday's decision.

And by the end of the week, the high court could strip the Environmental Protection Agency, founded, we should note, under a Republican president, Nixon, from enacting regulations that protect against pollution and climate change.

HARLOW: That's right. This is a changing America. This weekend, many Americans took to the streets in protest, some in favor, others opposed to the court's ruling. While most protests were peaceful, there were some arrests following some clashes.

Our reporters and correspondents are standing by to bring you the latest.

Let's begin this morning with our national correspondent Nadia Romero in Jackson, Mississippi.

And, Nadia, Mississippi is one of the ten states that have effectively banned abortion since Friday's ruling.

NADIA ROMERO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, good morning, Poppy and Jim. That's right. And what has to happen first is that the state's first female attorney general must certify that into law. We haven't seen that happen yet.

Once that certification happens, then you have a ten-day period for the building behind me, the locals call it the pink house. This is the last remaining abortion clinic in the state. They'll have another ten days to remain open to perform those abortions before it certifies into law.

The director tells me that they will then shut down this facility and they will move their operations to New Mexico. And they will encourage women to make their way to other states to get abortions and to get other health care needs.

So, we heard from the attorney general of Mississippi, Lynn Fitch, and she was elated to hear about the news of Roe v. Wade being overturned. And she talked about what's next for the state of Mississippi, what has to happen next.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LYNN FITCH, MISSISSIPPI ATTORNEY GENERAL: The task now falls to us to advocate for the laws that empower women. Laws that promote fairness in child support and enhanced enforcement of it. Laws for childcare and workplace policies that support families, and laws that improve foster care and adoption.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMERO: So, let's talk about where Mississippi stands right now. When you look at children living in poverty in the state of Mississippi, that's 28 percent. So that's more than one in four kids in this state live in poverty. That's 49th, so last in the nation. It's actually up from 2010.

Then when you look at education, 39th in the nation is how the state of Mississippi ranks. That's up again from last place back in 2013.

But, overall ranking, 50th, last in the nation for child well-being. Indicators like economic well-being, health, family, community and education.

So, when I spoke with abortion rights protesters and activists, they've said to me, listen, the state of Mississippi, the state leaders here have spent so much time caring about unborn children that the children who are out of the womb and in the state of Mississippi, they haven't done enough to protect them, to support them. And when you look at those statistics, you can see that's true. And so

that is why you're hearing from the AG, the governor, the speaker of the house in this state saying that they are dedicated now to doing more for children and women.

Jim and Poppy.

HARLOW: Nadia, thanks for that reporting and for those statistics that are so important to remember in all of this.

Right now a stepped-up security outside of the Supreme Court as Americans are reacting to this landmark decision. Over the weekend, thousands of protested in cities across the country.

SCIUTTO: Yes, we should note that those protests were mostly peaceful.

CNN correspondent Josh Campbell, he's outside the Supreme Court, where there is more increased security there.

[09:05:02]

Josh, I want to get, so our viewers understand what's actually happening out there accurately. There's a tremendous amount of security around the Supreme Court now, and some that has been there for some time.

What did we actually see over recent days? How many incidents of violence? Was it - was it largely peaceful around the country and what are law enforcement agencies preparing for?

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it was largely peaceful here outside the Supreme Court. And even after that controversial abortion rights ruling, we still see heavy security.

There's still fencing up behind me. That's because the Supreme Court isn't finished with their work. We're expecting a number of opinions here today as well.

You can see, it's relatively quiet here at the moment. There are primarily pro-life protesters out here right now.

Over the weekend, though, this was the epicenter for a wave of protests that we saw across the Washington, D.C., area. Primarily those who were against this abortion decision, but there were members of the pro-life community as well.

There were some heated exchanges here in D.C. No altercations to note. But that was much different than what we saw across the country.

I'll give you an example. In Los Angeles, protesters took to the streets, some of them entering the busy 101 freeway. In one now viral video, you actually see a woman being pushed to the ground. She's actually an actor. LAPD tells us that that incident is under review right now.

Up north, in Portland, Oregon, hundreds of peaceful demonstrators had their movement hijacked by vandals. And I say hijacked because you see some of the images of the aftermath. You see glass shattered, you see a lot of graffiti, some of which having nothing to do with the abortion rights movement.

And moving across the country, a very frightening episode in Cedar Rapids, Iowa, where a driver of a truck had this encounter with protesters. Police tell us that there were no serious injuries, no arrests, but that remains under investigation.

And where we are right now, again, this heavy police presence, this area remains fortified. Authorities want to create a safe place where people can come and demonstrate. They don't want to see those same altercations we saw across the country happen here in Washington.

Jim and Poppy.

HARLOW: Yes, Josh Campbell reporting for us outside of the high court, where, as you noted, decisions will come down in less than an hour on other key cases.

Thanks very much.

Joining us now to discuss, CNN Supreme Court reporter Ariane de Vogue, CNN national politics reporter Eva McKend, and Elie Honig, CNN's senior legal analyst and former federal prosecutor.

Good morning one and all. Thanks for being here.

Ariane, let me begin with you because the country's changed. Since last Thursday at 9:59 a.m., before the guns decisions was handed down, our country was fundamentally different in terms of rights granted and rights taken away.

Can you speak to the broader implications of the abortion decision on so many other so-called substantive due process rights because, yes, it was just one justice, Thomas, who wrote in his concurring opinion that the court has a duty to reassess all of those, but people want to know now, will same-sex marriage change? Will a right to contraception change? Will so many other rights that Americans have lived by go away?

ARIANE DE VOGUE, CNN SUPREME COURT REPORTER: Right. Well, you saw Justice Alito in that majority opinion, he tried to wall off this case from those other cases that have similar legal reasoning. He said, for him, abortion is different because it has to do with the taking of potential life so you don't have to look at the other cases, gay marriage, the right to contraception.

But the problem there was you saw conservative Justice Clarence Thomas, he was not on that program. He said that he thought, in fact, the court should revisit those cases. And the dissent really seized on that.

They said, you know, Justice Thomas is opening the door to this. And so in those protests that we saw over the weekend, you saw LGBTQ right activists back out on the streets. They thought they were in the clear. But they're worried now because they're worried that Clarence Thomas' opinions, often he plants a seed.

And Jim Obargafeld (ph), who was the key plaintiff in that case, the gay marriage case, he told CNN, look, he is sure right now people are working on lawsuits. And for him it meant the country was going backwards, revisiting things that they thought they had decided.

SCIUTTO: Elie, can you help me understand something, you know, again, as a layman here, you're the lawyer here. The Supreme Court says on abortion rights, it's up to the states. Let state legislatures decide it's up to them.

It says on gun legislation, if we look to Thursday's decision, you had a state that for 100 years had a law on the books, passed by its legislatures and so on, which is then rejected as not being consistent with the Constitution. We've seen that elsewhere.

Is there a principle to the way this conservative majority looks at what states can decide and cannot decide, or do you see some politics at play here that they kick to the states things they don't like and protect the things they do?

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: I don't see a unifying principle here, Jim. I think it is selective interpretation, selective constitutionalism. I think that's the reality of where we're at with the Constitution, with the Supreme Court right now.

And if you look at the way this is going to play out, it's going to be even more complex than that.

[09:10:02]

We all are familiar now with the map that shows about half the states in the United States colored in where abortion is or soon will be illegal and the other half not colored in. But as the court recognizes in the Dobbs dissent here, it's going to be way more complex than that because laws outlawing abortion can have extra territorial application. They can reach across state lines.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HONIG: A lot of these laws say, for example, it's a crime to prescribe, procure or advise somebody on how to get an abortion. So, if a practitioner, if a doctor, in a state that allows abortion, gives advice or sends medication to somebody in one of those colored-in states, then you could have criminal law sort of reaching across state borders. And that's going to create all sorts of complexities.

So, no, Jim, I don't see a unifying principle here. I think they're being selective.

HARLOW: So, Eva, to you and the politics of this. Obviously, it will become a rallying cry for folks who want their representatives in office in the midterms. But beyond that, there's a huge question now, an onus on state legislatures where they're saying to women, you have to have these children, then what? Then what laws will you pass to protect those children, many of whom

will be born into poverty because we know this affects the poorest women the most, to protect the women's health, the mother's health, guaranteed childcare, guaranteed health care. That's a real political question now they have to answer.

EVA MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS REPORTER: Poppy, it is. And no doubt abortion will be on the ballot come November, as well as a myriad of other issues.

What I've identified, though, as a real venerability for Democrats is this issue of restrictions. Sometimes we hear, frankly, these bad faith arguments from the right. I remember in 2018, when I covered a House race in Kentucky, when the incumbent Republican argued that his Democratic opponent supported abortion right up until the woman was going to give birth.

And we, of course, know that those cases of having an abortion very late in the pregnancy is extremely rare and many times only in the instance when the mother's life is at risk or the mother will not actually be able to give birth to a baby, the baby will not survive the pregnancy, yet we have not seen Democrats really push back on this argument on restrictions in a really fulsome way.

So, that is what I'm looking to as we get close to November. That is something that continually trips Democrats up as this argument proceeds.

SCIUTTO: Ariane, another piece of this, right, is that John Roberts, though very deeply, deeply a conservative himself, who, for instance, on Roe v. Wade wanted it overturned over time, just not immediately, but he wanted a more incremental approach.

He's lost this court, has he not, now that there's quite a conservative five willing to take on a whole host of other issues? Where is the moderating force at this point?

DE VOGUE: Right. I remember before Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg died, Roberts was in that key position. He could really decide cases. His vote counted. And now Amy Coney Barrett has taken that seat and he is being left behind on some of these cases.

No question, he's a conservative. We see him taking a lead often in the religious liberty cases. He was there with the conservative -- with the Second Amendment case.

But here in the abortion case, it really outlines how the conservative, the right branch of this court is moving on without him. Roberts, he wanted to maybe allow the Mississippi law, but stop there. Wait on Roe.

The conservatives didn't stop. They didn't want that incrementalism. They moved forward without him, leaving him behind on perhaps one of the biggest cases, really, in decades.

SCIUTTO: Yes. HARLOW: Yes, a defining case for his term and for a generation.

DE VOGUE: Yes.

HARLOW: Thank you very much, Ariane, Elie, Eva. We appreciate it.

So, what is next for the White House? What can the White House do on this? Dana Bash is going to sit down with Vice President Kamala Harris. You'll see the first part of this exclusive interview today at 4:00 Eastern.

SCIUTTO: This morning, the Ukrainian president sent a direct message to G-7 leaders, that he needs more help to defend his country against Russia. President Biden expected to respond with a package of new anti-aircraft missiles. We'll take you live to the region. Is that enough to make a difference?

HARLOW: Also ahead, nearly 700 flights canceled yesterday as staffing shortages continue to plague the airline industry. What the July 4th weekends could look like.

And, later, a look at which companies are going to cover costs for women to travel for abortion services.

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[09:18:52]

HARLOW: Welcome back.

New this morning, President Biden and G-7 leaders meeting in Germany, and they have vowed to continue to support Ukraine, quote, for as long as it takes. This pledge comes after Ukraine's capital Kyiv was bombarded with Russian missiles Sunday for the first time in two weeks.

Earlier today, in a video message, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy called on the G-7 to increase sanctions against Russia and to send more weapons to defend Ukraine against Russian forces.

Our chief White House correspondent Kaitlan Collins joins us now right where all these leaders are making these key decisions at the G-7.

What is the goal? What are the big takeaways so far?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: You know, one of the biggest things that we've learned coming out of this conversation that President Zelenskyy had with these G-7 leaders, virtually of course, earlier today was really about the timing of how long this potential and Russian invasion of Ukraine and the ensuing war could go on because that has become a chief concern for a lot of these G-7 leaders who are supporting it.

Obviously, you've seen the billions of dollars that the United States has poured into making sure that Ukraine has the weapons it needs to defend themselves against Russia. And so on the timing of this, they've had this concern that there

could become this kind of Ukraine fatigue or concerns about how long this could go on for, not just months, potentially years as officials have warned about at the White House.

[09:20:09]

And so Zelenskyy, this morning, we are told, conveyed to these officials that he would like to see this war end by the end of 2022. And President Biden's national security adviser, Jake Sullivan, later spoke to reporters, basically, Poppy and Jim, gave a readout of what happened during that call.

He didn't confirm those comments exactly. He said he didn't want to put words in Zelenskyy's mouth. But he said that the Ukrainian leader was talking about the next few months, not the next few years, when he was talking about this conflict.

It's obvious Ukraine would like to send this -- see this end sooner rather than later. But Zelenskyy was also appealing to these leaders, asking them, those that are supporting Ukraine militarily with weapons and assistance, to really maximize the next few months so they can hopefully try to bring this conflict to an end.

Of course, whether or not that happens remains to be seen, but there has been a concern about this potentially tipping into Russia's favor at this point as they have made these incremental but still pretty significant gains.

And, you know, it's also just remarkable, Jim and Poppy, to step back and look at this summit and realize how much of the conversation is about Ukraine.

HARLOW: Yes.

COLLINS: That is not something that you would have thought would have been the case a year ago, even six months ago. It has dominated this entire G-7 summit.

HARLOW: Yes, of course it has because of even beyond this war what it stands for and what the west's goals are.

Kaitlan, thanks very much for your great reporting.

Jim.

SCIUTTO: Joining me now, retired Lieutenant General Mark Hertling, former commanding general of the U.S. Army Europe and Seventh Army.

Good to have you back, sir.

LT. GEN. MARK HERTLING (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Good to be with you, Jim. Thanks.

SCIUTTO: You watch the Ukraine news closely. You analyze it almost daily. Russia has been making gains on the ground. Ukrainian forces have been bearing enormous losses there. And there's a risk now of them being surrounded in the east and having to make a strategic retreat there.

On the other hand, you've been positive, more positive than many, about Ukraine's chances there. I just wonder where you read the current situation. Is Ukraine losing in the east today or holding its ground?

HERTLING: No, they're not losing, Jim, but I also don't think they're holding their ground. And before I'd comment on that, I'd also like to comment on what -- the focus of attention of the G-7 over the last day and a half. As this shifts towards the NATO summit in Madrid, it's going to be even a greater focus.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HERTLING: They are reading -- the military members of NATO are reading this, I think, much like I am, seeing what is happening. I wouldn't call the Ukrainian withdrawal from Severodonetsk a retreat. It was a planned withdrawal. They fought very hard, much like the fighting that was going on in Mariupol.

They have gone across the Donetsk River. They are now defending high ground in the city of Lysychansk. That's the - that's the term that we're going to be hearing a lot in the next coming weeks because they have very good ground. They have thwarted an envelopment, forces coming from the north and south, trying to surround them, Russian forces, for the time being.

They have currently pulled off the front line, but I think it's a planned withdrawal in an attempt to draw Russia further into the country so they can further extend their supply lines.

I don't think Ukraine is getting beaten. I think they are certainly suffering casualties, as you said.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HERTLING: But there's a lot of fight left in the Ukrainian army.

SCIUTTO: OK, let's talk about the western response. I'm going to be in Madrid for the NATO summit. It's certainly going to be the focus there. They're announcing new weapon system, medium to long range missile defense system, something Ukrainians have been asking for some time. The HIMARS rocket system, we're seeing that deployed now.

But as you know, these are in small numbers. And Ukrainians remain far outgunned on that eastern front. Some estimates, higher than even ten to one. Is the west moving quickly enough and in great enough volume to help the Ukrainians to the degree they need?

HERTLING: I think they're moving as fast as they possibly can. It's tough to get these kind of weapon systems into theater. So we've talked about javelin. We've talked about HIMARS. We've talked about stinger. The new word you're going to hear a lot, Jim, is NASAMS. That's the

Norwegian or national air -- Advanced Surface-to-Air Missile System, which are medium to long range. It's a combined system, developed by Norway and the United States, and it reaches further out.

What's continuing to happen is, Russian rockets - or Russian aircraft are continuing to move over Ukraine territory. This will give them an added advantage. And, yes, there's probably not enough of this equipment right now, but it's going to continue to flow.

And these kinds of very effective, very precise systems, like the HIMARS, like the javelins, like the NASAMS, are going to make a world of difference. They're going to significantly affect the Russian capability to wage war and continue to trip the Russian forces.

SCIUTTO: I speak to European diplomats and they say that Putin - and, by the way, I don't want to exaggerate Putin's brilliance because he's messed up here before, right, underestimated Ukrainian resolve, western resolve, et cetera.

[09:25:06]

That said, the European view is that Putin's aim here is to wait the Ukrainians and Europe out. Just grind, burn down the east, bomb it, you know, into the stone age, right? I mean is this what we're seeing on a daily basis there. And I wonder if you think that strategy might work.

I mean Putin shows no interest in how many of his own personnel he's losing. That doesn't seem to deter him. And he's still making a lot of money on the oil markets.

HERTLING: Yes, he is, Jim. And is it certainly something we've got to watch.

But Mr. Putin and the Russian army have attempted these so-called frozen conflicts in other places throughout Europe. And they've worked in many cases. Like Abkazia (ph) and South Acedia (ph), places that the United States -- people in the United States probably haven't heard of.

But this isn't going to be a frozen conflict. Ukraine is not going to allow him to turn this into a frozen conflict. They are going to continue to fight back. And what I see happening is Russian forces are going to be continuously attritted.

It's going to have an effect on the domestic audience within Russia. And while Russia is being depleted, Ukraine is beginning to get more and more of these advanced, high technologically pieces of equipment that will allow them to certainly attrit Russia in significant manners that they haven't been able to do in the past.

SCIUTTO: Lieutenant General Mark Hertling, we know you're watching this closely. Thanks so much for joining.

HERTLING: Hope I'm right, Jim. Thank you. HARLOW: All right, well, WNBA star Brittney Griner is expected to

attend a preliminary hearing in Russia today in person. Of course, Griner, you know, was arrested in February at an airport in Moscow. Russian officials accused her of drug smuggling. They extended her detention through July 2nd.

No word on what happens after that. Obviously, she, her family, the State Department, have been vehement in their defense of her on those charges, which they call unfounded. Now, the House passed a bipartisan resolution over the weekend calling on Russia to release her. The State Department says she is being wrongfully detained and is working to secure her release.

We'll keep you posted on that.

Still ahead, abortion is still legal in Kansas, but that could be eroded by the end of the summer after a vote on a state constitutional amendment. The CEO of Planned Parenthood Great Plains will join us next.

And taking a look here at the markets, just a few minutes ahead of the opening bell on Wall Street, stock futures inching higher this morning.

Markets appear set to hold on to the gains from that big rally last week that drove the S&P 500 to its largest one-day percentage gain in two years on Friday. Recent reports have indicated the economy, potential inflation is beginning to cool.

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