Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

FBI Recovered 11 Sets Of Classified Docs In Trump Search; Eight Injured Including Five Americans After Gunman Shot At Jerusalem Bus; Prosecutors Say Attack On Salma Rushdie Was Premeditated And Targeted; Florida State Representative Pushes To Defund The FBI After Mar-a-Lago Search; Violent Rhetoric Heats Up Online After FBI's Mar-a-Lago Search; New Book Claims Trump Wanted Loyal Generals Like Hitler's. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired August 14, 2022 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:21]

JIM ACOSTA, CNN HOST: You are live in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Jim Acosta in Atlanta.

Authorities are on heightened alert this evening as they monitor an unprecedented number of threats against government officials in the wake of the FBI's search of former President Donald Trump's Mar-a-Lago estate.

Take a look at this. Armed Trump supporters were spotted protesting outside a Phoenix FBI office some wearing tactical gear and holding up a sign that read, "abolish the FBI." Fortunately the protest ended without incident. But there are tensions nationwide as officials monitor an uptick in violent rhetoric on pro-Trump forums. Some of the top comments that are being shown, lock and load and, quote, "kill all feds."

The Democratic chairs of the House Intelligence and Oversight Committees want answers about what fallout could await after top- secret documents were found at Trump's resort. They're asking the director of National Intelligence to provide an immediate damage assessment.

Let's bring in two former Trump administration insiders, former Homeland Security counterterrorism and COVID adviser to Vice President Mike Pence, Olivia Troye, and former Trump White House press secretary Stephanie Grisham.

Ladies, thank you both so much for being with us this evening.

Stephanie, let me start with you first. The thing that I can't wrap my head around is why a president who notoriously paid little attention to his daily intelligence briefings, at least that's what was reported time and again when he was in office, why would he hold on to this stuff? Why does he have this stuff around Mar-a-Lago? And you were his press secretary for a period of time. Why does he suddenly care about top-secret materials?

STEPHANIE GRISHAM, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Your guess is as good as mine and I'll leave it up to law enforcement and the investigation to come to that conclusion. But, you know, there are many things. I mean, there are small mementos I'm sure he kept because he thought they were cool or he could, you know, just show off to people but at the end of the spectrum that would be really bad is if he thought he could ever profit off of anything. And I'll stop there because I don't want to throw around those kinds of accusations.

Look, Donald Trump is innocent until proven guilty and we'll wait until the investigation concludes, but I do believe that Merrick Garland didn't do this lightly. I do believe that this was a buttoned- up investigation. The fact that he took such strong responsibility for it really made a lot -- for me made me really feel a lot better just as a citizen. So I guess we'll just go from there.

ACOSTA: And Olivia, let me ask you about this. A top Republican on the House Intelligence Committee has been very vocal in casting doubt on this FBI search. I want to get your reaction to this exchange that Congressman Mike Turner had this morning with CNN's Brianna Keilar, my colleague over there on "STATE OF THE UNION." Let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Do you take home documents marked special access?

REP. MIKE TURNER (R-OH): No.

KEILAR: And yet you're casting doubt on whether or not --

TURNER: And, you know, quite frankly --

KEILAR: Sorry. Go ahead.

TURNER: I've been in the Oval Office with the president. I'd be very surprised if he has actual documents that rise to the level of immediate national security threat. These are two-year-old documents that are in the president's residence. We don't know what's in them. They're not ongoing, certainly now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Yes, Olivia, the congressman said himself he doesn't know what's in the documents. Nobody really knows what's in these documents, I mean, outside of the FBI, you know, and perhaps some of the Trump circle close to the former president. And yet you have people savaging the FBI, savaging the federal law enforcement community, accusing them of all sorts of things, planting documents and so on. I mean, it just boggles the mind.

OLIVIA TROYE, FORMER ADVISER TO VICE PRESIDENT PENCE: Yes, I watched that interview earlier when it aired today and I have to tell you, I was disgusted with Congressman Turner especially given the fact that he is the ranking Republican on the House Intel Committee, and the fact that he would show just complete disregard for intelligence and national security documents. It doesn't matter what's in the documents, Jim. What matters is these

documents don't belong down in Mar-a-Lago where there's a bunch of foreigners going in and out of the place, and putting potentially national security information at risk. And so that's neither here nor there. And also, I found it preposterous that he would say, you know, that they're two years old.

That says a lot about what his knowledge I guess must be on the intelligence community because he should know better and understand that in many situations intelligence operations take a decade if not more than a decade to kind of get into place and sources and methods takes a long time to develop.

So I just found the entire interview insane. And these are the type of people that are fueling this kind of dangerous sort of narratives, dangerous rhetoric, that's fueling violence, potentially for political violence across the country as we're seeing it, you know, directed at FBI offices today and what we're seeing in the protests outside of the FBI again, well, today, in the events that happened earlier this week.

[18:05:15]

ACOSTA: Right. And two years old, I mean, that puts you smack dab in the middle of Trump's final year in office. It's not like we're talking about the Magna Carta or the U.S. Constitution or something like that. And I have a question for both of you.

I know, Olivia, you've spoken about finding misplaced classified documents during your time in the administration. And I'm wondering the same thing of you, Stephanie.

I'll go with you, first, Olivia, was there just a carelessness about these kinds of documents that you witnessed?

TROYE: There was, and at times I would see people carrying them around and not storing them properly or not carrying them properly. For example, in between the West Wing of the White House and the Eisenhower Executive Office Building where you'd see this carried openly. And I will say that the proper way was the way that many of the vice president's office handled it. People would come to me and say, you know, this needs to be stored. He's read it. Please take it back where it belongs. That's exactly the way.

But you would see documents. I mean, I saw some in the Oval Office sitting on the desk that were just laying on top. You would think that they would be covered or something. I mean, not everyone has that level of clearance for certain things to access it all.

ACOSTA: And Stephanie, what about you? Did you witness any of that sort of thing?

GRISHAM: Well, yes. I mean, I would actually speak, I would say you and I, Jim, both witnessed that. I mean, he was very, very messy with classified information just in a public setting. You know, I've used a few examples that I cite. One was when we were at the border down in Arizona but the Mexico border, and he started talking about a lot of the technological advances we had made in our administration.

And somebody had to step in and stop him and say, sir, you know, there would be a benefit for you to not say anymore. Also, when he made the announcement about the Al-Baghdadi made and his consequential killing. He also started to talk about a lot of things that were highly, highly classified and some tactical military issues that made a lot of people uncomfortable. So we saw him do that throughout our administration.

And I think that is something that made it so that we didn't have really a culture of compliance. I think it made it easier for some people, not all, because a lot of people did take it very seriously. I want to be clear about that. But there were a lot of people who as Olivia said would, you know, look and say, well, he's not taking it seriously. I don't know if I should.

ACOSTA: And Stephanie, there is a report about Trump's level of paranoia right now with all these investigations going on. A source close to Trump describing it to "Rolling Stone" this way. He has asked me and others do you think our phones are tapped on at least a couple of occasions. Also according to "Rolling Stones" since May the former president has wondered whether any visiting Republicans, Republicans visiting his clubs could be wearing a wire. What do think about that? Did you witness that kind of paranoia?

GRISHAM: Absolutely. I mean, Jim, you were a big part of that all the time. But, yes. He was always wondering how did this reporter get the story? Who is leaking? Big example would be the "Anonymous" book. You know, he was every day asking who do we think it is? I mean, we would be in meetings about one other topics and he would want to ask about the "Anonymous" author. So he was like that in the White House.

We were always looking for leakers. I was tasked with that personally many, many times. Find the leakers. Find the leakers. As you well know that was something that we as staff would use and weaponize against one another to say if you didn't like somebody you just go to him and say I think this person leaks.

But Donald Trump is a master at blaming others for his own bad behavior. So I think that that's just his way of thinking. Right? If you do something bad you're immediately just going to deflect it on everybody around you. And I think that's what he's doing right now. I don't think he leaked his own wrongdoings here but he doesn't trust anyone because he knows he cannot be trusted.

ACOSTA: Right. Well, that is very true. And Olivia, we talked to Jordan Klepper with the "Daily Show" about some of his, you know, interactions with Trump supporters. And, you know, I have to show this to you because, you know, I know both of you have been to the rallies, have been at events where there are Trump supporters and very rabid Trump supporters. And some of the outlandish things that are said. Let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JORDAN KLEPPER, "DAILY SHOW" CORRESPONDENT: Who do you guys see as the current, legitimate president? UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't think we currently have one. If we do maybe

hopefully Trump is running behind the scenes keeping the military on our side.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Biden doesn't know what he is doing.

KLEPPER: He recently just killed the head of al Qaeda

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't believe it.

KLEPPER: Do you think that's just a made-up news story?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just like bin Laden was Obama.

KLEPPER: Clarify who is still alive? Bin Laden?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: JFK Jr. is still alive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: I mean, Olivia, I mean, it's funny. We laugh at it but it does go to these disinformation silos that folks are in, you know, on the Trump side of things.

[18:10:05]

TROYE: Yes. And it's very extensive. And while, you know, it is, we are amused by it but the thing is there are real world consequences when it comes to it and the fact that, you know, this is why we're seeing what's happening with people targeting law enforcement. I mean, these narratives get started. They grow legs.

And the next thing you know everyone is against them and they get concerned that everyone is coming after them. And so this is a cycle, and, it's -- you know, and never ending when you have right-wing pundits repeating it and also when you have elected leaders repeating it. That's why it's so dangerous because they are supporters following or listening to what they say.

ACOSTA: And Stephanie, I suppose you have no doubt that if Donald Trump gets out there and announces he's running for president and holds these rallies they're going to be just as big and boisterous and out of control as we saw the last five years, six years?

GRISHAM: Yes, you know, sadly, and I don't mean to be dramatic but I think it will be a lot worse. You know, he's going to run. I think that his ego will be about, you know, not only am I going to run again but I've gotten away with all of these things and I will be the Republican nominee, and then if he gets elected I just -- I want to implore people to think for themselves as your guest Sam Donaldson earlier had said. Try to think for yourself. Like I was one of those people.

I'm not sure I was to the extreme thinking JFK Jr. was still alive but I was one of those people who really believed in him. And I think it's OK to still believe in a lot of the policies that he was behind, that our administration implemented, but, please, just think for yourself. If he gets a second term there will be no guardrails. Think about who will be his staff. Think about the cabinet. Think about what kind of national security implications there will be.

It won't be just a revenge tour. That will be the petty part of him that we're all used to but he will have no guardrails and I think that's something for our country to really think about when they're going to the voting booth if he is in fact the nominee.

ACOSTA: All right, Olivia and Stephanie, thank you very much for your time. Great to talk to both of you. Appreciate it.

Coming up, five Americans among the injured after a suspected terror attack in Jerusalem. The terrifying moments on board a bus by the Western Wall. Plus an update on the condition of acclaimed author Salman Rushdie after prosecutors say he was stabbed 10 times in a premeditated attack.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:16:24]

ACOSTA: A mass shooting in Jerusalem this morning has left eight people wounded including five Americans. Police say a single gunman opened fire targeting a bus and CNN's Hadas Gold has more from Jerusalem.

HADAS GOLD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Jim, this attack took place around 1:30 in the morning near one of the main entrances that religious pilgrims and tourists use to enter the old city of Jerusalem to visit the holy sites there. The attack took place at a bus stop as a bus was loading and unloading passengers and also went along the street and also targeted cars and pedestrians along the street.

At least eight people were injured in the attack. Two of them critically. One of them was a pregnant woman who had to deliver her baby by emergency C-section. Both she and the baby are in serious condition according to the hospitals that treated them.

Now, at least five Americans were among those wounded and at least two of them were American tourists. The others may be Israeli American dual citizens. The U.S. embassy in Jerusalem said that they are aware of the Americans that were wounded and have been in touch with their families. They say that they are shocked and saddened by the attack and condemn all acts of terrorism and actions that exacerbate tensions.

Now, as for the shooter, he initially fled on foot to a neighborhood in East Jerusalem. This sparked a massive manhunt. Hundreds of security forces as well as police helicopters searching for the suspect but a few hours later he actually turned himself in to a police station. Police say that the suspected weapon was also seized. According to Israeli media the suspect is a Palestinian with Israeli citizenship and a security source, Israeli security source telling CNN that the suspect is a resident of East Jerusalem who holds Israeli citizenship. Now in terms of the context of all of this taking place, this attack

happens just about a week after a ceasefire was declared between the Israeli military and the Palestinian Islamic jihad militant group in Gaza after about a three-day conflict that saw Israeli airstrikes and several dozens of Palestinians killed as well as more than a thousand rockets fired from Gaza into Israel.

Now, as far as we understand, the suspect has no known connections to any militant groups, although militant groups in Gaza such as Hamas which runs Gaza as well as the Palestinian Islamic jihad group all praised and celebrated the attack -- Jim.

ACOSTA: Hadas Gold, thank you very much.

And the family of author Salman Rushdie say he is off a ventilator but he remains in critical condition after a man stabbed him 10 times on stage before a lecture. The video shows the moment when audience members rushed to his aid.

And CNN's Polo Sandoval is following this for us. So, Polo, what's the latest?

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Jim, that medical facility you see behind me here in Erie, Pennsylvania, that is where that 75-year- old acclaimed author seems to be pulling through according to his family and various representatives of Salman Rushdie, basically saying that he is already beginning the very long and difficult road to recovery. But nonetheless, he is already on it. In fact his son earlier today saying that his father's life-changing injuries, though they are severe, his son said that that usual feisty, that defiant sense of humor, it is still basically as strong as ever.

So that's certainly important for the family to hear. Meanwhile, as we show our viewers that just alarming attack from Friday it's also important to mention that today we heard for the first time from Henry Reese. He's another man that was actually on that stage, a fellow writer, who was going to be having a conversation with Rushdie when the attack actually happened. He talked about just the sudden nature of the attack saying that the reality finally set in when he looked over and he saw that Rushdie was bleeding.

[18:20:04]

In the meantime we also heard from New York Governor Kathy Hochul in fact just a few moments ago as she traveled to the Chautauqua Institution, basically that organization that's a collection of intellectuals and writers that was hosting that event on Friday. I want you to hear directly from the governor as she not only condemns again that attack but tells really the whole country and the world that a man with a knife will not be able to silence a man with a pen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. KATHY HOCHUL (D), NEW YORK: I will tell you right now as your governor, New York state will always stand up to protect freedom of expression, freedom of speech, and we condemn the cowardly attack on Salman Rushdie.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANDOVAL: The big question still, a motive, and whether or not this attack could potentially be linked to the decades old fatwah, that death decree that was issued by the Iranian government in the late '80s. The New York state police, they are in charge of that investigation and we are told to expect an update tomorrow that could perhaps paint a clearer picture about a possible motive.

As for the suspect, Jim, Hadi Matar, that 24-year-old New Jersey man, he was in court yesterday. He pleaded not guilty to attempted murder and assault as well. So again, that investigation continues as does the healing of this acclaimed writer that will not be silenced. Back to you.

ACOSTA: All right, Polo Sandoval. Thank you very much.

Actress Anne Heche Will be taken off of life support today. A representative for her family told CNN that she has been matched with an organ recipient. Heche was declared brain dead a week after her car crash into a home, sparking a fire. Her son wrote on Friday, "Hopefully my mom is free from pain and beginning to explore what I like to imagine as her eternal freedom."

Coming up, he is taking right-wing outrage over the Mar-a-Lago search one step further. CNN's Drew Griffin speaks with a Republican Florida state representative after he called on the state to end ties with the Justice Department and defund the FBI.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTHONY SABATINI (R), FLORIDA STATE HOUSE: The FBI at this point is totally useless. We need to defund it and let red states --

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: You have no idea what the value of the FBI is.

SABATINI: Yes, I do.

GRIFFIN: Is a former president just above the law no matter what?

SABATINI: The FBI is not above the law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:26:42]

ACOSTA: A scare near the U.S. Capitol this morning. A man crashed his car into a barricade and then shot and killed himself. Police say it happened just after 4:00 a.m. The man's car caught on fire after the crash and he fired several shots into the air. As officers tried to approach him he turned the gun on himself. The driver has been identified as a 29-year-old man from Delaware. Police say it does not appear he was targeting any members of Congress.

The FBI says it's facing an unprecedented number of threats following the search of former President Donald Trump's Mar-a-Lago resort. It comes after Trump and his allies have repeatedly condemned the FBI for the search. One of those figures is a Florida state representative and congressional candidate Anthony Sabatini.

CNN's senior investigative correspondent Drew Griffin spoke with Sabatini about these farfetched proposals.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GRIFFIN (voice-over): The threats are out in the open.

REP. LAUREN BOEBERT (R-CO): I will make sure these tyrants pay the price.

GRIFFIN: And online. Garland needs to be assassinated. War. This is war. Go buy ammo. The FBI so concerned Director Chris Wray sent out a memo to the agency reviewed by CNN. It says, "Let me also assure you that your safety and security are my primary concern right now. Security division is working across the agency as we continue to stay vigilant and adjust our security posture accordingly."

CHRISTOPHER WRAY, FBI DIRECTOR: Violence against law enforcement is not the answer no matter what anybody's upset about or who they're upset with.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): In Florida --

SABATINI: How's it going?

GRIFFIN: Ultra MAGA Republican, Florida State Representative Anthony Sabatini is trying to take right-wing outrage one step further.

SABATINI: If it was up to me, I would totally defund the FBI.

I'm Anthony Sabatini.

GRIFFIN: He's running for Congress in Florida's 7th District and has been making the rounds on far-right media after writing a tweet saying, "Sever all ties with DOJ immediately" and "Any FBI agent conducting law enforcement functions outside the purview of our State --

(On-camera): "Should be arrested upon sight."

SABATINI: Common sense.

GRIFFIN: Because?

SABATINI: Well, because what they're doing is unlawful. It's time to actually start protecting the rights of Floridians under the 10th Amendment and push back against a lawless federal government.

GRIFFIN: Right now today in Florida, FBI agents are chasing down bank robbers.

SABATINI: OK. Yes.

GRIFFIN: Organized criminals, attacking cybercrime in the state.

SABATINI: Got you.

GRIFFIN: Helping local law enforcement.

SABATINI: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

GRIFFIN: You don't think there's any value in that?

SABATINI: It's an illogical argument. The FBI at this point is totally useless. We need to defund it and let red states --

GRIFFIN: You have no idea what the value of the FBI.

SABATINI: Yes, I do.

GRIFFIN: Is a former president just above the law, no matter what?

SABATINI: The FBI is not above the law.

GRIFFIN: If I'm saying they followed the law, which they did, to enter into that home, should that just not be allowed, the president, the former president is above the law?

SABATINI: He's a political target. He's being harassed by a lawless rogue agency --

GRIFFIN: But do you think he's above the law? It's not a lawless agency.

SABATINI: They spied on him. They have no respect for him.

GRIFFIN: You have no idea.

SABATINI: They hate the conservatives. They hate the Republicans.

GRIFFIN: Wouldn't it be prudent to wait and see what the facts are before you have such a draconian statement?

SABATINI: We already have enough facts. We have enough facts.

GRIFFIN (voice-over): In fact, he doesn't have the facts behind the search warrant. Former President Trump does yet so far is refusing to release them.

[18:30:03]

Meanwhile, FBI agents across the country are now being forced to watch their backs for doing their jobs.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRIFFIN: Jim, Sabatini has a good chance of joining that ultra MAGA contingent in Congress. He is running for Congress in one of the redrawn districts here in Florida. Redrawn to favor Republicans. And he is one of the top names among eight Republicans running -- Jim.

ACOSTA: Thank you, Drew.

And joining me now is CNN counterterrorism analyst and former FBI senior intelligence adviser Phil Mudd.

Phil, great to see you. Thanks very much for being with us. You know, there are real consequences when people like that Florida state representative go out there and trash the integrity of the FBI. I know you said the other day that you received one of the most malicious threats that you've ever read all because of your commentary about this search. And we've seen time and again examples over the last several days of just this, you know, alarming, you know, level of threats and heightened rhetoric in response to that search at Mar-a- Lago.

PHIL MUDD, CNN COUNTERTERRORISM ANALYST: Yes. I think there's a couple things you need to think about. The first would be threats to American citizens who happen to be FBI employees. If you look at what happened in Cincinnati and you've seen reports today of armed individuals outside the office in Phoenix, this is a numbers game, Jim.

If politicians start to encourage people to commit acts of violence against the FBI, even if you say defund the FBI, there is a violent fringe that will say I want to take action, there might be 100th of 1 percent of the fringe who say that means I should commit an act of violence, man, the FBI is an open organization. I served at both the CIA and the FBI. The CIA was closed, the FBI is open.

Those offices are public facilities. Those offices interact with the public. If 0.001 percent of the population says I need to commit an act of violence, those people, the FBI employees are under threat. Let me close with one other issue on defunding. If you think that state and local police can follow the Iranians, follow the Chinese, follow the Russians, follow one of the most horrific things in America, that is cyber pornography against infants, if you think they can follow white-collar crime, if you think they can follow mortgage fraud, that is not a state and local problem.

You may object to what happened at Mar-a-Lago but if you say defund the FBI, let your kid be abused by an adult. That's what the FBI does. Good luck, Jim.

ACOSTA: Yes. No, it doesn't add up. It's not a realistic proposal. And it seems to be made when Donald Trump gets himself into hot water. That is when they want to go after federal law enforcement. And speaking of which, we know that the unredacted search warrant was leaked. Many of the names of these agents who are involved are out there.

What are you hearing from your former colleagues that, you know, when they conduct a search like this, you know, this gets leaked and the agents' names and so on, it gets doxed?

MUDD: So let me step you through what happens. You've got to go home to your spouse or your girlfriend and your children, and you tell them my name is leaked and people who might want to commit an act of violence might come to our home. You've got to go to your workplace and say should we stay at home? And our kids are going back to school. It's August. Kids are going back to school. What do I do?

Will you provide me with security? Will the government provide security? How long will they provide it for? It's not just about people who want to commit an act of violence against an FBI agent. I would ask them to consider. Do you want to walk home to your family and your spouse and say, look over your shoulder when you go to the grocery store and ensure that you don't answer the door? It's that simple, Jim. It's that simple.

ACOSTA: Yes. And the motive here is intimidation. They want to intimidate people in law enforcement because of the nature of the work that they're doing. And it's not just the threats to the FBI. There's been an uptick in violent rhetoric online since the search including phrases like lock and load, another said Attorney General Merrick Garland, quote, "needs to be assassinated simple as that." Another said, kill all feds.

You know, a lot of this, Phil, reminds me of the overheated rhetoric, the incendiary rhetoric that we saw in the run-up to January 6th. How worried are you that we might see another spasm of right-wing, domestic terrorism in this country like we saw on January 6th?

MUDD: I mean, I'm looking at this today and I'm surprised. This is the first time I've gotten this question. I'm surprised this question isn't coming up more often for a simple reason. When I followed extremists overseas I never anticipated we would see this in America. We are. Extremists overseas in some ways have similarities to what we see in this instance.

[18:35:04]

That is they require leadership to tell them that what they're thinking is OK. And they require validation from that leadership to suggest to them that violence is OK. We saw that before January 6th if you look at the rally. Right now we're seeing that the former president of the United States sends a note evidently according to news reports to the attorney general before -- early this week, saying, the country is in trouble. Is there anything I can do to help?

After the raid the former president of the United States, President Trump said, this is a fraud. This is a hoax. Some of that stuff might have been planted. The same thing that happened before January 6th is happening today. And I'm going to tell you as we saw in Phoenix in the past 24 hours, outside the FBI office, people with AR-15s in camo are going to say I'm going to do something about it.

That's dangerous. I think we're going to see another catastrophic event. I'm not sure but I think so. ACOSTA: And it's all because Trump can't handle the scrutiny. He can't

handle being the subject of an investigation. And he lashes out by declaring an enemy whether it is the press or people in law enforcement and so on. And it just seems to be a recurring pattern. Here we are again.

MUDD: It is. I mean, you could look at this one way if you're a standard president. Most of the presidents I dealt with or my friends dealt with they would go down and brief a president. Most presidents would say I don't want anything top secret, secret, or confidential in my house. Because that's a problem. This president says it's OK. He could have said, he could have said, I'm sorry. Get it out of here.

I'm sure the FBI would have said we don't want any problems so we'll remove the boxes and secure them. If you'd like to see this information in the future we can return it to you. I suspect that the explanation for what happened here is more nefarious. You could have a simple explanation that says the president doesn't care what is on the compound at Mar-a-Lago. You could have a more complex explanation that says this is good for the president.

He is going to say the deep state is coming after me. This is another example that I'm a victim. And he's going to play this going into another election campaign. National security, Jim, used to stop the American shoreline. It no longer does. It's part of American electoral campaigns. That is what you're seeing here.

ACOSTA: And the question has to be, I mean, he's offered excuse after excuse as to why they're there but he has not explained, his people have not explained why does he have that stuff at Mar-a-Lago? Why did he have that stuff at Mar-a-Lago? We don't have an answer to that. And until we have an answer to that, we're not going to know the full story.

MUDD: Yes. Yes.

ACOSTA: Phil Mudd, thanks as always. We appreciate it.

MUDD: Thank you.

ACOSTA: And hope you're OK, too. Sorry that --

MUDD: I'm fine. You know, just one quick comment. My girlfriend and I went out to lunch today. Jim, I have to see who is around. I have to see who is around. I can't believe this. I've been retired for 12 years. I can't believe it. Take care.

ACOSTA: I know what you mean. I know what you mean, Phil. All right. Thank you very much. I understand that all too well.

Coming up, a new inside account of Trump's years in office. Did he really complain that his generals should be loyal like Adolph Hitler's? The author of a forthcoming book joins us live next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:42:22]

ACOSTA: In the hours before the search at Trump's Mar-a-Lago became national news there was another sensational headline you may have missed that during Trump's time in office he once complained that his generals weren't totally loyal like Adolph Hitler's were during World War II. It came courtesy of an upcoming book from award-winning journalists Susan Glasser and Peter Baker called "The Divider: Trump in the White House" which details how Trump quickly soured on the military officials around him.

The book quotes Trump as saying, "You effing generals, why can't you be like the German generals?" Which generals, John Kelly asked. "The German generals in World War II," Trump responded. "You do know that they tried to kill Hitler three times and almost pulled it off." John Kelly said, then the White House chief of staff. "No, no, no. They were totally loyal to him," the former president replied.

And joining us now to talk about this is one of the authors of that book, Susan Glasser, CNN global affairs analyst and staff writer at the "New Yorker."

Susan, I suspect had there not been a search at Mar-a-Lago that gobbled up a lot of our attention we would have been talking about this anecdote that you picked up and reported in your book with your husband, the great Peter Baker, and I just have to -- we have to talk about this because it's unnerving I think to hear about Trump's thoughts on loyalty when it comes to generals in the military given what took place on January 6th. But tell us about this and some of the other alarming things that you picked up on.

SUSAN GLASSER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Well, that's right. Look, Jim. It's a through line, right? I mean, that incident with John Kelly happened all the way back in 2017 at the very beginning of Trump's tenure. Now there's a whole reason why we wanted to do a real four- year history of Trump in the White House because I think January 6th didn't spring from nowhere, right.

I had Trump's efforts to politicize the military, to politicize justice, by the way, his attacks on the FBI, on intelligence agencies, his views about his ability to control anything, all of those go very back to the beginning of his presidency. And you know, I think can you imagine being the White House chief of staff, a retired four-star Marine general, and having the president of the United States, you know, compare you to Hitler's generals.

ACOSTA: Right. And what did he mean by that?

GLASSER: You know, Kelly, according to our reporting, took it to mean that Trump wanted personal, absolute loyalty and again what's striking to me is that so many different current and retired generals served Trump in a variety of positions and even though they might have had big disagreements with each other, H.R. McMaster, his National Security adviser, didn't get along well with Jim Mattis, the Defense secretary.

[18:45:07] Mark Milley, the final chairman of the Joint Chiefs, currently still the chairman of the Joint Chiefs, obviously had his differences with Mattis, and yet they all had this experience with Donald Trump. Trump wanted the men in uniform to salute and say yes, sir and he thought he could just give them any order no matter what. And you know, they are a group that as a collective essentially worships the Constitution and this idea of a nonpartisan military.

ACOSTA: Right. They actually, I mean, whether you agree with their policies and so on they actually understand the concept of country first which is the exact opposite of what Trump wanted. He wanted Trump first.

And Susan, you also take us back to the summer of 2017 when Trump went to Paris for Bastille Day celebrations thrown by the French President Emmanuel Macron, Trump then really wanted to throw a parade of his own and this is really incredible, you report that he told his new chief of staff John Kelly, a retired Marine Corps general, about his vision. And we put this up on screen. "Look, I don't want any wounded guys in the parade, Trump said. This doesn't look good for me to which Kelly replied," I feel like this is sort of like a running thing between Trump and Kelly.

But, anyway, "Kelly says those are the heroes. In our society there is only one group of people who are more heroic than they are and they are buried over at Arlington. Trump says in response I don't want them. It doesn't look good for me."

I mean, Susan, time and again this sounds like what a dictator would say and how a dictator would act.

GLASSER: Well, that's exactly right, Jim. And actually, just not that long after that conversation with Kelly there was another meeting in the Oval Office that we recount in that "New Yorker" excerpt in which Paul Salva, at the time the vice chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Trump again brings up the parade and he wants a military parade and Salva says, sir, you know, I grew up in Portugal when it was a military dictatorship and I have to tell you that kind of parade, that's not what we do here in America. You know, that is what dictators do. And Trump basically said yes, that's what I want. That's still what I want.

ACOSTA: Yes. He always wanted to see the tanks rolling down Constitution Avenue. It's just -- it's so absurd. And the book also takes us to the days after the Lafayette Square incident when authorities forcibly pushed out those peaceful protesters. They were using tear gas and so on. I was there at the White House that day. I remember all of this very well. And you talk about how the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Mark Milley kept rewriting and rewriting drafts of a resignation letter that he ultimately never sent. I mean, it's just remarkable.

GLASSER: Well, you know, the language, again, you know, it's known obviously that Mark Milley, he apologized for appearing in that Lafayette Square photo op in the week after it occurred. It's known that he obviously, you know, felt that he had made a big mistake in walking in his combat fatigues.

ACOSTA: Right.

GLASSER: He then challenged Trump, but to hear his own language I think that he considered the commander-in-chief and the president of the United States a threat to the international order, someone who did not believe in the fundamental values that the United States fought against in World War II, fought against fascism and Nazism, that's the through line to me to that conversation with John Kelly in the beginning of Trump's presidency.

ACOSTA: Right. I mean, and you know, Trump was running up against these guard rails, you know, of our democracy, and, you know, fortunately you did have -- I mean, again, people might say they did the wrong thing. They should have gone out there and blown the whistle and said all of the things that Trump was doing behind the scenes instead of waiting until after the administration was over and so on.

But in many ways you have to say thank goodness so many of them were there to sort of guard the country against Trump's worst instincts.

Susan Glasser, can't wait until the book comes out. Say hi to Peter for me. Thanks so much. We really appreciate it.

GLASSER: Thank you.

ACOSTA: All right. And we'll take a quick break. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:53:31]

ACOSTA: Imagine spending an entire year in one of the wildest places on earth, coping with hungry predators, stormy seas and high altitudes. Tonight, we'll get a behind-the-scenes look at what it took to film the groundbreaking series, "PATAGONIA." Here's a preview.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PEDRO PASCAL, NARRATOR: By the time the storm passes, the crew have just one day left before they have to return to port.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's usually tricky, not this tricky. It has been spectacularly difficult.

PASCAL: Then Tomas get some exciting news. Whales have been spotted only two hours away.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We got some whales. Nice. A big one and a small one.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: "PATAGONIA, LIFE ON THE EDGE OF THE WORLD" airs tonight at 9:00 right here on CNN. Don't miss it. And now a timeline cleanser. And to a miraculous discovery for a

caving team in Missouri. They found a lost dog 500 feet underground. Her name is Abby and she had been missing for two months. There's Abby right there. The team was mapping a cave when somebody told them they had spotted the dog.

[18:55:02]

They found her lying deep inside the cave, starving and unable to walk. The rescue took over an hour, we're told. As they brought Abby up in a duffel bag, she was reunited with her thrilled family and they say she is recovering, walking, and getting back to normal.

If my little dog Duke was in the same situation, my goodness, I would go to the ends of the earth, too, and that's what they did here. Good for Abby. If anybody out there has some pics of Abby, we'd love to see how she's doing now.

That's the news. Reporting from Atlanta, I'm Jim Acosta. I'll see you back here next Saturday at 3:00 p.m. Eastern. I'm going to go check in on Duke now. Kate Bolduan takes over the CNN NEWSROOM live after a quick break. Have a great week, everybody.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)