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Car Bomb Kills Daughter of Influential Putin Ally Outside Moscow; No Regrets for Liz Cheney Despite Primary Loss Over Trump; GOP Rep Rips Mar-a-Lago Search; Gary Busey Faces Sex Offense Charges at New Jersey Convention; Rising Hate, Antisemitism in America; 21-year- old Woman Crusading Against Abortion Rights; Remembering Anne Heche. Aired 8-9p ET

Aired August 21, 2022 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[20:00:00]

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: I love it. Absolutely love it. Ohio should have competed better and more. Keep better, Ohio.

All right. The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts right now.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY (voice-over): The daughter of an influential Putin ally killed by a car bomb on the outskirts of Moscow.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: There was a major explosion while she was driving on that highway. The car went up in flames and she was dead on the spot. The big question is, was she the actual target?

REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA): We would also like to see what documents that were marked top-secret-SCI were in the president's possession at Mar- a-Lago. This is very serious business.

REP. DAN CRENSHAW (R-TX): Do any of us really believe that Donald Trump is like reading his nuclear secrets on his bed side at night?

REP. LIZ CHENEY (R-WY): No regrets. I feel sad about where my party is. I feel sad about the way that too many of my colleagues have responded to what I think is a great moral test and challenge of our time.

MATTINGLY: Some 160 people safely evacuated from a New Mexico national park after being trapped by flash floods.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The roads that are washed out and we can't pass through. They don't even know about food and water for us.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's still raining. It's not letting go.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY: I'm Phil Mattingly in Washington. Pamela Brown has the night off. You are in the CNN NEWSROOM.

And tonight investigators in Russia say the car bomb that killed the daughter of a key Putin ally was preplanned. The murder investigation is now under way after Darya Dugina died in last night's attack on the outskirts of Moscow. Her father is an influential Russian ultra nationalist. He's also considered one of the architects of the Ukraine invasion, is often described as Putin's brain.

CNN's Fred Pleitgen is in Moscow tonight -- Fred.

PLEITGEN: Hi, Phil. Well, there's very little in the way of information coming out from that investigative committee as to where exactly things stand with that investigation. However, one of the things that we have heard is that the explosive yield they believe of that bomb was the equivalent of about 400 grams of TNT. They also say that they found parts of what they think might have been that explosive device and have sent those in for forensic investigation.

But of course a lot is still very much unclear, like, for instance, who might be behind all of this. Here's what we're learning.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PLEITGEN (voice-over): A car engulfed in a massive fire ball on a highway outside Moscow. Police say the vehicle exploded and then crashed. The driver dead on the scene. That driver was Darya Dugina, a well-known commentator and supporter of Russia's invasion of Ukraine who was sanctioned by the United States and by the U.K. She was also the daughter of prominent right-wing idealogue Alexander Dugin who promotes Russian expansionism.

According to Russian state media an explosive device detonated Saturday night setting the vehicle on fire. Russia has opened a criminal investigation and the investigative committee says they believe Dugina was murdered. Taking into account the data already obtained, the investigation believes that the crime was preplanned and of an ordered nature, a statement said. While forensic work continued the Foreign Ministry implied that Ukraine may be behind the attack.

"If the Ukrainian trace is confirmed," Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova wrote on Telegram, "then we should talk about the policy of state terrorism implemented by the Kyiv regime."

The Ukrainians deny any involvement.

MYKHAILO PODOLIAK, ADVISER TO THE HEAD OF THE OFFICE OF THE PRESIDENT OF UKRAINE (through translator): I emphasize that Ukraine definitely has nothing to do with this because we are not a criminal state, which the Russian federation is and even more so we are not a terrorist state.

PLEITGEN: But some in Russia believe Darya Dugina wasn't the actual target of the explosion but rather her father. Alexander Dugin also sanctioned by the U.S. remains highly influential in Russia as he calls for the annexation of large parts of Ukraine. An ultraconservative philosopher and TV personality with roots in the Orthodox Church he's a champion of Russian expansionism. Some claiming he may have influenced Vladimir Putin's decision to further invade Ukraine. In 2014 Dugin said Russia must, quote, "kill, kill, and kill" the people running Ukraine and that there should be no more discussion.

Darya Dugina was 29 years old when she was killed. Russian investigators say they are frantically working to find those responsible.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PLEITGEN: So as you can see there, Phil, the investigation is still very much in its early stages and as of right now we have not yet heard from Vladimir Putin on this topic at all. However, when you look at for instance the upper echelons of Russian politics and especially Kremlin controlled media you do hear a lot of anger there.

[20:05:08]

And of course this has had a chilling effect as well -- Phil.

MATTINGLY: Yes. Great reporting, Fred. So much more to come on this story. Fred Pleitgen for us in Moscow.

Now Republican Congresswoman Liz Cheney just days removed from a crushing defeat in her re-election bid says she has no regrets. Cheney became the top target of former President Trump and his supporters after voting for his impeachment and now serving as the vice chair of the January 6th Committee. Cheney says her greater concern is the direction of her Republican Party.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHENEY: No regrets. You know, I feel sad about where my party is. I feel sad about the way that too many of my colleagues have responded to what I think is a great moral test and challenge of our time, a great moment to determine whether or not people are going to stand up on behalf of the democracy and on behalf of our republic.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: I want to bring in two pals of mine, very smart people. CNN national politics reporter Eva McKend, and Tia Mitchell, Washington correspondent for "The Atlanta Journal Constitution."

Guys, thanks so much for coming in and hanging out.

Tia, I want to start with you because Liz Cheney got smoked, right? Got doubled up on her, on the vote total. I think everybody kind of expected it by the time it actually happened. But it was still a huge margin. What does it tell you about Trump's hold on the Republican Party? How much can you extrapolate based on Wyoming and the primary?

TIA MITCHELL, WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, THE ATLANTA JOURNAL CONSTITUTION: Yes. I think to me it's not just Trump's hold on the Republican Party. It's that the Republican Party has been remade in this MAGA image that is going to last even if President Trump isn't on the ballot. So it shows that the majority of Republicans are agreeing with these kind of MAGA principles and anti-democratic sometimes stances that Liz Cheney now finds herself on the opposite side of many members of her party.

MATTINGLY: You know, one of the questions that I think the question everybody has in Washington right now with Cheney in the wake of her loss is, is she going to run, right? And she has artfully dodged the question in a way that makes everybody continue to ask that question. But the big question is, if she runs what's her goal? Is her goal to win? Does she run as a Republican, as an independent? Is her goal solely to stop the former president? How do you see this playing out?

MITCHELL: That's a great question. I think in her mind she would like to run as a Republican but we know that's not really feasible because we've seen she -- it's going to be hard for her to win a Republican primary in her state, it would be hard for her to win a Republican primary nationwide. So she does have options of becoming an independent or, you know, the extreme of becoming a Democrat. But I think it still is going to be hard for her to find a path to winning in 2024 no matter what her political affiliation is.

MATTINGLY: Yes. And maybe that's not the goal. We'll see. It's going to be a question asked repeatedly.

Eva, Republican Congressman Dan Crenshaw was on with our colleague Jake Tapper this morning. He condemned some of the extreme rhetoric we've heard from some Republicans including those who've called for defunding the FBI, but he's also critical of the Justice Department's handling of the Mar-a-Lago investigation. Take a listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRENSHAW: I still haven't seen any evidence that he was even asked, that Trump was even asked to give these documents back. He's been cooperating with them on these issues for a while now, for months. And so why take it to this extreme extend? And I think that's why you're seeing so much backlash from the Republicans, you're seeing everyone coalesce.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: So there's two parts to that answer but I'll ask you about the second one. You can get into the first one if you want to. The idea of coalescing behind, that has been kind of a narrative, right, that like, oh, this made Trump the Republican nominee. Everybody is getting behind him now. Do you think that's true?

EVA MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Well, Phil, that certainly is the immediate consequence. It is going to be interesting to watch if this episode has that lasting power, that lasting effect. But Congressman Crenshaw's response I think is worth some scrutiny. So he didn't acknowledge that multiple attempts were made to make -- to get these documents, including through subpoena. He also suggested that the defund the police movement and defund the FBI movement were one and the same, equally as problematic.

We know that the defund police movement was born out of activists and marginalized groups living in those communities who have said that policing -- over policing and over surveilling of their communities has wreaked havoc in those communities. The defund the FBI movement relatively new seems to be a grievance about how a former president is treated and it seems like he would be treated the same way, is being treated the same way as any other American would.

So I think as these Republicans sort of stick to their talking points on these issues, we have to be really critical of these responses. No matter how much it galvanizes the party.

MATTINGLY: Appreciate your ability to actually try and contextualize the defund the FBI movement which to my sense up to this point has no sense or logic behind it whatsoever or policy proposals behind it to say the least.

[20:10:02]

Eva, I want you to take a look at this. The new ABC poll that came out today says the majority of registered voters want the investigations of the former president to continue. Nearly six in 10 voters back the investigations, all of them, to some degree. Does this surprise you in such a polarized nation right now, people being so tired of the former president to some degree or loving him so much that a strong majority actually supports this right now?

MCKEND: It did, Phil. And, you know, actually it echoes what I've been hearing out on the campaign trail. I've traveled to Georgia, Pennsylvania, in recent weeks. And I'm hearing that from voters at campaign rallies that they are -- one of their number one issues is the future of our democracy. So to the extent that these investigations are linked to that, that is why we are seeing this concern. What I will say is that it is, does present a problem for Republicans because they want the number one issue to be of course inflation and the economy. But voters are also concerned about the former president.

MATTINGLY: This is why it's important to talk to reporters on the trail as opposed to people in the studio. You actually talk to people. It's fascinating to watch it because the other big number there was that democracy and concerns about democracy popped in a way, I think it's 21 percent, it's a top issue.

Tia, the Biden administration has had a good couple of weeks, unquestionably. But there's been a lot of questions leading up to that good couple of weeks about how Democrats were viewing the president in 2024 but also in the midterms. Democratic Senator Mark Kelly says he's not worried about winning Arizona, his home state, in 2024 if Biden runs for re-election. But to some degree is that overshadowed by, you know, the reticence to say I want Joe Biden to campaign with me in Arizona in my very hotly contested race? He didn't even say no. But he wasn't like all in on it.

MITCHELL: Yes. And we're seeing it play out in Georgia and other swing states that have very high profile races. Biden has not gone on the road. I think right now the thinking is among Democrats that they should celebrate their wins but that Biden himself is just going to create another avenue for, you know, attacks and distractions from what they believe is a positive story for them to tell about all their recent wins on guns, health care costs, climate change, even the falling prices along a lot of sectors.

So we may see Biden eventually. There is still, you know, a lot of time until November but I think they'd rather talk about what they've done instead of focus on the individual knowing that that creates the lane for Republicans to come in on the attack.

MATTINGLY: Yes, it's going to be fascinating to watch. The president's travel schedule in this moment in time kind of post-Labor Day tells a lot about what's about to happen. And he's about to hit the road. We'll see where he actually goes.

Eva McKend, Tia Mitchell, thanks, guys. Appreciate it as always.

All right, there are still a lot more ahead tonight on NEWSROOM including new details into what led to charges being filed against actor Gary Busey at a movie convention in New Jersey.

Plus CNN sits down with anti-abortion activists who see new hope in persuading states to tighten restrictions on abortion.

And Jews face more than half of all religiously motivated hate crimes right now. Tonight in a CNN special report we get a first-hand look at some of the private operations dedicated to protecting the Jewish community.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:17:20]

MATTINGLY: We're now learning more about the circumstances that led to criminal charges being filed against actor Gary Busey. He's accused of sex offenses, several of them, for his alleged behavior at the Monster Mania Convention in New Jersey.

Jean Casarez joins me now. And Jean, it's been a fluid story. What more are we learning at this point?

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It is fluid. I think that's a great way to term it because this is sort of in its infancy. Charges were filed on Friday but let's go back to last weekend. The Cherry Hill Police Department out of New Jersey is telling us that it was last weekend was the Monster Mania Convention in Cherry Hill, New Jersey, at the Doubletree Hotel. One of the celebrity guests was Gary Busey. And then the police were called during that weekend and they say it was, quote, "for a report of a sex offense."

Now that's all we know at this point. We are not being told what allegedly occurred at all. But we do know this last week had to have been the investigatory initial phase because on Friday those charges were filed. Let's show everybody what the charges are. And they are criminal. Two

counts of criminal sexual contact fourth degree. One count of criminal attempt. Criminal sexual contact fourth degree. And one count of harassment, disorderly persons offense.

Now, there is an attorney for the Monster Mania Convention and they did reply to us. They said that they are working with investigators at this point and, quote, "Immediately upon receiving a complaint from the attendee the celebrity guest was removed from the convention and instructed not to return."

So we reached out to the Camden County Prosecutor's Office, the district attorney. They referred us back to the police department. The police department, the chief tells us that Gary Busey has not at all been processed. There is no mugshot at all. There is a complaint. Numerous attempts we tried to get it. They did not send it to us. And we've reached out to Gary Busey's representatives who have not responded back to us.

So we'll see how this develops but at this point there are criminal charges. It's the lowest felony there is but it is a felony.

MATTINGLY: Yes. Develop is a key word. It feels like there is so much more to come.

Jean Casarez, you've been all over it. Thanks so much.

CASAREZ: Thanks, Phil.

MATTINGLY: You're in the CNN NEWSROOM, and still ahead one of President Biden's top economic advisers reacts to critics who argue the U.S. is not in a good place economically despite some encouraging news over the course of the last few weeks.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:24:05]

MATTINGLY: A great week to be an American. That's what President Biden tweeted yesterday. The president does have some very real reasons to celebrate. Gas prices keep falling now down by more than 20 percent in two months. Jobless claims also fell slightly, unexpectedly, last week. And on Tuesday the president signed his health care and climate bill into law after many, including those of us who cover the White House, thought those agenda items were as good as dead.

Despite all of this Biden's approval ratings still poor. Earlier I asked White House economic adviser Jared Bernstein if the recent wins can reverse the president's sagging poll numbers and I mentioned the criticism from one congressional Republican.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ANDY BARR (R-KY): There is a reason why the American people are angry and anxious and that's because they are worse off under the policies of congressional Democrats and Joe Biden. Yes, they are concerned about our country and the future of our country because we're in a recession because we've had two consecutive quarters of negative economic growth.

[20:25:03]

MATTINGLY: What is your response to that? Because that is what you hear a lot of Republicans talking about on the campaign trail. And while things have been very good for the White House over the course of the last several weeks there are still headwinds facing you guys heading into a midterm election.

JARED BERNSTEIN, WHITE HOUSE COUNCIL OF ECONOMIC ADVISERS: No question. But there are also tail winds, and comments like the ones you just heard very much leave the tail winds aside. Now, look, I want to be clear that we've been very forthright even in our conversation about talking about head winds and inflation but let's not forget that we are looking at an unemployment rate that is 3.5 percent. That's tied for a 53-year low.

We just learned I believe on Friday that 22 states have an unemployment rate below 3 percent. That is a record and I'm not going to get into the technical definition of a recession. I will tell you that as a student of that technical definition those kinds of numbers are completely inconsistent with this being a recession in the here and now. So on a factual basis what you just heard was wrong.

Now, what is also true is that everybody's crystal ball is pretty cracked right now. And it's awfully hard to look out weeks, months, and quarters. But I can tell you from where we sit right now whether you're looking at the main factors that the group who actually calls the recession looks at, whether it's the retail sales number we just got, whether it's the jobs numbers we were just talking about, industrial production, personal consumer expenditures, those key economic variables are not in a recessionary territory at all.

But that doesn't mean we can sit on our hands and just be relaxed and forget. We have to continue to push to make sure.

MATTINGLY: We're seeing credit card balances start to shoot up over the course of the last couple of months. Are you seeing any signs right now that it's potentially problematic and that inflation is really starting to eat away --

BERNSTEIN: So I'm glad that you raised the last period where we were coming out of a downturn which was of course the great recession at the heels of the housing bubble imploding back then. At that time, both business and household balance sheets were an absolute wreck. And so that kind of credit area that you're talking about was really damaged. There was no buffer there.

I just looked at these numbers today. I don't know what you do on a Sunday but this is what I was doing. That the historical average of debt servicing meaning how much households have to pay to service their debt bill is 11 percent of their income. 11 percent of income is the historical average. Right now it's 9.5 percent, well below that average. And that has to do with household balance sheets in pretty good shape and the very strong job market that we're are talking about.

It's giving families a real buffer that makes this period much different than the one we were talking about after the great housing financial crisis.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: And I also asked Bernstein whether the White House expects gas prices to continue to fall. He said they do but added that he's keeping an eye on potential disruptions like China and the upcoming hurricane season.

It's one of the oldest forms of hate but antisemitism is finding new and very terrifying footing in American society. Dana Bash, a good buddy, is here to share what she learned while putting together an exceptional special report airing next hour on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:32:13]

MATTINGLY: Anti-Semitic incidents have been on the rise in recent years. And while the Jewish community makes up just about 2 percent of the population in the United States almost 60 percent of religiously motivated hate crimes are directed at Jews. That's according to one expert our colleague Dana Bash Spoke with in her new documentary, "RISING HATE: ANTISEMITISM IN AMERICA."

The threat has become so intense that there are private operations dedicated just to the safety of the Jewish community. Dana went inside one of them.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Spring, 2020. Chicago, like most cities in the U.S., was a ghost town. Locked down by the pandemic. But not this secret location.

(On-camera): So this is the command center?

(Voice-over): Mike Masters is the CEO of the Secure Community Network. Its 24/7 command center is privately funded and staffed with veterans from the intelligence sector. Analysts monitor all the way down to the dark Web for anti-Semitic threats.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We saw a spike during COVID. Our duty desks started registering a significant increase in proliferation of antisemitism in the online space.

BASH: That desk has never been seen on national television until now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What you're looking at here, all those blue dots represent a Jewish facility. And then the red paddles represent potential risk events. Where there is a congruence of the risk events in the institution that's when we're getting alert and that's when our team of analysts will start to go to work.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And we work with them day in and day out, really 24/7.

BASH (on-camera): What does their command center do that the FBI can't?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They give us a different flow of information that we might not otherwise have.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY: Our good friend Dana Bash joins me now. And Dana, look, I'm very happy you're doing this piece because I feel like over the course of the last several years we constantly see the stories about these very real issues that are going on. And yet nobody has totally put it together to really give people a sense of the scale, right? And you just look at the map, plot on the map what we saw there extraordinarily disturbing.

You spoke with a lot of experts for the documentary. What can you tell us right now about why there are so many threats in this moment in the U.S.?

BASH: So many reasons, Phil. One of the reasons is the internet. The internet is making it so much easier for hate to travel. I spoke to a former skinhead who was recruited and then started recruiting others on the streets of L.A. in the 1980s.

[20:35:02]

And now he is a tech expert in trying to combat hate online. And he said, right -- he was recruited on a street corner and now with the internet you can be on a thousand street corners at a time. That is one. The other is that there are leaders in America who don't condemn the hate. And we see data and you'll see in this special that shows that when a leader is asked to condemn anti-Semitic hate and declines to, the people who are watching, and they watch carefully, take that as a green light. And then the incidents spike.

MATTINGLY: And I think that gets it, (INAUDIBLE), the decision to explore the history of antisemitism in America, we've all learned about it. We all know it existed. Yet its prevalence particularly as it is rising now is stunning to some degree. This has been so pervasive for so long. Why? Why has it lasted for so long and continues?

BASH: For millennia. It really has. You say we've all learned about it. What is disturbing that I realized in doing this hour is that just even the most recent, most egregious, the holocaust, there is a decline in teaching and educating about the holocaust in schools across the country.

And what I learned, Phil, and it sounds so basic, is education is really the key. People need to understand what it means, A, to be a Jew. What it means to comprehend these conspiracy theories that have been going on for thousands and thousands of years in order to stay away from it, the tropes about Jews. That Jews run the world, that the Jews run the money in the world, and most recently Jews are responsible for disease.

And I say most recently because part of the spike in anti-Semitic incidents in 2020 and 2021 was because of COVID. There are data sets that show that people started to blame Jews for the existence of COVID, for the spread of COVID, even saying that the vaccines were created by the Jews in order to hurt people. I mean, all these conspiracy theories that have been going on for so long are still real now in the modern era and again spreading so much more easily because of the online presence.

MATTINGLY: Yes. An absolute accelerant and it's terrifying what you're saying about education or lack thereof. Incredibly important issue. Incredibly important hour of television. Also incredibly powerful piece that you wrote on CNN.com earlier this week about your son. I'm not going to get too detailed into it. You should read the piece. It really kind of moves you and shakes you to some degree when you think about the dynamics there.

Dana Bash, thanks so much for coming on.

BASH: Thanks, Phil. Appreciate it.

MATTINGLY: All right. And Dana's CNN special "RISING HATE: ANTISEMITISM IN AMERICA" is coming up at the top of the hour.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. The overturning of Roe vs. Wade is motivating Americans on both sides of the issue to take action. CNN speaks with antiabortion activists on what they feel should be done to support women now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ELLE REEVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Is the goal to convince progressive women to accept restrictions on abortion or is the goal to convince conservatives to create a more generous social welfare state?

ERIKA BACHIOCHI, DIRECTOR, THE WOLLSTONECRAFT PROJECT: I'd say the goal is probably both.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:43:03]

MATTINGLY: Tonight, she is 21 years old and at least according to polls completely out of step with nearly three-quarters of Americans her age. Deborah Cumbee is one of the newest and strongest faces of the antiabortion movement.

CNN's Elle Reeve sat down with her for a glimpse into what she sees as the future of her cause.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DEBORAH CUMBEE, COMMUNICATIONS AND RESEARCH ASSISTANT, MASSACHUSETTS FAMILY INSTITUTE: When I was 12 I was fundraising for a local pregnancy resource center. And during that time I was watching videos of what abortions actually were. And from that moment on I knew that the rest of my life would be dedicated to working in the pro-life movement.

REEVE (voice-over): Deborah Cumbee is 21 years old and has spent half her life in antiabortion politics. She is trained in activism at conservative think tanks.

CUMBEE: The first thing I texted my best friend was in all caps Roe v. Wade is overturned and she texted back, and she's like, it's about time. We're just absolutely ecstatic that the pro-life movement has been given this chance to modernize our laws.

REEVE: Cumbee is unusual. 74 percent of adults under 30 think abortion should be legal in most cases but she embodies an effort in the antiabortion movement to present a more modern woman friendly face. One still rooted in religion but with a pitch that makes claims based on science.

CUMBEE: My faith informs me how I treat people but science is what tells me that life begins at conception. I am not supposed to exist. I am a young woman who is a professional who is advocating for the life of children. We're here to say, if you need a community to come alongside you and give you another option, other than to take the life of your child and pay into an abortion industry that really just wants to take your money and kill your child, we're here to tell you, you don't have to do that.

REEVE (on-camera): Do you really think abortion providers just want to take your money and kill your child? Do you think that's the motivation?

CUMBEE: It looks like to a lot of us that they are hurting disadvantaged women so that way they can continue to have their practice and their stream of revenue come in.

[20:45:04]

REEVE: So is that a yes?

CUMBEE: Yes.

REEVE (voice-over): The Dobbs decision brings the fight to the states. At the Massachusetts Family Institute, Andrew Beckwith thinks his state is the front line in the cultural war.

ANDREW BECKWITH, PRESIDENT, MASSACHUSETTS FAMILY INSTITUTE: The child conceived in Massachusetts should actually have the same right to life and to birth as a child conceived in Mississippi or Texas or Alabama.

REEVE: The infant mortality rate in Mississippi which you consider the more pro-life state is twice as high as it is in Massachusetts. BECKWITH: That's a tragedy. Here in Massachusetts we've got some of

the best medical care. It is a shame that we don't leverage that to promote a culture of life.

REEVE (voice-over): Legal scholar Erica (INAUDIBLE) is trying to create a socially conservative feminism that rejects the sexual revolution.

BACHIOCHI: When you sort of enable through abortion what you think is consequence free sex, you're really just putting the consequences on women. We've left women with the burdens of fertility and we've really let men off the hook. And I think what we've seen, I mean, in the last 50 years, is this real epidemic of fatherlessness.

BECKWITH: We believe men should be responsible and be fathers, and not use abortion as a kind of after the fact contraception or get out of jail free card.

REEVE (on-camera): So do you think banning abortion would make men more responsible as fathers?

BECKWITH: I think it should. We're going to have to really help restore the culture to where fatherhood is valued. We want to give them something better than just sort of video games and Netflix.

REEVE: I just don't understand why I need to give something up so that men can be better people. Like maybe you could develop policy --

BECKWITH: What do you see yourself as giving up?

REEVE: Why would women need to give up their right to an abortion so that men can eventually become better people? What if you made policy to address the man problem that addressed the man problem directly?

BECKWITH: I think you're coming at it from a very different place conceptually even.

REEVE (voice-over): The conceptual framework Bachiochi is working in imagines a less individualistic society, one that emphasizes the obligations people have to each other. Less abortion, more family leave.

(On-camera): Is the goal to convince progressive women to accept restrictions on abortion or is the goal to convince conservatives to create a more generous social welfare state?

BACHIOCHI: I'd say the goal is probably both. The GOP has been really captured by libertarian forces for a long time and they have not understood the ways in which some economic transitions going all the way back to Industrialization have really harmed especially the working classes and the poor.

REEVE: This pitch is like, OK, sacrifice your individual rights. Like it is actually in your best interests. You sacrifice your individual rights to an abortion but we're going to get all of the other good stuff. But the good stuff never comes. BACHIOCHI: There is just a real shift I think happening in the GOP

that I hope happens more and more toward understanding the responsibilities that the community as a whole has toward families.

CUMBEE: We would love to see more organizations instead of paying for women to get abortions, we'd love to see them offer other alternatives like paid maternity leave and having flexible hours for the women who have children.

REEVE: I am wondering are you as focused on convincing conservatives of the necessity for a broader, more generous welfare state?

CUMBEE: I mean, to be honest, here in Massachusetts all of our time is really taken by putting out the fires of pro-choice and antilife policies. I want life to prevail within the United States and in Massachusetts.

REEVE (voice-over): Elle Reeve, CNN, Boston.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY: You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. The price of actress Anne Heche's memoir spikes online after her death puts new attention on what she wrote about her personal struggles in the past. Screenwriter and TV producer who worked with Anne Heche and knew her well joins us to share how she's remembering the actress, coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:54:02]

MATTINGLY: As fans remember actress Anne Heche this weekend there is also a scramble to find copies of her memoir "Call Me Crazy" detailing her career, dating life, and battles with childhood abuse. It's now retailing for hundreds of dollars.

Anne Heche died at the age of 53. She was taken off life support last weekend. That was after a fiery car crash in Los Angeles that left her so critically injured.

Joining me now is screenwriter and TV producer, Jenny Bicks.

And Jenny, thanks so much for coming on. You were the creator and show runner for the ABC show "Men in Trees," starred Anne Heche. But why I'm glad you're here is because I read your piece in "Variety" where you've added a human element to what has been kind of a very one dimensional story which is not a criticism of anybody but just you can forget sometimes these are human beings.

And in that piece you've described Anne Heche as incredibly open, incredibly driven. You also talked about her willingness to take notes and how quickly she would implement those notes. What can you tell us about that side of Anne Heche?

[20:55:04] JENNY BICKS, SCREENWRITER, TV PRODUCER: Yes. I think the thing about Anne was she -- we all know about her, she was very public about her traumas and about her past, and I think it allowed her by being so open about it to be incredibly empathetic actor, incredibly creatively open. One of the smartest people you'll ever meet and one of the funniest. And she allowed herself to be wide open and to allow other people to be wide open around her.

And so it meant that the actors that she was working felt really accepted and she was a fantastic screen partner because of that. But these are all the things that are easy to forget because of how she passed.

MATTINGLY: And I want to ask you about that. You know, you write in the "Variety" piece it is hard for me to reconcile the Anne that I knew with the circumstances of her death. What did you mean by that?

BICKS: I think there's -- it's so easy for us especially in the media to sensationalize an ending, and I think in some ways it allows us to forget who that person is when they're alive. And there was so much multidimension to Anne and so much life to her. She was the most alive person you'll ever meet. Incredibly charismatic. And inspiring and optimistic. And so when someone dies like this, it's so easy to shut the door on those other memories of them. And I think it's all of our responsibility to keep that -- the vision of who she really was alive.

MATTINGLY: Do you think -- and I mentioned this earlier, this kind of fallout story of her memoir being coveted to some degree, written more than 10 years ago. It's out of print and now it's retailing for hundreds of dollars. One, I guess, are you surprised? And, two, do you think that that will actually help in the process that you're describing and hopeful that it doesn't get lost in the wake of her death?

BICKS: First of all, good for her that her book is doing well. I wish, and I hope she's somewhere where she can know that. And I think, sure. I think it helps anybody who's been through the kind of trauma that she went through as a child. And if you read the book, or I was lucky enough before I worked with her to actually listen to her narrating the book on tape which is probably is worth now thousands of dollars.

You get a sense of really who she was. It was so easy for people to say, oh, she was just crazy and because that was the title of her book. But what it really meant was she had found a way through her trauma and become one of the most remarkable actresses that we had working today.

MATTINGLY: And I think that's kind of the point I want to get at where, you know, in the book she details some of the very trouble she faced throughout her life. Very personal terms both from the personal side and the professional side. You said that Anne faced her trauma and that made her stronger to some degree. Can you walk us through kind of what you meant by that?

BICKS: Well, she was a survivor. She had been through so much, first in her early childhood, but then obviously in terms of her relationship with -- her first lesbian relationship that was picked up by the media and was not looked fondly upon by a lot of the studios so she was in some ways blacklisted. When I had her on my show she actually begged to audition because she knew that there were those people who felt that she would be a liability. That they really did think she was crazy.

And she came in as she won the part hands down. And I, from that moment, I was charmed by her because she had such strength from her trauma. And I think that's something that can live on past Anne is that she was able to show that through trauma you can find your strength and I hope that is an inspiration to other people and I know she wanted it to be an inspiration to other people.

MATTINGLY: I really appreciate you coming on and sharing a very personal perspective.

Jenny Bicks, thanks so much.

BICKS: Thank you.

MATTINGLY: And before we go, I do want to update you on the condition of a Little Leaguer from Utah who has to undergo another CT scan several days after he fell from his dormitory bunk bed and fractured his skull. 12-year-old Easton Oliverson fell again last night and hit his head. According to an Instagram post the CT scan is a precaution to make sure the fall didn't cause any swelling. It happened just hours after Easton thanked supporters for all their thoughts and prayers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

EASTON OLIVERSON, LITTLE LEAGUE BASEBALL PLAYER: Hey, this is Easton. Thank you for the prayers.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You starting to feel better, bud?

OLIVERSON: Yes. I'm starting to feel better.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Awesome. Team Easton. We love you, buddy.

OLIVERSON: Love you, too.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Here in the CNN NEWSROOM we are all rooting for Easton's recovery, thinking about him. Praying for him. Go get them, buddy.

That's it for me. Thank you so much for joining me this evening. I'm Phil Mattingly. The CNN Special Report, "RISING HATE: ANTISEMITISM IN AMERICA" starts right now.

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