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Car Bomb Kills Daughter of Putin Ally near Moscow; Frontline Towns under Fire as Russia Tries to Advance in East; Doing the Dangerous Work Of Clearing Mines from Ukraine; At Least 21 Dead After al-Shabaab Militants Attack Hotel. Aired 1-2a ET
Aired August 22, 2022 - 01:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[01:00:28]
MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, and welcome to our viewers all around the world. I'm Michael Holmes. I appreciate your company. Coming up on CNN Newsroom, investigators in Russia say the car bomb that killed the daughter of a key Putin ally was pre-planned, ahead what we know about the influence of her family.
Plus, after almost a half a year of fighting in Ukraine, the land littered with landmines. So what's being done to clear them all? And Indiana's governor is the latest U.S. official to visit Taiwan just weeks after the House Speaker went there. What's behind his trip? And how is China responding?
ANNOUNCER: Live from CNN Center, this is CNN Newsroom with Michael Holmes.
HOLMES: Investigators in Russia are working to find out who was responsible for a car bomb near Moscow that killed the daughter of a prominent supporter of President Vladimir Putin. Daria Dugina died on Saturday night after the vehicle she was driving exploded. The Russian Investigative Committee is looking into it, a foreign ministry official has implied Ukraine might be responsible. Ukraine strongly denying that.
Dugina is the daughter of Alexander Dugin, who's been described as Putin's brain and called the spiritual guide to Russia's invasion of Ukraine. According to the Russian news agency tasked, the investigation has now revealed that 400 grams of TNT was used in Saturday's car explosion. CNN's Frederik Pleitgen following all of the developments for us from Moscow.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: A car engulfed in a massive fireball on a highway outside Moscow. Police say the vehicle exploded and then crashed, the driver dead on the scene. That driver was Daria Dugina, a well-known commentator and supporter of Russia's invasion of Ukraine, who was sanctioned by the United States and by the U.K. She was also the daughter of prominent right- wing ideologues Alexander Dugin, who promotes Russian expansionism.
According to Russian state media, an explosive device detonated Saturday night setting the vehicle on fire. Russia has opened a criminal investigation. The investigative committee says they believe Dugina was murdered. Taking into account the data already obtained, the investigation believes that the crime was pre-planned and of an ordered nature a statement said, while forensic work continued the Foreign Ministry implied that Ukraine may be behind the attack.
If the Ukrainian trace is confirmed, Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova wrote on Telegram, then we should talk about the policy of state terrorism implemented by the key of regime. The Ukrainians deny any involvement.
MYKHAILO PODOLIAK, ADVISER TO THE HEAD OF THE OFFICE OF THE UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): I emphasize that Ukraine definitely has nothing to do with this, because we are not a criminal state, which the Russian Federation is an even more so, we are not a terrorist state.
PLEITGEN: But some in Russia believe Daria Dugina wasn't the actual target of the explosion, but rather her father. Alexander Dugin, also sanctioned by the U.S. remains highly influential in Russia, as he calls for the annexation of large parts of Ukraine and ultra- conservative philosopher and TV personality with roots in the Orthodox Church, he's a champion of Russian expansionism, some claiming he may have influenced Vladimir Putin's decision to further invade Ukraine.
In 2014, Dugin said Russia must, "kill, kill and kill the people running Ukraine and that there should be no more discussion."
Daria Dugina was 29 years old when she was killed. Russian investigators say they are frantically working to find those responsible. Frederik Pleitgen, CNN Moscow.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES: Matthew Schmidt is a professor of national security and political science at the University of New Haven. He joins me now.
Good to see you, Professor. So Alexander Dugin has been called Putin's brain, but what do we know about how close he really is to the Russian president? How much influence he's had or could that connection be overstated?
MATTHEW SCHMIDT, PROFESSOR, UNIVERSITY OF NEW HAVEN: He's had enormous influence. He's not that close to the President personally, at least not anymore. Putin has distance themselves since a second term in office but if you look at the speeches that Putin gave leading up to the invasion of Ukraine, he's practically quoting Dugin's magnum opus, right? The foundations of geopolitics when he's talking about Ukraine not being a real nation, not being a real language. That's all Dugin and Dugin has been out there doing that, since the 1990s.
[01:05:20] HOLMES: After the explosion, eyes initially turn to the Ukraine, given what father and daughter for that matter, have said, as you pointed out, but a lot of attention speculation, too, on whether this could have been an internal Russian operation. You know, it's speculation, but what what's your read? How likely would that be?
SCHMIDT: Well, there are a few theories out there, right? One is that it was Ukrainian hit. Although the Ukrainian government has steadfastly denied that it was. Second is that Putin did it. We haven't heard anything from the Kremlin. And the other real theory out there is that it was some other group, either on the left or on the right now, a former Russian lawmaker, was given a statement by a group called the National Republican Army, which is this left wing group, supposedly, in Russia that's claimed credit for the murderer, but we really don't know anything about them.
HOLMES: If it was an internal Russian job, I mean, obviously, it's messaging of some sort. What could that message be? And, you know, you do get the sense there, there could be concerned there could be more to come.
SCHMIDT: I think if it was this national Republican Army, it's a sign that there's a real internal conflict, there's a real civil war brewing in Russia. Now, I'd caution that that one hit isn't a war, if they can pull this off again, somewhere else. And yet again, then I think you start to see a real threat to the governing bodies in the Kremlin. So you know, the other thing is, is that I think the Kremlin is going to react to this no matter what the truth is, by trying to hit back harder in Ukraine by trying to really go after Zelenskyy and other Ukrainian figures.
HOLMES: It was Daria, the daughter who was killed of course, but by all accounts, the father, Alexander was meant to be in the car with her and got out at the last minute, got into a different car. He has long agitated on behalf of the separatist regions in Donetsk and Luhansk. You mentioned his opus, what are his longer term vision for the greater Russia?
SCHMIDT: Well, Dugin, and his daughter who is a well-known TV personality, have long advocated for this idea of the Russian world, or something called Eurasianism. And it was this idea that countries like Ukraine, or Kazakhstan, or the other countries in Central Asia, aren't real, right? They're part of this broader Russian world that's ruled from Moscow, and that this whole world is actually anti-Western, right? It doesn't share our values. It's anti-Democratic, it's anti- gay, it's anti-free speech. And that what they're trying to do is exactly what Putin has said, right? It's the fight against the instruments of the West, like NATO. So they see this war as not being against Ukraine so much as being against the western empire that they oppose.
HOLMES: Fascinating. So as we say, and when we repeat, we don't know who did it, or what the motivation was, but in your experience, you know, covering the region and looking at the region and studying the region and him, do you think Vladimir Putin might be nervous tonight? SCHMIDT: I think he is, although you'll never see it in him. He's been nervous, you know, not just because of this hit, but there has been a lot of dissent, right? There have been a lot of attacks going on in Russia and he has to be wondering where they're coming from. And his biggest fear isn't that they're coming from Ukraine. Your sets are coming from inside that they might be coming from elements in his own security service.
HOLMES: Always fascinating to get your analysis. Professor Matthew Schmidt, thank you so much.
SCHMIDT: Good to be here.
HOLMES: Now, the government in Kyiv says Russia may be planning show trials for captured Ukrainian soldiers in Mariupol this week. It comes as Ukraine prepares to market Independence Day on Wednesday, six months to the day since Russia invaded. In his nightly address Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy warned that trials would make future negotiations with Russia impossible.
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, PRESIDENT OF UKRAINE (through translator): If this despicable core takes place, if our people are brought into these settings in violation of all agreements, all international rules there will be abused. This will be the line beyond which no negotiations are possible. Russia will cut itself off from the negotiations. There will be no more conversations. Our state has said everything.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Meanwhile, Russian troops are trying to advance in Eastern Ukraine's Donetsk region with their constant shelling reported along the front lines still Russian forces appear to be gaining little ground.
[01:10:09]
To the north, officials in Kharkiv are building bomb shelters at bus stops. Russia attacks have spiked in the region, including one on an apartment building that killed at least 18 people on Wednesday.
The leaders of Britain, France, Germany and the U.S. once again calling for an end to fighting around Ukraine's Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant. In a phone call on Sunday, they also urged the visit by the UN's nuclear watchdog as soon as possible. The area around the plant has been the site of repeated shelling in recent weeks raising fears of a possible nuclear disaster.
Now, the almost constant bombardment of Ukraine by Russian forces has left the country littered with destroyed buildings, as well as unexploded ordnance, which could detonate at any time. The U.S. State Department recently committed almost $90 million to help clear the landmines in Ukraine, calling it one of the worst challenges of its kind in decades.
CNN's David McKenzie spent time with a team doing this dangerous work.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN "MONTY" MONTGOMERY, FSD TEAM LEADER: That's where the vast majority of the contamination has gone.
DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: For each devastating strike is a deadly chain reaction.
MONTGOMERY: An item of on, struck this building any ammunition which didn't detonate on that initial blast has been kicked out. It's been thrown from here, and it can travel up to several 100 meters.
MCKENZIE: Ammunition like this live round can kill civilians often children long after the fighting has stopped.
MONTGOMERY: You see before us the sort of carnage that's been left by the ammunition trucks, which are privileges great detonating.
MCKENZIE: In March, Ukrainian forces struck this farm warehouse hosing tons of Russian shells and rockets.
MONTGOMERY: I can only imagine the fireball and the sound that was produced when it happened.
MCKENZIE: For this explosive ordinance disposal team in Chernihiv.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We don't go in aggressive, obviously, there's a threat out there.
MCKENZIE: The threat is very real.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, you will continue with the search straightforward. If I say stop at any time, do you stop immediately, advance.
MCKENZIE: We have to be all the way back here for our own safety. It shows how dangerous this work is. And it's painstaking. This small area has taken several days and you're not even finished?
MONTGOMERY: No, we've merely scratched the surface.
MCKENZIE: And you've got an entire country potentially?
MONTGOMERY: Yeah.
MCKENZIE: How could you possibly do that job?
MONTGOMERY: If me doing this job and being here in Ukraine, removing one item, however small or however large it saves one life, then for me personally, that's a goal that I've reached.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.
MCKENZIE: When they spot a suspected shell.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everyone come back. MCKENZIE: Team Leader John Eldridge (ph) must go it alone. Using only his fingertips. John works very, very carefully. These shells are designed to destroy defensive positions, if armed, even the slightest nudge could set it off.
What is it like when you're there scrambling to not knowing what exactly you're going to find?
JOHN ELDRIDGE (ph): Yeah, it's an interesting one, I think it's something that you get used to after time, but there's still that element of, you know, sort of adrenaline kicking in a little bit. Yeah. And few beads of sweat.
MCKENZIE: This shell can be moved safely.
JOHN ELDRIDGE (ph): Great.
MCKENZIE: Soon they'll have Ukrainian team leaders clearing their own land.
NATALIA (ph): This will be an enormous task says Natalia (ph). Since all this must be done carefully. You just can't rush this job.
Nice and steady, yeah.
Even if this was stopped today. It could take years per country to be safe. David McKenzie, CNN, Chernihiv, Ukraine.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES: We are getting a clearer sense of the human toll rushes war is taking on Ukrainians. The Office of the U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights says the war has killed more than 5500 civilians and injured more than 7000, countless more killed or wounded on the front lines defending their country. Some are likely to never be accounted for in the mayhem of war. But despite the circumstances some Ukrainians are working hard to give dignity to the dead.
New York Times photojournalist Lynsey Addario witnessed and documented those efforts in a powerful photo essay. I asked her what she would like audiences to take away from her work.
LYNSEY ADDARIO, NEW YORK TIMES PHOTOJOURNALIST: I think the interesting thing about where we're at now is that there's this false sense of the war being over in Kyiv than around these areas that were so rife with death. I mean Bucha, Irpin, people have come back, the cafes are open. People are getting married. There's this incredible life that's returned yet the funerals continue. And that is, it's important to remember what has happened here. The war is still very strong in the East and in the south, of course, but it's to see the fact that people are still being buried six months on is really astonishing.
HOLMES: Yeah, it is. There was one particular photograph of a group of men at a cemetery. And what is what was striking to me when I looked at photos, the sheer exhaustion etched in their faces as sadness, if you like, but give us a sense of the determination, the character of those working with the dead in such a dignified fashion?
ADDARIO: Yeah, I mean, the Ukrainians I've met over the last six months are extraordinary. They are resilient, they are strong. I mean, these are grave diggers who have buried hundreds of people. They just keep going on. That day was sweltering hot, it was high noon, and one after one, they offloaded the bodies with dignity. They brought them each one, the priests, Priests Andrei (ph), who has buried almost all of the dead and Bucha just went and blessed each grave. I mean, they're -- you know, no effort is spared to give people dignified deaths.
HOLMES: Yeah, what is it about the power of a photograph versus words? I mean, what advantages does the photo have, particularly in the context of war? And, you know, in the context of a place like Bucha?
ADDARIO: I mean, it's hard to say, I mean, I think your photo, obviously, someone like myself, I'm trying to capture the emotion I'm trying to show, you know, those little moments that can be captured in words. But I think obviously, when you look at a page, a photo stands out if it's powerful. And so, for me, it's all about trying to capture those moments.
HOLMES: So often, for journalists, a tough task is to have people look beyond the numbers, the broad strokes, I found this myself in Iraq, many times, to have people see the individuals, as people to make those looking at the photographs or reading the words, make a connection on a human level. How important is that aspect of what you do?
ADDARIO: I mean, that is kind of everything that that that I'm trying to do is to try to humanize these stories to try to bring, you know, a sense of who these people are, that are suffering, you know, to make the connection between those sitting in their homes in the United States, and people in Ukraine so they can understand that these are regular people who were living their own lives until February 24. And I think that that's very important for people to realize.
HOLMES: Many thanks to Lynsey Addario for sharing those stories.
Now, the number of refugees who have fled Ukraine since the Russian invasion is nearing six and a half million, think about that. That's according to U.N. figures. As we've seen for months Ukraine's neighbors continue to take in most of those refugees, including Poland, Moldova, Slovakia and Romania. Millions more of course, are displaced within Ukraine. With the fighting, especially fears in Donetsk, Ukrainian officials are trying to evacuate two-thirds of those living in the region before winter. As the humanitarian situation gets worse.
NATALIA, BAKHMUT RESIDENT (through translator): We're constantly being shelled. There's no power. It depends on the neighborhood. In some there hasn't been running water, nor electricity for over three weeks already. But in some there is power. So it depends.
OLEKSI, VOLUNTEER EVACUATING CIVILIANS: We started evacuating people from Kharkiv than from Lysychansk, were we get under artillery fire a few times, then the road to Lysychansk closed when we started evacuating from Bakhmut.
HOLMES: Now, if you would like to safely and securely help people in Ukraine who might be in need of things like shelter, food, water, and so on, go to cnn.com/impact you'll see a variety of resources there where you can help.
Still to come here on the program, Somali security forces fight a pitched battle against jihadists at a Mogadishu hotel. What we're learning about the deadly siege after the break.
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HOLMES: At least 16 people are dead, three injured after a truck crash in Russia. The local interior ministry says the truck driver didn't break in time and hit a mini bus which was stopped in traffic. Video from the scene shows the bus sandwiched between two trucks. There is now a criminal investigation into the incident.
In Somalia, emergency crews are sifting through the rubble of what was once an upscale hotel. They're searching for any remaining explosives after security forces ended a 30 hour standoff with al-Shabaab militants on Sunday. At least 21 people were killed more than 100 injured in the Hayat Hotel attack. CNN's Larry Madowo, now explains how the siege
unfolded and how it ended.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LARRY MADOWO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It lasted more than 30 hours, an attack by al-Shabaab, that's been described as one of the longest hotel sieges for the al-Qaeda linked terror group in Somalia in over a decade. And there are signs all around the Hayat Hotel in Mogadishu of just how intense and prolonged the battle was.
Police say it began on Friday night when militants blasted their way into the building, shooting civilians as they tried to escape. Witnesses say the attackers barricaded themselves inside and blew up the stairs in order to trap some people on upper floors.
Hour by hour, fierce gun battles erupted between the insurgents and elite armed forces who eventually regained control of the hotel. Authority say more than 100 people were rescued. But one Somali police commander says it was hard fighting.
He says it's shocking that innocent people lost their lives here and adds security forces were engaged in rescuing people one by one and in groups. Police say the hotel is badly damaged, and they are sweeping the debris for explosives that were left around the hotel. And they say they're still counting the dead. Or some relatives may have buried their loved ones instead of taking them to hospitals. But the attacking the hearts of the country's capital just months after Somalia's new president was elected shows just how dangerous al- Shabaab is and how difficult it will be to defeat them, as the Somali government has promised to do. Larry Madowo, CNN, Nairobi. (END VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES: Now, in the coming hours, we'll find out if Kenya's former Prime Minister follows through on his promise to challenge the presidential election results in court. Raila Odinga has until the end of the day Monday to file his claim with Kenya's Supreme Court.
Last week after officials declared he narrowly lost the presidential race, Odinga said he completely rejects the results. His opponent Kenya's Deputy President William Ruto says he will engage in any possible court proceedings that may come about. Official declared Ruto won the presidential election with just over 50% of the vote.
Pope Francis has made his first public comments about the Nicaraguan government's ongoing confrontation with the church. It comes just days after a bishop was arrested by police. Journalist Stefano Pozzebon has more on the story.
[01:25:03]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
STEFANO POZZEBON, JOURNALIST: Churchgoers in Nicaragua are praying for the health and the well-being of Monsignor Rolando Alvarez, the bishop of Matagalpa in Nicaragua, who has been taken into custody on Friday, after almost a two week standoff with the Nicaraguan police. These protesters are part of the Nicaraguan diaspora in Costa Rica, where 1000s of Nicaraguans leave fleeing the repressive government of Daniel Ortega. Police did not specify the reason behind the arrest of Monsignor Alvarez, who had been protesting the closure of a Catholic radio station in recent weeks.
However, on Friday, the wife of Daniel Ortega and the Vice President Rosario Murillo said that the arrested was made necessary because the church had failed to provide information to the police, now ongoing investigation, and concerns over the situation in Nicaragua were shared around the world even Pope Francis urged the authorities to use dialogue as a way to resolve conflict in the country in his a Sunday Angelus address in Rome.
POPE FRANCIS (through translator): Brothers and sisters, I'm following the situation in Nicaragua with concern and worry, I wish to express my hope that there will be a sincere dialogue and the basis for respectful living together can be found in Nicaragua. I pray that the Lord may inspire the concrete will to dialogue in Nicaragua to find a solution to the difficulties there.
POZZEBON: Francis, however, did not mention Alvarez in his speech and together with a bishop, a group of a priest and seminarians were also taken into custody in what is just the latest episode of Ortega's campaign against the Catholic Church in Nicaragua. This confrontation dates back to 2018 when the bishops from the Episcopal Conference acted as mediators between the government and pro-democracy protesters demanding free and fair elections in the country. Ortega won a fifth presidential mandate in 2021 in an election that U.S. President Joe Biden called a pantomime at the time. For CNN, this is Stefano Pozzebon, Bogota.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES: Still to come here on the program, a U.S. governor is leading a delegation to Taiwan in the third visit by American lawmakers to the island this month. We'll have the latest in a live report with our Kristie Lu Stout.
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HOLMES: Welcome back. I'm Michael Holmes. You're watching CNN NEWSROOM.
Taiwan now hosting a third delegation of U.S. lawmakers in less than a month. This time it is a group led by Indiana Governor Eric Holcomb. They're on an economic development trip to the region that will also take them to South Korea. Holcomb also met with Taiwan's president earlier.
I'm joined now by our Kristie Lu Stout live in Hong Kong. Good to see you Kristie. So, how is China responding to this visit?
KRISTIE LU STOUT, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. No immediate response from China. We are monitoring China's response this day.
But the latest U.S. official to visit Taiwan is the governor of Indiana, Eric Holcomb. This visit comes less than three weeks after the U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi made that controversial visit to the island. It also comes a week after that other congressional delegation led by the Senator Ed Markey visited the island. And both those visits drew outrage and the ire of China which responded by escalating military drills.
But again, we'll continue to monitor for any reaction from China for this latest visit. Eric Holcomb, the governor of Indiana, he arrived in Taipei on Sunday night with his delegation. It's part of a greater trip to both Taiwan and South Korea as well as on the agenda to meet with top officials including the president of Taiwan Tsai Ing-Wen as well as business leaders and academic institutions.
The press conference that you are looking at right now, I believe just wrapped up. This was between the meetings of the delegation, Indiana governor, Tsai Ing-Wen making a few comments as well.
I want you to listen to what the Taiwan president side about the nature of the visit. And also about what democratic allies must do. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TSAI ING-WEN, TAIWANESE PRESIDENT (through translator): Presently we are facing the continued expansion of global authoritarianism. In the midst of it, Taiwan has been confronted by military threats from China in and around the Taiwan Strait. At this moment, democratic allies must stand together and boost cooperation across all areas.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
STOUT: The timing of this visit is significant. It comes just after what happened last week when the Biden administration announced it would begin formal trade talks with Taiwan in the fall.
It also comes in the same month where you had President Biden signed what has been called the Chips Act, in order to boost American competitiveness in the semiconductor industry. And Taiwan is playing a very critical role in that.
Taiwan is home to TSMC, the world's biggest contract chip maker. TSMC has pledged $12 billion to create chip fab in the U.S. state of Arizona. And another Taiwan semiconductor player called MediaTek has also made a pledge to invest in a design office, where -- in the U.S. state of Indiana. Back to you, Michael.
HOLMES: Interesting. Now each of these visits draws as you've been saying the ire of China. But will this draw the U.S. and Taiwan closer together? What about that aspect?
STOUT: Yes. Apparently so. The tough rhetoric, the escalation in military drills by China in response to that visit by Nancy Pelosi over three weeks ago did nothing to deter Taiwan or its supporters including the United States and also Japan. Japan also has a number of officials that have been visiting there recently as well. And it is really interesting to see the economic and the trade relationship really build up and strengthen between the U.S. and Taiwan.
We mentioned that formal trade talks are due to begin soon between the U.S. and Taiwan. This despite the fact -- and we have to remember this -- U.S. and Taiwan do not have a formal diplomatic relationship. Back to you.
HOLMES: Good point. Good to see you Kristie. Kristie Lu Stout there in Hong Kong for us.
STOUT: Thank you.
HOLMES: Well, after Nancy Pelosi's visit, Beijing suspended some trade with Taiwan, including the import of certain fruit and fish. And some of the island's farmers feel they are caught in the middle of this diplomatic friction.
CNN's Blake Essig with that.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BLAKE ESSIG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: In a small township in the south of Taiwan, farmers like Li Meng-han are battling more than Mother Nature to make a living.
But geopolitics? That's something his hard work can't change.
LI MENG-HAN, FARMER (through translator): It's some kind of political issue between Taiwan and China. We simply want to grow fruits and sell them at a good price.
ESSIG: A reasonable request, but one that just got a whole lot more difficult following House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's recent stop in Taiwan.
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: We will not abandon our commitment to Taiwan.
ESSIG: China reacted by flexing its military muscle, executing at least six days of live fire drills, while at the same time, exerting its economic power over this democratic island, this time going after what some consider low hanging fruit.
Citrus fruits like this pomelo was included on the most recent list of Taiwanese items banned from entering China. Beijing says the reason is because of excess pesticides, accusations that farmers here deny.
It's a move that experts say is less about health care or the economy and all about politics.
LI: I didn't see the ban coming so fast. We were caught off guard.
[01:34:52]
CHIAO CHUN, AUTHOR, "FRUITS AND POLITICS": We all know that politics is behind the bands. This is a politically motivated economic sanction on Taiwan to exert economic pressure on Taiwan.
ESSIG: The latest sanctions on fruit and fish went into effect on the same day Speaker Pelosi met with Taiwanese President Tsai Ing-Wen. Sanctions that will cost farmers like Li a lot of money. And if things don't change, it could force him and other farmers to let people go.
SUN TZU-MIN, GENERAL MANAGER, MADOU FARMERS ASSOCIATION (through translator): It's been hard for farmers. A sudden ban can put everything on hold. The pomelo trees can live for decades, and the fruits get sweeter as the trees get older, so it's impossible for farmers to abandon them.
ESSIG: Each year, roughly 72,000 tons of pomelo are produced here in Taiwan. Only about 7 percent are exported to China. The vast majority being sold and processed here locally in places like this. A small number on paper, but one that will have a big impact on farmers financially and mentally.
CHUN: I think psychology is a bigger factor here. And they can say that they have banned a large number of fruit items from Taiwan in one go.
ESSIG; While Pelosi is now gone, the impact of her visit is still being felt. But farmers forced to get creative by transforming the pomelo into something different to make up for that lost revenue.
LI: Taiwanese people shouldn't suffer from the tension between the U.S. and China. They always come and then they leave the next day. But the impact is felt here by Taiwanese farmers. ESSIG: It's the collateral damage of world powers going toe-to-toe.
Whereas it's usually the case, it's not the politicians who suffer, but every day people just looking to pick some fruit and feed their family.
Blake Essig, CNN -- Madou, Taiwan.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES: Still to come, in the middle of a drought, states like Arizona are told to cut back on the water they use from beyond their borders. How extreme weather is changing life in America's Sun Belt.
Also still to come, could the climate crisis be hurting world economies more than we know? I will speak with one of the authors of a new study about his findings after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOLMES: Heavy flooding has killed hundreds in countries across South Asia. Have a look at the aftermath in eastern Afghanistan where state media say at least 20 people have been killed.
Floods ripping through homes, forcing residents to dig through rubble in an effort to find any personal items they can.
Now, the death toll is even higher in Pakistan where officials say more than 200 people have died from heavy rains and flooding since June.
At least four people are dead, six others injured after a landslide hit a Shia shrine in Iraq where authorities said earlier rescue teams were communicating with people trapped under the rubble through small holes.
[01:39:51]
HOLMES: Officials say the incident happened on Saturday due to moisture saturation. The landslide fell on the roof of the shrine which collapsed onto visitors.
Stranded for hours, a flash flood trapped nearly 160 people Saturday at Carlsbad Caverns National Park in New Mexico. Rangers tried to evacuate the park but the only road in and out became impassable. The tourists were forced to seek shelter at the park's visitor center.
Robert and Stephanie Saavedra and their three kids were among those stranded. They were about halfway done with their tour when the evacuation began.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERT SAAVEDRA, TOURIST: It took us about maybe 20, 30 minutes to get out.
STEPHANIE SAAVEDRA, TOURIST: The road center washed out and we can't pass. They don't even know about food and water for us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: The Saavedra family says the park had food but only for purchase and they didn't have enough to feed everyone. The tourists were finally evacuated around midnight.
Meanwhile, in neighboring Arizona parts of that state were under flood watches over the weekend due to annual monsoon rains. Despite the excess, it is not enough to stave off huge cuts to the state's water supply handed down by the federal government.
CNN's Bill Weir with more from Phoenix.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL WEIR, CNN CHIEF CLIMATE CORRESPONDENT: Summer monsoons are adding few precious inches to the Lake Mead waterline but not nearly enough. America's largest reservoir still 25 feet lower than last summer. So this fall, parts of Phoenix will see unprecedented tier-two cuts of their share of the Colorado River. Joining Arizona farmers at the end of the water rights line.
Do you foresee a day when it is tier-three, tier-four mandatory cuts that will get really severe?
KATHYRN SORENSEN, DIRECTOR OF RESEARCH KYL CENTER FOR WATER POLICY, ARIZONA STATE UNIVERSITY: Absolutely. I am genuinely worried about the possibility of the system hitting dead pool.
WEIR: You are?
SORENSEN: Absolutely I am.
WEIR: Dead pool is when Mead gets low enough to crash the whole Colorado system. And when Kathryn Sorensen was running Water Departments in Phoenix and Mesa, it was the biggest worry. But now it's worse. And the feds are begging western states to cut up to one out of every four gallons consumed.
I know from our reporting there was some western water managers that were frustrated that the Bureau of Reclamation was not tougher. They said you guys work it out or we will work it out for you but they did not do that. What are your thoughts on that?
SORENSEN: Well, you know, it's disappointing because the longer that we have to endure the uncertainty, the more at risk the entire system is.
And I don't envy the federal government, you know, Biden administration. They have some really tough to choices to make. No elected official wants to be the person saying who gets water and who doesn't. I'm sure they are desperately searching for the least worse option. But in the meantime, water levels continue to fall.
GOVERNOR DOUG DUCEY (R), ARIZONA: And we will invest heavily in conservation, efficiency, re-use and advanced water technologies like desalination.
WEIR: Arizona's outgoing governor wants to build a desalination plant in Mexico and canals in Kansas to bring more water eventually. But in the meantime, the call to use less puts fresh scrutiny on thirsty industries like golf. Especially after an Arizona Republic investigation found that 30 to 50 percent of courses here use more than their share of water with little oversight.
State records show that the water cops of Arizona have issued a punishment against a golf course exactly twice in the last 20 years. So it's pretty obvious that from the feds down to the locals, people are not exactly lining up to be the tough sheriff desperately needed to tame water use in the wild west.
SORENSEN: I don't golf. So I don't feel a need to defend golf. But I will say this, people focus on it because it's visible. But there are a lot of things about what we do, what we consume, what we eat, what we wear that are also very water intensive.
So I don't like to think of it in terms of we don't have enough water. I like to think of in terms of, what do we have enough water for? Do we want to build semiconductor factories or do we want to grow cotton. Do you want to grow subdivisions or do we want to have high density development that is more water efficient. Those are the conversations we need to have.
Bill Weir, CNN -- Phoenix.
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HOLMES: Now, across the globe severe weather is having a major impact on some of the world's largest economies.
Joining me now to discuss this is Bernie Bastien-Olvera, a climate scientist with the University of California Davis. Thanks for being with us, Bernie.
You've been involved in some important research that essentially says the models have been underestimating the cost of climate damage to society by a factor of more than five. What might that misjudgment mean in terms of real world impacts?
[01:44:58]
BERNIE BASTIEN-OLVERA, CLIMATE SCIENTIST, UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA, DAVIS: Hi, Michael. Thanks for having me.
Yes. That's right. Well, we have all seen it in recent weeks and months and even in recent years that climate change is showing some impacts already in our society. So what we do as climate change economist is to basically measure these damages and try to aggregate the metrics to try to get an estimate of how climate change is damaging our economies.
So what we've done recently is not only to focus on what are the damages on the market economies, on the goods and services that we can exchange by monitoring the market, but also what's going on beyond the market.
What's going on with these benefits that we got from nature, that we cannot buy, but that are still always affecting us. So we're seeing that basically, these are some orders of magnitude larger than what we knew before.
HOLMES: Which is terrifying. So briefly, what are going to be the major economic impacts and how will they vary between countries and economies? Different countries are affected differently, right?
BASTIEN-OLVERA: Yes. You're right. Basically, it depends. For example, for lower income economies, which depend more on raw materials to produce their manufactured goods, well then for them, basically, they're productive base is diminishing. So they wouldn't be able to produce the same as they would with climate change impacts.
But for higher income economies, also their supply chain and their infrastructure is affected as well.
Right, like for example, some of the heat waves that have been hitting Europe are causing major effects not only in different structure and in the economy, but also on human health.
HOLMES: It's a domino effect. And it's going to cost a lot. A lot of climate experts might be tempted to say, you know, we told you so. And it is true, there have been decades of climate change denial. What has that denial and the delay of meaningful mitigation done in terms of preparing for what is coming economically?
BASTIEN-OLVERA: Yes. Well, a lot of money was invested in distracting our economies and stakeholders and basically, a lot of money was put into trying to make us think that only short economic growth was meaningful for society while ignoring these long term effects of climate change. So what these did was basically, in the past, we would've been able to regulate better some of the developments and permits that we're giving to industries, to extractive industries that now they are basically competing with societies access to, for example, clean water, clean air.
So we're in a point in which we still need to do something, and we still have the opportunity to actually like bring all this momentum and to actually save what can be saved.
(CROSSTALK)
HOLMES: Massive economic costs coming down the pipe. So what then could be mitigated in the economic sense in the short to mid term?
BASTIEN-OLVERA: Yes. Well, there's a lot. For example, there are some things that we can still do to adapt our economies to climate change. One of the most basic one is, for example, labor rights. A farmer that has labor rights is more able to, for example, withstand or cope with a heat wave then a worker that doesn't have it.
For example, that some of the things that we need to implement to cope with climate change, as well as diversify economy, which shouldn't be like living in this world in which we think that there's only one way to produce wealth and well-being for our people. We need to promote the diversity of multiple economies locally.
HOLMES: Yes. It's a fascinating study, an important aspect of climate change. It's not just about the droughts and the flood. It's about the cost to economies globally. So fascinating, important research.
Bernie Bastien-Olvera, thanks so much, really appreciate your time.
BASTIEN-OLVERA: Thank you so much, Michael.
HOLMES: Now, a new tropical depression has formed east of the Philippines and is expected to dump heavy rain over the country as it moves out into the South China Sea.
Meteorologist Pedram Javaheri joins me now with the very latest. What are you seeing, Pedram?
PEDRAM JAVAHERI, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes. You know, Michael, we're watching the storm system very carefully. It's a complex of unorganized thunderstorms right now that are developing north of Luzon. And the concern with this is that it's going to take its time moving across this region.
So as it does, quite a bit of rainfall. We've already seen quite a bit of unsettled weather across the region. And of course, you take a look, climatologically speaking, this is where you expect the wet weather to persist.
[01:49:57]
JAVAHERI: Oftentimes, it's the peak season because of those tropical systems, and this particular one locally named Florita and the storm itself, the sixth storm of the season to impact the Philippines will kind of take this northerly track, so it does avoid Manila, impacting areas like the Cagayan Regions, certainly on into areas just towards the north that we're talking about some of the areas of the (INAUDIBLE) islands before it reemerges over the South China Sea.
And you'll notice, winds of 120 kph are typically what it takes to get to typhoon status, the system doesn't quite get there. (INAUDIBLE) It does keep it rather weak. You get a lot of rainfall in advance of it, and in front, once it gets -- once it gets some breathing room across the South China Sea, we do expect the system to try to strengthen, and sometime towards the middle of the week, let's say Wednesday, possibly even into Thursday, (INAUDIBLE) 100 kilometers per hour winds there, which are equivalent just shy of what would be a category one system.
And then, again the impact is going to be felt across areas of Hong Kong and points just south of town. So quite a bit rainfall in store, gusty winds in store, that's for later on into the week.
Now, when it comes to Hong Kong, this is what you expect this time of year. Heavy rainfall certainly is the case, and oftentimes it is related with incoming tropical system. Across this region, we know how hard it's been, Michael, in recent weeks and months. Notice, once the system arrives, enough rainfall to at least taper off the temps just a little bit by Thursday afternoon. But it will gradually warm it back up again into the weekend across that region, Michael.
HOLMES: All right. Thanks for the update there, Pedram. Appreciate it. Pedram Javaheri there.
Now still to come here on the program, rowing champion Erin Kennedy overcome with emotion as she crosses the finish line. We'll hear more though about her incredible win in the face of huge medical obstacles. That's after the break.
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WHITFIELD: Welcome back.
Now, one of the most remarkable triumphs of the year came last weekend at the European Championships in Munich.
Erin Kennedy helped lead the British team to a gold medal in para- rowing. And she did it while undergoing chemotherapy treatment for breast cancer.
She's already back home and continuing her treatment. And she told our Amanda Davies about her rollercoaster of emotions.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ERIN KENNEDY, ROWING CHAMPION: Yes, it's been incredible, to be honest. Going from sort of wrapping up my season with the team, winning gold, and then coming back and straight into medical appointments. Yes, it's (INAUDIBLE) but it's been amazing. And I've been so grateful.
Even to have everyone around me and supporting me last week, it was amazing.
AMANDA DAVIES, CNN SPORTSWORLD: We saw the emotion afterwards as we were doing that media interview. How easy, how difficult was it? How were you able to compartmentalize and actually focus on the racing at the weekend given everything else that has been playing out?
KENNEDY: I've been all right. And then, Sunday, I was really emotional. I think, you know, it's an athlete mentality. It's all about -- for the folks (INAUDIBLE). In rowing we talk about it as basically growing the stroke that you're on around, try not to get ahead of yourself, and that's something I've been trying to do all the way through sort of this diagnosis and stuff and my treatment.
[01:54:47]
KENNEDY: But Sunday, you know, felt really special. I was all right, and then on the dot, right before we pushed off for the race -- (INAUDIBLE) Ollie, came to me and said, you know, I'm going to end myself for you today, and that really -- that really got me. And I was like "Oh Ollie, not now. I need to get through the race."
And yes. Managed to get down the course, and then, well, I was wobbling in the last 300 meters, and then we crossed the line, and I'm not a big crier, and I just absolutely burst into tears. I was so proud and emotional, and yes. It was a lot.
DAVIES: I'm not surprised. Rowing is a sport where crews, you know, live, work, breathe together. It is so much dependence on everybody being in sync.
I mean what was that like? How did you begin to tell your teammates after your diagnosis?
KENNEDY: So I was actually on training camp when I found a lump, initially. And I told my roommate almost straightaway, who's one of the girls on the boat. And then, once we were on the flight home, I sort let them know that, look, I found a lump, and I'm going to be going to get it checked out.
I wanted to be open from the off, because firstly, this is one of the reasons I wanted to be open with the world, really, about what's going on. It's because it's scary, it is. It's scary thinking of what might come when you find a lump. But actually, most of the time, it's ok.
But it's also ok to, you know, go and get it checked, go and ask the doctor if you're concerned. And I wanted to lead by example, really, and let the other members of my team know that if they ever had something similar, that they could be open to me, and we could all sort of share that.
So they knew from the very beginning, and actually the day I got my diagnosis, I was due to fly with the team to Serbia to compete in the world cup and I postpone my flight by a day so I could get my results, which ended up being my diagnosis.
And then I jumped on a fight the next day and went and race with them a few days later.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Wow. And as you we saw there, the results, Erin Kennedy's team has not been beaten in over a decade.
Now, to my favorite story, congratulations are in order as the "World of American Child Mullets" has a new king. There he is. Eight-year-old Emmitt Bailey of Wisconsin is being crowned the winner of this year's Kids U.S.A. Mullet Championships."
There are important things to report here. That title puts him high in the running for the Best Junior Mullet worldwide. And mullet culture is alive and well in America's dairy land, with the winner of the team division also hailing from Wisconsin. Bailey won $2,500 in prize money, which he says he wants to use on a go kart, not a haircut.
And the business in front party in the back competition was for a good cause, $10 entry fees will be donated to the Michigan Week Foundation for Kids.
Thanks for spending part of your day with me. I'm Michael Holmes. Follow me on Twitter and Instagram @HolmesCNN.
Rosemary Church with more news in a moment.
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