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DOJ Filing Reveals New Details in Criminal Probe into Trump's Potential Mishandling of Classified Documents; More Than 150,000 Residents Without Safe Drinking Water in Jackson, Mississippi; Biden Sharpens Attack on MAGA Republicans in Forceful Speech. Aired 10- 10:30a ET

Aired August 31, 2022 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: To oversee documents seized during that search of Mar-a-Lago.

[10:00:03]

Justice Department officials say top secret government documents were, quote, likely concealed and removed in an effort to, quote, obstruct the FBI's investigation.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: There's a big headline here, not just the volume, the sensitivity but the apparent effort or at least the alleged effort to obstruct. The Justice Department also released its most visual piece of evidence yet from the August search. This photo shows documents laid out on the floor by the FBI, all of them clearly marked with some of the highest classification markings. Officials say they were recovered from a container that Trump kept at his Mar-a-Lago home.

All of this comes as Justice Department officials say Trump has failed to return dozens of highly classified documents despite several requests over several months. Since January, the U.S. government has been able now to recover more than 320 classified documents from Mar- a-Lago. The former president and his team now have until 8:00 P.M. tonight to respond to this new DOJ filing.

HARLOW: All right, let's beginning this morning with our Correspondent Kara Scannell. Kara, these are stunning developments. Walk us through the key -- the key revelations that tells us so much.

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. I mean, what we've really learned from this, from the Department of Justice filing is they say that when they went and executed this search warrant at Mar-a-Lago three weeks ago, they recovered twice as many classified documents than what the former president's legal team had given them pursuant to a grand jury subpoena in June. So, this all goes right to the Department of Justice's position that the Trump team has not been cooperative with this investigation. They're really trying to put forth a counter-narrative him.

I'm going to read a line from the filing. They say that the FBI, in a matter of hours, recovered twice as many documents with classification markings as the diligent search that the former president's counsel and other representatives had weeks to perform, calls into serious question the representations made in the June 3rd certification and casts doubt on the extent of cooperation in this matter.

And they also note that when they went in there back in June, when the FBI showed up, that they were shown the storage area in the basement where these boxes were stored, but the Trump lawyers would not let them inspect the boxes to see if there were any of those clearly marked -- as you can see, they are clearly marked documents, top secret and secret. And in the filing the DOJ writes, critically, however, the former president's counsel explicitly prohibited government personnel from opening or looking into any of the boxes that remained in the storage room, giving no opportunity for the government to confirm that no documents with classification markings were made.

What DOJ says is that they did uncover when they went in just a few weeks ago is that three classified documents were found in the desk drawers within the office of the former president. So, they have obtained records there. You know, this all is coming out because they want to put a counter-narrative to what Trump has been saying, which they say is completely inaccurate.

HARLOW: Which is he's been saying we've been fully cooperative, you didn't need to search. All this stuff that was found that you just went through is after a subpoena.

SCANNELL: All after a subpoena, yes. And, I mean, this is DOJ saying that there shouldn't be a special master, third party in this case, because the records don't belong to the former president, they belong to the U.S. government.

HARLOW: Thank you, Kara, very much.

SCIUTTO: Now, let's speak now to CNN Security Correspondent Josh Campbell to give us more details about what these photographed documents tell us. And, Josh, when I had a top secret security clearance for the time I had it, these are kinds of documents you would never leave a SCIF, a secured facility with. Tell us what you see here in this picture.

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes. This is that incredible photo that was released yesterday by the Justice Department as part of this filing. Now, these show documents recovered from the former president's residence. The FBI laid them out here in order to photograph them. You can see a ruler down there for scale.

We're talking about a significant amount of classified information. Interestingly, they also include here a picture of some magazine covers that were also recovered, or at least for this photograph purpose, and I think that's to show that these documents were commingled with other types of items.

Now, you can store magazine covers in a sensitive compartmented facility, you can't store classified information in a magazine closet. Now, let's look at what we're talking about here. We're talking about secret information and top secret information. The government definition of those two classifications is something that's secret, if divulged, could cause serious harm to national security. When it comes to top secret information, we're talking about information that could cause grave damage to U.S. national security if it falls into the hands of people who don't have a need to know.

Now, this is what is called a cover sheet. We see a lot of these in these photos. These serve two purposes. First, it allows the person handling the information to know what type of documents they're dealing with here. It also helps shield that information from someone who may not have a need to know.

Now, I particularly want to center in on these classification controls. Now, anyone with a security clearance, as you know, Jim, you also get read into different compartments that allow you to see information. And these initials, HCS, SI and TK appear on these documents.

[10:05:02]

When we talk about HCS, we're talking about clandestine human source information, highly protected by the U.S. government. SI refers to special intelligence. Think of that as collection by the national security agency regarding signals intelligence, wire taps and the like. These cover sheets also include the initials TK, talent key hole, which that refers -- it's not a household name but this is a highly sensitive U.S. government satellite program.

Now, we don't know what was exactly in these documents but we can glean from these cover sheets what this information potentially was.

Now, what is interesting is we're not just getting this photo from the Justice Department but there's also some new information that will probably trouble the Trump legal team, because the Justice Department alleges -- I will read you this quote here -- the government also developed evidence that government records were likely concealed and removed from the storage room and that efforts were likely taken to obstruct the government's investigation.

I want to focus on two things here, developed evidence. That's a nice lawyerly way of saying someone is talking to the FBI. They're getting information about how these documents were actually handled. And then the second word here, obstruct. The government is saying that this wasn't just sloppiness. You can't blame this on the movers for bringing them from the White House down to Mar-a-Lago. There was an effort, as the Justice Department alleges, that the Trump team worked to obstruct this investigation.

Finally, it's important to note that the former president has said that he's done nothing wrong, but as you look at this photo, one thing that is so striking is that we're told from the Justice Department, according to this filing, that even the FBI agents who showed up to gather this information, they didn't have the proper clearances. They had to be read into additional compartments even to look at these documents, Jim and Poppy.

SCIUTTO: Quite a remarkable find. Josh Campbell, thanks so much.

All right, so what's the law here? Attorney Paul Rosenzweig joins us now. He was senior counsel during the Whitewater investigation, also former deputy assistant secretary for policy at DHS. Good to have you back on, Paul.

So, let's talk legally here. So, there were, in fact, more classified documents at Mar-a-Lago after Trump handed over some in January and after a visit from government lawyers in June and after one of Trump's lawyers signed a letter claiming all documents had been returned to the government. Is that contradiction there in facts legal proof of obstruction?

PAUL ROSENZWEIG, FORMER SENIOR COUNSEL, WHITEWATER INVESTIGATION: Certainly getting very close. The people who know best what happened are likely Trump's lawyers and they are going to be the focus of the investigation now, which is to say that they are the ones who know whether, for example, President Trump told them to make that filing and assured them that he returned all of the documents, whether they knew that the documents were there.

It certainly is highly probative that the documents were readily found, easily found by the FBI, which strongly suggests that people in Mar-a-Lago knew that they were there. The precise question is going to be exactly which people knew and when and who authorized which representations. If I were Trump's attorneys, I would not want to be -- you know, I wouldn't be happy right now because I would be the subject of the ongoing investigation. And if I were President Trump, I would be thinking that I may need some new attorneys to help the attorneys out.

HARLOW: Well, they got one new attorney, a highly respected attorney in Florida, and that's Chris Kise. And he has got a lot of work on his hands today as well as those other lawyers, right? Paul, we've got to -- I think we lost Paul. Can you hear us? Okay. We're going to try to get him back.

SCIUTTO: We will do our best.

This just in, Senator Lindsey Graham is arguing again that a subpoena for his testimony before a Georgia grand jury should be quashed or at least heavily limited. In a court filing just in morning, a lawyer for the South Carolina Republican said questions surrounding phone calls he made to election officials in Georgia should not be allowed. He argues those calls were part of Graham's investigation into voter fraud claims and are protected under the Constitution's speech and debate clause.

HARLOW: This morning, a dire water situation persists in Jackson, Mississippi. Right now, more than 150,000 people there do not have safe water to drink. That means kids can't have safe water to drink, no safe water to mix baby formula with, on and on and on, that is because of this failure of the water treatment plant. The mayor tells CNN there is hope that water could be restored in the coming days. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR CHOKWE LUMUMBA (D-JACKSON, MS): We believe and are optimistic that we can see water restored to our residents within this week, but there is a huge mountain to climb in order to achieve that end, but they are working persistently to restore the pressure.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[10:10:00]

HARLOW: Overnight, President Biden declared an emergency in Jackson, ordered FEMA to assist with disaster relief efforts there and the governor of the state, Tate Reeves, says there is a plan to install a rented pump by this morning that he says will allow for at least 4 million additional gallons of clean water.

But this crisis is impacting more than just the water supply. Kids are out of school. School children have had to go to virtual learning because of little or no water pressure in their buildings.

I'm joined now by Mississippi State Senator Hillman Frazier, he has lived in Jackson his whole life, served the 27th district for over 40 years. Well, good morning, sir, and thank you.

STATE SEN. HILLMAN FRAZIER (D-MS): Good morning. Thanks for having me.

HARLOW: You've talked about this as being a lingering crisis for the city of Jackson, going back decades. Your own parents went through, you know, their homes being completely under water in the '70s and '80s. And I just wonder how you respond to some folks in Jackson, now like 36-year-old Anna Hart, who told The New York Times, we're just crumbling, it is like forget about Jackson. Do you agree with her?

FRAZIER: Well, this has been a major problem because the system needs immediate attention. Over the years, it has been neglected for different reasons. But our job is to make sure that we get the plant up and running so folks can have access to clean drinking water. So, it has been problematic over the years.

There has been that urban rule fight in the legislature with resources going to urban areas, so we're also calling in that urban rule fight to try to get in resources for the city of Jackson.

HARLOW: Why do you think it's been neglected for so long?

FRAZIER: Well, they've had a rural map in terms of what is needed for the water system. And one thing that is needed is resources, dollars both from the state and federal levels. We have not been able to access a number of those dollars over the years.

And also it comes down to how much are you going to support the city of Jackson in terms of real needs in the city of Jackson. We have to realize that Jackson is the capital city and it needs to be a first- class city. In order to be a first-class city, it has to have access to clean drinking water. So, it's been a problem because we have not been able to get together on the resources for the city of Jackson in terms of our shoring up the system here locally.

HARLOW: Senator, one thing that you've been calling for in the middle of all of this is for the governor to call a special session of the legislature. People might not understand but many state legislatures, including there, don't meet all the time, right, they only meet at certain times a few times a year to pass legislation. You want him to call a special session now. Can you speak to what you think that could help do and what you think will not happen if that special session is not called.

FRAZIER: Yes, I'm glad you brought that up because we will convene a regular session in January and it is going to be too late to address some of these problems in January. So, it's very important to address them starting today.

I'm very pleased that the governor did send a lot of experts to the water system, plant system to get it up and running, using resources to make sure that we have the right people and get the parts in place to get the system operational.

But a special session would give us a chance to come up with a long- term solution for the infrastructure problem and the water problem in the city of Jackson. So, that's why a special session is needed to we can address the long-term plan while addressing the short-term plans in terms of getting the water system up and running immediately. But this is just a stopgap measure. We have to look at long-term solutions to make sure that it doesn't become a recurring problem for the citizens in the city of Jackson because it impacts everybody.

HARLOW: No question. When you look at the population of Jackson, the most recent numbers show 82 percent of the city population is black, that number is just 38 percent when you look statewide. And I want to use those numbers to now play for you sound from one of the residents there in Jackson. Listen to what she said earlier this week.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DANYELLE HOLMES, JACKSON RESIDENT: We're very angry and we want to just name it in our state government, right, and their failure to come in and assist the city of Jackson with this infrastructure water crisis. The extreme racist politics that have been played, that have impacted over 175,000 residents here in the city of Jackson, you know, we can no longer stand for the ignorance.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Do you feel the same way she does?

FRAZIER: We have to look at what's going on. In the city of Jackson, we have had to deal with this problem for many, many years, starting with some of our white mayors and also when the city was not 80 percent black. So, this has been an ongoing problem in terms of addressing the needs of the city. But in terms of the legislature, we've been fighting very hard, trying to get additional resources for the city of Jackson for political control (ph).

[10:15:01]

But in the past, we have had strong opposition from people downstream because the city is trying to put the water back on them. So, that urban/rural fight is still very real in the legislature.

Like I said, we've had Mayor Kane Ditto, who was our last white mayor, he fought very hard to get resources to address this problem and he was not successful because of the urban rule split in the Mississippi legislature.

HARLOW: Well, Senator Frazier, thank you for your time and good luck to you, to everyone there. Obviously, this is an ongoing crisis. We will follow it closely. Thanks again.

FRAZIER: Thank you. Thank you.

HARLOW: Still to come, President Biden again targets MAGA Republicans in what may be a preview of his prime time address tomorrow from the key battleground state of Pennsylvania.

SCIUTTO: Plus, a CNN exclusive on the troubling deadly weapon that officers of the law are encountering across the country, DIY machine guns.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They are the size of a Lego, come in colors of the rainbow, and in seconds, can turn America's most popular handgun from firing like this, to this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: A machine gun. How that one little plastic piece is wreaking havoc today on American streets.

And later, 25 years ago, the world shocked by the death of Princess Diana, the latest on how the royal family is marking this anniversary.

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SCIUTTO: Tomorrow, President Biden will head back to the midterm battleground state of Pennsylvania for the second of three speeches planned there in less than a week. In a primetime address from Philadelphia, the president will outline what the White House describes as, quote, the continued battle for the soul of the nation.

HARLOW: He was in Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania, yesterday, once again, calling out some Republicans for abandoning their commitment to the rule of law. Listen to what he said. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, U.S. PRESIDENT: You can't be pro law enforcement and pro insurrection. You can't be a party of law and order and call the people who attacked the police on January 6th patriots. You can't do it.

Now, it's sickening to see the new attacks on the FBI, threatening the life of law enforcement agents and their families for simply carrying out the law and doing their job. Look, I want to say this as clear as I can. There's no place in this country, no place, for endangering the lives of law enforcement, no place.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Let's bring in our Chief National Affairs Correspondent Jeff Zeleny. Jeff, it's great to have you.

This is a strikingly different tone from the president. You know, obviously, it comes on the heels of a lot of legislative wins, you know, I think the administration feels like they have the wind at their back in some respects, but what does it tell us about what he's going to say maybe tomorrow night?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, Poppy, I think what it says is they are trying to make this election not about them. Democrats are trying to turn the focus back to Republicans and back to the former president who, of course, is in the news every single minute, it almost seems like, with the court filings and the search at Mar-a-Lago.

So, the president and the White House, they've never really wanted to spend a lot of time focusing on Donald Trump. You've seen President Biden really from the very beginning try and make his presidency about anything but that. But the reality is we have never seen a former president so overshadow and bleed into a current presidency.

So, the White House is simply leaning into that and trying to make this a choice between Republicans, in his view, MAGA Republicans and the current administration, rather than simply a referendum on the Biden administration. So, that is quite simply what they are trying to do is turn the focus a little bit back to Donald Trump.

SCIUTTO: Let me ask you this, because I know that both Democrats and Republicans have been indicating that this midterm is expected to be tighter than many had expected just a few weeks ago, not a red wave, perhaps unclear in the Senate and perhaps even in the House. But I wonder, given the experience, ours and people watching with polls in recent cycles, how confident are pollsters, analysts, campaigns in those numbers, and in your conversations, do their own internal polling, does that reflect the same change?

ZELENY: Jim, look, I think the only real answer to that question will come ten weeks from this morning because the midterm elections are ten weeks from yesterday. But, look, there is certainly some things we do know. And one thing we do know is inside the campaigns, Democrats, House Democrats, congressional races in tight districts across the country, they are seeing their numbers improve. Republicans are seeing their numbers not as strong as they might have been a few weeks ago.

But we also know that history tells us a lot about midterm elections. It is always a challenge for the president's party, no doubt about it. So, the wave does not seem as big right now at this moment for a number of reasons. One, Donald Trump and the old sort of argument is creeping back in. That was so damaging to Republicans in 2018. You talk to many Republicans, they want to talk about Joe Biden, they don't want to talk about Donald Trump. They want to talk about gas prices and inflation. They want to sort of blame the administration, but it's being sort of watered down by so many things.

So, look, right now, Democrats still pretty confident about holding the Senate. The House is a much stronger reach. But we do not expect to see a huge wave like we saw, say, in the first midterm of the Obama administration when he lost some 60 seats.

[10:25:01]

There just aren't that many seats to lose. The map is entirely different than it was back then.

HARLOW: Pennsylvania, obviously very, very important, I guess. Let's see, making his 14th and 15th visit there. Not just important for this administration, this president, it's where we're going to see former President Trump on Saturday night. What does it tell you about how crucial this state is 69 days out?

ZELENY: Look, it is important in many, many ways. And here is the first reason why, it's that Senate seat. Senator Pat Toomey, a Republican, is retiring, so that open Senate seat really allows Republicans, if they would win that with Mehmet Oz, that sort of blocks the Democratic potential of picking up the seat. But, look, Democrats feel pretty confident about that at this point, also the governor's race.

Look at the blue wall, if you want to call it that, that's how a lot of Democrats view it with Pennsylvania, Michigan and Wisconsin. These governor's races will be so important for 2024, as we already talked about how the votes are counted and cast and laws and things. So, the governor's race there is key, also several house races in Pennsylvania.

So, look, if this is becoming a bit of a flashback to Biden and Trump, Pennsylvania is ground zero for that because Joe Biden won Pennsylvania in 2020, of course, Donald Trump won it in 2016. So, for all of those reasons and more, of course, it's Joe Biden's home. He talks about Scranton so often. And it's easy for him to travel to it, so close to Washington. So, all those reasons make Pennsylvania absolutely the center of this midterm election.

SCIUTTO: It seems like that way every election cycle these days. Jeff Zeleny, thanks so much.

ZELENY: You bet.

HARLOW: Thank you, Jeff. Well, the Republican-controlled South Carolina statehouse has advanced a near total ban on abortion. However, at the last minute, lawmakers added an amendment that includes exceptions for rape and incest up to 12 weeks after conception. But that provision does require that those crimes are reported to law enforcement at the time. The bill also includes an exception if a mother's life is at risk but only a narrow set of medical emergencies qualify.

SCIUTTO: All right. Coming up, it's a piece of plastic, smaller than your thumb, but it can turn a regular handgun, semi-automatic, into something much more deadly. We are going to take you on a deep dive coming up. It's alarming.

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